Thats coz Andor did not try to be Star Wars, or it might end up like post-OT Stars Wars (apart from Rogue One & TLJ).... and yes that includes the unWatchable PT LMFAO

@@chasx7062 you mean because it didn't try to the be Disney Star Wars, Andor, (and Rogue One) was perfectly in line with the feel of A New Hope And Empire Strikes Back.

It was shit

Andor sucked. Drawn out scenes then pew-pew action - rinse and repeat

​@@darrengordon-hillit sucked for you, it didn't suck for others. People are the ones who decide.

Absolutely. Ahsoka is bad on its own, but when compared to Andor, it's barely even worth mentioning. The difference between the two shows is night and day.

Andor had to be some happy accident because Ahsoka and Mando Season 3 follow the status quo of forcing characters into situations due to the sheer stupidity in the preamble set up, that was seen from TLJ. Every choice the characters make in Andor logically lead to the next section of the story without issue.

I'm very sure that the Ahsoka show was already written before Andor aired.

It learned only one lesson - put Mon Mothma in it (as played by Genevieve) She's made Mon Mothma her own - I'm thrilled for her, after ALL of her scenes were cut from Revenge of the Sith Now - thanks to Andor - we got to see how amazing a character she is; and so she's done voice-overs for some of the animated series and shows up in Ashoka (which is apparently a load of rubbish - except for including the best Mon Mothma ever!)

@@aadd2935 shit happens - it just adds to the believability ... because real life is not a sequence of logical events or "plot points"

Similarly, Kino Loy helped the prisoners escape while knowing all along that he couldn't swim. Such good writing!

I still think Andor is a bland character and the original character they cut into like 7 pieces for Rogue One, Kyle Katarn, is way better. Luthen was great on the other hand.

​@@GrivehnAgreed. I enjoyed the show and liked Cassian in Rogue One. But damn was he bland in this show.

Couldn't disagree more. Andor is not a hero in his own series, he's degenerate rat that is forced into position of no return against his will again and again untill he snaps and go full rebel. The very prison arc exists because Andor was dumb enough to attrct attention despite escaping law for years at that point.. Well, if by escaping you can call him throwing constant amount of his collegause under the bus to save his skin like a worthless pile of shit he is... What does he do to Kino when such says at the end part of their escape that he cannot swim? Abandon such cause he's of no use at that point.

@@dimas3829 Some of your word choices feel kind of loaded, like "degenerate rat", "piece of sh*t" and your insinuation that he was essentially looking for trouble by walking along a beach on Niamos, but I'm not going to go there... I can respect that you hold an opinion while completely disagreeing with it. Also, Cassian got knocked off the edge of the platform right after Kino revealed that he couldn't swim... it was involuntary. You really seem dead set on making him out to be a man of absolutely no worth and no character. I mean, he shot and killed Skeen because he thought the man was morally bankrupt. Cassian ensured the remainder of his colleagues would get their fair portion of the heist money. He befriended Melshi in prison and worked with him again in Rogue One. He rescued his lifelong friend Bix from ISB custody. There are more examples of his evolving character arc, but I'm guessing you couldn't care less.

Yeah given how they were falsifying crimes to acquire slave labour, they evidently didn't want anyone looking at those books. Combine that with Cassian using a fake name and the empire is rendered incapable of finding someone who is literally in their custody. Any of those other prisoners could have used a fake name as they were arrested and therefore might not even have a criminal record in empire controlled systems upon escaping.

To be fair to the Empire, he was admitted under his fake name Keef Gergo. There was no "Cassian Andor" in an Imperial prison record at the time he was in Narkina 5. But I do like the idea and it's one generally explored in the rest of the show.

Yeah man it’s ALMOST like it was well written by an intelligent and competent filmmaking talent huh? Weird…

Oh, for a moment I thought by “horrifying” you meant to say “how shitty that arc was and was such a dumpster fire” but as I read on I realized you were praising this hunk of garbage. Sorry if I actually thought you had good taste.

@@aadd2935 😆 Oh, wait, you’re serious. Let me laugh even harder. 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Don’t let r/EmpireDidNothingWrong see this

@@aadd2935 I'm sure this guy will then go on to praise Revenge of the Sith as an "underrated masterpiece"

@@nagger8216 I’ll let your comment alone speak highly of your ignorance.

