Flood coolant on the Wells Index Mill - Improving on the pump

  Рет қаралды 7,411

Winky's Workshop

Winky's Workshop

Жыл бұрын

Trim Microsol 685 Coolant: amzn.to/3XdTl7w
Trim Tap Heavy: amzn.to/43Mqlq6
Heavy Duty Leveling Caster: s.vevor.com/bfQhIF
1 HP 1750 Motor: s.vevor.com/bfQgLZ
Vortex Coolant Pump: amzn.to/3qO1DHl

Пікірлер: 110
@AmateurRedneckWorkshop
@AmateurRedneckWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Good job as usual Winky. Just containing the chips is a significant accomplishment. Thanks for the video keep on keeping on.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I agree.... the table on this mill is much higher. I don't like hot chips down my shirt!
@richardbrobeck2384
@richardbrobeck2384 Жыл бұрын
What great little coolant tank !
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
It a nice size I think
@billjulian9496
@billjulian9496 Жыл бұрын
Mark, I like your modification to the coolant system. As far as equalizing coolant between the side that has a trap and the one that doesn't; I think it is best to keep the mill as level as can be and drill and tap a new trap on the side that is lacking. I have a 10"X48" Marena that has a trap on each side, it drains well
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
You're probably right... just didn't want to drill the table. To make it the same its 3/8" NPT although I could make it smaller.
@billkurek5576
@billkurek5576 Жыл бұрын
All of your viewers can see how perfectly neat ,organized and spotless you keep your shop. Your videos are getting better and better. Flood coolant undoubtedly is the best for cutter longevity. We won’t mind if you only cleanup occasionally. Some of us are “neatnicks. Just think $$ in cutter savings……. Keep the vids coming and I will keep watching an ignoring a little mess. Thanks.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@billkurek5576 The shop stays fairly clean for 2 reasons. One for youtube videos and two, so that I can find things. Whenever the shop gets cluttered I start losing tools. That for the generous comment!
@terrycannon570
@terrycannon570 Жыл бұрын
Great Idea Mark. But I would not have gone to all the trouble. I just stick with cutting fluid and a brush no more milling than I do. Most of my milling is to repair/restore other vintage machines. Flood coolant definitely has its place in production shops but on my Bridgeport clone it came with flood coolant, but I am not going to use it. Great craftmanship on your part though. Thanks for bringing us along.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I may eventually reach the same conclusion as you but so far I love it .. I don't like the chips all over my shop and going down my shirt. With flood the chips all stay put. If I stop using flood it will likely be because of corrosion but this coolant is "supposed" to control this. We will see.
@bobuk5722
@bobuk5722 Жыл бұрын
Another idea. Have the 'suds' come in from both sides - that way chips are not so likely to be washed into the path of the cutter. I like the swarf guide ideas. I could do with something along those lines on my mill. Be careful when choosing a 'trough' vise (vice over here!) - that coolant channel can obstruct rearward clearance in some cases - I've even seen cases where the guide channel has been milled off!
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Good advice! Totally agree about the coolant gutter!
@DavidHerscher
@DavidHerscher Жыл бұрын
You can tilt the entire mill out of level by a very small amount and it should be enough to force the coolant to flow to your drain side. However, flow rate will likely overcome that at times. So, ya know, cut another drain hole. That's the best solution lol.
@moosesmachinery
@moosesmachinery Жыл бұрын
If your drain won't keep up, you might want to look for limits in flow. Its oretty easy to fry the pump on these little coolant pumps. I've been flirting hard with setting one up chock full of cutting oil.
@DavidHerscher
@DavidHerscher Жыл бұрын
@@moosesmachinery I don't think he was struggling with the drain not keeping up, it's just that he didn't have a drain on both sides of his table so coolant is collecting in the tray on the side without a drain.
@moosesmachinery
@moosesmachinery Жыл бұрын
@DavidHerscher I've backed up a drain before by not keeping chips out of it, which is what I was thinking of. Interestingly, every bridgeport j head I have seen from the 70s and back have drains on both sides of the table.
