The billion dollar race to fix phone batteries

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Күн бұрын

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Lithium-Ion batteries were commercialized in the 1990s by Sony, and since then, very little has changed in the battery market. Capacity increases are slow and incremental, and only fast charging is improving at quick rates. Let's take a look at why.
The Story Behind - ep. 86
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Пікірлер: 1 400

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

We have 2 bonus videos with ~40 minutes of extra content this time: 1. Breaking down fast charging tech: nebula.app/videos/techaltar-how-fast-charging-took-over 2. Interview with Counterpoint Research: nebula.app/videos/techaltar-interview-with-peter-richardson-counterpoint-research The Nebula / CuriosityStream bundle is no longer active. Instead, you can sign up for Nebula directly with my discount now for about $2.5 a month with a yearly plan, which includes Nebula Originals AND the whole Nebula Classes platform, too, including my own class. Sign up here: go.nebula.tv/techaltar

@adilator Жыл бұрын

No thanks. Very informative youtube video though.

@cezarcatalin1406 Жыл бұрын

There is one element that wants to get rid of its electron and is lighter than lithium and it’s plenty abundant: Hydrogen Now if only there was a nice way of compacting lots of it in a tiny area without using extreme pressures.

@sailaab Жыл бұрын

👌🏽👍🏼

@nsubugakasozi7101 Жыл бұрын

I dont know why you say nebula is 15 dollars a year....from the links you shared its 80 dollars a year and 8 dollars a month. Basically its a really slightly cheaper netflix

@ZverseZ Жыл бұрын

Graphene batteries are the new lithium batteries. Sure no one wants to invest but you can't deny the insane advantages

@myrandomusername123 Жыл бұрын

I have a drawer full of old phones I can't use due to their dead batteries... You could say they're free of charge.

@ahdhudbbh Жыл бұрын

Ba dum tish

@slyceth Жыл бұрын

Can i have one?

@charleschaimkohl Жыл бұрын

Lol

@AtulKedia Жыл бұрын

You should recycle them so that the Li, Ni, Co can be used in new devices. Atleast the battery.

@vanditjain9587 Жыл бұрын

😂😂😂😂

@jbq Жыл бұрын

I am a battery engineer, and I have to say that this was very well researched. With phone batteries in particular, they rely very heavily on cobalt because they are almost exclusively LCO-based chemistry. Compared with cars which are typically NMC, NCA, or more recently LFP as you mentioned.

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

Happy to hear!

@jesuslcampillo1989 Жыл бұрын

And what happened to graphene batteries? I've been years hearing from them. I think even there is an expensive powerbank made with a graphene battery

@Markel_A Жыл бұрын

@@jesuslcampillo1989 The technology is still in it's infancy.

@CrayCrayslab Жыл бұрын

I have no idea what you're saying but I'll toss a like anyway

@framedthunder6436 Жыл бұрын

@@Markel_A Is good the real deal is they need to find how to produce in large scale

@btfilther Жыл бұрын

I am honestly OK with the battery charge density as of now, but I think that the near term goal is to make them last at least twice as longer in terms of charging cycles. I am ok with charging my phone every day, but I am not ok with the battery degradation.

@vanjagrigoriev1442 Жыл бұрын

I think you're fine with it because companies have had to adapt to it. Try to imagine what companies could create if batteries were half as large and twice as dense. I think it could create new form-factors and greatly improve some of the stuff we have today.

@willstikken5619 Жыл бұрын

@@vanjagrigoriev1442 While Boris is accepting reality and highlighting an actual problem you countered with "imagine if physics didn't exist"?

@vanjagrigoriev1442 Жыл бұрын

@@willstikken5619 my point is that it's easy to be content. Before smartphones exusted people were content with the phones that existed because it's hard to imagine the stuff that hasn't been invented yet. Looking back smartphones might seem obvious, but at the time I don't think they were.

@willstikken5619 Жыл бұрын

@@vanjagrigoriev1442 I have some difficultly reading that into your comments but it is valid. Right now, we live in a world where people have conflated regular marketing 'advancements' with real technical innovation. This leads to the effect swinging the other way. Companies have set an expectation that they will announce seemingly wondrous technologies every year at their respective events each year and on schedule. When this fails to happen, people have all sorts of irrational reactions. People in general lack the technological or scientific literacy to grasp what’s going on. They only know that their unrealistic expectations were not met. What we end up with is a situation where, as you noted, people’s imaginations are limited by their experiences but also their expectations are set by their perceptions. People are unable to envision the next big thing while also believing in magic nanobots and satellites that can zoom and enhance to check your eye color…

@adr1ano1987 Жыл бұрын

Oppo battery health engine promises 80% battery life after 1600 charge cycles. That's double the current standard of 800 charge cycles

@MohamedSalahYouTube Жыл бұрын

My main problem with lithium ion batteries Is their health declining over time Battery health degradation honestly gives me anxiety

@jesuslcampillo1989 Жыл бұрын

Especially nowadays, when companies sell us 800e phones without replaceable batteries. Furthermore, without a way to buy an official battery down the road if you want to pay for a replacement.

@nieldewet5315 Жыл бұрын

This is a problem with all batteries...

@1337Jogi Жыл бұрын

It is mostly a problem for phone or laptop batteries. To make them fast chargeable and high energy density the cut alot of corners. Car and (local) grid storage batteries seem to have much better lifetimes in the range of 10-30 years. Of course with declining capacity but that is not such a massive deal.

@1337Jogi Жыл бұрын

@@Niiju Yes but they also use a different kind of Li-Ion Battery. Also they do not pack the batteries quite so dense in cars as weight and space is less of a problem. Also they always have extra unused battery cells that are used as backup for stressed or failing cells. Plus 100% charge in a car is not really 100% of the battery pack - probably more like 80-90. The car does not give you access to the full 100% possible charge. What is most taxing and wears your battery out very fast is charging beyond 80%. That is why it is recommended to hold your phone charged between 30-70%.

