You are the first shooter I have heard say, "I welcome the change"? All, including myself are not impressed by the product, or implementation/manipulation tactics of certain shooting organisations and the sheer lack of science behind certain statements, and claims.

Agreed

I have been shooting Winchester Super X steel shot loads for a long time and I haven't had any damage to my shotgun.

@@Phoenix_Atlas Same here, My Winchester Supreme O/U has digested many hundreds 3" magnum steel loads without any damage to either barrels or chokes. Full chokes with steel shot should be avoided and steel usually patterns 1 choke size tighter with steel over lead. I typically run Mod/IC in my particular gun. A thin walled barrel would be the true test with the un protected steel, the 1300 Winchester has a barrel profile that is nearly as thick as a rifle.

I have a feeling that when steel started to become a thing, gun manufacturers didn't change anything about their guns, they just steel proofed the guns they were already making.

Did that as well, but shot normal nitro steel cartridges and after a few shots the gun wouldn't open for a while ... sold the gun ...

I shoot steel shot in my Mossberg 500 no problem. I even shot ball bearings with no problems or damage.

Thin walled barrel, I have seen the same with pre mid 70"s Auto 5's

Actually, that's been known for about a century with some continental makers deliberately honing their barrels lengthwise for tighter patterns.

aoe76 thanks for your life’s story but I couldn’t care less about Denmark or what you do there or don’t do there ,this is the uk 🇬🇧

I have been proven wrong on this, it is low carbon steel according to the maker of the shot. Still very soft compared to the barrel.

​@@CandidZuluthanks for this information

It is wrong though, its' steel, very soft steel.I talked to a manufakturer of steel shot.@@sdriza

chris jebb BASC and pals have dropped another clanger. They probably did some deal behind the scenes and thought they could simply impose it on shooters and cartridge makers. Not going to happen without a change in the law. I’m certainly not using plaswads under any circumstances so no steel for me in my English game guns.

Sacs response . SACS CLARIFICATION STATEMENT ON LEAD SHOT Following the joint announcement today by the UK’s leading shotgun cartridge manufacturers, SACS wishes to provide further clarification on its participation with the joint statement released by the nine shooting organisations in relation to the proposed five-year transition away from lead shot for live quarry shooting.  It is SACS’ understanding that the trade and cartridge manufacturers were consulted about the proposed transition and that the Gun Trade Association itself had engaged with its relevant trade members. Furthermore, the GTA provided the organisations with a guidance document, which we shared with our members and community at the time of the announcement on Monday. SACS signed the joint statement on this basis. The issue over lead shot cannot be ignored; it is a genuine threat and SACS wishes to work collaboratively with other shooting organisations AND cartridge manufacturers to find a suitable solution and way forward for all. SACS is a grassroots shooting and country sports representative body that exists to support its members and stands for integrity and truth. The hard work and commitment from the SACS team is self-evident, from individual member help to national scale advocacy. We work proactively with our members’ best interests in mind, addressing difficult - and sometimes controversial - issues. It is our duty to make our members aware of these challenges and to find practical and timely solutions, in partnership with other bodies where appropriate. Our committee position is clear: lead shot faces serious challenges, which we have all known about since at least 2010. There is acceptance from all organisations that alternatives to lead exist and can be further developed, though clearly that must be in a realistic timeframe. No-one is better-placed to judge that timeframe than the cartridge manufacturers themselves. SACS members with any questions on this matter are welcome to call 01350 724228 or email info@sacs.org.uk or send a message to the Facebook page.

We interviewed BASC this evening - film to come tomorrow morning. No statement on the cartridge manufacturers stance, as it was a little fresh!

@@myleschilton3473 Yes, the correct term is dropping a bollock, or more aptly, going off half cocked. What a shambles.

Listen to the manufacturers, you should have consulted with them first!

I presume this may date back to a time Of much harder steel shot, and at some point we may do some video testing to see what happens. Just need to sit at a bench and load a few!

@@tgsoutdoors The information i found refers to steel with a Vickers hardness (hv) of >40.

They measured identically - they were pretty poor on manufacture, and remained the same after use

TGS Outdoors This is good news.

We have made some phone calls to look into getting this exact interview

Are carpet tacks non toxic?

