Does it matter where you mount your rack tom from?

Does it matter where you mount your rack tom from? | Season Two, Episode 35

Рет қаралды 36,222

4 жыл бұрын

There are all sorts of little design details that we like to focus on when it comes to our drums. Some of them have a massive impact on sound and some are more for aesthetics or even simply marketing. This week, we’re experimenting with the idea of whether or not it matters where you mount your rack tom from when it comes to the tone of the tom & the bass drum.
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Signal chain:
Mics - Focusrite Clarett 8Pre USB & OctoPre - MacPro w/Pro Tools 12.8
Recorded at 48kHz / 24bit
Focusrite Clarett 8Pre USB tinyurl.com/Clarett8Pre
Focusrite Clarett OctoPre tinyurl.com/ClarettOctoPro
Full kit: AKG C414 (ear-distance)Snare drum & tom tom close mics: Shure SM57
Bass drum: AKG D112 (at mic port) + KAM R3 Ribbon microphone 8” away from reso
Drums: Pearl Masters Maple Custom Extra
Tom Batters: Evans EC2S Clear
Tom Resos: Evans G1 Clear
Bass Drum Batter: Evans EMAD Clear
Bass Drum Reso: Evans EQ3 Reso Black w/DIY 6” Port
Hosted by: Cody Rahn
Production: Ben O'Brien Smith @ Cadence Independent Media
Presenting Sponsor: Promark by D’Addario
Production Partners: Focusrite, Evans Drumheads
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Пікірлер: 224

@chickenbeforeegg 4 жыл бұрын

I just want to say, with no pressure attached, on behalf of the drum community: y'all have earned our trust and praise. All your resources you put out are so informative and interesting and are solely made to improve QOL in terms of practicing our instrument and we're grateful for that. PLEASE keep going with your amazing content and know that we all back you and support you 100%! THANK YOU!

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much for the kind words! This motivates us in ways we can't begin to describe. We put a lot of effort, time, and energy into this series and it keeps us from working on other things but we really do love it and hope to grow what we're doing to offer a wider variety of content as well. We're incredibly grateful to our Patreon supporters who have stepped up to make this all possible. Cheers!

@JeffRandallDrumming 4 жыл бұрын

Super relieved to know there's not a discernible difference between mounting the rack tom to the bass drum vs. mounting it on it's own stand! I personally find mounting the rack tom to the bass drum preferable since it allows me to use one less stand which cleans up my setup a bit. Plus it adds a bit of weight to the bass drum which helps to prevent it from sliding. Great video fellas!

@hombreenojado 4 жыл бұрын

That and it allows me to get the tom closer in but then I favor 18 & 20 inch kicks.

@vjgarate 3 жыл бұрын

This is exactly my point of view!

@myaliasmakaveli1 Жыл бұрын

My only concern has always been the thought of adding stress/Weight to my bass drum throughput it’s life? Go ahead roast me…..

@Nathan00at78Uuiu 10 ай бұрын

6:19 daaang. So that just preemptively put to rest any disagreement. love it.

@triggerhappydad65 4 жыл бұрын

Great vid as always. I'm 54, and grew up living for music like, Zeppelin, Sabbath, AC -DC, ELO, Scorpions, and about a hundred other bands, and (from a very young age), I always seemed to be unconsciously tuned in to the drumming of most songs. Although I'd rewind (that's what you did with cassette tapes back then, kids) to listen to and absorb myself in certain drum parts, I never really thought I was capable of someday actually playing the music that I loved so much. I bought my first set (Pearl Export, I think), in 2002, and was self taught, by playing with a local garage band. I was playing in their barn (the "party barn") with actual musicians after having only one week of playing along with my home stereo system! Their drummer moved away and they were desperate. They we're very patient with me. I didn't have a clue what I was doing, but I had natural rhythm/timing, and all those years of "drum interest" just sort of kicked in....eventually. I've now played in several cover bands, including a "power trio" with my best friend and bassist, in which I was also the only vocalist. Great times! I'd always dreamed of being in a band, and at 37, I made it happen. I really appreciate this channel's time and effort. They're doing an excellent job of helping us all become better musicians.

@paulkennedy4920 4 жыл бұрын

I appreciate how thorough you two are with everything you do -- it makes life so much easier for the rest of us.

@tompetteruti250 11 ай бұрын

Nice job gentlemen. Hopefully, this will help put an end to the current trend of virgin bass drums.

@GingerDrums 4 жыл бұрын

Subbed. Charismatic, relaxed, detailed hosting and high production value on sound and image. Slick job guys, you are nailing this format and wish you lots of success.

@JacksJamz 4 жыл бұрын

I actually love these videos and I don’t know how I’ve gone so long without seeing them. You are making the dark art of drum sound easy to understand and accessible. Good job!

