GixxerFoo are you sure the 99 to 2002 tc 88 motor had duel timken bearings on the crank ? I thought the timken was on the drive side or left hand side and the right side was a press fit in the case roller bearing.

From 2003 on the Timken was on the right side, and they used a press fit to save money 👎 on the left. Crap in my opinion as the years went on and power increased. But Harley happily charged you an extra 50 bucks on your $2800 dollar kit for a required "lefty bearing". Plus labor.

GixxerFoo ok no worries so are you saying my 2001 dyna wideglide has a timken on the left being the drive side and has a press fit roller on the right side?

Sounds like you should deal with the hydraulic tensioner first

At the very least that would be the first thing anyone should do.

😆😂 l swear l have another shelf, l just haven't got it up yet. That was the temporary to permanent model lol.

😂🤣😂 took me a sec to realize

It's a bit of conversation piece now 😆🤷‍♂️

Lewis A. Now that was funny

🤦‍♂️ it hasn't fallen yet, l need to start a contest on how many cans are actually up there.

Will do! There's some differences on the 88 vs the 96 and 103. 88 is an excellent motor and a huge torque producer!

We've got some awesome viewers on this channel and some great conversation!

That's awesome, those early twin cams have the Timken bottom end so you know it's solid as rock. The tensioners were really hit or miss on those bikes, sounds like you've got one of the good ones though!

Firebearfl I have the 98 flstc and now since my wife passed away I have her 03 lowrider. Never spent much time thinking about different upgrades other than I had the dealership before we even brought it home put Vance an Hines pipes and chrome spoked wheels on it. Nothing is more comfortable than my heritage but I don’t think I will ever sell her bike. But the mid controls suck for me. I didn’t know about the tensioner. Guess I’ll have to do that and forward controls to ride comfortably. Sorry about rant. But I know how you feel about your bike

I upgraded my cam chest at 35k miles on my carbureted 02 Electra Glide and basically used the same components as you. Feuling hydraulic cam plate and tensioner shoes, oil pump and lifters and went with the S&S 510’s. I wanted the power gain at 3k RPM (around 70mph) while freeway cruising. And man do they kick in when passing. I also have no problems keeping up with newer Harley’s. My GL-1800 GoldWing on the other hand, rips down the road. I compare my Harley to an old American made muscle car which just growls and is downright mean. My Wing is like a sleek Porsche. I love them both

I do remember something about a bad run of cam bearings, I don't think it was as well known as the tensioner failures though. A lot of guys that had an early tensioner failure mentioned getting their cam bearings and tensioners replaced under warranty. I know they never recalled the motors for the tensioner failure but they quietly replaced them.

Wow that's a lot of miles! I am sure you enjoyed some fun trips on it.

Damn why did you trade it?! The new bikes are awesome but your bike is a seasoned beast! No they definently weren't screamers but they had the down low don't buy expensive grips torque.

@@GixxerFoo Traded it in because I didn't have the funds for a new bike, it was 15 years old with 90,000 miles plus change, I average about 6-7 thousand mile a year, and owned the bike for 15 years, purchased new....Believe me when I say that I am more than happy with the M8 107...I am planning to do the high flow breather, with a tuner, I already have the needed exhaust....The one thing I truly miss on the FLHT is a cigarette lighter (I know) haha.. which I will install when I do the stage one...maybe a little bit down the road I will add a cam...maybe....At my age (65) all I want to do is ride.

Dang you got your money worth out of that bike! Lol l can see why it was time to get yourself a new ride now, l hope you plan on doing the same with your new one!

Thank you, l appreciate you watching. That 95 is where it's at on the 88, wakes it up and reliably too. I love the older bikes more than any of the new stuff today.

@Lurch I don’t necessarily disagree with your assessment (coincidentally I am an Aviator lol) but I have to say converting my TC to 95ci and making gear driven vs spring tensioner has worked out quite well. Motor has plenty of power and reliability. Newer M8s (114) are pretty decent motors imo and I’ve only upgraded the cam, air cleaner and exhaust. It’s been nothing but reliable as well. Just goes to show those AMF days have had longer reputation builder than one might think.

Thank you, l appreciate you watching and your support! I am a fan of the Low Rider, it's one of my favorites! Yeah you'd have to pull the head to know for sure if it's a 95ci.

A square 88 is a monster, I've always stumped for those 88's with a conversion!