@@tgsoutdoors No, but his carpets are really well fixed, if a bit oily :D

Is there much left of the carpet by the time it has been laid?

so what do you do with your lead shotshells? I am over in Pennsylvania. Never bought any steel shot and dont forsee doing so...do you sell your lead shotshells on gunbroker?

keystonecountryboy We can still use lead for clays. I gave away to my AZ friends my lead hunting loads.

Quite possibly, but the fact they count score and shred after a singles shot is contrary to what many believed. We may do more extensive testing on this in the future to see what a good amount of ammo does to a barrel.

I have shot steel through a rizzini which was my first gun when they first brought in the ban in about 2010 for wildfowl. But did find that after several years with not a lot of use that the action came of the face.And am convinced this was the cause so went over to semi auto. Great channel love the film quality keep it up.

Get your loading press out, make 1500 and I’ll shoot them!

TGS Outdoors I’ll load 1500 for ya but seeing as I’m American their gonna be 1 3/8oz 3.5” but kickers.

@@roeng1368 Wow man, ya'll are having it tough in the UK. I'm in the US and have never hunted waterfowl but the closest shotgun range to my house only allows steel, non toxic shot..... even though the range is right across the street from a landfill and also in the middle of a protected wetland where I hunt turkey.

These were super high performance

@@tgsoutdoors i shot 4-5 high performance steel and still it was fine but i dont think i will keep shooting high performance steel.just gonna stick to standard steel

THE man.

I hunted ducks with a browning citoire 1977 full improved mod, made in japan. I still question if anyone really knows the impact on my gun. Browning said that my gun was capable of handling steel however a full choke is not recommended. I didn't even give a @#$!@ back then what i shot as long as it was the right shot size and load.

That is a good idea, might buy a kit I do believe these barrels are chromed.

Why not?

Bismuth is available but it's very expensive, just as tungsten matrix is.

@@TurinTuramber Its expensive here as well about 3$ a shot for my 10 ga 2 7/8 . However it's still cheaper than ruining a vintage sxs.

its about £3 a shot upwards in the UK and if you did a 250 bird day pheasant shoot shooting maybe 100 cartridges that's a very expensive day out (£300)

@@captaindoughnut3356 Here in the States we have a company that makes ammo specifically for damascus guns called RST . Doing some conversion their 12 bore 2.5" bismuth would run £2 a shot . It may be expensive but its still cheaper than damaging a antique/vintage sxs . We dont have pheasants in my part of the country but we do have quail . You would be looking at £2000 for a quail hunt here and thats not including ammo .

Bismuth is a safe alternative for these

@@Tuton25 but 6 times more expensive...

@@Tom-gl1iw because a Purdey owner is bothered that a cartridge costs £1 instead of 20p, I don't think so

@@robfnet I am

Some of the alternatives to lead cost over 2k a thousand. Not everyone is lucky enough to shoot a purdey or holland, but a lot of really lovely middle of the road guns will be made obsolete with this rubbish.

Hi Andrew, reading your question I wonder if you`ve slightly missed the thrust of what we were doing. The cartridges we used had no protecting wad whatsoever. The steel shot was in contact with the bore from first to last. It was no4 shot which is small enough to move about through any choke constriction. The problems with "bridging" may occur with much larger shot which is why the regulations mention a change in status when using shot sizes larger than no3 in standard steel or 4mm, roughly 1 to bb, in High Performance. Have a read of this basc.org.uk/download/63109/?fbclid=IwAR1WJlvQMHB0oqQg8zBkimfGITnJZI5Q1DEbKD_6mEQfvFHA8OmqtEwO4Vc regards, Nick.

But that choke was proffed for steel

But he's shooting 3 inch number 2's , if anything is going to clog and blow the end of his barrel out it this , no ? Especially through an extra full choke, or am I just being extra thick??

Yes, but the ammo you buy has the protective cup in the wad vs. this test.

Interesting

@@tgsoutdoors tungsten super shots which is amazing, it's using by federal tss in the USA ,bismuth shot is more softer than TSS.

