The Not Official At All Wings Of Liberty Campaign Unit Tier List

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0:00 - Intro
1:50 - Marine
2:42 - Diamondback
4:10 - Viking
5:08 - "Hell's Angel"
5:52 - Marauder
6:26 - Medivac
7:40 - Ghost
8:43 - Battlecruiser
9:34 - Jackson's Revenge
10:03 - Raven
11:00 - Bill Nye the Vessel Guy
11:30 - War Pig
12:10 - Hammer Securities
12:30 - Firebat
13:03 - Devil Dog
13:43 - Medic
14:17 - Hellion
15:07 - Vulture
16:01 - Predator
16:21 - Siege Tank
17:01 - Siege Breaker
17:45 - Wraith
18:58 - Banshee
19:28 - Dusk Wing
19:53 - Thor
21:11 - Goliath
22:55 - Spartan Company
23:32 - Spectre
24:45 - Reaper
25:40 - Hercules
27:41 - Outro

Пікірлер: 471
@soverania8041
@soverania8041 2 жыл бұрын
Now that the tier list is settled, let's answer the question: CAN YOU BEAT ALL IN WITH D-TIER UNITS ONLY?
@stormwing9123
@stormwing9123 2 жыл бұрын
Firebat, Hellion, Predator and Wraith? No. No he cannot.
@Manslayer-eo1nh
@Manslayer-eo1nh 2 жыл бұрын
I doubt that he could do that even on casual.
@alfonsocyrusjoshua9551
@alfonsocyrusjoshua9551 2 жыл бұрын
@@stormwing9123 the wraith can deal with all in air but ground is a bit sus since there isnt anti armoured ground units in the comp
@VK-sz4it
@VK-sz4it 2 жыл бұрын
With hive-mind emulator - it is easy. Without - man, that would be interesting to watch!
@soverania8041
@soverania8041 2 жыл бұрын
@@VK-sz4it Technically the Zerg units you steal are not D-tier on this list. So you can use hive-mind emulator to neutralize them but not fight with them 😉
@maxonee13
@maxonee13 2 жыл бұрын
Would love to see tierlists for the other campaign units! Especially LoV because my tiny brain can't process how good every unit variation is
@CsabaGamings
@CsabaGamings 2 жыл бұрын
Vanguard S+ tier
@vumasster
@vumasster 2 жыл бұрын
Nerazim DT is its own in SSSSS+++++ tier
@VegetaLaunchedFinalFlash
@VegetaLaunchedFinalFlash 2 жыл бұрын
@@CsabaGamings 18 * 16 splash damage, can you believe that...
@alfonsocyrusjoshua9551
@alfonsocyrusjoshua9551 2 жыл бұрын
@@andrewgreeb916 brutal+ modifier for legacy of the void is that enemies get campaign units Also taldarim are also their units so wrathwalker vanguard ground lmao
@djenei2564
@djenei2564 2 жыл бұрын
@@CsabaGamings exacty what I wanted to comment lol
@DanStaal
@DanStaal 2 жыл бұрын
I think a couple of the really low-rated units got included in the game mainly for multiplayer play. Notably the hellion and reaper are made in nearly any high-level competitive game, as early worker harass and scouting, where they do quite well. However there's never a place in the campaign where your enemy is at that low-level tech and economy where those units can do what they do best: slip in and harass on the back line.
@123mickymouse123
@123mickymouse123 2 жыл бұрын
For the reaper there is *one* notable exception where they are stellar, which is ironically the Hellion into mission.
@Necro3Monk
@Necro3Monk 2 жыл бұрын
Would write this part, but flipping "added for multiplayer" to "included from multiplayer" since its clear multiplayer was the core of the game and single player units were added to it.
@edschramm6757
@edschramm6757 2 жыл бұрын
@@123mickymouse123 I still actually use the hellions there, but I find if I plug up the areas between my bunkers while defending, they make great area denial, while still having a reasonable clear speed when massed, since they are pretty fast units. But like the reaper, generally don't build them outside of their intro mission. I generally pretty much lean on the same few units for pretty much every mission : Marine (bunker), Siege Tank, Ghost, Banshee (vs ground heavy sections. They show late in my runs, so really only see play on Char), and battle cruisers (char only). I don't think I have actually used marauders much. Would probably make my life a lot easier if I used them to slow incoming attacks on char. I just hide behind PFs and call it good. In my defense the last time I did a serious run I was like 12, and struggled to beat Safe Haven/Havens fall. So that would actually be my last mission. I don't know why I struggled so badly with it
@honourabledoctoredwinmoria3126
@honourabledoctoredwinmoria3126 2 жыл бұрын
Vultures are also not in multiplayer, which aids hellions there.
@jesusbarrera6916
@jesusbarrera6916 2 жыл бұрын
also the medivacs are the strongest harass force of any race
@danpitzer765
@danpitzer765 2 жыл бұрын
I will contest the Goliath placement, on grounds that it has more to do with how you like to spend your upgrade funds. I tend to get both upgrades for the Goliath immediately. The big reason is that it *simultaneously* hits ground and air when you've done that. That's something nothing else does. A unique and useful ability, allowing a smaller amount of supply to deal with threats that would otherwise wear you down by too many targets.
@14soccerplayer1
@14soccerplayer1 2 жыл бұрын
@@saphironkindris more range, once your bio ball gets too big you have to stim and run in to get max dps, but with Goliaths they sit in the back. They fill their heavy fire support role very nicely.
@lepidusstupidius2956
@lepidusstupidius2956 2 жыл бұрын
Honestly(probably stupid but whatever) I rush goliaths and their upgrades, as it provides basic ground support fire, destroys anything in the sky(at the same time), and it is super low micro.
@danpitzer765
@danpitzer765 2 жыл бұрын
@@lepidusstupidius2956 Great for protecting Siege Tanks. Close range fire to keep the fast guys out of the deadzone, missiles to keep the sky clear. Tanks can handle the heavy ground stuff. Does mean that instead of multiple barracks and bio upgrades, you do multiple factories and vehicle upgrades. And maybe a couple science vessels to hang out as medics.
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
* sad colossus noises *
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
@@Whatthe914 storms ultras siege tanks?
