The story was better in the regular games. The gameplay improved in the Ultra games.

Oh my god YES. Thank you so much for making this point - I feel like so many people completely miss out on the abuse of Lillie's story that they don't notice what's missing in USUM. I cried twice in Sun and Moon because I saw so much of myself in Lillie and her situation. To get rid of that is only to validate those who think Lillie is just an helpless little girl and a nuisance.

US/UM should've been direct sequels.Imagine Lillie guiding a new player throughout their journey,with a full team based off her time in Kanto,except for the mascot Legendary,who is of course nicknamed Nebby.And then an new Ultra Beast conflict,not involving Nihilego,occurs,and Lillie can occasionally mention an friend's journey in Alola,and perhaps commenting on how Nebby is similarly drawn to your new character. Anyways,during the conflict,the whole Necrozma thing is what caps it off,except Ultra Necrozma isn't buffed up like it is the normal thing,and you have to face someone who apparently leads the Ultra Recon Squad,and he uses Naganandel and Ultra Necrozma,but frees Nebby after he's defeated because it's a Pokémon game. Then,the player goes on their normal journey,perhaps assuming they'll face the previous protagonist,only to face Champion Hau.After defeating Hau and claiming the title of Champion,Hau will reveal that his Rival gave him the title so his Rival could go to Hoenn and train some more.Lillie can show up and imply that the old protagonist will be returning to reclaim their title from the new protagonist. Cue the Rainbow Rocket post-game.

I definitely felt that Lillie's character arc felt... off in USUM, same with Lusamine and Gladion. You really hit the nail here with why that was.

“Sure, Necrozma was out to steal all the light in Alola, but I didn’t know he was also taking the characterization too!” You sir have officially gained one extra follower for this amazing video, and that ending line alone! Congrats!

Five years later and I’m still salty that they removed that exeggutor island scene. One of my favorite scenes in the original game and even in Pokémon in general and they just said “Nope! You can’t have that anymore, we have Necrozma! Don’t you loooooove Necrozma? Isn’t he just soooo cool?” Makes me mad.

Oh Lillie, why did USUM trade you in exchange for Hau She was just SO much more interesting as a character...

Nearly 4 years ago since Ultra Sun and Moon came out and I decided to replay the gen 7 games to see if they held up. Aside from the large amount of tutorials, I had a lot of fun with Sun and Moon, but it wasn't until I played Ultra Sun and Moon that I realized how much Lillie's story carried the game for me. Lillie and Gladion were two kids that ran away from an abusive mother, but the Ultra games imply that Lusamine was more an absent mother busy with research and work, but not necessarily abusive and still provided for them. Which makes Lillie's and Gladion's attitude toward Lusamine a little exaggerated and unfair to a degree. I still like Ultra Sun and Moon, but if I'm ever revisiting the Alola Region, it's going to be the original Sun and Moon games, it just had the better story. I wish that they made ultra sun and moon sequels rather than improved versions and that Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee could have been the story of Lillie's Journey in Kanto.

I'm glad I played Sun and Moon, it felt so fresh at the time, I kept up with updates leading up to the game, the environments were great, basing it off Hawaii was super cool, getting rid of HM's was fantastic, and Alolan forms was such a good idea! The storytelling, I think, is so good, and there's no better example of the rich connection to the characters than when Lillie gives you the Legendary and you're allowed to rename them, I have never seen someone name them anything other than Nebby on a first playthrough.

The thing that bothers me is... Where Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon made improvements, other Pokémon games are still better. Whereas the one area Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon ruined (the story) is what made Sun and Moon stand out from other Pokémon games.

