Backwater Swomp Lite 13hp Water Trial & Tune
Рет қаралды 31,822
4 жыл бұрынThe Backwater Swomp Lite Glider Kit for my 13hp Predator Engine is assembled and ready to go out on the water for its first water trial.
For those who like to read - www.jtgatoring.com/backwater-...
Quick Flash Back:
Unbox and Assembly Video - • Backwater Swomp Lite G...
Unbox and Assembly Article - www.jtgatoring.com/backwater-...
The first thing I had to figure out before heading out to the test lake was to figure out how to strap down this shorter tail. This 65" tail now rests on my rear seat so I had to come up with a rub-stop to protect the seat.
I used two 2x2's, screwed them together, and put the skeg in between them. That way I could pull this block of wood off of the skeg when I wasn't trailering it. I then strapped the shaft down like a would a normal longtail and drove out to the lake
I got to the lake fine, got all the cameras ready, and launched the boat. I lowered the bunks on my trailer which greatly helped with launching the boat. I also have a new coat of Wetlander on the boat also.
Water Trial - 1436 riveted flat bottom with a light load.
I got the boat out on the water, started it up, made sure the kill switch worked and then idled around to warm up the engine. The first thing I noticed was that there was a lot of vibration. A LOT. I was hoping this was because the Tracer Plate wasn't shimmed properly so I continued to warm up the engine.
After warming up the engine, I let the engine rev up and let the Backwater cruise. It had a different feel to it when compared to a Thai longtail. It did not take much effort to keep the prop in the water but I still noticed that strong vibration.
The max speed I reached was 15mph. I also saw that the Tracer plate was diving a little bit so I stopped, added a shim, and then started running again. Adding the one shim made the tracer plate ride where I think it is supposed to. Right at or right below the waterline. If I put any downwards pressure on the handle the prop would jump out so I feel like adding another shim would be too much. Still, I was only getting 15mph.
So I drove and cruised and put 3 hours on the engine. Never going above 15mph and never really dropping either. The throttle lever was difficult after a while with the heavy vibration so I normally only drove for 15 minutes and then took a break for 5 minutes.
After I put a couple hours on it, this is what my thoughts are:
Balance - I don't like the engine falling forward. Is there a way to fix it?
Vibration - Lots of vibration. What could cause this or how to troubleshoot it or rule out the kit?
Speed - a 8x4 prop, 15mph, is this a normal speed, and do you recommend a certain prop to test and go faster?
Throttle Lever - is there a better throttle lever I could use because the static throttle lever just isn't my style and is difficult/uncomfortable to use.
So now I need to call/email Backwater with the issues & questions I have and see what they say about it. After I talk with them, I will put all the updates in a new video.
BOAT SETUP:
1436 lt Alumacraft Jon Boat (would not recommend - get a tracker or something else other than an Alumacraft) {135lbs}
Custom front deck and floor {~75lbs}
Battery, trolling motor, fishing supplies, cooler, anchor, etc... = {~100lbs}
My weight = 150lbs
Total weight = 460 pounds + 76lb (engine) + 55lb (backwater kit) = 591-lbs
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@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
I have talked with Backwater on the phone. There are two 9" props on the way, along with a different throttle lever. There will be an update video once I get those parts and start working on the rig to see if I can get it running better. For those who like to read, here is the article - www.jtgatoring.com/backwater-swomp-lite-glider-kit-12-16-hp-water-test/
@smokedgecko3601 4 жыл бұрын
thorough, comprehensive and thoughtful.....thank you for your time...these vids aren’t free and don’t make themselves...i have no doubt that you’ve saved people a lot of headaches and money with your channel 👍...continued health and success to you and yours!
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
I greatly appreciate that @smoked gecko, thank you.
@CatchingDinosaurs Жыл бұрын
i have this motor its a beast you did have the cavitation plate still running a little low in the water, it pushed my 16x48 at the same speed it was pushing yours.