@MainTopmastStaysail
@MainTopmastStaysail Жыл бұрын
One funny thing about the Medivac: for some reason, Medics can't "heal up" but Medivacs can. If you're using the Hive Mind Emulator on All In Air the inability to heal Mutas or Brood Lords is weirdly relevant.
@krunkcleanup2949
@krunkcleanup2949 9 ай бұрын
I would definitely move Medivacs up a tier just for the simple fact that you can do micro to save valuable units (i.e. mercenaries), not just drop a location.
@TOOTHBRUSHDUCK
@TOOTHBRUSHDUCK 2 жыл бұрын
Merc's really show how small stat boosts and skipping production time and tech requirements is hugely powerful. Makes sense why raynor at the end of the epilogue just only builds mercs
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
he builds mercs at the production buildings, not the mer compound meaning that they just get the flat damage/health buff i mean, it works with Siege Breakers, sooo
@thebacongamer1488
@thebacongamer1488 2 жыл бұрын
I like how the regular firebat stole the devil dogs place in the tier list XD...just goes to show how simmaler the models are
@14soccerplayer1
@14soccerplayer1 2 жыл бұрын
Devil dog is pretty different, but yeah they are close
@RoyalFusilier
@RoyalFusilier 2 жыл бұрын
"Smells like... victory."
@almaspite6840
@almaspite6840 2 жыл бұрын
i thinked it was wierd from a pro starcraft player to think the devil dogs is the firebat
@badrinath5306
@badrinath5306 10 ай бұрын
​@@almaspite68401. He isn't exactly a pro player he is a content creator. 2. A pro player probably would ask what a devil dog is cause theu probably don't play the campaign that much.
@almaspite6840
@almaspite6840 10 ай бұрын
Kinda fair and true and i gues @@badrinath5306
@mmg5188
@mmg5188 2 жыл бұрын
Considering that you already have a starport, to pay for a transport slot on a medivac would cost 100(cost in minerals) / 8(number of transport slots on a medivac) = 12.5 minerals and also 12.5 gas (due to the medivac having the same price of minerals and gas). For a hercules it costs (300(mineral cost of hercules) + 50(mineral cost of tech lab) + 150(mineral cost of fusion core)) / 30(number of transport slots on a hercules) = 16.(6) minerals and (200(gas cost of hercules) + 25(gas cost of tech lab) + 150(gas of fusion core)) / 30(number of transport slots on a hercules) = 12.5 gas, therefore the medivac is slightly more efficient if you build only one hercules, however it depends on how many you build, for example 5 hercules come out as 11.(3) minerals and 7.8(3) gas per transport slot. In the end, it depends on how many hercules you build.
@sgtkumpel
@sgtkumpel 2 жыл бұрын
Summary: Medivac 12.5 Mins 12.5 Gas/Slot Hercules: 16.7 Mins 12.5 Gas/Slot So it's a better unit and even with all the hassle of getting the fusion core and techlab it's still super close in cost/capacity (bit more expensive in minerals) just getting more accessible for any one over the first you build.
@casey653
@casey653 2 жыл бұрын
If you have to build a starport, the efficiency gap really widens and the hercules becomes a lot better. If you have to build a factory, oh my.
@catsquidcatoverlord9842
@catsquidcatoverlord9842 2 жыл бұрын
But if you fill your supply with Hercules then they are the most efficient.
@yamatohime2035
@yamatohime2035 2 жыл бұрын
@@Archphoenix1 Medics are more efficient if your bio can survive on ground. Hercules main advatange is survival ability and deployment speed.
@Ruzkiel
@Ruzkiel 2 жыл бұрын
Should the cost in supply be considered? It's not a significant factor when comparing a single Hercules to Medivacs, but I imagine the gap widens a fair bit (much like how the mineral cost gap decreases) as you jump to 2 Hercules.
@geammanDW
@geammanDW 2 жыл бұрын
Agree with pretty much everything except maybe the goliaths. When I go ground mech, they are usually the core of my army with a couple science vessels for healing, and they can shoot ground and air at the same time, its like having free vikings with it. And they are quite cheap to mass produce.
@therat1117
@therat1117 2 жыл бұрын
Have you considered that the Goliath is not a Marine?
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
Also, Vikings suck to use when you play ground! They just fly away now, fly away now, fly awaaaay Seriously, it is ridiculously hard not to lose them against enemy AA simply because they can be hit with it and because they don't bunch up like all ground units do Yes, it's a plus, it's also a minus
@jordanread5829
@jordanread5829 2 жыл бұрын
I would say that being massively dependent on the upgrades is a negative in my book. If you look at units like the Marine or the Ghost, they are still strong units even without the upgrades. You are better just going bio for Welcome to the Jungle instead of mass goliath like the game encourages. Just like how mass reaper is better for Outbreak over the Helion.
@geammanDW
@geammanDW 2 жыл бұрын
@@jordanread5829 You're right, Marines are better, but I was saying how the Goliaths aren't as bad as they are portrayed and also if you wanna go mech for fun, its really not a bad option.
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
@@jordanread5829 it's not like that Hellions are always horrible
@anjoumaaka
@anjoumaaka 2 жыл бұрын
The problem with Wraiths is that Blizzard made them literally the same as they are in Starcraft/Brood War. The lack of being anti-light and anti-armored makes this even more apparent.
@RainingMetal
@RainingMetal Жыл бұрын
There is one change, for the worse: They need a Tech Lab to be produced. The basic fighter from the previous game needs a tech upgrade.
@leoneldiaz78
@leoneldiaz78 Жыл бұрын
They are actually worse than in Broodwar as their anti ground rate of fire is significantly slower which severely effects it's DPS (it's anti air attack is slower too but it's less noticable) it costs 150 gas instead of broodwars 100, has a slower move speed and takes much longer to build. Basically the only things they didn't nerf is it's damage per hit which is the same and it's HP (which got buffed by 5 lol)
@hanneswiggenhorn2023
@hanneswiggenhorn2023 9 ай бұрын
I think the bigger problem is that the viking and the banshee exist. Both are specialized offsprings of it. This means that to be balanced, the viking needs to have better anti air capabilities than the wraith, else the viking would be useless. The same counts for the banshee with ground. So the wraith is stuck in a place where you have better options for both ground and air targets, making it it pretty useless in comparison. It's only unique features compared to viking and banshee is a cloaked anti air attack, but that's by far not enough to justify its existence
@zeratai2465
@zeratai2465 9 ай бұрын
​I think the game does a good job of showcasing how outdated some of the original units are. The Banshee effectively covers the anti-ground weakness, while the Viking seems based on the superior anti-air unit that was the Valkyrie. Salvaging the superior UED tech did wonders to the evolution of Koprulu Terran tech.