Other points I didn't mention/delve into too much in the video: * On the subject of Lusamine not having the same twisted, delusional maternal complex she had towards the Ultra Beasts in the Ultras as in regular S/M, one such example of this is the immediate aftermath of the fight with Nihilego at Aether Paradise. In Sun and Moon, after confirming she needs to get "that Pokemon" back (Cosmog), she declares that she'll find that creature again, and that "I will love it!" with a rather sinister look on her face, before going back to her friendly facade to see off the player and Hau. However, in the Ultras, after confirming she needs Cosmog back, the Ultra Recon Squad shows up and Lusamine is just like, "Oh, you know, we'll be ready if that thing or Necrozma shows up". And the Nihilego incident is pretty much NEVER MENTIONED AGAIN, despite Nihilego specifically being so crucial to the change in personality and mental state that ultimately tore her family apart in the first place. * With the incident with Mohn not even really brought up at all in the Ultras (in regular Sun/Moon, you could talk to Gladion at Aether Paradise about it in the post-game), as well as Lusamine's obsession with Nihilego being basically made moot, it's rather surprising (read: ridiculous) that the Ultras got a cutscene wherein a still-amnesia-ridden Mohn visits the Aether Paradise and has something of a bittersweet reunion with Lusamine, wherein she and Mohn have a nice conversation about how Aether Paradise and the Poke Pelago both help Pokemon in need of care, before Lusamine accepts that Mohn doesn't remember her or her family and learns to let him go. * Without the scene on Exeggutor Island where Lillie talks about the time her mother ran out to get her in the rain -- which includes a mention of Lusamine allowing Lillie to sleep in her bed with her afterwards when they both got sick -- the aftermath of the battle with Lusamine in the Aether Paraside has less impact. It's such a small scene, but still one affected by the change in their dynamic -- in the originals, Lillie says she wants to sleep in her mom's bed one last time, perhaps trying to recapture some of the good memories she had from that day with her mother in the rain, whereas in the Ultras, Lillie still wants to sleep in Lusamine's bed in the post-battle scene, but simply to "try and understand what her mother might've been thinking". Again, it just doesn't hold the same weight there. * In the endgame of the regular Sun/Moon storyline, the reason that Lillie goes to Kanto is to help Lusamine get better and to help herself become a stronger person by starting a Pokemon journey, but in the Ultras, it's Gladeon that leaves on the boat, because...he wants to train in Kanto and Johto? I get that this is likely so that he can get stronger with Silvally in order to challenge the new Champion (the player) and he doesn't need to be the acting President of the Aether Foundation since Lusamine is able to fulfill her duties in the Ultras, but this is just another thing Lillie is robbed of -- the chance to go somewhere new, start fresh, for both her mother and herself, and to give herself the chance to grow even more than she had during the journey she had with the player, all so that Gladeon can gain a few more levels for a Pokemon League battle that we all know he'll ultimately lose.

The Ultras seem to have changed Lusamine to where she was never infected by Nihilego.Which only makes the pieces of cruelty that remain worse.

Y'know, if I've gotta be honest, this is exactly why I _don't_ like the Ultra games. Say what you will about what they did for the gameplay: more pokemon, more side quests, etc., ... But you wanna know why Sun's still my favorite gen 7 game _and_ my favorite Pokemon game in general? Because the story and characters were so much more developed and interesting than anything I'd seen out of the series _possibly_ barring Mystery Dungeon, and nowhere was this more evident than with Lillie's arc. When I first played Sun, Lillie and Lusamine were tied for my favorite characters in the entire series, and that still holds true a year later, but only in Sun. In the Ultra games? They basically just said "Yeah, Lillie's cool and all, but HEY GUYS CHECK OUT THIS BADASS LIGHT DRAGON!!1" This is gonna sound super fucking petty of me, but it's gotten to the point where out of all the pokemon in existence, Necrozma's the only one I actually feel dirty about liking because of what GF sacrificed in order to give it the spotlight. Sorry for the rant. I've been going through some difficult times recently with college and shit, and because of that, things that I would normally find disappointing at worst have been stressing me out a lot more than they probably should. In fact, maybe that's why the Ultra games stung so much for me; playing through Sun was one of the last good experiences I had during high school. And here I am getting emotional over Pokemon. Fan-fucking-tastic.

I LOVE how you used the word 'sanitised', that's added my lingo now

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought this pair of games messed with the whole Aether family story arc

"Lillie...? When did you start getting so beautiful?" Me: *Cries*

In my opinion US/UM could totally have this necrozma subplot after the lillie and lusamine confront in the ultra beast verse, but i guess so gamefreak did'nt want one of the best, if so the best character development in all of the franchise in the "2.0 version". meh!

Honestly before I watched this video I couldn’t see how this was possible. However when I watched the video I completely understand it. Her arc was completely destroyed in ultra sun and ultra moon.

THANK YOU! I felt like I was the only person ever to feel this, but clearly not!

ngl so many people fall into the last category of Lillie, craving love from a parental figure who is toxic and overjoyed when they get even a little of it. In that respect, while it was unsatisfying and most likely unintentional, I can respect that aspect of the story for its realism.

