CYC Photon, can it be reliable? - Back from repair, my experience with the warranty process.

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High Voltage DIY Electric Bikes and Vehicles

8 ай бұрын

This video is a look at my experience with the repair and warranty process after my CYC Photon motor developed a fault. Also in this video is a look at the chain ring removal tool that is being produced to replace the original one that came with the kit. Please feel free to leave comments on the video or join in the discussion on our discord server. highvoltagekits.com/discord
Thanks to / @hiphopsuperman for the video clip used.
and / @oneshotquesters for the D20 video clip

Пікірлер: 106

@mixermanbear.4002 8 ай бұрын

I’ve been running a BBS02 for 8 plus years now. I have about 20 thousand miles on it. It has performed flawlessly the entire time. Knock on wood.

@muramusan 8 ай бұрын

Besides the bearings giving out or the clutch pawl mine has been great 😂

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah. I think people want this way more than bells and whistles.

@uvwuvw-ol3fg 8 ай бұрын

@alank808 8 ай бұрын

AS to the hammering on the bike or motor. I think I may have caused my only failure to a bbs02, pas feature, hammering the lock ring tight. I did this long ago on a new unit. Replace the board to the pas with no results. Not going to throw money on controller and magnet replace. Can buy another new complete setup for $360.00. Just use this as a off road motor on trail bike that I would not have used the pas anyway. Live and learn @@uvwuvw-ol3fg

@patrickbonin137 8 ай бұрын

3 years with a good old fashioned BBSHD I am sure the high voltage team could come up with a torque sensor solution..you might not be a engineer but your the best ebike developer I have come across....keep going one day you will come up with your own motor design 😅

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Looking more at the DM01 from TOSEVEN in this regard. In early testing. I think it's more viable than trying to engineer the bbshd. 72 volts test this week I hope.

@polunu 8 ай бұрын

If only someone besides Garmin made the pedals with built-in load cells, otherwise it would need a spindle made for the specific bb width I think. I love my bbshd, but my next bike will be a bafang ultra-capable full suspension frame that can fit the cottonmouth motor, hope they get smooth torque sensing with that kit.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah we are going to try and develop the TS for the cotton mouth. We have a few candidates. We need to get a base version up to speed initially though as adding too many variables is asking for trouble! I am modeling some parts at the moment that should allow the tensioning to work with a full suspension frame.

@ericfleetwood6744 11 күн бұрын

Great video; very helpful. CYC is targeting the enthusiast willing to spend more to get a better product and experience. A 3-6% failure rate could drive their targeted Photon customer toward Bosch.

@HighVoltageKits 7 күн бұрын

Yeah. I tend to agree. With a bit of luck they can get that rate down.

@bobbybecker80 Ай бұрын

Really interesting and instructive. I have eight years of off road riding in pretty severe terrain with a BBS02 with neither maintenance nor problems. My son and a friend have had similar results.

@HighVoltageKits Ай бұрын

Thanks. The bbs stuff is really overbuilt. I think they dropped the ball a bit on making a torque sensing version but that gap seems to be closing now.

@MumfordJim 8 ай бұрын

Would like to see you diagnose what caused the problem. Yes they should include the better tool.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Sounds good. Cheers

@alank808 8 ай бұрын

Nice video. Well said without bad mouthing them. I have two of their units but just last wk. bought another BB bafang as the cost vs reliability on their units are superior. Also had to return my Photon. The stealth gen 3 continues to perform as it should. Photon as a BBSHD killer has not happened as they advertised. Thousands of miles on BB motors with only 1 pas failure. Not bad

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah a bbshd killer it's not. Although I think its taking some sales away. No ill will to CYC. It's just being fair to everyone.

@justinshields7501 8 ай бұрын

Hopefully if you have any problems in the future they will send you a gen 2 version. I've been holding off for a long time for the proton. Now that it's going to be even longer. I'm really considering the toseven DM01. Love your videos Thanks 👍

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Now that would be nice. I'd be happy to review it. In terms of the DM01 and 02 I will do some comparisons. Can't say they are more reliable as it stands as it's just too early. I know of people with issues on those as well.

@robburley9494 8 ай бұрын

Yes thats a great idea you guys come up with a torque sensor for the BBSHD I would order one on release day

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

We are working with the TOSEVEN DM01 which has a torque sensor. It's a bit beyond us to implement one into the BBSHD. Bafang are doing one but it's locked behind CANBUS.