@1337Jogi Жыл бұрын

@@Niiju I think it is not hard at all. I let it rarely fall to 20% or less and try to unplug at 90% latest. Does not work all the time but often enough. Regarding your car you should inform yourself if that is needed. Since some(alot) car companies actually do that 80/90% max charge for you, there might be no need to do so yourself. And I am not talking that your car stops at 90% charge and displays it so like you can set as a setting in some phones. I mean that the 100% of your car might actually be 80-90% of the actual total charge.

@miiiikku Жыл бұрын

When we look at Moores law of doubling number of transistors on chip every two years, we might feel tempted to think similar development is possible in other technologies, but its not.

@AlexFoster2291 Жыл бұрын

I'd say the growth of new solar photovoltaic installations is close

@4G12 Жыл бұрын

@@AlexFoster2291 1st law of thermodynamics: Allow me to introduce myself...

@AlexFoster2291 Жыл бұрын

@@4G12 non sequitur = bot?

@TheGoukaruma Жыл бұрын

@@AlexFoster2291 Don't assume bots when stupidity is sufficient.

@joey199412 Жыл бұрын

@@4G12 He doesn't mean the efficiency of solar panels. He means the amount of solar panels installed is growing at an exponential rate, which is actually true we almost install double the solar PV capacity every year compared to the year before, and this trend has been steady since the 1990s up until 2022. If we continue at this exponential growth rate then by 2035 all electrical generation could come from solar PV. non-electric power usage would still come from fossil fuels though.

@francescogiuseppearagona1109 Жыл бұрын

As a chemist (who is also interested in electronics) i have something to point out: - Not only sodium is heavier than lithium, but it also have a slightly lower (well actually higher, because it's a negative value) redox potential (talking about the Na / Na+ couple), and even more importantly it has a larger radius, which make it difficoult to intercalate it in a crystalline stucture, such as graphite (Na also forms dendrites when crystallizing). Na is also much more reactive than Li, exploding in contact with water instead of "just burning", but at least it doesn't burn in N2... - EVs are the devices which benefit the most from Li-ion tech: since they have to carry around the battery, the lighter this is the less energy you waste in carrying it around. Using a less energy dense battery type on EVs is ideally wrong. For stationary devices, on the other hand, weight is not an issue. - Silicon doesn't have any energy storage power, because it's not involved in the redox cycle. The sole responsible for energy storage in Li-ion batteries is lithium, and this is why you would want to use pure lithium as your anode, instead of using lithium ions intercalated in graphite / silicon. Unfortunately this is impossible, because of lithium's tendency to form dendrites, which then short the battery, triggering an explosion. This is ultimately due to lithium's crystalline structure (which cannot be changed). - Solid state batteries were thought to be a way to prevent dendrites formation, hence to use pure lithium as an anode, eliminating the need for an intercalating material (such as graphite / graphene or silicon), thus increasing energy density. However, solid electrolites looks to be ineffective to limit the formation of dendrites. - Making batteries more energy dense would be extremely dangerous: since batteries contain a full redox system they are essentially a fuel which already contain the oxidizer to burn it. In other words they're a lot like gunpowder, or thermite (which is the best analogy, due to its metallic nature). The fact that Li has the lowest (-3.07 V for Li / Li+ couple) redox potential of the entire periodic table doesn't help: it basically means it can burn in everything using everything as an oxidizer (apart from noble gases). It's also one of the two known metals (the other one being magnesium) capable of burning in a pure nitrogen atmosphere. This is why Li ion batteries are considered a dangerous good and can't be shipped on airplanes. In synthesis, Li ion battery technology has reached its full potential speaking of energy density. We have kinda reached the end of Moore's Law for batteries. If an improvement to battery life can be made, this will come from software optimization, SOCs specifically designed for mobiles (such as Apple A series), new manifacturing process nodes and more efficient displays.

@cyan_2169 Жыл бұрын

What is your opinion on solid state batteries as a future technology? Is it bunk science?

@Niemand80 Жыл бұрын

@@cyan_2169 the company ElecJet will build a 'test production line', which starts producing in Q1 2023. Here they'll build solid state batteries.

@jacobarcher1097 Жыл бұрын

@@cyan_2169 as a chemist with a chemist friend who's masters project was on solid state batteries I wouldn't say SS batteries are bunk science but they're not as close to creation as is stated by corporations and their benifits may not actually be as good as first predicted atleast for a long while

@IonorRea Жыл бұрын

-Czechs-made HE3DA battery which you can shoot at and it will not start burning, though the cost will be higher, it may be a better choice for home solutions in places where house destroying natural disasters (tornados, earthquakes) are common like the US. The most useful will be HE3DA for aerospace & military though as dealing with lithium fire on diesel-electric submarines would be problematic, that's for sure. Currently, only a few mostly Asian submarines from early 2000 onwards use lithium batteries, and with further development when coupled to Sterling engine or hydrogen assisted energy storage like on German subs can possibly displace the need for nuclear subs even for larger nations in the future. -Solids state batteries are likely the future because they charge faster and presented models do not last as many cycles, which is perfect for car producers that want to sell you a new car every decade or two while claiming how they care about the environment. The fact that they can precisely time when you will need to buy a new car by using a battery with limited charging cycles which many will actually prefer just to shave off a few minutes from supercharging is pretty much the perfect way for guarantee planned obsolescence for people living in cities without own garage that will want such batteries in their cars. Batteries on current Teslas and South Korean passenger cars that can recharge from 20-80% under 20 minutes are already more than good enough from performance and service life standpoint for 95% of the population that have their own garage and do not need to tow heavy cargo on regular basis, it's more than plausible that future generation of car batteries would not last as long when there will be no ICE car alternatives anymore which would allow customers to protest against likely trend of cheaping out on future car batteries. -As a buyer of higher quality electronics I am personally far more interested in long-lasting batteries than ones that can charge a bit faster or adds 15-25% energy density improvements at the expense of service life, Mrwhostheboss made a video on bulging Samsung phone batteries that did not like European heatwaves, did Samsung used different chamistry for European market as they once used different chips compared to what the US got? Searching for replacement battery decade or two down the line is with the current rate of progress rather problematic, at least some producers allow you to purchase AA/AAA battery pack replacement for original li-ion battery so you don't need to horde lithium-ion batteries for various measuring and radio equipment that tends to last decades.

