Anger often turns outward (the world sucks, destroy it) or inward (depression/selfharm) Turning to social pathology or self destruction, addiction, workaholics, etc.

While that may have some truth the deeper question is why do so many NOT seek out intense therapy to find answers regarding the anger? Why are so many completely accepting and normalizing of their misplaced anger?

@@lijohnyoutube101 Therapy is expensive. Not everyone has access to it.

The problem with this disorder is that one psychiatrist will diagnose you with BPD and three other psychiatrists will diagnose you with 3 completely different diagnoses. These DSM5 diagnoses are scams, to say the least.

The problem with this disorder is that one psychiatrist will diagnose you with BPD and three other psychiatrists will diagnose you with 3 completely different diagnoses. These DSM5 diagnoses are scams, to say the least.

I can relate. My dad was very likely BPD but undiagnosed. My 2nd wife was diagnosed BPD. At 64 years, I’ve never taken a breath without a significant person in my life with BPD. My wife is bipolar as well. …I’m now seeing a therapist.

@@joekrepps Sorry, that sounds rough. Best of luck in therapy.

@@joekreppsI’m very sorry for you… I had to say that before pointing out the way you seemingly purposefully placed a comedic pause before your last line…. I’m sorry, it gave me a chuckle

Why can you losers get help, but ppl with bpd are ignored and pushed to the side? Fuck you people.

Same. But now I see her more as a Narcissist. I swear she would have killed me once if only she could.

And I get the sense this may be the literal trauma, where it all began .. or?

I think these emotive interpretations can actually be grossly misdirective. I’m very glad that people have empathised with this interpretation but the danger is that these narratives can become causal rather than explanatory. What I mean is that he talks about how there’s copious evidence of social dysfunction, and he FEELS (amongst others) that this is the heart of it, in conjunction with BPD being reactive to social stimulus. This is not my experience at all. I am (humble brag.) fucking great at masking but I don’t enjoy it, so I’ve spent months/years both being very social and absolutely alone. For me the periods of mania and depression snuck up on me (unless I was paying close attention) and like when anyone is in a bad mood, something would eventually set me off. When I was externalising this and struggling, but not identifying, the pain, this manifested itself in enjoyment or anger respectively. I found myself forming a protective wall to isolate myself from people as I was socially rewarded for doing so and had a huge aversion to embarrassment. Once I started with more introspection however it quickly became apparent that these were periods of mania and depression, and that the pain I was feeling could be channelled into anger or simply let out. Letting it out was so much harder but felt so much better in the long run. I’m not a saint I’ve fallen back into channelling and admitting defeat to it through addiction, bulimia, self harm all the good fun stuff. Now whatever I was doing, my emotions manifested themselves as a reaction function to outside stimuli, so when I was being social , it would be to whatever someone says; but when I was being antisocial, it would be to politics, games, movies whatever. So understanding a specific person’s experience as a socially reactive condition would make complete sense if they are social, but not if they’re antisocial. Now this video is all good, but if you then go, okay, we need to sort out how you engage in society, then you’ve turned an interpretation into a cause and addressed it as such. This is what finally gets me to this comment they made. I have felt empty so often and so profoundly for so many years. But it is nothing like a hungry child. I can see how one might describe it as that, if you externalise your emotions onto lived experience. But I never lacked for anything, and the guilt of feeling bad anyway, knowing I had no excuse, was a huge problem for me. I did not lack anything; I didn’t need to be given anything. I need to rearrange how I process and react to emotion or hopefully get someone to “fix” my fucking brain. My strong interpretation is that this emotional disregulation creates strong inconsistencies in the OBSERVED self (everyone has them but we see them very clearly) and this is what causes that feeling of emptiness; of being a shore racked by waves. This interpretation has causality for the hungry child hypothesis; if you’re socially observant then you might feel other people have been given something you haven’t - you feel a distinct absence of what you should have. What you believe (very viscerally I don’t mean entitlement) you deserve and need is provably circumstantial, so this makes as much if not more sense than a failure of parenthood to address innate biological needs that have been supposed elsewhere. Although this isn’t the cause. It’s a philosophical interpretation that I think the facts suggest is more appropriate than the hungry child hypothesis because it explains more of the variation. The real cause is neurobiological by definition. Unfortunately no one has any idea what that is as there is no “normal human” so an abnormal one is impossible to define. We feel a distinct sense of wrongness, but that doesn’t mean we can get the basic pill and go back to being perfect. TL;DR don’t generalise, and since BPD is basically just an arbitrary categorisation of human variation, why not just ditch the objective rules yeah?

@@dominicellis6185 so are you saying that the intense variation of feeling make you wonder: "What am I truly at the core?". Is this this feeling of emptiness? Aka: there are only waves but no stable cliff in the middle? A cliff you always feel and can orient towards no matter what?

