HERE IS HOW WESTERN RIVER EXPEDITION CAN STILL WIN

The Western River Expedition concept should make a comeback! That would be the perfect expansion to Frontierland…sadly Disney will probably lean into IPs instead of classic or original ideas :(

Tony Baxter’s thunder mesa comeback would be insane. If they did that I’d throw my life savings at Disney

Two points: 1. Encanto is not set in the desert. It's set in the tropics. 2. Splash Mountain never had anything to do with the West, it's based on Song of the *South* as it takes place in Georgia which is actually less to the west than Louisiana.

The American frontier is more than just desert plains. As someone who’s grown up on the West Coast it always surprises me that people think the American west is just like Cowboys and dirt. Having some lush green in there actually is more realistic.

This is their chance to finally build the western river expedition.

Honestly everytime I eat at Pecos Bill, I never had a bad meal. I notice alot of people usually have either a good or bad meal at Pecos Bill and pretty much every quick service restaurant at Magic Kingdom but for someone like me, Pecos Bill is my 2nd favorite quick service at the park. The theming inside is also one of my favorites so seeing the restaurant close and retheme..well I'll be sad when it happens but maybe it's for the best.

I grew up in Ca, and went to Disneyland many times. I remember the country bears that used to be there, before they put in Winne the Poo. I wish they would do more with that area, it felt like it really only had two rides, Winne and Splash. I wish they would bring back country bears, we need more things we can just sit and enjoy with all the standing in lines. And some other rides in that area.

Pecos Bill’s is so much better than Cosmic Ray’s hockey puck burger but most people have no idea who Pecos Bill is anymore. Makes me sad but an expansion/retheme of the area is for the best

Me being sad because frontierland is my favorite part of the whole park and feels super alienated cause the company is just destroying the only thing u liked

Disney isn’t in a position to open any new parks TBH. The current era of IP being virtually the only way anything creative can get off the ground doesn’t lead to a cohesive theme they can really build a park around. Making improvements to the existing parks is the only way they’re able to shoehorn IP in to existing theming. Building something new from the ground up that’s heavily based around IP is just going to expose Disney’s creative drought even more.

I'm going to go ahead and predict this now. If they plan on extending frontierland don't be surprised if they put in the Western River ride that was originally intended for Disney World.

My DCP had me working in the Pecos Kitchens. I loved the experience tbh but everyone there knew Pecos wasn’t long for this world. We never got any official word on that and the leaders never spoke on it but we knew. Kitchen equipment that needs to be replaced wasn’t ever replaced. We knew they were waiting to gut and rehaul that kitchen

The pecos bills slander will not be tolerated 😤

I’d love if we’d get some Tony Baxter Discovery Bay designs.

On the surface changing the existing Frontierland into a New Orleans theme area and creating a new Frontierland beyond big thunder mountain seems like a good idea but we are dealing with a different kind of Disney management who doesn’t want to invest any money into the parks. So, what are we gonna have? A new frontierland full of western themed planters? I also agree that Disney does not need another park, at the rate they finished Tron it would take 50 years, and we’d all be pushing walkers around not to mention the thousand dollars it would cost for a daily admission. All they need to do is maintain and expand the ones they have.

Whatever is in that ride better be a banger if they are changing a whole land for it.

I do feel like the Pecos Bill change was a complete after thought, and slowing down the completion of the bayou aesthetic. This whole thing wasn't done using the Imagineering process. It just feels like one big ask after the next, and if just one of those asks is declined it'll fudge the whole theme.

I just hope they could add thunder mesa to the beyond big thunder plan and I would be very much happy with disney.

Frontierland has always been my favourite part of the parks - not only due to its unique atmosphere, but also the ability it has to immerse you in another time. The sights & sounds are second to none, & thus it will be to Disney’s great detriment if they destroy what is already a winning formula. Some things really should be sacred, & this is certainly no exception.

I think for an expanded frontier land it would be much smarter for Disney to build an attraction based off of Western River expedition, but it in the style of the Mickey Mouse cartoons like runaway railway. They could probably build it similarly to the Pirates of the Caribbean ride at Shanghai and it would get lots and lots of attention since so many people want to go to Shanghai to ride that anyways.

Moving west through America and forward through time sounds so perfect. Do it Disney, add that to the pile of fun facts about the parks

An expension that closes the loop would be smart. I hope they take this opportunity to add some flat rides. You can't have a park of nothing bu E-ticket attractions, it just ends up with tons of long lines. They need to add ride capacity and flat rides are a cheap way to do it and add energy to a land.

Definitely agree with your thoughts in this video. Whether or not you like all the changes announced, Frontierland is LONG overdue for something new. It’s been stagnating for too long and needs some kind of change. Would love a New Orleans Square (seeing that Tiana’s is next to Pirates and Country Bears could work there), as Splash Mountain never made sense in Frontierland anyway, seeing as it was themed to the old South not the old West. If they need some kind of IP for a cost justification for a Frontierland expansion, Coco would make the most sense.

