Thanks so much. Same to you :-)

Thank you :-)

Ok let’s get a few things straight. First of all it’s really difficult and fraught with danger to judge anything when filmed on an iPhone or similar and then played on KZfaq. With different light levels and different aperture and ISO and actually shot on different phones (we weren’t planning a KZfaq video when we recorded some of this) means the footage itself is not consistent. And, you are entirely wrong in your statement about DLP in fact it could be said DLP arguably struggles with contrast but the BEST primary and secondary gamut luminance I have recorded to date has been on DLP projectors, initially on the BenQ X12000H. Finally … what spinning wheel :-) !! There is no colour wheel in a Barco Bragi (Nor in the X12000H) Both are LED light source units and as said have high gamut luminance. The Barco Balder does however have a colour wheel. Go get your facts straight …..

Hi Joey. Not ignoring you. Great questions as always. Will get back to you on these in the next couple of days. Happy New Year :-)

Would love to hear about this as well

It's a myth that there's a difference in black levels between LCOS, DLP and LCD projectors. It's all to do with the design of the optical path, the quality of the lens, brightness and room design. JVC achieves it's high "native" contrast ratio by using a wire-grid polarizer to block light bleeding out horizontally. Sony uses a variable iris to block unwanted light in dark scenes on their lcos projectors. Without these tricks their lcos projectors would produce the same 2000:1 to 5000:1 full on / full off CR as DLP and LCD models. Similarly... you could use the same wire-grid polarizer design with dimmer DLP projectors to get JVC-like black levels. I believe Wolf made a DLP like that a while back which claimed a 100,000:1 CR. All of this is irrelevant in practice IMO. No bright projectors ever produce dark blacks on a white screen but a brighter image adds way more to perceived image quality than dark blacks (with projectors). My advice, as someone who has tested hundreds of projectors, is don't choose a projector based on advertised contrast or black levels. You want quality all glass lenses, larger chip size and high (calibrated) brightness. Most high end projectors use 3 chip DLP tech. It's the gold standard. The image you get on a high end 3 DLP blows any JVC home theater projectors out the water. The real world ansi-contrast can be double or triple the best JVC models. You'd think a dark all black screen is all that matters the way some people review projectors...

Maybe you can get a vw 5000 with 5000 Lumen and great hdr adjust it is already a Stunning device. I have a 150" Screen and use an epson tw9400 for it. For Ambient light its quite a bit to weak bit iam happy with the Performance in a dark room and its a 2700lumen 3000$ projector. Sure the Sony big bad with 10.000 Lumen is the golden Ticket right now but a vw 5000 is beyond normal picture quality as well. I would suggest you to Check it out. The gtz380 has around 10k just for the objektive so .. it will be expensive for a while.

The F80 is designed for commercial cinemas. Barco Residential units are designed for Home Cinemas...so I wouldn't recommend using a commercial projector in a residential space as much as using a residential in a commercial space. Fit for purpose kind of thing. What does this all mean...? Well the commercial projectors focus on huge brightness as a priority (at the expense of contrast). Residential is the reverse. In part it comes down to screen size, but it's also how content is processed etc. Using a Barco Residential projector in a Home Cinema will result in a far better image...it's designed to. Also you can only get the CS units in the residential line up.

As Dream AV says these are not really aimed at home cinema. The resolutions are media/ business oriented as opposed to movie media formats and resolutions plus light output for conference rooms is optimised. Again not for Home Theatre

@@dreamav8161 thanks for enlightening

@@HomeTheatreEngineering thanks , but I hope you could get yours hands on any of the barcos ,benq or Christie's commercial projector and make a comparison video , you would be first one to do it on KZfaq

I'm no expert, but I believe the Bragi CS will instantly change aspect ratio on the fly where necessary. The advantage of configuring it as "native" 5k is it doesn't need to use zoom to change aspect ratios. To me it seems the most clever way to do it if you are using a cimemascope screen.

There is a version for 16:9 screens then one specifically for 2.35 to 2.40:1 screens. Hope that helps 😁

@@dreamav8161 I think the Bargi 16: 9 version is only with 3840x2160 resolution, right? Would it be wrong to use Bargi cinemascope 5K on a 16: 9 screen?