I truly believe Andor is the piece of media that pays more respect and elevates the work of Lucas and the people involved in the OT. Andor is just amazing by it self but goes even further to give even more weight to origins of the franchise.

Andor felt like a Legends novel. That’s the best way to describe how I feel about that show. It was great.

Its not even about logical consistency per-say but maintaining the verisimilitude well enough to suspend the audience's disbelief. Characters can say or do things that are illogical but if them doing so has in keeping with that character's behavior as established in the story to that point. That's why what they did with Luke in TLJ didn't work for so many people because we saw him try to redeem his literally genocidal abusive father even after torture and threat of death, he does crack and lash out at Vader but only after being literally assaulted and mentally deconstructed and manipulated by Vader and the Emperor for hours, him pulling out and igniting his lightsaber in contemplation of killing his troubled nephew (who we never get any insight into why he was troubled 🙄 ) is just not in Luke's character and it very obvious Rian Johnson wrote Luke like that for the sake the theme he was trying to convey but he didn't earn that character moment. He took the quick and easy path of a lazy writing and doing so only served to highlight how much better the very same theme about learning from failure was better realized and conveyed between TESB and ROTJ.

@@Terminalsanity logical consistency can also mean about the in character actions

This is one of the things I love the most(among so many) of Andor, it elevates the OT even higher, Andor could have been content to just be a good series on its own, but it just go extremely far ahead and boost the OT over the stars. Now I cant see the OT the same way, now every pilot on a X Wing that die in that trench covering Luke has a tremendous weight

The contrast between Andor and the OT is part of the point. Luthen works in the grime and shadows doing what realistically needs to be done for revolution. For real change. Provoking the empire to commit atrocities for his own goals. Using and manipulating his own people. Betraying the morals of the side he fights for to give them a chance. And the only way to take advantage of that chance is to always have hope. You have to believe there's a light at the end and keep pushing for it or you may never reach it. All of Luthen's work building up the rebellion means nothing without Luke to fire the torpedoes and turn Vader. And Luke never gets the chance without Luthen's effort and sacrifice. Realists, idealists, heroes, antiheroes. Rebellions need all of it.

"A revolution is not a dinner party, or writing an essay, or painting a picture, or doing embroidery; it cannot be so refined, so leisurely and gentle, so temperate, kind, courteous, restrained and magnanimous. A revolution is an insurrection, an act of violence by which one class overthrows another." - Mao Zedong

Luthen isn't even really an anti-hero. He's almost more of an anti-villain. He is well aware that much of what he is doing is objectively evil, but he's doing it so that eventually the greater evil-the Empire-might be brought down. He knows that in situations like this, someone needs to do the dirty work, so he's going to do that to keep others from having to.

Proton Torpedos are not 'lasers'. They are actual physical torpedoes with an actual physical casing. Not every weapon in Star Wars is an energy weapon. Rockets and missiles are still used. I will agree with the rest of the sentiment that not every Rebel has to be a 'good guy' just as not every Stormtrooper was a 'bad guy'. Andor did a proper job with that. I will disagree that the Heroes of the Rebellion 'did nothing'. Remember that one of the key tenets of the OT was that 'Evil wins only if Good stands by and does nothing.' And yes, remember the OT was written during an era where Black/White morality was more widespread to drive that point home.

Honestly, I liked even more than House of Dragon, Andor is now my favorite series of Star Wars along in that line with the OT

Wow, you have very low standards.

​@@danyknight9107 Same, Andor is definitely up there with the OT (more specifically ANH and ESB) in terms of how much I like it.

I would say that, but I didn't discover Arcane (Don't ask me why) until September of 2022.

@@joycongod4831 That depends on what you define as art. Anything can be "art" in someones eyes even if it isn't intended to be art. Like a tree or a car. So from that perspective you're right. But from the perspective that art is something someone makes put of love, care and passion then there is bad art. Like the star wars suquels who were made only with intent to make money. They weren't made with love, care and passion, they were made with laziness, greed and deception. Therefore it is bad art. Again, you can argue that bad art is great art on a different level because it represents humam flaw and greed and yada yada yada, but that's not the argument here.

@joycongod4831 Art is both subjective and objective. Between two pieces of similar quality, the judges individual taste and interpretation will decide which is preferred. However in cases where there is a great disparity in quality, one can find universal opinions. If you are offered two meals by chefs, and one meal is undercooked and gives you food poisoning, then it is objectively inferior to the other meal regardless of one’s own personal taste.

