GreyJedi91 Hey, I think I speak for quite a few people when I say I have absolutely no problems what so ever with two versus videos coming out close to one another! Two videos from my favourite versus series creators is simply fantastic.

+Luke Murtagh Agreed.

GreyJedi91 Great video, really enjoyed this. I know it's highly speculative so you probably left it out, but I believe in DoE Cognus says she sees multiple futures between the fight for Zannah and Bane. I know she lists different times and planets, and still says the ending is basically 50/50 across the board. Do you think this might imply more offensive sorcery than what we saw, or the fact Zannah may be able to use dark side tendrils more skillfully than some seem to believe(not you personally, but I've seen quite a few videos that seem to imply she could only use them on a heavily steeped dark side planet) Either way thanks for great video, looking forward to the Council Forcecast Tales of the Jedi discussion.

I saw Cognus' statement as more of a commentary on the fact that the two were so evenly matched that even her precognitive skills couldn't narrow down the most likely outcome. As far as Zannah's sorcery goes...I am of the opinion that she operates at her peak when she's able to draw on external dark side energies. She was shown to have developed her mental abilities to the point that she required very little in the way of prep time to unleash. She also transcended the need to perform complex hand gestures to unleash those spells like she had to in her earlier stages of development. So she definitely has the capacity to improve upon or grow stronger with certain aspects of Sith Sorcery. Having said that, I do think that the more extreme uses of Sorcery she has been credited with (as well as many of the most prominent examples of Sorcery throughout the SW timeline in general) are either reliant on or strongly facilitated by external aid whether in the form of an environment steeped in the dark side (whether in the natural world like the cave on Dagobah, or manufactured by Dark Siders like the Star Forge) , or an artifact imbued with such energies such as the Muur Talisman, Exar Kun's amulet just to name a couple examples.

GreyJedi91 you and Jensaarai1 uploading within 2 days has made my week :D

+Kristopher Creecy I wanted Mace Windu vs Oppo Rancisis. Far better matchup. But your comment is gold.

Well, at $0.00 the budget backing my video is FAR higher than that movie's would have been :)

I could see it as a book more like it

Why would it have been a "far better matchup?"

I had the same question actually...

That's what kind of motivated me to talk about Oppo in the first place. I view Mundi and Fisto in a similar light. I thought Oppo's win was a little undeserved even though I think he's good competition for them. So my whole reason for using him was to offer a different perspective from Evan's. As time went on I found Zannah to be a more interesting opponent for him though. So here we are :)

Kasim curbstomps

@@thordgensec What about Kas’im vs Kao Cen Darach or Sora Bulq? Both were esteemed lightsaber instructors like the Sith Blademaster, and I think both are capable of posing a challenge for Kas’im based on the opponents they were shown dealing with - Darth Vindican & Darth Malgus for Darach, and Mace Windu & Quinlan Vos.

I agree with that. As I tried to make clear. My point is not that Oppo's endurance sucks. It's that Zannah's endurance > Oppo's endurance.

Thank you :)

Thanks! I hope it won't disappoint :)

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed. Got a lot more planned

It is my intention to do more of those when I can. Thanks for the high praise! For the record I think your channel is a superior one as well. I haven't much use for the more popular and mainstream info channels. You've got some style and a pleasant presentation and visual aesthetic to your content. Very good stuff. Keep it up!

Sweet, I'll be looking forward to them. Haha thank you! Funny enough, before I started KZfaq, you, Evannova, and Jensaarai were the only Star Wars KZfaqrs I knew, so I thought everyone made these super atmospheric, artsy, 3-month-project videos. So, thank *you* for inspiring me to use the style I do today! Coincidentally, I am also working on a Bane video as we speak. But as I said before, I'll be looking forward to whatever you release next!

so have you checked out Antoine's channel yet?

who wants to fuck with the sith lady? she looks pretty nice if you erase the tattoos

yeah me too. we discussed this a bit in Rob's comment

that actuallly wouldn't factor in as Zannah is a defensive fighter and doesn't attack people on high grounds so if Kenobi does get the high ground and says 'I got the high ground' Zannah would A: stare at Kenobi while Kenobi waits for Zannah to jump, stalemate B: Zannah uses the chance to use her force abilities (likely ineffective but prompting Kenobi to attack)

:l

Nah zannah will get slapped. Even though kenobi has a very dark past, he always learned to overcome and not let it consume him. On top of that he’s the better duelist so it’s a stomp

Yeah...it's one of the more amazing things about him really...I was surprised when I realized just how old he was relative to the standard of his species.