They improved everything else, made it easier to get get BP that isn't called the fucking tree that shall not be mentioned by name, made SOS battles less bullshit, extra side-quests, expanded on the lore (sorta), TRR (even though I thought how it was handled was disappointing, I still enjoyed the ride)and they even gave us new Pokemon, but they some how fucked up the aspect that made the originals great in the first place?! *H O W ? !*

There could have been an easy way to make this not so bad. Make it so in the Ultra timeline Lusamine was the one who disappeared, and while her husband stayed in Alola to run Aether and raise Lillie and Gladion.

This is the big reason why the Ultra games should have been sequels like B2W2. So the wouldn’t have had ruin one of my favorite characters in all of Pokémon with a crappy rewrite

They totally ruined Lillie's character in ultra sun and moon. She is probably my favorite pokemon character. I just felt a very deep emotional connection to her. The emotional abuse Lillie faced is very close to what I faced from my own mother. I honestly felt like it was like I was looking in a mirror at some points. I faced constant of verbal abuse, manipulation, gaslighting and guilting. She hasn't changed. She doesn't want to change because she doesn't think she has ever done anything wrong. One odd parallel to Lillie and myself is that her mother made her wear only the clothing that she chose for her. She would get angry if she wore anything else. If I tried to go out outside of what my mother's general range of clothing choices for me or had her deal of approval she would get angry at anything that deviated. She would insult you, talk down to you and say you were a freak. Lillie's final confrontation with her mother felt very emotional for me. I actually cried when you hear Lusamine finally acknowledge her daughter for the first time by saying "Lillie when did you become so beautiful?". It was so bittersweet for me. I was happy for her character and it felt so heart warming. I was a little depressed because thay sort of thing never happened with my mom and I. It probably never will either.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

I've actually been disappointed in myself for having not even played Ultra Sun past the intro since I bought it when it was released. After watching this, I'm kind of glad I never played through it. Lillie's journey and development was my favorite thing about Sun and Moon. Come on, Pokemon. You can do better than this. Also, this shit is getting a little outrageous. I'm not a genwunner by any means but these Ultra Beasts and Ultra Space and Ultra Wormholes and holy crap, what even is Pokemon anymore? I love Pokemon for the well-designed creatures, beautiful landscapes, battles, characters and the usually fantastic storytelling. As much as I love and will probably always love Pokemon, I just think things are getting a bit out of hand.

I only played ultra sun and was not aware of the downside. what a bizarre change to make.

Dude these videos have so been missed

Yes. Yes! YES! Thank you so much for making this point. If they had just gotten this one part right, US/UM would be the unquestionable superior to Sun/Moon. When I first watched a play-through of Ultra Sun and saw how this aspect was changed, something felt really off about it, and you put it into words better than I ever could. I'm glad there is someone else who takes the time to appreciate the stories of the games they love as much as I do.

As someone who doesn’t really care about difficulty and collecting stuff in video games I do dislike USUM entirely because of what they did to the family trio, that was the only thing I actually cared about in the games. I forgot if hau had his character arc in the original games but if not then that is the moment I actually started liking hau.

Sun and Moon were unfinished, but it had a good story. Ultra Sun and Moon were finished, but had a less impactful story. They could've had both, like Platinum or Black and White. But when it comes to Pokemon, Nintendo thinks lowly of their consumer. They've stopped making their games as stories, and now they're focused on making games as consumable generic media.

THANK FUCKING CHRIST SOMEONE SAID IT. My favorite part of Sun/Moon is that you don't play as the main character. You play as the main character's best friend. That's what makes it so powerful. And when you take that away and shoehorn in yet another "ooh big scary dark legendary is threatening the world! :0" it ruins so, so much. Fuck USUM.

I feel like y'all have changed my opinion on the USUM games and now I feel like I'd rather eat my own hands than play US again. Damn it. I loved the game and didn't think anything of it because I was too enthralled with the story, so I barely noticed the changes. On top of that, I prefer antagonists that aren't just sitting in that black area of the moral compass. I prefer ones that have a fair point, not "eww y'all are peasants time to summon Satan and destroy the world because I'm a selfish dick." Which is probably why I like Lusamine in US better. Other than that, I was a bit disappointed with the fact the Looker quests are gone and how the Ultra Wormhole motion controls work and how small an area the Mega place was or whatever, but I wasn't too disappointed story wise.