@DavidHerscher
@DavidHerscher Жыл бұрын
@@moosesmachinery Yeah, mine has drains on both sides of the table.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
The one drain keeps up fine but the coolant gets trapped on one end of the table. As for cutting the flow... the pump is a centrifugal pump so it should not hurt anything.
@tjs_welding_and_fabrication
@tjs_welding_and_fabrication Жыл бұрын
Sand that coating way back when tig welding. Coating loves to migrate as you can see the contamination and sparks flying. Clean bright shiny metal. Cool project.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Good advice and no doubt true however, I found the problem. The guy at the welding shop gave me a tank of MIG gas (Argon and Co2 mix). After making this video I tried to weld a couple pieces of totally clean 1/2" cold rolled and came to the conclusion it was either the welder or the gas. I always wondered if MIG and TIG could share the same gas and I found my answer. Maybe in a pinch for a small weld but otherwise NO. The guy at the welding shop traded tanks without question. He said, "I remember you telling me TIG, I messed up".
@tjs_welding_and_fabrication
@tjs_welding_and_fabrication Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop yes. I was also going to say you have a gas problem from the looks of the spitting and blackened welds. Glad you found the issue.
@larry3064
@larry3064 Жыл бұрын
Very well done 👏
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks Larry!
@mikewatson4644
@mikewatson4644 Жыл бұрын
Looks like a nice upgrade. Thanks for sharing
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks Mike!
@65cj55
@65cj55 Жыл бұрын
Cool, works a treat Winky, you will solve any issues as the come along, if any.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I'm sure, thanks!
@ghostses
@ghostses Жыл бұрын
To avoid having to walk around the table and bend over to turn the pump on and off, I would mount a standard receptacle in the box. Then mount the magnetic switch up on the machine with the load side wire powering the receptacle. You'd still have the advantage of unplugging the pump to remove the tank for cleaning, but would gain easy access to turn the pump on and off. G.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Not a bad idea but I made the post tall enough to where I really didn't have to bend over. Plus I also like the simplicity of the plug switch I put in the box and honestly I think the magnetic switch is a little bit overkill.
@ghostses
@ghostses Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop Fair enough! Take care, G.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@ghostses I do appreciate input! Thanks.
@ghostses
@ghostses Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop Good deal! G.
@robertwalker7457
@robertwalker7457 Жыл бұрын
Mate nice work. If you go with plugs in the T slots nothing is lost if they don't work. Bit of rubber cut to shape and tapped in with a mallet and a stick. Another hole means another hose, you'll have more hose than a fire truck.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks... Yeah, I hate a bunch of hoses and wires!
@RAYAR54
@RAYAR54 Жыл бұрын
Hi Mark, nice addition to your mill, looks good.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks 👍 It works great
@bobuk5722
@bobuk5722 Жыл бұрын
Hi Mark, just watching how you cut the support frame pieces to fit was useful to see. Obvious, I suppose, but I doubt that I would have thought of it! Good idea to spilt the cable (obviously!).
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks. Yeah, that cable was ridiculous. I've dealt with unmovable small tanks at work and its always a mess. I love the idea of taking the mess outside.