I believe the hitching point for diagnosis is that which is found in the data to be neuro "typical." These types of conventional or neurotypical minds make up most of the tapestry of society and in representing the lion share of the societal thread...these also by default establish the rules by which one may find him/her self successful. So, even though personality may be relative on many levels what brings the abstract into the concrete is the "fitness" of the odd mind to compete successfully within a framework that predates it and subsequently judges it's fitness. Hence the distress of the borderline mind and of all those unfortunate enough to become entangled with it and I mean that from the heart being borderline myself.

Also, I would absolutely say that for many of us borderlines, that the analogy of a hungry child was very apt.

You need healthy boundaries. Figuratively and literally. Good fences make good neighbors

Yes! Cereal box accidentally falls out of bottom cabinet and next thing you know they jump on the box, kick it to the base board and swear at it. Then they act like the totally bat crazy reaction is TOTALLY justified!

@@lijohnyoutube101 Youre coming from a place of judgement.

@@B_K69 absolutely, after 2 plus decades am just DONE with the immature crap and dysfunctional emotional regulation. At some point as an adult you do the work and fix your crap and stop traumatizing others. And the example was a real experience.

@@lijohnyoutube101 seems like you just need to vent.

Thank you for writing this. My partner has BPD and I don't see enough about how it is possible for people affected by BPD to build meaningful, trusting relationships - the hard part is building that relationship with yourself first

@@rfarrow3483 Thank you for staying with your partner. the live/hate relationship is so deep within that unfortunately it overflows into the rest of our lives. He is so so lucky to have a supportive partner. probably scary for him but necessary for trust building and self regulation. Co- Regulation is essential for the person who suffers from BPD . Gratitude and Love to you and yours ❤️

​@@aleciawimer8506what does that even mean when parents are usually the ones who abandon the children first? lol. genuinely, what are you expecting of a child who probably cared about their parents the most (as most children are prone to do because hey, the NEED to be parented) and got left behind. they're not gonna know how to form proper bonds to begin with.

@@AdzaanMaiiTso You misunderstood me. The BPD parents claim to not be loved, when they are ones that didn’t love their children. I’m sorry that I wasn’t clear.

neglecting or "not trusting" a 3 year old is a pretty pathological response for any parent. ​@@aleciawimer8506

True. I had a friend who is BPD and she idolised her mother who had NPD and basically used her from the very beginning. She was conceived to save an ailing marriage, the mother was depressed and could not interact with her baby or toddler ( I was actually shown a film of her in her crib and the mother had a dead face without affect- maybe because she saw that the new baby did not save her marriage and this also showed that my friend as a baby got little mirroring from her mother) , and then the mother later latched on to her daughter as a surrogate for the unloving husband to avoid loneliness. But to this day my friend with BPD has split off this knowledge and still tells herself that her mother loved her . She went through her whole life with this belief that her childhood and family was normal, splitting off the truth from her awareness. And yeah- she as also very very angry but did not know the anger was against her mother.

They destroy all intimate relationships almost punishing people for daring to love them

Very very few children are loved and accepted totally unconditionally. I would say that those who develop BPD are simply less repressed than the majority of people, and so are more conscious and aware of that lack. I may even go out on a limb and say that people with BPD are objectively less traumatized than so called “normal” people, because if they had experienced as much objective trauma as so called “normal” people, they would seem “normal” too. “It’s no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society”- J. Krishnamurti

​@katieandnick4113 do you have bpd?

Beautifully said.

There are worse things than being alone! I feared being alone once and it kept me in bad places. Not scared of that anymore.

Because we forgot about that part when we're alone lol.

Because the fear of engulfment isn’t a _causative_ factor. Quite the reverse, actually.

@@waynepolo6193 huh

@@cosmingurau is that a ‘that’s interesting’ _huh_ or a ‘what are you talking about’ _huh_

Agree, just as much as the root of the issue as fear of abandonment, if not more so

It seems like people with bpd never received the love, care and structure (meaning I can depend on someone being there)

​@@katrinat.3032well they got fed and housed it would seem. Clothed. Are alive. That's loving. Caring. An inner emptiness is not dependant on outer abundance. The abundance outside them can be there. Isn't that the point of saying its an inner hunger. A lack of care or neglect is an outer hunger. Like if you are actually lacking food that different to always being hungry and ending up obese. Those are two different ends of something. One is an outer lack the other ann inner lack. An inner lack can have all the love care attention structure in the world around them and never be fulfilled. That's why people dont like them cos they're like a black hole. You feed them and feed them and they're still crying for food. With food in their mouths and both hands and obese and still sucking other people dry for attention or whatever.

​@@PadraigpThat's typical of what a narci ssist would say - "you were clothed and fed, what more do you want?"

@@janec1489 I mean go around diagnosing people with napd if that's what gives you your jollies. But she literally can do nothing about the past except heal from it and have gratitude for what she has. When you have gratitude for being fed and clothed that is very healing. Nobody can change the past. People are imperfect and life will cause you scars. Thats not a weird anomaly on this planet.

