The real question is, 'Will wealthy people ever vote for legally restricting their own freedoms?'

The problem with many electronic appliances is that they're designed to break after x number of years so that the manufacturer can sell new ones. One of my GCSE Chemistry classes from 25 years back has always been burnt into my memory, where we were basically asked given two materials in car manufacturing: iron and aluminium, where iron is cheaper to acquire, is heavier and will require more petrol to move, and rusts over time, whereas aluminium doesn't rust, is lighter and will use less fuel to move with, but is more expensive to produce, which one would you use? For me in my naive youth the answer was obviously aluminium. For capitalism as taught in UK schools, the answer should obviously be iron, because it reduces production costs, sells more petrol, and the consumer will be forced to replace the vehicle every so many years. This is fundamentally what's wrong with society, and something we cannot overcome if our lives are ruled with the goal to make money, something that cannot be done if you're producing things to last rather than replace.

Tax the flip out of private jets.

We need cheaper domestic holidays. It can be cheaper to fly abroad with kids than a beach in UK

Tom's ability to calmly answer every question and reassure every doubt was very heartening. He is the sort of person who can get people on board.

I'm vegan, i don't buy clothes or random crap, i don't drive, i fly less than once a year. I still feel like nobody else cares

Re. Eating green. Specifically eating all food you buy. I'd say if your eating mostly plant based, you could start growing your own, if you have room, and therefore composting any fruit and veg that doesn't get consumed. Allowing it to not get wasted as it will add to the nutrition of the earth around us.

I started worrying about climate change more than 40 years ago after studying oceanography, and I ran out of worry a long time ago, but I still try to do what I can. I don't drive, I don't eat meat, my clothes all came from charity shops, it's more than 20 years since I boarded an aeroplane, and that was because it was the only way to get to France to sign documents in the time available, but I still felt guilty about it. I live the way I do because it is an internal compulsion, not because I think it will do any good.

Haven’t flown for 15 years so I’m due 3 trips 🤔😉

The obsession with flying is very recent but sold to us as if it were a fundamental right . Growing up in the 60s, I didnt take a plane flight until my late 20s. I took my last flight in 2012. If no-one else you know is doing it, you dont feel you're missing out. An air miles ration, doled out to everyone equally, is a very reasonable response in a world that is literally on fire

The reactions of these three (well, mainly Ollie and Ava) say it all… something tells me that if flights did become ten times more expensive and trains were better and cheaper (i.e., system change), they’d just argue that travel is a human right and shouldn’t be just for the rich - like Ava’s comment that working-class people should be able to over-consume too. Well yeah, but is getting everyone to an equally unhealthy level of consumption really the answer to inequality? Like Tom says, you have to try and change the culture as well as the system. But at the end of the day most people don’t want to give up the things they enjoy. People will study conversations like this in 30 years I reckon… rising levels of cognitive dissonance before any real sense of urgency kicks in. Until then, keep advocating a system change that you know deep down isn’t coming anytime soon, and carry on as normal :/

Great video! Just a quick mention, I love using Vinted for second hand stuff. Not only is it cheaper than buying new, most of the time people sell stuff that's never been used. I recently bought 2 vintage jumpers, a dress and some old books for less than £15. All arrived in perfect condition. I live on an island with no access to a clothes shop. So it's perfect for me. We should be showing pre-owned items more love.

Fossil fuel companies and governments 100% need to be taken to task on this stuff. But, consumers are a key part of our current systems. When 1,000s/ 1,000,000s of people make small, coordinated changes, that will have an effect on the system as a whole. A company won't keep making things that aren't selling, and governments are more likely to change laws when there is public appetite for it as a result of cultural change, built on the daily habits of many people. Every bit of single-use plastic you avoid, every disposable item of clothing you don't buy, and piece of meat you don't eat counts. Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.

Haven't flown in several years now. The worse part is when you're in IT yet companies still insist you visit a site that is in another country that you could fix remotely.

As a man who constantly gets literally 'ragged on' about the holy T-shirt I've had for twenty years, and the green tracksuit pants that I wore until they were nearly totally white mesh, I feel vindicated.