@@waylander9265 exactly!

Everyone in this thread is varying degrees of wrong

@@rudolfambrozenvtuber Including you?

Andor infuriates me because THEY. CAN. MAKE. GOOD. STAR. WARS. and yet they pick writers and directors who refuse to.

Andor is to Kenobi what House of the Dragon is to Rings of Power.

whats your pfp?

Did u js call the mandalorian junk food? Season 1 is one of the best pieces of sw media out there

@@thefuriousfatty2297maybe he is talking of Mando S3 wich was horrible bad. Mando S1 was very good, it has not the complexity of the Andor wirting but it was consistent and logic, hell Mando S1 and Andor are the very proof you can have both type of shows, one for more older audiences and one for more young ones, but each of them with consistency and care.

Well said, especially the last point

I'm pretty sure that blowing up multiple planets at once *is* the vilest thing that happened in movie sw

This is probably the best breakdown I’ve seen of what was wrong with The Last Jedi. Personally I have always defended the movie and Rian Johnson, despite some very obvious problems that can’t be ignored I respected the direction he tried to push Star Wars in. It was a poorly constructed shoddy prototype for what Andor has succeeded at. Maybe we wouldn’t have gotten Andor without that movie existing. Regardless Andor is the best Star Wars media I’ve ever seen, I really hope they can recognize that more like this would be very welcome to fans

The last bit is the worst. Why doesn't Luke say "there's good in you, Kylo" at the end? He just seems to want to troll him then disappear. Not Luke at all. Horrible characterization

Then you must not have watch much TV/Film.

@@peterkrochmalni673Believe me, I've watched plenty, I just happen to find this episode more satisfying than most other things I've watched.

​@@peterkrochmalni673hey look a pretentious cockroach who thinks he knows it all

Had me in tears during the escape 😭😭😭 - not many shows do this

@@peterkrochmalni673well, it is a good episode. Well directed and wrote. I think there are a lot of prejudices about Andor for (maybe) being a spin-off from a spin-off, or just ‘cause it’s an Star Wars show. And the true is, Andor it is very outstanding in a lot of aspects.

@insane_troll It screams of a first draft and Rian Johnson having a case of Dunning Krueger. Lucas did the same thing with the Phantom Menance. Any writer worth their salt knows the first draft is there as a base. It’s never perfect and revisions and redrafts matter during the process to get the idea as close as possible. Ignoring how the sequels has no plan, what Rian did was horrendously irresponsible in not watching TFA and having complete control. Contrast this movie to something like Puss N Boots the Last Wish or even Arcane. The scripts for those pieces took time. Arcane they spent three years( six in total. Half for the animation; the other for the writing) and it shows. Quality comes from diligence, drive and a willingness to question everything and make what you do count. Rian didn’t do that. He was too much in his bubble and worse wanted folks to be divided. Woefully irresponsible for a tentpole franchise.

@@Avarn388 the difference between a good writer and a bad writer is confidence. the bad writer has too much of it, the good writer not enough. Which is why the good writers redraft constantly and obsess over the details, and Rian Johnson is giddy about how he just ran with his first draft....

7. If the speed of the Resistance fleet is limited, why didn't the First Order just surround them with all the Star Destroyers they have and turn them into Swiss space Cheese?

Why don't the rebels just take one of those frigates that dies doing nothing and have it hyperdrive ram that mega Star Destroyer thing. Why don't the Empi.. I mean the First Order do the same with some smaller ships. Why don't they build missiles that have hyperdrives? Why?

Why didn't the definitely not the empire have a few star destroyers tactically drop in ahead of the definitely not the rebelbfleet and sandwich them?

What’s sleep?

I never sleep. Just run.

250 millions on budget put to good use and on top of all that money insane levels of passion, creativity and care. Tony and his team get the most out of every coin. I can only hope that the initial low viewrship dosent stop S2 to reach the same level of S1 or fly even higher

just listen to yourself, "nearly perfect" ... just say what you feel! It's "PERFECT!" I want that word ringing in your ears!

@@jazzx251 you’re right, Andor is PERFECT!

KOTOR and KOTOR II came out

​@@JackdawMilesI think EU stuff like that is a whole different discussion. He's most likely just talking about the movies and shows

Even if the prequels weren't perfect, they at least told a complete story and allowed a whole new generation (2 generations actually) to get into Star Wars, and I think that matters.

