I'd like to see the Scouring of the Shire. It would make a great stand-alone, essentially self-contained story.
@AnthonyDGreen8 ай бұрын
I've always wanted to see the moment Sauron forges the One Ring and the keepers of the Three become aware of his intentions and remove theirs. Something about this simultaneous telepathic realization just always intrigued me. And Sauron's wrath at his plan failing would also be nice to see.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
There are a couple of versions of this story. I assume you are referring to the one where Celebrimbor distributed the two of the Elven Rings to Galadriel and Gil-galad after he made them. I have always imagined that it was a struggle for them to take the Rings off their fingers.
@peternouwen8 ай бұрын
Isildur stealing the fruit of the white tree of Númenor.
@Nottz4Lyf188 ай бұрын
God i am so glad you’re back doing content, i know you have for a wee bit but just want to voice my appreciation
@radagast72008 ай бұрын
Before watching, mine would definitely be the scouring. Seeing Sam become The Garderner with the seeds would be awesome. Also, Aragorn visiting Sam in the shire, but using the same actors so they've aged appropriately. Roverandom would also make a great kids movie.
@Captain_Insano_nomercy8 ай бұрын
I would love to see Fingolfin vs Morgoth, but I do agree that it would be difficult to capture the grace and power of elves who lived in the blessed realm
@vileluca8 ай бұрын
Yes!! Show the Bestest Boy fighting werewolves !
@gandalfolorin-kl3pj8 ай бұрын
Melon Geek, I pray that one day someone will put these scenes into production. They are worthy of being treasured and handed down to our offspring. Namarie.
@wardaddy65958 ай бұрын
Would love to see something on Gandalf's visit to Tom Bombadil for an epic debrief at the end of the war!
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
I’d love to see how Tolkien envisioned that visit going lol
@ShmuelSch8 ай бұрын
A tallest of all Thingol killed by tiny tiny dwarves
@delichonnl77448 ай бұрын
The children of Hurin would be a great movie on its own.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
Can you make that movie without glorifying suicide? Too many young people are killing themselves nowadays without giving them the message of victory via suicide.
@delichonnl77448 ай бұрын
@@Enerdhil I don’t think that Tolkien is glorifying suicide in this tale. An act that we all must prevent if it is within our capacities. In The children of Hurin the suicides are not a victory of men, but of Morgoth, leaving the children and their mother dead and the father a ruin while being on the right side. Turin will show up at the end of time to victor over Morgoth.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
@@delichonnl7744 You should checkout Rainbow Dave's take on his Tolkien Untangled channel. I don't like his take but he also sees the suicides as being a way to escape from the Curse of Morgoth. Death frees the fëa from pain, misery, and suffering of the hröa. Thus they achieved victory in death. Isn't that a good reason to kill oneself?😞
@richtomchuk158423 күн бұрын
King Brand's and Dain's last stand during the War of the Ring.
@pwmiles568 ай бұрын
I should have liked to see Rose asking Sam why it's taken him so long to get back.
@NoahBrown698 ай бұрын
Id like to see the moment Turin accidentally Kills Beleg. The way Tolkien describes that is so cinematic with the rain and the thunder. Also Fingon and Maedros on Thangorodrim
@David.Bowman.8 ай бұрын
I always chuckle when Frodo moves to Buckland and leaves the dishes in the sink for Lobelia hehehehehe. No opportunity in the films of course.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
I'd rather see the look on Lobelia's face as she grabs the gift spoons from Bilbo's hand. Pride and shame mixed together in a comic scene.
@David.Bowman.8 ай бұрын
@@Enerdhil just more Lobelia. Or other Hobbits in general!
@blakewinter16578 ай бұрын
I'm a bit worried about the Fingolfin vs. Morgoth fight, because they say that Grond rips open great pits in the earth. I'm not sure how much that could be portrayed. It also reminds me of mythical stories in which a giant's fight causes a change in the local geography.