What all did you have to do to get the 100 ci

T Sports are frickin awesome! You won't regret the 95 inch kit, they run strong with the short stroke the 88's have.

That's no joke, l am a fan of their reman program. Especially since they upgrade your motor to current specs, also you can upgrade displacement as well. It's at a deep discount especially compared to buying a kit!

Could probably build one to go 100/150K reliably with normal maintenance and no abuse. Got 85K from my 2001 ElectroGlide Classic before I sold it in 2013. Decided to have the camshaft chain tensioners checked at 50K and found them completely worn out. Fortunate I didn’t wait longer

If Harley Davidson had less lawyers and less bean counters and would let the engineers design the bike without budget constraints we could make it last for 300K miles. I have been a mechanical engineer for 40 years and I can tell you from experience that we don't always get to build what we design. It's always..."how can we make it cheaper"...."Price Point"... It has nothing to do with Engineering. It has to do with profit for the stockholders, price point and revenue. We know how to build it bullet proof but, if they won't let you ...well you see the results...Look as some of the Harleys that were made when AMF owned them. Absolute junk for the very reason I stated above...

@@chuck7432 Mercedes seems to stay in business with this very business plan....

@@bqbquinn Yeah that was known by Harley but they won't admit it. If they did it would force a recall. I swapped mine out twice in 65K miles...The last time was with hydraulic tensioners that came with the Feuling 525 Reaper Cam Chest Kit...

We love Harleys not because they are the best and or reliable because they are not! we love them because new or old we always have the opportunity to modify or change something to make them unique, plus nothing in this world sounds like a Harley. 😊

Never buy the first year, even the M8's had some serious issues that first year. Sumping issues, oil wasn't returning to the crank case and shelling motors.

@@GixxerFoo Thats a good advice and it works with all the models Harley have ever made. I have mostly messed with my trusty '73 shovelhead, which has been in my possession over 18 yrs now. Its made in the notorious AMF era, so i know the first year/early years rule.

GixxerFoo shows the lack of quality control on harleys. No excuses. They will sell their bikes regardless of reliability issues.

That's awesome to hear! I really appreciate the support!

You're right and doing your own work makes a huge difference. I dunno if it was a bad run of tensioners or what. Your bike sounds like it's done great and other people had an engine failure before 15k.

Be careful about age as well. When I took mine off the crumbled from age but still had plenty of life.

Dang probably a good thing you got them out of there! Better they fell apart taking them off instead of running through the engine.

I still have my 99 RK Classic 35k mi runs great stage 1 , reg maintenance oil is cheap motors aren’t

That's what l've always said too!

You've got that all upgraded and won't have to worry about it again. How'd your spring tensioners look when you got them out having 52K on them?

@@GixxerFoo They were done. Worn almost to the metal. Didn't consider a gear drive. Heard to many horror stories. Stuck with what works. I'm that kinna guy.

I don't blame you, gear drives work really well if you have a run out within spec and it stays that way.

Bought an '02 FXSTI new in 01, still have it, has the stage 1 conversion, Vance and Hines str8 shot pipes, quick detach sport windshield, quick detach tall sissy bar & luggage rack, only like 23,000 miles on it. Not tagged or insured @ the moment, health issues make me wonder if I should even keep it, but, can't bring myself to sell it. Damn, getting old sucks!

I have same bike,first tennsioners went out at 50,000have 60,now making a little noise HD DEALER installed Screaming eagle kitincluding cams.

The 95 is a strong combination on the 88. It delivers plenty of power and torque. It's really a good deal if you do your own work like you and l do.

Good question! No, you don't NEED to do the Timken conversion with a big-bore kit, but in so-doing you render the lower-end Bulletproof! When you disassemble the cam-chest, check the pinion-shaft run-out, and it it is greater than .005 think hard about how long you plan to own the bike; over the long-haul the pinion-shaft run-out will only increase as a result of the increase in HP and Torque associated with a big-bore kit.

Will do! A lot of people heard the stories about the 88 and won't touch em, but they aren't bad engines at all.

I've had an 88 (Deuce in profile pic), 96" DWG and now 103 Ultra. I didnt care for the 96. Felt sluggish. 88 sounded and ran great was just lacking top end speed. 103 has been great so far it feels more balanced on top and bottom end speeds than the smaller brothers. Overall unless I'm buying a shovel or pan I will only buy TC engines.

Did you notice any heat reduction after the upgrade?