Massive respect for your use of the word "whelmed" in this video.

Why wouldn't they just put Coco in Epcot? It makes way more sense.

Honestly, a third gate in So Cal wouldn't help. DCA is, at best, a 3-4 hour day trip. They need to expand that park with twice or three times as many ride offerings.

I do think something is going to happen to Frontierland, but I never thought that it would entirely be a New Orleans retheme. I personally thought Liberty Square, the existing Frontierland street, and the area by Tiana’s would be combined into an old fashioned “Americana” land. The land would represent colonial America (Liberty Square), the American south and heartland (Country Bears and Tom Sawyer Island), and New Orleans (Tiana’s). Then the new Frontierland would start at Big Thunder Mountain. But I get what you’re saying about the transitioning between Adventureland, New Orleans, and Frontierland. I also wonder what will happen to Big Thunder Mountain Railroad amid these changes, if anything. Hopefully it gets the Disneyland treatment someday. Of all things, I REALLY hope Disney doesn’t slap an IP on it.

Thanks for actually listing the video you talked about in the description. So many creators will mention a video and say they’ll link it but never do lmfao

I've said it before and I'll say it again for the people in the back- think of it as traveling from the American west, thru the Louisiana bayou on the way to the Caribbean (aka transitioning into Adventureland). It's all part of the journey✨

I like this idea. Whenever people complained about how Tiana's Bayou Adventure doesn't fit in Frontierland, my thought was always "Why not just make a mini New Orleans Square?" Sounds like that's what they're doing. Let's be honest, Splash Mountain didn't fit in Frontierland either. It was based on the South rather than the West. The area surrounding the log flume ride (by either name) was always its own mini-land anyway.

Rename the area to “Port New Orleans” and starting with the Big Thunder expansion, call that whole area “Thunder Mesa”

Perfect excuse for Grand Western Expedition! Or that drill drop ride they were planning for Disneyland's Fronteirland before DCA bombed... Also, did they confirm whether Disneyland's Bayou Adventure is part of New Orleans Square? That will make the Pooh Bear ride be VERY out of place.

I’m not sure about everyone in this reality, but in my honest opinion yes, Living With the Land is the CURRENT best Disney ride. I, however used to ride The Peoplemover in Disneyland (like, a LOT) and that one is the best Disney ride of ALL time!

Did I see you cutting in line at Cosmic Rewind yesterday?! Would love to know why, we were very confused

I think Country Bears would be a part of Liberty Square, since Disney specifically said the new show was taking inspiration from Nashville country music. It’d be a bit out of place in New Orleans, and it wouldn’t make sense to move it all the way over to New Frontierland- maybe they could move it, but then there’s a big empty space in the middle of current Frontierland!

The ennnnnd card!!! Living with the Land is *my* favorite

Regarding what has to be moved Beyond Big Thunder Mountain...the three logistical issues are Thunder Mountain itself, the backstage parade float/boat maintenance area and the Mark Twain Riverboats. They can work around Thunder Mountain's train maintenance shed, and they can move the parade float docks...but the waterway that you're saying can be filled in can't at the moment, it's used for taking the Riverboat out for overhauls, and I'm not sure that Disney would readily get rid of that despite how rare it gets used.

Keep up the great content!

Frontierland is my favorite area and it’s so sad to se it slowly get striped of its original components. I hope they do it a justice and I am exited to see the new one but I’m still sad about the things we have lost like splash and country bear jamboree

Expand Frontierland beyond the berm! Start by adding "Rattlesnake Canyon" with a copy of the mine train at Shanghai Disney. Then add a Wild West version of the trackless Mystic Manor. Tony Baxter had some awesome ideas in the pre Thunder Mountain days.

"Moving West, through time, through America" - you're right, that's a great narrative throughline.

I think you’ll probably be right overall but it leaves one major question for me- they are calling the new Country Bears show a Nashville inspired show. So if current Frontierland is becoming New Orleans, how does Country Bears fit?

I had a feeling a video about Frontierland would be coming 😂 I’m here for it

Saw you when you were at Animal Kingdom, but didn’t get the chance to say hi :( I was excited to see that you were at WDW because I knew we were gonna get some videos!

Pecos used to honestly be really good when they had the whole burger and nacho topping bar (early to mid 2000's) but with every single menu refresh prices go up and food quality goes down and so does item size. I know the shrinkflation in the parks in bad but Peco's definitely has gotten the worst of it.

…Pecos Bill is my favorite restaurant in MK 😢

If they get rid of Big Thunder Mountain Railroad then I will have zero disney attentions I love.