@kennethhudson8013 2 жыл бұрын
Smooth as glass
@carsonkeitt9028 4 жыл бұрын
Just my opinion, your speed sounds about right. As far as vibration I've never ran a single cylinder engine that didn't. I've never thought mine was excessive. I own a backwater but, have have a good bit of experience with my friends swamp runner. The swamp runner is better for open shallow water and speed ( better angle/ longer). It's a great budget motor for getting shallow .If your really doing 4×4 boating the backwater is far superior, in the rocks, logs, sand, true mud and really thick nasty weeds and muck. My buddy breaks a prop every other time out from hitting logs and has bent the shaft when trying to leverage/ pry a stuck boat. They both have their place in the shallows, but I've yet to see a video of any one really bashing and abusing a thai style longtail or using them like a mudmotor. I think the swamp runner is more of a shallow water outboard rather than a mudmotor.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
I do not remember the vibration being this bad on my Swamp Runner. I talked with Jake @ BW and he going to send the 9x4 and 9x5 props over. I'll also test a few other things to see if I can decrease the vibration. The backwater american design vs the swamp runner thai design is definitely a topic that I will try to cover and really break down the pro and cons of each once I put a few more hours on the Backwater kit and get more familiar with it. As you said, I do think that each kit has its own style/function. As of right now I agree with you that the Backwater is more designed towards the muscle through; pry, dig, and burrow type of approach, where the Swamp Runner Thai kit seems to really get some speed. I have still yet to break a prop on it though. I don't have any rocks where I am but logs and fence post I do have. I run the 8.75" weedless by swamp runner, and it is a thicker cast prop when compared to the standard props. Maybe that helps, but I would still think you could pry a good amount with the thai kit. I am not able to because my transom is about to give. I think I'm going to have to rebuild it this winter. Once I feel confident in my boat, I'll feel better about really putting the kits to the test. Thank you for your input Carson 👌
@dockmasterted 3 жыл бұрын
And for a better throttle you should just get a bicycle hand brake leaver and squeeze to go. But first loosen and twist the handlebar to the left. it will lower the handle, and move it to the left out of your way, and will probably solve your problem of the falling forward of the engine when at rest.
@threesetstofailure9941 3 жыл бұрын
If you primarily sit then you have to either bend that handle down to be level while sitting or you grab another metal piece and make another at the correct angle etc.
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
The only problem with lowering the handle is that it may bottom out on the seat if you're doing a level change since the tail goes up, the tiller has to go down. So yes it can be lowered but depends on the user. I'm starting to find out that there's a lot of little intricacies that each mud motor has for certain reasons.
@2ndrambo1 4 жыл бұрын
I have a backwater 13hp vtwin kit with a vanguard . Your NVH probably has a lot to do with a more secure ( less play) mounting , tight tolerance as well as running a single piston lower end motor. Not to say it’s not a reliable motor but HF doesn’t make the tightest tolerance motors out there. I can tell you that backwater will hit rocks and other hard surfaces far better than most on the market . Their service is also second to none . Good luck with the rest of your tests.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
Yeah, I think a 16 or 18 hp vtwin briggs would be awesome. They are so smooth. For the price, the HB engines do work but as you said are not the best out there and especially with being a single cylinder engine they will have vibration. The backwater is sturdy built kit no doubt, and thank you for the support 2ndrambo1!
@cdp50359 4 жыл бұрын
Im curious about the vibration. Here is my suggestion. 1. Run the kit not in water and see how bad it vibrates. 2. Remove the prop and see if it decreases. If so, call Jake and ask for another prop, it may not be balanced. 3. Rotate the prop on the shaft to see if it may balance out. This may help because the single cylinder engines don't have a counter balance to smooth it out. 3. Take your handle and rotate it one way or the other and drill a new hole for the handle mount. 4. Loosen the Phillips head screw that holds the throttle handle. You may want to add loctite to secure the screw. This should allow the throttle to return. If not, add a spring to the engine to help it. 5. Get the teflon plate I was telling you about between the transom bracket and the engine bracket. 6. May want to tighten the tilt bracket bolts to take slack out
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
Those are all things I plan to do to try and troubleshoot the issue. I did have a conversation with Jake @ Backwater and he also mentioned a few things and has some parts and props heading my way to see how things go when I get back on the water. This week I'm hoping to get the parts and test a few things on land before heading out again. For the teflon plate, is it easy to get at a hardware store, or is it more of a specialty item that should just be ordered online?