@ZverseZ Жыл бұрын

"we've reached the end of moore's law for batteries" Surprised how you know so much about current technology, but yet know nothing about future technology. I'm talking about the most mainstream future material, Graphene. A graphene battery could charge batteries up to 10x faster, whilst also being able to store more charge in a smaller form factor than lithium. It has the same issue that lithium batteries had, and that's becoming commercial. But yeah we're far from reaching the end of "Moore's Law".

@TheGoukaruma Жыл бұрын

They could also try to reduce the power that the phone needs. New displays or low energy CPUs could help to make the battery last longer.

@JolleBoiii Жыл бұрын

I mean, that's exactly what they are doing. Given that companies like Apple and Samsung are stuck with current battery technology, it would be foolish to not optimize the phones energy efficiency. When it comes to displays for example, OLED's are more power efficient than LCD's for most image content, variable frame rates save loads of energy without sacrificing performance. And an example for CPU’s is Apples A15 bionic chip's performance cores which improved energy efficiency by 17% on it’s peak performance versus the previous A14 chip. Furthermore; software is very much responsible for power consumption, not just hardware

@algot34 Жыл бұрын

or RLCD screens which reduce energy needs by like 70%

@monhi64 Жыл бұрын

Yeah that’s what they’re doing but that’s exactly what’s holding phones back. If you’re gonna reduce power consumption it’ll also reduce the speed of the phone (99% of the time). So the video was talking about how it’s the bottleneck in a ton of products reliant on batteries

@realspeedghxst Жыл бұрын

@@monhi64 instead why don't you make the architecture so powerful and ahead of it's time and then underclock it's power so it will last like 5 years and will be efficient I mean that's what ARM architecture is and why apple went to that for their computers witj the M1 chips, but also CPU architecture needs to evolve

@MarcABrown-tt1fp Жыл бұрын

@@realspeedghxst Easier said then done. they have been trying to do that for 2 years, ARM CPU tech hasn't been able to improve density it has hit a brick wall where it can improve no further without using new materials.

@cgerman Жыл бұрын

Perhaps the most significant problem is that batteries actually degrade, which means that their capacity slowly becomes smaller and smaller. Which means after a certain amount time you will need to replace it.

@trignite 4 ай бұрын

This is a problem for consumers, not manufacturers though

@SYNDESTV Жыл бұрын

Great video! Hope developers can focus on making computing more energy efficient since battery capacity has hit a plateau

@carholic-sz3qv Жыл бұрын

Computing has also always evolved and to become more efficient, from the smallest 5nm node to, galium nitrite mosfets………

@Dada228822 Жыл бұрын

Hence Apple switching to ARM, and Microsoft soon copying.

@carholic-sz3qv Жыл бұрын

@@Dada228822 bullshit!! You realise that Microsoft did the ARM thing first right!? The Microsoft surface RT almost a decade ago had an ARM chip but it was way too earlier for its implementation, you’re welcome!!

@nobeltackful1 Жыл бұрын

@@carholic-sz3qv Not like it is mater to the context but you do know, that Apple-ARM made the ARM RISC processor for Apple Newton in 1992 right? The lackluster support and investment from MS in Windows RT and later versions of "Windows for ARM" contributed hugely to the commercial failures. That only makes the success of Apple with ARM more impressive.

@carholic-sz3qv Жыл бұрын

@@nobeltackful1 lame comment!!! Apple was only able to make ARM chips viable recently for their desktop, back then the Microsoft surface rt was way too early to the market and also windows also had to run on intel, nvidia, AMD cpu and GPU unlike Apple only intel and AMD GPU.

@willmather4046 Жыл бұрын

I think for mobile tech the other side of the equation might be as important as battery tech. Apple virtually doubled battery life in their MacBook range by switching from Intel to Apple Silicon. I think a shifted emphasis to efficiency across the market is pretty important. Obviously there's less room to squeeze in the smartphone market where efficiency has been a much bigger factor already but I expect there's still some room to move in that space. At the moment we seem to be getting bigger and bigger phones with hungrier processors and bigger batteries for steadily diminishing returns.

@michaeljohnson89 Жыл бұрын

Apple switched from X86 to ARM. Phones are already ARM so not much improvement is to be had

@Jona69 Жыл бұрын

@@michaeljohnson89 The efficiency improvement largely comes from the density of chips.

@danzjz3923 Жыл бұрын

@@michaeljohnson89 A15 was a pretty big efficiency jump?

@imerence6290 Жыл бұрын

@@michaeljohnson89 See the Risc-V instructions set

@LeonardTavast Жыл бұрын

There isn't going to be much gains in terms of efficiency. Screens need energy to light up and modems need energy to send and recieve signals. Even if SoCs manage to do computations with fewer and fewer electrons there will still be other parts of the phone that are hard to make more efficient. I don't see a paradigm shift on the horizon. Folding phones are trying to change the form factor but are expensive, fragile and fail to impress. I believe that in 5 years from now phones will look similar as they do today, only more optimized.

@mscbijles1256 Жыл бұрын

Potentially, there might be better charge carriers than lithium in the guises of beryllium and boron. Both elements are only slightly heavier than lithium, but carry more charge (electrons to give away) than lithium. Potentials issues though are availability of the element and how willing they are to give their electrons away in the battery.

@andreirachko Жыл бұрын

…but what if you ask them nicely? :D

@egeyamak394 Жыл бұрын

@@andreirachko Lithium has the highest oxidation potential among all the elements in the periodic table.

@manakmishra Жыл бұрын

It's not about availability of electrons but it's reduction potential

@mscbijles1256 Жыл бұрын

@@manakmishra I know lithium has the highest potential in that regard. But I’m not sure how the potential power output compares, a higher voltage for Li vs. a higher possible current (more electrons to give away) for Be might make them comparable. My knowledge about that is however insufficient to make any claims here.