Western river expedition coming soon

I love this idea since I always wanted a New Orleans theme in WDW. I grew up on the East coast so WDW has always been my park and I really wanted some kind of representation of New Orleans Square!

I finally got my magic kendall company it smells exactly like the parks

I'm usually a Disneylander, so when we went to WDW this year I was absolutely disappointed in frontierland. Its one of my favorite places in Disneyland, and the flow in disney world plus its odd and limited scope makes it so weird. I think it would be an epic overhaul if they could change the borders of the land and expand. If they could keep it frontier ish, that would be beyond my expectations

Only time will tell but whatever happens an expansion beyond BTM would not only help with crowds but also making MK more walkable like you said I think bringing in more of that exploration aspect would be fun and a great way to bring new life to old and gone attractions like the rainbow caverns or the sub ride

Universal Studios takes the W in this one they’re making new theme parks they’re making you rise their trying Disney did they just don’t care just because they’re Disney doesn’t mean that they need to stop getting rid of old rides. They definitely need to add a hell of a lot of work into the previous land. It’s embarrassing because super expensive that the quality isn’t there anymore.

I love Brayden’s content! He did say in that video beyond big Thunder’s desert themed land would fade into a villains land which would fade into haunted mansion. I feel like Disney knows that villains is a popular idea for a land

I think it's safe to say that Country Bear Musical Jamboree will still technically be in Frontierland. They said it would be different types of country music, not jazz.

The idea of the existing Frontierland changing into New Orleans and creating a new Frontierland behind Big Thunder would be amazing and would really create a better flow through that end of the park. Changing Pecos Bill into Tiana’s would also be amazing. As far as the timeline, I don’t think that Tiana’s Mountain won’t be completed until the holidays. I don’t expect the new Frontierland until 2027. I am looking forward to the new Country Bears attraction. Thank you for another insightful video.

Give us what we want, they own Fox and it’s time to bring a certain Wes Anderson to the the parks and specifically Fantastic Mr. Fox which would fit perfectly in there

Maybe they will make a Big Thunder Mountain / Frontierland themed movie, and then build an expansion to Frontierland at Disney World with specific ties to the movie. Probably not but I think it would be cool. Also I still cant tell if he genuinely loves Living With the Land or if its all sarcasm lol

Good stuff

At Magic Kingdom, the thematic and *architectural progression* from Liberty Square to Frontierland gets gradually further West until the "Pueblo" style building of Pesos Bill's. The detail is truly AMAZING. It's theming currently makes more sense than it would if it diverted to the Deep South. New Orleans was not part of the same historic timeline of the American Westward Frontier expansion. I actually feel that Florida's Frontierland is better than Disneyland's short, western style only Frontierland. Big Thunder is almost its own area on the side with not much to it.

If I could blue sky the expansion it would be done with 3 simple words. Western River Expedition. Bring Marc’s creation to life Disney!

Yeah now that they made Floridian place connect directly to Reams road they could get rid of Floridian way and that gives them a ton of space for expansion!

Love this idea. I think that is a fun idea to expand Frontierland on the other side of Big Thunder and then transition into a Coco land back around to Haunted Mansion, it all fits really well.

"All we can do is wait." I think there's a Harry Potter quote I could use here, but Disney lost those rights to Universal. Wouldn't be proper, ya know?

Love this vid OHD. I’m going to post more in a bit but I’ll start with three words… Western River Expedition.

... and 6 months from now, we'll discover Disney was just talking about a new merchandise cart somewhere in Frontierland.

If they do this, I REALLY hope they consider adding the Western River Expedition that Florida was originally going to get instead of Pirates. Obviously it would need to be updated from its original concept, but I've always been sad that they didn't try to find a way to do both once people started asking for Pirates in Florida.

Living with the Land is the GOAT!

Ok, I'm excited.

I wish Mystic Manor and the cool Pirates ride overseas was at Disney World :(

i hope villians land does happen

The spanner in the works is that Beyond Big Thunder will likely not include Encanto if Tropical Americas comes to fruition with Encanto and Indiana Jones? We could still see Frontierland Beyond Big Thunder with Coco (esepcially now DLP has a Coco restaurant in their Frontierland) but what else could fit thematically other than Home on the Range???

