LOL! Oh, yes. Q's words were prophetic indeed. 😏

Dominion , Species 8472,

@@user-co8uy5rb2s The Hushnock until they were wiped out!

@@MrCrazyrob666 yeah. No telling just how powerful that THEY were. Also, Iconians.

Nobody listens to Q

Fools will always underestimate the Federation's technical skill

As Chekov once said: “My brother! You killed my BROTHER!!!” 😡😡😡

very satisfying.

Disagree the reason that so many ships made it back to DS9 was because the Klingon fleet turned the tide

@@hansgugel2275 Nah. The Federation fought this war alone for most of the time and they were holding off the Dominion Alliance despite having to face many different hostile species of this Alliance (Cardassians, Breen, etc). Klingons jumped back in late game. Federation can flex with that a achievement.

God bless them

to me the ending of this episode and the adversary still gives me chills

I get the feeling. The Borg doesn't feel as shocking because they are strong in a technological sense. While scary, it is hard for a 20th / early 21st century human to draw relateable real world experience to comprehend. This scene however, demonstrates how kamikaze is still a threat even in 24th century. Kamikaze is something we can relate to from ww2. While largely unsuccessful due to superior Allied AA fire, some ships were indeed sunk and the psychological impact it inflicted to all of us (even those born after the war) likely will linger on for generations.

​@@UNSFthe DS9 writing team said they used a Galaxy to underscore the point that in this situation, Picard and the Enterprise would have been destroyed. Sadly, how close the Dominion came to defeating the Federation and how devastating the war was has largely been glossed over by both the franchise and the fandom (many of whom didn't watch DS9 and never will). Instead Wolf 359 is considered a bigger deal.

I still wonder why they didn't use the bridge set from Next Generation for the Odyssey instead of a different bridge. I mean wouldn't it make sense that all Galaxy Class ships would have basically the same bridge?

That's clearly Joe Biden

@@Doodmeister0 Sounds nothing like him.

Also played Dr. Rudy Wells in early seasons of the Six Million Dollar Man.

Playing another legend once more.

if he was the voice of Skeletor then the man was a god

Well, but that's because they a. heavily shielded the Galaxys with their squads, b. that galaxies were not fully equipped ones, but stripped to the bare minimum and most likely all the parts near to the hull were heavily armor upgraded and c. it weren't the command ships

​@@acmenipponairmost of the ships during the dominion war was sent out with most of thier luxury, crew recreational and advanced sciene labs left at the shipyard. Instead they just fitted weapons, sensors and shields and other stuff that helped with the war effort

@@Groza_Dallocort Yes but I guess they used parts of the not used space for more armour. When you don't need a thin hull for your sensor arrays to go through, you can make especially the engineering hull more durable during a fight.

@@acmenipponair true true

​@@acmenipponairActually, it's my understanding from various sources that they didn't even do that. They simply added redundant shield generators, upgraded the Phaser systems, and added additional power generation to feed the beast. Fitting additional armor to an existing ship class like the Galaxy would have been expensive and time consuming (and the Federation was never much for armored hills, anyway...thus their shock at the addition of ablative armor to the Defiant) and chose instead to rely on their superior shield technology. Once the Dominion Polaron Beams were countered, even an Explorer fit Galaxy like the Odyssey could stomp through a flight of Jem'Hadar Fighters like a toddler walking over plastic army men.

The Odyssey charging into her ultimate Doom gotta love it

imagine having to have that guilt trip

@@sadev101 what would be the point they are dead Jim!!!🤣🤣🤣

All those lives to save the sisko​@@SaraMorgan-ym6ue

@@J.Wolf90 Maybe but without Sisko the Federation would have lost the war, how else would we have gotten the Defiant aka "Ben Sisko's Mutha Fudging Pimp Hand" he also brought the Romulins into the war and was basically feared by all

To the Odyssey! Was the war cry as all the sister Galaxy Class Starships with modified shields tore the Dominion fleet a new one in Sacrifice of Angels.

Is it that the name of a book by Homer Simpson

Let’s make sure history never forgets the name…??? Already forgotten.

@@xaviercast970 Said no one EVER. Odyssey and Keogh were embarrassments to all those who served on their Galaxy-class sister ships.

​@thomashong2938 the problem is the Federation doesn't study the enemies strengths and weaknesses good enough and that's what makes them destroyed..look what happened at Wolf 359 when most of the ships were destroyed by the borg.."knowledge is power".