It “can be” but it would be a waste of capability and $. For a 16:9 screen you would go for the standard Bragi not the CS version. Unless you plan to switch to 2.40 in time to come and are thinking ahead.

@@HomeTheatreEngineering thanks 🙂

We post these things out of interest like people watch Top Gear for cars of interest. I don’t own all these things but they fascinate me. Someone always has a bigger house. Better car. Nicer job but I don’t get bent out of shape by it. Technology is amazing. To be appreciated, respected but not always owned. In terms of value. For the technology packed into it, the cost of developing that technology it certainly is value. Value is different to expensiveness or affordability. I would love to own a space shuttle.. not likely though. :-)

To achieve the same light output on a cinemascope screen, youre looking at an NX9 (RS3000) with an anamorphic lense. Definitely not orders of magnitude cheaper...

Barco Residential does tone mapping via a different process. Hard to explain in text as it takes a bit. The top JVC model is definitely very, very good but you are talking similar price point to the Bragi, then you have to add an external lens (which introduces potential issues) and even an external processor such as Lumagen or Mad-VR. Nothing is the panecea of all things. There are pros and cons to all. But comparing products half or less of the price...well the best way to consider this is do this with cars. You get a lot less performance in a $25k car versus a $50k car. Yes, they both get you from A to B, but in far different levels of comfort, efficiency, power and overall performance etc.

There is no wheel in this projector so no rainbow

As Zo LP says... because this DLP (DMD) device has no colour wheel and has 3 independent light sources fired onto the chip it cannot produce rainbow effect. One of the big benefits not to mention no light loss through the colour wheel!

The problem is the ability to compare stats under true load as many brands do not provide this. This is for contrast, brightness, response rate etc. You can easily find all this on Barco Residential website. Yes LCOS based systems produce blacker blacks, but Barco tech (which is beyond just the DMD tech) actually produce real contrast that is measureably better than. Be careful of the quoted stats and make sure you are looking at actual true real life stats under load...and if you can't find them from any particular manufacturer...well that is a story in itself. Even if you have blackest blacks that's not the be all and end all of things. That's like saying I have Pirelli Tyres, but the rest of the car is a 30 year old junk heap that runs at best average. One element does not make great performance. It's all about all elements bringing high quality output and working together to create performance where the sum of the components performance are far greater than any single one ...which answers your question as to why you would consider Barco Residential. This is what they do. All the elements are chosen to perform equally well with each other and you pay for it. This then has little to no lowest common denominator effect. It's why the commercial cinemas are pretty much 98% DLP based tech for movies as over many years they have learned it is the superior image quality overall (the majority of cinemas also use Barco). So recently so, that a certain LCOS based projector company pulled out of supplying commercial cinemas. Just some of where Barco Residential excels is : - brilliant optics (this is huge, one of the most important aspects of the projector, similar to anyone that is familiar with DSLR cameras) - huge jump in processing capabilities on board (no need to add another device to bring it up to spec) - finest detail (as they point out in the video) - more cinematic feel, far more immersive - no fringing effects - cinemascope without cropping, blowing up and overshooting, or requiring an additional external lens - their Pulse Platform for one step processing is huge. It means all elements are processed at the same time and not in a chain. This eliminates a lot of fine detail issues in image quality (as the guys refer to as well in their comparison) - huge upgradeability. Barco Residential design their projectors to not only be capable of significant software updates but also hardware. You can purchase a cheaper projector but in 12 months time, some of the essential tech is obsolete...so you have to buy an entire new projector. Not so with Barco Residential. They have a far longer ownership life span Just look at the comparison they show on screen. The Barco Residential is rich with deeper and more colours, and that is no doubt more emphasised in person. My biggest suggestion always is rely on your eyes, not stats. Don't even listen to me or the team at HTE. Go see the products side by side which have been installed by guys who know what they are doing (like HTE). Stats are loosely governed and unless you are someone like Home Theatre Engineering with all the expensive equipment, not something easily measured.