Glad to hear it!

As noted in the description and the comments...it IS a coincidence...I had no idea he was uploading a video around the same time...let alone one that featured Zannah's master!

Rob George Lol. Remember what I said yesterday about how surprising these are?

+GreyJedi91 I'm sorry. I'm aware that this is a coincidence. I really wanted to do that joke.

+Lenny Slayer of Goldfish Overlord of Trail-Mix Holy shit your right. Just got a dozen of Krispy Kreme Doughnuts btw for 80 cents.

Rob George Oh...I'm assuming that's decent. I have no idea what they are but it's pretty self explanatory. They're a U.S thing right?

Tanner Lowrie I would agree (as I mentioned in the video) that Oppo was already exhausted largely because of straining himself through continuous use of battle meditation at the time he fought the Anzati. But but because of the fact that he's so old and Zannah's entire style is meant to conserve energy, I think the same thing would happen to him regardless of whether he'd been using battle meditation or not. Even when he's fresh, there's just no way his stamina stacks up to hers in the long run. That's my contention.

No, he didn’t. She is NOT underrated at all.

I prefer not to say the word but to write or type it

*I really enjoyed the video this may be one of the best match ups someone has come up with a for a while given how well it highlighted Zannah's capabilities. You also made a really great point about why Bulq distracted Rancisis first and you've changed my mind on that.* Thanks! *I mostly agree with what you said about Zannahs sorcery, unfortunately for her she hasn't broken anyone of note with her sorcery so we can't really assume it would have a major effect on powerful force user unless they had some mental issues like Ventress. Though I do feel it is worth noting she did manage to stop bane momentarily with her mental attacks. Considering Pod bane effortlessly stopped Kaan's mental attacks(who was mentally persuading the brotherhood to do his bidding for years) it's safe to say anyone with some inner fears or other weaknesses they don't have complete control over is screwed if she uses her sorcery on them. Though her sorcery alone may not kill them it should stun them long enough for her to cut them down with a saber or kill with some other force ability. Its just most powerful force users don't have some crippling mental weakness she could exploit.* I do think her abilities make her viable against most people...even most Jedi Knights. And certainly her mental powers eclipse Kaan's...at least on the level of how they apply to personal combat. He had skill with mass manipulation and battle mediation where she displayed no such prowess. But certainly I agree...her powers make her very viable. And while they weren't anywhere near enough to bring Bane down they did stop him in his tracks. But the thing is, Bane's a Sith. He draws power through passion, hate, rage, anger, jealousy, resentment etc. Her illusions can prey on visions of the past influenced by these emotions. I see Jedi Masters with strong Telepathic abilities of their own (Oppo Rancisis being a strong example) as being more viable than even Bane would be given their own focus on such Force abilities as well as their mental discipline. *Though one minor nitpick is i don't think using Zannahs performance on Tython is fair considering she was nowhere near here prime at that point unless it is to show she is way more capable in her prime than she was then, just compare how she fared against a far weaker Bane in RoT compared to prime bane in DOE. It's like using ESB Lukes capabilities and limitations in a RotJ Luke match up* I agree and disagree. I don't think it make sense to disregard he performance entirely on Tython. Bu of course you're right, it makes no sense to judge her solely on that. Still since she's only had about...4 or 5 serious fights (3 of which were brief and not really fair contests) we don't have much to draw from. And she allowed herself to be boxed on during that fight as well as in her fights with Bane. So it points to a pattern even though it's clear she progressed from RoT to DoE.