I know I'm like almost a year late to this video, but I found it because I was wondering if anyone else had made a video on the subject (I was thinking of making one to talk about my own feelings on it on a personal level if no one else had). You hit a lot of the same points though, so thank you. I'm glad I'm at least not the only one who feels this way about how USUM treated Lillie.

I know this videos old but I just happened to play Ultra Moon for the first time and beat it a week or two back but I think you make a really good point. I loved the game but now seeing how it compares to S/M which I never played really does seem like the whole thing was unearned. But maybe if they happen to make a Ultra Sun 2 or something like that they could show that Lusamine isn’t right still or something like that idk just a thought but great video.

Yeah I agree that the original SM games handle Lillie’s characters much better then USUM.

ayyy i've missed your videos glad your back, really enjoyed this one :D

Necrozma: Who needs great story themes and character development when you got me?

Did someone else notice that lillie tried to confess to the main character in the game and that ots not in ultra sun or moon i liked the Extra content and more gameplay and stuff but i hate how they changed lillie as a character

Idc I still love the story of the originals better. They’re the only Pokémon game that made me cry at the end. Another reason why original Lillie is better

Was a reason ever given for why they neutered her and her mother’s character development? Because one of the things were Lusamina in sun/moon that made her such an interesting villain was the reveal of the cryo- room. Because she flips it on its head, attributing it to no different than when you put a Pokémon in a box. For me at least this hit, especially hard. Because with the little thing with the Pokédex showing you the evolutionary line when you catch a new Pokémon. It made it very enticing to collect all the Pokémon on each island before you move on. And that’s exactly what I did. I basically raised every single Pokémon I caught in Malee island to level 20 as a start off point to get them to all evolve and then I put them in their box all nice and neat and organized and then I kept going. So when I finally got to her that whole revelation really stung. Ultra Sun /ultra Moon slap a hero complex on her. It really took the teeth out of her Villainy.

... yeah I got nothing. XD AMAZING video dude, dat editing too Kreygasm

I’m just glad something happens between Lillie and her mom. Plus Lillie stays in Alola to be your partner. That’s rewarding.

Honestly this made me wish for an ultra sun or ultra moon mod where they still have the quality of life changes and additions but keep the Story of Sun and Moon intact rather than the Necrozma bullshit Maybe have Necrozma and the ultra recon squad be post game stuff, i was so mad when i found out i was robbed of a decent story line cus i played ultra moon thinking the story aint changed

I mean I see your point. Honestly I feel the same but the big plot twist I found amazing was faba was the true villain. So, in this sense, let’s say lusamine was never infected with the toxins but it was faba who was secretly controlling her to take over the foundation with rainbow rocket. That’s why lusamine has been abusive is because faba wanted the legendary to make rainbow rocket easier.

Lillie hasn't changed a bit of her mother villain You know but unfortunately Lloyd father of Ninjago You know

This is why all of the stuff in ultra sun and moon would have been better off as DLC

So, in trying to develop Necrozma, they got rid of Lusamine and Lillie's character arc?

This is why I think it would’ve been a better idea if Gamefreak went the sequel route with USUM rather than the remake route cos now everything Lillie and Lusamine went through in SM is basically declared null and void lorewise. It would’ve been so much cooler seeing maybe Lillie coming back from Kanto older and stronger and Lusamine all cured and doing better and Lillie could’ve been like a mentor to us the protagonist and then assist us in dealing with Necrozma and they could say like our old protagonist released Solagelgo/Lunala or another Cosmog was born and grew up into Solagelgo/Lunala and then Necrozma gets its hands on it. It would’ve been a much better story and experience if it was a sequel. So yeah SM definitely handle Lillie and Lusamines character arc a hell of a lot better. Yes I am aware that the junior team at Gamefreak worked on this game in fact it’s the only reason I can forgive them for not making USUM a sequel most likely due to the fact they didn’t want to force the juniors to go craft an entire project from scratch so they just gave them SM and told them to remake it so they still had a basis to work with while the main guys worked on the integration to the Switch. What saddens me is that because of this Gen 7 has technically already received a remake so we probably won’t get one again but we can only hope if they do decide to make one for the Switch or whatever new console we’ll have by then they make it a sequel instead