Yes both Kicks and some Carlson chokes are available here in the UK, I shoot a Benelli Super Nova with Kicks full with Gamebore steel loads to good effect. The problem is with my Berreta game gun ,30 years old and no steel shot proof, What can i get away with? Are standard steel truly all i can put through it??

philip nesfield I’m not sure but I’ve got a Vinci and I shoot a full carlsons choke with hevi metal #3 shot 3” which is a really good American load. I have great success even past 70yds.

@@morganyoder4277 We could certainly do with some of your American loads over here but the CIP regs dont allow it F##k knows why !!

I’ve had a gun with a chrome lined barrel for a while now. I know it’s more smooth than steel but is it also less prone to scratching(harder)? I shoot a tungsten steel combo and haven’t gotten a scratch yet so maybe it’s true.

@@morganyoder4277 on a fibre wad?

full

If that were true, River rocks wouldn’t be warn smooth from water flow.

@@dgoodman1484 there is no barrel in the world that does not wear with use, no matter what it shoots, lead, rubber, steel, bizmuth, The question is will you shoot enough for the barrel to wear out. Some pro skeet/trapshooters shoot enough to do it but those guys spend more ammo in s month then most shooters do in decades.

Hahahaha me too

non-plastic wads!!! That's the one thing we should all be able to agree on, we don't need to be firing plastic all over the countryside. The fibre wad has been just fine for a few hundred years. And biodegradable shot cups are slowly becoming more available.

Tor Crawley yes fine but modern guns are back bored and there there is a issue with fibre sealing as they go up the barrel , so you are saying we should sell all new guns and go back to muzzle loaders. Or may be there needs to be a effort made by the powers that be to take a long careful look in to it before they jump.

If that hadn’t, we would have felt more foolish than a £100 pumper!

@@tgsoutdoors is the matching one you have for sale?!

Afraid I am emotionally attached to both!

It is difficult to destroy a pump with anything other than stoopid loads. This is why they are handy for 'scientific' purposes 😁 I also maintain that if it fits down the barrel you can fire virtually anything out of a 12g

Lead is not good in the nature.. nothing wrong in caring for our kids future health and the nature. I have hunted in Denmark for 18 years only with steel, nothing wrong with that. Use bigger shot sizes and don't shoot 60 yard birds (most people can't make clean kills consistently much past 40 yards anyway) Kind regards a happy "steel hunter"

@@salkinjensen I appreciate your input but I have witnessed too many crippled birds with steel in the uk. Lead shot kills more efficiently and to be honest with all other commercial pollutants lead shot is not even in the same ball park. Here in the uk it's purely meddling by antis the enviroment is nothing to do with it. We are constantly being crapped on by our shooting organisation and our political masters. The science does not match the uk risk levels at all. Anyone eating shot game will avoid or remove any visible shot from the meat. I just don't see the need to meddle. All the best mate. Tony

@@salkinjensen I have been shooting game and clays for 30 years with lead, i have not grown a second head, or any other side effect. Its lead, not radioactive asbestos.

@@roeng1368 well, my mom has smoked cigarettes for 45 years, and she has, like you, not grown an extra head, so I guess smoking isn't bad for your health. I agree that steel isn't as effective as lead, but long therm exposure to lead, is worse than reduced range in hunting. In a study about reproduction, several females has been tested for lead content in blood tests, and a big part of them had lead in them. (This was not due to lead pellets, but from fish they ate). This just show leads ability to stay in the food chain and end at the top. Banning lead (and plastics) from shotshells is just a very small step in the right direction.

The only way to fight this it's not to insure ourselves with this 9 shooting organisations that volunteered for this ban, without consulting with us members first! I would urge people to research the alternatives to lead shot... and you will discover that they are much more toxic than lead... they have no real Killing rage, overtime will damage your gun and it all comes with extortionate Price Tag!

First lead. Then shooting.

GuTWorm68. Thats why we as a sport need to undertake voluntary moves like this to demonstrate our responsibility. Being ecofriendly, safe and responsible and initiating this ourselves is a great way to take the initiative.

@@vtv8man "Change is happening. This can only be a good move" - I have no issue with steel replacing lead in cartridges but it is wrong to assume that change is a good thing. Change is only valid when it a backed by good reasoning and new information & knowledge.

Of course.