Maybe I have a problem with change but before splash mountain was booted off for a Tiana ride (I loved the movie btw) I was super excited about the new things in other lands and really wanted a chance to go to galaxy’s edge but now with Splash Mountain gone I have no financially sound reason to go. If there were only a few things that had me stoked to go I wouldn’t waste my money on disappointment with never getting to go on a ride that always excited me it was a Disney parks staple to me. Frontier land has always been my favorite part since my only memory of my trip to Disney when I was maybe 4 or 5 was the Country Bears so seeing so much change about my favorite Wild West area takes so much of the magic and excitement from the park now

Ok hear me out. Your thought of moving Frontierland behind BTM has really got me thinking. Most people know that the western (as in left) side of the park starts in New England and goes back in time as it runs around the Rivers of America (key word America). The Tiana addition has really bothered me from a flow standpoint as it sits in between CBJ and BTM. However, with the retheming, CBJ could be set in Nashville. It’s not linear, but a move from Nashville down to New Orleans and then out to the proper west makes a lot more sense to me from a continuity standpoint. If you look on a map the Cumberland river flows past Nashville and empties into the Mississippi which terminates in New Orleans. If they really wanted to go old school vibes they could bring back the canoes. After all, Davy Crockett was born on a mountaintop in… From there the shift into the Tiana part of the park would make more sense and a Pecos Bill face lift to Tiana’s Palace works better. I can even argue that jumping over to Pirates in Adventureland roughly firs in with this layout. After Tiana’s you get BTM and then you expand into new (old) Frontierland with an updated Western River Expedition ride. Heck, even a Coco land after that would make sense. The whole thing would stretch around the Rivers of America and those rivers would actually gives us a ton more of America then ever.

I see two issues with this theory: last we heard Encanto is now planned for Animal Kingdom, and after D23 2022 Disney came out to say they had noticed the fan interest in a Villain themed landed.

Since they seem to be serious about replacing Dinoland, U.S.A., I hope they include some easter eggs about Diggs County in new Frontierland. Like, replace the park but don't excise it from the Disney Parks "canon".

Discovery Bay would be an incredible land to loop around the R.o.A. to Liberty Square. The details of Discovery Bay, Liberty Square and the proposed New Orleans Street/Square would go a long way to improving this side of the park.

Thank you saying that a fifth gate isn't needed, but more capacity at the existing parks is. An Encanto track less dark ride in the style of Mystic Manor would be great. As would a Coco ride similar to Flight of Passage, that ride system should be used again. Disney could spend this year completely the Tiana's, updating some rides, please give Epcot's Frozen the same technology as Hong Kong.

Yesss

Honestly Western River Expedition should be brought back

Aloha Dalin..well..I understand what you are saying but when you look at the New Adventureland Tree house in DL the stream seems to be sourced by a stucco building....I am no longer convinced Disney give a crap about sight lines...thoughts?

Oh and yes...I have seen Braydons video and it is well done

Where did you get that Anaheim map print? I love it

when do you think Test track will be redone?

I love pecos bills. As someone who’s autistic, the many smaller spaces to eat is very nice to get away from the over stimulation found everywhere else in the park

I do think that Disney will be expanding to that open land area, with a full walk around. But MY feeling is they will do it in a more kiddie style of attractions, since they really have nothing in the outskirts to have families bring children. only around fantasy land can parents have their children have fun, besides characters around the park.

I have been to WDW 13 times and I promise you I've only seen Pecos Bill open a few times.

Big Thunder Bayou Adventure?

Only oddity is that they're redoing Country Bears right now -- which is located in what would be the New Orleans area. Seems odd to redo that now if the land is changing.

Agree, but I think you’ve got the scale wrong. Haunted Mansion will be New Orleans in WDW, too. I think Disney has recognized that Liberty Square and Frontierland are too controversial (e.g. Founding Fathers with no mention of slavery, cowboys vs “Indians”). Big Thunder might be rethemed to a villain mountain.

I’ve never been impressed by Florida’s Frontierland, so retheming the existing Frontierland into New Orleans while making a new Frontierland is a win-win.

I agree with everything except for Coco in Beyond Frontierland. Coco belongs in the Mexico pavilion in Epcot.

I’ve said from the jump build new Frontierland on the other side of Thunder Mountain and convert old Frontierland, after it’s moved, to New Orleans Square. More lands plus new and improved lands, everybody wins. Based on what’s going on at Universal, they will shoot to have it open 2026-2027, but they would have to start this year and not go at Disney pace.

Love LWTL!

My jaw dropped when you said you didn't like pacos bill food 😭 I love their tacos

Arghhhhhh!! Say it aint so! I LOVE Pecos Bills and I look forward to eating there on every visit to Magic Kingdom. I think the food is awesome, is "reasonably" priced, and the theming is fantastic. I love the tables, it's location across from Splash Mountain, and the seating. If you can't get a table, which is often because it is SO POPULAR, there are lots of places outside to sit and consume your food. I wouldn't be surprised to see the changes you predict, but I would be sad to see Pecos Bills go away.

Idk bad experience? Pecos bill has been the best meal around the park for my crew (besides Tony’s)

"I'm from the Wild West" lol

I think its more likely that the potential area surrounding Tiana would borrow more from Critter Country than New Orleans Square. It would be cheaper and take less effort as they can just repaint existing buildings and add more foliage.