I gave up flying in 2019 and haven't missed it anywhere near as much as I thought. You can have great international travel experiences just by train. The last few years I've taken the Eurostar onto various destinations across mainland Europe. It can be more cost prohibitive and it definitely requires more upfront planning, but I prefer getting to experience the journey and see places along the way. There's a whole debate and discussion to be had about the subsidies in air travel, ghost flights to maintain airline slots in scheduling and the broken industry of carbon offsetting. Continually taking flights, like much of consumerism, is like borrowing against the planet's increasingly high interest credit card with the knowledge we're already in a shitload of debt.

I used to fly for work about 20 times a year. I was off work for a couple of years from 2016 and when I came back I just said I would go if any more. We just changed all the interactions to online stuff and it worked fine. I still travel 3 times a year but I do it by train.

Last holiday was by train from Mannheim (Germany) to Ljubljana (Slovenia) and Trieste (Italy). 4am start, 2pm arrive. €55 single pp. Booked two weeks in advance. ❤ the EU!

Great initiative. There's a real nirvana fallacy at play here. 'There's no point in me changing because the system isn't changing' . It doesn't absolve us of our moral obligation to do what is right.

It does feel hard sticking with ways to do your bit with the environment when you see that Neymar has travelled to Saudi Arabia from Paris in a private Boeing 737 jet, what is washing out my tomato tin going to do when that is happening regularly.

Sounds good to me, start at one flight a year and work up. If you dont fly anywhere you get free flight voucher you can sell to the highest bidder.

*IVE VISITED 55 COUNTRIES* but I stopped 10 years ago. It was part of a radical life change - I now live a very tiny minimalist life and that included not jetting off around the world I don't believe this "My actions won't change a thing, look at the people in China" If you belive that - why do you vote??? 1 vote had NEVER changed an election in the UK I also don't accept corporations pushing 100% of the responsibility onto consumers. But is an EVERYBODY and EVERY COMPANY problem - we ALL have to change.

This guy is right. Look at how consumers changed to free range eggs or drink driving. Do what you can.

Hmm. I'm not in bad shape for this one. Not big on buyin new clothes and quite happily what I have until it's threads. Haven't been on holiday since 2017. Have a minimal meat diet that could quite easily transition to veggie. I forgot the rest, not gonna lie. Feel like I can spin my exceptionally depressing life into a win!

One thing Labour could do to raise money for improved public transport is have taxes on private planes which increase with each flight.

Fortunately, much of what you can do for the environment is also good for your bank balance! :) Seal the airgaps in your home and add insulation to your windows, you'll waste less resources on heating and cooling. Grow celery as house plants, it likes indoor conditions, keeps your air fresh and can be harvested as needed. Dwarf root stock fruit trees can be grown in containers next to windows. Blueberries, black currants and raspberries are good options. If you have outdoor space, add biomass to the soil to compensate for all the dead soils humans create. Then you can grow bamboo for construction, or fuel plants, or food. You can buy fire brick makers that turn green waste, packaging and junk mail into winter fuel. Build with timber if you can, buy timber furniture. Everything timber is a carbon sink. Buy less appliances that save effort, physical activity is good for you! Don't use a garbage disposal or green waste bin. Compost if you have a big outdoor space, have a little worm farm if you don't. Anything you do to curb your own power bill is saving you cash and reducing emissions. So, home insulation is king. If you rent, you can still fix temporary insulated storm shutters over your windows in the depths of summer and winter. Expect jack from governments, people need to work on this stuff at the grass roots level. Most people use the 'I don't have time' excuse, but I think mostly that's just a cop out...... :D

The problem with travelling local is, especially parents, you have to go during the same time so locals in the beauty spots are overrun already, so what would it be like if everyone did? We only camp and we camp in the UK with our kid and even now with many many people going abroad, Devon/Cornwall/skye/lots of places in wales during summer are absolutely wild with people and so therefore so much more expensive

The majority of people already living like this in the west are typically ultra socially Conservative, like the Anabaptists ie. Amish and Mennonite (usually less strict than Amish, might have a car, but very few electrical items, modest living, no excess consumerism, home made clothes) and some very rural living people like Boer farmers in SA. Even Britain just 30 or 40 years ago was less consumerist than now. Shops were closed on Sundays, pubs were closed in the afternoons, very few short flights, events like Halloween involved buying some black crepe paper at the newsagent, not huge aisles packed with mountains of plastic items, more home made meals not ready meals and fast food.