"I do think her abilities make her viable against most people...even most Jedi Knights. And certainly her mental powers eclipse Kaan's...at least on the level of how they apply to personal combat. He had skill with mass manipulation and battle mediation where she displayed no such prowess. But certainly I agree...her powers make her very viable. And while they weren't anywhere near enough to bring Bane down they did stop him in his tracks. But the thing is, Bane's a Sith. He draws power through passion, hate, rage, anger, jealousy, resentment etc. Her illusions can prey on visions of the past influenced by these emotions. I see Jedi Masters with strong Telepathic abilities of their own (Oppo Rancisis being a strong example) as being more viable than even Bane would be given their own focus on such Force abilities as well as their mental discipline." I see your point but most Jedi don't lack any fear, hatred ect they simply suppress it and don't allow it to control them. The final story arc of clone wars showed even Yoda had some fears like what would happen to the Jedi order if they lost the war. I Legends and canon Obi Wan had romantic feelings for someone and hes generally considered the perfect example of what a Jedi should be. The sith feed of that fear but most don't allow it to control them. Sure some like Savage Oppress of Sora Bulq generally just acted on their emotions more than they should most fed off their hate, anger ect but didn't allow it to control them. Bane despite having complete control over his emotions , a massive amount of willpower and strength in the force was still momentarily stunned by her sorcery. In that same story arc Yoda admits nobody is immune to the lure of the dark side and most of the council agreed. That shows they all have vulnerabilities. The difference is many Jedi fear those weaknesses or like Ki Adi Mundi refuse to admit they exist making them all the more vulnerable when Zannah at the very least brings out some of those weaknesses or vulnerabilities. Of cause it varies from each jedi or sith but i don't believe most Jedi masters would be close to as capable of resisting Zannahs mental attacks as Bane was. "I agree and disagree. I don't think it make sense to disregard he performance entirely on Tython. Bu of course you're right, it makes no sense to judge her solely on that. Still since she's only had about...4 or 5 serious fights (3 of which were brief and not really fair contests) we don't have much to draw from. And she allowed herself to be boxed on during that fight as well as in her fights with Bane. So it points to a pattern even though it's clear she progressed from RoT to DoE." Yeah i understand why you used it, i just think it would have been worth mentioning around 33:50 that though she would have likely lost against Zarro Xaj that would not be the case has she been in her prime. Without saying that it could been seen like you are implying Zarro > DOE Zannah . Which though i know isnt the case some who aren't as familiar with you or the source matter could wrongfully assume. Though as i said it was just a minor nitpick.

*I see your point but most Jedi don't lack any fear, hatred ect they simply suppress it and don't allow it to control them. The final story arc of clone wars showed even Yoda had some fears like what would happen to the Jedi order if they lost the war. I Legends and canon Obi Wan had romantic feelings for someone and hes generally considered the perfect example of what a Jedi should be. The sith feed of that fear but most don't allow it to control them. Sure some like Savage Oppress of Sora Bulq generally just acted on their emotions more than they should most fed off their hate, anger ect but didn't allow it to control them. Bane despite having complete control over his emotions , a massive amount of willpower and strength in the force was still momentarily stunned by her sorcery. In that same story arc Yoda admits nobody is immune to the lure of the dark side and most of the council agreed. That shows they all have vulnerabilities. The difference is many Jedi fear those weaknesses or like Ki Adi Mundi refuse to admit they exist making them all the more vulnerable when Zannah at the very least brings out some of those weaknesses or vulnerabilities. Of cause it varies from each jedi or sith but i don't believe most Jedi masters would be close to as capable of resisting Zannahs mental attacks as Bane was.* I don't think most Jedi Masters would be either. I do think Oppo is one of the relatively few who could/likely would be. *Yeah i understand why you used it, i just think it would have been worth mentioning around **33:50** that though she would have likely lost against Zarro Xaj that would not be the case has she been in her prime. Without saying that it could been seen like you are implying Zarro > DOE Zannah . Which though i know isnt the case some who aren't as familiar with you or the source matter could wrongfully assume. Though as i said it was just a minor nitpick.* Point taken. Even if I still think some of her mistakes during that fight carried over to her DoE incarnation, I see your meaning that others could wrongly assume/infer something I didn't mean to convey. I did give her credit for what she accomplished during that fight...but I suppose I could have been more clear.