Whoa

Holy... I had to look it up. Michael Jace. 40 years to life for 2nd degree murder. He also played a cop on the TV show "The Shield".

Oh my god, it was his wife he killed too 😔

Wow. I had wondered what happened to him.

@@Psirosand he played the lead Black Panther on Forrest Gump

Careful... you might give this guy: www.youtube.com/@JTVFX1/featured an idea for a HD reanimated Video

Slightly less blurry?

​@@sarcasticguy4311 sounds like the main selling point of new gaming consoles. Lol waste of money

@@J.Wolf90 ok grandpa, let's get you back to bed

Agreed! That could've been the Enterprise, and it STILL would've been smoked. But at least it set the stage for the arrival of Sisko's Fist aka the Defiant. 🖖😎👍

"Divert shield power to weapons!" That's what killed Odyssey. That little bugship would've bounced off Odyssey's shields if Keogh hadn't given that order.

@@fruitofthelum5815 LOL! Not necessarily. The weapons of the Jem'Hadar Fighters were already penetrating their shields, so the odds of the shields getting knocked out were a near certainty anyways. Hells, in TNG the Enterprise's shields had this habit of being knocked out, even when they were up anyways. 😅

@@fruitofthelum5815 Agreed, he didn't anticipate a suicide run because they didn't know who they were fighting.

@@kevinedward6132 He didn’t anticipate a suicide run because he was an arrogant and complacent old fool who didn’t bother to fire his photon torpedoes or to send all his runabouts and shuttles out to form a protective screen around the Odyssey.

Well their shields were useless anyway so might as well use that power for something else

This is what should have happened in "Star Trek: Generations." When a puny bird of prey was bypassing the Enterprise's shields, they should have just gone full crazy mode will all their firepower.

Didn't destroy a single attack ship with all power divereted to weapons! Just goes to show the ingenuity of starfleet and the federation tech leap durin the war.

​@@john-bu6suthis is the problem with this Odyssey business. A Galaxy class ship, with all power diverted to weapons, would be capable of vaporizing a planet. These bad guys get Deus Ex Machina'd into the victory spot. That was always ST's problem. Too much DEM.

@@TestUser-cf4wj Are you trying to be funny? The Galaxy class starship has NO CHANCE of vaporizing a planet. When you get your head out of Star Wars, let us know?

Change Odyssey to Enterprise, Galaxy to Constitution and Jem'Hadar to Klingons and that was me after watching Star Trek III

It was *especially* impactful for those of us who were introduced to Trek via TNG as kids. It was like "🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯" for 10 year old me to see a *Galaxy* class get kaboomed.

​@@dougsmith6262 it was so shocking to watch as a kid, definitely. I did a full rewatch of DS9 again in my 20s, got to "The Jem'Hadar" remembering full well what time it was.....got to the Odyssey part and was still struck with strong emotions. DS9 was just a very well written show imo.

Same here!

I hated “KHAN!!!” more 💀💯💀

*_"Victory is life"_* indeed. Or as I personally like to say, 3:58 _"GLA Postal Service~!"_

You mean shuttlecraft fights.

I'd imagine the dominion war version galaxy's turn rate no doubt be much improved. Better than being a cruise ship that could sink the navy of a small country

*laughs in Enterprise-D acting like the Millennium Falcon in ST Picard*

@@dmanc85 yeah That was stupid

@@dmanc85 The Odyssey was heavily damaged (the left narcelle is even flickering, which means that the energy conduits must have been broken even before the attack), so most likely the inertial dampers didn't worked properly too = they had to turn slowly to avoid having their crew killed. In the case of ST Picard, they didn't needed to care for any crew on board, all of them were on Deck 1, Bridge, so Data could finally fly the hell out of the D without having to consider the safety of the people on board.

Sir... there's another starship coming in. It's the... ah... do we even name our ships?

@@MrCrazyrob666 something like Zulu-5-Bravo

Keevan to Jem’hadar First: “Set trajectory and prepare for ramming speed!...I’m just going to take a short stroll to the escape pod and back before we actually ram them”

@@spartybrearly7221 Keevan to First: "Wh- Me? Abandoning my post? N- No, I would never! I just... left my... k- kava nuts and rippleberries near the escape pods and really need to go get them. brb."

they were bad asses

Imagine also what it would've been like had they gone in with a cloaked squad of Klingon ships backing them up

Zero Starfleet casualties had rhs Defiant been there instead.