That happened to me. I'm a super late diagnosed, autistic woman at age 50, and they just slapped the BPD label on me, when some of the traits just don't fit, but some do, because of my autism. I don't feel empty inside, or have a deep fear of rejection, but have the emotional dysregulation due to over stimulation from outside forces.

@@dreamscape405. I know how a tad about differential diagnosis between adhd and bipolar wich has more to do with if emotions are congruent with contex and extreme vs have a life of their own, but not sure how that differential works with bpd vs autism /adhd because I know to an extent they can at times be coorelated and tech bpd is a higher level diagnosis vs adhd or autism. And in the end the labels are only as useful as the facets and symptoms are to us as understanding what we need and how to better predict us. Dx are just a list of symptoms theories and models. Outside that we kinda have to put ourself together

Interesting remark. Also a lot of folks claim it’s CPTSD instead of BPD. For sure those as well as ASD level 1 might be present all together. We don’t know.

I got diagnosed both autism and BPD recently. Misdiagnosis can happen but having both is possible. Especially when you grew up with long term abuse.

Autism and ADHD are overdiagnosed

Thank you ...

Don't forget that part of self harm may be unprotected/irresponsible sexual encounters and substance use outside the "norm."

Wow, my mother rings every bell on here.

That’s what I used to think.. until I realized how insanely calculating and manipulative they are. There are a couple of doctors who believe that BPD is actually a different form of psychopaths/sociopaths. They copy the person they are with (also signs of a psychopath) they use guilt and sympathy to get what they want, and once you’re no longer useful to them they will move on to the next target. They lack sympathy, only care about using people, and will use everything against you once you find out how evil they are. If they are jealous of you it’s going to be a nightmare because they will hurt your reputation and isolate you (just like psychopaths do) they are very sneaky. I know a couple of people with BPD and after many years dealing with them I don’t buy into the whole “I’m hurt I need love” thing anymore it’s just an act. That’s why you will never receive anything from them because they are users and energy vampires. I stay as far as I can when I see red flags.

To be fair, when you're a child raised with love being dangled but whisked out of reach the moment you ask for love from your foundational people (like parents, for example), it's almost expected that said child will have trouble trusting love to stay when they grow into adults. Not trying to downplay the harm and grief your ex has caused you but there is a method to their reasoning, even if illogical. She, unfortunately, was not in a place to look inwards even though that would've been her saving grace.

I fill your pain... I experienced the same thing.

“Surrender” isn’t a term you should EVER be applying to a relationship with a a real live woman, much less a pwBPD. “Surrender & share” well if ima be honest it sounds like this breakup was for the best & the problem isnt on her end, it’s you’re own! Maybe she refused to support u financially throughout ur time enrolled in the School of Pr@nHu6… Or perhaps she was unwilling to provide u with her phone password after the 2 of u had been dating for 2 weeks? 💀

@@richcountyratrodsjrod2329 With you...

I’m loving his insights

Agree

😱😱😱

Was gonna say the same thing but you beat me to it. RIP Dr. Gunderson

He also got a lot of neurodivergent people misdiagnosed, especially women.

Wow!…Thank you for sharing. You literally have just described me, my journey with BPD. I also am the same. It’s a living hell. Everyday is a bad day for me. Totally withdrawn as well. Live alone, have no friends (lost them all) they have moved on & can’t understand my illness. I’m drained of life force, fought for so long. Also had so much help but nothing works. I have given up. Broke me too. I’m not impulsive anymore, barely leave the house. Can’t keep a job down because of chronic anxiety. My brain now does not even work. Nothing to talk about with people as I have no interests anymore. Can’t feel passionate about anything. Don’t even bother with romantic relationships, not for years now. The emptiness that gets me. Nothing going on inside me. Nothing. Can sit & stare into space for hours. Awful existence & people think your just negative. So much more than that. I just want to die. Don’t have the energy to do it. I keep my life minimalistic. I buy nothing only what i need. I feel like I have it all prepared really. Always thinking about death. Why wouldn’t you?….I get overloaded too. I currently have not left the house for a week. I don’t because just spent 6 years sober trying to heal & nothing has worked. Even got sober for a very long time. I just can’t bare to walk the beach one more time alone. 6 years, around the park or up & down the beach. I can’t make friends cause people think I am odd & weird. So empty. Worst part is I’m 42 now. No children, no partner, no friends & have no talent. Nothing to live for. BPD has broke me. Nothing left of me, literally skin & bone. Some of us have it way more severe than others. I had a lifetime of trauma. People who reflected me back were not good mirrors. Nice to hear your story. Your truth. Mine also. Life is unfair. I believe in nothing. Hard to have faith within illness like ours. Wish you well all the same. I just get through each day. Existing but not living. X

@@Lilynite10 I understand at least we know we aren't alone. Don't think it helps much though..other people have no idea the living hell we are in. I do think about suicide but I just don't have the will to do it, even if I'm that far gone already. It's absolute torture. If I had a 100% chance of a effective painless death, I maybe could consider it. I don't necessarily want to die. I just wish that I didn't have the trauma I do, and feel the way I do. Death or a lobotomy seems like the only viable escape from it. That's why do many self medicate and have substance abuse issues and of course actually end up killing themselves.