18:26 There's a type of passionfruit that can be grown outdoors with delicious fruit in colder climates, and it was probably that that your colleague saw. Passiflora incarnata, commonly known as maypop because the fruit pops if you squeeze it or step on it, is apparently delicious and grows quite far north in The US, and can be grown here in the UK.

I think people should just reduce whatever it is they overconsume by 50%. A small thing we can all do, doesnt need laws, rules or dictates from above, doesnt even neeemd any complicted thinking or philosophy, you just cut your sugar in half, or your coffe in half, or your holidays in half.. whatever you do too much of. No rocket science needed.

Why is it that the individual is deemed responsible for climate change, when the worst offenders are industry and transport. I accept there are steps the individual can take to help, but what is the point if industry is not pulling it's weight as well?

I don't see why I should fly every three years, where would I even go? I can't remember the last time I left the country and it certainly wasn't on holiday. Been eating a plant-based diet since 1983, it was just called being a vegetarian then, now I grow my own, what doesn't get eaten gets composted. I make my own clothes or buy them from the chazzer and upcycle if need be. I don't drive. Yes the system needs to change, so we should make changes in order to put consumer pressure on, not altruistic self-denial. Planned obsolescence isn't a theory, it's a common manufacturing policy, which needs to be challenged - demand products that last. To use a cliche it doesn't have to cost the earth, I have never had any money. It does mean having to do without some things and one of the biggest obstacles are job requirements, businesses have to stop expecting employees to be able to attend a meeting in Bristol in the morning and London in the afternoon, it means a lot more working from home or working within cycling distance. You don't need a list of rules, it's about considering the impact of your actions on the planet and also understanding how rejecting consumerism and materialism generally can seriously improve the quality of your life. I'm just going to give up thinking I don't have anything to offer this conversation.

I think it would be fair for everyone to have a carbon allowance. So if you want to waste it on bacon butties and driving an SUV you can or you could just lead a low carbon lifestyle and use your credits on a holiday abroad or some expensive tech. The important thing would be that everyone starts to budget for carbon rather than just based on cost as cost in money provides things like tons of single use plastics and subsidised oil.

It's not right to start by saying emissions from jet engines are not huge in percentage terms. It's to do with where those emissions are being made. A little known fact about 9/11 that caught some peoples attention is that when America closed It's airspace for 10 days after the twin tower attacks, the meteorologists noticed that the daytime temperatures went up by one degree and night time temperatures went down by one degree. It's to do with contrails from jet engines creating an artificial cloud layer at 30k ft, stopping sunlight getting in and heat getting out. One degree might not sound like much but in meteorological terms, to see that change in a week was astonishing. Now think about Covid and the lack of flying for 18 months on a global scale and it may explain why 2020 was such a beautiful summer and why we are now seeing such extreme weather events, the climate had a chance to reset itself to where it should be. .

Realistically you don't have to holiday in the U.K. to avoid flying. You can take the train to Paris and then pretty much anywhere is western Europe is a few hours away. And there are loads of sleepers if you want to be adventurous and go further afield.

Cheese (also yoghurt and milk in general) contains dopamines (added there by the mother nature to sweeten our first ever food in life), so people miss cheese the most

Did Ed clean his bathroom after sharing a bath with a tuna?

The phobias are coming out: Ed’s ichthyophobia, Ava’s claustrophobia…Oli?