@anarionelendili89618 ай бұрын
There is definitely an implication that spells were slung in Gandalf's fight with the Balrog: 'There upon Celebdil was a lonely window in the snow, and before it lay a narrow space, a dizzy eyrie above the mists of the world. The sun shone fiercely there, but all below was wrapped in cloud. Out he sprang, and even as I came behind, he burst into new flame. There was none to see, or perhaps in after ages songs would still be sung of the Battle of the Peak.' Suddenly Gandalf laughed. 'But what would they say in song? Those that looked up from afar thought that the mountain was crowned with storm. Thunder they heard, and lightning, they said, smote upon Celebdil, and leaped back broken into tongues of fire. Is not that enough? A great smoke rose about us, vapour and steam. Ice fell like rain. I threw down my enemy, and he fell from the high place and broke the mountain-side where he smote it in his ruin. Then darkness took me; and I strayed out of thought and time, and I wandered far on roads that I will not tell.'
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
Yeah but it’s really vague what’s going on, and in any case I still think Jackson’s approach with the lightning is off.
@Patrick-qed8 ай бұрын
Re: Gil-galad's birthplace. Yes, most writings imply (require?) that he be born in Beleriand. There is 1 note, however, published at The Nature of Middle-earth, p. 81, that suggests Aman instead. CT found a short blurb by JRRT suggesting an age Gil-galad must have been to become king. The math results in YT 1481, thus in Aman under the Trees.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
It makes sense to have Gil-galad born in Eldamar because the High King of the Noldori should be a "high" Elf at least.
@celtofcanaanesurix22458 ай бұрын
I know its a small moment but I just want that moment where Eomer and Aragorn lock arms like Arnie in Predator
@christina35124 ай бұрын
Absolutely Turin and Glaurung! Honestly, the whole Children of Hurin would adapt to film pretty well.
@Henngist4 ай бұрын
Your description of Ar Pharazon (and Sauron) reminds me of Frodo and Gollum approaching Shelob's lair.
@KevDaly8 ай бұрын
I'd like to see the fall of Sauron as Tolkien described it, including Gandalf's "Stand, Men of the West!..." speech, (which my compatriot Peter Jackson butchered and completely misappropriated, leading me to wonder whether he actually misunderstood it)
@istari08 ай бұрын
I'd like to see the Fall of Gondolin, the breaking of the siege of Lindon in the War of the Elves and Sauron, and the Battle of Azanulbizar.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
Especially Ecthelion vs. Gothmog.
@anarionelendili89618 ай бұрын
Glorfindel's death AFAIK, doesn't the Balrog snatch at his golden hair as it is already falling? So it is more of a victory for Glorfindel before the Balrog takes him with it. It is not a sacrifice-play. Ecthelion's headbutt of Gothmog into the fountain is more of a sacrifice-play, IMHO.
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
I guess it depends on which version. The published Silmarillion just says they both fell. Which I guess I interpreted as him sacrificing himself unless there’s a version that states it clearly. I’m not sure if there’s a version that says the balrog grabbed his hair.
@anarionelendili89618 ай бұрын
@@TolkienLorePodcast Found it. Book of Lost Tales II, The Fall of Gondolin (p. 194): Already the half had passed the perilous way and the falls of Thorn Sir, when that Balrog that was with the rearward foe leapt with great might on certain lofty rocks that stood into the path on the left side upon the lip of the chasm, and thence with a leap of fury he was past Glorfindel’s men and among the women and the sick in front, lashing with his whip of flame. Then Glorfindel leapt forward upon him and his golden armour gleamed strangely in the moon, and he hewed at that demon that it leapt again upon a great boulder and Glorfindel after. Now there was a deadly combat upon that high rock above the folk; and these, pressed behind and hindered ahead, were grown so close that well nigh all could see, yet was it over ere Glorfindel’s men could leap to his side. The ardour of Glorfindel drave that Balrog from point to point, and his mail fended him from its whip and claw. Now had he beaten a heavy swinge upon its iron helm, now hewn off the creature’s whip-arm at the elbow. Then sprang the Balrog in the torment of his pain and fear full at Glorfindel, who stabbed like a dart of a snake; but he found only a shoulder, and was grappled, and they swayed to a fall upon the crag-top. Then Glorfindel’s left hand sought a dirk, and this he thrust up that it pierced the Balrog’s belly nigh his own face (for that demon was double his stature); and it shrieked, and fell backwards from the rock, and falling clutched Glorfindel’s yellow locks beneath his cap, and those twain fell into the abyss. I don't have the new Fall of Gondolin book, but I suspect that could be found there, too.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
That is what I remember reading too.
