How funny that while James White brings a tulip, Tim Stratton brings flowers

2:20 I LOVE THAT VERY SLOW SLOW SCROLLING, FOLLOWED BY THAT LONG PAUSE AND SURPRISE OF JAMES HAHA! toooo funny

Dr. White offered an excellent rebuttal. I wish others in academia would exercise the same level of scholarly discipline. Well done! Respectfully. Dr. Carlos E. Rios

I’m very grateful for your time with this topic Dr. White. I am having a hard time understanding all of the key areas to point out the flaws of Molinism. I foresee that this will be a popular viewpoint coming against reformed theology in the coming years. Maybe another book incoming? 😄

"The secret things belong to the Lord our God, but the things revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may follow all the words of this law." Deuteronomy 29-29. This is a standard of us reformed christians and it should be for all christians too. If what the scripture says is not sufficient you are going to start looking elsewhere and come up with things like molinism etc.

I could have used all he has addressed over these past two weeks about 3 years ago 🤦‍♂️ I was being led down the WLC road, along with Frank Turek, and the like, but while listening to them / reading their books I was also listening to hundreds of Spurgeons sermons. Along with A.W Pinks book "The Sovereignty of God" and all I can say is that I followed what the Bible taught, and not what I thought it should teach in order for it to match my world view. Thank you James for these past few talks addressing Molinism and the like. Love you brother, and can't wait to chat when we meet in Glory!

Suffering is inevitable in both systems. The reformed view at least holds that God has a reason for the suffering that he ordains. The Molinist system like Arminianism has a view of God that makes his hands tied, and has him settling for damage limitation rather than actively working all things for his glory. It is man centred system and offensive to the biblical view of God's wisdom, sovereignty and power.

Everytime I hear complaint regarding Calvin's teachings, they often misunderstand. Then, when corrected, they usually just walk away bitterly having nothing to say or they still can't understand. I've met a good handful of men who went through bible college, having studied through the institutions of the Christian faith, who are unable to effectively communicate the doctrines of grace in their own words.

Excellent explanation, thank you. Praise God for His infallible word, of itself perfect. This was very well-articulated, sound teaching..in the power of the Holy Spirit.

That Jonathan Edwards quote was spot on!

I have really enjoyed this whole series defending calvinism over molinism. The "molinists" like to use big words in ways (in my opinion) to sound intelligent, but there is no substance. I guess thats what happens when you chum up to ivy league professors and put on "debate night with WLC" at Cambridge. The consistent molinst, as I've found with this series, is the most consistent arminian. That is to say they are consistent with open theism. There is 0 doubt anymore where Craig and his students stand in regard to their fundamental principles on what sovereignty means. They are without a doubt open theists and therefore should be disregarded as biblical "scholars".

Does anybody what book James is reading from? I know is an extract from "On the Eternal predestination of God" but is it part of a collection?

I just do not understand why some think that misquoting and misinterpreting historical pastors and bishops will 1. Honor God, 2. Love the brother they are citing and 3. Gain favor of the faithful over time. It won't.

What was the publication of the book, "The Eternal Predestination of God", when he read it in this vide?

This is yet another very clear example and evidence of the fact that those of the Calvinist prospective have always been sensitive to even the remotest possibility of being accused of making God “the author of sin.” This is something I have always deeply appreciated about Reformed Theology. It is derived directly from the text of Scripture, and allows Scripture itself to answer these complex and thorny questions. In this issue as usual, we find Scripture to be totally sufficient for everything we need for a godly life as God Himself made it a point to answer this question for us before anyone ever asked it. As I was leaving the “Church of Christ,” I was already seeing this for myself before I had ever read a word from Calvin on this issue. When I saw myself coming to the same conclusions as those dreaded Calvinists then I allowed myself to read directly from Calvin, Augustine, and even Dr. White. As I read their works and finding the voice of Scripture contained within them, I knew I had found my home. Calvinism simply is the best and most logically formulated explanation of theodicy that I have ever seen, and it is the best because it “speaks where the Bible speaks and is silent where the Bible is silent,” contrary to the opinions of the Campbellites.