I've managed to cut out most new clothing (95% of what I buy is second-hand and I don't buy any fast fashion any more. Also, don't flood charity shops with crap - give decent stuff, re-use the worn out stuff as rags for cleaning etc and get the most function out of them), and I've reduced my meat & fish consumption a LOT. I could probably manage without cheese! (Vegan bread products gotta get better though, what passes for crumpets are a war crime 😞) And I resist buying new electronics. I don't look for a replacement til my phone basically stops functioning properly, and it's never the newest model. I don't drive, never have & probably never will. Travel is the hardest ask. I have a lot of beloved friends & family in the US, and going to see them once every 8 years would be hard to commit to. (Euro travel though, sure. Make the trains consistently affordable and I'll never get on a European flight again.)

Managed decline of the living standards of the working class. The Oligarchs driving this agenda will not cut back.

Sounds like I'm well on the way but I'll be damned if it is mostly because living is too expensive to be a good little capitalist consumer or even have some life experiences before shuffling off this mortal coil. Flights: Can't afford holidays anymore, even in the UK (Have in the past but it cost more than a package holiday & spending). Meat: Can't afford much meat anymore. Food: I waste almost nothing, I batch cook and only have to throw food out if life has messed with the planning. Appliances: I repair unless the cost of the spares don't make financial sense. Most of my electronics are rescued or repaired. Mobile: Chosen specifically for repairability (Fairphone 3). Vehicle: Bought a broken EV for cheap, repaired it. Clothes: Worn to tatters, gradually replacing with higher quality (more expensive) clothing that doesn't need as much washing (Merino and Alpaca Wool) I'm not an angel or a martyr, I'm lucky to be mechanically minded and hate to see the amount of resources wasted on flimsy, tacky crap.

How about first banning the unnecessary flights on private jet by the PM?

Great discussion thanks.

Go Olly, the voice is back !!

Interesting guest. Good to hear his stuff is based on solid numbers. And hes right. Govts wont act on climate unless the public demand it. Its chicken and egg.

If Tom thinks I'm going to Margate 2 in every 3 summers he's got another thing coming.

I think I just watch for the intros

*Fast Fashion* ... In the 80's the average number of wears an item of clothing in the UK got was 200 wears. Think of anything that you have in the wardrobe that you have worn 200 times.... Buy things you like, that you can match together. Look after them. Think if they really need to be washed between wears. Store them properly. It's totally doable to get long life from even cheaply bought things. For example, before I was aware of the mistreatment of garment workers in Asia, I bought a Primark t-shirt for 3 euro. That was 10.5 years ago, and I'm still wearing it, and it looks ok.

Re dishwashers, better still don't use one. Wash up by hand.

I don't holiday. Never left the UK, but I do live in the English riviera. Can't afford meat. I will eat it if offered, but it's cheaper to eat vegetarian. I eat once a day as is. Longevity of appliances is down to planned obsolescence. But I like to think I'm crafty enough to bypass that. Cloths are rarely bought but charity shops are a thing. I can't drive, so need public transport but I like walking most the time if I can. I don't do any of this with concern for the environment. I'm probably quite ignorant of it. But while I'm ignorant of it, I actually enjoy my life. So I can believe people making these changes are able to and can be just as content with life with excluding these things. Usually when we talk about personal responsibility for climate change, I struggle to understand what I can do to help it since I have no power to make impact-full changes. I guess this explains why I don't understand. I already do these things. Perspective is a wonderful thing. Could I be better? Of-course. But I don't know how. In my mind I'm living life to its fullest without sacrifice. Could this be a method of encouraging others to do the listed things without feeling like they sacrifice? It could be helpful.

Ayyyyy Oli has his voice back 😎

More time in our lives due to automation so get there by sailing ship.

Lol tell me where these Morleys are you can feed 4 for £10 I'll be down there in an instant feeding 1 for £15

Capital J Journalist. Had to look it up, now I get it.

boursin cheese is allowed to be made out of the region it comes from. not sure if it can be imported in though.

Donella Meadows says worldview and goals are the 2 biggest influence on system change.

Only ever flew twice in my life time

If yiu mention to people that you don't fly, they think you ard weird? Package holidays bevef appealed to me. I haven't flown for about 15 years, however, i use the car as the train system doesn't get me to where i want to get to.