@oblivionwalker8613 4 жыл бұрын

This was super interesting! I was shocked to hear that the waveforms looked identical; thought for sure that, even if it *sounded* the same, surely the physical waves would tell the difference? But nope! This is why I love this show- you guys persistently challenge my preconceived notions of "good" drum tone and "proper" tuning. Thanks for another great episode!

@PabloJ1968 4 жыл бұрын

Your information, as always, very important. Your deliver and joviality PERFECT.

@jonas2484 4 жыл бұрын

Hey guys, great video as always, I also really love the point you made around not falling for the marketing spiel, and focusing on getting the sound you want out of the gear you have. Keep up the good work! Cheers. Jp

@dannymaes7709 4 жыл бұрын

Hello Cody, First time I react on a video of you. This video about the mounting of the racktoms was very pleasing to me because I did the same experiment and came to the same conclusion. Many thanks and keep up the good work! Greetings from Tienen, Belgium.

@johnvcougar 4 жыл бұрын

Interesting, thanks. Useful stuff to know. Recently shopped for a new kit with my son, he settled for a Blaster kit with "virgin" kick and stand tom mounts. That mounting system is proving useful as we expand the kit, adding toms. So less to do with tone and more to do with practicalities of mounting.

@batmayn123 4 жыл бұрын

Yet another great and informative video. I'm learning so much from watching your content! keep up the amazing work!!

@DrGray_Drummer 4 жыл бұрын

I wanted to thank you for your bass drum pedal vid. After years I cleaned my pedals, and adjusted my bass drum spring tension. I couldn't play, or figure out why my foot wasn't working. Turns out I've played with minimal tension all these years. I threw on some old cameos, with the fluffy beater, and my foot hasn't been better!

@iorijones6351 4 жыл бұрын

Thank you for all your interesting and informative videos. I enjoyed this one particularly as I have recently acquired a s/h Ludwig Classic Maple with an undrilled bass drum, which has a12in rack Tom on a tall snare stand. If I were to add a 2nd 13in rack tom I was wondering best way and place to mount it. Really appreciate your knowledge and sharing it. Many thanks, Iori (writing this from Liverpool, UK).

@AdamStachelek 4 жыл бұрын

Great video! I think the point about subtle differences being there is true but playing technique being a much bigger factor to the sound is spot on. Being a shorter guy I find I prefer putting my rack tom in a snare stand or off a cymbal stand but it’s purely ergonomics since it’s a 22” kick. I find the snare stand deadens the rack tom a bit but that too is minor. Nice work!

@scottwheeler3071 2 жыл бұрын

Very helpful. Just started playing again after 30 year layoff and forgot most of ehat I knew. Thanks

@SopranoPizzaJMFNJ 2 жыл бұрын

Great info & the Supra sounds Killer BTW!

@johnreardon4944 4 жыл бұрын

I put my 13 tom on a chrome Optimount for positional reasons. The BD mounts on my 78' Pearl kit are toward the front. With the Optimount I can bring the tom closer to me. I sit back a little because I'm tall. Also, if other drummers are sharing my kit for a gig, then the flexibility of positioning is easier for them too. I think suspended toms look cooler. And I was/wasn't surprised by your sound results. I didn't notice anything different but expected that you guys would. Great video! Thanks again! I love this channel!

@elijahfaith7480 4 жыл бұрын

Great demonstration of the difference between the two...as for me I've always had them attached to my rack and i get alot of feed back from people that they sound great without even mic-ing them at all in mostly small to medium room size gigs.when I don't use the rack I mount them on my bass drum and I get the same response..i don't notice a big difference.

@ronfults3844 4 жыл бұрын

I'm so glad you busted this myth for us. Thanks!

@DeyRadiance Жыл бұрын

Kick sounds and more importantly “feels” better. I’m on a Yamaha Hydrid Oak, and just upgraded to a hex rack to expand my cymbals. Added benefit was being able to take the Toms off the bass drum. I notice a difference in how the air moves and the resonance feels different. Great video!

@rogerwelsh2335 8 ай бұрын

These drums sound incredible

@DavidEpstein 4 жыл бұрын

This was a really interesting one. I've found that the biggest factor in how much the toms resonate when you hit the bass drum is how they're tuned and their proximity to the bass drum. If any mounting factors impact the overall resonance of the tom, it will also impact cross talk between the bass drum and the tom.

@NikkeK 4 жыл бұрын

This channel is so awesome!

@thundermolloy 4 жыл бұрын

I run a 4 piece kit, and putting the rack tom in a snare stand was the best change I ever had in terms of set up. You do lose a little floor space but. The freedom of positioning (no arms to worry about, just set the height and angle and put ot where you want) and the slightly increased sustain was what I needed

@littledrummerboyph 4 жыл бұрын

I own/play/work with 4 different vintage 4 piece kits, and use snare stands or modified mounts for 3 of the toms purely for placement reasons. Each company is different in where they allow you to place the tom, and the size of the kick and rack tom make a difference, too, and it just happened that I could actually place 1 of the 4 comfortably.