@ZephyrOptional8 ай бұрын
I was always disappointed that the movies didn’t end with the white ship sailing off the edge of the world on the “straight path”. I also need a good cinematic interpretation of the scouring of the shire. Personally think PJ dropped the ball with the 45 minutes of slow motion hobbit hugging ending. The song battles between Sauron and Finrod and then Luthien would be epic! Of course with Huan too!! Still have a lot of hope anime can bring new life to the Tolkien world in the War of the Rohirrim!
@MoritzGruber78 ай бұрын
I think he was right there. One of Tolkiens chief points is that the story *doesn*t* end with the victory on Mount Doom and the Morannon, plus three half-sentences about how they were all rescued, Aragorn became king and married Arwen, the Elves sailed West and Frodo went with them. No; there still follows (in the book) the Scourging of the Shire with the explicit statement that the War of the Ring ended. The War of the Ring; but not the book; Frodo still sets goes West. But the book pulls it off once more, *again* : it doesn't end, but Sam still goes home and says "well, I'm back". And *that* ends the book, at least its main stories. (Tolkien on purpose cut the Epilogue he had already written... still the Tale of Aragorn and Arwen, in the Appendices, functions as a sort of Epilogue.) It is a pity (albeit understandable) that we got no Scourging of the Shire, in the movie, of course; but at least PJ does *not* deny the general spirit of the idea which is that the Dominion of Men (with Hobbits included) begins and people have to take care of their domestic problems (if we put it rather unpoetically). A detailed explicitification of that, which the Scourging of the Shire would have been, had to go, of course; it would have been 45 minutes of screentime. But PJ does not *reject* the idea. He leaves the the 2 or so minutes of Sam coming home in. I positively think that was rather nicely done.
@ZephyrOptional8 ай бұрын
Just rewatched. As someone who’s been reading Tolkien for 40 years, and have been personally involved in a armature filmmaking, PJ botched the end of the films. When I watched this several times in the theatre when it first came out, I noticed that if your audience is laughing and sighing at the 4 different false endings, you messed up.
@troupemusographes24608 ай бұрын
I’m not much into this trend of adapting everything into live-action. First, we should remember we could also make animation, and that can be much more fitting for some stories. But even animation is turned into live-action movies as we speak, so... I think we have kind of a childish fascination for live-action adaptations, same way we yearned for a ride on the ghost train when we we’re younger. We want the unbelievable to be made real. And more often than not it gives us a pleasure not very subtle in itself and it brings the multiplicity of visual interpretations to a single one (see how the aesthetics of PJ trilogy have nearly wiped out everything else). I’m not interested in seeing the scenes you describe turned into live-action, because it would mostly be spectacular, at least nothing more illustrations haven’t already done. Yeah, I’m a grumpy one. I don’t care about this kind of rollercoaster, except for the last one (Elendil and Ar-Pharazon) because movie making here could offer something the books can’t : simultaneous cuts. In this particular case, it would really make way for a very strong and moving scene. Nice pick of yours. That’s what I liked most in PJ movies : these very rare moments when I said to myself "this is purely cinematic, something Tolkien could never have succeeded". That’s why I love the opening pan on the mountains with voices in the background in the Two Towers or when Frodo stumbles on the path to Cirith Ungol and is put back on foot by Galadriel in the Return of the King.
