in that case, i belive yes

For the sake of diplomacy and alliances I must say yes. Thranduil might be a little bit greedy, but he is not a fool.

Yes, I believe he would have.

Thranduil is quite reasonable and wise leader, he is capable of kindness and compassion and to remind in the book he was the one reluctant to start war over gold. The fact that he left Orcrist at Thorin's tomb as a sign of respect says as much that he would return it in reconciliation if Thorin was alive, after all, it was taken from the dwarf in captivity but for all intents and purposes it was already his (even Elrond who would have greater claim to such a weapon, being after all related to Elves of Gondolin acknowledged it as his: "They were made in Gondolin for the Goblin-wars. They must have come from a dragon's hoard or goblin plunder, for dragons and goblins destroyed that city many ages ago. This, Thorin, the runes name Orcrist, the Goblin-cleaver in the ancient tongue of Gondolin; it was a famous blade. This, Gandalf, was Glamdring, Foe-hammer that the king of Gondolin once wore. Keep them well!'" ... "Long will I tarry, ere I begin this war for gold. The dwarves cannot press us, unless we will, or do anything that we cannot mark. Let us hope still for something that will bring reconciliation."). Thranduil also wasn't exactly greedy (it's noted that he had weakness for treasure especially silver and white gems but not that he was obsessed with them, his wealth was already great though he wished to increase it, he wasn't much different from any other king or ruler who requires wealth, as Beleg Strongbow once said to Turin: "…a king or the lord of a great host has many needs. He must have a secure refuge; and he must have wealth, and many whose work is not in war. With numbers comes the need of food, more than the wild will furnish to hunters. And there comes the passing of secrecy." Hehe even magical mystical Elves think of logistics and mundane material matters :)), he was pretty much rather generous, he helped the Esgaroth's refugees: "...great store of goods he sent ahead by water." In general it was a nice speculation, Thorin already made a fine leader (when he provided his colony in Blue Mountains with prosperity working as hard as his people) but he always had pride issues, his experiences during the quest, had he lived through, would make him a bit wiser I think, though I would say that his reign wouldn't differ that much from that of Dain Ironfoot. Dain as king was fabulously rich and his reign brought peace and prosperity not only to kingdoms of Dale and Erebor/Iron Hills, but helped the entire region, Dain from the start was more humble and somewhat wiser individual, he was the one who felt or seen the dark terror of Moria, during Battle of Nanduhirion when he cut off Azog's head and that's why he was reluctant to let Balin go on his expedition to make colony in Moria (it is said that he didn't give leave willingly, but in the end agreed). Under Dain's reign Dwarves of Erebor became numerous and strong again, Dain showed remarkable generosity, Thorin if indeed he came out alive and changed by his experiences, he probably would be the same, so he would be free of 'dragon-sickness'. Problem is that Dwarves would still need lot of time to recover and it is doubtful that even under Thorin's leadership they would expand so fast. Dwarves under Dain are certainly as united as they would be under Thorin, Dain is still a member of Durin's House, a younger royal line descending from Durin the Deathless the eldest of the Seven Fathers. Dain's power and influence was great and he already as lord of Iron Hills commanded great respect. His lordship that he inherited from his grandfather Grór already gave him great following among the Longbeards (also many survivors of the sack of Erebor by Smaug, fled to Iron Hills boosting his people: "Thorin was then a youngster in the reckoning of the Dwarves. It was afterwards learned that more of the Folk under the Mountain had escaped than was at first hoped; but most of these went to the Iron Hills.")

Men of the West it would happen this way or something very close to it love ur videos

I wonder if good forces had more armies to use at pelennor fields battle, what would have even been the difference? In the end it was all up to Frodo Sam and Smeagul anyway

They were really outnumbered in that battle bunch of dwarves would have helped

It’s funny, because it’s true!

Heck it would not have been just war of the rings in easy mode but even battle of helm's deep easy mode. Had thorin lived he could have also sent a few hundred dwarves to help Legolas, Gimli, Aragon and Rohan against the enemies they were facing in that battle simple

How so? Please respond, I love reading different theory's.

That would've left erebor undefended tho.