It probably wouldn't have made much of a difference, we should remember that this was at a time that the Federation knew little to nothing about the Dominion but clearly they knew more about the Federation. We should also remember that the Defiant got a much stronger hull because the Federation didn't have a defence that were effective against the Dominion weapons, so who knows how the Defiant would have turned out before this event. But either way, as the war got going, the Federation learned a lot more about the Dominion and their capabilities, after that, galaxy class and likely all the other classes of ships got better suited to handle what the Dominion threw at them, hence why we see the Galaxy class ships kicking arse later in the war, especially against the bug ships which were more or less cannon fodder.

@@paul1979uk2000 Wasn't this the encounter that led to Sisko requesting command of the Defiant in the first place?

The very next episode is where she makes her debut.

I feel the Yamato's destruction was more horrifying cuz at least the Odyssey's civilians and non-essential personnel had been offloaded onto DS9 prior to this.

Obedience is victory, and victory is life.

It's even more frightening, when you remember that these scenes were made 7 years before you saw similar images on live tv from NYC...

@@AndrewChapman We don’t know for a fact that anyone was actually offloaded at DS9.

@@thomashong2938 it was stated in the dialog in the DS9 Operations OPS Center when Lieutenant Jadzia Dax asks Captain Keogh has he planned on offloading nonessential personnel and Captain Keogh arrogantly asked Lieutenant Dax had she ever considered serving aboard a starship to which she answered that she was happy serving at DS9.

well atleast the Odyssey is taking hits like a boss those runabouts would be toast without shields the odyssey atleast has the mass to soak some hits before she blows

It's safe to assume the Odyssey gets an -A. The Enterprise-F was Odyssey-class.

@@Sirithil shame the Odyssey was not an Odyssey Class she might have fought off the Jem Hadar🤣🤣🤣

⁠​⁠​⁠@@Sirithil not quite; in alpha canon we don’t yet know its registry but in the game the ship class originated from the new USS Odyssey has the registration NCC-97000. Though being the namesake of the class for the biggest, toughest ships the Federation was producing at that point (aside from maybe the Lexington variant of the class) is a pretty good way of honouring her legacy.

@@Sirithil That doesn't necessarily hold. The Federation often reuses ship names without appending an -A. For example there's a USS Defiant in TOS and a new, different USS Defiant in DS9. There's a USS Stargazer in TNG and a different USS Stargazer in PIC. This still honours their predecessor! But adding the letter suffix seems to be a special extra honour which only protagonists get.

I don't think that's what this scene shows at all. Despite essentially having no shields, the Odyssey was able to tank sustained heavy damage from 3 Dominion attack ships, which we know to be heavily armed. We see that it's still able to lay down phaser fire despite taking heavy damage, and it's still able to retreat at the end of the battle. The only reason it was destroyed was because it was rammed in possibly the worst possible location. The reason the Federation started doing better against the Dominion wasn't necessarily because it started putting armor on its ships (that definitely helped), but because they adapted their shields to the Dominion's polaron weapons. Put nearly any other ship in the Odyssey's position and it would have been destroyed in under a minute. My takeaway from this scene is the Galaxy class is incredibly durable despite not having shields.

@@kyle223cat The Galaxy class is my favorite Trek ship and always will be. I absolutely love the ship, and I'm the first to argue that it'll beat the Sovereign as a warship every single time if they both carry the same weapons. But, I'm not going to say it's without its weaknesses. Yes it tanked several Jem'Hadar attack ships, but it was barely in any condition to escape before they rammed it. The Enterprise-D blew up from a warp core breach while her shields were compromised and she took handful of hits from a century-old Bird of Prey. Before that, the D exploded from a stray ship scraping a warp nacelle in a groundhog day loop episode. If the Odyssey tanked those attack ships so well, it's because they didn't know where her weak spots were. It's because of sloppy writing that the Galaxy class is so weak when its shields are down, since the writers have the goal of making the ship go boom. That doesn't stop it from being canon though.

​@@BlastHardcheeseable In-universe, it was not because the Galaxy class or USS Odyssey were weak, but because Jem'Hadar ships were so much more advanced.