@badopinionssquid1735
@badopinionssquid1735 7 ай бұрын
​@@zeratai2465And then they salvaged the Valkryie again and it gave us the Liberator
@dallasgarza2610
@dallasgarza2610 2 жыл бұрын
I remember choosing the predator for the first time, thinking it would be amazing! I was immediately regretting my choice.
@BlazingGlaceon
@BlazingGlaceon 2 жыл бұрын
Same lmao. It _sounds_ so cool, and then you field a few, and it's like "... oh."
@jordanread5829
@jordanread5829 2 жыл бұрын
Honestly that row in the zerg research is just disappointing. Predator is garbage and the Hercules is only good on like 2 or so missions. That being the Mobius Factor and Maw of the Void. The two missions where dropships are mostly needed. Hell, the latter is ultimately mass BC and A move. Even more so if you pick the Science Vessel over the Raven on the Protoss tree. It is weird how the Science Vessel vs Raven makes sense. As you are picking two strong utility units. While for the Zerg research you choose between a paper cat and a dropship. Like neither of them have anything in common.
@hanneswiggenhorn2023
@hanneswiggenhorn2023 9 ай бұрын
Same, on paper it sounds really cool and fun to play with, but in reality the enemy armies are way to diverse/strong to be vulnerable to it. It's good at one thing and exactly one thing and has hardly any synergies, making it effectively useless
@Satherian
@Satherian 2 жыл бұрын
Next: Real-scale tier list
@madness1231
@madness1231 2 жыл бұрын
I genuinely really appreciated the breakdown here, my gripe with most tier lists is that they don't explain very well at all *why* something is in a certain tier but this was genuinely helpful knowledge. The rankings all make sense and are well-explained. I'd love to see more tier lists on the channel
@casey653
@casey653 2 жыл бұрын
The Medivac and the Hercules (starting with the cost of a starport, so factory + barracks not included) cost per slot is: Medivac: 31.25minerals per slot and 25gas per slot Hercules: 21.67minerals per slot and 15.83gas per slot So, assuming you started with both a barracks and a factory, Hercules is a better dropship But what if you had start with building a factory? Medivac: 50minerals per slot and 37.5gas per slot Hercules: 26.67minerals per slot and 20gas per slot Most campaigns start you off with a barracks, so I'm not doing barracks. I also assumed you aren't using a tech reactor (building a tech lab instead), but medivacs don't need one anyway. I think, as a dropship, that the hercules is wayyyyy better than a medivac can ever be. Now all we need is to be able to put a marine on the back of a predator. Factory: 150m 100g Starport: 150m 100g Tech Lab: 50m 25g Fusion Core: 150m 150g Medivac: 100m 100g 8slots Hercules: 300m 200g 30slots
@tabula_rosa
@tabula_rosa 9 ай бұрын
The Hercules is also a better healer since medics heal units inside it, AND if you stick scvs inside it it is an insanely busted OP science vessel that perma defense matrices the units its healing
@Ruzkiel
@Ruzkiel 2 жыл бұрын
I'm personally a bit happy to see as many people defending the Goliath in the comments as I am. I was experiencing a bit of personal success in using them, but assumed it was primarily due to the differences in Brutal versus Hard, and the fact I decided to wait on getting Vikings and Ghosts to see what Tosh and Hanson have to say at the conclusion of other missions.
@MainTopmastStaysail
@MainTopmastStaysail Жыл бұрын
I've done mech-only Brutal and I think the Goliath is a perfectly fine unit. Your tanks obliterate ground forces and your goliaths sit just in front of them fending off air. They are appreciably better than marines in this role because of the extra bulk and range. (Actually tank + goliath is pretty much the only viable mech-only composition...)
@HalfGroxus
@HalfGroxus 2 жыл бұрын
And that is why Infested Diamondback is so much better than regular diamondback. It can (sorta) target flying units, it costs 3 supply instead of 4 and it can be made without tech lab. And it also has prior experience with dying.
@dondaketype8811
@dondaketype8811 2 жыл бұрын
As an added bonus it's pretty much immune to getting hit by melee if mirco'd
@HalfGroxus
@HalfGroxus 2 жыл бұрын
@@dondaketype8811 Especially if mucus trail is evolved. You just can't touch this
@dondaketype8811
@dondaketype8811 2 жыл бұрын
@@HalfGroxus yup. The downsides (being bio and only +10 vs armored vs +20) are not enough to outweigh all the buffs they gave the infested version
@_wingtip
@_wingtip 10 ай бұрын
The top comment mentions a D-Tier units challenge. Well, I think it might be possible with some adjustments to the rules... I got pretty far in the campaign with C-Tier and under allowed, but no Goliaths. Static defense is allowed and is a must in early missions, but I picked Perdition Turrets instead of the Planetary, and the HME is not allowed (obviously!) What I wanted wasn't to make an impossible torture test, but to force the usage of under-utilized units like the Reaper and Diamondback. I have the difficulty on Brutal, however. It has been a rousing success so far! I've done several missions using all kinds of different strategies: Evacuation was done with Firebats + Missile Turrets, Smash and Grab with Perdition turrets guarding the base while Reapers wielding clusterbombs cleared the path to the artifact, and I even got the Hellion upgrades to help slay the insane amount of Marines on Cutthroat, allowing me to mass up enough Diamondbacks to storm Orlans base. Air units a huge problem as you'd expect; neither the Thor nor the nor the Wraith have particularly good anti-air. Lack of good AA is currently a hurdle, but it feels possible to win. I feel like I'm close to cracking Bel Shir with Thors and Missile Turrets. As for All-In, I recall hearing that the Thor cannon ability (not the 330mm upgrade version) can stun Kerrigan, so I'm curious to try it.
@AlexaRobin21
@AlexaRobin21 6 ай бұрын
Nice one. Would you mind recording a playthrough like that? I'd love to see it in action.