@@sidneyadnopoz3427 I mean obviously he'd fortify Erebor and make sure it's secured

​@@sidneyadnopoz3427 Thorin didn't had to send many soldiers I think, I mean thorin and dwalin were able to defeat 100 goblin soldiers and maybe Dain as his steward would defend Erebor with his soldiers

That's kinda true 🤔

True, but Aragorn tended to be more unsure of his place as king.

@@foolslayer9416 because unlike thorin he never lived his life as a king or prince. He only became that when he got crowned. Until then he lived to earn that crown eventually.

He is

Not almost

A GEED likes thAt is verey t0 oevercome

path to science fantasy I’d agree it’s hard but not impossible. And given the trials Thorin’s family went through I can see why greed overtook him-living in exile, fighting for your family and yourself and now suddenly you have 100 times the means to provide for them...I don’t know many people that wouldn’t be overcome by that. I suppose I just think that showing Thorin’s deep flaw with greed didn’t need to necessarily end in the death of his direct line. That always felt more tragic for the sake of being tragic to me.

Well that's life. He's a mortal which means his life can be vanquished at any moment in a world full of dragons, orcs and evil

It's simply a reflection of the truth of war. People die. Not everyone overcomes their problems, not everyone wins. Thorin, Fili and Kili perish on the slopes of the Lonely Mountain, and in doing so regain everything they'd fought for. Later, Dain and the heir of Bard would die too in defending Erebor and Dale. They aren't fighting orcs and bands of ruffians in these areas, these were massive wars that were only eclipsed in the Third Age by the likes of the Fall of Arnor and of course the War of the Ring, both of which directly involved servants of Sauron himself. Tolkien never shied away from death. The death of Thorin Oakenshield reflects that very well I think, for as tragic as it is, that's the very intent of Lord of the Rings and the Legendarium - great, epic tragedy. From the corruption of Melkor all the way to the departing of Frodo from Middle-Earth, there is as much sorrow as there is joy.

Save Throin and kill off Frodo

I think second breakfast would also convince them

What about luncheon? Afternoon tea?

"We've had one yes, what about second breakfast?" -Pip "Elevensies!? Luncheon?! Afternoon tea?! Dinner?! Supper!? He knows about them right?!" -Pip

Bring some salted pork, ale and longbottom leaf lol

Thorin: YOU'LL TAKE TEN THOUSAND AND LIKE IT!!!

It may not have been a good idea. The concentration of bad asses would have unbalanced the world, or would have turned Rivendell into a sink hole. :)

@@richardthomas5362 Don't worry, the presence of the living dwarven legend would be diluted to his reaction at seeing Bilbo and Gandalf, as well as another Baggins at Rivendell and seeing the living legend himself radiate "me and the bois" and "back in my day" energy.

If we are going with that than the dwarves can bring out their anti arrow ballista that we see in the extended version of the battle of the five armies. Also i can just imagine the dwarves and men just mixed up then charging causing havok amoungst the orcs

Matthew David I completely agree!!

I concur!

Every single thing Tolkien's worte is awesome my friend. From the First page to the last. If you think about the world Tolkien created and all the fantasy beaind It its really all awesome.

First time I read the book "The Hobbit" I was 9..., and I cried when I read Thorin died..., it was tough after building the liking and relationship through the story and him falling it sucked..., for a 9 year old. Now the movies came out and extended editions and its just as bad seeing these deaths play out..., it sucks.

Where is a magic spell when you need one! RIP Thorin.

Nha Sauron would still gone same way, he had huge armies to spread on both fronts anyway

The scouring wasn't the only time Hobbits fought. The battle of Greenfields, and even during the war between Arnor and Angmar, bands of Hobbits were noted fighting for the doomed free people of Arnor

I don't think Khazad-dum could be reclaimed permanently because of Durins Bane.

