Joel is the type of guy to add "This was revealed to me in a dream" to his list of sources.

Imagine being a pro athlete and having all these world class trainers that would love to work with you, and then working with Joel Seedman.

Joel Seedman’s workouts are what my mom imagines I do at the gym when she says “don’t hurt yourself”

Zack I’m really hyped you took the time to put out this kind of warning and information despite being in the Lost City of Nokron.

We have to give him the point of the consistency, he really never gives up 😂

To be honest I can't even blame the guy anymore. I worked as a gym employed trainer for a few years and got frustrated that the majority of regular, mostly-sedentary clients weren't interested in science-proven methodologies. Most didn't want to do the same thing everyone else was doing, they wanted that "one weird trick" that they could pretend gave them some kind of advantage because it was a more novel challenge. That's the key phrase: "novelty" which is what a large number of uninformed people prioritize over optimization.

"I'm scared to expose how mediocre I am at standard lifts so I'm going to be the best at the b.s. standards I make up" is a profitable area in the fitness industry

Hitting a guy on the head while he’s doing deadlifts hahahaha wtf I’ll try it if it gives me gains baby

Here I am struggling with imposter syndrome as a trainer and Joel Seedman is out here shamelessly being a charlatan with 100 percent effort..

Showing the dozer comment "Where was the squat?" was a nice touch lol

Dozers comment "where was the squat?" 😂

the elden ring backgrounds are class

Joel Seedmoney has yet to address a study I sent showing that connective tissue will only adapt to stress within 15 degrees of the angle trained. Hope none of clients encounter a low toilet.

I live for the video of Zack crying laughing at Seedman doing RPF drills back in early pandemic 2020 😂

Normal weightlifting sources: soviet studies on hundreds of athletes, Bulgarians, decades of experience Joel Seedman sources: Russian Sleep Experiment

The best part of this video was when it scrolled through Seedman's caption, and the first comment was from Dozer "Where was the squat?" LOL brilliant

I got in a motorcycle wreck a year ago, i landed on my right knee at 60mph. Probably should have had PT, the ligaments felt like rubber bands stretching when i bend the leg. But i had a genius experiment, which was to get in the gym a week and do ATG pause backsquats 2-3x a week for a year. Best thing i ever did.

What bothers me is he says he's a PhD, but his references are poor af and not referenced easily. If I referenced like Seedman when writing a paper, I would be a laughing stock. No difference here, if you're leaning on references this much they should be easily accessible for discussion, rather than "bro trust me theyre referenced"

Seeing Dylan's comment under his video sent me 😂. Love the awareness and knowledge you bring in these videos keep em coming!

Fantastic. I got this clip sent to me by several other coaches who only wanted me to see it so I would be annoyed and angered by what I was seeing. Glad I stumbled onto you channel and keep up the great work.

Love the Eldenring back grounds

The look of frustration on Zack's face, especially his eyes, when he starts loading up a post from Joel is priceless 😂😂 Man's like heeeere we go again

God dammit Joel semen back at it again

Really would love to hear joel attempting to explain somehow logically what smashing a medicine ball against a deadlifters head is supposed to improve. He cant be serious about that.

Joel is the celebrity trainer of the sports world.

I do admit that squats like the one he showing can be useful if implemented in the proper timing of training. But for him to disregard full range squats, and deemed them all as damaging or wrong, is simply negligence on his part. Side note : the only studies I’ve seen that show benefits in squatting like that has to do with people that sprint I have not seen it with any other sport

This guy makes me so angry, like way too angry. I hold him and liverking at the same amount of hatred in my heart.😂

Regarding deep squats causing injuries. StrongerbyScience put together a review of all the studies looking at injuries in gym-adjecent sports. Shoulders and low-back. Not like, a majority was shoulders and low back. Every single goddam study was shoulders and low back. None of them said knees. They had another post called Injuries in Powerlifting that broke things down a little more and knee injuries accounted for 9 out of 116 injuries. Yay data!

Zack taking a break to teach us about the charlatans while having a break from ball busting in Elden Ring. Respect

I find it ironic that Chris Carson got injured and ended his career

I feel like I see this to a minor extent watching TikTok and stuff. I’ll see videos where they’ll say “if you don’t train like an athlete your not training correctly, join me.” When of course their just trying to sell their product. Nothing wrong with the selling something, it’s when you make it the proverbial “secret sauce” and saying this wrong but what I have is right which is wrong.

You're misusing jargon, the word you're looking for is buzzword. Jargon is just technical language that might be difficult to understand. An example of jargon would be say 'RDL' as an acronym that has a specific meaning within strength training profession or community, but would by meaningless to the average person. Buzzwords is usually derogatory, and refers to terminology that claims professional legitimacy by disguising as jargon, while NOT conveying the widely accepted definition.