@pawelmorrison 4 жыл бұрын

People goin crazy about virgin bass drums and then stuff the thing up with pillows like a winter dog shelter

@idontknoweither8112 3 жыл бұрын

lmfao

@1111Paiste 2 жыл бұрын

"...stuff the thing up with pillows like a winter dog shelter". LMAO!!

@EvanFMusic 2 жыл бұрын

Yep. this.

@martyboosinger8854 6 ай бұрын

That was a great video. I play a small venue. I get a lot of snare buzz from my 12" tom, none from the 14". I tried putting both toms on a stant on the left side of the base like Ringo's kit on the rooftop recordings. It cured my snare buzz, and everyone thought it looked cool. I s8it to low for it to work for me, so i reset my kit to on the base drum. Moved my snare down and further away from the 12'. That fixed it enough. I still hear it a little but moves the base amp to the other side of the platform. Hahaha Thanks for your videos, very informative.

@christiancanalita6487 4 жыл бұрын

So glad you guys spent the time to do this! I could never hear the difference and glad you heard the same. The only concern, if it is a concern, is the weight of the tom (or toms) on the bass drum shell especially if it's a set that isn't broken down a lot.

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for watching! I think those fears regarding the weight of the toms on the bass drum are pretty unnecessary assuming you don't have overly massive toms and/or hardware.

@chrisberryk3111 Жыл бұрын

I was concerned about scaling down from two rack toms to one rack tom. I was worried about balance and strain on the kick drum. I found this video and saw you mounted a single tom on the kick drum without affecting the tone. Think I was worrying too much about nothing. Thanks for a straight forward informative video. Chris (UK)

@abarragan2973 4 жыл бұрын

I have a 70’s Pearl crystal beat that had these mounts that made me hate tuning the toms because they would really deaden the sound. Fast forward 30 yrs later when I put that kit back together and used the pearl iss system on it, those toms sang like birds. Great resonance and tone. It was a totally new kit.

@solidpotatosalad 4 жыл бұрын

Nice video as usual. Please dig the rack tom mounted on a snare drum stand. In my experience, there is absolute difference between tightening up the basket and loosing down it.

@MrPacoFrogs 4 жыл бұрын

I like the tom clamped to a stand because I switch between two bass drums. I also find it easier to put it in the perfect position

@mikel.laughridge9480 4 жыл бұрын

you are great..............thank you for the information. Interesting no question.

@charliecontrino1626 4 жыл бұрын

That Supra sounds great!!

@dconsmack 2 жыл бұрын

Whoa. When the tom was mounted on the stand I heard noticeably more attack on the tom and a much fuller low end on the kick when listening to the back-to-back comparisons. To me, it wasn't subtle. I was listening through Sony MDR-7506 headphones. Thanks for all the work you guys put into these videos!

@jonathanreddish8590 4 жыл бұрын

today i moved my kit about 5 feet to the right, and it sounds way different....

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Yes! Room acoustics can completely shift the sound of your drums.

@frankwalker9078 3 жыл бұрын

@@TempoDrift1480 that's what she said.

@jonathanreddish8590 3 жыл бұрын

@@davidschlotterback8374 no, its really amazing... it works with speakers as well. try shifting or aiming things differently, its fun!

@brianchisnell1548 Жыл бұрын

Everybody wants resonant drums, then they put a blanket in the bass, drive the beater into the head, moon gel the toms, snare ect.. All my drum kits are vintage and mounts are drilled. They sound incredible. '48 Radio Kings, '69 Ludwigs and '75 Slingerland Sound Kings. Sold the Yammies. A lot of hype on shells, mounts = SALES. Been playing since '68. I've seen it all.

@danialdevostmusic 3 жыл бұрын

one scenario that i have definitely noticed a difference was in toms not using suspension mounts. Many years I play my 1982 Tama Superstar kit with a 13” Tom mounted on the bass drum. Then the bass drum mount broke so i got a clamp and put it on a cymbal stand and immediately noticed almost twice the sustain out of the tom. Of course this is very different then a suspension mounted toms as the shell in this case is connected directly to the bass drum

@JulianFernandez 4 жыл бұрын

toms sounding good!

@flowmotions 10 ай бұрын

Nice video ! I think that depends a on the type of tom mounts on the bass drum, also the type of tom suspensions. I recently bought the new Gretsch catalina club studio in satin flame. I realized the 12 rack tom sounded way better mounted on a snare stand, and taking all of that weight of the bass drum also enabled for more tone and sustain. I think that also is because of the mahogany being very « resonant », maybe on a hard wood like maple or walnut this would make less of a difference !