Oppo has no willpower feats close to bane, he's also nowhere near as powerful with the force. The only way with regards to mental resistance that they are is with the fact both have control of their inner fears ect On top of that bane knows far more about sith sorcery and had been preparing for it for a while unlike Oppo

banethesithari He is more directly concerned with mental influence than Bane. his greatest strength in the force make me think he'd be able to compensate for what Zannah brings to the table. Even Mace knew magic was only an illusion. as did Yoda. the jedi of the clone wars may have lacked experience against the Sith. they did not entirely lack knowkedge of what they were capable of. Bane may have known exactly what Zannah would do. I believe his years of training with the Force and the access to the temples collection of forbidden Sith holocrons granted to high ranking jedi masters made it perfectly possible that Oppo was familiar with sorcery. I just don't buy into the idea that a Jedi consular of his stature would be helpless against illusions. He deals in mental influence himself. and while Bane may possess greater willpower I'm of the opinion more was required on his part. He had greater demons to face as it was and as a Sith he thrived on emotions and passions. as a Jedi master (a conservative one at that) Oppo would have had those better in check from the beginning. and months of continuous battle meditation is a solid willpower feat by my estimation. I think it balances out. I do believe he could eventually recognize and dispel the visions. you'll notice I never said he could easily though.

As one of the Council Forcecast members...I agree with you.

Yeah I'm not that interested in the more main stream match ups. I like to feature more obscure or less extremely powerful characters because I think it makes for more interesting engagement. Thanks or watching :)

You do a good job at it, it was a pleasure to watch. :)

+Ki Adi Sandwich I want to say Oppo due to his biology and unique force abilities.Mundi is probably the superior duelist though.

*However, I do feel that it should be noted that during her duel on Tython, she was still yet to undergo a further 10 years of training, so she wasn't at her absolute apex at the time* This is absolutely true. I agree with that. But because of the amount of controversy other match ups featuring Zannah have stirred up I have seen a LOT of people claim in comments that her skills were good enough to kill 3 of the 5 Jedi on Tython and that's why most of my commentary on her performance there was a detraction. The matter was much more complex than Zannah just being good enough with a lightsaber to kill that many Jedi. But you're right. Rule of Two is by no means her observable peak. *Just out of interest, if you had done Ki-Adi Mundi Vs Oppo, who you you have declared the victor?* Mundi actually. And I'm not just saying that to you because of your channel name ;)

GreyJedi91 Ah, I see. I'm satisfied that somebody is giving Mundi the respect that he deserves. He is, after all, one of the greatest Jedi of his time. In fact, do you agree with Evan's verdict for Kit Fisto Vs. Oppo?

I did not agree with his verdict on Kit Fisto vs Oppo Rancisis. I think it would be a close fight, but I thought Fisto deserved the win.

GreyJedi91 interesting...I agree.

One of my friends and I are putting together plans for another match up featuring Bulq in the near future. Feel free to contribute any info you'd like...much appreciated :)

:)

Isaiah Torres I probably wouldn't do that particular team match but I'll promise to use all of those characters when I can.

I think it's pretty clearly in her favor of course. But yeah...I don't have much time for the argument that she could beat anyone on the council by clicking her fingers and driving them crazy.