You get a Timken bottom end and gear drive like you did, that's years of trouble free miles.

Bronze is the way to go on any bushing, it wears better than steel and aluminum, doesn't come apart. S&S does things right with their products.

That's awesome to hear! The 88's are really some very reliable engines once you get the cam chest upgraded. Just another tip if you get a 99 to 02, get the carb version and stay away from the Magnetti Marelli fuel injection. But don't get a fuel injected bike unless it has the Delphi fuel injection.

@@GixxerFoo I was able to purchase a 2012 Ultra Classic a couple weeks ago. What a sweet ride. Your videos helped in my year choice and things to ask the owner about the bike.

90K miles?! That's awesome, yeah I'd open that cam cover up and take a peak at those, wouldn't hurt to go ahead to change them.

I love hearing about bikes that stay around a while, that's the beauty of a Harley is being able to keep it like that. Sounds like you've got it all updated and reliable as any new bike out there!

@@GixxerFoo Now has Progressive front cartridge replacements in front fork tubes, Mustang seat with back-rest and LED head/passing lights, and head breather so no more oily air into carburetor. Looking at an oil cooler next.

Very nice, you've got the solid bottom end! It should do great with that gear drive in there!

You said it right there, you have to treat the tensioners like a wear item. Buying a new bike has perks of not chasing down gremlins. I am curious to see how the tensioner on M8 plays out, a lot of miles out there already and no reports of issues 👍.

@@GixxerFoo yes, i am curious too. I am guilty of not riding enough. But there's been many bikes that have crossed at least 25k and some even 50k and I haven't really heard of any major issues. I am keeping it stock for now and feel satisfied with the power for my riding style. Hoping these turn out to be reliable motors.

I would fall back on tensioners past, at least check them out every 15k or so. I am sure they learned something but l am the suspicious type lol.

Right on, doing your own work is the way to go! The shift levers always seem to be a problem on the 88, I remember the return springs used to break a lot years ago.

Man I just bought a sweet 06 electra glide classic with 41,000 mile so ill send to my certified Harley mechanic to just know its fine i mean its smooth as silk except for a small vacuum leak on the oem carburetor. Everything is stock with slip on Vance and Hines

@@onementality9781 Nice! Mine had about 46k on it when I got it. Chuggin right along with 54k on it now. Check those cam chain tensioners!

Yep, Huge PITA...The front shifter linkage isn't any better . It gets sloppy and floppy. I had to install new bushings and a new shifter shaft. Luckily I didn't have to remove the primary...to get to all of it..

@@GixxerFoo My '99 88a model Ultra's shifter gave me problems. Before I trashed the splines I took some meat out between where shifter clamps down. Fixxed that deal. I thought mine didn't 'lope' because it was the unbalanced engine, didn't know it was because of efi. Tensioners went 110,000 before they wore enough to make noise, embarrasing I let 'em go that far. Cut out pushrods (just couldn't open the top end, nothing wrong with it.) adjustible pushers and new pads is all she got. 160,000 on it now, bone stock. "cept got cam bearing recall without trashing bearings. Had to fail before Harley would touch em. A screw on the stator backed out and the noise it made sounded like it came from cam side. Free upgrade + $100 for tightening screw, lol. Been a dependable bike. Ok, let me write a book. The cams had huge chunks of metal missing, forging irregularities, but not where lifters rode, so ya, they're still in there too. It was a factory demo bike with 9900 miles when I bought it for $17,500. Always did my own work, rode my 62 FLH 27 years before this bike.

Holy crap autocorrect. The Timken lower

It's crazy how some of those motors went that long and others failed before 15K. I dunno if it was a bad run of tensioners or what, but no two motors are exactly alike.

how much did it cost to do that?

how much did it cost to do that?

@@brookebrawley2142 I don't exactly recall but I do remember that the kit retailed for $499.95 if I remember correctly. The kit included a cam plate, hydraulic tensioner and improved oil pump. I just checked Harley-Davidson's website and the kit now retails for $574.95. Keep in mind that this is for a twin cam motor and not an M8. I am not certain what is offered for the M8.

Yeah ain't nothing cheap about that Harley tax, but they are fun to ride!

Those carbed bikes always sounded so awesome, the fuel injection is great but it doesn't have that lope.

@@GixxerFoo And why is the lope so much different ? My buddy has a 2002 Dyna and I have an `03 RK, his is carb`d, mine is a fuelie...same engine, different idle. Does the ignition have alot to do with it ?