​@@moneyandbonesWrong

VERY low bar

Too bad Gilroy is on the street striking with the WGA. We're strapped in for Hollywood production limbo for a long time.

@@aquapendulumHe didn’t have much of a choice. He tried at first to continue but the British joined the strike and then forced him to join it or face the consequences.

@@lembitmoislane. I think he made some declarations that before the Strike he had finished the Andor S2 sricpt and production was almost complete, is this correct? In any case am dying to see the S2 of Andor, I just cant wait.

@@danyknight9107 Yes he said that but the filming wasn't done and it's possible that while filming they wanted to improve some things in the writing. So now everything in that show has been halted.

I don't think that's the solution. I think there are a lot of good writers who don't want to work with Lucasfilm since it's just not a fun place to work anymore. They can't write Star Wars forever, they already said they don't want to. Proper change needs to happen for Star Wars to have a future.

What homework would Book of Boba need? He's completely different from all prior Boba Fett appearances... It's like studying from math, and getting literature exam. Neither Kenobi requires any homeworks from you, I don't understand what you're talking about??? Maybe Mando Season 3 does somewhat

@@user-yq9im9dk9z What!? Is this a freaking joke!? You HAVE to know who the hell obi wan kenobi is in the first place! You also need to know that Anakin Skywalker is Darth Vader and he attacked the Jedi Temple. You need to know that Leia is Anakin and Padme's daughter. You also have to know that Anakin and Obi-Wan have fought against each other in the past before Obi-wan has a Rematch with Anakin(vader) in episode 6. There's so much freaking homework that needs to be done for someone who did NOT watch star wars. Also you kidding me? No homework for Boba Fett? The Mandalorian literally appaears mid-season and they make references to season 1 of the mandalorian! If you don't know that, you'll be lost! You're a fool

@@nonbinarygenderqueerhomosa8820 watching previous movies and shows is not homework... That's just basic Star Wars??? Mando and Ahsoka are the shows that need homework because you have to watch multiple seasons of animated shows... Wtf is the fandom today if they don't know who Vader is? He's a cultural icon, even people who didn't watch Star Wars know who Vader is. Are you joking?

@@user-yq9im9dk9z You contradict your own statements. "watching previous movies and shows is not homework" "the shows that need homework because you have to watch multiple seasons of animated shows" Pick one. It doesn't matter if someone is a cultural Icon. People who have not seen the prequels will be confused and will not properly understand the meaning of the fight.

@@nonbinarygenderqueerhomosa8820 I didn't contradict myself, George's movies are Star Wars basics, not some extra homework

Is really infuriating, this "so called fans" are the ones that call the masterpiece of Tony Gilroy and his team boring and garbage. Andor was slow burn precisely beacause all the worldbuilding and character build up that make. You cant just see Andor with the brain off or half on, you have to see with all turned at maximum, paying attention to every piece of the beautiful dialogue. Just the dialogue alone and the iterations of the characters made the plot move, in Ahsoka nothing advances, is just very basic almost not functional dialogue where all the characters are this weird stoic personality

I enjoy both shows. Obviously, believe that Andor is far superior to anything else Disney has put out, but I can still find enjoyment in their different shows.

@@sirboomsalot4902 Yeah, there are definitely enjoyable aspects of Ahsoka, and I don't completely hate it, but as a whole it feels amateurish.

To be honest episode 3 has been my favorite but still I think andor is miles away I would give it a 6-7

Don't stress it these 'fans' are the same ones who were noisy about how good TLJ was, and then years pass and they have to admit they were wrong when public sentiment and the echo chamber that is thier social media runs out. Not many people are arguing TLJ to the end nowadays, most people just say 'yeah it sucked but I enjoyed it'. Longevity matters. These shows are fleeting.

Possibly not even by accident- might have been a script they got when they bought out Fox, for instance.