Don't ask even if he put hoth above bane obi wan wont stand a chance

Zannah’s spells only work on the mentally ill and unstable lunatics with crippling depression. They wouldn’t work against a textbook Jedi who could see the spells clear and through

The match up between Darach and Kas'im is a close one to call. Because one of them is a Jedi battle Master and the other is a Sith Weapons Master. Both have shown that they are quite formidable as duelists with Darach having fought off two fully realized Sith lords in Darth malgus and Lord Vindican and Kas'im not only teaching multiple Sith trainee's at the Sith academy but also nearly besting Darth Bane in a lightsaber duel. However this is partially do to the fact that Bane had little to no experience when going up against Duel Blade Fencing. And this is a tactic that wouldn't work against Darach because in his fight against Vindican and Malgus he himself used Duel Blade fencing quite effectively. For force abilities I'd say that they are on par with each other as neither of them has shown any force abilities above the standard. The big turning point in this fight for me would be in their physicality. And this is where the fight tips into the favor of Darach as his race that Zabrak's are noted for their physical hardiness/durability while Kas'im's species the Twi'leks have no such physical advantages. Basically while it would definitely be a close fight, Darach would get the win. And as for Darach or Kas'im vs Maul, I'd say that Maul would be able to defeat Kas'im but it would be difficult as all hell for him to overcome Darach. Though that fight would be a physical war in my opinion.

Generally that's what happens. But it's entirely questionable how far she would have progressed given the lack of any details on this. And given that Zannah believed she would never match Bane's own martial prowess, I'm disinclined to think that would have been a major element of her training regimen even after she became the master. Her strength in the Force likely grew...but how this would have expressed itself is entirely unknown and I, like you or anyone else couldn't do anything more than speculate I'm afraid. I will say that her apprentice Cognus was already capable of fighting on the same level as Set Harth whom Zannah recognized as a highly capable fighter...and Set had formal training whereas Cognus did not. Personally I would expect Cognus to be much much more aggressive than Zannah as a duelist and her signature ability was similar to the power Force Suppression as it's expressed in various gaming materials. This may have made her into the perfect weapon to be used against Zannah as she may have developed her powers to the point that she could disrupt Zannah's ability to call upon her sorcery. Zannah's strength being more with the Force than with the blade, I do think Cognus would have likely seized the mantle of Dark Lord from Zannah more quickly than Zannah did from Bane. That's about as far as my speculation bout Zannah's life after Bane really goes.

Everything you say makes sense. And i hadn't really thought that much on cognus, but yeah i could see her strengths working very well to more quickly take the title of master. But who knows. I think you guys talked about this in a council forcecast but, i would be so interested to see an anthology with the rule of two sith. And i'd be interested to see a story about how cognus became master. But i guess that ship has sailed. Thanks for the reply :)

yup

I kind of did that already. Darth Bane and Darth Zannah vs. Obi-wan Kenobi and Mace Windu. Bad quality video and audio compared to my recent projects but whatever. It was the first vs video to feature Bane, Zannah, or WIndu on this site. And while the production value is poor I still stand by my points in that project. It being a team match with 4 characters it's about an hour long though. Just to warn you.

GreyJedi91 I'll check it out, really enjoy your videos, I've read a lot of the novels but I like to here other points of view. Keep up the good work, you can tell that you do your research and you enjoy what you do! Thanks for the reply

I'm not that much of a Lord Hoth fan...try Connor or Evan. One of them might give that one a go.

I agree. To me I view them as a circumstantially viable power. Not one she can apply at the drop of a hat. But if she could, and Rancisis failed to dodge them, I do agree.

i could see if Zannah used Niman(if say another novel was made or hypothetically), she could develop a quicker ability of using sorcery. if she could pull what happened in RoT(Cyndra) for even a second, many fights she would be in could end quickly.

It's actually called "Beautiful" by Future World Music

Awesome thanks.

Ummm...so what other topics? Because your suggestions are all versus match-ups

You could do book reviews of SW books.Just a thought.

+GreyJedi91 You could do Star Wars Legends theories, continue your character profiles, philosophy profiles between Jedi, Sith, and the Potentium, you could do a psychology profile series of characters and what mental problems they may or may not, or cover the other forms of combat in the Star Wars Universe like Teras Kasi, Echani Martial Arts, Tae-Jitsu, Sokan, Dun Moch, or Trakata.

Rob It's spelled Malacia seeing as you think Zannah's style is effective against offensive light-medium weights with poor stamina, do you think Zannah could defeat Old Ben Kenobi?