Just an FYI Dyna kept the carb till 2005(last year). However Somehow some 2006's still have them. I currently ride a 2005 Dyna(FXD), with carb 88.

I have a carbureted 02 Electra Glide TC88 that I will never sell. My wife calls her “The Boneshaker” and the old girl is part of the family. And yes, I have had guys ask me on occasion if I would ever consider selling. Most recently, last summer at 4am one morning while filling up at a truck stop on a cross country ride. He actually gave me his business card in case I change my mind. (I do have a stage 1 & 2…. No tensioner issues now)

I have a 2005 FLHT that I ordered new, with a carburetor. Runs and sounds great. My TC88 is stock other than the cam chain tensioner & oil pump upgrade. Never had a single problem with it , just routine scheduled maintenance. This bike is a keeper.

You got it hooked up for the long haul and definitely worth the upgrade! The early 88's sound damn good!

@@GixxerFoo Absolutely. My oem headers were cracked in three places, so got them welded up. SE tips, and I love the sound of my bike. Nothing like it.

@@semperoccultus1969 Harley OEM headers are a lot better than people give them credit for, those are worth welding up for sure. Harley's headers with a set of slip on exhaust pull some damn good numbers on a dyno.

@@GixxerFoo Yup, and I got a TTS tuner to go with, so my bike dyno'ed at almost 77 HP and I think (I don't have the sheet in front of me) 91 torque... maybe. I'd have to look at it again.

That's solid numbers for an 02, those motors were more lnow for the high torque and you got it.

99 is a good year! For sure update that tensioner set in there, but it will have the solid crank setup.

Dang 130k?! That's impressive, I have seen a bike in person with that many miles on the motor.

Really? I've heard that quite a bit down at the local indy shop, a lot of guys run built 88's down there.

@@GixxerFoo surprisingly other than pipes and modest tuning my 05 is not that far from stock and my buddies 96 has a hard time keeping up off the line . I rode quite a few bikes before I settled on my 05 Dyna but just passed 50,000 miles and absolutely love the thing. Do kind of miss not having a Sportster though and if I can find an early 70s Ironhead like my 74 or even a 1200 carburetor Evo I will gladly get another. Love the videos 👍

I appreciate it! Sounds like you do your own work if you're interested in an iron head. I wouldn't mind having one myself. Lol just when you think you got gremlins worked out and take it a little farther than usual that's when you find a good one.

@@turbomustang84 bought a 05 fxdx to replace my 05 sporty. ....5yrs of the fxdx, still can't bring myself to sell the sporty. ....😆

I really enjoy my Sportster too, l don't think l could sell mlm one off either!

That's exactly the point I am trying to get across, the 88's a great motor for someone who wants to buy it cheap and do the work themselves. Like you mentioned you have the good bottom end, with the Timken bearings you'd have no worries going to a 95. The 88 isn't for everyone, you have to do the work yourself and know what you're getting into.

You put in the best cam, ever! I have.them and love not having to rev the crap out of it to pass someone! And taking off under power at normal revs you can't really explain; they have to ride it to believe it.

Not a bad idea with that kinda mileage!

You definitely got a good motor then! Not everyone had that good of luck with their engine.

85,000 on my O5 uc

Dang you got a stable of sweet bikes! Sounds like you ride them too! I'm curious to see how your 110 does as much as you ride.

@@GixxerFoo Thanks, I bought the CVO used with 41,000 already on it. I bought it to take it to Milwaukee in 3 years. I haven't received it yet. I literally just bought it and they are shipping it from California. So I'm curious too.

@@rorycalhoun5853 Damn, lol l have never bought a bike and had it shipped like that. Well the best way to buy a CVO is used like that. The CVO is the biggest value loss of any Harley if you buy one new.

Oh yeah you gotta have some good cams, exhaust, tune and even better upgrade the clutch while you're at it.

88's are solid motors once you get that tensioner upgraded.

You're welcome, l appreciate you watching!

That's awesome your still riding! How many years do you have in the saddle? It's strange cause Harley never acknowledged it officially. Good maintenance is the key though too!