@claverton 8 ай бұрын

would love to see your analysis on this motor

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

on it

@blackmilkmusic3123 8 ай бұрын

thanks for review .I was thinking to upgrade my bike with this motor ,but glad that I found your channel .you saved me from being an idiot. for the price of this little crap I can buy a propper new frame and the motor like bafang M620 ultra ..way better .

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

It's a shame it has these issues as the torque sensor is really good. Lets see how long it lasts once its back on the bike.

@Bengy22 8 ай бұрын

Such a shame because it did seem like a really nice motor when you first reviewed it, why it's good to always wait for long term reviews

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah. I guess I took one for the team.

@mickp10 8 ай бұрын

Thanks for the video. Would be really interested in your thoughts of why it failed and what changes they need to make

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

You are welcome. I will sort something out!

@claudefournier4940 8 ай бұрын

Thanks for the video. I am also interested by your analysis and follow-up.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

You are welcome. I will put something together.

@michaelsprinzeles4022 8 ай бұрын

It's too bad, I had some hopes for this motor. You have a long history of being spot on so I'll stay tuned in to find out how the Photon does long term. I hope that the DM01 runs more reliably (& they come out with a 120mm version). For now it seems that the BBSHD is the only reliable mid-drive option for a 120mm BB (unless you go with a double chain mid-drive).

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

There is one up to 110mm. Not seen one yet tho. In terms of reliability it's unknown to some extent. The ASI should expose weaknesses though!

@michaelsprinzeles4022 8 ай бұрын

@@HighVoltageKits Unfortunately 110 is not 120 and my Dolomite ALX requires every mm of 120:(

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah I have made them aware of this. It would not work with the fatboy either

@uvwuvw-ol3fg 8 ай бұрын

Someone on aliexpress was complaining that BBSHD nylon gear was rattling requiring to loosen it's internal cover. That seemed like a strange thing to do. Mine seems to have developed frame resonance/vibration as if IPM motor rotor is unbalanced. It might have started after having to hammer in some hex bit in a worn out rear axle. The shock load might have damaged something inside the motor such as magnets which are said to be sensitive to impacts. Shame there is no way to compare to previous state since it's impossible to memorize every detail and sound. There were also some problems with uneven sprag clutch drag on BBSHD and excessive thurst bearing drag after tightening Lekkie Pro HD cover up to specified 6Nm (currently 2Nm with threadlock). Another thing was intermittent cadence sensor failure which I had no other choice but to disable the cadence sensor to reduce the probability of unexpected acceleration at intersections and use throttle for hills only.

@michaelsprinzeles4022 8 ай бұрын

@@uvwuvw-ol3fg Sounds like you got a dud. My only issue, so far, was frying the stock controller. It was entirely my fault for testing if it could climb a steep hill in high gear on throttle alone. I swapped the controller for a 50 amp and have put on a couple of thousand trouble free (& quiet) miles. I did buy a replacement gear, just in case, when I bought the motor but 6 years later I still haven't replaced the original. I also have a BBS02 which has been trouble free but it is set up to be "class 2" & hasn't seen more than 1k miles. I don't have the Lekkie cover. I do have a 42T Bling Ring on the 02 & a 42T Eclipse on the HD. I doubt it effects much but perhaps the cover makes a difference.

@user-sk4dv4kn2m 8 ай бұрын

I have experience of cyc (direct) watrenty. I have been riding the Photon/Sw102 on a Harry vs Larry Bullitt cargo bike and loving the ride feel it still makes me happy to ride. It is our main transport (quicker than car) and halls the jids and weekly shopping no problems. In the UK and so running 25kph and 250w. But here is where the problems start. Mine has twice been stuck on 29" wheel, and i have been unable to change back to 26" that it should be. Cyc have sent one replacement SW102, which fixed it for several months before the problem happened again. Another is on thw way. Apparently they know about thia issue, but i am the only one who has had it happen twice?! The second issue is that the motor cuta out early. 21kph full 250w. 22kph i get about 170w and by 23koh around 100w. 24kph and 25kph. 0w. Thia is really frustrating trying to be legal and cycle in traffic. Cyc's response has always been super polite. And trying to be helpful. New sw102 sent out no issues (once videos evidincing issue provided). But i am concerned what will happen after the watrenty, and frustrated they are not doing a firmware fix (as this is clear a fw bug). The early speed cut out is less serious, but way nore frustrating. I have tried to reach out in this several times. Customer service agents wikl seem to understand, but then technical advise this is how it is designed. This ia with all FW inc their latest by link only. So, be warned buy a photon wiht sw102 and you may get atuck in 29" in the end, and with a 250w /25kph. Youll inly ever get assistance to 23kph. That all said, wheb i cqn put all that iut of my mind. It is still great to ride. If you dont care about uk legals, just bump up apeed limiter and you wont notice the issue!!!