@@realmofoz I hear ya!….It does help to know your not alone suffering. There are many of us. Again it’s like addiction, mental illness is the same, different levels. When you have an illness bad very tough. Nice to share truthfully about it without feeling guilty or negative. I never talk to anyone anymore about it. Everyone got so sick of me, nothing else to talk about. Now I say nothing. I don’t want to die either. I don’t think anyone does but I understand why people do take there lives. Suffering, mental torture is unbearable. I am the same, always say please at least let me die peacefully in my sleep after a lifetime of suffering. People should have the right to end there own lives though I believe. Nobody should have to die alone & hurting themselves. Think in the future laws may change for people with long_term debilitating illness. I can’t take the loneliness or lack of energy. The mood swings. All day everyday. I thought I was an addict first & then diagnosed with bpd at 38. Looked back & was like oh makes sense. I went through life like the Tasmanian devil! Substance abuse is dangerous. Get drunk & low enough.

I’m still unsure whether it is C-ptsd or perhaps I have both!

I’m so grateful for this thread of conversation. My sister has/is bpd. I was greatly favored over her by our father. I ended up with severe disassociative disorder which 4 years in therapy resolved. My sister (only sibling) discards me for years at a time; just Christmas cards. These posts help me feel less bitter towards her for not getting psychiatric help so maybe we could have been friends. I’m sad every day for this loss; for “what could have been” since she is the only one “who knew me when”. I AM the trigger for her pain so it’s probably hopeless.

It may help you to understand that humans evolved to NEVER be alone. We are hardwired to be surrounded by other humans that we know and trust deeply, 24/7. When people seem to be very comfortable being alone, I think it’s actually because they are MORE traumatized, and therefore more disconnected from their humanity than people who really struggle to be alone. We are natural collectivists. The very concept or illusion of “self” as an individual probably didn’t develop in humans until around the time we started farming(about 12,000 years ago), and our brains and bodies have really not changed at all since then. The ego is an adaptation to a cruel, scary, isolating environment, but it can never be objective healthy. I do not have any diagnoses beyond anxiety and depression, which I was given in my early teens(I’m 40 now). I attribute my high levels of emotional and psychological health to the fact that I’ve never been alone. I’ve been in a committed relationship since I was 14(not with the same guy, but between two very long term relationships). I also had very good relationships with my parents, who are both dead. I had kids pretty young as well. We need other humans, and anyone who pathologizes you for that need simply doesn’t understand what it means to be human. They are far more “sick” than you are.

@@katieandnick4113 I really appreciate that. Staying connected is definitely my advice to anyone willing to listen. I’ve studied psychology to try to understand myself better, tried meditation, therapy, pretty much everything I could to stay grounded. Unfortunately my situation did ultimately get the best of me and as a result, everyone I knew, supported and cared for has come to hate me. I also have no faith in my ability to recover at this point and I have lost the ability to pity myself. Always encourage the people around you with the same advice you gave me.

Gosh, my heart goes out to you. To live in a constant state of nightmare because of the lack of a solid self to ground you when you're alone is horrific. I wish I could say magical words to make it go away but I don't have any other than that I really do hope peace comes to you to give you respite so you can enjoy life

Life was meant to be difficult for most ppl. Pain is the great teacher. For those who decide they’ll escape & leave early, like my sister, they immediately find out they are returning for a new incarnation. There’s a very powerful word, HU, that when chanted daily, can open doors to seeing why we are here, & who we are as eternal soul. The HU chant is on many YT channels, & the one w/ the quotes is great. Ask for spiritual help if u want it. ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

@@katieandnick4113yep I’m more traumatized and prefer to be alone! I’m dating after a very abusive marriage and fine if people walk out or eventually ghost and frankly I expect it and that’s why I don’t sleep with men and I’m very guarded who I let into my soul. I’ll kiss and make out with the guy, but even that’s under certain circumstances. Tremendous amount of trauma, put me here. I never really wanted to be alone alone. I hate it being alone now doesn’t bother me. We’re all gonna be alone eventually you get older. It gets more difficult if you’re scared to be alone so get used to it.. marriages nowadays, society out there

Me too, love being alone... and yet when i have a girlfriend i can't stand being apart from her... so i chose alone the past few years and its been a good choice.

It’s like a push pull. Read the book titled “I hate you, don’t leave me”

I think BPD was a useful diagnosis in a world where nobody knew what cptsd was. now we know better

@@HomeFromFarAwayyou and I agree in full

Just came to say that like everything Borderline traits are on a spectrum and not necessarily a personality disorder even if you have traits. I could have Borderline personality disorder but as I listen to Dr Gunderson I remember my life thus far and know that I have childhood trauma. However, I've never physically self harmed. I've sometimes been impulsive in both the driving and the sex categories but it is definitely not regularly or even very often. Sometimes I have a lot of trouble saying no. I'm a woman so men don't mind not listening to my no as well. That is damaging to my psyche. In any case many of the feelings that Borderlines have can come from C-PTSD. They can also come with neurodivergence like ADHD or Autism. And all of those diagnoses live on a spectrum as well. I won't be so fast to diagnose myself with something as complex as a personality disorder but will understand that I have a fair number of issues to work through and I don't feel like I'm in denial about it or unable to see it myself and understand it intellectually. I'm glad that people are taking the stigma of mental illness away by talking about it.

