A good fix could be, only the highest "Flammable" Effect matters. So the list won't add up to 120%. Remembering the Render Bull Centaur that crushed Cavallery way above their price? They might be buggy too. I hope you can make CA see these issues and work slightly on them. Just a tiny bit.

Read: anything that has the potential to be fun and effective needs to be preemptively removed from the game, because mp-playing morons can't play the game properly. Just git gud lmao if someone pulls this off on you they deserve the w.

i had to dislike this video. because you don't show health bar of these test subjects. incredibly annoying. yeee,..... it goes down fast! but no, it is not true 5:36. we can not see it.

The Warhammer 3 Chaos Dwarfs are looking to have all the same problems as the Warhammer Fantasy Chaos Dwarfs which led to them being removed from the game in the first place.

@@goazer2 yeah. they have a short legs.

The dwarfs do have a curse in their toungue for this treachery.

Yeah, accounting for that, the blunderbusses are doing 130% damage. The enemy is recieving double, so it is 260% of the original damage.

@@draegonspawn5361 It wouldn't be 130%, since damage is split into armor-piercing and base. Flaming sword buffs base damage only, and blunderbusses are mostly armor-piercing.

@@ineednochannelyoutube2651 oh I totally overlooked that detail, true.

I mean, in the goblin vs N'kari case N'kari has literally no armor and there are a LOT of goblins, and in the Blunderbus vs Skarbeand case its always been that way with gun units, they are able to melt single entities easily but in compensation they need perfect line of sight, (most) large single entities are able to stay away from them and do their job if managed properly while small single entities are able to ignore them by using other units including enemies as cover

I feel like there is some mathematical fuckery occuring. I think its probably something like this: if a unit had like 80% ward save then the 100% fire weakness doesnt mean they take 2x as much damange, it means they take an extra 5x as much damage because the ward save is applied and then the double damage takes the weapon strength not damage already done to unit. Maybe its not that but i have a feeling something like that

The problem here seems to be how accurate the Blunderbusses are. They are probably balanced around the idea they miss a bunch, but that doesn't seem to be the case at all vs lords and SEMs

@@pimentinha1121 they have always been good but there is good and then there is 2 shotting. N'kari does not currently get 2 shot by any other trash tier archers...

@@fieldmarshalgaig4856 i think you are on to something. would be nice with an example of them firing till the death on these same single entity units without the flame weakness on them. see how many volleys it would take because i kind of think that it would indeed take 5-6ish so would fit pretty well with that theory. gonna test this asap

Vial is a one time use to my knowledge

Agreed. Even tho N'kari melts to missiles anyway, but mazda or skarbrand normally wouldn't, so those few volleys seem more then 200% damage by quite a bit

The shotguns in this do high ap,magic and fire plus aimmed at a large still targets ,add balanced for missing

The fire weakness bonus damage might be unaffected by armor and other resistances, then it would actually make sense from math perspective

@@RiskOfBaer another comment mentioned it could be multi rather than additive

Looking at the combo first a majority AP inaccurate shotgun ,on a large still target in close range ,being buffed up with fire and magic + potential of more damage due to sword(spell,unsure off hand) and the target getting hit by a limited use item + other setup (& WoM use)

I bet I know why, it's not taking the base level if they're already buffed. So 120% of normal damage for the first buff for example and then 140% of the increased 120% instead the base 100%.

@@a-walpatches6460 hmm,good point

wrong

I agree with the exception of Ash Storm. This ability is so massive that it's basically a 20% damage buff to your entire army, not to mention that it slows so it's incredibly powerful for stopping flanks from calvary or doggos. The size of this abiltiy and the duration needs some hefty adjustments.

​@@sionbarzad5371 inmo it depends if it's campaign or multiplayer. In campaign it doesn't matter because it's vs the AI But in mp the enemy players can counterplay this depending on their tools (Cathay for example can use the reverse uno card on the focused unit)

@@BucketKingu Ash Storm started looking a lot worse to me when I realized that Lore of Fire does something very similar as a lore passive. Kindleflame is a *global* 15 second 20% weakness to fire debuff, vs. Ash Storm which is 32/48 seconds of 20% weakness in a limited area. And Ash Storm isn't super cheap or anything at 10/14 WoM. For fewer winds, you could cast both Fireball and Flame Cloak and trigger Kindleflame twice.

​@@gabrielmelnik6796 Game design always matters, don't make excuses for the AAA company lol

He should be immune really, fire does no damage, he is a goddamn hell spawn ffs then, to compensate, make him suffer more damage from light or ice, idk. But it's weird indeed, how the devil can be killed with fire

Okay if this guy is legit, I want a wardancer to kill Archaeon with a branch. It is equally ridicolous.

