hi Antoine!

No. He isn’t. He ISN’T even a niman specialist.

@@dazdavis7896 I never said he was. But, yes, he is as a character the embodiment of Niman. THe middling form.

IMO, Plo Koon was quite exceptional. I like Vindican very much, but he’s not good enough.

@@adamdonahue2079 I believe you to be correct

Yikes that’s a hot take

@@thepriorstone4064 I think he's referring to when Connor (Jensaarai1) called Plo Koon, "a diet can of Darth Vader" in regards to lightsaber technique.

I only trust jen and the other experts to do it. Anybody else who attempts these is biased, don't know much of the characters, or is completely inept.

@@lapplandkun9273 lmao. Are you serious. He’s not biased? Or inept? He cries about anything regarding TCW, literally cries about it. It’s embarrassing. He’s a hypocrite. He makes a big deal about things that are literally negligible. Every single one of these versus series fanboys, are blatant NJO fanboys that use their own headcanons above actual confirmed sources & content.

@@dazdavis7896 loser,

Until this video I didn't know Luminara used Makashi and shien. I alway saw her as a Form 3 soresu specialist. Through Vindican (though not officially confirmed) gave me an idea of what shien with the Saber staff looks like.

@@baki484 The more you know, yes. Another case similar to Vindican is Kazdan Paratus, who uses saber pike-based Shien.

@@yrooxrksvi7142 Does Luminara also use ataru? I'm basing this analysis on Barris' application of Jar Kai in TCW and Luminara herself when she fought TCW Ventress. It seems a lot of jedi use Ataru as a primary or they supplement it with other forms or vice versa. It's a recurring theme I've noticed.

@@baki484 Likely yes, Connor does mention it here in this video iirc. For Barris, I'd rather stick to her EU self, using the fight against Separatist droids on Illum from the 2003 microseries, as her TCW self gets an unexplained, plot-convenient Dark Side boost.

@@yrooxrksvi7142 I understand. Hey I saw your comment on the Calorusmagus' vs video (was able to finish it work my through him over explaining the real world logistics and different mediums). I chimed in and had a debate with him on the subject of the combatants in question. I think worries way too much with real world implications and differing mediums as opposed to looking at the medium as whole (it's a bit of a read if you're interested in reading the back and forth). On the subject of Barris I understand also in the EU she was Depicted as solely a pacifist combatant so soresu she was also incorporating force abilities like the when she was performing the circle of shelter she used the force to loosen the stalactites.

i laugh my balls off as well

"Sloppy"

lol

***** Well crap. My next suggestion was going to be Revan, but based on your response, I assume he can't be conclusively pinned down technically either, seeing as how the player controls his stats and abilities. Also, I'm sure you get Revan all the time.

***** yes pls don't unless they make a proper movie after him lol

Seeing you write "the longest serving member of the Dark Council", I seem to remember that was Vowrawn, but I don't recall where I might have that from, so I could be mixing that up. Could you point me to where Marr is cited as such? Just being curious and not connected with the suggestion at all. :)

***** Sorry for the confusion, I was referring to ech0six's opening post. :)

***** Just out of curiosity, why wouldn´t you use Revan?

***** Alright can't wait :)

You should do eeth koth and quigon jiin vs yureal poof and oppo rancisis

Eeth koth vs qui Gon Jinn will be on my channel in two days

Ok that’s cool I guess

I think that kota probably has little to no chance.Vos would probably get stomped since katarn is arround dooku's level and he dominated vos.Tbh I don't know about the last one.

Mundi Kyle Malak

@@Aintnoonewatching why does Kota have little to no chance? I'm not necessarily arguing that he would win but it's certainly a possibility

@@tiredjediknight3110 as far as i know kota while a capable duelist is prone to the weaknesses of form 7 namely weak defense capacity .Since Kid Adi is a form 5 specialist and counters are one of the form's strengths he could take adavantage of that weakness easily. Beyond that I consider him the superior martial artist which would only make the advantage more prevalent. As far as the force goes well,I think it is safe to consider that he has the edge as well.Furthermore Mundi has other abilities like force healing and an overall better grasp of the force In the end I just don't think kota has any real advantages to capitalise on

@@Aintnoonewatching is Ki Adi Mundi a confirmed form 5 specialist? Because I'm fairly sure he was proficient in forms 2-4. At least as far as the legends continuity goes. And while Juyo is a primarily offensive form it has to be built off the mastery of multiple other forms, in Kota's case almost certainly form 5, at least the shien variant. To be fair Ki Adi may well be the superior lightsaber duellist given his demonstrations against grievous and Ventress but there were other circumstances in play in those fights. I do however disagree on their force abilities. Kota has demonstrated masterful command and variety in regards to Telekinesis, skill in Tutaminis, skill in the healing arts and force barriers strong enough to repel lightsaber blades. If there's an edge to capitalise on that could well be it for Kota

Darth Maul vs Ventress? Not even a contest. Maul would kill her so fast.

I think Antoine Bandele might do that. I've always wanted to know to.

Plo Koon would win.

i argee, but to be fair Darth Maul would not die immediately.