@Makkaru1128 ай бұрын
Tales Of The Ring channel did lovely regarding the trees
@LK0418 ай бұрын
I think you could see fights with the mythical figures of the Silmarillion if you changed the style of the fight choreography and the scenery, and draw inspiration from anime, eg. Dragonball Z or even Attack on Titan. That sort of the-fight-terraforms-the-environment level of power. The jarring difference between that and LoTR would emphasise the difference in the ages, which the audience would have to be prepared for, eg. through seeing the gods themselves beforehand and seeing more pacific divine powers, eg Morgoth throwing up mountains for defence.
@jaredmarkham73008 ай бұрын
I think the dual battle of a window and gilglad. Yo God could work because you don't know exactly how much power he has left after both the fall of numer. As well as the amount of his left over power that he put into the ring. By the third age, the only people with the ability turn stand against him. Or spell or spread out or not existent. So that's what makes him super dangerous in the Lord of the Rings.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
It would still be better to show Ungoliant sucking the life juices out of the Trees and growing to the enormous size she became when she just about killed Morgoth.
@Sletty738 ай бұрын
I am thinking at the first elves awakening at the Cuivienen and gazing at the stars. Perfectly doable, poetic and beautiful. And the touch of the firstborn saying "Ele!" (star) meaning "look!" is so poetic. I'd love to see it.... And of course, I'd love seeing my boy Tiurin killing that son of a b**ch of Glaurung.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
The lighting would be tricky.
@stevehall50008 ай бұрын
gandalf and witch king at gate, done the way it should have been
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
We do have Rankin Bass for that ;)
@tominiowa25138 ай бұрын
The 144 OG elves awakening in Cuiviénen (if done right).
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
The lighting would be very tricky.🤔
@Krommer10008 ай бұрын
Another great listen. While I agree that falling down the hole with the Balrog wasn't part of Gandalf's plan, I don't think he went into that thinking something like that "couldn't" happen, so while it was surprising when it occurred, I think the steel shown by the character's in both occasions you bring up are already pretty close to one another.
@blakewinter16578 ай бұрын
Regarding the lightning and magic in the Balrog fight, I think this might be somewhat in keeping with the book? Gandalf says that witnesses would have only said that lightning leapt from the top of the mountain, or something. And when he fought at Weathertop, there were flashes like lightning. So I think, when he was really pressed, he could dig into a certain amount of magic that we don't usually see him use in other situations.
@PatriceBoivin8 ай бұрын
Regarding Earendil's arrival, now that Rings of Power has been made, it may be possible to prevent the Tolkien Foundation from arguing that elements of the stories cannot be reproduced by others: "Well, in Rings of Power that didn't happen at all and you backed it. Since what the defenddant depicted doesn't match Rings of Power, how can you now claim this infringes on a copyright claim? Are you now declaring that Rings of Power was invalid but you backed it anyway? Please explain."
@PatriceBoivin8 ай бұрын
My wishes were more simple, I wanted to see the awakening of the dwarves; elves travelling in the wilderness; dwarves and elves building beautiful items and structures; rangers patrolling Rhudaur; ents; Tom Bombadil and Goldberry; high elves and other elves we read about but never saw depicted, how did they live. Also, the Valar, their intentions, what they observed and how they acted. The world as it was during the Two Trees. Landscapes (New Zealand? 😋), beautiful geology and landscapes -- Middle-Earth, in other words. The film directors and producers, artists, demonstrating how they love the world, its beauty, make it real. Care.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
I'll take "Tom and Goldberry: The Musical."🎵🎶
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
@@PatriceBoivin How can you depict a world lit up by scattered faint stars in the sky. Remember, there is no moon or sun. Stars are the source of light. It would be impossible to not make the scene look eerie and creepy when it should look magnificent and heavenly.
@ianleggett84298 ай бұрын
In my opinion, if you want to do another trilogy of movies that cover the beginning ages of middle earth, you do the story of Beren and Luthien with the first movie covering the creation of Arda.
@michaelogrady2325 ай бұрын
Ungoliant and Morgoth. Morgoth was the most powerful of the Valar. That would make him second only to Eru. So, how could Ungoliant be more powerful? As Eru created all things, when did He create Ungoliant? What was her form when created? Certainly not the evil form she adopted? What was she originally? Maybe these are questions that have no answer.