A quick summary for anyone who doesn't have the patience to watch this. 1) Dramatically pointing out that the ellipses in Stratton's quote resemble the ellipses in Leighton Flowers' quote, and inferring Stratton is quoting "the bad guy". 2) Then what feels like 40 minutes straight of reading Calvin, with no real goal, organization, or explanatory coherence. 3) Concluding with: See? Calvin was nuanced. "He made distinctions. He was consistent." Absolutely failing to point out a single distinction, why that distinction is relevant, and how it actually maintains God's holiness. 4) Then quoting Jonathan Edwards, where he places the burden of proof on those claiming Calvinism makes God the author of sin. The burden being to define the meaning of "author of sin". Then concluding "See? Edwards was nuanced. He made distinctions." Again, zero attempt to point out a single distinction, why the distinction is relevant, and how it actually maintains God's holiness. 5) Attacking Molinism: since Molinists "can't tell [you] where they get these true subjunctive conditionals".

Ah, Leighton Flowers foiled again. It’s beginning to feel more and more like a bad episode of scooby doo with Leighton always being found out. 😂 Remember kids, Leighton doesn’t do sound research.

Kind of sad how they miss the point on God's sovereignty over good and evil.

Always starts with a wrong frame of reference. Total depravity states that a just God would punish all wrong doers. Which is all of us, so God is just to punish all. Not until this is understood will any recognize the magnitude of grace. Beelzebub has blinded many.

What book from Calvin is he reading from?

The exact same error is made in Kenneth Keathley's book, "Salvation and Sovereignty" page 144. Keathley uses the same, though shorter, quote from Calvin's "Concerning the Eternal Predestination of God". Following Calvin's quote, Keathley claims, "So Calvin makes the breathtaking claim that God is the very author of sin, an assertion that subsequent Calvinists reject." This kind of misquoting in order to disseminate anti-Calvinist propaganda is unethical! It is neither respectable nor academic work that they are doing!

You don't make it easy James, I'm 54, I came to Christ it's nigh on 10 years now. My life changed radically, it's a long story (and no I didn't have visions or hear voices) but though I have the academic title of Dr. it is in Philology and not Theology and having been a rabid atheist 12 or 15 years ago I've learned just about everything I know from you mostly. I have no Greek, I have Latin and other languages and it's hard sometimes when in my case I don't properly know Church history and so much more but I take what I can get. Mike.

First of all Craig admits Molonism is not derived from scripture but a manmade philosophical system imported onto scripture. Huge huge problem there. What Dr. Flowers parsed out from that quote from Calvin was "...who DOES NOT make wills evil, but uses them as He wills, while being himself UNABLE TO WILL EVIL". (9:59-10:06). God goes doesn't create fresh evil in the hearts of men, they already are! (Rom. 3:10-18) It's this constant misrepresentation of Calvinism that has us shaking our heads. To say that Calvinism is the author of evil shows a gross and total ignorance of Calvinism and John Calvin himself. White quotes Calvin "numerous citations" from Calvin starting at the 16:25 min mark that totally destroys Dr. Stratton assertion. But that's the problem with non Calvinist critique of Calvinism, they never read Calvinists! They'll create a strawman version of Calvinism and fill him with out of context parsed quotes from "former" Calvinists and the like. My non Calvinists friends read the 1689LBCF, WCF, Calvin, Berkhof, Pink, Palmer, Sproul, Edwards, etc. Get a proper and comprehensive understanding of Calvinism then bring your case forward. God Bless

Wait… what? From what I heard, by the 11 minute mark, the quote from Leighton was spot on. Nothing you read even contradicted the quote…

Imagine making charges against a christian brother like at the start of this video, that are so baseless and untrue, just to advance a false narrative and poison the well. How can these men live with themselves knowing how the Lord feels about false witnesses?

I love how after lengthy readings of Calvin and edwards, with all their refined thinking and articulation of complex ideas, the videos ends with “……we’re cool….” So funny. Thanks for your time, effort and talents Dr. White!

God calls His elect out of all false gatherings. He will deliver His sheep out of Mormonism, Hinduism, atheism, Buddhism, Jehovas Witlessism, Roman Catholicism, paganism, Molinism, Judaism and freewillism too. The ones on the outside will be left inside of those side door religious cults to remain lost and without....

Excellent rebuttal, even today

God is Sovereign. Period. Full stop.

I think many of these arguments stem from a wrong definition of what sin is.

How many molinists are alive on this planet currently? In what denominations are they usually found?

Help me think through this, we should clarify what we mean by "Author of evil". The Bible says a lot about God causing and using evil to exalt his name and in his purposes. Does that make him its "Author"? Would another, less toxic title be more useful, more appropriate? God made everything, and nothing comes into being apart from him, and he uses evil and causes evil, so really what's so bad in calling God the author of evil? Why should we run from that? Maybe we should challenge nonreformed christians to squarely confront what the Bible says about this. Your thoughts?