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Sounds like frustrating problems. Because essentially if you were to be stopped and checked you would have to argue why you changed the settings to be more than the speed limit and more than the permitted power. Although in reality all of those bosch ones that claim 250 are actually pushing out more. There is no real way to test them by the side of the road and the reporting of power is self governed. IE they set their own tests. If you look at the torque they put out there is no way 250 watts can cut it. I am pretty sure I do not have the 29" bug. I will check the speed and power at 25kph.

@user-sk4dv4kn2m 8 ай бұрын

Thanks for reply. Love the channel!. It is most evident ona long slow uphill drag. The most expensive thing for me so far is that it broke the internals of my Alfine 11! (Not a strong hub, but what was on bike. Prob low gearing I have for hills too and a cargo bike that is often me (70kg), bike (35kg) and weeks shopping (50-60kg). Now have Alfine 8, reduced torque on 1+2, and not doing sprint starts from lights anymore. Lesson learned.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah the internal hubs are not that strong under load especially the ones with more gears. Actually the Photon itself is possibly not the best motor for a cargo bike in truth. It's a little bit small with small internals. For the same reason the Tong Shen struggled with cargo bikes.

@user-pv6hk9pd5y 8 ай бұрын

Man, I also had high hopes on this motor. I was about to purchase one in the next month, but now I'm not sure. I'll hold off on it and see if you can get it up to 10,000 km after this repair. That tool issue may be deal breaker though for me even if the repair works.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah. I am interested to see what will change for Gen 2. It's a shame as the torque sensor feels great.

@bujin5455 8 ай бұрын

I agree 100% of thoughts and feelings expressed here.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Cheers!

@monkeymagic4555 8 ай бұрын

A pre aware to all live youtube stream one evening or sunday afternoon (obviously with chat turned on) would be the way to go probably starting about 6pm UK time would cover globally best for that kind of thing.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

As in to have a chat about the Photon. I'll see if I can rig it up. Maybe do the reinstall on one. I'll give it some thought

@hiphopsuperman 8 ай бұрын

I was so frustrated when I needed to come up with that tool to remove the chainring. And yes, my chainring is now pretty banged up from whacking that cheap tool with a hammer. I've thought of designing a simple printable template for anyone who needs to make their own tool like mine. (i.e: a PDF showing placement for the 5 holes, drill them into a 1x4, Insert five M8 bolts, etc...). Maybe I will get around to that.... Here are my thoughts as someone who has had a few problems with my Photon (and use my bike as a daily commuter, over 2600km on my Photon so far). I'll play devils advocate. I pre-ordered this motor knowing it hadn't been broadly tested by the public. I went in knowing I'm taking a risk. Can we really act surprised that CYC is working on Photon Gen 2, when they are already up to Gen 3 on the X1 and Stealth? That's what they do. If anything, I hope they will provide a means of upgrading the OG Photon to this Gen 2 version. I also don't think they should need to send this tool out for free to anyone who ordered the Photon. In very few cases does the chainring even need to be removed for repairs. You don't need to remove it to replace either the Controller, nor the motor. And with a single chainring, it likely last the life of the motor. I do however wish they used a standard format like you mention in the video. What they should do is find a way to make this tool cheaper, and figure out a way to ship it for less than $40... That's just crazy.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Some good thoughts. I tend to agree with you history does point at multiple generations. Although I was hoping that after 3 years of development this might not be the case here. In terms of send them out for free. I mean if this was the auto industry and it was part of a recall they would have to. I think if a person orders a new chain ring they or runs into problems they should consider it. That tool is machined from Alu so making it cheaper might be limited. I doubt they are trying to profit from it. We will have to wait and see what they do in terms of the next gen of it. I know where I see weak points but where do they? Can they be fixed without fundamentally changing the design. Appreciate the use of the video clip.