In my opinion a story a game possesses is a factor that can either make or break the game it isn't present within,and due to the watered down,unjustified,depthless story absent of any essential character development established within it's predecessors,aswell as due to the fact not many people acknowledge said flaws and view it as better in comparison then it's predecessors,,that has rendered these "Ultra" installments as my least favorite Pokemon installments

Let's not forget how she throws away Nebby's safety after all of this, saying that Necrozma needs Nebby's light to sustain itself... even though Necrozma is a dangerous monstrosity that has shown that it is clearly power-hungry. But no, it deserves *forgiveness* for almost ruining *two* worlds, even at the detriment of a Pokemon she cares deeply about. Really, the whole problem with Lillie in Ultra Sun & Moon can be summed up as he being *too forgiving.*

thx for the recap i only played Ultra ver

5:00 all i wanted to change in the ultra remake was to be able to go with her, as a neat post-game thing, but instead we got rainbow rocket. Ultra should've been a direct sequel wherein you go to kanto to find and help Lille.

Alternate universes exist in pokemon in this version of the events probably insted of nihilego when mohn got sucked by the utra wormhole and lusamine getting attacked by said nihilego necrozma showed up graged mohn into utra wormhole and lusamine got tramatised (or something like that ) and she wants revenge so yeah the reason that in that reality lusamine wanted to fight necrozma it was for revenge

I played the Ultra version right after the regular version and I remembered that I was so mad that the game said the boat to Exeggutor Island was not enough for two :< Getting rip of the talk in the cave so we can't even know how their mother-daughter relationship is, how Lissamine was and how Lilie feels about it :< GameFreak could exchange a match with Kukui to give you a Champion match with Hau, which made him well-developed in the Ultra. However, yeah from how I feel, Hau's character development can't compensate for Lilie's character development cut.

You right

Everyone here keeps saying that the Ultra games should’ve been sequels, when honestly Necrozma could’ve easily been the post game where you join Looker and Anabel with the Ultra Beasts(catching them like in vanilla) but more wormholes start popping out to the point it becomes to much to handle. Then the Ultra Recon Squad can come and assist with you three and tie into the plot with Necrozma, with how Necrozma is going haywire, going through dimensions so we have to wormhole travel and stuff to stop it or our world may collapse on itself. As for Rainbow Rocket, we can tie it back to Necrozma with Giovanni wanting it for his own plans of further world domination. Getting the other box legendary, all he needing is Necrozma. So basically keeping it the same, but like you have to track him down via wormholes till you find a pocket dimension he created, thanks to abusing the opposite box legendary dimensional powers. Having to infiltrate inside and so and so forth. But that’s just me. :/

I wonder what Game Freak will do with the plot if/when they remake Gen 7 (after they do remakes of DP, BW, and XY, so probably around the year 2034? If the 5 year thing is accurate, so probably not lol)

gladion is such a good charicter

Ultra sun and Ultra moon had a much better story about Lillie and her mother. Though Lusamine is evil, she had finally learned right from wrong. You shouldn't just take out your anger on your kids just because their father got lost in an ultra wormhole due to a bad experiment. She primarily was looking for how to get him back. Also, family is one of the most important things in life. After all, absolutely no one can choose his/her own family. I'm glad it had a happy ending for Lusamine and Lillie after the battle with Necrozma. I didn't want to see her leave Alola at the end of Sun and Moon. She was my favorite character in the whole game.

Now I'm sad since I ended up playing the ultra games first just cause that's how things ended up. I guess I have a better story to look forward to at least

forgot to mention the exegutor island cutscene

The Ultra games simultaneously feel better and worse than sun and moon. I actually put more hours into ultra moon, but it pretty much took out the story that made sun and moon so great.

i think usum would have been one of if not the best Pokemon games ever if they 1. baked the original story into the necrozma story, and 2. made them a third version instead of splitting them again, there was no need for it, they got their cash grab with the split versions just release an enhanced version for the people who don't like messing with getting version exclusives and what have you

Lillies story is so different in the anime

Includes Pokemon Sun and moon anime lack's of Lillie hasn't changed a bit of her mother As well As the ultra sun and ultra moon lacking of Kanto never mentioned By Lillie words shouldn't allow to speak from Kanto region alone As well

Absolutely Phenomenal! Every single reason made sense, I 100% agree with you!

A bit late to the party sorry As a guy that really loves gen 7 i think that you are 100% right In my opinion if they just gave us the story of sun moon and after you save lusamine then necrozma shows then this game would be perfect

Thanks for this informative video, i like the Lillie and Lunamine plot and the way you described all the cut content, made me decide not to buy the game

do the sun and moon games take place before or after the anime?