The deadlift medicine ball bonks killed me lmao

This is great content. Thanks Zach!

Joel Seedman and Knees Over Toes Guy are the unstoppable force and immovable object

I thought you made up the word "informational" right at the end, but hey presto, that be a real word Zack. That was a very edumacational video indeed.

Like Rippetoe says, the recruiters are responsible for the athletic performance of NFL players, not their coaches.

i indeed often have had dreams about clarence chocking me while i squat

Its crazy that the only difference between what he does and what the egolympics guys do is just intention and marketing

Awesome Elden Ring background.

I thought he was a professional Circus Trainer 😂. Kind of similar to those Hollywood Trainers

This video was like listening to an episode of Oh No! Ross and Carrie, a skeptic podcast I enjoy, except with Coach Z and lifting. Choice!

joel is the red hat of the fitness world, no data or facts to back up his beliefs or training method just training in his echo chamber

I appreciate you keeping up the fight against charlatanism.

Ah, Joel Seedman, my favorite comedian

Great vid and interesting argument. So much of what you said is applicable to other parts of life.

Finally, the return of the movement laboratory.

I liked your analysis. There's no shortage of people commenting on Joel but most just laugh at his exercises without really delving into the sales tactics he employs. It reminds me a bit of the kind of anti-crossfit videos a few years back where people would make fun of Crossfit for the exercise selection, not that there's no argument to be made that some WODs are kind of haphazardly thrown together but I remember people making fun of movements like the zercher and kipping while glancing over the flawed philosophy behind it.

Awesome background!

9:46 slowly scrolling down and stopping at dylans comment lmfao i cant

another banger, bravo

You just want to capitalize on his famousness - with his program I was able to get my 90 degree isometric pause jump squat from 40kg to 60 kg in only 3 years..

Cal Dietz, one of the authors of Triphasic Training (eccentric, isometric and concentric) also says that you should do supramaximal lifts with partial range of motion. He has been an Olympic strength and conditioning coach. Are his writing also wrong???

Imagine how much better all these nfl teams would perform if they had someone like Jim Wendell coaching them with basic strength training like he uses for high school athletes.

Another great term for the data avoidance is the unfalsifiable hypothesis. "Every athlete who trains with me has better performance" can be tested. "If you put the effort in, and do exactly what I say, you'll see the results you want" cannot be tested. If you leave yourself wiggle room to blame the athlete, the weather, the economy, or the fucking stars, you can always just refuse to acknowledge any negative outcome as being partly let alone entirely your fault. But good luck stopping him from claiming that every success is entirely because of him.

You broadcasting live from Nokron, the Eternal City?

Back in the day i think Joel preferred the 90 degree squat on the basis that its great to do ATG squats but not many do them correctly. Thus 90 degrees is preferable to most apart from those few who did them perfectly or weightlifters. Later he changed to flat prescribing 90 degree joint angles. Still of he could show tangible ecidence that his methods lead to better performance or lower risk of injuries then full power to him.

Nokstella in the background, pretty dope

ATG squats and knees over toes split squats saved my lifting. I had a lot of patellar and s/I joint issues and these two exercises as well as similar ones made it so I can squat again…fuck this guy. Seen him before and hate what he promotes as well as that functional training guy who shits on squats and deadlifts. As always, love your material Zack!

I have some wrist issues at the moment so I can't really barbell curl and can only inverse curl without issue... to circa 90 degrees.....Seedman curls ftw!

Live And Let Die is a James Bond Movie w/Roger Moore. Probably thinking of the Guns" Roses remake of Paul McCartney/Wings title song.

A lot of what you said also applies to Athlean X

Never has there been a better time in history to be a charlatan.

I clicked on this video because of the Eternal City Nockron background.

Nothing like using an NFL athlete who retired from the NFL because of injury to tote how safe your program is.

Joel Seedman: the guy who write a whole book to name a simple exercice done with poor technique, lots of unecessary toys and almost no ROM.

seederboy shows up in my feed and I lose my shit

Well it's like Zack says, "Live and let die"; moral of the story.

David weck is a person that should be featured in the this serie..