@Jubei700 8 ай бұрын

I had a faulty Photon, mine had a faulty torque sensor, and I had to return mine to the dealer in the UK to be replaced, and I found myself in the same position of not being able to remove the lockring. Like you I returned mine with the chainring still attached and they removed and returned it with the new motor. I have a couple of thoughts. 1. I also think that in most cases the chainring need never be removed. The tool that is included with the kit exists only to INSTALL the lockring, and is not really meant to remove it again. 2. Expanding on the above, i don't think the tool applies force in the correct direction to remove the lockring. It doesn't apply purely rotational force, but instead pushes the lockring sideways in it's threads. Using the official removal tool applies rotational force at the centre applied evenly between all five pins. On trying to remove mine I eventually bent one of the pins on the tool and deformed the pin holes, without slipping a pin out. It could never have worked.

@Frombie_01 8 ай бұрын

I read an article a few years ago on the rapid advancement of the EV industry in China. It covered everything from scooters (kick boards) to cars and and commercial vehicles as well as safety and reliability. In a nutshell it basically stated that the Chinese consumer was not just the manufacturing industries R&D departments but also their crash test dummies. Also, that the Chinese government had/has no interest in legislating and enforcing any standards, due to industrial production and manufacturing exports driving employment, their economy as well as systemic corruption. I suppose similar to their construction industry.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

I have read some interesting things as well. Some videos as well. They are certainly pushing hard to electrify. Usually when there is a push like that standards go out of the window. CYC are meant to be be getting a CE rating on the Photon. But that's safety not engineering I think

@Frombie_01 8 ай бұрын

@@HighVoltageKits The problem as I see it with the CE ratings is that as I understand it they are self reporting. To my mind that is about as reliable/believable as when I tell my son that he can play soccer with his mates when he has done his homework.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

HAHAHAHAHAHA as someone with two boys that tickled me! You might have a point. Did you know the power ratings are also self reported. Which is how Bosch gets away with saying stuff is 250 watts even when the rated Torque increases year on year.

@NamelessPassenger 8 ай бұрын

Damn...i was looking to get one. It's pricey but i love the minimal footprint it is with torque sensor. I may have to look for tongsheng. Don't get me wrong, i heard good thing about bafang casdese sensor but the unit is just too large and goofy on my frame.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Might be worth checking out the TOSEVEN videos I have in the channel video lists. There is a small version of that one thats a bit like the TongSheng in size but way better in terms of the internals. I will have a quick video on it today. It's called the DM02. They are also new motors though so I can't say they will last like the Bafang although they are a different design to the CYC.

@NamelessPassenger 8 ай бұрын

@@HighVoltageKits thanks for your recommended but i couldn't find To7 supply here in Australia. Even Tongsheng also very hard for me to get my hand on due to low stock. The most common ebike kit here were all Bafang. My bike frame is also a folding one so maybe i should look into hub motor or invest into better bike with nice frame.

@kiwiscoot2318 3 ай бұрын

Thanks for your great videos. I have a BS01 that has finally died after about 8 years. I am considering this motor. How has your experience been since the repair? How many miles/kms trouble free?

@HighVoltageKits 2 ай бұрын

Sorry missed this. It ran for thirty kms and now issues again with random power cuts. I need time to diagnose it.

@tamholt3494 8 ай бұрын

That mounting tool really turned me off of the Photon when I first saw it getting reviewed. It looks so poorly thought out. I use a soft hammer on the stamped metal tool that came with my BBS02b to lock the inner ring down, but the little nubs on the Photon tool would shear right off if I tried that

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

I tried using a mallet and it was a no go. If I was developing I would have tasked a person to install and take it off again and again. Problems like this should reveal themselves. Maybe they did and were just not listened to. That happens alot too.

@claverton 8 ай бұрын

Yes, you hit on the nub of the problem with this motor; it sells for a high price, it is expensive so as a consumer you would rightfully expect to receive a premium top quality product with a very low failure rate and long life ... this doesn't appear to be the case here

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

It's a high rate for the price. The warranty is good but it still is a time suck.

@jackserna3440 Ай бұрын

I would really like to see a mid drive motor that is compatible with aftermarket chainrings and cranks. I want to convert my gravel bike, but I don't want it to look like shite.

@HighVoltageKits Ай бұрын

Fair point. Gravel bikes are great. Most Bafang motors can use aftermarket. The CYC is proprietary sadly but they are not hideous looking

@jackserna3440 Ай бұрын

@@HighVoltageKits A lot of cyclists, myself included, want to see the bling. It feels like a downgrade if there's no bling. That and the heating issues give me pause. I can wait another decade for the tech to catch up, if that's what it takes. I need the exercise anyways.