Maul should win. Plo lost to Savage.

Plo Koon would win.

My theory is that Shien was developed first and makes up the bulk of a Form V specialist's technique since it solves most of the problems that Djem So (which specializes in saber-to-saber and close combat) doesn't really have an answer for. But yeah Djem So is clearly the discerning Jedi killer's choice if Vader, Bane and Malgus are anything to go by.

I think part of the reason Shien isn't as seen as its brother, Djem So, is because when the form is described.... All that is ever mentioned is that it was focused on blaster deflection, is weak against single opponents, that practitioners have a thing for reverse hand grips and recently (relatively speaking) I've heard it described as Soresu applied with a Makashi mentality. However, you don't generally hear much about how Shien does in saber to saber combat. And it seems as though Djem So was developed for Form V since Shien wasn't good enough for the practice. In fact, this video is the first time I've heard anything about how Shien can be applied in saber to saber combat... I've always heard it used for aimed blast deflect and wasn't as passive as Soresu I'm actually interested in hearing more about Shien itself

***** thanks for a better analysis of the form and giving us a better look at it. The description of the form does not do it justice in my book. You shed some light on it as being more than just a blaster deflection technique, good work.

you still have ignored my replies and ownage of you in the grievous and revan threads

No way she's Tier 3. Besides, that's TCW Ventress, not the devastatingly effective Dark Horse Comics/CW '03 Ventress.

***** Though apparently you believe Yoda to be extremely poor at integrating force-based attacks into his lightsaber combat too, despite Yoda being a confirmed master of Niman?

KatakiDoragon despite Yoda having apparently mastered Niman, his preference is Ataru, and it really shows.

Cade Skywalker would win this

***** except so far it hasn't really ignored much of the EU beyond the fates of Luminara and Depa Billaba, with the Inquisitorius, Sienaar Fleet Systems, Femme Troopers, Kaiburr Crystals (literally they flat out adapted Splinter of the Mind's Eye in a recent episode) and the like. Also in the new novels, Femme Troopers, The Darth Bane Trilogy, the Darth Plagueis novel, and large chunks of Old Republic-introduced star systems were carried over. To just ignore changes regardless of your tastes of them or not is callous, unprofessional, and frankly, pretty ignorant. One thing a Jedi should never be is ignorant. Afterall, There is no Ignorance; There is Knowledge. Just because the story group chooses to re-adjust established continuity, doesn't mean we shouldn't acknowledge that it happened.

***** uhhh, not really, I'm just enjoying Star Wars continuing on whatever form it may take. Might wanna scale back the butthurt mate, you make great videos, no need for that. So yeah, you are being rather ignorant. This is fiction, shit can be retconned and altered in a moment's notice, DC and Marvel Comics have been doing it for decades, yet the stories still get seen and adored by generation after generation. Plus, AS an EU fan myself, I am also the first to admit there are TONS of stories that were goofy as all hell. The Glove of Darth Vader? Half of the New Jedi Order book series? Large chunks of Tales of the Jedi that had little to do with Exar Kun, Ulic Qel-Droma, or the Sunriders? KOTOR 2? Dark Empire? Jedi Academy Trilogy? Yeesh. So what if they are "cherrypicking", so far all they've done is mild cleanup. They haven't done anything so massive where people warrant a "NO! BAD Lucasfilm!" and no, I personally think that Karen Traviss had it coming when her attitude towards the Star Wars mythos beyond her trying to make the Mandalorians the superheroes of Star Wars, thus getting changed because George wasn't crazy about it in his world so he altered it, though kept a few bits here and there he did like. If anybody is in denial here, it's you because published, released, and highly rated with millions of viewers TV shows would beg to differ versus the perhaps hundred thousand copies of the comic book that portrayed the death of Luminara Unduli sold. So no, Luminara was captured, tried, offered up as a sacrificial lamb, THEN died, before being used as a trap for the crew of the Ghost, notably Kanan Jarrus and Ezra Bridger.

I honestly can see both of you guy's points, but this is just my two cents. I've always thought of most of the eu books as what if books like with the line of comics that marvel has done in the past. The what ifs are like after Return of the Jedi. For awhile there nobody thought they'd ever make any new star wars movies so the books/comics sprang up. Don't get me wrong, I like a lot of the eu stuff except for the "Darth Krayt stuff"(sorry people, I just didn't care for it much at all and the only character I liked at all was Talon cause I like twilek force users.) I know people are upset over the eu, but I like that they're putting in some new ideas as well. At first I didn't think I'd like Rebels then I sat down watched a couple of episodes and was hooked. I love how they used Luminara as bait to lure jedi that had survived order 66. That's exactly something the empire would do. You have to admit though its cool that they're at least they're using ideas from the eu instead of completely writing it off. There's always the possibility of some of the eu characters showing up in the movies even if its a small part. Oh, and, Jensaarai for a future vs video, take a look at the Dread Masters from star wars the old republic game. They're an interesting bunch of sith.