Maybe but I choose to believe that Tony and his team really take all the intention in this, remeber, Tony and Diego already where in Rogue One, Andor dosent seem like just a script abandon and pick up later, though, maybe some inspiration may have come from other sources, often writers take from every place and mold to make new thnigs, nothingcomes from the void. Eithe way am extremely happy that Andor got made with all tha quality

I have my own conspiracy theory. I believe the "Mon Mothma" shown in the show is an avatar for Kathleen Kennedy First - she needed to gain their trust. By churning out rubbish Star Wars year after year, she certainly achieved that! ("I'm seen as an irritation") But ... "when you see the rock in my hand, you miss the knife at your throat" She stole $250 million dollars from right under their noses - because they thought she was one of them, as we all did. We were all fooled. "you just walk in there and look like you belong". She used "Asohka" as cover for her crime of making the best Star Wars in history ... "perhaps you find my version of Star Wars too strong for your taste? ... Smile :))" I hope this is close to the truth - because otherwise - JUST HOW??? This was a massive project - and I believe word of mouth will make it a massive success for future generations. Nobody watched Bladerunner when it was first released - now an all-time classic

​@@jazzx251 if KK is that way, why couldn't she make every show a banger Star Wars show? Why keep degrading George's characters when she promised to protect them?

@@user-yq9im9dk9z Because it's her cover ... in order to steal $250 million dollars from the evil Disney Empire, she had to infiltrate them with weak-ass Star Wars shows to gain their confidence. It worked - she was able to walk up to them and say "I need $250 million" "What for?" "Star Wars" "Ok - there you go ..." She spat in their food on the way out ... Please let it be true! - you couldn't make up a better tragic redemption arc if you tried (except in Andor - lol) - I think Kathleen actually wrote Luthen's speech in episode 10: She knew that she was deliberately ruining Star Wars, in order for Andor to exist - and save Star Wars. The ends justified the means. "I have made my mind a sunless space I use the tools of my enemy to defeat them I sacrifice love, kinship, respect I'm damned for what I do, And will never see the light of gratitude I have sacrificed EVERYTHING - for Star Wars."

God no, please, I don't ever want to see Kino again. I love the ambiguity of whether he survived and made it out or not. That last scene with him and Cassian was perfect and I feel like exploring his fate in any way after that would completely ruin it.

Aka: the "future" our world is heading too right now at lightspeed, this series came at the most perfect time, look around you and let it inspire you when the time comes.

Big brain play.

Not really, you have the entire EU to rip off but then nobody even tried

Ppl tend not to like nitpicking bc so many of the ppl who nitpick r doing it in bad faith

Yeah, but then the rebels would have had the bomber fleet, and unless you knew about hyperspace tracking tech (WHICH YOU DID NOT), you could jump away all the time

@@chasx7062 Not sure what your point about the bomber fleet is, yeah the bomber fleet would have survived to be completely useless for a little longer before getting wiped out anyway. You think those slow moving and completely unprotected ships would have survived having to make an even LONGER trip to there target? Doesn't matter if he didn't know about hyperspace tracking. His entire point is that the ship is a fleet killer and that taking it out would save countless lives. He turned out to be correct much sooner than he thought.

@@williamcronshaw5262 Clueless Poe did not take out the Dreadnought BTW, his "useless" bombers and crew who risked their lives to take out ONE dreadnought, which the Empire could have replaced, rebuilt, or just mount the BFG on another ship !!! Fleet killer it was NOT, we never saw the Dreadnought do anything but two big blasts that didnt even kill the rebels on planet, since they "ran away to fight another day" which is the tactics of hit and run of a hyperspace jump? Duh !!! Star Wars fans are the Dumbest Mofos LOL

​@@williamcronshaw5262no he wasn't, more people died in Poes Bombing run than in Cruiser chase. Literally everybody was evacuated into the capital ship except for each ships Captian and they all made it down to crait, where the majority were killed by The battle. Had Poe not used the Bombers they couldn't used them on the surface to fend off the First order Forces approaching on land while the fighters and the falcon lead the ties away. Even the dreadnaught wasn't going to keep up, last Jedi showed us that physics in space don't matter and larger ships are slower meaning that Dreadnaught wouldn't be travelling any faster than the Supremacy was

@@Captianmex1C0 The only reason more people didn't die in the cruiser chase is because they were "just out of range." The Juggernaut ship that Poe destroyed, according to TLJ, is both a fleet killer and is equipped with "long range cannons" that can wipe out an entire base from orbit. For reference; assuming the resistance planet is about the same size as Earth, the distance between the surface and space is approximately 62 miles. That's extremely long range and the Juggernaut is quite a distance away from the planet's atmosphere so it would be even more than that. Considering how badly the resistance fared in the battle without the Juggernaut being present, had it been there they would have been completely annihilated. This is, of course, ignoring all of the other stupidity in these scenes like the fact that projectiles have unlimited range in space because there's no gravity or wind resistance to slow them down or the fact that the First Order could either have some of their fleet light speed ahead to cut off the Resistance or just call in reinforcements to cut them off. Or the fact that the Resistance ship is faster than the First Order ships because it's "smaller and lighter" even though, once again, no gravity in space means everything is weightless so mass actually has no bearing on speed.