Craig and similarly moved folks deign to absolve God of a problem from which He has never said He needs help to be absolved. They create the problem themselves, and come to conclusions in that effort that directly and manifestly contradict the Scriptures. I appreciate White's defense of classic Christianity, and enjoy these videos, but this is an old, old issue. This isn't some new thing. No more need is there than to turn to Paul, Augustine, Calvin, the WCF, Hodge, Warfield, Shedd, Dabney, Gordon Clark, etc. This has all been done before. This is well plowed ground.

Because they eisegete rather than exegete? 🤷🏻‍♂️

Ummm, I want White's sweater!!!

That’s laughable. The context didn’t help the slightest. Calvin was a confused babbler

Again, Dr. White doesn't answer the question, he deflects. Yes or no, does Calvinism believe God is the author of sin? If no, why not? This isn't that hard, but he chooses not to provide a straightforward answer.

I honestly don't like referring to Sovereign Election as "Calvinism." Calvin did not write the bible. I have never read the works of Calvin but I have read and studied my bible for 27 years and I hear James White saying the exact same things I believe about God's sovereignty in election and regarding "free will" and evil. I also believe that while Molinists and Arminians accuse "Calvinists" of having a presuppositions, THEY are the ones who bring the presuppositions to scripture on who God SHOULD be. Which is more likely for the "natural man" to believe? 1. That God loves everyone, wants everyone to be saved and gives everyone an "opportunity" OR 2. That God chooses some and not others, and that men are responsible for their rejection of Him (which is evil) even though He did not ordain them to believe? We KNOW that to the "natural" man gravitates toward the first because its "fair." We also know that the natural man will say the second is NOT fair! Which is exactly what Paul said people would say about HIS doctrine! (Romans 9:19) As R. C. Sproul once said, nobody will EVER make such an accusation against Molinism or Arminianism! This point alone should cause all discussion on which doctrine is biblical to cease forever! Unfortunately the "natural" mind will not allow for God's word to say what it actually says!

In your debate with William Craig you made a comment in the sense of "I prefer Reformed theology over Calvinism". Would you please elaborate on the differences between the two and why you hold your position?

that laught !!! 3:22

I get the feeling that anyone who disagrees with Calvinism is told they do not understand it. But Calvinists understand every other soteriological system. Can someone please tell me how God determines all evil and moves men to commit evil but does not cause it.

Dr Stratton accuses Dr White of making assertions and not arguments. Dr White answers with mocking Leighton Flowers, reading a long passage asserting that it's relevant but makes no effort to explain why. He asserts that Dr Stratton doesn't understand Calvin, but makes no effort to support the accusation. Dr White is an intelligent man, but his defense of Calvinism constantly proves his critics right and I no longer think White defends Calvinism for any reason at all except that he's too arrogant to admit that he's been wrong. If an argument could be made, certainly White would know what it is, but he constantly shows that his critics are right- he relies entirely on unsubstantiated assertions and personal attacks and refuses to even answer arguments, let alone make any of his own.

Molinism is kingless theology, God's word is true we respond to the lovely king

How do those who call the oppositions view of God "evil" expect to be reconciled to God if they are wrong? "Hey God sorry I called you the author of evil, turns out I was wrong, are we cool?"

I’m 8 minutes in And Dr. William Lane Craig say that the reformers didn’t derive their theology from scripture (paraphrasing of course)…

Let me get this straight, God doesn’t cause men to will sin but He inclines their wills to sin as an act of judgment and penalty for there sins? Listen closely, this is the crux of what’s being argued. I have one question, what about those first sins a human commits? Those determined by God as well? If so (which has to be the case in Calvinism) then how does the escape-claim of judgment apply here? Remember, we are talking about the first sin a human commits which cannot be an act of judgment against prior sins. Calvinism is no less an extra-biblical theory than molinism. Both theories attempt to explain what is not explained by the text itself. If both sides would just be honest on this point the debate would go much easier. 🙄

Sir, don't work yourself up too much about this topic. You took a stand on your tradition and Will offered his view. It was a productive and fruitful conversation between you two as brothers in the Lord. There are important differences in theology (mainly cuz of different approaches to Faith, Scripture and Philosophy) but secondary to the unity of the faith. It is wise to remember that and not stress too much about it. Peace of God to all.