@cajundaddy64 4 жыл бұрын

I've had toms lose resonance when positioned over the top of a bass drum. I move my tom to the side. It seems more resonant when there is only open air under it.

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

That’s an element that we didn’t address here but is definitely something to consider.

@drumkitguy 4 жыл бұрын

If a tom is close to flat and very close to the bass drum, it won't resonate as much. It behaves the same when positioned one or two inches above a table. raise the tom up so that it resonates in a typical fashion before comparing the difference between mounted on a kick versus mounted on a stand.

@j.b.55 2 жыл бұрын

Funny, resonance aside…to me the tom seemed a little louder mounted to the bass drum….because of the sound reflection off the bottom of the tom on the surface of the bass drum. When the tom was mounted on the stand…same tone…but not as loud…the reso head having no surface directly underneath to have sound reflected.

@SopranoPizzaJMFNJ 2 жыл бұрын

This is an interesting comment. I suspect the resonant head tuning would make a big difference here.

@OmarDrumsTJ 4 жыл бұрын

I like your videos a lot, you give us so much information, just to point out the slightly difference between a virgin bass drum and one with a hole drilled in the shell, even without the tom mount they do not resonate the same to my ears, but thats just my thought.

@Rich-ik3dp 2 жыл бұрын

I have a 13x9 Tom mounted on a cymbal stand and it always sounded dead with no resonance or sustain. The mount has a big rubber cushion that sits against the shell and with the shell touching it it was flat and dead but when I pulled the shell even slightly away from the rubber it sounded great. Long story short I turned the arm of the mount upside down so the Tom hangs off it rather than sits on it and it solved the problem straight away. I think the vibrations of the shell were just being absorbed by the stand and for some reason just having it hanging from rather than sitting on the mount has completely changed the sound of the drum. I have a memory lock on the mounting rod under the clasp of the mount as a double measure to stop the Tom falling off in case the clasp comes loose and I’ve had no problems at all

@georgemickel6608 4 жыл бұрын

Great vid..I moved my tom off of my bass drum years ago for comfort. My bass drum is also positioned further away too..no restraints and sometimes I use different tom sizes. Just my 2¢

@jcsk8 4 жыл бұрын

Good to see something like that. I´ll tell a long history. I´ve started druming in early 90´s. Been in bar, rock, metal bands for more than a deacde. Than I graduated, started the adult life stuff, started playing bass and guitar. The instrument today I´m less picky about is the drums. You can make very nice sounds on a old average kit. All this suspended toms, racks and other "modern" stuff it´s almost bulshit. When the whole band come in you and audience won´t discern what is going on. Head types and tunings, as well as muffling make the most difference. Cymbals are a different history. Love the K´s. Peace out.

@Xtremecarfan10188 3 жыл бұрын

I agree with you, my ear might he bad but cannot tell a difference between having a drum on a snare basket, a RIMS or whatever its called, L-arm, an old style Pearl holder that goes in the tom. The all sound the same to me. I have an old Pearl Wood Fiberglass with huge hex arms going inside the drum. That thing resonates for days in a very focused way. I feel like all the different mounting systems are a gimmick and negligible once you start playing. Also I never notice a difference on the bass drum whether a tom is on it, or not, or a virgin shell. Once again, my opinion.

@thomasgomez4263 4 жыл бұрын

i have a 22" bass with no internal muffling, so it rings and vibrates a lot. the difference between virgin and one tom (or a cymbal) is minimal. but when i add a second tom, then i notice not that the tone/pitch changes, but it shortens how long it vibrates (i can feel it with my hand). but if one were putting internal muffling, i imagine this wouldn't change a thing.

@mrtc29 4 жыл бұрын

I think it depends too on what drum manufacture you use. I know for certain that some don’t really have it together when it comes to mounting systems (off the bass drum) and the Tom will just choke out completely. Same drum, from same company mounting off a cymbal stand with a clamp 100% difference in sustain & tone of the drum. The rim mounts seem to work best in all situations even when it comes to mounting 2 drums off the bass drum (some companies have problems with one drum ‘robbing’ the other of sustain etc.) So, I agree with your comparison completely, But also know it’s not the case with other drum company brands (the difference between bass drum mounting & cymbal stand mounting the toms I mean) Really enjoy your videos guys. Many thanks 👍

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Absolutely! There are a multitude of factors involved here (as there are with any sonic scenario). Hopefully these videos serve as the "tip of the iceberg" for people to create their own experiments with their gear in their space to determine whether something like this is worth agonizing over. Thanks so much for the kind words- Cheers! -Ben

@djentlover 4 жыл бұрын

I notice more attack on the cymbal stand mounted one and more low mid beef on the kick drum mounted one. It could be just your playing though, as you said.