I absolutely would rather be alone than deal with ignorant people who are just noisy n refuse to actually pay attention when we point out why we do not feel like we do

What podcast

Tell us if we can find the podcast in KZfaq

@MJ also interested

BPD can be passed on by how you treat your children, so if you can't control your behaviour and impulses you can traumatize them by explosive actions. Sorry to hear about your struggle.

They might still get it even if you didnt pass it and tried your best 🫣 So dont worry too much and just be the best version of you and get kids without these worries :") wish you best.

Came here to say this. BDP and AuDHD (combined autism & ADHD) present very similarly, particularly in females

I know it’s not uncommon for the odd variant( emotional regulation executive function vulnerability + chaos in family enviroment of some type) to have a fearful-avoidant or disorganized attatchment style and I heard Thias gibson explain it’s kinda like a lite version of borderline as far as attatchments go. Like you want closeness but you push it away.

ADHD isn’t real, or rather, it’s not what we are lead to believe it is. The diagnoses of ADHD and ASD were expanded(made broader and more encompassing) in the most recent DSM in an attempt to hide the rapidly increasing incidences of trauma induced “disorders”. The very wealthy and powerful people who pay the doctors who write the DSM are heavily invested in the populace believing that everything in society is just great, and that if we’re suffering, it’s because there is something inherently and uniquely wrong with us. If we believe there is a genetic cause, we are more likely to take drugs rather than seeking therapy and trying to change our circumstances(and also rising up against our oppressors). It’s not too different than the idea of original sin. We are born broken and we need god(or doctors) to save us, and the only way we can be saved is to repent(or take drugs), and even then, our inherent “sin” will always be with us. It used to be that clergy was the middleman strong arm of the ruling class, and now it’s the institution of science and doctors. Their function is to protect the ruling class from us, though of course, doctors do not know this is their purpose. Just like clergy believe(d) that they exist to “save” people, so too do doctors. Interestingly, all doctors are actually highly narcissistic. It takes a very narcissistic person to believe they have the power to “save” other people. More deeply though, they need their patients who are suffering to be inherently broken, because their massive god complexes make it impossible for them to acknowledge that the society in which they live(that has worked so well for them, seeing as they’re doctors and all) is causing so many other humans to suffer miserably. The trick with doctors, unlike clergy, is that doctors don’t buy into the idea that people can just be “evil”, so they need to believe that people are suffering due to some sort of genetic “curse” over which they have no control. Because again, the only other option is that society is making people “sick”, and if you’ve done very well in a society, you’re not going to be able to see how that society can cause others so much pain. A healthy person in a sick society is objectively sick, while a sick person in a sick society is objectively more healthy and whole. We definitely live in a sick society, but if doctors were to acknowledge that, most would have to contend with the fact that they must be objectively sick. So they believe that society is healthy, and that the sick people in society are objectively sick so they can maintain the delusion that they, themselves, are objectively healthy. No human being wants to be rejected. Rejection is probably the most terrifying experience a human being can have. For people who seem to handle it well, it’s only because they are incredibly emotionally repressed. They’re in denial. Humans are pack animals and are completely interconnected and interdependent, regardless of what most of us would like to believe. It is not healthy for any human being to feel as though the people upon whom they depend only accept them conditionally. That’s going to drive anyone “insane”, and I would say that the insanity is just not obvious in most people because we are all “insane” to some extent. The healthiest people in a sick society, again, are the most objectively sick.

My casual familiarity with the topic of BPD is because of it literally being discussed in that context. Probably not discussed enough though since much of said discussion is, for example, around the potential misdiagnosis of people on the spectrum with BPD. Also railing against the tendencies in medicine to pathologize the behavior/reactions of the marginalized to being marginalized in society in accordance with the moral precepts of the ruling class just to turn around and pathologize doctors for being tools of the ruling class feels less than liberatory and more of a rhetorical inversion of the power balance within the rotten state of affairs you take umbrage against. I sympathize with what you are driving at though.