+Joshua Kei Thank you for the typo. Zannah probably could beat old ben due to a war of attrition. Both cant really do much to each other (her spells are pretty useless against Ben and she doesn't bust out the tk offensively that often despite her immense destructive potential). This impasse applies to dueling because we get the form 3 vs form 3 matchup. But her superior stamina should let her win via war of attrition. I actually see Zannah' style also being effective against over-zealous offensive heavy weights as well in a similar way to Kenobi. TCW Maul (in dueling at least, she probably would crumble against his Teras Kasi though), ROTS Anakin, Sora Bulq, etc. come to mind as opponents Zannah is well optimized for going up against. But if I put her up against Greivous...she is basically fucked.

yeah not sure about ROTS Anakin though. But I totally agree. so what do you think about Jensaarai's Zannah vs vids? (I personally disagree) it would be pretty interesting to see Zannah vs Old Ben though. both combatants staring at each other and assuming defensive postures until someone (probably Old Ben since he attacked Vader first) attacks

+Joshua Kei If she could take Bane's offensive, ROTS Anakin is not outside of her reach to stone wall. Sith sorcery would also tear apart Anakin's mind. I feel like Old Ben vs Zannah would just ignite their lightsabers, and stare at each other until someone makes a move. Old Ben probably does, Zannah defends, Ben retreats, and we are back to square one. I gave my thoughts on Jensarrai's Zannah vids.

ok thx. I can't seem to formulate an unbiased opinion on Zannah vs Anakin since it's Anakin but I can't argue otherwise as when I look at it Zannah does seem to have the necessary tools to take down Ani, so I'll just wait until later to make a decision. I can't find your comment in Darth Zannah vs Tholme I think Zannah would use her spells if Ben doesn't do anything, and that would prompt Ben to do something. I guess an important deciding factor in this is if standing makes people tired and depletes Ben's stamina or not. If the situation on top does happen then it depends on who falls to dehydration/fatigue (people need to sleep, you know) first

I have a Malak video in the works. Sorry, it's not one of those ones though. It's one I just like on a thematic level.

Thats awesome. Malak is one of my favourite sith, and he doesnt get enough credit IMO

I'm confused by your question. I'm not sure what you're referring to when you're talking about less overt Sith magic giving one an advantage. Could you please give a specific example so I understand what you're talking about? More than that I'm not sure what the functionality behind Sorcery and Malacia have to do with one another. My main point was I think Malacia is a useful power...but in my view it's most reliable against rank-and-file mundane opponents. In Oppo Rancisis vs. Kit Fisto, Evan pretty much gave Oppo the edge on the basis of Malacia since he felt that Kit Fisto would have "no possible means" of defending against it. But all the power does is influence a target's equilibrium and internal functions. I would expect most trained Force users of this level to be capable of staving off the effects by drawing upon the Force themselves. It might require some mental/physical exertion on their part...but that's about it as far as I would expect.

Andrew Stokes Go away, nobody cares. *grumpy face.*

You clearly did enough to reply to me

Lol yoda. He taught oppo. Did you not watch the video?

I will. Just not against Oppo.

I look forward to that.

First, thanks for the kind words. I dont really understand where the disagreements lie though. I actually DID give her credit for the fact she was fighting someone who had a battlemeditation amp bolstering him. That was an overall good showing. My issue is when people say she killed 3 jedi on tython without explaining how in context. She didn't defeat them in dueling, which a lot of fans like to misrepresent. As for the point concerning her prior knowledge of the spell versus the impact of the nexus...with respect, even if you're entirely correct (and to be honest I don't really agree with your case) I still don't see what the problem is with regard to analysis of the fight itself. The most relevant point is whether or not she can bring the same devastation to the battlefield as she did on Ambria. I personally doubt this as I've explained. And just as an example, Bane knew many spells and sith rituals but most were beyond his ability. Knowledge of a technique isn't the same as true ability. If she doesn't require a nexus to use the power on a lower level, and the power is normally massively weaker...then that still diminishes the effect of what was seen doesn't it? At the end the day, I don't really see the difference your distinction would make to her general performance level. As for Oppo's battle meditation being underplayed...may I ask how I underplayed it? I explained very clearly why I think he's slightly overrated by others, but I never said he wasn't a great master. Also its not a combative ability that can be relied on in a one on one fight. He can't enter a battle meditation in the middle of a melee with a Sith Master.