@jangobango2847 4 жыл бұрын

I thought i heard much more resonance when the tom wasnt in the drum, i wonder if the hardware for the mounting holes makes a difference versus a virgin shell? my very thin shelled virgin bapeva maple 22x18 bass has some huge tone i have never gotten from a bass with mounting racks but maybe expensive drums arent as affected, i have a pearl export im selling to my bro and the 16" floor tom resonates fine when i hold it but on the floor is completely dead could it be where the legs are placed on the drum? Ive tried new legs new pads, no foot pads still sounds dead on the floor

@epidemicfoxx7295 4 жыл бұрын

On my kit I've noticed that when I hit the kick I definately get a slight bit of sympathetic ring out of the toms if they're mounted on it, really not much though. For me it's more about feel, the toms feel a bit stiffer when I hit them mounted on the bass drum, having them on a cymbal stand just makes them float a bit more thus giving them a better feel to me.

@Timdrums67 4 жыл бұрын

Great video, as always. I only wish you added one more option- mounting the tom on a snare stand. I did that with only one set I have owned (40's Radio King) and the snare stand noticeably choked the sound of the tom. It sounded pretty bad, honestly. I bought a set of "mini booty shakers" that mount to the snare stand under the points of contact with the drum, and it did help quite a bit. But I suspect that 13" radio king would have sounded much better with a suspension mount than a snare stand ( I was going for a vintage look at that time).

@artsaenz9111 4 жыл бұрын

This was on a early 70s Ludwig. 3 ply,12/13 inch Tom's,mounted on the bass drum,the 13 would choke on the topmost,i moved it to my left,took off the 12 of course,it opened up, moved the 12 to the right,it choked,i had an extra Ludwig floor tom leg,cut it to 8 Inches,shaped it into an l arm , 4 inches into the topmost,so it's out quite a bit,thatfixed the problem.

@littlephoenix1115 4 жыл бұрын

I think my situation is very specific to the Tom construction, I have noticed that with concert toms specifically, not only did mounting to my kick kill the resonance completely, but even over tightening the wingnut on the opti mount when mounted on my crash stand would shorten my fundamental tone and leave me with more overtone ring. This only happens with my concert rack and not my regular 2 headed toms.

@charlesfarran1717 4 жыл бұрын

I find snare stand mounting and cymbal stand mounting to be a total pain. This is mainly due to having to mess around at gigs setting the stand in the correct place. I also use DW lightweight stands, having to carry an additional an heavy snare stand or a double braced cymbal stand is not for me. It’s of course a personal choice.

@sammbobdylan 4 жыл бұрын

Amen Cody. Even the length of the rack tom mount stem won't interfere with the sound of the bass drum. For proof of concept I used the Mix Craft 8 program with a Samson Q52 bass drum mic on a Mapex 22"x16" which has a stem of roughly 13"-14". I tried 4 different rack tom's at 1 up and 2 up with 1" depth intervals of the stem. It was very time consuming and the frequency waves don't lie. The only difference I had was when I had both of the heaviest 2 toms at absolutely maximum height that could still hold the stem in place. There was a difference of 0.023 of 1 Hertz difference and I put that down to the flex of the shell at the bottom of the rack stem mount. I watched other KZfaqr's say that the stem at its lowest point (inside the bass drum) will interfere with the resonance. Pffft! Wrong! Anyone with a program with wave zoom and a half decent bass mic, oh, also 5 hours to spare and extreme patience as I lost my cool many times, please, prove me wrong. I now have a virgin 22"x20" bass and I get deeper tone and more ("thumpification" as Rob "Beat Down" Brown would say). If you haven't heard of Beat Down, check him out. Full pro with quick 3 minutes per drum tuning system and so much more.

@ChrisJS1987 4 жыл бұрын

I wonder if this myth applies to older toms where the mount is on/through the shell.

@robinhoodwasasocialist.1401 4 жыл бұрын

(To me) The toms sound much better in this video than in others.

@ivanbajovic3476 3 жыл бұрын

Because here are Ludwig mounts instead of Pearl Optimount

@johnmccorry7536 4 жыл бұрын

Mounting my rack Tom on a snare stand allows me to use the RIMS style mounting bracket as a splash cymbal arm holder. Also bass drum has no hole in its shell. Drum rotated so the bracket is at 3oclock-ish and the cymbal arm hangs the wee cymbal where Buddy kept his. Also, you can LEAN on your rack Tom when on a snare stand to press the centre of the head & change its pitch for a special fun effect!

@johnmccorry7536 4 жыл бұрын

Also the British Drum Company make a gadget called TOM SPRING which is 3 wee plastic brackets which attach to 3 tension rods & isolate the drum from its stand. Power, bam, wow! My rack Tom now matches it's floortom in resonance. Cracking gadget which is a niche item but, boy, does it occupy that niche nicely! Thanx BDC. Fits any six tension rod drum.

@kellanmurakami5340 4 жыл бұрын

Mostly I think the advantage stands have is greater versatility for where you place your rack tom.