You guys must be American and just the fact that one is criticising profesionals by outlining their characteristic as they are pathological is extraordinary. As a psychologist I am there to listen, understand my client and by use of Socrates questioning get them to the point where if they are honest to themselves they will gradually get to answer their own questions. I can’t help or tell people what to do. They have to do that for themselves. Also, psychologists do not make diagnosis but formulations and we only advocate for medication if it’s absolutely necessary and that’s the job of a psychiatrist. As a mother of a girl with autism and as a grandmother of a lovely baby boy who is a product of a BPD girl chasing my older son who eventually met her to talk to her and ensure that he’s not encouraging her in any way as he was not interested nor in her nor in having any intimate relationship with her. So for trying to be honest and gentle with her that encounter ended up with him waking up next morning with her in his bed, horrified as he couldn’t remember what happened! She laughed as she was explaining how he doesn’t have to worry as she understood that he’s not interested and it was just sex so she’s not expecting anything. He threw her out but about 2 weeks later she told him she was pregnant and now we have a child but my son is struggling as we are slowly expanding the conversation and he’s coming to terms with what has happened. The difference between autism and BDP is that my daughter is happy to be on her own, doesn’t have emotional fluctuations, doesn’t have those neediness dramas and she doesn’t stalk anyone. Western health and social care systems is a business, big pharma is behind prescribing and that’s what acceptable to Americans. Here in the U.K. we have a National Health Service and I don’t know how I would’ve felt if I had to pay to be seen by a doctor or for staying in the hospital. Its preposterous. U.K. approach is patient centred and harm reduction approach that is looking at mental health illness as a social construct. Individualist consumerist society and perpetual divide just about anything is another cluster of triggers are contributing to most of those issues. Plus, American states don't have a common culture as they are all pushed together rather than anything else. It's a social experiment that is slowly crumbling in its own collective delusion. Opioid epidemic, homelessness, perpetual wars and urge to dominate others, control over aspects that cant controlled, worshiping of Hollywood entertainers, obsession with murder and court trials and not to even mention demented president who's son is a crack addict and lack of regard for others….are just some of negative aspects of the society that was built on annihilation of the population previous inhabitants and just that is deeply engraved into societies collective consciousness and collective guilt. Anyways, when someone doesn't have any intention to confront their own shortcomings in order to evolve then they are just going to fall apart….

Thank you for that breakdown. You helped me tremendously! I thought I was maybe BPD, but how you describe yourself is spot on how it is with me. Your sister is like my sister. Is she older than you by any chance?

Interesting thoughts. I would caution against stating that BPD is a personality disorder rather than an environmental one. I was of the understanding that all personality disorders are environmental. No-one. is born with BPD, NPD, etc. They are formed in relation to primary caregivers. I think it's important to understand that all these names, these acronyms are just labels for clusters of human behaviour. They are not illnesses that we can 'see' like cancer, or flu, with a single, identifiable source. They are coping mechanisms that develop over time. I would argue that BPD is a symptom of CPTSD, and that any differences that show up are down the the complexity of human beings, and how that manifests in resolving the trauma of not being loved. As someone who for a long time thought I had NPD, then BPD, and now see it's just CPTSD, to me, it all stems from abuse, neglect and trauma, in all it's different nuanced flavours. Just my thoughts.

@simeonmorris1774 I completely agree with what you said. However that does not change the fact that BPD is a personality disorder (borderline personality disorder) and does not even require history of trauma to be required, and CPTSD is not a personality disorder and would not even exist without reoccuring trauma. Again, that cannot be said about BPD. As i said there is definte overlap to which you extrapolated on 😊 I did not intend for anyone to take offense to that, however, I did feel it is important to bring more attention to the distinction between these two conditions. Again, I am sorry if anyone took offense to that.

@flamingsword777 yes. glad it was helpful. Reviewing the diagnosis criteria online was very helpful to me. And there are lots of education resources online as well that offer more info on the overlap and distinctions between the two as well 😊

@@LilOnAgain Hi, certainly not taking any offence :) However, I don't agree that BPD could ever exist without a history of trauma. I have to say, I don't really trust the medical model of psychotherapy, that led to the construction of the DSM. I think it does more harm than good. I one day hope that the name and label BPD is dropped and the focus turns to the patients abuse, rather than a so-called personality disorder. I think the whole concept of a personality disorder is shaming and reductive There is nothing wrong with someone who suffers like this, what is wrong, is what was done to them. My thoughts anyway. I hope this doesn't feel like an attack, it's certainly not meant to be, just a differing of opinion. Nuance can be lost in text based exchanges. I hear all your thoughts and know they are valid. :)

I am so sorry to hear this. Send hugs to heal!

It's very interesting: as a kid I learned to lock myself up in the toilet whenever I got angry, because my souroundings couldn't handle my intense rage. This is still a pattern but it has become more subtle. Anger is unfortunately an emotion which is frowned upon and thus suppressed in our society. Not many outlets. I found boxing to be very helpful as I learned to channel my anger into discipline and directed physical activity. That feels very very good.

I'm also dealing with this exact same thing. Breathwork is the answer

You deserve to be loved. ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤ Even though your parents were too damaged to love you, consider yourself a sweet innocent clean slate. Worthy of all the love, protection, security and opportunity. Start by inventing a warm ball of love for that little starving child, abused and afraid. Perhaps take in a dog or cat. Let them love you unconditionally, take good care of them. The older I get the more I realize I prefer solitude and my own company. Animal companionship has a lot to offer in its simplicity. Humans are tricky animals.