@cdp50359 4 жыл бұрын
@@JTgatoring I have a friend that works at a gasket store to make mine. But it would be easy to make. Btw, sent u a text
@D_Alley 4 жыл бұрын
Try to give it a little throttle with the prop out the water before easily dropping it in and you won't have that strong pull down before jumping up on plane. You can also look into the newer spring style squeeze throttle handle from BW. I just got rid of my backwater and really didn't want to. Loved it (vibration and all) but just went to a whole bigger rig
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
That was one thing that I don't particularly like. The prop does not bit until the whole prop is submerged. Whether I try idling up before letting it in the water or while idling up under water. Thats why I want to test it in heavy vegetation to see if there is any issue with how the prop performs in that aspect of idling and biting to propel the boat forward and if the engine will bog or cut out at all. I talked with Jake at Backwater about a few things and one was the throttle lever. He was going to send over the squeeze throttle so I can test it out.
@yvens001 Жыл бұрын
if you remove some of those wood platforms, it might go a little faster. i run a sps kit on my 1436 with a modified 6.5 hp predator i hit 18mph. the vibration is from the motor, you gootta remember its a pressure washer/mini bike/gocart motor not an outboard
@JTgatoring Жыл бұрын
I prefer my swamp runner over the backwater. It has nowhere near the amount of vibration as the backwater did and it was much faster. The backwater got up to 16mph and I was able to get 23mph with the swamp runner on the same boat setup and the exact same engine.
@dockmasterted 3 жыл бұрын
Just loosen the handle back by the engine, and rotate it to the left. That will move the handle to the left, and give you room to sit more toward the middle of the boat my friend.
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
That is possible. I would have to slide the handle in a little to make small adjustments though. Once I found a good position, I could then drill another hole for the through-bolt but there isn't all that much room to drill holes so you'd have to pick your spot and commit to it. Definitely possible though
@brettrakestraw522 4 жыл бұрын
I had a backwater before I went to swamp runner. I prefer the swamp runner over the backwater. Looking into a mudskipper surface drive now
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
As of right now, I prefer the Swamp Runner too but I'm still going to run the BW and see if I can get it to run a little better. Any specific reason for wanting a Mudskipper surface drive?
@jacksonseale7191 4 жыл бұрын
I have heard nothing but bad about mudskippers surface drive. I would suggest getting a used one cheap. Or if you are looking for small HP for cheap. Mud walker, copperhead, drake surface drives
@tylertudor6920 3 жыл бұрын
I’d like to see those other kits do what that one can do. I promise you the others will break bf the backwater does. I own 2 backwater motors and they run fine not much vibration in handle But I also ordered it together from the company I did not put it together myself
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
It would also depend on if your engine is a single-cylinder engine or a v-twin engine. The v-twin engines are balanced a lot better. The one kit that I do prefer over the backwater is the swamp runner kit. I really enjoy it for what I use it for, and I would really like to see what else it is capable of. I first have to reinforce the transom on my boat, but after that, I would like to find some more challenging areas and see how things perform.
@pjbrashear7402 4 жыл бұрын
The vibration is from you engine. The Swamp Runner rattled as well, but you didn't feel it as much because the shaft that mounts to the transom mount absorbed most of it. I had a SPS on a boat with a hunt deck and the vibration echoed through the hunt deck making it sound like a tool box falling down a flight of steps. The Backwater had a little more vibration in the handle but no rattle. Speed, I got the same speed with both setups. However, the SPS speeds seem to not hold top speed. It would hit top speed then bounce down 1-2 MPH and then back up and bounce back down. My Backwater carries a load better. The biggest that puts the BW ahead for me: one, is it has a steel prop. I get the idea of the SPS prop, but running mud flats the SPS prop do not hold up. Having to change props three plus times going through couple hundred yards in a mud flat is not fun. Second, the hex shaft makes changing a prop much easier. Third, my BW water has the top brace on the shaft, so the amount of flex in the BW shaft vs. the SPS is night and day. Fourth, the skeg on the BW is built thicker and tougher while giving the shaft for more support while the SPS skeg I have bent many times digging into mud and or sand. Also, running both motors through grass, I have less that gets wrapped around the shaft with the BW. Not saying that the SPS is a bad product, but the BW did better for me than the SPS.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
I've had a couple of people tell me its from the engine, but either way, I still feel the vibration in the handle a lot more in the backwater when compared to the swamp runner. I can only run it for 10 minutes before my hand goes numb. Whether its the engine or the backwater kit, I still can't drive it for more than 10 minutes where the swamp runner I had no issue. I do not have any mud flats by me, but I've been running the same prop through vegetation and stumps and still haven't broken a prop yet, but I'm also not trying to break a prop. Its starting to become more clear that there are situations and environments that suite one or the other when comparing the backwater kit and swamp runner kit. I plan to cover that later on, but right now I am trying to get the Backwater to run better.