@halqthedarktemplar
@halqthedarktemplar 2 жыл бұрын
Spectres have more dps (7.5+2.5 vs armored) than ghosts (6.7+0.7 vs light), even against light (7.5 vs 7.4). They have 20 less hp and no range upgrade though. On the other hand, they are a little faster (2.75 vs 2.25 speed)
@SenyiKimmo
@SenyiKimmo 2 жыл бұрын
Spectres also shoot slower than ghosts
@halqthedarktemplar
@halqthedarktemplar 2 жыл бұрын
@@SenyiKimmo already took that into consideration when calculating dps
@adrianrodriguez8503
@adrianrodriguez8503 Жыл бұрын
Spectres are my go to! Can't betray my man Tosh.
@Federer227
@Federer227 2 жыл бұрын
1st I was "well, why not - I gonna watch this" and then I have so much fun listening it like a podcast while I was driving... please, make it for the other campaigns as well P.s.: One more positive point for the Hercules - you have to choose between him and the Predator... and I think it's not even a choice here, right? I mean: it's not like you're trading off something good to have it (like Raven vs. Science Vessel)
@casey653
@casey653 2 жыл бұрын
Things I've learned from this video: Marines are better than I thought. Mercenaries are better than I thought Build some f*king vikings Its time we get the entire sc2 community to find a way to make the predator a good unit
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
We did! Check out the Three Player Campaign!
@Abuzz03_
@Abuzz03_ 2 жыл бұрын
I’d absolutely be interested to see HOTS and LOTV units as well. I love when Starcraft elements are discussed it creates the possibility of new ideas or potential great changes to make units viable.
@vivybestgirl822
@vivybestgirl822 2 жыл бұрын
Little nitpick, you switched up Devil Dogs and Firebats
@norberthiz9318
@norberthiz9318 2 жыл бұрын
ah the poor goliath is getting bullied again, I think it's actually pretty close to being a good unit, it's has decent ground attack, good anti-air, not that tanky, but still not made of paper, can attack both ground and air at the same time, which is a very cool and unique thing that very rarely comes up. It just not great at anything and a bit too expensive and also mech. I still think people would not hate it so much if it wasn't introduced in welcome to the jungle, it so abismal on that mission, that it's no wonder people just never use it afterwards. About the wraith, the unit is... garbage, BUT it's good on one single mission. On Haven's fall I think it's better than the viking(or at least on par). It can very effiecently deal with the air, you just snipe the overseer and kill everything while cloaked, and you can just kill the virophage without bothering with the ground. The problem is that they obviously become useless when you try to push the bases Ans yes I think we all would like to watch a hots and lotv tier list as well
@jordanread5829
@jordanread5829 2 жыл бұрын
I would say the negative about the Goliath is that it really needs the upgrades from the Armory to be a good unit. Mainly the attack ground and air at the same time. It is in the group of units where it is garbage for the mission you get them from. Joining the Firebat, Helion and Wraith. And that is a bad thing considering that the missions in SC2 (mainly WoL) are designed to be cheesed with the unit you unlock in that mission.
@bogusjuan4998
@bogusjuan4998 2 жыл бұрын
Was doing a factory play through of WoL a little while back, found the diamondback with HP upgrade but no range upgrade makes it a good screen for goliaths that sit back further than the DB after it gets its range upgrade. Goliath does have the highest DPS in game if firing both weapons I believe. DB’s are just so absurdly expensive though that even in this screening role it isn’t that great but there is no other choice really. It’s like they made it suck on purpose so people wouldn’t complain on why it isn’t in game. Can mineral dump some throwaway hellions to aid in that gas heavy comp as well btw
@paintswithlead7517
@paintswithlead7517 25 күн бұрын
love your vids really cool info! Helps mods and just regular players
@MultiKeto
@MultiKeto 2 жыл бұрын
one thing about the medic it can heal in a bunker for brutal+
@geammanDW
@geammanDW 2 жыл бұрын
Would love to see the other campaigns too.
@jeffreywarf
@jeffreywarf 2 жыл бұрын
firebat should do bonus damage to biological and have stim. that would differentiate it from the hellion in a useful manner
@bluesbest1
@bluesbest1 2 жыл бұрын
You'd think that those two would do that by default, especially considering where and how they're introduced.
@jeffreywarf
@jeffreywarf 2 жыл бұрын
@@bluesbest1 blizzard: "let's just make all the buildings and almost all the units have the light tag to trick people into thinking the hellion is better than it is in this campaign"
@bluesbest1
@bluesbest1 2 жыл бұрын
@@jeffreywarf At least the third Colonist Unit, the Viking, had an accurate description: a fighter that can transform to land. Jim: "We need fire." Game: "Fire is actually useless."
@lukas4333
@lukas4333 2 жыл бұрын
I liked this video a lot! I'd be up for more tier lists.
@sgtkumpel
@sgtkumpel 2 жыл бұрын
Hi Grant, I had hoped for something like this video for a while now, so thank you. I'd be interested in this ranking for the other campaigns and maybe also for research, kerrigan abilities and solarite options. I have no idea if this can be done for Nova CO. Maybe Nova gear, don't know if units or unit upgrades could be rated somehow because there's just a bunch of combinations. Anyways, have a great day.
@golemgolden4670
@golemgolden4670 2 жыл бұрын
I will defend the goliath here, overall without upgrades they are pretty terrible i agree, with upgrades they become a more expensive marine with more hp (that might seem like an insult but that's mostly because the marine is the best unit in the bloody game), that can fire at both ground and air at the same time and can fill any nieche it wants. Enemy air does not exist, seeker missiles dont exist to punish your clumps and ground will die bloody fast as well. I am pretty sure that it could beat the entire game without any other support and no major difficulties which can only really be said for the marines (and the marine only run was still difficult) and ghosts. (you may need a dropship on maw of the void but only for getting on the island initially)
@soythelubu5389
@soythelubu5389 2 жыл бұрын
Now i want to see maw of the void goliath only
@ThanhLe-ti8nx
@ThanhLe-ti8nx 2 жыл бұрын
The thing is, it's so much cheaper and faster to get an army of marine than an army of goliath. For goliath, you need to spend quite a lot of gas: the production (2-3 factory techlab), 1-2 armories for upgrade and some for scv repair. And with that amount of time and resource, it's more efficient to make marines, barrack doesn't cost gas, engineering base doesn't cost gas, so it can be use for upgrade, medic, and reactor.