I always loved how this is the only federation ship to take a suicide run after that it's always the Klingons taking the hits in future battles which is interesting you would think the dominion would suicide the galaxy class ships as well as vorchas but nope they suicide birds of prey instead which is a waste of a ship to be honest

It was not the weapons fire that destroyed the odysee. It was the collision. They had reduced power to shields. The shields were set to disperse enemy fire not solid objects. They were damaged and the J'em hadar aimed at the engines. That took down containment of the warp core. After that matter meets antimatter and radiation annihilation turns the fusion plants into nuclear bombs destroying the ship. Fusion power is how they power the ship and impulse drive until the warp core is online.

@@Boa_Omega so what's your point no one here said that weapons fire or ship collision destroyed the odyssey? are you cranky do you need a cookie?

To be fair, Runabouts only last longer due to sheer weave energy. Small frame, way higher agility, they were surviving on not getting hit as much as possible. Case in point, Dax and Odo's Runabout was about to get steamed faster than the Odyssey as soon as it took just a few hits. The Odyssey is definitelly more durable, it's just that Runabouts can be pretty hard to hit.

Data would have saved the day..😂

Lol i didn't notice that

Worf, TRUE Warrior!

It looks like another battle bridge redress, but I do see the center pylon from the old bridge rail behind Captain Keogh.

I think it is meant to be the main bridge, it looks to have the usual galaxy class divide bit behind Keogh but the back is very different. They've often said a lot of bridges were modular and could be swapped out. I believe the Enterprise had a large spacious bridge because it was the flagship and often on high profile diplomatic assignments.

The real-life explanation was that they couldn't use the Enterprise bridge because they were filming Generations at the same time. But yeah I imagine it's either another Battle Bridge, or the Odyssey had a different bridge. There's a few deleted scenes in this episode's scripts that took place on the bridge, I've never managed to find video of it but I imagine they would give us a better look at the bridge layout.

lol not all ships have the same looking bridge you know

@@bryanpassifiume8255 Usually, ships of the same class do, at least when it comes to the layout..

Not sure if they are using the Battle Bridge

I believe that was the intent but sometimes actor availability becomes a problem.

@@danielbuggie591 that's understandable, disappointing, but understandable.

@@stith Yeah, it happens. Like the Admiral in the 2-parter regarding the coup on Earth (Paradise Lost) was also the actor who played General Hague in Babylon 5. However he opted to go with DS9 with the scheduling conflict so the character was killed offscreen in B5.

@@danielbuggie591 "Where is General Hague" - "he is on Deep Space 9, he got double booked, so JMS just killed him off screen" - at least Talia Winters got a send off episode before her brain ended on the desk of Walter Koenig. :D

@@acmenipponair Talia was more important to the story arch though. Unfortunately she presumably would've gotten the increased screentime she wanted as the show shifted into the Shadow War based on the way things played out with Lyta. Hague dying though would've been inevitable since the story needed Sheridan and Co to lead and become the faces of the resistance. I suspect Hague would've died in Severed Dreams myself or shortly after regardless.

I often get Dune ads with these clips :)

budget probably lol

The saucer has a lot of weaponry on it also, they should have separated it though, two targets, firing from different angles, but as the other poster said, budget.

Uh, incompetent, arrogant, complacent starship captain and equally bad senior officers.

Once they said that I knew the Odyssey was toast.

@@Infern0121 multi vector assault system.

Alan is largely a voiceover actor so yes I assume he did Skeletor

And Man-At Arms...and Mer-Man...and...

Yes

The one and only.

They just had the rotten luck of having the biggest fool since George Armstrong Custer as their captain. “This ship and crew were every bit that Enterprise was.” If that was even remotely true, then Odyssey wouldn’t have ended up in bits and pieces.

@@thomashong2938 Imagine thinking that an enterprise ship is invincible for any reason other than plot armor

@@Cd5ssmffan A ship is only as good as it’s crew and it’s leadership. Is it plot armour that every Enterprise had great captains in charge of great crews? Enterprise ships are not invincible because if they were, there would only be a new one built every 50 to 100 years. 🖖 🇺🇦🏁>🇷🇺

They went to some lengths to make her as much of a peer to the Enterprise-D as they could.