🫂

Being alone is really the only way to actually grow and heal.

It might be, or it also might be that we actually are. I think things have changed since the diagnosis originated. I did think back to having an imaginary friend in my younger years.

To me the feeling of being watched (almost everywhere), comes from feeling unsafe; fear of threat, or judgment (shame).

It's because through your consciousness, God is watching and recording everything 🙏 🙌

Thanks for being detailed in explaining some of your travails and how you've interpreted your experience. I met someone recently who suggested that BPD could be viewed as the ultimate symptom of other underlying personality disorders. So... Just to layer things a bit more. Anyway... appreciate your participation here and glad for your curiosity and tenacity in trying to unriddle the rhymes.

Your not alone 💜

@@BorderlinerNotes it's interesting that the ICD seems to be moving more in that direction. Getting rid of the separate personality disorders and instead recording traits. The ideas being that so many of the personality disorders are interlinked and simply manifestations of an underlying issue, and that it's artificial and unhelpful to keep separate personality disorders as the DSM does.

@@th8257 I think that's great news. I, myself have a constellation of symptoms that are like a grab-bag of different disorders. I don't meet enough criteria to be diagnosed with any one PD, including BPD, but these different maladaptive traits are there and are hell to manage.

You mean speedballs . Just say speedballs we know what it is

Nice explanation and analysis and review. I too appreciate the lack of jargon which is mostly just distracting. As a reluctant HSP with a violent alcoholic narcissist Father and a dysregulated critical controlling Mother, life was hard growing up. I was also the truth teller and scapegoat so I definitely got emotionally neglected and emotionally repressed. This left me by turns anxious and depressed. I feel that Borderline does have me on it's spectrum but I've been able to chip away at it with awareness and support in therapy. We don't need to label ourselves if we are working on our interpersonal understanding and growth. That in and of itself indicates not having a PD because most of the time a personality disorder causes us to not know what and who we are. It puts us in denial to help us survive. If we want to heal we need to become aware and get help any way we can.

Sensitive temperament combined with opposite temperament parenting. With adverse childhood events is exactly how it affects BPD. I really believe with mindfulness and emotional neutrality minus the anger would be beneficial.

Thank you Nicole, I never could really find the words to describe how I feel about myself yet here they are. I owe you big time! You were able to perfectly capture what my "ball of knots" is. Ugh it is, it's our ugh and we are the only ones who can take care of our ugh. I'm in recovery and have found more constructive and actionable tools in Recovery Dharma/Buddhism/Mindfulness than in any other sorts of therapies combined. For me it is the glue that solidifies and makes life acceptable/tolerable while I start envisioning the possibility, and start seeing a glimmer of hope, that living could actually be something to look forward to. Thank you Nicole and I wish you only the very best, Rocco

Complex PTSD is the same as BPD, mental health providers just want you confused & discredited. They are not trained to understand people with trauma.

I really hope you're feeling better. I don't think labels like BPD are helpful. We all have needs that weren't met and some cope better than others with that -- don't feel you're worse than other people. You aren't. You are in fact lovable. "Just writing this makes me feel like I'm attention seeking" shows you try not to impose on others. The hard thing is knowing when to ask for help and how to feel safe while doing so. It sounds like doctors have been only so helpful -- maybe a different therapist? Or an online support group can help. I wish you the best.

@@rr-gq3gc Oh Rocco, i hope this finds you in a safer, happier, relaxed state--- I've heard so many great things about Buddhism. Not heard of recovery dharma but mhm, that liberation you mustve felt when your ugh felt more tolerable to live with, that triumph, i hope you get more of those little and powerful victories. Warrior to warrior, you sound like an absolute beautiful soul. Take care, lovely xo

@@kristyeldredge2308 Honestly, i know this phrase gets thrown around a lot, but----thank you, Kristina. "you are in fact lovable" --- this----its a weird one because i naturally have a warming, inviting, bubbly personality which makes people think they love the image of myself i have given to them, but underneath this persona (that i want to be true) is just turmoil and mess. it feels----nothing short of murder to let people in on that--. I'm in therapy now for my eating disorder and i'll be joining a support group to manage the eupd side. ---sorry for ranting, but i think i have hope that things will improve. i hope you are able to smile a genuine truthful smile each and every day xo

from.

100% accurate. One of my first real relationships was with a BPD person. I tried to make it work for seven years and it almost ruined my life. I still don’t think I’ve recovered from the damage or fully healed from it. Cutting her off without warning and blocking them on everything was the best decision I ever made. Been in a healthy and loving relationship with someone that truly cares about me for 10 years now and I wouldn’t have found her had I not had the courage to leave my previous partner.

I've had Bpd a long time, I've never done any of that to my friends. I could say so much. Sounds like your friend was a narc. Manipulation is not a borderline trait. We are not all the same.. And we are not borderline personality disorder, we are people with borderline personality disorder.

Gaslighting isn't BPD, that's psychopathy

What type of BPD is if you have one portion of these and not all?