Has Ava got a lisp in this video or is it just something weird with the audio (or my hearing)?

I haven't flown since 2006 , passport ran out 2013 , I need some catch up !

I pretty much do all these things already-coz I'm poor! 🤔

I guess not much is talked about cars and public transport. We just moved house and now can sell one of the cars and use much less petrol as I can walk to the train station. Some people can choose to live nearer public transport and should make a big difference

This show helped me drink after 15 years of sobriety.

"Drinking doesn't count id it's an event." What if drinking IS the event?

Id take my last flight out of this country. Dont want to be trapped here.

I go for one flight per decade and staying in your own country otherwise

What rave in Rhyl was it?

had the iphone 4s from new to 2018. it can be done.

*"It's very nuanced"* ... The problem is that it is a climate emergency. There is no time to wait to "nudge" the system. In the past, the societal changes that lead to increased greenhouse emissions eg the Industrial Revolution (mainly) were driven by scientific breakthroughs, and access to capital and cheap labour. Society had to mould itself around these developments. To say that it happened at the same time forgets to mention that it was involuntary. An independent (of politics) civil service branch should be tasked with managing the response to the climate emergency, whatever that might mean : planning for energy generation model; planning that man transport model etc. If that means a cap on the number of flights, then do it. If that means closing sections of motorways and diverting the money saved into an efficient and cheap rail network, do it. If that means buying up farms, or banning cow rearing, then do it. Things have to get radical and fast. This isn't something that "we can look back on in 50 years and say 'Wow, the change'." We need to make the changes real in the next 5 years.

If you only have one flight every 3 years, how you getting home?

diversity of tactics

Did a clip just this morning discussing this. Anyone got USA stats when flights were grounded after 9/11? But economics interferes, airline Capitol Hill lobbyists etc..

Hmm, I mean, I'm no expert, but one of the key selling points, specifically of white goods, is their improved energy efficiency. So, saying a washing machine from the 80s still works and therefore shouldnt be replaced sounds kind of dubious; after x washes to account for the energy cost of its manufacture then it would be better for the environment than continuing to use old tech.

We can only do what we need to do as a society if we force the rich to reign themselves in. In the case of the Global North countries it's going to be a bigger a shift. To make space for the Global South to develop.

We need vintage clothes to become cool.

Promoting anti-consumerist policy whilst wearing a Nike T-shirt, probably made in a sweat shop, made by a brand that epitomises consumerism. If that's not hypocrisy what is?

The clothes one is perhaps a bit misleading - I have to buy new socks and boxers every year as they just don't last, so that would easily be 25 new items of clothes a year alone. I find t-shirts and shirts don't last as long as they used to either, so just have to replace them more often.

Said the 6 a bit fast.

"...what's good about this, is that we can't actually afford to do it anyway." -Ava Santini💀 that deadpan delivery is killer! 😆

Air travel is a massive contributor to the pollution issue. London has 6 airports, one of which is the busiest international transport hub in the world. Heathrow. Much of its air traffic is freight demand. Stop expecting that Amazon parcel next day delivery would be a better start. Ask an Aerospace engineer on the level of pollution a jet engine produces in comparison to a modern ICE with emission control systems fitted in a car. Instead the focus is on private ownership of cars. There are no emission delete systems on a jet turbine. This is the most ill informed conversation ive witnessed recently and its focusing on having your cake and eating it on an individual basis. Limiting personal flights in no way equates to removing pollution from airliners when air freight demand has never been higher. You haven't even factored in the increasing demand on electricity grids and therefore fossil fuel usage just to provide power to enormous server farms for social media users to needlessly post pictures daily or pointless debates such as this one. If you want to reduce fossil fuel usage, start by reducing the needless server traffic/global electricity demand. Digital connectivity is killing the planet too. As for eating less meat, yes it has a possitive to the environment but Britain imports approx 50% of all its food requirements and is limited by how much arable land it has. You can't grow crops on a hillside, mountain, wetlands in a town or city etc. Britain already imports the majority of its grain from Canada, the US and South America via oil burning sea going tankers the size of container ships. Its fruit and veg from southern Europe and the middle east often out of season and you believe increasing that demand will be better for the environment.