@anwarchairil5152 3 жыл бұрын
👍
@enuff2bdangerous 4 жыл бұрын
Called it:). They are made well and built for abuse. BW-Solid kit but will not perform as well as the SPS. SPS-The longer shaft, light prop make all the difference in carrying a load and speed. Curious did you see a rpm difference at full throttle?
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
You were right. At full throttle I was still hitting the governed RPM range of 3800-3900. I talked with Backwater and he is sending out a 9x4 and a 9x5 for me to test out so I will see what will happen with those props and of course make a video about it haha
@kylekarwowski2642 3 жыл бұрын
Did you custom fab a little protective roll cage out of pvc for your straw hat?
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
Haha I may need too.. it's starting to get real weathered hahaha
@jimboneutron8399 3 жыл бұрын
If vibration bothers you upgrade to the v twin motor, they run smoother
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
Good thought! With this size boat, it can only handle a 13hp engine. So if I were to go to a v twin engine I would need a bigger boat. I do agree though that vtwin engine is the way to go
@justinhouser7554 4 жыл бұрын
I noticed a transom support running from transom to the floor is that new ? If so I'm interested in hearing more
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
There is a factor support that is off-center towards the starboard side of the boat. That is the only support on the transom at this point in time. I do plan on rebuilding the transom soon
@user-rq6in8tx4s 2 ай бұрын
The way you carry yourself. The way you talk. Are you a Marine Corps vet?
@gbstrick1 4 жыл бұрын
I run the 65" shaft on mine and it balances with the prop in the water. Maybe the 55" is a little different? Like I mentioned before, it's not as fast, it is significantly better built than the import kits though. It's meant for abuse. Had mine a few years now on the same hull as yours. Never had an issue. The speed you are getting is odd though, I run 18 empty and 16 with two big guys in the boat (500lbs between us) on the 8x4 prop. Never noticed the handle position is odd, but I've always driven a surface drive standing up. It is definitely odd if you like to sit.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
I do believe that the shaft length is a 65" on this kit. I guess I just have to get use to putting the tiller handle down in the boat instead of expecting the tail to fall into the water. I would think it would handle physical abuse better than a thai kit being that it looks like it has thicker wall tube and shorter tail you don't get as much leverage compared to an 85" or 100" shaft. The housing is powder coated on the Backwater but the Thai kit I use is hot dipped galvanized so when it comes to abuse in that manner the tables can turn. I will do a complete comparison and breakdown between the two, but for now, it seems like there is a certain group of people that would benefit from the BW over a thai kit and then the opposite way around. For speed, I know that the boat has good weight distribution and I have a light load so I don't know whats up with that either. There have been a few guys on Facebook that have experienced the same thing with getting slower than expected speeds. I like to sit if I'm planning to be running open water and traveling for 20 to 30 minutes. No need to stand.
@austinhowze6280 3 жыл бұрын
How are the seals holding up I got 2 gx390s needing frames but I'll never own another go devil product
@Reddirtrelichunters 3 жыл бұрын
Ever take some place... you know, shallow?
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
Yes, if you continue onto some other videos on the channel, you will find that I did take it into shallow water.
@MudMotorsMax 4 жыл бұрын
Do you miss your Thai longtail from SPS? that Backwater swomp Lite seems kind of slow
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
......yes. It's taking me a while to try and get used to this motor. It is definitely slow when compared to sps longtail. I am going to make a few more trips with the Backwater and make my decision then. As of right now, I can't run this backwater kit for more than 10 minutes before my hand is numb.
@MudMotorsMax 4 жыл бұрын
@@JTgatoring have you tried loosening your handle and turning it sideways or upside down so it's lower for you that might not be possible with the design. But yeah I think SPS is probably the best when you compare affordability durability ease-of-use and speed
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
@@MudMotorsMax Yeah, I will be adjusting the handle and drilling a new hole to put the through-bolt through. I will make a video of all the adjustments I do and see how it goes. So far for the price, swamp runner seems to really provide a lot of value
@nickboehm7667 3 жыл бұрын
@@JTgatoring A yellow leather work glove makes a big difference on running comfortably on long tails.