@@GixxerFoo the hyvo can chains in the 60's through to now was the major problem with all american car engines ..as the first to eliminated the chains altogether were gear drives for small block Chevy engines for the world of outlaw sprint cars that are still used today and are quite exotic and last for years and years as when you blow an engine you take your gear drive and use it on your next new Short block...does anyone remember the evo engines with one gear on the cam and one gear on the crank ..with absolutely no issues ever with the valve train ..and with 96 inch jugs from S&S ..100 plus horse power was common

And at your age you will never have the issues we are taking about ..as the twin cams self district at around 60 to 80 thousand miles and can take out the engine cases and you're fucked

@@donniebaker5984 Why do people take more into account the "destruction" when there are tons of the same motors still running and doing well? It's something I just don't understand.

That's true, there are failures out there with any engine but it's a small percentage compared to the ones that never had a major issue.

Thank you! Harley never officially acknowledged it, but some of the chains were better suited for a chainsaw. Dang you got lucky that didn't run through the engine. Good reason to go ahead and do a 95 though. Best engine build you can do with that Timken lower end too.

@@GixxerFoo haha that’s funny!

@@GixxerFoo They couldn't acknowledge it, that would trigger a recall and thats the last thing they want to admit or do.

Harley finally started listening to their customers and put better brakes and a 6 speed. I am still trying to find that 6th gear on my bike too!

Depending how deep your going into the motor it's not too hard to change that output shaft bearing on the left side.

Really I was only thinking of doing a cam kit as I already knew of the chain tensioners and good tune, it’s only done 3700miles to me it’s only just broken in so I don’t really want to tear into it

A set of cams won't hurt anything, it's when you start adding big bore kits and high er compression is when you really need to change the output shaft bearing.

Yeah okay cool, also being carby do you know if it has a rev limiter? I never have turned it that hard to find out but can’t find online if it dose or it will just got till valve float?

Being carburated the stock ignition module should cut it off about 5800 rpm, it should start to stutter around that range.

What year is your bike?

@@GixxerFoo it's an 02 wideglide

Glad it was helpful!

It's one of the best upgrades out there for an 88, l wouldn't go back with the spring tensioners if l had it apart already.

The short stroke of the 88 really has its advantages, l personally like the the shorter stroke. You get more stop light to stop light.

That's a solid ride with the good bottom end! I don't have a video of an install, but l would highly recommend picking up a Harley Service Manual. The official manual is literally step by step with torque specs, tools and everything you need. We did one on a friends bike with a manual and several KZfaq videos.

That was the craziest thing about the 88's tensioners. Just goes to show how stout that Timken bottom end is with run out. That's impressive mileage on your twin cam, l hope you can hit 200k on it!

I had 70000miles without open the inspection cover.2003 88B carb free breather

I sure hope so, too many have found out the issues after they bought one.

You're mechanic steered you right, Feuling makes solid products. 1700 for the kit isn't cheap but it's worth it. Glad it didn't shell your motor, that's the crappy part is that there is no warning.

@@GixxerFoo Got that right... learning as I go.

You won't have to worry about it anymore with the gear system. Does it have a high volume oil pump too?

@@GixxerFoo actually it did get a upgrade oil pump

That's a perfect example of why the used bikes are where it's at! Did you go back with springs or update to the hydraulic tensioner system?

@@GixxerFoo well I went back with springs this time so I could afford to get it back running asap but I'm already putting back money to go with at least hydraulic if not gears. When I do the next change I'm putting performance cams in too. Love ur channel too man!

Thank you! I appreciate it! There's nothing wrong with the springs as long as you keep up with them. The new spring tensioners don't have as much tension as the old OEM versions did. Still not a bad idea to update at all.

Agreed. Fortunately you can do it yourself, so many people got screwed that don't do their own work and had to pay the dealer to do it.

@DrLove if this was No small wear and tear, then it should be in the manual. This is not normal, this is 100% design screw up. HD still not not even acknowledge this problem. Normal wear should be in the manual

That's awesome to hear, to many people had tensioner issues early on with low mile motors. It must of been a bad run, built on a Monday or Friday before a holiday weekend.

My 03' Wide Glide has over 36K miles and when I checked the cam tensioners, they were as fresh as the day she was born. Solid motor, solid parts.

The Cam Tensioner problem was ironed by; seems like by 2005.. 2006 twin cams are rock solid and first year with the rear cylinder deactivation for heat... 2007 twin cam was bumped up from 87 to 96

Ken Tyson I had the first year of the FLHX with the 96 and the 6 speed as well. No issues there either.

150000 miles on four TV 88's impressive, almost beats my 1990 FLHTC evo that I've had since she was new with 290 km ( 179000 miles) and the motors never been touched. Took Harley 90 years to finally build a good engine and then they f*** it up.