All I heard in these 25 minutes is: 1) God determines all things, according to His will. 2) He is not the author of evil. 3) Don’t dare ask why or how this is so, for that is God’s mystery.

Thanks Uncle Jimmy!

Christians understand calvinism just fine.

What I love about this is that u debate among yourselves .. Let us heathens know when u have the awnsers..

James, Tim has taking his fashion sense from you. Are you his father?

09:33 MR white you read all that context in an attempt to refute MR flowers but it seems to me all you did was fortify his argument even further. All calvin does in the part you read is expand on the same exact point of the piece Dr Flowers has up on the website. The point is Calvin tought God is the author of evil. There's nothing there that refutes that or makes any sense of How than that would not mean God is culpable with men in their sin being the author of it.

Calvinism can't best explains reality of Christianity.

Calvinists seem to spend most of their time defending a set of doctrinal propositions or criticising the doctrinal propositions of other religions. If you actually lived like Christ and his apostles and the martyrs you might actually transform the world for the better.

So the quote was correct and more context only serve to show the not only is God the author of evil under Calvinism but God employs satan to work out his decree. I think we can put the “you don’t understand Calvinism “ to bed. Also note Dr. White has so far offered 0 documentation as to what Molina’s beliefs or what his motivation were.

So the Calvin quote was correct, you simply wish he had read more so it would feel more balanced? Then you go on to say be careful because Leighton is unreliable? I don't see how one follows the other. The quote was correct and nothing you read beforehand or afterword contradicted it. Where does God say that trying to reconcile freedom and sovereignty is a secrete thing that we should not try to understand?

so Leighton Flowers is a dishonest fraud? but he's such a nice guy! lolol he needs to retire

Woe comments open! 🥳

Well, look, some historical clarification is helpful. The "Molinists*" beef was with the "Jansenists," who WERE roughly stating some of the same things that the Reformers stated with regard to "efficacious" grace. And this wasn't the first time this debate occurred, being at least as old as Augustine vs. Pelagius and probably even earlier. And it certainly isn't going to end any time soon. We NEED (as brothers in Christ) to find sufficient doctrinal wiggle room to allow for differences of opinion here, on what amounts to a cosmic paradox--God who created all, knows all, even before it happens, and yet places upon us guilt for our sins, especially the sin of denying Christ. He foreknew our transgressions. This no one doubts. But is he then the "author" of our sin, and if so, how are we then to be held culpable? *Molina had developed an argument for free will which attempted to reconcile Scholasticism (Catholic traditional doctrine based on Aquinas) with predestination (as had been first affirmed clearly in the West by Augustine, and later elaborated by the Reformers, especially Calvin). If for nothing else but his attempt to steer a middle course and be something of a peacemaker in this hot issue, he is respected by thinkers even to this day.

God (to White when he gets to heaven): Yeah, you were wrong about the Calvinism stuff, but we’re cool.

God knew from ALL ETERNITY, that Judas would FREELY CHOOSE to not cooperate with God's saving grace and betray him. God did not force Judas to sin, just as God knew from ALL ETERNITY, that Mary would freely choose to cooperate with God's saving grace and allow Jesus Christ to take Flesh in her womb. Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink

Evil is not part of God's revealed will. He is not the author of evil in the sense that he produced evil, but by allowing evil He takes ownership of it and the responsibility for producing the ultimate good from it for His own glory and for those He has chosen.

Is the problem of evil a problem,,but that you live with your sin and your fine with it. Repent turn to Christ, be washed clean in the blood of the lamb