@robingill99408 ай бұрын
id like to see Balin coming to bag end looking for Bilbo's help to retake Moria because he cant find Gandalf , and Bilbo saying he's just adopted so he cant help but he introduce his new friend the Dunedin and they plot ...i know its not canonical but it would explain why strider explored moria
@Makkaru1128 ай бұрын
Fingolfin & Morgoth might work BUT then the eagles come and trounce him so as far as that goes thanks to LOTR film it’ll look a little bit silly and predictable if not done right
@margaretalbrecht46508 ай бұрын
You ever wonder what happened to the Balrogs after their physical bodies are destroyed? Why don't they ever create a new body? They're Maiar so they can't be killed.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
That's a great question. I mean, Sauron could remake his body in multiple forms. His Fana died and he reembodied himself, without the Valar being involved as they are in Elven reembodiments.🤔
@kaibaman878 ай бұрын
It will be intresting to watch,how rings of power show are gonna handle both those epic akallabeth monent's in screen or are they botched like many stuff in first season?
@KororaPenguin5 ай бұрын
I don't trust Taurduin Studios to do either scene properly.
@markbertenshaw39778 ай бұрын
Regarding the Noldor coming to Middle Earth - I could never get why any of the Elves should have any martial abilities at all. Until Ungoliant kills the two trees, the Elves have never known anything negative happen. Weapons, armour and battle tactics arise from experience of murderous conflict, and I can't think of any "enemy" that the Elves had before Ungoliant, and even then, she is more of the Valar's enemies.
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
Remember Morgoth has them forging weapons well before in Valinor, so presumably they also practiced with them.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
The Japanese have KENDO. Maybe Tulkas and Oromë taught the Elves the art of hand-to-hand combat just for sport and/or exercise.
@margaretalbrecht46508 ай бұрын
I just figured out what scene I'd like to see filmed: The Nazgul vs the Rangers at Sarn Ford where the Rangers lost and were routed by the Nazgul. Was it ever clarified if Aragorn was there?
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
Pretty sure it wasn’t possible for him to have been there.
@margaretalbrecht46508 ай бұрын
@@TolkienLorePodcast Why not? He was in the area because he knew he'd soon be meeting Frodo and Sam in Bree.
@pwmiles568 ай бұрын
The Hunt for the Ring says Aragorn was already on the East Road near Bree by 22nd Sept, the day of the Nazgul's attack. This is Bilbo's birthday, when Frodo was expected to set off from Bag End. In fact Aragorn ends up waiting a week, till the 29th. Anyway he definitely wasn't at Sarn Ford, which is about 100 miles from Bree. Sources: Unfinished Tales / Appendix B
@margaretalbrecht46508 ай бұрын
@@pwmiles56 Thanks for the information.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
No way anyone should make a film of the Children of Hurin. Depicting suicides in an honorable way is not good for a society that already has too many people who are committing suicide.
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
I don’t think it’s depicting suicide as honorable at all. I think it’s just showing how utterly broken they both were when they did it.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
@@TolkienLorePodcast So they were justified in killing themselves. Niniel was justified in killing her baby. All had good reasons to die. Do you see what I am upset about?
@TolkienLorePodcast8 ай бұрын
I see that you’re equating two things that aren’t equal. The fact that both of them are broken individuals doesn’t justify their actions.
@Enerdhil8 ай бұрын
@@TolkienLorePodcast What two things are not equal? Turin's vs. Niniel's suicides? Real world suicides vs. Legendarium suicides? (Edit) Or maybe you mean broken doesn't mean justified? Broken is a great excuse if you are suicidal.
@TolkienLorePodcast7 ай бұрын
Yes an excuse, but excuses are usually given precisely when there is no justification. The distinction is even present in law-justifiable homicide (where the homicide is “right” as in self defense) is fundamentally different than excused homicide (where it’s still wrong but the perpetrator is held not guilty on the grounds that it’s understandable anyway, eg a father does a hit job because his daughter is a hostage and will be murdered if he doesn’t.