He was only in his mid-40s. Not that old. And he wasnt weakened in the prison. Not permanently at any rate.

I do question their decision to "drop bricks" on her if only because I think matches where that's the ostensible goal left a bad taste in the mouths of a lot of her fans. It's possible to come off as biased and/or petty when that's your operating style. At least if you're not careful about how you state your case. And I don't think they always have been. By the same token, I went into this match to say that I felt Oppo was pretty overrated and Zannah underrated. I went in with a point to make. I had an agenda. But I also tried to paint both in their best light even if I had criticisms to make about them. I will say very honestly that I don't think Connor and Evan in particular always succeed in that regard...and certainly not only when it comes to Zannah.

In progress. I mention technical difficulties in my pinned comment where I explain why I released this match ahead of schedule. Technical difficulties concern the Sharad Hett match as well as a few others. Still forthcoming. I assure you

Paulie Tonro the same reason nobody talks about Yoda in his physical prime. It's an unobserved version of the character and is therefore mysterious. He would have been more physically robust...but we have no way of knowing what his levels of skill with the lightsaber or Force abilities would have been during that part of his life.

im 100% on your side im all over the comment section defending her. here is the of people she was pitted against- shaak ti vs zannah. i had her beating shaak ti (jen 1 says the opposite) - zannah vs master jin. master jin looses.( jen says the opposite) zannah vs tholme. zannah destroys him ( jen 1 says otherwise) vodoo siask bask vs zannah. zannah wins bass lacks stamina and is to slow for her and he has no lightsaber ( jen1 says the opposite) even in the team battles and fatal thrée ways i her have unbeaten. general greivous vs darth zannah.. zannah wins ( evan nova and grey jedi had the right outcome) zannah vs oppo rancis. zannah wins ( grey jedi has the right outcome.) zannah vs darth bane zannah wins

@@lukegreensaber7362 I was emailing Drew Karpyshyn and I asked him plainly "can Zannah use her dark side tendril spell with out the dark side nexus like on Ambria" and he stated yes. That means Zannah can whip out a OHKO spell on top of her others that can catch people as fast as Bane.

@@josephmoore5422 than at this point in time she is basically unbeatable with the exception of a few people that beat her a very few like a handful

she is also stronger than darth bane in the force and i laugh my balls of with tholme winning

jensaara1 has a general dislike for her in every video. and plays her ( yes u do jen yes u do) Greyjedi and evan nova are the only ones her truly evaluate her.