Matthew 10: 29 Are not two sparrows sold for a copper coin? And not one of them falls to the ground apart from YOUR FATHER’S WILL. Some will tell you it is the bird’s fault. But what about the greatest catastrophic event? Was God not in control of that? Matthew 10:34 “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. 36 And a person's enemies will be those of his own household. After God created all things and God saw that it was good [perfect] God planted a tree: “The tree of life was also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and EVIL.” Men did not know about evil but God did. Blasphemers are those that deny the Sovereignty of God. Iblīs was an Angel he was cast out of heaven because he argued with God why He created men who He made out of clay in His own Image with so much Glory. He said with more other angels to God: "You created them from clay and us from Fire why are we servants." we should receive more glory than they. God’s anger arose and Fire came from His Nostrils. The anger of God was never seen before. Michael and the angels on God’s side started war and threw Iblīs and his followers out of Heaven. Due to his fall from God's grace and jealousy he went to the earth to Paradise and deceived Adam and Eve to hurt God in the Crown of His creation. Iblis is often identified with Al-Shaitan ("the Devil"). It is a story from older manuscripts. The name Iblīs is derived from Ancient Greek διάβολος (diábolos) This or something very similar must have happened. There was no Devil on day 6 when God saw that all he made was GOOD. If God did ?? not predetermine things???? God The Creator of Heaven and Earth could have thrown Iblīs In hell in the outer darkness or even destroy/ Annihilate him completely. But no God let him go to the earth take upon himself the form of a snake and deceive Eva and then Adam by his own wife, God gave him. Did God just only know that it would happen? God already had a plan of salvation from eternity past, and that Christ our Lord would come and die for the sins of the world. The plan was not optional it was determent. God is all powerful and could have prevented them to eat from the tree. However sin was needed because for Christ to take upon Him humanity and die. the Creation was not finished on the 6th day but it will be when our Lord reveals the Glorious plan when the New Jerusalem comes down from Heaven. Joseph went to see his Brothers. What happened they were jealous of him being his dad’s favored kid. We know what happened he was sold as a slave to Egypt. He becomes the slave of Potiphar. His wife want Joseph in her bed. Joseph refusal end him up in jail where he reveals a dream and because of it he was called by pharaoh who also had a dream. He became the second ruler in Egypt. When his brothers came because of hunger in the world. Was God in Control of that? Joseph tells his brothers Genesis 45:5 But don’t be upset. And don’t be angry with yourselves because you sold me here. God sent me ahead of you to SAVE MANY LIVES. 6 For two years now, there hasn’t been enough food in the land. It was God’s plan even the drought God could have given rain. God knew that the drought would force Jacob and Joseph's brothers to Egypt and made Joseph go ahead of them. It's clear this was the plan of God! Jacob went to Egypt to move there and see Joseph again. God did NOT tell Jacob to start a mission post in Egypt. Did they not need the faith of Jacob if God wants them Saved? But instead God gave them their own territory the land of Goshen separated from the Egyptians. The Israelites became Slaves for 400 years. This the Lord already told Abraham It was not an option it was determent and instead of doing mission they started to serve the Idols of the Egyptians. God made pharaoh affright for the Israelites [or was it not God Who controlled even the tiniest thought of the Pharaoh if He can Harden his heart?] He started to kill every boy born to the Israelites. Because of it Moses ended up with the princes of Egypt and could have all the riches of Egypt but: Hebrews 11:24 By faith Moses, when he was grown up, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter, You get it God was in control of the weather and could have given rain so Joseph’s brothers would not have gone to Egypt. Pharaoh’s heart would not have been hardened and all first born in Egypt who did not know the left from the right hand not have died. All the calamities in the desert would not have happened. From the almost 2 Million people that left Egypt just a few entered the promised land. What about all the first born in Egypt who died because God hardened the heart of Pharaoh. All the army of pharaoh drowned in the red sea without the Gospel. And the order of the Lord to kill each other after worship of the Golden Calf. 3,000 were killed by sword instead of a temporary punishment to give them time to repent and being forgiven. This worship was because they went to Egypt were they learned serving Idol gods. Was that a good reason for God to let them kill each other? Or did God not have to give an account to anyone for what He does? according to Flowers and other anti Calvinist God was wrong. Daniel 4: 34 At the end of the days I, Nebuchadnezzar, lifted my eyes to heaven, and my reason returned to me, and I blessed the Most High, and praised and honored him who lives forever, for his dominion is an everlasting dominion, and his kingdom endures from generation to generation; 35 all the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, and he does according to his will among the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of the earth; and none can stay his hand or say to him, “What have you done?” It is time for Leighton to come to this same conclusion Just a period of drought created all this and Joseph being sold to Egypt. If God is Confused then Arminian Leighton and the other Palagians or semi Palagians are Right. If God is the All Glorious Lord Creator and the Alpha and the Omega the Begin of all things and the Ruler of all the earth and Do whatever him pleases. Better remember what Happened to Iblīs I say Iblīs and not Lucifer because that is the King Of Babylon and a wrong translation of the word Morning Star. While all is translated in English it is left in Latin. This is why the Mormons say that Jesus is the Brother of Lucifer. Revelation 20: 1 Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, having the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. 2 He laid hold of the dragon, that serpent of old, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; 3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more. Why now release Satan to deceive the nations? Did God just know? Where does it say that? Revelation 20:7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan WILL BE released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. “WILL BE” means it will happen BECAUSE of God’s Decree …Then the righteous will answer him, saying, “Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?” And the King will answer them, “Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.” (Matthew 25:37-40) those being Saved by grace did not know that what they did that pleased God. They knew themselves to be undeserving sinners. Only on the day the New Jerusalem comes down from Heaven we sure will know 2 things It was grace and grace alone I would have chosen dead if it would have been up to me. What God our Lord did was the MOST perfect plan men could never even imagine before it was revealed in Eternity. What about those born in Thailand, (where 93% of the population is Buddhist and 5.5% Islam) Can you even imagine how for them to find the Gospel by their own will. There are a few Christians but it needs a miracle of the Lord to become aware of the gospel.