@Farm_fab
@Farm_fab Жыл бұрын
Mark, you might need to go with stainless steel couplers for your coolant hose. These would not be cheap, but probably would be in the long run. The switch provided by Vertex is not magnetic, but is a mechanical action type switch. I prefer magnetic to mechanical if the power shuts off. It won't ne forgotten that way, and potentially run for a few days, or even hours. When i was in college, they had a print shop, and their used aluminum plates went to a company that made solar air warming panels.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Interesting on the plates! You are probably right about the switch but any low wattage switch would be fine. The magnetic is only an advantage it you lose power. The only way it would be an advantage to me is if I forget to turn it off and happen to lose power. Not likely.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I just bought a stainless coupler. Nebraska is all I had at the time. It wasn't too bad I think 6 or $8
@donsengine3158
@donsengine3158 Жыл бұрын
Don's Rule # 2 of anything machine: If you make it easy to maintain, it'll get maintained! Nice job Winky. Ought to do a comparo between your old mill and this one. A stack up / pros n cons etc.. I think that would be interesting. Don
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Interesting idea. The RF30 was actually better than I though but I'll leave the rest of my opinions for the video :o)
@ellieprice363
@ellieprice363 Жыл бұрын
A coolant pump on that mill should work well once all the drainage problems are solved. I believe you’ll find that HSS cutters are entirely adequate for the speeds and feeds your mill will run. They’re widely available in all sizes, flute styles and lengths and much cheaper than carbide.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I 100% agree... and they do well at lower RPM so the end mill doesn't sling as much coolant
@cyclebuster
@cyclebuster Жыл бұрын
i dont like to run my old iron fast enough for carbide, so most of what i uses is HSS. My 4 in face mill is carbide but its big enough to have a good SFM at lower rpms. I tried a cnmg in my lathe and its useless at the rpms i run.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@cyclebuster I think my mill handles the speed just fine however, I do like HSS. It cuts a little smoother and the lower speed means I don't end up with chip everywhere (or coolant). I use carbide on my lathe all the time. I use a TCMT insert I like although... the last two orders of inserts I got on ebay are useless. VERY brittle. I may have to spend more than a dollar each to get a good one. lol
@Baron3D
@Baron3D Жыл бұрын
Happy Midsummer
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks, it;s been a nice summer. Not super hot.
@lintelle2382
@lintelle2382 Жыл бұрын
uh, didn't summer just start a day or two ago??
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@lintelle2382 Oh... ha, maybe so. I never pay attention to that.
@robert574
@robert574 5 ай бұрын
I stopped at goodwill last week and there was a large, thick, square aluminum pan about 18" x 18" x 4" deep maybe 1/4" thick. The bottom was flat all the way to the sides with only a small radius in the corners and the sides were flat. It looked new. It would have made a good "something" for the garage, maybe something to put under a vise with coolant. I had trouble setting it back down, but I'm cured from dragging stuff home anymore.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop 5 ай бұрын
Cured? Ha
@robert574
@robert574 5 ай бұрын
Yea, I'm drawing the line, there's no place to put it. Been pushin' stuff to the curb for a few weeks now. Not my tools or shop stuff though, but storage is an issue. I have a big section of my garage that is just dedicated to hurricane stuff here in FL. I use 5/8 plywood now and it takes 500lbs to do the house by myself. Not sure I can continue that as I turn 70 in a year or two and reality is setting in. (@@WinkysWorkshop
@robert574
@robert574 5 ай бұрын
Your garage is small also, but it looks like you're in a 4 car garage in the videos with room to spare.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop 5 ай бұрын
@@robert574 26 x 24 feet if I remember right. Big enough for metal working but when you add several woodworking tools... WAY too small.
@outsidescrewball
@outsidescrewball Жыл бұрын
Enjoyed
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks Chuck
@bobuk5722
@bobuk5722 Жыл бұрын
Ah, the drain challenge. I don't think tilting will work, far too much tilt required. If you don't want to drill another drain hole than maybe just pack the sump with a block of metal or infill with a casting rubber which could be pulled out. I think though that the 'drill another drain' is the best way to go. Maybe into the bottom of the table rather than the side. You would need a very low profile adapter, maybe installed from below and not protruding above the surface of the sump. Use a large diameter adapter and hose - less likely to get blocked, or have a mesh pre-filter mounted on the sump exit.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I think you are probably right. I also installed a larger fitting in the table and hose... for the same reason.
@JamesJohnson-dd5mf
@JamesJohnson-dd5mf 6 ай бұрын
add a second drain and hose with a y to the outher hose i think i would put the drains in the bottom of the well for better draining
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop 6 ай бұрын
Thanks! Yeah I added a second drain but it had to be on the back. The table moves to far to put it on the bottom.