@kennethhudson8013 3 жыл бұрын
Take the governor out of it. Will give your more power and speed
@SluSharkND 4 жыл бұрын
Great non-biased review, as usual. Great job, JT. A one word su cmmary from this angle: awkward. It looks like it was not intuitive to use. I want the "made in USA" to be better, but it looks like someone's interpretation of what a longtail should look like, not what necessarily works best.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
It is awkward for me. I did have a conversation with Jake @ Backwater, and I'm going to try a few things and put some more hours on this kit to see if I can get it working better. The quality of parts is there, but actually using it has been awkward
@austinhowze6280 3 жыл бұрын
The angle is more on his boat bout you do drive these standing up it's not a sufacedrive also you want the widest boat you can get for a long tail
@TheDtrolinder 3 жыл бұрын
You shorten the crankshaft. Possibly the reason for the vibration.
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
I was thinking that. I am going to be putting my swamp runner kit back on and see if the vibration is still there
@smc65714 4 жыл бұрын
Is that shaft bent?Looks like it.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
Would you be able to give me a time stamp where it looks like its bent?
@user-uy9xw1fo7g 3 жыл бұрын
How many liters of gasoline does your engine consume per hour? Liters 5 per hour or more?
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
4 to 5 liters per hour. 5 liters if its full throttle the entire one hour
@user-uy9xw1fo7g 3 жыл бұрын
OK. Thank you
@MiceliCreations 3 жыл бұрын
I'm going to try to build a big brushless electric motor on a stick and run it like this.
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
Sounds cool!
@dylanjohnson6361 4 жыл бұрын
I have a 8hp predator with a swamp runner kit on that exact same Alumacraft and get 16mph with me and my wife I’d save my money on this and get swamp runner
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
Those are pretty good speeds! Good for you Dylan 👌 thats awesome. As for right now, it doesn't seem like the Backwater kit will be a speed demon. I still have to test it in the vegetation and see how it holds up there. But for the money, if you want speed, Swamp Runner does seem like the way to go right now. I did talk with Jake at Backwater and he's sending out some 9" props for me to test to see how much I can get my speed up
@austinhowze6280 3 жыл бұрын
The balance of his boat is holding him back plus if he runs shallow he would be hitting 18+
@brettkunkle5468 4 жыл бұрын
It definitely seems slower than the SPS kit. Almost like the engine is struggling to push the boat with ease
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
I was still running the same RPMs (3800 to 3900) which is the governed RPM range for my engine. The Backwater design is just not as efficient as the SPS kit. The SPS kit with a 8" prop would get me faster than that speed. It may also be prop design too. For which ever reason, the SPS seems to be more capable of reaching a higher end speed. I did talk with Backwater and they are going to send over some 9" props that I can test.
@brettkunkle5468 4 жыл бұрын
@@JTgatoring I had high hopes for the Back Water kit as far as same speed/performance as the SPS, just with better handling. I'm still a die hard sps fan. Keep up the amazing content brother. Thank you for what you do
@geortanders5626 4 жыл бұрын
Steel boat or aluminum.
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
This is an aluminum riveted jon boat. 1436 LT Alumacraft
@kennethhudson8013 2 жыл бұрын
That throttle is at a bad angle needs to be bent down
@duanemorris8486 3 жыл бұрын
What song is that at 1:20?
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
I'm going to have to get back to you on that... I have it on my computer. Its from Epidemic Music
@duanemorris8486 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks. I found it. "My new life" by Jaslyn Edgar. Good video btw I just got the sps medium with 100 inch shaft and predator 420 putting it on my 1450 deap v hopefully trying it out today!😎
@JTgatoring 3 жыл бұрын
Great and thank you! Oh boy! Have fun!! Take a look at this video before you go out so you can adjust it as needed on the fly - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/fKdxas1hybzWfIk.html
@davidgordy1 4 жыл бұрын
Not a fan too short
@JTgatoring 4 жыл бұрын
It is short compared to the Thai longtail I normally run. Overall a different design. I'm still going to put a few more hours on it and see how it does
@MiceliCreations 3 жыл бұрын
The sound and visual is throwing me off.
JTgatoring
Рет қаралды 4,6 М.
Excited Bro
Рет қаралды 38 МЛН