Right lol

A lot is ok. Being broken is not ok.. simple concept.

@@GothPaoki and being broken means you need a spell, a debuff, and a one time use item to hit all at once on a stationary monster? i think people are, as always, over exagerating, just like everyone is doing with the bull centaurs calling them super op and comparing them with cavalry without realizing they literally are just minotaurs that cost 150 more gold in exchange for some more hp

​@@GothPaoki even in a controlled setting like this he said that he missed some of the effect of kindleflame on Skarbrand

That isn't true at all. There have been plenty of new factions that weren't OP. In fact I would say most of them haven't been.

Yes they all stack and good list.

Flaming Sword doesn't give weakness to fire. Imbues fire damage to friendly units.

Kindleflame is global weakness to fire after casting a spell, not just one unit

I see, thank you. Edited list. :>

Sigvald's infantry sized all the shots just miss don't worry

@@Nota-Skaven he’s too sexy to die

Also he has a shield.

I dont really get how this wouldn't be useful against players? Ash storm+ Flare+ Kindle flame is more than enough to destroy a unit of elite cavalry or infantry. This little thing doesn't just cover legendary lords. Ashstorm has a slow effect as well which would make a play like this quite easy to pull off if you know how to build a formation ranged units can shoot through. I think it'd be pretty easy to do this against a player.

It's going to get changed. Are people seriously thinking this will stay in the game? There's about 0% chance of that happening.

@@Quicksilver_Cookie Yes, it will stay, because 1: it's no more powerful than just getting a bunch of ranged units to focus on the one enemy and 2: it's much better on paper (or in this case, quick battle) than in practice. Lots of factions reward micro in the same way as this.

@@IronSquid501 No, my dude. It's not the same as focusing other ranged units. Because this only requires a few of them, not a dozen to achieve the same effect. Also, casting one spell and ordering units to attack isn't some peak macro, it's trivial. It will definitely get changed at least for a reason that numbers don't even work correctly. It increases damage like fivefold, instead of doubling it. Thinking this will stay is madness.

@@Quicksilver_Cookie Have you ever played a gun-heavy army? 3 or 4 units of tier-2 gunners can delete lords like Skarbrand in the same amount of time with zero buffs, in perfect testing conditions. But as Zerk pointed out, you're rarely going to have "perfect testing conditions." Lords usually aren't going to sprint at your gunline, alone, while allowing you to hit all your debuffs and letting you get 2 volleys off. This is a strong tactic if you can plan your battle line around it, but it's nowhere near overpowered.

@@IronSquid501 What you are saying is that a unit of tier-2 gunners will kill a lord like Skarbrand in just 3-4 volleys...We're playing different games, apparently. Because it's complete nonsense, no matter how perfect the conditions are.

Someone failed class

@@jtowensbyiii6018 Don't worry, I'm sure there's a resit you can take.

A close range and still large target against majority AP magic fire shotguns?

Not that damn fast, though. Off the top of my head there's maybe 1500 points of damage per unit per 10 seconds, best case. That means two units of thunderers need half a minute of uninterupted shooting to kill a big thing like Skarbrand.

@@languidspider5252 But with a lot fewer combination gimmicks required! Your math is also wrong. Two thunderers don't need 30 seconds to kill Skardy

I’ve wondered if many of these people ever seen what Sisters of Avelorn can do without debuffs, buffs, and a warning shot from a lord 😂. I don’t play competitive multiplier but I watch it a lot. I rarely see them get used much on it. Idk if it’s because of cost or house rules. But in single player- I’m not sure I’ve heard anyone call so heavily to nerf them. To be fair, I wasn’t around when SOA’s were originally released.

Most people just play single player, so it is a major problem.

Good luck keeping mid tier infantry alive against a Magma cannon which seems to delete everything it hits

@@Starstreak170 Yes, most people play single player and I do not see why this is a problem at all. There are tons of way to derp out, cheese or generally abuse the hell out of the AI anyways, this is just a more honest way to doing it.

@@toxicfireball2690 Now the magma cannon, as it currently is, is quite abit more troublesome than this gimmick.

@@Starstreak170 How so? You can just choose not to do it. It's not like AI is goona do it to you.

No it won’t lol. The AI are brain dead and just walk at you, you could do this easily

you can't even tell because the DLC isn't released yet. we just see some ytubers playing it whilst having more or less multiplayer skills. kinda weird to judge it as beeing "very hard" to work in multiplayer. 1 spell and 2 archers are very cheap ressources for such an effect which can be executed very very easy. this is actually a big problem. same with Bull Centaurs. there needs to be some balancing

I'd withhold judgement until it's released. If your Lord gets hit with a bunch of weakness to fire maybe just run him away?