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
Banelings ahahahahahahah
@soythelubu5389
@soythelubu5389 2 жыл бұрын
I mean you could use tech reactor rather than build a third factory (infact i never gotten orbital drop pods)
@golemgolden4670
@golemgolden4670 2 жыл бұрын
@@ThanhLe-ti8nx If you compare any unit to the marine, it will win. its the best unit in the game and i am not saying it isn't. But after a while it gets really bloody boring to mass marine every mission and steamroll everything with almost 0 things the AI can do. Slap in all the mercanries and you have an easy mission no matter what.
@hanneswiggenhorn2023
@hanneswiggenhorn2023 9 ай бұрын
I kinda love how the Thor went from bad against air in WoL to being the go to ground to air unit in LotV
@pawli7470
@pawli7470 2 жыл бұрын
I can't believe grant forgot the greatest unit the scv it is the unit that is needed in any composition hance forth the scv is the omega s tier imo
@StrakanDocrusReakal
@StrakanDocrusReakal Жыл бұрын
No, no, no, it's not S tier, it's SCV, tier, which is far above S tier
@Leon_Ryu
@Leon_Ryu 2 жыл бұрын
I've been looking forward to this! The big surprise is how much better the mercs are compared to the vanilla units. Saving build time, not needing infrastructure, and being easier to fit in various compositions, all these are bonuses less obvious than the "+x damage, +y HP" that the game advertises. I'd love to see this for the other campaigns as well!
@BullYo12
@BullYo12 2 жыл бұрын
I would like to see you make tier lists about other campaigns. It also serves a purpose since anyone can see your opinions about units in one place instead of hunting for them in the VODs
@MajoraZero
@MajoraZero 2 жыл бұрын
Great list! Please do make one for HotS and LotV! I'd love to have your thoughts on all units of these campaigns.
@SmugLookingBarrel
@SmugLookingBarrel 2 жыл бұрын
Yeah, I'd love to see tier lists for the other campaigns, especially since Hots and Lotv have mutually exclusive units competing with each other.
@conradbielicki774
@conradbielicki774 2 жыл бұрын
I actually like to mix in a few hellions on all in to keep me running out of gas. I always use tech reactor. I like drop pods but find rallying at base is pretty useful to reduce on static defense spending anyway
@act2hu
@act2hu 2 жыл бұрын
Yes please do the rest of the campaigns units as tierlists 🙏
@Beautiful6064
@Beautiful6064 2 жыл бұрын
I am super excited for him to do Zerg and Protoss and Nova next, Grant I dont think you know how useful this actually is, I have a few friends that play SC2 but struggle with the units and what to build and I think this will really help them
@rakisuzuki-burke4148
@rakisuzuki-burke4148 2 жыл бұрын
Hercules in WoL is 300 minerals, 200 vespene, +150/150 for the fusion core and 50/25 for the tech lab and has 30 slots. Medivac is 100/100 for eight slots. Total for hercules is 500/375 for 20 and medivac is 100/100 for eight. The Hercules is more expensive, but it deploys all of its units at once without a lab upgrade, and the units are not destroyed if it is.
@Garryl367
@Garryl367 2 жыл бұрын
A Medivac costs 100/100/2 for 8 slots (12.5/12.5/0.25 per slot). If you assume that Medivacs can replace some of the Medics you would otherwise have to build and transport with your bio army, as opposed to just being transport units, their cost efficiency goes up dramatically. Even if you only use 1 less Medic for every 2 Medivacs, that drops the effective cost to 75/87.5/1.5 for 8 slots and 0.5 virtual slots from the extra unit you don't have to bring (8.82/10.3/0.18 per effective slot). A Hercules costs 300/200/6 for 30 slots (10/6.77/0.20 per slot). Assuming you build only one and aren't going for BCs or any other Tech Lab Starport units, the additional cost of a Fusion Core (150/150) and a Tech Lab (50/25) brings the total cost up to 500/375/6 for 30 slots (16.67/12.5/0.20 per slot). At 2 Hercules, you beat Medivacs on gas but not on minerals, with a total cost of 800/575/12 for 60 slots (13.33/9.58/0.20 per slot). You need at least 3 of them to break mineral parity with Medivacs with 1100/775/18 for 90 slots (12.22/8.61/0.2 per slot). Also worth noting, until your army hits the 200 supply cap, each extra unit of supply costs 12.5 minerals in Supply Depots, plus an indeterminate amount of lost SCV mining time that I won't attempt to estimate. Consequently, you can add 3.125 minerals/slot to the Medivac's effective cost and 2.5 minerals/slot to the Hercules's effective cost, which makes 2 Hercules only 1.33% more expensive in minerals per slot than Medivacs (15.833 vs. 15.625). It's also worth noting that you can tailor your Medivac troop size to more closely match the size of your droppable army, whereas Hercules come in larger packets of 30 slots. If you don't fill up that last Hercules, you might be able to save on fewer Medivacs. Ex: 2 Hercules can provide 60 slots which would otherwise require 8 Medivacs to carry, but if you only have 45 slots worth of units to drop it still takes 2 Hercules, but only 6 Medivacs. Note: Costs are listed in minerals/gas/supply.
@bluenicholasbf2142
@bluenicholasbf2142 2 жыл бұрын
For your last point on 45 slots of units to carry, you're not forced to only build hercules, you can mix and match. So 1 hercules and 2 medivacs will do the trick.
@nacl4988
@nacl4988 6 ай бұрын
Also, the Hercules drops all its units in literal microseconds, While Medivacs take a full 3-5 working days to get their units down. And the Hercules is tanky as hell, So even if the enemy is trying to shoot it down, And its trying to drop into a medium-danger Area, It flies in, Tanks all the damage, Drops its entire army in 2 seconds. Instead of Medivacs, Who mostly die on the way in, And then most of them die when trying to drop their payloads
@nivannakingsman1383
@nivannakingsman1383 2 жыл бұрын
I honestly forgot the Goliath needed a tech lab. I'm so used to playing Swann in multiplayer and they cost no gas and are a base factory unit. Aka, a mineral dump. Curious on your thoughts with the co-op aspects of the units. Just curious, no need for a vid
@DrakonLameth
@DrakonLameth 2 жыл бұрын
I want predators and firebats to be better too. Also, I'm sure that, if they went through with the idea of the merc. reapers, those would be, like so many other merc units, a good thing to pick up to add to your army without having to worry about the extra costs in normal production of that kind of unit. Also, I eagerly await not only the LotV one (as you've done HotS by the time of my comment), but also Nova Ops for the unit upgrades there too.