@drac124 Жыл бұрын

The least improved part of a smartphone is resistance. You used to buy a phone and that's it. Use it. Now you have to buy a screen cover, a phone cover. Phones used to drop on the floor and one piece got to each side of the room, you put them together and done. Now it scratches, breaks, etc. We are now using expensive fragile bricks made of glass rather than a decent piece of hardware that can stand day to day use.

@saygoodnighttoghosts Жыл бұрын

Well, yeah, phones became multimedia powerhouses during that time. Phones are becoming more durable, though. I should know, I'm part of the small segment of the population funding them. My three most recent phones having been the Unihertz Titan, Pocket, and RAZR 5G. Flexible displays seem to be promising and I hope that cost of ownership continues to trend downward in years to come. What are your thoughts on foldables and their impact on durability?

@drac124 Жыл бұрын

@@saygoodnighttoghosts Yes there are indeed many hardcore brands (don't know if this is the right name for it). I even thought about buying one of those twice, but the hardware isn't impressive. I don't really like the idea of foldable phones. Its kinds of build an extra step to use the phone. But I really like the idea of slidable phones. I had once a Motorola that the keyboard slides and it was a physical keyboard. Was pretty good. No problem with durability and convenient to slide. A screen that expands would be much better. You use the phone in the regular way and if you need extra space just slide it. Foldable on the other side they make an even narrow rectangle, kind of makes you need to always open to use. Plus I think its less durable, but who knows. The idea of a screen that folds or slide is good, considering the current size of screen is too small for the amount of things we do in our phones. I have a Galaxy Note 20 Ultra and I think the screen is not large enough. I use desktop most of the time, specially for shopping. Phones are too small.

@kornaros96 Жыл бұрын

Nokia again.

@ExclamationMarx 9 ай бұрын

@@drac124 I'm on a Fold4 at the moment & the cover screen is actually really usable even with my big hands. I only do maybe 25% of my usage on the main screen. But the times where I do need the big screen, it's incredible

@WaterZer0 2 ай бұрын

What the fuck are you on m8? I've dropped my old Samsung Galaxy countless times, and it has maybe one scratch.

@TheStigma Жыл бұрын

As far as phones go, I've never understood why they don't just make them like 30% thicker. That should allow for maybe a doubling of battery size, and if it wasn't for this "form over function" obsession with getting ever slimmer electronics, it would be hard to even notice the difference. I would take double battery life in exchange for a few extra mm thickness any day. It's a much worse problem in other devices where you can't so easily just expand the battery - like a smartwatch for example. And this is why I think we are heading for a potential disaster with the rate at which we are carelessly using lithium/cobalt and those other very limited materials to power everything. For wearables we really have no other good options right now due to the density and weight needs - but it is a terrible idea to use lithium-battery tech for large-scale grid storage for example. We will already struggle to make all the lithium batteries we need for EVs (where weight is also crucial). Let's not waste these precious resources for static batteries too where size and weight is much less of a factor. The unfortunate reality is that very few people with real power over how the market develops care about sustainability. It's all powered by shortsighted greed. if there is profits to be made right now and lithium is marginally better suited right now, then they will use it even in cases where it's arguably not needed. Even if it will end up making the tech prohibitively expensive for later generations. Sure - we may have managed to create better alternative batteries at a reasonable cost before we hit the brick wall on this, but that's not guaranteed by any means - and it is very irresponsible to just assume that science will save us out of every pinch like this.

@Z4KIUS Жыл бұрын

some extra thickness makes the devices more comfortable to hold but please, make them narrower and shorter!

@TheMrLucasP Жыл бұрын

@@Z4KIUS So basically we are going back to their original form factor

@Z4KIUS Жыл бұрын

@@TheMrLucasP well, I just want to safely handle my phone with a single hand

@TheMrLucasP Жыл бұрын

@@Z4KIUS True, the latest flagships became massive

@sttonep242 Жыл бұрын

I'm all for that, I like thicker. But it would also make it heavier

@anubhavforall Жыл бұрын

The consistency !!! As usual, a well explained video. 🙂

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

Glad you liked it!

@haldyrs.telvanni4829 Жыл бұрын

Well having an option to replace just the battery in my phone would be another way to make it better. Even if they managed to make it last double at new, what is the point if it doesn't last a day after two years of use.

@palamidagheo4520 Жыл бұрын

the point is to make you to buy a new phone every 2 years at least

@TylerMBuller12 Жыл бұрын

@@palamidagheo4520 Yep that's pretty much the case if you notice with any product bought there always seems to be a weak spot and that's on purpose because they want you to buy another. Making a phone that lasts forever isn't profitable to these companies.

@mjjjuly Жыл бұрын

well, i tried this tactic a few years ago. i bought a phone with a replaceable battery. two years in, the battery won't last a single day so i tried to buy a replacement. problem is, phone model has been discontinued and i cannot find an official battery replacement being sold, so i had to resort with an off-brand replacement. it didn't last for a year.

@TylerMBuller12 Жыл бұрын

@NTVEL Martynas It's not that easy to remove a glass/metal back glued on especially for someone with no experience in doing so not only that the price of those tools add up. Idc what the phone looks like I really don't I always put my phone in a case I'd much rather have a easily removable shell no tool required. I'll take functionality over form and day. Sure phones look pretty now but just imagine if I could easily hot swap my 5000 mah battery on the fly and also have a SD card slot. The look of the phone is the least important aspect to me and trust me they could make the phone look nice even with a removable back and they could probably make it out of metal if they wanted to as well it's just they want the general consumer to buy another whole phone rather then replace the battery themselves also the average consumer is probably more enticed by looks it would be nice if they at least made a version of the phones with these features just to see how they would sell in a more modern time.

@toshineon Жыл бұрын

@NTVEL Martynas That's what they say, but as far as I can remember, the Samsung Galaxy S5 was dust/water resistant, and also had a removable battery cover. There's also the Fairphone 4, which has some water and dust resistance, although admittedly not as much as some other phones, while also being the only modern smartphone I know of that has the classic removable back cover.