@LTDLimiTeD1995 3 жыл бұрын

Would love to see a comparison of all different kinds of and brands of mounts from arms, RIMS, ISS, STM, etc.

@SopranoPizzaJMFNJ 2 жыл бұрын

Concerning Bonzo, I think his impeccable tuning is the common denominator. The Stainless Steel & Vistalite kits are much louder but still maintain his “Sound” even if the wooden kits were warmer sounding. He also used different hardware to mount the rack toms on each of these different kits.

@martijnvaassen 4 жыл бұрын

I'm kinda hoping for an episode on roto toms, especially the larger sizes. What heads do work best with which tuning? What are options on mounting and does it affect the tone? Stuff like that :)

@cartoune 3 жыл бұрын

That's awesome! I'm way more open to mounted toms then. Less moving stuff around, smaller footprint, what's not to love?

@betulaobscura 4 жыл бұрын

Very true!

@abarragan2973 4 жыл бұрын

I think I may be crazy but I do hear a slight difference. The mounted to the bass drum gave it a bit more tone and decay but took away some of the thump from the bass drum and vice versa with the other configuration. I don’t think you’d notice it in a live setting or even in a mix with other instruments.

@rocketmobile 4 жыл бұрын

Great video as always, still I hear very little difference of the way rack tom sounds mounted on the bass drum vs. off of the bass drum. To me, the rack tom sounds with a little less bottom end when mounted on the stand. The difference is insignificant and will be unnoticeable when the drums be played live with other instruments. On a side note: there's a little more sound difference when rack tom is maunted ot the snare stand vs. mounted on bass drum or cymbal stand. To me the tom resonance is tad less when on snare stand.

@fergusfurlong 11 ай бұрын

I might have bad hearing but thought the bass drum sounds like it has a subtle more presence with the Tom mounted to the the bass drum. Both Tom’s sound the the same and awesome for both options. I have my rack Tom on a snare stand with rubber mouths underneath to allow for good resonance, without the rubber mounts the Tom chokes. But I find my bass drum sound allowed to clean. So have been considering installing a bass drum mount. It’s an SQ1. But I’m still on the fence. I play a 4 piece so no pressure to change. All stands are Yamaha cross row light weight, so an extra snare stand doesn’t create much extra weight. Plus I’m always moving the Tom position, I seem to be moving more and more to the left and away from the bass drum so the snare is the centre of the kit and the bass drum pedal and high pedal are the two other triangle points. I prefer the Tom mounted to the bass drum but on a snare stand is fine and not much more work either. Would know the difference when the rest of the plays starts playing either. But when I am isolated in the studio, just me something is missing, some lower tones and that might just be the SQ1 birch shell.

@jojothetasmaniansassmonkey8866 3 жыл бұрын

I think it may depend on the drum. On my 22in I can not tell a difference, but on my 18in the difference is night and day.

@thesithari7785 4 жыл бұрын

Thank you! MYTHBUSTED!!!!

@user-ib8uj1ic7d 4 ай бұрын

I like my tom (or toms) mounted on the bass drum. It's just too much work setting up and adjusting cymbal stand mounted toms for rehearsals or gigs. I noticed Pearl went back to bass drum mounting on their Professional Series kits. And apparently, it was due to consumer demand. PDP's Concept Series kits are also bass drum mounted (a friend of mine just bought this kit.) So it looks like there's a trend back to bass drum mounting.

@nqmt9968 4 жыл бұрын

Second example have darker wash in my opinion, but both sounds are similar and so nice.

@TommyD1021 4 жыл бұрын

I have a Tama RoadPro stilting double tom stand that chokes my toms. I think it is the stilting effect that is causing the issue. Probable cause is the upper tube pressing up against the inside of the lower tube from the weight of the toms and grounding out the stands ability to freely "resonate". I need to try that stand without the stilt effect on and see if it fixes the problem. Also, I have had my cymbals choke out on heavy duty cymbal stands vs lightweight cymbal stands. That could be a fun experiment you guys could try. Get some overbuilt stand with a big counterweight on the back and mount a 16" crash on it. Then mount that same crash on a lightweight flat base stand and hear the full tone of the 16" come back. I would be curious of ride cymbals of light or heavy weight would sound different on the different stands. Pretty crazy.

@jeffreyappezzato3432 4 жыл бұрын

Comment at 7.20: I've noticed a similar affect by using a large heavy blanket to tent the reso side of the bass drum. Simon Philips is known to do this in the studio.

@hamadbernes1980 3 жыл бұрын

Hi can you explain me why when I test mi tom without tom holder sounds with more resonance in comparison when I put that tom with his tom holder ?Is to much mass??