@muroawolff7762
@muroawolff7762 2 жыл бұрын
I would love to see for each tier a list of things buffs and or tweaks no needs unless stupid overpowered like the raven, that could be done to improve each unit in custom campaigns to make each one a viable unit in almost any build you can think of. Just a future video idea.
@StealthFoxx
@StealthFoxx Жыл бұрын
It’s really interesting that the coop heroes (swann for example) while only having specific units, have upgrades that solve the major issues of the low tier units making them viable
@caenen6869
@caenen6869 2 жыл бұрын
Tier list videos have the stigma of "low effort", and arguably they're easier to make as other types of videos (which doesn't have to be a bad thing), but they're still enjoyable to watch so that's what counts. I'm looking forward to hearing the insights in your rankings in this video!
@Gemoron
@Gemoron 2 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see these tierlists with Hots and LotV, maybe even for Ghost(maybe a module tier list?) As for the goliath, I would agree that it isn't S-Tier. it fills a nieche of ground to air mech unit with a good range. Considering you argues for tanks and marines with upgrades, I do the same with the goliath, and then it is good, not as a spamable unit (Swann coop mode), but at least as supplement. and yes, then the goliath merc fully fills the slot as well.
@user-rb9xg7zl7c
@user-rb9xg7zl7c 2 жыл бұрын
Great video!
@ehk5948
@ehk5948 2 жыл бұрын
I enjoy well informed tier lists.
@fredhurst2528
@fredhurst2528 2 жыл бұрын
You could do tier list for upgrades, I'd check that out. I'd look at a tier list for brood war campaign units as well.
@solaariel2692
@solaariel2692 2 жыл бұрын
I be interested in seeing a tier list for WoL armory upgrades, it might help to explain why you aways buy certain upgrades and ignore others.
@DarkQuill
@DarkQuill 2 жыл бұрын
Lists for the other two and even Nova Covert Ops would be neat.
@roswellblackrose
@roswellblackrose Жыл бұрын
Has he done a tier list for the Terran research upgrades? I'd like to hear his thoughts on stuff like auto refineries, vanadium plating etc.
@vladimirtchuiev2218
@vladimirtchuiev2218 2 жыл бұрын
I like how the good units coincide with bio and bio-tank multiplayer play, maybe with the exception of hellions and medivacs. I would also like to see how the hots and lotv fit in here, but I understand it's a stretch.
@Pure_Linnsanity
@Pure_Linnsanity 5 ай бұрын
I know I'm a year late to comment as I rewatch this, and that it's about the campaign, but the goliath comments made me think about Swann in co-op. It's kinda neat to me that while it retains the hefty cost, it does benefit from his "medic" healing, can be reactored, doesn't have to compete with vikings and you can build the range upgrades mid-mission when you need them. Kinda nice that the co-op version solved some problems the campaign goliath had.
@jessesturgeon5327
@jessesturgeon5327 2 жыл бұрын
Mass predator is so much fun in Haven's Fall. That's the only mission I've ever used it in though
@emilchan5379
@emilchan5379 2 жыл бұрын
I agree with most of the unit placings except the Goliath and to a lesser extent the Viking. Imo the Goliaths once you get both upgrades are really nice fire support units to throw into your army composition. Their long-range missiles do a great job taking down enemy air, while any survivors are mopped up by your Marines. They pair up nicely with Siege Tanks too, since their autocannons will kill any unit that survives long enough to breaks through to the tank line, while their missiles deal with the air units. Because I use the Goliath so much I almost never see the need for Vikings. Unlike Vikings, upgraded Goliaths can attack both air and ground without needing to transform, and because of their longer range it means they usually stick behind your Marine army. Whereas Vikings need more micro as they tend to fly ahead of your army into enemy AA, or they need to transform to support ground. I seldom use Ghosts either, but that is mostly because I prefer siding with Tosh in the campaign lol.
@darko8959
@darko8959 2 жыл бұрын
I would love to see your tierlists for HotS and LoV and maybe NCO
@andischwarzkopf2297
@andischwarzkopf2297 2 жыл бұрын
Grant had some fun with the timestamps
@maherthemage1458
@maherthemage1458 2 жыл бұрын
I'd watch another one of these!
@mattcat83
@mattcat83 2 жыл бұрын
I modded my Nightmare Mode predators to jump along with me reapers to give the group something a bit tankier to accompany them with and I sped them up to keep pace. It makes for an interesting niche.
@StrakanDocrusReakal
@StrakanDocrusReakal Жыл бұрын
If all units could jump, I wonder what the worst jumper would be and then what the worst one to have jump into your base would be.
@PeterZaitcev
@PeterZaitcev 2 жыл бұрын
Grant: I am a tier-list purist. S is for Sacred. There could be only one, at least two items for the S-tier. Also Grant:
@The-jy3yq
@The-jy3yq 2 жыл бұрын
What's wrong with three units in S tier? It's not like Artosis's SC1 unit tierlist's S tier.
@PeterZaitcev
@PeterZaitcev 2 жыл бұрын
@@andrewgreeb916 i know. A just don't think Ghost are THAT good. Also I'm just joking on Grant by using his own words
@NoraNekos7
@NoraNekos7 2 жыл бұрын
Well, he did say at the start how this tier list works
@yonokhanman654
@yonokhanman654 2 жыл бұрын
If the main antagonist of Wings of Liberty hadn't been Zerg, the Spectre would have been better than the Ghost. Stun shreds both Terran and Protoss compositions, but Snipe shreds Zerg compositions. Stun is just an incredible tool for your bioball when you are faced against Siege Tanks and Colossi, but Ultralisks can't be stunned and the rest of the Zerg units are too swarmy to be effectively stunned.
@EC123z
@EC123z 2 жыл бұрын
i like how you mixed up the images for devil dog and firebat
@timmy9818
@timmy9818 2 жыл бұрын
Great video, it would be interesting to see the HoTS and LoTV version Also I was curious about something, can the Raven point defense drone block Kerrigan's attacks on All In? I always choose the science vessel because of the heal (too lazy to drag scvs and it saves a few resources) so I never played with Ravens
@poscat0x04
@poscat0x04 Жыл бұрын
It can, and it's absolutely broken.