Thank you for your support!

Damn you caught that just in time! That could of been a major disaster if that would of let loose!

That's awesome to hear! What brand and what mods do you have done to the motor?

@@GixxerFoo I bought the 2002 Road King in 2013 and it had the high flow air cleaner on the carb, and it runs really well and I have never had trouble keeping up with guys on TC96s--so I am guessing that it has the 95in displacement upgrade. The hydraulic tensioners are the screaming eagle ones (those I had done at a Harley Dealership). I have Screaming eagle street cannon hi-flow exhaust with true duals and I replaced the standard CV carb with an S&S super E. One thing, which I think is common to all touring models, is the shift linkage that is fragile. You have to keep an eye on it. If it starts to get loose or wobble a little, tighten it right away or you will be taking the whole primary off to put a new inside shift lever on or maybe even a new shaft on the transmission. That is all that I have done to it. She has 70,000 miles on her and running like a dream.

I remember the linkage issues, when l was younger l dated a girl who's dad was the the man in service at the local indy shop. He was always working on shifter linkage for people!

Wow that is nice

Thank you! Yeah the inner is a pain to try and inspect, sometimes people will change the outer unaware there is an inner as well.

@@GixxerFoo Wow ! I also fitted a Feuling pump, S&S inner bearings and a Baisley pressure relief valve. Any idea why Feuling spell it the way they do. Happy biking from England.

I've said for years don't count out that short stroke 88, converting those to a 95 they can really make some impressive power like you've seen!

I have a 2000. I would really like to ask you some questions. I have a guy who is trying to help me, but he can't write or spell worth a damn, and I can't figure out what he's trying to say.

Harley never exactly came out and admitted the issue, the lucky owners were able to get it taken care of quietly. I'm amazed how some bikes went 50 to 60k without an issue and many failed before 15k.

They are some dang good motors, a lot of people are discovering this and the price is starting to go up on good used Evo's.

😆😂 thanks, l knew someone would recognize it eventually. The back of it is definently not KZfaq approved lol.

@@GixxerFoo no...no it is not!😂😂

Doing your own work is the way to go, the new ones just aren't built like the one you have. Is your 125k with the original top and bottom end?!

Baker could of hooked you up with a very nice 6 speed!

@@GixxerFoo They still might hook me up. My first bike was a 2003 100th anniversary 883 I bought new. Vivid black with 100th ann badging. I've always loved the paint and badging of the black 100th. I'm very seriously considering finding a 2003 Heritage softail 100th in black and adding a baker 6 speed. That way I can have the bike I want and the 6 speed. Will still be much cheaper than a new softail. That's pretty much my dream bike 👍. It reminds me of being 19 on my first bike accept it will be a heritage softail

That's awesome! I see it that way of getting an older one and adding a transmission. A lot of people always wonder why we'd put that kind of money into an older bike. It's all about getting what you want and not being in serious debt on 30k dollar bike.

Good catch, it was an 88 when it began life. Aftermarket (Screamin Eagle) transmission and a lot of updates and upgrades.

The gear drive is big bucks but the way to go if you can spare the cash!

@Lurch yeah right… 1st good for you. 2nd my bike is carburated. So know cartography will work. 3rd I am only interested in the boost of torque I could get. 4th if I want more HP, then I take my KTM SuperDuke.

Yeah no kidding, Timken bottom end with a 98, if it didn't have it would would we got done if he is going all the way down with it. You'll love it, it will be night and day when you get it back 👍. Let me know how it turns out, and what you think of it!

Yeah the tensioner failure never should of happened, that was bs.

You are so right in 2006 I just trusted them it was harley davidson boy was that a mistake I should have done my diligence 9. I know I will never buy another new one ever. I will stick to the shovel and evo I have put countless miles on both with very few problems they might be slower but I an in my sixties and they all go fast enough for these days and nothin sounds better than a shovel with drag pipes no brag just fact

Those shovels and Evos just have a classic sound they haven't truly replicated since.

It's called "planned obsolescence". Most American companies started adopting this policy in the 90's. Some were far before that but it gained major traction in the 90's.

Yeah, that Evo was hard to beat for power, sound and reliability.

95 EVO stage 3 wheelie beast!!

Lol well that's one way to get it done, how many miles on that Evo?