THIS. I think Lillie was, and always a great Pokémon character. Lusamine could easily be the best villain because she reminds me so much of my mother, so as much as I loved USUM gameplay wise, I feel like their great character arcs died out in USUM. I hated the fact, and up to this day, seethe towards the erasure of what made Lillie and Lusamine excellent characters in SM because Lusamine in USUM is a great example (not great IRL) of how mothers abuse their role and excuse themselves of the trauma they cause their children because it was "supposedly done out of love" and how they feel they can always get away with it because that's just how mothers are. That was just not it for me. If only they likened their relationship in USUM the way they did in the anime where their story was explained further and was more fleshed-out, then it might not have been so bad. But even then, it's nothing more than a shell of the better storytelling Sun and Moon did.

Lillie Is still the villain of her mother As well 👍😒

the anime sitll worse because after lillie story arc, she just turned back the way she was before like nothing happened

So Lusamine's supposed to be like Mrs. Coulter? Interesting.

Why can't a good story and good gameplay go hand in hand, this kind of problems happens so much in video games, in black and white 2 it was fine because it wasn't the same game and was a very enjoyable sequel for fans, it's like an higly extended post game for people who loved black and white, there was so much possibility with a sun moon sequel

OK you convinced me to play the original Pokémon Sun. 😅👏🏻

Perhaps I think they should fix the the new story line with this... I think they should point out that lusamean should be abusive to her kids (I think they left out the toxins) because she was lead to believe that they have to subcome to the influence of some Rocket splinter faction. And was also lead to believe that the monster she wants to fight personally has a special weakness. After she returns from ultra space, she learned that the rocket thing was proven false. Lusamean let her husband live in his amnesia life because she was afraid what he would find out what happened to the children. During the rainbow rocket Arc, it was revealed that the assistant that betrayed her was also responsible false information on the kids as well as the false weakness. In the end lusamean tries to reconcile with her husband by disguised as a drifter looking for a new adventure.

FUCKING YES! Even though I could hardly keep up with your speaking speed... ^-^;

This is why I only played Sun and Moon and not the Ultra games and I probably never will Infact those are the only enhanced versions I skipped in the franchise.

It's basically just why they shouldn't have made this a duo of special editions but rather their own things. If they wanted to play into Necrozma and the mystery of Ultraspace...then do it! Don't drag a plot into it that has no purpose anymore.

You forgot the romantic attachment to the player

THANK YOU

I think the biggest reason for the change was people complaining about there being too much story. It really feels like they cut down as much story as possible, and added the very minor Necrozma changes. They should of just kept the story the same, and reworked a few elements to feature Necrozma. I hate that so many people complained about how much story the game had, now we may get less in future games.

For lillie's mom please say the hole thing just don't say a at the end

YES YES YES YES YES!👏👏👏 I 100% Agree! This vid describes EXACTLY my thoughts on why USUM utterly DESTROYED the Aether Fams dynamic!👏 FUCKING...y a s!🥰 Awesome vid ma dude!🥰🥰🥰😘

But well the best thing is that she is not going away after the story

I just bought the game to not need to buy a Minifigure for 162USD but i am not that far into the story so i didnt realise that thats so big of a problem. I played moon two times so the better story is still deep in my mind and i hopefully will just reflect (xD) the USUM story... Lillie is such a great character... But i dont want to buy a new Sun game... :(((

Atleast we get to keep her this time.

I also wrote a post about this on /r/Pokemon. Goes into detail more, and shares some of my own feelings as well as yours. Made sure to reference you! www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/92ewj3/why_lillie_will_forever_be_my_favorite_pokemon/

It's pronounced Loo-sa-mean. no accented E at the end.

this video was awsome!!! i love gladion

I'm pretty sure that's because ultra sun and Moon is in a different timeline then normal sun and Moon. In the normal timeline we get way more story about lillie and her family. But in the ultra timeline we don't. The reason is probably because in the ultra timeline lusamine wasn't effected by the toxin so she didn't get obsessed with ultra beasts and instead just wanted to get revenge for her husband. And the reason. She still treat's her kids like trash is probably because the lose of her husband did more emotional damage to her in the ultra timeline and like some mom's and Dad's do if something like that happened to them take out there anger on there kids. But I am disappointed that we don't get a lot of character development with Lillie in the ultra timeline. Also another reason could be that gamefreak probably thought that did enough character development in the first version of sun and Moon. Or they just wanted to make the game way more different than the original one's for some reason I don't know. Hope this helps you out.