@TheEuropeanFox Жыл бұрын

This is a better summary of upcoming battery technology than any other video I have seen discussing the topic.

@the7observer Жыл бұрын

I think the next step is to make much more efficient chipsets rather than more powerful ones + industries research alternatives to Lithium-ion/polymer not only in phones but for other specific applications (like lithium iron phosphate for drones) so the demand for components for lithium-ion/polymer is reduced

@Arkan_Fadhila Жыл бұрын

But improving chipsets efficiency become more and more difficult too as lithography process improvement become slower every years

@LiveType Жыл бұрын

Yes, see the new Logitech hyperx headset. Laser focus on efficiency even at the expense of features. 300+ hour battery life on a ~6Wh battery. Or a battery less than half the size of what smartphones use nowadays.

@stormburn1 Жыл бұрын

@@Arkan_Fadhila A, shall I say, "courageous" option would be to settle on a standard performance level for phones that has no need to be surpassed. This way any efficiency gains wouldn't be immediately offset by increased processing demands. For example, take the Raspberry Pi 4 whose processor is currently manufactured with a 28nm process (however that correlates to Intel and TSMC's process definitions). Imagine setting that as the performance target, but using a 7nm process. 1/4 the nanometers means 1/16th the chip surface area and theoretically about 1/16th the power consumption. I'm sure the math isn't that clean in practice, but the point is the triangle of tradeoffs for chips is basically power consumption, cost/size, performance. If we sacrificed performance, we could have incredibly small chips that use very little power. That's a tough sell marketing-wise, but I think plausible with the right branding as a "lifestyle" brand of product where owning a low-power phone signals detachment from the treadmill of endless tech consumption.

@Arkan_Fadhila Жыл бұрын

@@stormburn1 really agree with you. and hopefully people will realize that processor with higher efficiency is more needed compared to processor with just higher performance alone.

@KrolKaz Жыл бұрын

Nah. I want more powerful chippers not ones that are more efficient. Efficiency is boring.

@charleschaimkohl Жыл бұрын

I'm glad you're back. These videos are some of the best that are out there!

@natidadon Жыл бұрын

I admire your graphs and visualization abilities even more than your great content and topics. Every time I'm watching your videos I'm taking screen shots to show people the beautiful graph I just saw in your video. Thanks a lot.

@Alex-zs7gw Жыл бұрын

Such a good vid!! Been following for years and quality has always been impeccable But whilst I'm gushing... I'm so glad I'm a child of the walkman era - such a gamechanger to all of tech, and both Sony and Ninetendo used to feel so on it 👌 back then.

@thcoura Жыл бұрын

Something that is needed to included and considered is that the modern SOCs got incredibly smart with Power management. Drop voltage, control clock speed and activity, cut power of features that are not in use and the list goes on

@computerfan1079 Жыл бұрын

I really like this video. I have seen a lot of videos claiming "the next big thing" is only a few years away. This is an honest overview which is a lot more useful

@thefamilyguy2552 Жыл бұрын

Been waiting for these types of contents regarding battery technology

@lucjanooo Жыл бұрын

Great video! Finally a clear description of battery tech

@urban94 Жыл бұрын

One of my favourite videos of yours!

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

Happy to hear!

@blastu99 Жыл бұрын

Sad that a few years ago there was a supposing GRAPHENE Battery that was to come out it seems that has Poof from existence (not really but you get what I'm saying)

@syarifairlangga4608 Жыл бұрын

The rich elite need to buy the land first before it can be mass produced. It always happened

@attomicchicken Жыл бұрын

We need to kick Sony's bum and get them to pull the same move they did with li-ion.

@HALLish-jl5mo 2 ай бұрын

A lot of batteries are really promising as a single cell in a lab, but are unsuitable for some reason when you try and mass produce a full battery to use in real world conditions.

@Ali-M2 22 күн бұрын

@@attomicchickenthey announced in 2016 they would make lithium sulfur batteries commercial by 2020 but in 2017 they sold their battery business

@dav2mai Жыл бұрын

Writing a paper on batteries and this video cleared up some confusion I had, thanks!

@davidgrisez 2 ай бұрын

Since I was born in 1951 I remember in my young years that there were two main rechargeable battery technologies. One of them was the lead acid battery, such as used in cars. The other was nickel-cadmium battery known is the Ni-Cad battery. Now we have these lithium batteries that can hold a lot of energy for their size and weight.

@hsuyang3246 Жыл бұрын

Would love to see some statistics on the median and variance of battery life :)

@sarveshyadav6902 Жыл бұрын

I am very happy that story behind is now back and uploading regularly.

@ac3_train3r_blak34 Жыл бұрын

This video was incredible. Thanks for bringing this to the world!

@amirmirzaei3940 Жыл бұрын

I don't care about charge speed, I care about longevity. If I was forced to charge my phone at 5w for it to live 2 extra years, I'll take that any day than 120w charging

@ANGELRA Жыл бұрын

I am an electronic engineer, but I don't study batteries. From my limited knowledge the only tech discussed in this video that can improve the battery longevity is the solid state battery.

@PowerScissor Жыл бұрын

Luckily the scenario you describe is very possible. Charging at 5w will give you at least 2 more years than charging at 120w. Most Androids allow you to terminate charging at 85% nowadays also which will also help.

@SirFaceFone Жыл бұрын

Get a 5W charger.

@Odust Жыл бұрын

Right to repair is the better sollution I guess

@mrfarid8562 Жыл бұрын

@@SirFaceFone BASED

@mikatu 5 ай бұрын

I think the main problem with batteries is their decay. If they remained working correctly we could keep using them as-is. But they lose their properties quite fast and require replacement or at least an external charge at some point. The only reason I am replacing my iPhone 6S now is the battery, the phone works just fine for me, but the battery is pretty much gone after a little usage.