@@dreamav8161 That’s all very well, but things like ‘more cinematic feel’ and ‘finest detail’ are AV woo-woo commonly conjured when no tangible rationale can be found, and I think you greatly damage the credibility of your statement here by including those. Like when people say vinyl ‘sounds warmer’ - entirely to do with internal biases towards the medium and nothing to do with how it sounds. If it’s not something measurable, it’s the Emperor’s New Clothes. I’ve lost count of the times I’ve been told something is appreciably better by someone who has just spent a lot of money on something, and yet as if by some sort of magic no one else can see what they are seeing. If you have a Sony or a JVC you are still paying a lot less even if you add a Lumagen and/or an anamorphic lens. So I don’t accept the ‘cinemascope without cropping’ or ‘huge jump in processing capabilities’ arguments either. And talk of what commercial cinemas use again doesn’t help your case here. It’s almost completely irrelevant to home installations. Cinemas have to concern themselves with max light output and workhorse components in projectors built like tanks, designed to run hot and incredibly bright for 16 hours a day, every day. These are completely different concerns to home users. Appreciate the effort you put into your post, I really do, but all it really tells me is what I already assumed: They’re for people with more money than sense. To quote Kris Deering “Did a comparison between it and a NX9 about a month ago with a few people including the Barco rep. Everyone picked the NX9 regardless of the content viewed. But Bragi can go brighter if needed depending on screen size. But then you could go 4500 or 5000es for more light.” That’s the problem with Barco projectors. They cannot compete outside of a cinema setting. Deering won’t even review them. What’s the point, he says. They’re bright, but the lack of contrast makes them a poor choice for home installs. They cannot even be rated on the same scale as JVC and Sony. And you can say that contrast is only one aspect of image quality and you would be right. But arguably it is the aspect that most impacts how we rate the images presented to us. And in terms of colour, detail, motion and everything else, the Sonys and JVCs are also excellent. Sorry, I just can’t see the argument for Barco at home unless your dedicated installation has 30+ seats and at least a 200-inch screen. So you have answered my question, and I thank you for that.

If you use Barco Commercial projectors at home, yes, they are too bright etc. and they are not designed for home use. Barco Residential is a different division and their projectors are designed for home use, specifically. They don't have the same contrast as the commercial units...they have far better. They are also nowhere near as bright. Yes, brightness is a concern for all screens, the bigger the screen the brighter the projector required. However the brighter the projector the harder it is to maintain high levels of contrast...for any brand. They take the lineage from their simulation and commercial tech then create what is for home residential cinema requirements. They are very different beasts. As to using words like "cinematic", well I appreciate you don't like them and fair enough, that is your choice, but that does not invalidate or diminish my points and dismiss any of the information provided. Do you then think for speakers words like bright and muddied are non compliant as well? Words like this are used at times as the performance belies the specs. I agree in speaker world there are a lot of weird terms and many are like wine tasting...but some are not. They are often a way to summarise the performance as a whole. Even the guys at HTE use these words as it is sometimes hard to describe how the image is to your own eye...and this is the point...use your own eye. There are brands out there that outright exaggerate their specs or worse. 99.9% of the population only have one tool to determine if this is true...their eyes (or in cases of speakers, their ears). Relying on specs as a basis for choice alone...good luck! Well how do you truly know those specs are correct? I mean seriously, a projector with Infinity contrast? If you are talking about such creditability, any brand that uses such measurements...well you can work that out for yourself. In addition, take a Hisense TV compared to a Sony with the same level of specs, but the Hisense is 30% less, but by the logic you have presented, being cheaper it still should be better or equal to as the specs are the same or better according to the manufacturer. The specs say so...but go look at the picture. They are nowhere near the same. The assumption you have made is that the specs put forward are true, especially in real life use. That is a dangerous assumption. As to price, let's look at a Sony 870 with lens + scaler versus a Bragi CS. The Sony is $29k RRP. Add a lens ($10k), a scaler ($11k)...total price is $50k. Same as Bragi CS. With the Bragi you also get a myriad of lenses with short focal stops (which anyone knows anything about lenses this is a key critical element) upgradeability and a whole earth of other features. But again, it's somewhat all irrelevant, you need to see the image to make the judgement. Contrast, yes it is a very good indicator of measurement to compare (if it's measured realistically). So is brightness at screen which is just as important especially if you want to hit HDR or even min Rec 709 fL ratings. Sharpness and convergence is also important, response rates etc. It is also somewhat irrelevant what the unit produces internally as well, but more relevant what it produces at the screen in the environment it is in, which is where measurements should be taken. So you can have all the best internals but put on an average lens...you lose so much of those benefits. Many brands also just quote on/off contrast as their spec. I even see reviewers doing this and noting their results as a basis for determination as what is good. As noted I said under real life scenarios (in the dynamics of watching a movie), those are not the measurements you want. They are irrelevant. It's what is produced ongoing with all the dynamics which is important. It's like saying I bought this car as it can go 300km/hr max and that is the only reason to buy a car. The thing is the car that is 250km/hr max happens to be such a better ride, smooth as silk, comfortable and gets to 250 km/hr faster. Let me put it this way as well please. I have two cameras in my hands and you cannot tell which is which except that I tell you one is 12mp, the other is 20mp. On that basis alone I ask you to pick. No questions to be asked either. My guess is you would say the 20mp. Then I say the 12mp is $500, the 20mp is $300. Ok, hold on. Do you still pick the 20mp. As to what you said above...yes, you would. Cheaper and so called better specs. means it must be better right? For some of us, we would start to doubt the 20mp. Something is just not right as it is way too cheaper. I finally tell you that the 12mp is a Nikon camera and the 20mp is a Polaroid. So what do you choose now? What produces the better image? Well the Nikon has a far better quality lens, better sensor, faster aperture response rate etc. etc. Nothing wrong with the Polaroid but the price is the lead factor here as to actual true performance. Please do not misunderstand me, I am not trying to say Sony is bad, or JVC etc. They are all class leading at their price points. Barco Residential is, as the guys say here, the "Rolls Royce". Your original question is "why buy a Barco" and I have tried to explain the potential reasons. Whether you value those or not is of your personal choice. You may feel that bang for buck a Sony or JVC at half price is better value. Again, that is only a decision you can make. As I said, at the end of the day, go see for yourself. Don't listen to me or any reviewer...it's irrelevant. Reports that say 90% of the people preferred one over the other...well it's easy to create this scenario (I could go into the psychology of leading outcomes and group consensus factor and other factors, but that is a complex area). I have first hand witnessed projectors side by side at shows and shoot-offs. Ones that say their specs are way better and it's amazing how often the so called "lower spec" unit had the better overall image at these higher end price points. Also how many times I have seen "experts" set up products incorrectly so the comparison doesn't work properly. Even if it is accurate, the only way to truly judge is to see it (or in the case - listen to it) first hand.