Doesn't anyone grow tired of all these "LABELS?" Can't we all just, "GET ALONG?"

Dr White it is you don’t understand Molinism. You don’t even understand the objection to Calvinism in that it makes God the author of sin or you’re dodging the objection because WLC has actually explained to you the objection and even gave you an argument for it in your debate, making the premises very clear for you to refute, but you didn’t or couldn’t (maybe because God causally determined you so). If on Calvinism God CAUSALLY determines (not just decrees) people to sin or moves people to sin, then it is God who is morally responsible for those sins. When you hold a stick and use it to beat someone, the stick is not the author of the beating. The holder and mover of the stick is the author of the beating. Same thing if I program a robot to kill. Since the robot doesn’t act freely and is causally determined by me to kill, the moral blame would lie on me who programmed that robot. On Calvinism God is moving men to sin like lifeless sticks or causally determined robots which have no freedom of the will, and is therefore the author of evil that has the moral blame. In Molinism, God decrees what people would freely do by setting up the circumstances while not controlling, moving or causally determining men’s wills. God also lets people freely sin, right. But moral responsibility lies on them since they freely did what they did. So Molinism is unlike the stick or robot illustration because what you have are personal agents whom God endowed freedom of the will to -to do good or to sin. So even though God knows and lets these to happen, the moral blame is on the sinner who freely acted and not on God. So on Molinism, while God did make it possible for moral evil to take place, he is not the author of evil in the sense of causally determining sins. People freely sin and are themselves the authors of moral evil (moral evil being acting freely against God’s absolute will). So Dr White, it is you who don’t understand both Molinism and Calvinism! If you reject that God is the author of sin (like Molinists do), then you should reject Calvinism. 1. If Calvinism is true then God causally determines or moves people to sin. 2. If God moves people to sin, then God is the author of evil. 3. God is not the author of evil (Dr White agrees with this 22:08). 4. Therefore God does not move people to sin. 5. Therefore Calvinism is false.

The question I have for those that follow Calvin/White is that your Westminster Confession says that God is not the Author of Sin. Who then, is the Author of Sin? The Molinist offers an explanation to show how people are the author of their sins and not God, agreeing with the Westminster Confession. So how do Calvinists explain who the Author of Sin is?

Calvinism is a waste of time, the Bible is enough

Opens with his favorite, The genetic fallacy. 🤦‍♀️

That’s a COSBY SWEATER! Jimmy….?

And it all begins with one question: did God predetermine Adam to sin or just knew that Adam will sin… Were there no possible world that God could create where at least one of the first couple rejected the idea to go against God‘s clear order? If God knows all possibilities and chooses to create a world and reality with the best outcome then we simply must conclude that in no possible futures there was a world, where Adam and Eve remained pure and rejected Serpent‘s lie.

This is really simple. James, does any being (human or otherwise) other than God possess libertarian freedom? His answer would be no. If no other being has libertarian freedom, then no other being is the first cause or origin of their actions. If no other being is the first cause or origin of their actions, then they cannot be said to be the author of their actions. If they are not the author of their actions, then someone else must. If someone else must be, then that person must have libertarian freedom. If God is the only being with libertarian freedom, it seems to follow that He must be the author then of all people's action (good and bad).

At 6:18 - yes but the question is *HOW* does God move the hearts of men. Is it with Spiritual/Invisible strings of manipulation (like a puppetmaster) or is it by Middle Knowledge, and a divine plan of circumstance and precision, as the Molinist says? The advantage the Molinist has is that we can be sure that God is not the author of *SIN*. I still don't see how what Calvin wrote agrees with that assertion. I think he believes God is the author of sin and that that bible teaches that. But it's because he is assuming a specific way of God acting and controlling the circumstances that isn't explained in the Text of Scripture.