@lwwells Жыл бұрын

“Batteries are holding progress back”…. Or focus on improving the energy efficiency of displays, processors, and antennas maybe…

@TillRiedell 3 ай бұрын

Im a chemichal engineering student. More than half of my professors' areas of research are solid state batteries. Very hot right now.

@appuser Жыл бұрын

I wasn't expecting to learn so much so quickly... subbed.

@nutzeeer Жыл бұрын

They are getting better in the way of being managed. I have set an alert when the battery is outside the 35-75% range, which helps prolong its life a lot.

@a.g.9437 Жыл бұрын

I have an idea. Why don't we make removable batteries in our smartphones. Just imagine how awesome it would be, if we could open our phones and take out the batteries by hand without special tools.

@bymicromize Жыл бұрын

Hehe this made me giggle

@stalincat2457 Жыл бұрын

You can! You start by heating up the device and using priers to remove the glass. Taking care not to damage the glass. Or the battery. Or the mainboard. And you know what, the glass will probably break so just order a replacement screen alongside the battery. Also that new screen might have a fingerprint reader that isn't paired to the mainbo- oh yeah I think I see where you are going with this.

@salgen1319 6 ай бұрын

As a Fairphone owner I feel obligated to yell FAIRPHONE HAS THIS!!!!

@DroidHolicOfficial Жыл бұрын

That was one Fascinating video. Amazingly explained 🔥

@1337Superfly Жыл бұрын

great to see a new story behind video. Bears looking sharp✌️

@slvshy666 4 ай бұрын

it's absolutely mind boggling to me that one of the biggest challenges for EVs is that we literally cannot trust humans around the globe to not abuse one another while extracting resources.

@harrytowers1076 3 ай бұрын

The billionaires paying the people extracting the resources don’t care whether humans are abused in the process. Only if the rest of the world will find out before they make all their money

@maxofb7745 Жыл бұрын

Yes, this old battery tech is holding more powerful gadgets back. BUT -hear me out- it also forces companies to make their processors and stuff more and more efficient to squeeze more performance out of every mAh the battery can deliver.

@deniseengle4269 Жыл бұрын

You are a treasure. Elsewhere in comments there are engineers lauding the accuracy and comprehension of this video whilst I on the complete opposite end of the spectrum feel like I didn't get lost in your explanation once, not one bit. Just as an unusual bonus I rarely find an accent that makes it easier to understand someone. And when I say rarely I mean never.... Thank you.

@kalkippins9076 4 ай бұрын

I just love this channel. It's very informative. Thanks man

@masterplayer5982 Жыл бұрын

More battery capacity doesn’t necessarily mean longer battery life on a phone but it also depends on the phone’s power consumption and efficiency

@rfvtgbzhn 28 күн бұрын

true, but I don't think they would increase power consumption much., because modern phones are already close to overheating when the CPU or GPU is fully utilized and of course there is no reason to abandon power saving technologies when the hardware is not fully utilized.

@justinwilliams7148 Жыл бұрын

I like waterproof phones. But god I hate the non removable batteries. I tried living with it and what happens? "OOPS your phone screen is black and restarts and running it out of power doesn't work to reset it!" Solution turned out to be to disconnect the battery and reconnect it. Would have been simple with removable batteries, but nope, this sealed phone design has dug its heels in and how convenient that we need special tools or pay an exorbitant fee just to do something that used to be routine.

@andrewbest5854 8 ай бұрын

Thanks. Well explained. Concise, but with helpful detail and good examples.

@MasterMind-xr2qr Жыл бұрын

Thank you so much for this video. I really appreciate it. This video is so important

@ThePapanoob Жыл бұрын

Great video but you only talked about the energy density side of things. Wouldve been great if you included the efficiency of the batteries aswell! One of the biggest problems is cooling the batteries. Because of the high internal resistance of current batteries they tend to release quite alot of energy as heat and tesla found a great way to massively reduce the resistance by introducing the tabless design. This means higher amperage & less heat 😄

@antonnym214 Жыл бұрын

In the lab it looks nice, but an improved battery coming to market always seems three years away. Excellent video in any case. Good research and nice graphics. I subscribed. All good wishes.

@vangildermichael1767 Жыл бұрын

{improved battery always three years away}. And it always will be. Until you get where you are going. And stop. The battery gets better all those (3 years). And a different goal is posted for the next (3 years). Just because there is also a (hopeful) goal posted in there. And it makes you feel like we failed. A person should back up and see that a lot of things have happened. And we are getting close to the (long goal. And by the time we get there, we will already have a better technology.

@dielaughing73 Жыл бұрын

He just described how battery tech has been improving all this time. A huge quantum leap is always a possibility, but these kinds of changes are rare. There's no point being upset that not every promised improvement is actually delivered

@sailaab Жыл бұрын

Very well presented and researched Marton brother.👍🏼👌🏽

@Hyggeliste Жыл бұрын

thank you TA! Great video as always. Cheers from a happy subscriber 😀

@dovnb Жыл бұрын

6:25 Can't help but notice that while average battery capacity improved by 39%, the Counterpoint's battery chart managed to increase by 364% 🤔also the exponential graph 😅

@paolaanimator Жыл бұрын

While I am glad battery tech are being improved, I really want to see batteries that can last longer and stays cool, especially when viewing video content, playing games or multitasking where the battery drops quickly, and it seems to get worse over the years as well. I'd like to see improvement in this aspect, that would be great! Less charging as well and waiting for the battery to get full.

@Legority Жыл бұрын

batteries naturally degrade over time, you can’t avoid that! however, you can slow the degradation down yourself with various methods (keeping it out of strong heat/cold, keeping it in the 20%-80% range, not constantly keeping it at 100%, etc) and the manufacturer can as well, by making devices more power efficient and whatnot

@wa9ilaidk43 Жыл бұрын

@@Legority so if i happen to use my phone until the battery is at 10%, is that okay?

@jjhack3r 5 ай бұрын

It’s not the battery getting hot... it’s the stupidly overpowered cpu that nobody needs unless they are a hardcore gamer... high end phones now days have higher performance than a cheap laptop for no good reason.