I wonder what Charles Poliquin’s opinion would have been about Seedman

hey youtube just unsubscribed me to you. looking for your videos and it wasnt in my feed. just a heads up

Where there is a product, there is a customer

I can see why the swiss ball chaos collisions would improve neural adaptations 😂

Love your videos. Always appreciate your nuance. You are a good example of someone with whom it's safe to disagree because you demonstrate a love for the discussion. So purely in the spirit of discussion... I would push back on the "ingroup outgroup" criterion you use. I understand your meaning to be, similar to the sacred knowledge criterion, the charlatan uses the allure of being "in the know" and being superior / better than "those people." So I think you're saying there are very EXTREME terms of ingroup / outgroup, or that the ingroup is even morally good while the outgroup is deficient and evil. You don't have time in a 12min video to do linguistics, so I get that, but we realize that we do ingroup / outgroup all the time, with or without realizing it. You did it several times in this video. When you said "in weightlifting" or "in the strength and conditioning world" etc. Every time we use language to define a cross section of the population, we create ingroups and outgroups, intentionally or not - either you fit into the ingroup I just defined when I said "in weightlifting" or you don't. I make this comment based on what I've read about linguistics, but I'm happy to be corrected. Like I said above, of course we all get what you mean, but I don't think it's accurate to say that charlatans use ingroup outgroup language and the rest of us don't. In fact, I just did in that last sentence 😂

Joel Seedman, professional lolcow.

If Joel can acquire a PhD in kinesiology, studying any sports focused science must not be that hard

He’s also just a weird dude who just says “Nice”, “Hold it” and “Stay tight.” I’d be asking to crank the music up after 5 mins of his coaching

Great vid but that background is on point.

bro is spitting truths from the siofra river

Throw rocks, explain unique selling proposition, create fear around current status add in scarcity and you’ve got yourself and easy AF sale

Kyriakos does Seedman's 90 degree squats.

What's great about the Seed-man is that Dr. Mike Israetel is the polar opposite with going on on the team ROM. But to be frank, I follow the Seed man only for the lulz.

What happened to the glassman video?

lol thats the chain every mom bought their son in 6th grade

Just to add, the videos included here were partly of Seedman training Seattle RB Chris Carson, who had to end his career prematurely because of neck injuries. Like stated in the video, impossible to connect Seedman with that outcome, but it sure isn't a great look in my book.

Isn't the original fitness charlatan Mike Chang?

This dude uses Nokron, the eternal city, as his background. Im down.

Legend

That guy looks like if Asmongold was a real person.

The problem I see is that nowadays even people with legitimate knowledge are starting to push this type of bull because it sells so well, s lot of people want to feel special and unique, they want the “secret training methods”, regardless if they are proven or not, and it’s just so unethical to push this type of training just because it fills your pockets.

Nice elden ring background

What would Clearance Kennadee say about Joe Semen?

Sounds like all these terms can be applied to crossfit too tbh

He has succeeded in creating a character on social media, that is all

"Unless you compete in olympic weightlifting or powerlifting, there's no reason to do loaded squats deeper than 90 degrees" or unless you want to be a functional human being in your everyday life. Also I'm a bit puzzled by the claim that 90 degree squats are much better in high force conditions, isn't that where there's the biggest shearing force in the knees, making it the most troublesome for the joint? I've actually never seen a person say "I'm happy that I don't have mobility, I have benefited so much in my life from having just certain part of my natural range of motion under control when under load". Of course for high level specialized athletes it can be very true, like runners generally don't need high mobility and ass to grass when they're doing their power work, it's not specific training for their sport. But "flared toes requiring lifter to reach excessive depth to have any semblance of muscle activation" isn't it shown that flared toes provide much better stability for more force production and prevent rolling the ankle? Or does he mean flared feet? And to think that you need excessive depth to have any muscle activation? I don't think that's been shown or claimed anywhere ever. I'm also not sure if he's trying to show that the 90 degree squats are the best for power, strength or hypertrophy? It kinda sounds like the muscle activation would imply hypertrophy, and he's captioned the clip with "monster mass program". Like how does his position fit with the recent studies of Milo Wolf and Dr. Pac where they confirmed that like with a couple of other studies, the most hypertrophic position is the lengthened one under load, which with quads would be? At the bottom of the squat in my understanding. They did find that partials (in lengthened position) probably work even better than full ROM, but Seedman is pushing the inarguably least effective range: shortened position. Even before that study it looked like full ROM would be the more hypertrophic range, I don't think there's ever been evidence that shortened range is more effective than any other range. Another thing is that I'm pretty sure the literature is heavily on the side of using the biggest range of motion in exercises that is pain-free when rehabilitating an injury, and trying to push for more range as you progress (under the natural limits of your body). I actually thought Joel Seedman admitted to the weirdo movements being just very specific special tools that are very rarely if ever used on his clients, when he was on a podcast debating with Dr. Mike Israetel. This looks like outright bullshitting against generally acknowledged facts to market his services.

Seedman is a genius, you wouldn't even know!!! 🤣 sarcasm

it is funny that Zack Telander is less radical version of Joel Seedman he he

Honestly who doesn’t like a Clown 🤡

Personally i like squatting as deep as possible for me rather than specific degrees (latley been doing smith machine which takes care of saftey considerations)

This guy is like the evil version of Squat University