Grace (real) doesn't remember sin. Go ahead judge it does nothing except to you who remember.

I’m sorry but most of this is just you reading other people’s work and not actually dealing with the opening problem stated in the video you played. You can not explain how God is not the author of evil if he causes all things to happen. All things include sin so God would have to cause sin. Never once in this whole video did you answer that, again. All you do is attack Molinism to cover your failed theology and with arguments already refuted. The truth value of subjunctive conditionals is based on God’s knowledge and character. I mean you say you believe God knows everything yet think He could know what would be different possible outcomes of any event in history if any one factor was different. So God only knows that which He creates and not what is possible to be created? How did he plan the world before creating if He can’t know what is possible or what would happen before He creates? I suppose you would say he causes all things to happen so there is no need for knowledge since he has control. That control though makes God the author of evil and limits his omniscience. Even I can think of things that are subjunctive conditionals in my own life. I should say this now when my wife is busy, she would get needlessly stressed out. How can I know a statement like that to be true and act on it and yet God can’t?! So silly.

"we're cool" 🤣

It's good to make distinctions, but it's still true then, and White is admitting here, that God is still the "ultimate" author of sin and evil. Which, to me, is fine! It explains why he had to die - because he himself is guilty in all this! I feel like only people that want to suck God's d object to this and struggle really hard to just admit that God likely had no choice but to create good and evil together to create the ultimate universe. It strikes me as so childish how obtuse White and Craig both act about this - as if it's utterly impossible to understand the other's view and that their own view has all the answers. Silly. Be humble. Everyone's got a major problem in their view. No one can claim to be absolutely certain of possessing the perfect and coherent doctrine. Not that it doesn't exist or that truth doesn't exist - but we're only human and it clearly is beyond us. This childishness just kills me. Ugh.

If the Bible actually teaches this, why does it take volumes and volumes of philosophical and theological treatises to explain it? Why are people not coming to these conclusions directly from scripture, rather than from tomes of angry rants and argument from Calvin clearly reacting to specific topics and controversies of his day that are clearly influenced by much more that "sola scriptura"? This is a double-speaking, divisive, and destructive doctrine that only attacks and confuses genuine believers. It does nothing to be the hands and feet of Jesus to a hurting world to whom HE calls us to go. It simply ties us up in debates and controversies that do not further the kingdom on heaven on earth at all.

This is basically double talk. 1. Men cannot do depraved acts without God ordaining it. 2 . God doesn't control the men through "external" means. 3. God sends evil Spirits to make people do evil stuff. 4. He also does other stuff to influence the hearts of evil men. 5. After doing all this, God is not the author of Sin.. 6. But, when God does similar stuff to make evil men repent and do good.. God is the author, and glory be to Him alone. Why? Cos the Calvinists says so. Consistency, logic etc may be damned..

Ad hominem *IS NOT* an argument. But Uncle Jimmy still hasn’t resolved the contradictions. In a world where the Calvinist God is planning, authoring, ordaining, decreeing and predestining *EVERYTHING* it is axiomatically true that the Calvinist God *IS NOT* permitting *ANYTHING!* @6:30 --- So the Calvinist God is actively willing, by manipulating Satan to perform his will of evil! Which is consistent with hard determinism. @8:00 --- White is reading proofs mans thoughts, beliefs and actions are *CAUSED* by the Calvinist God; i.e. he is the author and cause of sin and evil. @13:00 --- None of that is an argument that fixes the contradiction. @13:31 --- John Calvin isn’t a reliable source for information. lol! @15:15 --- But Calvinists don’t have something they are trying to promote; i.e. their man-made theology. @16:24 --- @2015 --- lol! *”IF”* mans sin is voluntary *”THEN”* it is axiomatically true that the Calvinist God *IS NOT* sovereign as Calvinists define sovereignty, he *DID NOT* decree “all things” and he is learning as time passes. @20:45 --- White repeats that the Calvinist God uses Satan to *CAUSE* evil. @21:15 --- Just another contradiction within RT. No, it actually proves Reformed Theology is a morass of inconsistency.

Read and study the Bible for yourself stop worshiping the trinity of Augustine, Luther, and Calvin they are not the end all of understanding the Bible.