@georgemacheel2039 8 ай бұрын

I was about to buy this motor to boost me over hills that overstress my 77 year old heart. Adding 15 lbs to my 22 lb cross bike seems like an elegant solution-much better than forking out $7k for the purpose built electric bicycle from Trek, Specialized, Cannondale and the like. So how does the reliability/performance of these conversion motors compare to the likes of Bosch? Are purpose-built electric bikes more reliable because the motors are detuned? If not, why can’t someone build a conversion motor that can compete?

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

I think that part of the issue with me was that I was banging 2000 watts into the Photon. It was being run unrestricted. Which is permitted by the warranty. But might not be wise for longevity. I also know people who have had issues from the get go. It's frustrating because I am pretty sure that you will like the torque sensor. The Bosch stuff is likely going to be more reliable. But no less of a pain to fix. I think it could work for you quite well as you are only looking for a boost to get you over the hills and keep you doing what you love. There is also the TOSEVEN DM02 which I have some video on. It's also new so longevity is upproven. It's quite a bit cheaper. In terms of Bosch and Shimano... they just have huge development budgets. If the choice is between $7k though and a conversion motor you can buy a motor, spares and a much bigger battery for 1/3 the cost and still enjoy a bike you know and love. So despite reliability issues I think it is still the way I would go.

@Silver4567z 8 ай бұрын

@@HighVoltageKits People with issues from the get go are probably part of the usual 1%. I bet they can thank their 2000 watts unrestricted mode for that 6% failure rate otherwise it would be 1% like any other product.

@larrym2434 8 ай бұрын

@@Silver4567z I'm not putting high wattage through my Photon, but I'm still having problems with motor intermittently cutting out. So now I'm going through vagaries of troubleshooting. Also, the CY app acts strangely in edge cases, so overall, I don't have a great impression of CYC.

@SteveLyons57 7 ай бұрын

What is the torque spec for the chain ring retaining cap? I can’t seem to tighten mine very much before a feel the axle binding for 5-10 deg of the 360 rotation. Any thoughts why that might be happening?

@HighVoltageKits 7 ай бұрын

I'm slightly confused about the axle part. I thought the axle went through after the chainring was secured. I make sure the threads are engaged correctly. You are welcome to post a quick video clip on our Discord server. If something is binding it does not sound quite right. There should be a Discord link in the video description. The part that holds on the chain ring should finish flush. You can't put a torque number on it really with that tool. I got mine tight by hand and it's been ok.

@Silver4567z 8 ай бұрын

What caused the problem? using it unrestricted at 1500 watts ? High speed ? I heard they disabled the heat protection sensor. If their motor can't take it and is more like a 750w bbs02 Maybe they should remove things like the unrestricted mode.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

I think its a 500 watt motor for most conditions. It's winter here so we can see how it behaves in cooler weather. But it throttles pretty fast at 750+. What caused the sensor to fail could be many things but I thing constant high heat cannot be a good thing.

@TheRickurb 6 ай бұрын

Bingo

@FarmingGoneWild 8 ай бұрын

The original v shaped tool is just a cheap hydraulic cylinders Assembly tools. Its not proprietary.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Interesting. I had assumed they had made it. Off the shelf then I guess.

@alank808 8 ай бұрын

I`m reasonably sure they had it made for the kit. Even the replacement tool everyone is lauding about is not new tech. Most any tool design has been made before. Modifying the fit does not mean someone invented it. CYC just didn`t anticipate the seizing problem with the photon chain ring. In all fairness to consumer the new tool should be made available, which it is, for reasonable price, $18.00. The shipping cost is the issue. Bafang nor any other motor company includes the tools needed to work on their units. Look at the cheesy wrench that comes with Bafang to tighten the bbracket nut. And no allen wrench to install the chain ring. Now the failure rate is the real issue here. That is not going to get them on the top shelf for sure. @@HighVoltageKits

@jackserna3440 Ай бұрын

If the motor heat is trapped inside, can't you just put thermal pads or thermal paste in between the outer shell and motor shell so that the heat can properly transfer to the outer shell and dissipate through the fins? Is CYC doing this going forward?

@HighVoltageKits Ай бұрын

Hey Jack. With an inrunner that’s easily doable. But this is an outrunner and filling that gap is not possible. It would stop the motor turning.

@muramusan 8 ай бұрын

I also that that it was insane that even the motor is potted 😅 like just use a gasket 😢

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

The controller definitely is. Not sure about the motor core based on photos. I have a few to show though so we can have a look.