@ZeHeavyArmor
@ZeHeavyArmor 2 жыл бұрын
Now that you made the WoL Campaign Units tier list, the RS edition would be super interesting.
@brentramsten249
@brentramsten249 2 жыл бұрын
i feel like i could make an entire co-op commander from the D and C teir list with maybe one tech unit thrown in for fun. making warfield and trying to get the gorgon to work even a little like it does in the heart of the swarm would also be hilarious.
@Oktenko
@Oktenko 2 жыл бұрын
I'd love to hear your opinions on Heart of the Swarm. And Legacy of the Void as well (killing time or not, I'd love to hear your take on them)
@YellowEllo
@YellowEllo 2 жыл бұрын
Goliaths do not suck :( The ability to shoot air and ground at the same time is nice. I think of it as a slightly tankier, more expensive marine with permanent stim if air and ground are together. They can also be healed by science vessel and scv, the anti air can cover for any banshee or for the science vessel
@pallingtontheshrike6374
@pallingtontheshrike6374 2 жыл бұрын
goliath fragile
@YellowEllo
@YellowEllo 2 жыл бұрын
@Pallington the Shrike For a mech unit yes, but I conpared it to bio and as such it seems a viable replacement to me. It also has 2 healing source options instead of one
@pallingtontheshrike6374
@pallingtontheshrike6374 2 жыл бұрын
@@YellowEllo the problem is it costs more and takes longer to build up to than bio [in pure production/building time], and one of the repair sources is from the starport [which takes EVEN LONGER], the other costs res [if you mean repair] for something that is vaguely equivalent in combat power to mass marine
@YellowEllo
@YellowEllo 2 жыл бұрын
@@pallingtontheshrike6374 But its cooler
@Varkenarah
@Varkenarah 2 жыл бұрын
For the Predator, I would have loved to have seen it have upgrades at the armory (as well as the Hercules). Both of these units have to compete with other upgraded units, and they just can't compete. I would have loved to have seen a combat "raptor zergling" upgrade to the Predator - it would work great with the theme of a mechanic pouncing panther, and a defensive upgrade to make mech-only more viable or a utility upgrade like making them a mobile sensor tower (like predator instincts) or a weaker mobile psi disruptor
@AbelGomez1987
@AbelGomez1987 6 ай бұрын
Love your tier list, for me I would put the thor to a C because it's 330mm Barrage Cannon is really good at wiping out ground units when properly placed. I absolutely love them in any protoss missions where they send a bunch of archons and immortals coming your way. Which the ghosts are very helpful anticipating when they come. Only two are necessary for me. Their tankiness is also appreciated which is what I combo with Hercules and I rate the Hercules an A tier. If they decide to focus on and start pounding on one of the thor units while the rest of your smaller bio composition is gunning the enemy down, Hercules can come in and transport Thor or any of your valuable ground units such as mercenaries off the battlefield, saving the unit because of how fast and bulky they are. Their tankiness is also greatly appreciated for transporting and flanking the enemy. Yet again, I've only played on regular Brutal difficulty, I can't imagine how much of a different ball park it is playing from Brutal to Brutal+ My plans will likely fall flat on its face. lol 😅
@Darkside007
@Darkside007 2 жыл бұрын
I would also like to see more campaign unit lists.
@chiaroscuro25
@chiaroscuro25 2 жыл бұрын
26:12 Unless the Hercules is over water. Even a little strip of it. Then everything dies. That was a very harsh discovery on Moebius Factor one day! 😮🤦‍♂🤪
@Zylosio
@Zylosio 2 жыл бұрын
Honestly compared to Thors goliaths feel way better, Thors are slow factory units that are only good against ground, for which the Tank is just way better both for sieging and just fights. So the Thor doesnt rly do anything while the Goliath fixes the total Lack of anti air that all the other factory mechs have, the only reason Not to Go goliaths is because marine medic is just better i
@14soccerplayer1
@14soccerplayer1 2 жыл бұрын
But you can always add some Goliaths at the back of your bio, they have good range
@TylerMarsh43
@TylerMarsh43 2 жыл бұрын
Grant, I thought of a potential way to may firebats good. What if they on death exploded causing area damage kinda like a baneling aoe splash radius
@TheFighterofthenight
@TheFighterofthenight 2 жыл бұрын
would love to see a series of modded campaigns that grant would consider every unit balanced/ good. It would be interesting to see and i want biosteel etc to be good
@XupyprKZ
@XupyprKZ 2 жыл бұрын
All da units be like "yeah we are Raynor's Raiders" Raven: I AM G R E E N
@xseros7954
@xseros7954 2 жыл бұрын
You should rank the individual Armory and lab console upgrades
@logicalspaghetti
@logicalspaghetti 2 жыл бұрын
(Assuming that you already have a starport) medivac: cost: 100/100 slots: 8 cost per slot: 12.5/12.5 One Herc: cost: 300/200 + 150/150* + 50/25* (500/375) slots: 30 cost per slot: 16.6/12.5 Six hercs (enough for max supply) cost: 1800/1200 + 150/150* + 50/25* (2000/1375) slots: 180 cost per slot: 11.1/7.638 *(There's a one time cost for the fusion core and tech lab)
@shadowguy321
@shadowguy321 3 ай бұрын
Another couple of benefits of the Hercules that makes it better than the Medivac. It has natural rapid drop, the Medivac requires an upgrade. This holds the Medi even further back because now units can die if it gets popped out of the sky, and it is slow to drop troops off. The Hercules is also quite fast! Considering it`s a Fusion Core unit, it has no business being as fast as it is, and yet I was quite surprised how quick a unit that is relatively high on the Tier list and pretty tanky moves quite quickly. Compare it to its fellow Fusion Core Unit the BC, or even the Medivac speed. Lastly, although this is very mission specific, on the 1st Char Mission (forget the name, the one where you want to grab the drop pods). If you plan ahead a little bit, it is possible to gain an army that exceeds 200 supply and pump out 2 Hercules units before that happens. It is rare to have an army that huge, but in that specific situation, it is quite useful to be able to load up a vast majority of that force, and go into a hot zone with rapid drop and not need to worry about it all getting blown out of the sky. Especially when that mission is somewhat resource starved compared to other missions.