Most of groups from hobbit couldn't fight they never did

Karl Franz Durins Bane (the Balrog) is killed by Gandalf after he makes his stand on the bridge of Khazad Dûm when the rest of the Fellowship escape Moria. Which because of the battle between the Balrog ( aka Durin's Bane) and Gandalf, Gandalf dies and is brought back by iluvitar (the major God in Tolkien's lore of middle earth) and is brought back as Gandalf the White. Which Gandalf later reveals to Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli in Fangorn Forest in the movie the Two Towers. So the retaking and permanent settling of Moria is completely possible and logically a very sensible thing to do if you are a dwarf lord under the rule of king Thorin Oakenshield. Just a little handy bit of information for you. 😊

@@leiflyon3583 since this is an "alt timeline"where Thorin lived, how would you know that what happen in the movies will happen here too?

I didn't even think about that. The scouring of the Shire either wouldn't have happened, or Frodo, Sam, Merry and Pippin would have had a lot of reinforcements.

Thank you

That is true

yea once peace was established, thranduil would return it.

why would he return a gondolindrim sword let alone a sword of turgon to the dwarves? he only did out of respect for thorin and kinda as an apology for keeping him as a prisoner, if thorin survived thranduil would've kept the sword knowing the dwarves can make better steel

That is true, after all it belongs to his kin. Yeah I agree with you on this one.

not necessarily his kin since we know he wasn't fond of the noldor due to the whole feanorian wars and ''noldor bring war'' (which they did), more like keeping it as a relic of the times of Beleriand

John Smith Aiya Earendil Elenion Ancalima!

John Smith You're right! A video abaut It would be' awsome

I think Thorin would have unified all of the dwarves as the video suggests. Dain was a good ruler, but Throrin being the primary heir to the throne and the arkenstone as his heirloom would without question unite the dwarves of Middel Earth to flourish across the land; not just Erebor. Moria was attempted to be retaken, however, even after Gandalf destroyed the Balrog, dwarven strength was not sufficient to retake it.

Balins company failed but Durin the seventh (Dains son I believe)did reclam Moria

@@Jesse_andrew Grandson, son of Thorn III Stonehelm

Wheatly That would be an interesting story to discuss! In the desire to recover the Dwarven Rings and Khazad-dûm, he might’ve betrayed his non-Dwarven allies.

Men of the West yes that’s what i think.

I don't think neither Balin nor Thorin would accepted the offer, first of all Thorin would have personal grudge against Sauron for death of his father Thrain in dungeons of Dol Guldur, second even if they desired the remaining of the Seven Rings (which they did, as another Balin's hidden motive for expedition to Moria was hope of finding one of the Seven Rings, the one that belonged to kings of Moria since Durin III, that he believed must have been either buried in secret tombs of the kings or lost there after murder of Thrór by Azog, he was wrong of course as we learn). Balin and Thorin would also know well that revealing information on Bilbo and his home would put him in danger and both in the end were loyal friends to the hobbit (Balin especially seems to be close with Bilbo and would never want him to be in danger). Thorin's eventual political moves would also make him wary of making any deals with Mordor, knowing that it's a dangerous game and too risky, Dwarves in general didn't like attempts at foreign power dominating them, making deal with Sauron would put them exactly in such position (also Dain would advice against it, he was one of the wisest Dwarves, and that's why his portrayal in movie makes me angry, Billy Connolly might be good comedic actor but he wasn't good for this role).

fantasywind yeah that’s true.

what if we disregard the shitty peter jackson movies. now that be a great theory, we just go back to the book that was a hell a lot better.

Arcen yep!!!

Molly Shay Glad to see someone else who will join me in my conquests

KingdomH342 Thank you! I doubt it would have changed Gondor’s protection of the Shire much, as King Elessar would have likely still banned men from entering the land uninvited.

@@MenoftheWest but not Dwarves and Elves.

sauron would have never invaded Minas Ithil, and never had a hold on osgiliath, he would be curbsumped by the might of Arnor and Gondor alone.

also i don't think that moria would fall, has Arnor was allied to the dwarfs of khazad dum and would probably help them reclaim their ancestral home, that would make middle earth so much stronger in the third age.

shit breaks loose

Everyone would die.

@@spaghetii5337 Sauron: Hey you balrog gimme back that ring tho Durin's Bane: No bro I wanna summon Morgoth back into Middle Earth Sauron: *Conflicting emotion noises*

@@KonnyP You. Are. Amazing! 🤣