***** Everyone has something different that got them into Star Wars, mine, was seeing Empire Strikes Back as a little kid in the theatre being absolutely wowed by the story, characters, everything. For me, it was all about the characters of Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader and the whole storyline. That and I absolutely love at-ats and tie-fighters shooting things up. The EU for me is basically icing on the cake. I understand you like the whole world-building and its like dungeons and dragons and their various realm expansions and all that. Just wondering on Rebels, have you watched any of it at all or do you automatically assume its horrible because its Disney? As far as future movies, I'm going to watch them with an open mind. Maybe they'll be bad. Maybe they'll be good. I find if you go in to watch something before hand not open at all, you're going to hate it completely not matter what's in it. To anyone out there, I'd invite them to give Rebels a chance, at least a season or two and see where it leads. I remember people hating the Clone Wars series when it first came out too, but people began to like it. Most of it I liked, except a few things like Darth Maul should've stayed dead, etc, but hey who didn't like Darth Sidious scenes with them, especially when he mopped the floor with two of them. Anyways, kudos on all your vs series. I've watched them all and enjoy them quite well. Here's an idea for a battle royale so to speak, The Sith Council vs the Dread Masters(from the swtor game.) That would be an interesting battle for sure!

***** except so far, the new material hasn't proven to be any different or less fun than the content that has come before. I admit, having the EU is what kept Star Wars alive and breathing for me, but one of my biggest gripes with other Star Wars fans is when they claim to be fans of all things Star Wars, then refuse to accept the new content that came before, even if doing so might contradict it, and before the new canon purge, there were 5 forms of canon. Yes, most remained C-Canon, but we always knew there was going to be more content that overruled it, so why should we be shocked? It's basically now everything going forward is G-Canon. And why do I hate when other Star Wars fans do this? Because they are also the same people who shit over OT purists who refuse to accept the PT and the EU for "not taking in all things Star Wars." And yet they turn around and do the same thing to the new content. Bottom line, you do great reviews, but trying to shunt new material because it isn't what you may not know (though there is nothing really major, and let's face it, Luminara, Ventress, and the like are C-lister characters at best to begin with, that has been changed.), it makes it no less viable, and no less Star Wars. Now when we see legit Mickey fucking Mouse running around and going "LOOK AT ME! I'M A JEDI FELLAS!" and have a lightsaber duel with Darth Deadpool (*vomit*) THEN I will scream vitrol and bile, but so far that has not happened considering their work with Marvel has been hands off and still fantastic, at least cinematically, while their comic division has continued to be a mixed bag aka. no change.

Makes sense.

This would be a fitting one, but I think Vader has no chance against Krayt. He is as good as a swordsman and far beyond Vader in force abilities and to top that of his force lightning is pretty strong.

NoHarmony I would disagree. For one before becoming Sith Anakin bested A-Sharad in a duel on Tatooine. Also, Vader learned from one of the greatest force wielders of all time Darth Sidious, as well as Kenobi.

theYoungNation I may be wrong but if I remember correctly you mix something up. A Sharad battled Kenobi on Tatooine, he was with Anakin on another Desert planet and as far as I know Skywalker got angry at him but they did not really duel each other. And beyond that: Skywalker became Darth Vader, he refined his swordtechnique and became a lot more creative with his force powers. He may have learned from Sidious but his abilities were still very hampered by the fact that he lost all his limbs. Also, Kenobi was not a great force user. A Sharad became Darth Krayt, learned from Bane, Revan and a whole lot of other Sith, he survived for centuries, built his own Sith Order... by the time he was a Jedi he was only a pretty average guy but by the time he was a Sith Lord he might be comparable to Darth Sidious. And Vader would have no chance against someone as potent as Sidious. Vader may be the greatest Jedi killer and may also have had the potential to become the most powerful force user of all time but against Krayt what is left of that potential can not compete with Krayt. In a lightsaberduel there may be a draw, maybe even a very slight advantage for Vader but once forcepowers come into play this fight is over. I would say the chance that he beats Krayt is near 0.

NoHarmony Krayt merely learned from holocrons. No room for technique improvement or the master's views or Krayt's abilities. Also, Bane, Nihilus and Andeddu And educ refused to teach Krayt as he defied their individual methods for a Sith empire, such as defiying the rule of two. It was on Tatooine, however it was Kenobi whom he fought with. He defeated Aurra Sing, had bounty hunter training and Anakin nearly killed him out of hatred of the sand people. Whilst Krayt may have used Sith techniques to extend his life. In his most powerful age he was elderly, weak even. Vader at his most powerful would be elderly, sure, but wise and strong. I'm sure Vader would win. Don't doubt Kenobi's ability to teach, he was the greatest Soresu user ever. Sidious on the other hand flooded Vader with knowledge of the dark side, he was all-enpowering.

theYoungNation Comparing Anakin to A Sharad does nothing to decide this contest. Vader changed and A Sharad changed even more which is saying something. Vader was a great Jedi killer with much more experience, thats an advantage for him. But in all other areas Krayt is on par or better that Vader. Even if we assume that Krayts force lightning is not strong enough to kill Vader (which I doubt since he is so damn powerful) he is still the superior one. But I guess this discussion leads us nowhere. Of course Jensaarai could always end it but telling us what he thinks :D