@GeordiLaForgery Жыл бұрын

Fascinating great work.

@ankur.vloggs Жыл бұрын

Love the graph visuals

@JohnMushitu Жыл бұрын

I can only imagine the insane amount of research that went into making this video 🙌

@derdummeasi Жыл бұрын

Imagine a 1 week battery an a phone. 2022 and we still have to dream..

@paolaanimator Жыл бұрын

That would be amazing, yes please, 1 week battery sign me up!

@phonepsycho2855 Жыл бұрын

Your content and editing skills are lit 🔥

@Zeyek1 Жыл бұрын

nice episode keep up the good work

@fuzz33594 Жыл бұрын

Your videos are always brilliant; this one is exceptionally so. Very nicely done.

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

Very happy to hear!

@OmgEinfachNurOmg Жыл бұрын

I think the comparison with Moore's Law is kind of stupid. There is nothing in physics that hinders this 'law' and has its focus merely on fabrication progress of structure size. Nobody expected something like this from batteries, since we already know what the energy densities of every single molecule is. And there is no combination of molecules that will lead to EXPONENTIAL energy density increase.

@codyrap95 Жыл бұрын

Amazing video and info as usual. Thanks!

@kibbo9056 Жыл бұрын

damn that was a really good video, keep up the great work! 😄👍 You just earned a new subscriber!! 🥳

@rayoflight62 Жыл бұрын

The tipping point for batteries will be reached when the energy density of Li-Ion battery will be three times of the batteries currently in use. In practice, the battery of the size of a current petrol tank of an ICE car will allow the same 600+ miles for a single charge. This may take anything from five to twenty years, depending on the level of investment the battery manufacturers decide. The energy density improvements will not come from new material or chemicals used for the batteries; they will rather stem from new crystalline structures achieved with new manufacturing techniques. Regards, Anthony

@_Painted Жыл бұрын

It seems like we have a few different paths to improving battery life: improve battery capacity, improve hardware efficiency, offload processing (to the cloud or to a paired personal computer), and develop longer-range wireless charging.

@7654321220 Жыл бұрын

efficiently transmitting energy to a small patch of space (10cm) at a practical range (10m) without some physical (wave)guide is surprisingly difficult, you'll have to focus the energy accurately and keep an active tracking of the receiver's position, and yet there's still the orientation of the receiver.

@me-myself-i787 Жыл бұрын

And make more efficient software.

@iadam1993 Жыл бұрын

Good! To the point and well researched!

@dastard12 6 ай бұрын

Love how you didn't shy away or gloss over the ethical factory for batteries, great video

@warlander7450 Жыл бұрын

There's constant noise going on in the video, especially when talking - video is great, but I think the noise issue is something worth looking into.

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

It's the hissing from the transformer of my Neon sigh, which is a bit tricky to work around, but I have a plan to fix it eventually :P

@Finnec123 Жыл бұрын

I didn't notice it. But maybe it's because I use an external loudspeaker (Bluetooth).

@KrolKaz Жыл бұрын

Just record the video and sound separately, or insert thr neon light digitally

@fincaman2 Жыл бұрын

You didn't mention that Li-ion batteries can only be charged to 80% quickly and then have to be trickle charged. This why car companies only ever give 0 to 80% charge times. A friend of mine went to buy an electric car and they couldn't tell her the 0 to 100 % charge time !!!

@TheZachary86 Жыл бұрын

Is this by design or is it the physics?

@silvy7394 Жыл бұрын

This isnt special to lithium. Thats kinda a general rule for all batterys.

@haguruma7832 Жыл бұрын

Yeah cuz otherwise it will degrade the battery way quicker.

@Anon-kx8tm Жыл бұрын

@@TheZachary86 it's more chemical as charging your device to extreme ends of the battery i.e 0% and 100% is when the batteryis more stressed which is bad.

@thebaker8637 Жыл бұрын

@@TheZachary86 Its physics. Squeezing out the last bit of toothpaste, accelerating to the last kilometer of your car’s top speed, cleaning up the last bit of trash from a park, etc. are all asymptotic processes, the closer you are to the goal, the harder it is to progress at all.

@ForeignManinaForeignLand Жыл бұрын

Excellent video, big man

@kiddketathereal Жыл бұрын

this is such an interesting video format, very glad the youtube algorithm led me here :)

@rasmusrasmussen9415 Жыл бұрын

In my opinion, I think we should try to optimize software more, than try to brute force more battery capacity. Cool video tho. It explains a lot in a manner that's easy to understand

@prism2451 Жыл бұрын

That's also happening simultaneously. I think so

@dennisjungbauer4467 Жыл бұрын

I would agree with that - there's a lot of inefficient software and/or bloatware nowadays, just because the hardware is often powerful enough for it to "not matter". And as a developer myself I share the sentiment that it's nice not needing to actively optimize everything and focus on the business logic, what the software should do, but it does come with a price to pay. And when a news website (indicating: simple) takes long to load or is lagging when interacting with it, or when a supposedly simple operation, like opening a menu in a program, takes longer than an instant, something has gone pretty wrong.. But in the average company optimization probably* is not exactly a common topic and priority for stakeholders/product managers etc. and apps by a single dev are often enough built by inexperienced devs that don't have the knowledge or interest to optimize things, at least I assume that's the case for most software. (I don't exclude myself, I definitely have written some very inefficient stuff due to not knowing better and often enough don't pay much attention to it.) * I am fairly new in the professional industry and have a sample size of one unfortunately, but I've also heard from multiple people with similar experience.

@groszak1 Жыл бұрын

Text renderers have gotten significantly bloated over time. Instead of doing full hinting as was originally intended in TrueType, they use lots of bloaty render techniques that make not only the performance but also the rendering quality even worse. Microsoft’s best renderer is the one they used before they introduced ClearType. So on Windows you have to disable ClearType to get the correct rendering (even then, it doesn’t work for DirectWrite which is even more bloated). And virtually no Unix systems provide ways to unglitch TrueType rendering.