So it's a contraction of _electro-_ and _execution?_ That'd make sense. What about _electrified_ as a compromise; to be clear he doesn't mean _shocked:_ the emotion.

​@@samwallaceart288Or "zapped" if you're low on syllables.

I feel like zapped implies a visible bolt of electricity arcing through the air and hitting someone. It doesn't seem right to me to call what the prisoners experience as being zapped. @@charlesruteal9062

Andor practically grabbed a defibrillation kit, turned the output to full power, and charged us almost to a third degree burn. We finally woke up and our eyes were opened, SW will never be the same and that's a very good thing.

Nah the heist was

If you have not watched Andor, you should. It is hands down great television...not just the best written and acted Star Wars. It stands in the same universe as The Expance, Breaking Bad, Game of Thrones and The Wire.

Andor, and so far Ashoka, are very good TV shows

It’s possible they have an entire prison for recycling prisoners into that’s stricter or worse than this one, in the opening shot of the prison it’s shown there’s multiple of them in one ocean. It may also be possible it was a genuine mistake showing their incompetence and that this is the first time it’s happened and to avoid further unrest they just killed all of floor two! Or at least that’s what I’ve theorised lol

You’re better off. That show is boring.

why? It's a streaming service designed for you to watch whenever you like It's not like the old days where advertising revenue from "prime time" shows would determine whether they lived or died. It's about demographics adding "value" to the service "Only" 1.4 million watched Andor in its first week - roughly in line with the disastrous Ashoka But those 1.4 million are going to tell their friends about a great show they watched That adds value to Disney's brand - hence why they think upping their prices massively was justified And it's not like "the Star Wars demographic" either ..... it may be true that people like me, and perhaps yourself, never watched Mandalorian or Boba Fett, but heard good things about this show that we never had any intention of watching If that's true - then we ADD to Disney's viewers, on top of the casual Star Wars fans that just want to see some light sabres; - and with a prestigious show like this, add value to the brand. So - they have existing Star Wars candy-coated rubbish for the kids (so they think) - and Andor for the grown-ups (so they think - my 7-year-old self would have loved Andor WAY more than any other Star Wars, and my schoolfriends as well)

No I’ve seen the show now and it’s really good. Something being “boring” is not a qualifier of the show and only speaks to your attention span.

I’m just saying I wish I watched it so I could talk about the show with everyone else while it came out instead of after the fact.

@@ActuallyAndrewYT if you had watched the first episode alone, would you have still wanted to wait for the next week to watch the second episode?

Which is why he couldn't be allowed to leave- when it comes to plot, Andor uses "therefore" and "but," TLJ uses "AND THEN...!"

Exactly. If he wasn’t talking to the galaxy’s most stubborn, know it all, Uber feminist, he’d have been able to communicate that all he was doing was leaving to warn their most effective warrior that they were in trouble, the rest of their convoluted plot to make Holdo a hero would not have been able to unfold because Luke and Ray would’ve come to their rescue while Poe would likely have pivoted to a plan that was dependent on someone focused on saving their friends instead of an idiot who gets caught up in rescuing a bunch of horses (still blown away that Holdo was considered a hero by the rebellion, instead of a deserter who was 99.999% likely to escape to light speed with her very own warship without being tracked because the empire was sidetracked with murdering all her friends escaping to the planets surface… Admiral Holdo- unluckiest deserter in the history of galactic warfare)

If that happened, Rey wouldn't be manipulated by Kylo. Maybe Finn could discover he had the Force faster too. If Rose let him leave, the only one who would be worse off would be Kylo Ren and nobody else.

At least in Andor, people stay dead, and those deaths have consequences.