@@blacktronpavel The ships were the same class and were commanded by charismatic captains. The crews wore the same uniforms and the same communicator badges. The main bridges looked similar. And that’s about it as far as similarities. DS9 production did not establish, either in dialogue or scenes, that Keogh and his crew were as highly regarded as their Enterprise counterparts. Not in the episode or during the season. The writers and producers should have had the Odyssey and its crew as a constant presence throughout the second season. Not only would it have given them a chance to tell non-Enterprise starship stories, it would have provided an opening for TNG fans to start watching the show. And to get to know Odyssey crew the way we knew people on the Enterprise-D. The loss of Odyssey would have had a greater emotional impact.

Sheer mass, at nearly 5 million metric tonnes. Armour-wise, the _Galaxy_ class, and the others like her (the _Cheyenne_ , _Nebula_ and especially the _New Orleans_ classes) had none whatsoever, as they were planned and built during one of the Federation's most peaceful eras. But what they lacked in armour they made up with powerful shields and sheer mass, at least for the _Galaxy_ and _Nebula_ classes.

Sadly, it was simply careful shooting on the Dominion's part. They were *WAITING* for Sisko to escape...according to plan. The Dominion could have blown the Odyssey apart instantly on contact (since it's shields were rendered essentially non-existent) but they only *chose* to destroy it *AFTER* Sisko had been rescued to send a message.

@@digitalis2977 A strong martial artist who's 200lbs of muscle, is still going to be in serious sh!7 if three 100lb martial artists decide to attack him.

@@apreviousseagle836 Not when your "three martial artists" are 28 pounds each.

Tri-Tanium?😂😂😂

..the Starfleet had nooooo idea about the Dominion.

Non essential personnel were left on DS9

Because Federation also want to show power projection by sending it's most advance starship in service at the time😂

Special effects budget :) I'm kind of confused as to the tactical "advantages" of a saucer separation when it at the very least means losing the saucer's phaser banks. I would think an optimal solution would be to just jettison escape pods during most fights, but those are effects budget-limited as well.

@@otomicans6580it was the 80s - retractable roof stadiums were all the rage, Transformers were unleashed on the world - of course the Enterprise could detach the saucer section. Though I believe in universe, the idea was the entire saucer section becomes the “escape pod” and the warp section is the battle ship - they even have a battle bridge. There’s some logic to it - depending where they are, it could be months or longer before anyone can come help them. There’s a better chance of everyone surviving longer on the saucer vs escape pods. The star drive section can send more to defensive systems, and it’s got less surface area for the shields to protect (maybe that makes them stronger?)

Likely the JH fighter were too maneuverable for an accurate torpedo hit

also torepdos this close would damage the ship

​@@rammigraterammigrate3533 They're not more maneuverable than a bird of prey, so I don't think we could say that.

@@ahhlewis_mapping The Enterprise crew can adjust the yield of their torpedos on the fly by this time, Shouldn't they? Couldn't they open fire before they got so close? Oh well. Not everyone is at the Enterprise level.

@@RyanMarice It isnt specified what yields could damage the ship itself. Even if a low yield torpedo would only damage the shields as well, the odyssey rerouted shield power to phasers and a low yield warhead would not damage the jem'hidare considerably.

When properly led by competent, experienced officers, the Galaxy-class was generally unmatched. The problem was that Odyssey was captained by the biggest fool since General Custer at the Battle of Little Bighorn.

@@thomashong2938not a complete fool. Unlike another captain of another certain Galaxy-class, Keogh was smart enough to off-load all non-essential personnel and civilians off the Odyssey first

@@DantesonofSparda85 What visual proof do we have that he actually offloaded the civilians and nonessential personnel when Odyssey was docked at DS9? And it wasn’t confirmed in dialogue that there had been an evacuation. We are assuming that Keogh acted on Dax’s recommendation to leave the families and nonessential personnel behind on the station.

@@thomashong2938 hubris

@@thomashong2938 I think it's a fair assumption he did offload non-essential personnel. We'd have to check to see if there's been any characters so say anything about them in later episodes.

I believe they left all of the civilians and families back at DS9. However, a Galaxy class starship normally has 1,000 souls on board, plus or minus.

none, all were evacuated to th station before the venture through the wormhole - its mentioned in ops in the episode

You’re kidding, right?

@@tomsmith5584 Of course they did! The issue with some Star Trek fans is that they make crazy assumptions because they base it on what they don’t see or hear, and sometimes what they *do* see. For lovers of a franchise that has technobabble and pseudo-science that became world-changing inspiration for the entire sci-fi genre in the same manner that J.R.R. Tolkien’s Middle Earth inspired the fantasy genre, they really don’t use their imaginations a lot.