@Antare5
@Antare5 2 жыл бұрын
I'll also say the Hercules having the rapid drop ability innately whereas the medivac you have to buy the upgrade for, as well as just being a tankier dropship make it that much better compared the medivac. To the point where if I have the research, I will build the Hercules on the dedicated medivac mission.
@sillyking1991
@sillyking1991 2 жыл бұрын
for the warpigs: not only do you not have them early, you also don't get a huge number of them all at once. its what, 3 charges? so by the end of the mission you can max out at 12 war pigs? by late mission thats not enough to make a significant impact on your army. i usually just use war pigs for bunker duty. edit: i'd say the wraith deserves c-tier just based on it 1. being a stealth unit and 2. hitting both ground and air. its got some major downsides, but both those 2 abilities mean that its at least something you can use.
@vahlokdodov8436
@vahlokdodov8436 Жыл бұрын
You forgot to mention the Hercules can load up sieged tonks, making it great for slow pushes
@GreenSwordsman1
@GreenSwordsman1 Жыл бұрын
With wraith introduction mission, I ended up just running viking banshee and it went so much better
@samiamrg7
@samiamrg7 Жыл бұрын
It’s funny that the Goliath is outclassed as an anti-air platform by the Viking considering that is literally the lore reason why we have the Viking. The Viking was introduced as a replacement for the Goliath as a anti-air fighter which can transition into an anti-ground walker, filling the same multi-role walker niche as the Goliath.
@marks7484
@marks7484 2 жыл бұрын
I think you could make goliath far more reliable if, without an upgrade, you make ground attack range 7 and air 12 ( yes, I know it sounds ridiculous) Making it a less damage AA siege tank would make it a really great aa unit and would generally keep it out of the harm's way, while pretty large ground range would let it actually be a heavy support unit like in description. for an upgrade, I would still keep both attacks, but for the other give it jump ability like in Nova covert ops. Additional mobility plus long-range would make this expensive glass cannon far more attractive.
@talibus22
@talibus22 Ай бұрын
I'm surprised that it wasn't mentioned that Thor's upgraded siege cannon ability can stunlock the final boss if couple of them take turns to land the ability proper
@AresKusa
@AresKusa 6 ай бұрын
I bet someone else has mentioned this already since the video has been up for a while, but Thors with the upgraded Strike Cannons can stunlock Kerrigan on All-In, completely trivializing her while Siege Tanks or whatever else blast her in to oblivion. Not really something that would elevate it out of C tier, it leaves it in the same spot as most of the other units in C tier such as Diamondback or Battlecruiser: Useful for one mission only, and rarely if ever used elsewhere
@Snowfireblues
@Snowfireblues 2 жыл бұрын
Now that you mention units from StarCraft 1 that got ported into StarCraft 2 WoL. I don't understand why the Wraith requires tech lab. The in SC1 the Wraith was the ONLY unit you could create without an Add-on to your starport. Goliaths in SC1 can be created WITHOUT an add-on but require an Armory. Since the Barracks didn't have an add-on, but required Academy for all other units outside of the Marine, it makes sense that the Marauder, Firebat, Medic, Reaper, and Ghost/Specter, require tech lab. Still, the point is, some of these units could be made better by shifting the requirements around. Nerf the Science Vessel so that it requires a Physics lab, but the Raven doesn't. Buff the Goliath to 150HP and only make the armory it's only pre-requisite (i.e. reactor but with a caveat). Wraiths don't require tech lab.
@joshuakim5240
@joshuakim5240 2 жыл бұрын
One really interesting thing to note regarding Ghosts and Spectres in the campaign is that, due to the campaign-only Ghost not having EMP (even though enemy Ghosts do, Nova rips us off), it's only good vs Zerg but shreds them like no tomorrow. In comparison, the Spectre is usable vs everything since its abilities don't care if the target is bio or mech, but said abilities don't have the wtf-everything-died power of Snipe spam albeit stunlock spam is applicable against everything and in some cases can be better.
@oliverking8633
@oliverking8633 Жыл бұрын
Don't they also get psyonic lash which if memory is correct deals 200 damage (as an upgrade)
@joshuakim5240
@joshuakim5240 Жыл бұрын
@@oliverking8633 Yes but it is much slower than Snipe, and usually Ultrasonic Pulse spam stunlock is way better.
@corvoattano8567
@corvoattano8567 2 жыл бұрын
This for coop units would get a lot of views imo.
@GamerGuy249
@GamerGuy249 2 жыл бұрын
The cattle bruiser and Goliath are S tier in my heart
@Etropalker
@Etropalker 2 жыл бұрын
HotS unit tier list would be neat, LotV would be amazing, there are way to many units to pick from.
@Garryl367
@Garryl367 2 жыл бұрын
Ghosts are great with rapid-fire Snipe, but what about without it? As a much more average player playing in the year or so after SC2's release, I remember finding it almost unusable. Alternating between Q and click meant I could get off maybe 3 Snipes per second at best, and usually less than that as enemy units would move out from under my mouse cursor before I could click on them or I'd mess up the timing and click before pressing Q and just deselect all my units.
@norberthiz9318
@norberthiz9318 2 жыл бұрын
rapid fire snipe is may be the most overpowered thing in sc2, I can't even imagine that people played against that in 1v1 at some point. It is soo easy to use, you literally just hold down a key move around your mouse and every zerg unit dies. I don't understand what you mean by " but what about without it? ", what would siege tanks be without siege mode, it's just there and you supposed to use it, why wouldn't you use it? Ghost are also a pretty good a move unit and are very easy to use, they have perma cloak, insane range, pretty good dps, and are fairly tanky. The unit is just soo insanely overpowered
@halqthedarktemplar
@halqthedarktemplar 2 жыл бұрын
Q + Shift + click and you just keep clicking without having to press Q. You're welcome :)
@gasbasman
@gasbasman 2 жыл бұрын
Fire bats only with a mod that ground units can hit air. Let's go
@JoshSweetvale
@JoshSweetvale 6 ай бұрын
My standard comp doesn't have Ghosts. I'll give it a go.
@kichrootra
@kichrootra Жыл бұрын
wraith - D tier performance, S tier voice actor
@1987retroman
@1987retroman Жыл бұрын
"The Goliath is trash" Oh, Grant hasn't actually played this before.
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