@TimChump 7 ай бұрын

CYC look great but just break. Stealth Gen 3 owner died at 1600 miles, took 3 months to repair. Have a BBS02 as a back up now thank god. I will never buy another CYC

@HighVoltageKits 7 ай бұрын

Three months is a long time to be without a bike. I was lucky in that I could give my wife something else to ride.

@CamiloSantana 8 ай бұрын

you're 💯 on it being wrong to use customer bar as beta testers. it's theft of your time, peace of mind, life and money.

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Yeah. Video game developers do it as well..Release it half baked and the drop patches. Only with hardware it's not possible. In cars it would be a recall...

@alank808 8 ай бұрын

Sell the unit to the public and the company gets thousands and thousands of test hrs. for free. This is not the first nor last industry to do this. It would take a company yrs. to accumulate the amt. of test hrs. in one wk. of consumers use. Not maybe right but the way it is.

@gaby90210 8 ай бұрын

Told you: Toseven DM01- Dm02 !! :D if you want 2000w ...

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

I should be testing 72 volts this week on both.. weather allowing!

@noe616 4 ай бұрын

Yes, that chairing tool is useless. I'm running a 50t chairing, and it's really good for city commuting. If a 53t becomes available, I'll take it.

@HighVoltageKits 4 ай бұрын

I wish I had got the 50t Its a better all round one. Lesson learned.

@lanabyk8012 3 ай бұрын

The photon is too expensive....

@HighVoltageKits 3 ай бұрын

It’s not cheap especially when it’s still broken :(

@SkyGizmmo 8 ай бұрын

My money will be on the To Seven working out their production. I would not roll the dice on any CYC at this time. 3 years of development ....what a sad commentary the resulting field testing experience is currently. I am being kind to say that the tool issue is a joke and is further reason NOT buy a potential as inop brick that is NOT serviceable without paying shipping... Yeah F that!

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

In the interests of fairness I can't say that TOSEVEN are more reliable as it stands because they are so new to the market. In terms of the Photon I think there is nothing wrong with having a service option via dealers. But it should not be the only realistic option. I think maybe they spent all this time designing the neatest most compact package they could and not much beyond. The fact they are now rushing out a tool to remove the chainring hints that this part was not well planned for.

@Bamboothought 8 ай бұрын

Dude , I honestly think you are the problem.....I realized that when you were unable to operate a simple adjustable pin spinner , I’ve installed two photon motors and they do need proper installation and it’s not for everyone , it requires someone with an aptitude for mechanical processes, and problem solving abilities. Like I said it’s not for everyone.....

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

Nothing I could have done would have prevented the hall sensors from failing. There was nothing about the installation that would have affected that part of the motor. Regardless of my skill or not with a pin spanner which I agree is not something I have encountered before. The failure of a hall sensor is not related. Both my installations the motor worked. Otherwise I would not have been able to make bunch of videos. If you can explain to me how the failure of a hall sensor is somehow my fault I would love to hear it. The Pin spanner supplied is garbage and the fact that CYC are themselves making a better one goes to show that its not fit for purpose. Installing two Photon motors yourself with no issues does not make you the definitive source on this. Nor does it invalidate anything I have said. But you are free to think what you want and construct a scenario where the Photon has no issues and it's my incompetence. Does that mean everyone else with issues is also incompetent?

@alank808 8 ай бұрын

Mine failed with 500 miles on it. 48volts with no alterations to factory settings. Never off rd. on a street bike. Just quit. Sent off to Matt at BMW and the unit was repaired and returned within 1 wk. He paid priority mail both ways. Excellent service. Not so excellent unit but time will tell if it continues to perform.

@arronjohnston742 8 ай бұрын

i was watching a guy yesterday moan how the BBSHD is now over 10years old with no real updates and is being phased out? he went on to say the CYC is the future, that might be so but i think he failed to take into account the backing the BBSHD has, problem such as those you had only turn people off tho i'm sure in time that'll be fixed it's the $$$

@HighVoltageKits 8 ай бұрын

The BBSHD was release in 2015 so not quite 10 but getting on there. There was an update to beef up the rotor in 2019. Mine is the older version and still going strong. The thing with CYC is people have said its the BBSHD killer etc etc but then they break. I only know of one person that has over 10,000 kms on a CYC and he only ran it at 1000 watts. There might be more but the point is that the CYC stuff does not last anywhere near as long especially if you run it at the power that they are claiming.