The Captain evacuated all the families and nonessential personnel to DS9 before entering the wormhole but yes, countless families seemingly have died in similar incidents.

Keogh was a fool and Dax knew it.

Yes it's the set used for the Enterprise refit,a,b,c, relient, excelcior, D's battle bridge, etc.

@@DrummingWriterTrekfan84 yeah that spare Bridge got a lot of usage it's just they would have liked to have used the TNG sets for the Odyssey but they couldn't because of generations was filming and I read somewhere that Ronald Moore and Brian Braga said for that episode they would have preferred the production sets but given the tight filming schedule it just couldn't happen they couldn't risk overlap

@@TheDogGeneral yeah that makes sense. And even with the little we saw, the odyssey bridge looked really cool!

The TNG Tech Manual said that the bridge was a completely separate module that could be plugged in, so maybe the Odyssey had a differently designed one.

@@blackjac5000 and it's possible I don't refute it or discounted the 4-ft filming model they used for that episode of Deep Space Nine was the 4-footer from the TNG television series it was more filming friendly than the master Studio 6 ft or which they had difficulty shooting the visual exterior of the Odyssey is identical to the Enterprise so on an exterior basis they are identical but why the bridge internal volume is smaller it's never elaborated on but it is visually different but you're correct the Odyssey could have very easily had a different bridge for that was condensed for equipment reasons or some other explanation that I'm sure it had they had time Rick sternbach would have extrapolated I just think it is kind of funny though we had they had the original TNG sets available they would have used that and we wouldn't be asking ourselves all these years why the Odyssey bridge look different obviously they went to Great pains to try to match the sets with the spare Bridge set that they had that was the Battle Bridge and the bridge of the Enterprise a and the Excelsior the Enterprise B so we are left with this visual discrepancy in the canonical source it is after all a television show and sometimes they had errors regardless so we take it with a pinch of salt

There are some TNG tie-in novels about the Enterprise-E during the Dominion War, along with the Excalibur being kept off to the side as a contingency if the Federation lost and they needed someone still out there doing hit-and-run attacks on the occupation.

They actually wanted to get the enterprise instead but the creators of TNG refused so they invented the Odyssey as a galaxy class instead, for that reason, funny thing is though just a few months later generations comes out and they blow up the enterprise anyways 😂

@@adamboyen4727 You know what’s even funnier? LaForge rebuilt the Enterprise-D.

They failed miserably at proving the Enterprise-D would’ve suffered the same fate. Because that ship is not led and crewed by arrogant, complacent fools.

Unless Captain Picard and Lieutenant Commander Data performed The Picard Manuever and fooled the Jem'hadar to attempt to ram the wrong ship.

@@adamboyen4727 The refusal to destroy the hero ship of a different series was reciprocated two years later, when the first draft of ST: First Contact had the Borg destroying the Defiant. DS9 producers went ballistic when they found out, and they compromised on a rewrite where the Defiant survived.

Yes, of course. They are the same class. Sister ships are generally hard to separate externally. Only minor appearance details between them.

@@Locutus The only distinction I can see is the lettering on the primary hull.

@@JacobAllen918 Yes, that's my point. It's not obvious. If you look at the Nimitz Class carriers, they all look identical, but once you know what you're looking for, you can see some minor differences between them. If you don't know what you're looking for, you won't notice them.

That's because they're both Galaxy Class Starships, so they're sister ships. Sister ships are pretty much exactly the same with only minor differences. It's the same as modern day naval ships. The Titanic and the Olympic being two high profile examples.

NCC 1701 no bloody A B C or D

He’s got the Pence hair. Now he’s just got to get a fly to land on his forehead.

@@thomashong2938 yeap

The case here weren't about size. The mistake however, Capt Keogh had diverted all of Odyssey's shield power to weapon. The ship's defenseless. With its shield, the Galaxy class could withstand against the ramming jemhadar fighter. Apparently, the dominion didn't try suicide run anymore against any of Galaxy class during battle of Chin'toka. Going into battle w/ only stardrive section are an incredibly stupid idea. As most of its main phaser arrays were on the saucer. Also by going w/ either saucer or stardrive, they only brought 50% of its shield power & its core computer processing effectiveness. (Just as the manual described, separation mode only mean for emergency evac. of the saucer section. When the destruction's inevitable; not to be deliberately exploided for tactical advantages.) That's why all Galaxy class have their maximum configuration during DW. So your counterargument are the correct one.