@@GixxerFoo 28767 miles garage kept one owner complete with maintenance log owners manual and shop manual.

That's a hell of a deal, one owner with all the documentation and the manuals is hard to beat!

@@GixxerFoo I was lucky the guy who bought it new was an old guy like me and took great care of it. The only change he made was he upgraded the exhaust. He had sold it to move out of state. The guy who bough it had a issue with his wife and returned it the day before the guy was moving. He called me and i made a stupid low offer and he took it. Best bike deal I made in 40 years.

😮 wow! Dang l could never get that lucky to fall into a deal like that!

Oh I agree, as much time in development as Harley put into it you think they would've caught those issues before it was released.

The problem is not the company it is the persons who buy the bikes only lawyers and doctors can afford one LoL seriously the problem lies with the service most people just hop on it and expect it to run forever maybe only stressing to change oil but a bike of any model requires MASSIVE service heck most European bikes require valve adjustment the average blue collar American including the poser grungy bikers guys would cringe at the idea of tear down to do regular service on intervals these are the same guys that can not lite a pilot light or fix a water leak my point is these bikes have 20, 30, 40, 50k miles with no real service performed they just get started revved up rode like heck & then the owners whine cause it has problems an analogy would be if I drove a car & never changed brakes heck eventually it will be a problem

I completely agree, fluids are important but you still have to take a wrench to every nut and bolt. Throughly inspect and listen to every little sound on the bike. Don't put off fixing a little noise that sounds odd. Loose metal likes to travel in those motors.

I think Harley thinks, "planned Obsolescence" in design parts like failing timing tensioner pads! H-D would have started out with gears an had no problems in first place!

EPA was the reason they went with the chains, noise reduction to satisfy the feds.

That's awesome! You've got your money's worth out of that motorcycle! That's the best part about a Harley is being able to keep them forever like that. You made one hell of a cross country trip on that bike, that was back before the bagger craze and thinking you need a giant touring bike to make trips like that. You've got the key to the longevity, just fix what it needs and keep on going. Harley doesn't build them like they used to like that 88, nice to hear you're hanging onto it!

@@GixxerFoo Thanks for the "Like" and for your thoughtful comment. I have to confess though...in 2007 I traded it to a dealer in NJ for a new Road King which I hated from the moment I brought it home. First model year of the TC 96 & the six speed transmission. Absolute horror show on wheels. Noisy fifth gear and the bike ran so hot (fuel injection) that I couldn't stand the heat at a stop sign or light. The made the engine bigger but it still had the same EPA constraints. Wrote to Harley-Davidson, their board of directors and to anyone who would listen about how much I hated this bike. I wanted it to work for me. I was so used to the Softail that perhaps I didn't like the balance of a touring bike...I don't know. But I pretty much scolded HD for putting bikes out to production with such inherent issues. I did the homework and discovered I wasn't the only one who was angry over this. I chose NOT to live with it. One day I get a call from the GM at the Harley store where I purchased the Road King. She invited me to come in for a conversation. Well. it wasn't just with her. Every manager in the joint sat in at that meeting...Service, Sales, Parts, even motor clothes! Each concluded the same...buyers remorse. I told them no way. Like anything else, when you're in the show room you get carried away and a fellow rider friend convinced me it was time to "move on up". I was offered free oil changes, motor clothes, heat shields and some bling to trick it out a little. I told them none of that was going to improve the The GM then pulled a woman's point a view by smiling and saying..."But Mike, It's such a pretty bike!" Where I replied, "yeah, it is that. But you can put whipped cream on a piece of S__T, it still ain't a cupcake..." Her sweet smile turned to a grim business face and asked, "What do you want then?" I said, "My Softail." She turned to Mr. Sales and asked if they even still had it, he checked the inventory and, yes, it's in the warehouse. I said go ahead and re-write the contract from the Road King to re-sell the Softail back to me. THAT'S how desperate I was. She said, no, we won't do that. Instead, she re-opened the balance of what I owed on the Softail, added a $1,000.00 depreciation and offered me a six year ESP. Done and done. I had tears in my eyes riding Ol' Blue home and still with me 13 years later. Thanks for letting me share.

I don't blame you at all for getting your old bike back! Yeah l gotta be honest that would of pissed me off if someone said that to me a meeting. I have heard some dealer horror stories, there are some shady ones. I am very fortunate to have a wonderful local dealer, people come from all over to do business with them. They are really straight forward and honestly very small for a Harley dealer.