This. Deconstruction done right vs bad

TLJ doesn't have a problem with deconstruction. People expected things, and hated that Rain didn't make that things (Rey being nobody, Luke being a human being with flaws and not a demigod always perfect, the idea of burning the old things). A TLJ as the fans would wanted was the worst idea of all

The issue with that is, don’t try to do something new to an existing 9 part series. You’ve basically just said F everything, fans, stories, etc. make your statement about something new.

@@stazeII I am old enough to remember that this was criticism leveled at The Empire Strikes Back too, lol! Some people just wanted more of the familiar story. How much came before almost doesn't matter.

@@douglasbaker9663 that's fair. But Empire didn't shit all over everything established in ANH. Rian decided to shut throw out everything from TFA and before it and say "to hell with the fanbase"... and then left whomever directed/wrote episode 9 to do something with it. Honestly, I mostly blame leadership at Disney/LucasArts for not actually having enforcing some overarching plot for the final trilogy. That's on Kathleen Kennedy or whomever.

It is a little more original than TFA, although it's largely a copy of ESB. But everything it does is done with the subtlety of a meteor

@@stazeII What exactly did TLJ "throw out" from TFA? Just because he didn't made your theories from TFA come alive in the way you hoped to, doesn't mean he didn't acknowledge it? I'd argue he respected everything in TFA and approached in the best way a second movie in a trilogy can do - by focusing on the characters. - Rian writing Luke as a hermit, is literally him trying to come up with an explanation to why JJ placed Luke on a remote island and hiding from the war. - Rey's parents revealed to be nobodies, isn't a middle finger to JJ and the fans that hoped her to be someone special. It's the complete the opposite. The fact that Rey (and the fans) were hoping that she would be related to somebody we already knew, is what makes the reveal that they're nobodies so much more powerful and meaningful for the character of Rey It's Rian saying that Rey has to stand on her own two feet and create her own story to be special and not depended on her heritage. - Rian didn't throw away Finn's character. He literally gave him a complete side story that wasn't depended on Rey. In TFA, Finn was obseesed with saving Rey and fleeing the first order. Rian he didn't saw him as a rebel at the end of TFA, which is why he made him go through a journey of choosing what side he wants to fight for and for what ideels. - Neither is the fact that Snoke was killed in TLJ an example of where Rian "threw away" the setups from TFA. It was an awesome choice for the further development of Kylo Ren's character. If there's anyone who didn't acknowledge the movie that came before it, that would be JJ in the rise of skywalker.

Thank you, I've had a similar thought process. The plot points and themes of TLJ could have worked if they were logically consistent with the movies that came before and the plot gave the characters an opportunity to present their perspective naturally. The plot was so contrarian it becomes predictable and the characters just say what their thinking, no nuance or intrigue. I've never seen such an unengaging film garner so much controversy.

@@diemes5463 I'll never forget walking out after first seeing it and thinking 'something feels off, did I actually like that movie or not?' and then it hit me that I simply didn't care about anything that happened in it. The whole film is just very grey and dark which I don't think helps, but then the actual story was paper thin, on top of being badly executed. I was so hoping it would take us to new interesting worlds, build out it's own lore and really break the mold, instead it just stalled upon arrival.

For your last criticism, since the scene ends with the workers grabbing their gloves and all getting on a transport, I think the whistle blowing was a signal for their shift to *begin* instead of *end.* They could leave their gloves outside to dry while waiting indoors, and the whistle would tell them all that the transport has arrived to take them to their worksite. That's my interpretation at least. But I agree with or at least understand your other criticisms. Even great shows are rarely perfect.

@@darienwest4748 - it’s mostly the pacing one and that they let go of the search for his sister plot that bug me the most… but it’s still great 👌 and about the gloves… it would make sense they grab their gloves to start a shift, but they all come out of the door at once and scatter. one guy on the little speeder lift does say “come on, let’s go!” to Brasso, but it seemed like that was just a shuttle home 🤷🏻‍♂️ the gloves are meant to be like the tags that miners put up on the board before entering the mine, so if there’s an accident, they’ll know the ones whose tags are still on the board must still be in the mine… it’s a cool reference, I still just think they got it backwards, or chose a silly item to replace tags.

I assume Tony is going somewhere with the whole sister thing in season 2, because I feel like it could be so easily removed from the story, so there must be some more importance to it. for Karn, I really liked his arc, but this is a subjective thing, so I can maybe understand people not liking his arc as nothing of note really happens. For me I really like Karn because we see what kind of person he is in the first 3 episodes, and then we see why he is that type of person. He then further spirals and becomes obsessed with the empire. Obviously, his arc isn't complete and it's quite obvious that his arc in season 1 is completely just set up for whatever he will do in season 2, so I am very excited for whenever that comes out.