@@thunderboltcougar5626 A reason why it wasn't a mistake to give that order,...you seem to be overlooking that he diverted power to weapons BECAUSE the shields were proving to be completely useless versus the new Dominion weapon.

​​@@pauld6967nah, i fully aware, that capt.Keogh diverting all shield's power to boost their weapon's power, since the JemHadar found a way to neutralize their shield. However at one point ,their weapon system were taken offline and they couldn't use their weaponry. Later, they didn't restore power for their shield, despite they already changing tactic & are about to retreat. (While there's no need to switch power back to shield, in the middle of battle when their shield serve nothing; but considering they'r now about to retreat, the best course of action is to put your defensive cap at maximum strenght. Something Capt Keogh had overlooked). This's difficult situation that required them to act precisely in short time to counter the changing of JemHadar's tactic. Nevertheless, those are still **the very same of only "mistake" needed by the JemHadar so they could exploited it to put an end for the Odyssey.

​@@pauld6967but one thing that i pissed the most is that, when Bryan said the jem making a direct run onto the Odyssey, Kira didn't rely the information to Capt Keogh; but calmly trying to intercept it. My point is, if the most powerful phaser of the Federation have at that time couldn't even damage the Jem, then what was she trying to achieve by intercept it with just a runabout's? Officer didn't rely important message often happens in the battlefield, in a very crucial moment, which often resulted in catastrophic disaster.

@@thunderboltcougar5626 Agreed. She made the wrong decision but I guess the writer(s) wanted to show her making an effort to save the Odyssey.

When the Vorta realised it would likely escape they decided it wasn't a strong enough message and had to take it out quickly.

And yet the enterprise D takes a single blast and loses the starboard power coupling (ALWAYS that same power coupling)

The so called 'Galaxy Class' is a TOTAL JOKE! A stick of TNT with a short fuse! Its a huge,ponderous target that is Easily destroyed,like ww2 battleships'invulnerability'? in the age of airpower!

@@iggyarctic5711 A joke? Easily destroyed? Not when competently led, like the Enterprise-D.

@@TheCormTube The Vorta? More like the changelings or the Jem’hadar decided.

He tried that in 'Cause and Effect'. Didn't work on the Bozeman, probably wouldn't work on a Jem Hadar fighter.

I think the shields were down - Captain Keogh diverted all power to weapons after the shields failed to prevent the polaron beams from damaging the Odyssey. If Data was on board he may have quickly raised the shields in the nick of time. I recall in an episode of TNG a shuttle rammed the Enterprise and bounced off it's shields. I'm pretty sure shields were capable of deflecting fast, large solid objects - Asteroids and floating junk would be hazards. Captain Keogh made a fatal mistake...

​@F22ERaptor Did Keogh make a mistake? Perhaps. Dominion beam weaponry was/is Poloron based, and that's always been a weakness for most shield tech in Star Trek. That's why the Klingons developed a Poloron based warhead. If I remember correctly, Dominion torpedo technology also made use of a similar Poloron based warhead comparable to their beam weaponry. It would be fair to say that the torpedoes could have also penetrated the shields. If all the ship had to deal with were beam weapons, then the shields might have stayed up. But with the defensive measures so easily bypassed, diverting that power to weapons wasn't a terrible idea. In the defense of Keogh, he literally had no way of knowing they were going to be rammed until it happened. I imagine him having a "Oh, shit!" moment in his head as he saw what was happening, kind of like Admiral Piet on the bridge of the Executor in Star Wars when the bridge gets rammed by an A-wing. Had the Dominion ship rammed into say, part of the outer saucer section, the ship would have been badly damaged, but probably could have limped home. It hit on the port side, up into the engineering section below and behind the main deflector array. Between all the energy and power in engineering and the section of the array the blew off and into the nacelle, I am not surprised that the ship blew up. To be fair, between Data, LaForge, Riker and Worf, the Enterprise probably would have survived, but it would have been in dock for months getting repaired. In order to sell the Dominion as the new serious threat, they had to drive it home. Could they have done it with a Miranda, Excelsior, Ambassador, New Orleans or any other ship? Yes, but with less effect. Of the four other classes I listed, only The New Orleans is new enough to be on par with the Galaxy, but is smaller, but possibly better armed. The other three are old enough that the argument could have been made that their age was why they were destroyed.