@robert574
@robert574 5 ай бұрын
I haven't run the coolant, but have used the mist (quite a bit). Coolant is messy, but it does collect those fine chips that get everywhere including on you. Even with safety glasses, I used to make regular trips to the ophthalmologist to get a metal splinter taken out of my eye (work will see that as an injury now and drug test you on the way). It's best to just go see your eye doctor and don't even mention it at work. The other issue is the vacuum (wet and dry I guess), you need a hose that doesn't have all those darn ridges on the inside and maybe a little filter box that could catch the chips in a disposable bag of some sort and not crud up the vac.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop 5 ай бұрын
I agree, coolant has some disadvantages but after I get a better vise and way covers it will be worth it. HHS, especially with cobalt cuts much better than carbide. I do end up with about 8 ounces in the wet vac after using the mill but with all the other stuff I suck up its pretty much solids when I empty it. I sometimes take a stick to the hose to break up all the sludge and also have a bracket on the wall that holds the hose up to drain back in the tank.
@robert574
@robert574 5 ай бұрын
I'm always totally amazed when you fire up all the woodworking equipment and don't have sawdust lying everywhere. Gotta have those vacuums.@@WinkysWorkshop
@davidkarath6549
@davidkarath6549 Жыл бұрын
Would a paper coffee filter on the return help?....put another table drain on the other side. "t" them together, then to sump...
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I'm not sure the filter is needed, most the chips stay on the table but I agree on the lines.
@joebutcher8877
@joebutcher8877 Жыл бұрын
Hi, A lovely job you made of the Wells Index milling machine. I am considering purchasing one of these myself. What do they weigh approximately please so I have an idea for moving it. Many thanks :)
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks, if it's a model 40 if weighs about 1250 lbs.
@joebutcher8877
@joebutcher8877 Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop That is great! Thank you for the information :) Out with the shop hoist it is then!
@randyjones9188
@randyjones9188 Жыл бұрын
Drill and tap the end that doesn't drain and run a hose over to the other drain and tee it in it will all end up in the coolant tank
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I'd say I'll end up doing that - thanks
@brianbutler3954
@brianbutler3954 Жыл бұрын
On my model 40 someone drilled a coolant drain hole in the trough on the right hand side of the table, I guess they got fed up with the coolant pooling in there
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I'd say the same will happen to me. Ha
@elanman608
@elanman608 Жыл бұрын
The only setup I have ever seen which was close to 100% successful was similar to yours, this chap had a load of aluminium sheet a bit thinner than yours (I think it was the thick foil they used to make takeaway containers from) which he cut and folded into shields as required and held to the bed with old loudspeaker speaker and TV focusing magnets.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Hmm? I'll have to remember that magnet trick!
@jubiletabustamanteserrano2446
@jubiletabustamanteserrano2446 Жыл бұрын
buen video amigo EL INTERUPTOR DE LA BOMBA NO SE VE DONDE LO MONTASTES
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
True, I could have mounted the box the other way.
@37yearsofanythingisenough39
@37yearsofanythingisenough39 Жыл бұрын
I know the advertising hype all coolants have regarding corrosion inhibitors. Mixed according to direction they all corrode to a certain extent especially where capillary action takes place, even if you mix on the heavy side. I coat my vise bottoms, and in your case that removable “fixed jaw”, with Sta-bil Rust Stopper or equivalent, before bolting to the table. (No they don’t slide around and come out of tram….they are held with tons of pressure for God’s sake.)Without doing so you will discover at the very least a nice shadow of your vise and, if you leave it long enough, pitting of both table and vise. I also offset my vise right and then left to even out wear on the lead screw. This leaves room for an indexer, or etc. besides.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
THANKS! Both excellent ideas. I've never tried this rust inhibitor but I will do this for sure. I was thinking about offsetting the vise anyway but this comment was a good reminder.