So only 1 short haul flight every three years and 1 long haul flight in 8? So what is gonna happen regarding the Olympics, World Cup, and other major sporting events? Let alone medical research and business or visiting elderly relatives abroad

Also, regards travel and public transport usage. Its TOO EXPENSIVE normal people cant do it. Its so much cheaper to drive. We're going as a family ti Bristol for my birthday for the weekend, to drive our ev its peanuts, even booking 3 months in advance, its £248 for 2 adults and our son is free. The hotel is only £80 for 2 nights. Plus if you don't drive when you camp, you can't carry all your stuff? So its just inconceivable.

How is personal responsibility unimportant? The idea that corrupt oligarchs, psychotic barons and pathological narcissists will steer the vessel for max. common weal is NOT going to happen. Personal consumption matters. Reduce meat at the least.

I was discussing this with my Dad recently in a car journey. We are both very environmentally concerned but very keen on travel. He's in his 60s and hardly flies anymore but flew A LOT for work when he was younger and saw much of the world, whereas I love travelling but cant afford to do it very much because of aome career setbacks. We were saying how a few flights per year per person seems fair, or there shouuld be an airmiles allowance so you can decide how to use it, or can buy or trade carbon credits or whatever by paying for offsetting or similar. To me, 2 or three short-mid haul (same continent) flights for recreation per year seems fine, it just does make me feel funny seeing people flying to 5+ long haul destinations per year purely to drink cocktails and take instagram pictures at the beach. Is this really a good thing to destroy Earth for? Living in the UK becomes much more palatable when able to travel once or twice to actually see the sun, and I'd be willing to limit to one or two per year, but flying once every 3/8 years is not gonna cut it for me personally.

I've worked in sustainable engineering for 8 years and think this is a bit rubbish - schemes need to incentivise people to change behaviour, not guilt them into it. For example no one wanted a Nissan Leaf but then Tesla made electric cars cool and everyone wants one. Same needs to happen with better public transport, cheaper vegan food, more sustainable clothing etc. The responsibility isn't with the "consumer", it's with Governments and corporations.

These rules scream privilege. Mate the solution is to get legislation to curb industrial abuse of the environment not have individuals (the majority of whom are poor) to make personal choices

Church traditions? How enlightened. Opinion of panel plummeting.

Still hate the intro!! But the content is generally good 😢😊

3 minutes of listening to these fools is enough.

so this was amazing, really interesting and inspirational. Thanks for featuring this guy!!!!

I love this podcast, but hese are the type of ideas a sixth former would could up with.

Limiting flights is such a European centric approach. This is a very small piece of land very well connected - at least Western Europe. Would this approach work in other continents such as the Americas, Asia or Africa? Anyone who has lived in any of these continents knows the answer.

Great document....check the new stuff, from the top team...lacking.

Stop travel? Naw 😂

The argument that rich people can afford to be consumerist in a sustainable way whilst poor people can't and that's therefore unfair is... a weird take. If you want to be consumerist and can't afford to... you can't afford to ethically do so... so don't. And to be clear that's different to poverty and only having the money to buy unsustainable stuff... that's obviously awful... but choosing to have an unsustainable hobby is a choice and if you can't afford for it to be sustainable that's not unfair in any reasonable objective definition of the term.

Fo not Tel me how to live my life .

"I suck at eating everything I buy" If you invest in a chicken coup and get a couple of chickens, if you are already buying green they will happily eat what you don't and you get eggs as the reward. Sell or trade the eggs if you don't eat them. Almost no food waste this way. This has already worked in France, Belgium and other countries.

love podcasts hating answers it's the politics joke podcast ladies and gentlemen

This is half a solition. Without wealth redistribution and reform in labour relations its just middle class people cosplaying the working poor, who then loose their jobs.

Consumerism is good. It creates wealth, keeps people in jobs and creates taxes which pays for services like our NHS.