The sister part was addressed by the show? She was there originally as a way to start off the whole conflict by giving andor a reason to be at that bar thus attack and kill the guards and ultimately have to flee the planet so that's why she ever existed explained. As for what happened to his sister then mother figure says to him when he is leaving after the heist and pre prison arc to forget about his sister she never made it out alive, andor was the only survivor and the idea of his sister was always just to make his home being wiped out less painful. Before being told this news about his sister he was busy preparing and then doing the heist, after being told this well he had no reason to look for her since shes yknow, dead, so he settled down on the beach planet before being caught for a crime he didn't commit and from there prison arc etc

@@declangilmour8184 - Maarva (?) told Cassian to give up the hope of finding his sister and accept the fact that she was almost certainly dead… but that was _after_ the Aldhani heist, and it wasn’t a fact, just a likely reality… and Cassian doesn ever really take that advice to heart, at least not where the audience can see. I’m not expecting his sister to show up finally, alive, in the present… I just wanted him to acknowledge that she’s likely dead, and then maybe use that as motivation for actively fighting the Empire, rather than looking out for himself. one more flashback would’ve been nice (but the flashbacks to Cassian’s childhood didn’t have subtitles, so whatever 🤷🏻‍♂️), or even just a conversation about her with Bix or something would’ve been fine.

Just finished the video and needed to add on that you did a great job with this one as always. It has everything I love. Sheev’s perfect voice, cinema discussion, Andor praise, and TLJ criticism

My thoughts as someone who watched Clone Wars is that after several seasons of clones becoming close to their Jedi commanders and deciding that good soldiers DON’T just follow orders, when they were given the order most of them (especially the higher ranking clones) would’ve refused because they’d question why apparently the entire Jedi order has turned against the Republic. They’d investigate; they’d ask their commanders why some would betray the Republic. Even if the evidence that Palpatine was evil never turned up and he managed to convince the Senate that the Jedi are trying to take power, it would give the Jedi time to be more prepared. Instead of the entire order being wiped out, they’d scatter and vanish; assuming they don’t convince their troops that Palpatine’s up to something. While thematically, Order 66 can be seen as the Republic blindly walking to its doom, in story Order 66 is about wiping out all the Jedi in one fell swoop so they can’t stop The Sith from ruling the galaxy.

@@cybertramon0012 but thats not how Humans work though, it takes more than just a feeling of something ain't right for you to want to willingly forfeit your life, besides you are watching it completely through a Obi-Wan and Anakin lense. Not all Jedi was so close to their clones and in many cases clones could quite easily feel like their life was meaningless and nothing more than a tool for the Jedi or Republic to win their war aka that they are to the Jedi what clankers are to the sith. Besides most Clones never ever got to even talk to a jedi let alone to befriend them and as i said Authority has a way of making people forego any higher thought about their action and morality and instead just obey, there are 100's of such experiments like the shock experiment where participents quite litterately could hear the pained screams of those who they thought they were shocking/torturing but kept doing it anyways because the experiment ''officers'' ordered them to do it, very few stood their grounds and resisted and even then it was only long into the experiment where they had already ''shocked'' the person lots of times, truth is in reality people aren't as fast to oppose bad people and deeds esp when they feel directly threatened or like their lives are on the line. Also Clones where more Loyal to the Republic than to the Jedi, and some Legions didn't even have a Jedi as their leader and General, esp planetary defense Legions and corps, like fx the Coruscant Guard. In real life the events of order 66 could happen exactly as they did for so many reasons, but just as in how the story used to be there would have been quite a few Jedies who were spared or even saved by the Clones and whom had their Clone troopers join their side due to the bond they shared, but yeah it is a quite likely scenario and we have seen these events unfold 100's if not 1000's of times before in our history as i have mentioned. esp when 2 groups of authority within a country split up and start vying for control, aka Civil Wars. this time 1 group was just a lot more prepared and thus instead of an actual civil war it just ended with a slaughter which btw we have also seen many times before irl and btw many times some of those who participated in the slaughter of the losing authority group was their own surbodinates themselves just like here with the Clones.