Sorry, I forgot to also add a few things. You stated that Kris Deering won't even look at Barco Residential projectors as they are for cinemas and don't have relevance to the home cinema market? Interesting... Why would a reviewer and calibrator not even consider a brand that is often used at this level...that is Barco Residential. Kind of weird that someone like himself would make a statement like that...I wonder why? ...but I can only go by what you have noted. If you want as well, look up John Bishop and about him and what he thinks of projection use in Home Residential projectors. Worth getting a balanced look from the other experts out there as well.

@@dreamav8161 I respectfully disagree with the entire premise of your argument - that specifications (or more to the point MEASUREMENTS) should be ignored and we should pay attention to how we ‘feel’ instead. It’s nonsense. Such belief proves only that the weakest link in most given set-ups is the human. Every aspect of a projectors’s performance can be measured. Light output, contrast, sharpness and detail, colour accuracy. This is not some intangible voodoo, it’s science. And both the Sonys and the JVCs outperform the Barcos in every important respect and in all cases a lot cheaper, bar the example you hand-picked on the basis of its vastly overpriced and incredibly poor value ARC-F lens array. I’m not even arguing that the Sonys and JVCs are better value for money. They are, but they’re also better projectors in the cases of the NX9 or 760. I will accept the Rolls Royce analogy. A Rolls Royce underperforms compared to many cars half its price and is marketed to the sort of wealthy dilettante who enjoys paying for a prestige brand he or she can wave in the faces of those who can’t afford it. But really I don’t think any of these analogies are helpful. We’re talking about projectors. Not cars, not cameras. The speaker analogy isn’t helpful either. You can hear ‘bright’. You can hear ‘muddy’ or ‘boomy’ - there is nothing of the wine-tasting cacoethes liquendi in those terms. Cinematic on the other hand is meaningless, unless you’re literally referring to the grey, washed-out quality you’ll typically experience down at your local multiplex. Because that I will believe. Interesting discussion, but neither of us is going to change the mind of the other. So let’s just have a chuckle and walk away. 😉