@ronch550 Жыл бұрын

That's what Apple does, not just with batteries. They heavily optimize memory usage, software, etc. and the result is less energy consumption and faster performance.

@groszak1 Жыл бұрын

@@ronch550 No, their software is Unix based so it’s highly bloated. The real optimized software came from legacy Microsoft. They literally made a renderer called GDI that is the fastest renderer ever, so much so that I consider GDI to be the only hardware accelerated renderer ever. Of course, modern Microsoft software (as opposed to legacy) is highly bloated as well.

@MarkusMaal Жыл бұрын

Episode 86? Man, it feels like I saw Episode 1 a few weeks ago!

@RupakRoyC Жыл бұрын

Worth to watch your videos

@vedaryan334 Жыл бұрын

Extremely well done video

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

Glad you liked it!

@lwwells Жыл бұрын

@12:40 Graphite also expands during lithiation. The conversion of C6 to LiC6 has a volume increase of about 10%. Per lithium, the expansion differences between graphite and silicon are not THAT different. The issue is that silicon can hold a magnitude more lithium per unit of mass.

@azurelad236 Жыл бұрын

Planned obsolescence is a very reliable employee.

@neem9115 Жыл бұрын

My favorite technology based channel💯🔥

@hadykrema7820 Жыл бұрын

great video, keep up. you are doing great :)

@nikolaisafronov3452 Жыл бұрын

Don't dumb down your videos, chemistry is a good thing in your videos

@sherry356 Жыл бұрын

Silicon isn't all that abundant anymore. It is mostly extracted from beach sand. Humanity has already extracted most of the beach sand in the world to the point where we have to extract even more underwater - thanks to vanity projects like Dubai's artificial islands. The impact on the environment is very concerning.

@Steamrick Жыл бұрын

The biggest sand consumer - easily taking places 1, 2 and 3 for itself - is concrete. It sucks up sand like nothing else. Construction mostly uses river sand because they don't have to deal with salt that way, but it also means that there's no new sand washing downstream.

@Alhussainba Жыл бұрын

Beaches and concert need coarse sand, why can't fine sand form desserts be used to make silicon ingots?

@sherry356 Жыл бұрын

@@Alhussainba I highly recommending reading about it online - it's quite an interesting topic. Desert sand is largely useless to us - I found this explanation online: desert sand grains are finer and smoother so their surface chemistry would not be able to offer sufficient number of multidirectional chemical linkages. They also have other undesirable contaminants. Basically: desert sand is the wrong shape and difficult and expensive to use.

@atinofspam3433 6 ай бұрын

ive always bought my iphones refurbished rather than new, and i also hold onto them for ages before upgrading. As a result, ive replaced the batteries in my iphones twice each. Ive had a 5C, 7, and 12mini (current). Replacing the batteries in these is piss easy and i don’t understand why people complain so much. The only difficulty is getting past the waterproof seal in the newer ones, but it’s still easy; just a bit of heat to soften it and gently using a pry tool.

@jangwan Жыл бұрын

Glad you took the feedback and working on it quickly, really want to share the video with my bro, please reupload soon. It was awesome!! Naruto is ❤!

@SlipknotOlly Жыл бұрын

This is an excellent piece of research, lots of new technologies are being trialed by our military and their research areas for future power and future green power.

@jonr6680 Жыл бұрын

Impressed by this vid, subject is clearly important on many levels, and TA presentation style is reassuringly definitive. Sad that the exploitation really has not improved in the global supply chain and the same disgusting behaviours is rampant in tech as all the others, channels such as TA should keep reminding us of the harm we are causing. I love tech and my phone but hate that folks are dying for it. Same story with so much of our 1st world products, like cacao growers who have never tasted chocolate, or oil producing countries who's population remain poor due to corruption, or fast fashion enabling child workers....

@F0RLORN Жыл бұрын

Another amazing video!

@bernlin2000 Жыл бұрын

This has been a problem for a long time on computing tech, and it's a big part of why CPUs on desktop computers gave up on the "gigahertz" battle (which was literally lighting computers on fire) and moved to multi-core systems, and we haven't looked back, thankfully. But it still means CPUs and other processing systems are getting a lot more powerful than improvements in battery technology. And that's been true throughout the history of mobile computing.

@HaggardPillockHD Жыл бұрын

Right to repair should hopefully put an end to this shady practice of soldering batteries into phones.

@ajohny8954 Жыл бұрын

Great video overall, however QuantumScape as far as I know has not given up on solid state

@TechAltar Жыл бұрын

Thanks! You are right, they haven't given up, it's just that they overpromised initially and our expectations had to be dialed back for later dates

@elsonemson1116 Жыл бұрын

great content as always

@billgates3699 6 ай бұрын

The asterisk correction 😂 top tier production here

@SwordQuake2 Жыл бұрын

7:30 the resources are only valuable if they're used. Not "stripping" them would mean no money for them.

@syarifairlangga4608 Жыл бұрын

When the battery is too good the sales of the new phone might plummet. That's why the manufacturer might increase the battery size but CANNOT increase battery reliability. Phones without an original charger like most phones sold lately also will make the battery broke faster

@tjb3171 6 ай бұрын

Love this high quality vid❤

@jejunamja Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the video , very interesting .

@eddiestilll Жыл бұрын

i feel like smartphone batteries are "good enough" for the average consumer already which may explain why there's not as much incentive to innovate on this front. my huawei p20 pro 2018 smartphone which has 4000 mah is still doing great in 2022, so i have no doubt anyone with newer smartphones or bigger batteries will be even better off

@thelakeman2538 Жыл бұрын

10:18 wouldn't that be hydrogen though I suppose lithium wants to give up its valence electron under any circumstances unlike hydrogen.

@knifekitty_ls 8 ай бұрын

13:02 now imagine phones still had easily-user-replaceable batteries that are somewhat standardized and companies like Sila/Amprius could simply manufacture aftermarket-upgrade batteries for existing devices while iterating research of new battery materials, without a need to build whole new products for starters