@@lisaproustresearchit depends on the way the symptoms present, quiet BPD is usually internalised anger and guilt, expressed through self-harm and impulsivity towards unsafe behaviours like sex and drinking alcohol. The symptoms are all usually still there in all types of BPD but just affect the person differently. When you have some traits but not all (4 or less), it is diagnosed as traits of BPD or BPD symptoms rather than the full disorder - and that’s only if the symptoms aren’t better explained by a separate diagnosis, such as bipolar, ADHD or depression.

All of above, AuDHD+INFJ+BPD, basically am f****

Fixed me after being so emotional and loving towards someone that was very ill NPd or psychopath!

Whats the difference with NPD?

Wow - this actually happened to me in my 40s. Ended up following a friend round like a baby duck following it's mother

@@nielsbal3385 there's debate on where to draw the line mostly because BPD and NPD often goes hand in hand on the spectrum and its symptoms will often occur together. There's also debate on what truly is NPD/BPD and what has been skewed due to genderization. It's a complicated, nuanced topic that requires more research outside of a KZfaq comment but for sure, the biggest teller for BPD that you don't quite see elsewhere is the fear of abandonment.

I deactivate and deactivate my social accounts all the time.

You are describing “splitting “ read about it.

I relate, I've split on God themself. Religious debate aside, it's such an isolating experience as someone who's loosely faithful, to doubt even the thing that's supposed to love you unconditionally.

Thank you so so much for this feedback! Beyond illuminating and helpful. It sounds like we need someone to formally translate the videos into Spanish and Portugese. We can search for this person, but if you know any people right for this effort, you can reach me at borderlinethemovie@gmail.com. - Rebbie

You sound unstable if so speak to someone

Interesting that you say it's worse than going to war. I am still suffering PTSD from a train wreck marriage 36 years ago! In my case the marriage only lasted 3 months. Maybe that was a good thing. I am pretty sure my ex had BPD. I have my issues too - maybe CPTSD (maybe autistic too - I'm about to have an assessment) and I own those issues - but nobody could have had a successful relationship with her. In the end she said as much, that all her relationships ended the same way and that nobody could help her. I know she had a fear of abandonment because she asked several times if I was going to run away, and she responded so well to assurances from me that I wasn't. At the height of her stress, she developed paranoid delusions falsely accusing me of dishonesty and keeping secrets. She had zero respect for me, even making sarcastic comments about me in front of her friends. According to her everything was my fault, she felt nothing for me and she married the wrong guy. Charming! To this day I miss the thoughtful loving and capable person she could be when emotionally calm, and I feel sad thinking about the suffering she's probably had in her life, and I still feel the pain of those hurtful accusations from someone I loved deeply.

Not all are bad. But there are definitely users out there. Try to find a couple of people you can learn to trust just a bit and then see how it goes. Maybe a book club or golf club. This is a good therapy .

Splitting. Watch every video on it

There's "quiet bpd"

interesting: are you seeking for a person from the outside who tells you who you are? No shame on that btw!

C-PTSD, codependency, highly sensitive, childhood emotional neglect, being the scapegoat of narcissistic people, a borderline projecting on you. Just some things to explore for possibilities for growth.

It’s often not understood and many won’t even take a patient with it on

For sure, thats why BPD is done. Too many missdiagnosed people, which is very harmfull too the patients and their families.

See, the problem with people getting serious help for mental health issues that can be devestating, even lead to suicide or self harm, are trolls like you that mock others, and immaturely joke about mental health. God forbid it's ever you. Grow up. 🇨🇦

What medication did they put you on?

@@nielsbal3385 the return of sanity was Suboxone - yes it’s for opiate use disorder- there have been studies where they saw amazing results psychologically but it’s for that specific thing - if they gave it to non opiate people they would become dependent on- there are annoying side effects but the mental clarity is worth it

Thank you. -P

Do you say, you don't want to be reduced to a small part of yourself (although you love that part of yourself) because you feel you are so much more?

Two very different disorders which are easily distinguished from each other.

From what I know of, autistic people have sensory issues (hypersensitivity or hyposensitivity), problems with social interaction,they like patterns, routines,they stim, they have repititive words or things they do. These traits, specifically the sensory issues which is a large part of autism,is not present in someone who solely has BPD. Women are often misdiagnosed because of the lack of research and difference in signs about autistic women.

@Wei Li After consideration I believe the condition to be an inner emptiness, which one can handle in time. Thats not all ofc but.. the black and white thinking it may all have to do with that. Its still mysterious to me.

@Cj Johnson yeah sure

Reach out to someone local. I believe Psychology Today, or something, has a directory of Providers. When youre looking, see if they do a sliding scale for payment, many do, some dont. When reaching out, keep in mind that many are and have been seeking help since the Pandemic. It may take some days before they return a call or email. Also, look for a few in your initial search in case one or two are at full capacity. Take care.

That's quite an extreme version!

@@janec1489 True! That's the typical example they use.