@@F22ERaptor By the time of the suicide run, Odyssey was as good as dead in the water. They didn't have warp drive, phasers, or even communications so it's extremely unlikely they could have diverted power back to shields. Assuming that Worf's request to go to battle readiness wasn't shot down like it usually was. Even if by some miracle they somehow had enough shield generators still working to deflect a ramming attack, that only means the Jem'hadar shoot them with more polaron beams until the shields go back down and then ram the ship to make their point. If anyone made a mistake, it was Starfleet Intelligence for having absolutely no information on the Dominion. They were also at fault for not following up on stories of the Borg. The only thing Keogh or anyone else in Starfleet knew about the Dominion or the Jem'hadar is that the Dominion wanted the people of the Alpha Quadrant to stay on their side of the anomaly. Hence why O'Brien said "we were retreating". Not only did Starfleet not know what lay ahead of them per Q's warning, but they didn't even bother to ask the locals about how things worked in the Gamma Quadrant.

Can't blame them, federation never encountered Phased Polaron beams before, they had to study the stolen fighter before they could redesign their shield system to resist the impact.

This proves how ineffective Starfleet's weapons were to begin against Domion ships. The same applies to defense systems.

Weapon's wise Starfleet was not completely defenseless, the Jem'Hadar fighters just happened to knock out the galaxy class weapons before they had a chance to use them. While the Runabouts did score a few hits, their phasers are undoubtedly weaker than a typical starship, nothing the shields of the fighters can't handle. It was a technological difference, can't be helped. Fortunately, it was a gap the federation quickly closed, albeit at a great cost.

Same way Best of Both Worlds Part 2 did it with TOS by showing a destroyed Constitution-Refit at Wolf-359. Just as the Odyssey was meant to symbolically represent TNG and the Enterprise-D, that destroyed Connie was meant to symbolize that the Borg would have destroyed Kirk's Enterprise too

Still, imagine you are a mother with 2 children and then they have to tell you: "sorry, they killed your husband and the father of your kids"

@@acmenipponair Yes, that is true.

We don’t know from visual evidence that civilians and non-essential personnel were actually dropped off at DS9. No evacuation scenes and no sudden influx of people onto the station.

"sorry, they killed your husband and the father of your kids" I think the second part doesn't need saying.

We will always forget the Odyssey.

A higher death toll if they do the Dominion would of had their scalps as well as the Odyssey

Star Trek did a lot of lone ship actions. Perhaps because of budget.

Evasive maneuvers wouldn't help here. A Galaxy-class ship is far too large and slow to outmaneuver the Dominon's fast and maneuverable Jem Hadar attack ships

​​@@Lightsoul1987 no, she is not. In sacrifice of angels episode, you can see in background the Galaxy class were pretty fast & agile as she turn to port chasing a flight of three jemhadar bugs fighter, destroying one in single burst of her saucer phasers. Its common misconception, that big mean slow. That's not how physic work in space. In contrast, bigger mean you can have more powerful engine or more thruster, which in turn, give you faster and more maneuverable platform. To answer the question, why she just sit there in this episode, its simply because of budget constraint. Edit : but you'r right evasive maneuver probably won't work here, since they able to bypass her shield and she's outnumbered.

She is 300 years old 😮😮

That’s precisely why they blew it up. The writers wanted to show the audience that the Dominion wasn’t fucking around, and the easiest way to do that was to destroy a ship that looked like the Enterprise

Realistically tougher??? How??? Its shields were useless against the Dominion's weapons. It took a pounding from 3 warships, over a 10-15 minute period (at least), destroyed 2 of 3, and the 3rd one did a kamikaze, which was what destroyed Odyssey. If it wasn't for the kamikaze, it would have survived.

@@Locutus That's what I'm saying. It was too easy for them to penetrate the shields from the start. Even against the Borg, the Enterprise's shields held for longer than that.

@@Smeginator Yes, I totally understand why the writers did what they did.

The so-called Galaxy Class is a JOKE!

I had to look that up

He doesn't have flat feet or bone spurs.

There's a lot of kids to sniff on a galaxy class starship

​@@maclennylucas2248 You absolutely killed It!!!😂😂😂

You can understand why it got destroyed and blown up can’t you.

I hope his prized corvette wasn’t on that ship 😧