@andyZ3500s
@andyZ3500s Жыл бұрын
Nice improvement Mark, I have used flood and mist in the past. They both have pro's and con's it just depends on your situation and your preference. Your sure scored finding a older mill that wasn't completely worn out. Have you been thinking about a power feed in the future? I have seen pictures of Bridgeport style power feeds on the X axis so I know that it is possible. Anyways I hope that all is well, you have a fine machine there.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks... yes, a power feed is probably in my future. As for flood and mist... I like the flood better because it stops the chips from flying across my shop.
@wilkbilt
@wilkbilt Жыл бұрын
does the aluminum plates affect the levelness of the vise ?
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
No... Maybe you missed where I milled slots on the bottom of the vise. This provided a clearance for the aluminum to the vise is flat on the table.
@JamesP_TheShedShop
@JamesP_TheShedShop Жыл бұрын
Awesome
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Thanks!
@EitriBrokkr
@EitriBrokkr Жыл бұрын
Drill and tap a drainhole in the other end of the mill table, drain it back to the sump
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I was trying to avoid that but probably will do just that
@EitriBrokkr
@EitriBrokkr Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop tiny sump pump :) you could block it off the last 1/2" or so of the t slot, and pour a resin like epoxy or a liquid pour rubber in there. Would make a perfect sized dam. They put a little sheet metal cover over the reservoir
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@EitriBrokkr I was also thinking the same. Maybe make a mold and cast one out of silicone.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@EitriBrokkr I ordered some silicone rubber for casting. I suspect I can cast it right in the slot although I may wax the Tee slot before casting.
@EitriBrokkr
@EitriBrokkr Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop yeah, a little paste wax works good for a release agent
@peterlitwinczuk5403
@peterlitwinczuk5403 Жыл бұрын
Next week, curb feelers for the base.....
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
Yeah, I forgot about the curbs in my shop 🙃
@patrickoquin7215
@patrickoquin7215 Жыл бұрын
Yea, maybe static straps too lol 😂
@bc65925
@bc65925 Жыл бұрын
10 oz per gal for 2 gal is more like 20oz instead of 25 isn't it?
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
It's a 10 parts water to 1 part coolant. 128 oz (1-Gal.)/10=12.8. Two gallons would be about 25. Maybe I messed up in the video but I thought I said a bit over 10 oz per gallon. Either way... it's not critical. I went with the highest concentration to control corrosion (hopefully).
@lintelle2382
@lintelle2382 Жыл бұрын
@@WinkysWorkshop you always wanna lean towards heavier coolant in the ratio so as to minimize/eliminate rust.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
@@lintelle2382 Yep
@gregsmith2262
@gregsmith2262 Жыл бұрын
Why not just pump it dry into a bucket and then clean it out?
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I syphoned it out and then soaked it up with rages. I just don't want to do this every time I use the mill.
@roulbook1921
@roulbook1921 4 ай бұрын
Winky,you are bending that poor vice real bad by putting alusheet under the ends and press down on the middle.Run an indicator over it and see how much it gets out of whack.At least put some alu under the vice at the middle,direkt under the holddowns.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop 4 ай бұрын
You would be correct and I would never do that without taking the needed steps to avoid warping the vise. If you watch the video again you will notice that I milled slots in the bottom of the vise to accommodate the thickness of the aluminum sheet. Maybe not the best approach bit certainly better than warping the vise. I've since bought a new vise with coolant gutters and installed a cover behind the table. It catches nearly 100% of the coolant and chips. It works great! kzfaq.info/get/bejne/fdihf8KE2dDLmqM.html
@user-bl1eh2qs9o
@user-bl1eh2qs9o Жыл бұрын
Nice job, but...... $315,- !? that's $250 too much.
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I think $150 would be okay but I agree! WAY to high! I got mine on ebay.
@odd5hau
@odd5hau Жыл бұрын
so you"re saying the chinese crap sucks
@WinkysWorkshop
@WinkysWorkshop Жыл бұрын
I don't remember saying that or implying this. Some if the Chinese stuff is great and some of it is not. The Vevor motor and casters seem to be good.
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