@oldcrackadated 6 ай бұрын

When the sound meets the ear that’s all that matters and that can only be measured by a person ,but one person does not process the sound the same as another

@justinlee2268 4 жыл бұрын

I just got a dw design Series last month. I wish it had a bass drum mount. It’s a little late for that. I’m not gonna buy another drumset for awhile.. I’d go with coated heads...but that’s personal and aesthetic.

@giovannibloom6433 3 жыл бұрын

That's exactly my story this year. I bought a beautiful sea glass design series from DW last month. I'm not sure if I prefer a bass drum mount or not since this is my first drum set.

@drummercarson896 4 жыл бұрын

I experienced the same way with this method.

@markkuliini 4 жыл бұрын

Tom sounded the same but on the bass drum sound there was a difference. When the mount is on the bass drum, I hear reduced low bottom end on the bass drum sound and added high end ring from the tom caused by resonance. Same thing I have also noticed on my own bass drum, which is thinner shelled Gretsch which flexes a bit when you put the tom mount+tom on it. It's not a huge difference, but I noticed it on this clip too.

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Yep, if you listen carefully, you can here small differences with the tom too but would anyone know/care in the context of a musical performance? If you heard the recording without seeing the mounting system, would it throw you off? That's the key here. Thanks for watching! -Ben

@obijuan8466 4 жыл бұрын

I am glad I'm not the only one. There was a HUGELY discernible difference in the tone of the kick. Far more low end and resonance. Enough, that I am surprised by the review. There was no discernible difference for me in the tom, but the kick was unequivocally different. I am using a pair of Creative Aurvana Trios to listen. Same ones I use for my stage monitors.

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

@@obijuan8466 As was mentioned in the video, yes- you can pick out a difference if you listen carefully. However, in the context of a performance or a recording, I'm willing to bet you there's little-to-no chance that you'd be able to hear the difference.

@markkuliini 4 жыл бұрын

The difference is probably too small to make any real difference in a musical setting. But like you guys also said in the video, the difference gets bigger if you play with an open tone, and I think also that the thickness of the bass drum shell plays big part regarding how much bottom end you lose. On my tests with openly tuned thin shelled kick the difference was much more noticeable, sort of: live I would not care but in the studio I would. I want to also note, that I usually listen to these comparisons without watching, so that I get more objective results because I can't be sure when the setting changes. So the answer is yes, it threw me out without seeing.

@obijuan8466 4 жыл бұрын

In the context of a live, musical setting, I agree. However, if one were to record, that's an entirely different kettle of fish. Even live, if one were trying to get that last bit of low end thump, and were using quality mics; I use an Audix D-6, and a lovely 10" homemade "subkick", I imagine it would still make enough difference to pursue. Of course individual mileage, and tastes may vary. Keep up the great work. I love the channel.

@a.j.wilkes6352 4 жыл бұрын

For anyone looking to take the tom mount off their bass drum, assuming you have chrome hardware, sink hole covers are a cheap and shiny option to cover those mount holes. Pair with a big 1/4" fender washer on the inside. Example: www.homedepot.com/p/DANCO-2-in-Sink-Hole-Cover-in-Chrome-88952/204386233?mtc

@JeremySmith23 4 жыл бұрын

I have a kit that has a bass drum mount with a hole in it for the Tom mount hardware and when one day tested it there was a ton of cross talk. It could be that had i tuned the drums different it wouldn’t have happened (my kick has no muffle, tuned for a boom).

@bobdadruma 4 жыл бұрын

I remember the first time that I tried a virgin kick drum and I thought that there was something wrong with me because I couldn't tell the difference in the sound.

@bogartsandoval 4 жыл бұрын

Hello, thank you for being honest and precise with the drum sound analysis. I know the choices for drum sounds all comes to personal tastes, so please forgive me for being biased on my previous comments. Is there any way I can support you guy’s excellent work with merch, etc...?

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Hey there! Thanks so much for the kind words. We have merch shown below each of our videos (you’ll see a little carousel of options) but the best way to support our efforts AND get access to extra content is to join our Patreon: www.patreon.com/soundslikeadrum

@zacdrake 4 жыл бұрын

I personally like to mount my toms on the kick for gigging! Positioning 2 toms on cymbal stands on either side of the kick is a time consuming pain in the ass. Drop the 2 tom arms in the holes on the kick, slide the toms on and voila!!! Just like last time!! In the studio I have an Icon Rack and also a virgin kick and I like the flexibility to move things around occasionally.

@Pearl3Drummer 4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the video! Btw...what kind of ride is that? Love it!

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Thanks!! Jesse Simpson made it for me here in Brooklyn - check him out! -Cody

@jjfloyd618 Жыл бұрын

This seems to indicate that removing the isolation mount from the equation would then increase cross talk between the drums as well as perceived resonance and tone by enlisting an additional vibrational assist, kind of like a sub woofer.