Chaos Dwarf's price tag on their good unit is really high, this kind of scenario essentially half of your army's best units focus on one target which gonna hurt anyway with any other factions.

@@DOSFS Yeah and have your opponent have Skarbrand just kind of run at you straight on.

how is it hard to pull off? 1 spell and 2 hobgobbo archers? this is rediculous

Delusional apologist

@@HomerJSimpson999 stack those units up like that and any MP regular with half a brain will know the shit you’re trying to pull

The oneshot setups feel like more of a gimmick, but I think the scary thing is that they can get to 80% just with Blood of Hashut + the gun/Kindleflame/Ash Storm. That seems like it's fairly easy to set up with just a Sorcerer Prophet. A Fire Sorcerer Prophet in particular can give any unit in the game over double damage for a short time with Blood of Hashut + Flaming Sword, once you take everything into account (80% fire weakness, -40% armor, +25/30% base damage from Flaming Sword, magical attacks if they have phys resist).

@@darkChozo8 Again though, this requires you bringing a Sorcerer Prophet in the first place, and considering how strong the Chaos Dwarf Lords are, that's a pretty big sacrifice to make. I'd much rather face this kind of synergy than have to deal with Astragoth all game.

One use combo

Content creators get early access.

Meh, 5 years of dominance please don't cry that finally there is a race that is a counter to the dominant vamp meta for half a decade.

Bait it out,it is a heavy investment that is easy to see coming

You make reasonable points. The only global map debuff is kindle flame, correct? Vile is a one time use. The range lord has to shoot at an enemy. Flaming sword of ruin has a cool down. I doubt the player will be able to use this strategy to eliminate an entire 20 stack but the player might be able to use it to eliminate key targets. It would take a bit of micro by triggering the spells and aiming the lords shot to get this off on maybe 2-3 units at most (I think this is being generous since vile is one use) in single player. Plus, the enemy will be approaching and will probably try flanking. In multiplayer-a smart player will probably hold back higher value targets or distract the shooters or lord with chaff. If he player waits to use it, the other player can play around it by keeping the SE out outside the range of vile and shooters until they’re locked down. I’m welcome to be proven wrong once an actual competitive test is run and against an AI that’s actually heading in to fight the player or a PVP match.

Fire,magic and high AP on a unit most likely to be balanced with a good deal of missing on a large still target

Equally keep in mind this is literally perfect conditions

@@honorguard7616 This particular case may be the perfect condition that allows for a 100% fire-weakness. HOWEVER Through all the tools they have, achieving 40%-60% fire weakness on their target is incredibly easy. And with all the fire damage they got in their roster, it's a tad bit too powerful.

If it does get nerfed (wich i doubt) it will be a small nerf, because its not that units are too strong or anything, its just a good combo that needs decent timing that you will most probably not be able to do in the middle of normal battle.

Fiiiiine. But please can I have some fun with it first?

It relies pretty heavily on a number of situational elements, not the least of which is a once per battle item. Sure it will hurt pretty bad if you just...leave your massive bullet sponge out in the open as vial of hashut comes out and flaming sword of rhuin hits two full units of blunderbusses

@@Freekymoho at close range...

The nature of TW games means aggression will *always* beat passivity.

@Michael You cant apply it to legendary difficulty of most of the factions campaign and to dawi of course.As quantity AI better than you at early game inevitably so surviving until late game and surprass AI by doomstacks one of the most popular tactics.

It's CA. Their dev team is people that are constantly falling over, smacking their head on the toilet bowl and then they go back to their terminals to apply that brain damage to the code in their games. The 'fire weakness' is probably doing something like applying 2,000% damage instead of 100% because someone added an extra zero or or a piece of old code that should've been cleaned-up long ago got triggered or God knows what.

If you know about the danger, never. It's basically the same as letting your lord get trapped with a snare or a net, and then getting shot to pieces with handgunners. Everybody knows not to do that. And it will be even easier to avoid against Chaos Dwarfs, since Blunderbusses have such a pitiful range and this strategy works best with them since their damage burst is incredible. In general I doubt Blunderbusses will be useful at all in multiplayer since they have so many disadvantages for a premium ranged unit: Their range is horrible, they need LOS to shoot at the enemy, and they are way too slow. Too easy to play around. But they will work wonders against AI, they are the new best unit at sniping lords and large monsters because of just how much damage they do in a single volley (+ how easy it is to multiply it with fire weakness).

Sounds like someone who's never won a game with Accusation and handgunners lmao. That's one of my favorite empire builds to play. I use Okham's Mind Razor overcaste with it as well.