Can I pay for you to take me in your Cessna? FAR 61.113 & Holding Out Discussion w/Aviation Attorney

Рет қаралды 17,274

2 жыл бұрын

(Please Subscribe!). Aviation Attorney Greg Reigel comes back to the show to sit down with Dan (@TakingOffDan) to discuss the whole can or worms with taking money as a private pilot, starting with FAR 61.113 and also a discussion on what Holding Out is.
Greg Reigel: www.shackelford.law Email: GReigel@shackleford.law
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Пікірлер: 131

@Mooney201er 2 жыл бұрын

Greg may have made a mistake when it comes to pro rata share. I don’t believe the shares needs to be equal. 61.113c states “A private pilot may not pay less than the pro rata share of the operating expenses of a flight with passengers.” So for a flight with pilot + 3 passengers that costs $100 in gas, every occupant can chip in $25 or one passenger can pay $75. As long as the pilot does not pay less than $25, it doesn’t matter how much everyone else’s contribution is. The pilot could just as well pay for $70 worth of gas and the occupants chip in the other $30.

@Zalaniar

This video really doesn't clarify anything and just serves to confuse the topic. Holding out really means nothing to a private pilot, and 61.113 really means nothing to a commercial pilot, and you guys really didn't clearly define which you were talking about when. A commercial pilot can absolutely accept compensation or be hired for something prohibited by 61.113. Also, the lawyer guy really seemed to be ignoring Dan's question about things a private pilot CAN accept compensation for, such as towing gliders.

@glennwatson 2 жыл бұрын

Most of these regulations are just there as a "catch all" for people blatantly breaking the law, not the occasional $100 thrown your way to compensate you from a friend. Hard to regulate otherwise.

@mattalford3932

Thats dumb. I can take my friends in my car for gas money. Not commercial. I need no special licenses to drive random strangers around for profit. But if i fly my drone for fun and let a church use that footage. No compensation. No contract. According to the FAA thats commercial. So technically giving your friends a ride to a destination without compensation falls under the FAA definition of commercial use.

@barhammd

This podcast didn’t answer the question.

@Maddenj38 2 жыл бұрын

Good idea for a video topic but missed the mark with the execution - doesn’t seem there was great pre-planning. It is an awkward conversation and questions seemed very random, unarticulated, and hard to follow.

@robertwren2289 2 жыл бұрын

So basically, you can ask is anyone going to somewhere, and then share the cost or allow them to go for free. Let's be honest, this happens a lot with no issues. Friends talking with friends. The FAA needs to be investigated first. Do they do anything right?

@Avi8tor857 2 жыл бұрын

I've often wondered where KZfaq falls in this. Most aviation KZfaqrs are not commercial. They are making money from the video. I have always assumed it falls under the incidental clause. But as more people make videos taking higher risks for views one has to question will that be cracked down on.

@WolfPilot 2 жыл бұрын

Another money based regulation that has nothing to do with safety. It's also mostly unenforceable. Famous line from Training Day: It's not what you know, it's what you can prove

@sizzelot 2 жыл бұрын

Why cant the passenger just sign a waiver saying they are willing to take the risk with a private pilot? In a free country thats how it should work. If I as a member of the public would like to do something like a Cessna 172 tour from Seattle to Alaska I dont need government agencies telling me I cant in order to protect me from myself.

@DWAYNESutherland-lw2dh

Very informative session. Right on time for my CPL exam !!

@Anonymous99997 2 жыл бұрын

Yep. Sport Pilot training in your own plane got dealt a huge setback.

@Mrsournotes 2 жыл бұрын

Interesting discussion Dan.👍🏽

@Rudydugue 2 жыл бұрын

Hi Dan & Taking off team,

@hottrizzle 2 жыл бұрын

Wow!

@christopherbeddoe406 2 жыл бұрын

Interesting. Eventually I'd like to be able to get by commercial and atp.

@flyer617

If someone at the FAA wants to get you they will. Even taking a friend up for a free sightseeing flight can be considered a violation. After all, you are getting logable flight time which has some value in the eyes of the FAA. Since only the time required to establish currency is required to be logged, is the answer to this to not log the flight? No money, no log time benefit?

@KevinSmithAviation 2 жыл бұрын

Another excellent episode Dan thank you. Thank you Greg for making another appearance and helping everyone make better sense of the regulations. Keep up the great work. Safe sky's 🤘🇺🇸🛩️