@tommo3378 4 жыл бұрын

I thought there was a smidge less sustain in both kick and the tom when mounted from the stand

@BubblegumBrown 3 жыл бұрын

I believe most if not all floating style mounts work with a rubber ball joint for adjustment, and that rubber separating the two drums is likely what helps deaden any reverberations from the direct connection to the bass drum, as well as the rubber that separates the mount from the tom rim. Some other questions to consider: 1. What about cheaper drums with "combo" style mounts that stick directly INTO the tom without the floating mechanism? I've always felt that it does make a difference here, and is a contributing factor to what makes a line of drums (sound) cheaper. 2. Does the weight of a tom with a floating mount have enough force to push or pull the rim closer or further from either side of the drum, causing a detuning effect? (When angled unparallel to the floor) 3. Is there a noticeable difference between using a stand clamping a rim and using a free floating mount, and how does a combo style arm differ from those two? Maybe you could revisit the concept of this video with those things in mind (if you haven't already. I haven't gotten around to watching all of them... yet.)

@GolddenWaffles 4 жыл бұрын

I’ve always wonder if Rail Consolettes affect the tone even more than just regular tom holders. Any opinions on that?

@ivanhiliev 4 жыл бұрын

it does matter for the kick drum!! :) and this is why i do it for my kit. i play a 4 piece, and each drum is different brand but conditioning and heads just made them sound well. and don't get me wrong they are good drums each one of them. my experience with cheap/expansive etc drums is mounting. as less you have it sounds better, i've played a 16 + 18 floor toms with single mount drumstand.... those sounded huge, as they don't get the floor to kill power, and i put jellies on everyrhing

@dennisboxem Жыл бұрын

In my experience, it all depends on the drum and wether you muffle it or not. Some drums actually do choke under weight, but it's pretty rare. My 20" Sonor signature bass drum holds two large toms and three cymbals and it doesn't sound remotely different to when it's just on it's own.

@philmullins886 4 жыл бұрын

Love all these, guys. Could you do one on how to tune and set up small toms? Or have any suggestions? Thinner heads? I have an 8" that always seems wooden and choked. I'm currently set up with Calftones all-round, and with coated resos (except on that 8", thin clear reso) for a warm open sound. Love it; just can't get this little tom to fit in sonicall, even before switching to Calftones (from EC2s with factory resos). I've watched the other tom vids and have learned a lot. Thanks again!!

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Hey Phil! Thanks for the kind words. Our method for tuning smaller drums isn't any different- just in a higher range. Head choice is an important factor though. The Calftones may be a bit much for such a small drum. I'd personally recommend going with a single-ply non-laminated drumhead. Unfortunately, some smaller toms like that just don't speak the same way that larger drums do due to the mass of the hardware and/or mounting system but don't let that deter you from experimenting. Cheers! -Ben

@philmullins886 4 жыл бұрын

@@SoundsLikeADrum thanks a bunch Ben! You guys are my go-to reference now for tuning and sound questions. I'll try a few options on that little tom. Good to know to maybe temper my expectations, but I'll keep trying.

@rapscallion52 4 жыл бұрын

biggest difference is probably going to be if you use triggers, mounting anything on the kick might make the triggers go off if you hit that thing

@GregGarner 11 ай бұрын

I personally like having the freedom to move the toms independently of the bass drum placement and vice versa. So I mount them in front of the snare. And not having a vestigial tom mount staring at me helps my OCD 😂 So, I prefer the virgin bass drum for those reasons.

@DeanMcKey 4 жыл бұрын

My only experience with this has been moving a kick-mounted tom onto a snare stand, and that definitely changed the sound. I noticed a drastic choking of the tom. The kick on the other hand, sounded largely the same (as you’ve said). I think the floating mount in your test went a long way to making the difference negligible.

@derekrobinson5116 3 жыл бұрын

it may be here somewhere that I'm not seeing, but what is the ride you are using in this video?

@thisismoc 4 жыл бұрын

What about octave tuning? Or if it's a 10" tom hanging on to /next to a 20" kick? Also, is there a difference if the kick shell isn't drilled for the tom mount?

@SoundsLikeADrum 4 жыл бұрын

Yep, there are all sorts of additional x factors that could be introduced. For these, we recommend you try them on your drums so that the results are that much more relevant for you. Let us know what you experience!

@StevesRykerAdventures 4 жыл бұрын

The only reason I took my tom mounts off my kick was due to the added weight of the mount on my older Saturn kit. My kick was heavy with that mount. Without it is much better. I wonder if anyone else removed there’s for that reason. It seems like the older kits had lighter hardware, but the newer kits are much more reliable. Maybe someone needs to make a lighter but sturdy mount, or maybe they already have?

@franklarssen1807 4 жыл бұрын

I can hear a relatively clear difference. Both the tom and the kick sounds duller when the tom is mounted on the kick when I listen through my HD650s.