Point 1: *it is reasonable to assume he could hold down a fight for several minutes at least without tiring significantly* Who said he was incapable of doing this? I certainly did not. What my cumulative points build up to is that he's very old and the cap on his stamina is undoubtedly lower than Zannah's given the combined facts that she is MUCH younger and her entire fighting style is built around conserving her energy. I don't think Oppo's a tired usesless old codger. But compared to Zannah? His stamina is DEFINITELY inferior. *One of the things Greyjedi handwaves during his analysis is Oppo being tired by MONTHS of nonstop Battle Meditation prior to being put into a fight, and even then stomping a group of Anzati Master Assassins which he rather absurdly calls "foot soldiers" later on* Never called them foot soldiers... How did I hand-wave the impact of his Battle Meditation? Its acknowledged more than once in the video that he did this. But it took everything he had and I wouldn't call it a stomp. He was visibly exhausted and had sustained several cuts...a respectable feat to be sure...doesn't change my assessment of his limitations. *This did put him on his last "legs", but he was already exhausted prior to the engagement, meaning to draw a conclusion on Oppo's stamina from this fight is removing the fight from its context, a form of the fallacy known as cherrypicking* Do you really think he's a match for the likes of Bane and Zannah? Beyond an early fight scenario I just can't see that being the case. Now are you claiming that the only reason he was tired was because of Battle Meditation? Eh, maybe you're correct but I have my reservations about this. But I don't think it matters much because he's still very old and Force-Augmentation can only take you so far for so long. You even acknowledged that this was the case for Yoda himself... Zannah being just as capable of augmenting herself will still have the stamina advantage. You will notice that I gave Oppo the physical edge because of his combined traits. But his old age limits the duration that this advantage will apply during the fight. You haven't said anything to challenge this claim and so I'm not exactly sure what the point of contention here is at all. Point 2: *The third is his Jedi training, which would make his lower arms stronger due to them being worked out more* Stronger than your average Thisspiassian upper class citizen yes. But that's all that can be said with certainty. Plus he's old and certainly has grown somewhat infirm over the years. As you have conceded he was nearly double the age of a venerable one of his kind. Plus he's working at a deficit anyway. It's a species-wide trait and only those of generations accustomed to working with their hands are born without this. He's a member of royalty and thus would have been descended from a line that suffers from the limitation. Augmentation can only take you so far and it would be of...questionable use and specious value during a lightsaber duel for him to spend his Force energies on such a thing. Especially as Zannah's style is so defensive. My main reason for bringing the limitation up in the first place is because of how drastically Evan thought it would apply during combat with other Force wielders as he stated in his Fisto video...I disagree with this notion of his. 3: *This assertion is potentially true, but is heavily lacking in terms of evidence* And Evan's assertion that powerful Jedi Masters such as Kit Fisto would have “no possible way of defending against” this power has heaps of evidence to back it up? I think not. *Here, however, what he says is contrary to the evidence provided, and the fact that he went into a tangent about Evannova instead of providing any is telling* What evidence? And how is it anymore a tangent than your very response to my own video? I took issue with what he said and stated why...not sure what you're calling me out for. Point 4: you made a much bigger deal of this than I did. All I said was I didn't consider Ataru as major an element of his training as Shii-cho and Niman likely did. I went as far as to say that he no doubt had a great amount of exposure to Ataru through Yoda/Yaddle...I stand firm on Ataru being the most minor element of his training...though of course none of this is established. The very idea that he practiced Ataru, Niman, and Shii-cho is ALL based on conjecture and I helped Evan come to that conclusion. After taking his physique into account, a full and unrestricted practice of Ataru is actually unfeasible for him. He could use a retooled variant or simply the fundamentals, but he wouldn't have mastered it in the traditional fashion. Point 5: Mace and Bulq both sensed the events of Asajj's duel with the remaining Jedi on Ruul while they were in the middle of a fight. I see no reason why a consummate telepath like Oppo couldn't have summoned help during a lull in combat. And again, it would have left Sora outnumbered 6-7 to one. In any case, I'm not saying Oppo couldn't challenge Bulq. I said he could give him a run for his money in the video. But I have no doubt that Bulq was a superior martial artist in the long-run. Point 6: *Where are the tactics? Possibly the most egregious mistake Greyjedi made in his analysis of Oppo Rancisis is his not analyzing the tactical mind of Oppo Rancisis* Egregious is it? Then why don't you tell me how exactly you'd envision the tactics being implemented. There is a huge difference between being a master swordsman and a tactician or strategist in charge of the war-effort. That much should be obvious. Exar Kun's saber staff and Mace Windu's fighting form are both directly applicable in a lightsaber duel and have a huge influence on the way they fight. Oppo's renown is not as a field-agent or front-lines commander. It's as a strategist who devised complex defense/attack strategies. If you can come up with a reason/example of something he's done that you think applies to a lightsaber fight then I invite you to name them now. For the moment, I don't see how they'd apply. You accused me of hand-waving a number of things that I think I acknowledged for all that they were worth. I comfortably admit to hand-waving the tactics (even though I acknowledged that aspect of his character several times) during the verdict segment because I see no reason why that would factor into a victory in a contest like this one.