I honestly am not too disappointed. Okay I was a little disappointed but not to the extent of everyone in the comments saying they dislike the game over it. The only part I was truly disappointed in was that in Team RR, There was no Gen II representatives and no B2W2 Ghetsis with his Kyurem.

I kind of fell off the mainline Pokemon games after how badly Black and White 2's story disappointed me. Couldn't get into XY for reasons unrelated to the game (had a lot going on in my personal life), and hearing that USUM did pretty much the same thing to Lillie and Lusamine that BW2 did to N and Ghetsis just makes me wonder why Nintendo/The Pokemon Company likes kneecapping their powerful stories about emotional abuse so much. Like, BW1 really resonated with me deeply because N reminds me a lot of myself as a kid/teenager, and while I never had anyone _as_ bad as Ghetsis in my life, it's a question of degree and not kind. All the retconning and weird character decisions in BW2 felt to me like they were actively trying to undermine the powerful statements BW1 made; softening the blow by Ghetsis not being his birth father and so on. Thank you for this piece explaining the Lillie and Lusamine situation - it was informative even though I haven't and may never play the Alola games.

its 4am where i am so a lot of this might not make sense but this is so accurate and im so glad to hear someone saying it! whilst i greatly enjoy ultra sun and moon for its extra features, the most important part of a game for me personally is the story, and watching one of my favourite stories get twisted and turned into this empty hollow-feeling...mess was pretty heartbreaking like dont get me wrong the CONCEPT of necrozma/ultra necrozma and all that is pretty badass, but it didnt fit, and they tried to make it fit by changing the characters core motivations and values and personalities, and stripping away so much, and they just dont feel like the characters we'e come to know and love (or hate) so it just did NOT work at all (which tbh does a disservice to the human characters AND necrozma) what gets me about lusamine is that whilst she doesnt feel.....as evil in the ultra games, she still had pokemon frozen??? she still let the type nulls get made, she still put cosmog through a lot of pain and stress, yet this just gets brushed aside completely and she never has to face consequences for these actions, and her kids suddenly are completely okay with her again, its...almost insulting, like after the rainbow rocket stuff happens, and the player character, lusamine and some others have a giggle about something, they're literally in the cryo room, there's goddamn frozen pokemon right behind them and we're just expected to ignore that? and dont get me started on gladion, like his whole thing in sun and moon was about protecting type null, mirroring the way lillie ran to protect nebby (but have them do so in ultimately different ways) and now its just about him getting stronger? i get he wants to protect lillie and thats part of his motivation, but i feel like type null really got shafted here, and since that was an important part of gladion's story, his character suffered as a result you pretty much nailed everything wrong with how usum handled lillie so i've got nothing to say there but jesus...i cant really forgive ultra sun and moon for stripping the heart of the story just to put in necrozma, when they really should have just done a sequel to handle that stuff

Hey nerd what was your opinion of breath of the wild

Lillie

Some tend to think Pokemon started its inevitable downwards spiral with Gen8 but tbh, it started well before that and it wasn't just with this particular incident. One anti-consumer decision after another has brought us to the shithole that GF/Nintendo are now and while I'm not surprised whatsoever, there's many who've become almost defiantly ignorant of it. I plan on making my way through the old games I used to play, from Gen1-6. I never got to Gen7 so I had to resort to just research and walkthroughs. Gen7 was really the beginning of the end for Pokemon; SM were unfinished as all hell and while USUM were indeed more 'finished products', personally, I feel like it's utter BS that we had to wait for the 'Ultra' versions for them to be 'completed' in the first place. It's nothing like with Gen5's BW games. B2W2 were sequels, not remakes. Completely different. The fact they had to remake the generation they had just done was a huge red flag and this was prior to Gen8's dull and lifeless release. Then there was Gen9... that didn't surprise me at all. Yeah, Gen9 outsold every single other Gen... and it was also deemed the worst Gen out of them all. It's kinda funny... Lusamine's original personality in SM reflected GF/Nintendo to a T. Of course they neutered her more sociopathic tendencies; they wanted to come off as more 'child-friendly'. I could bring up Japan's overall bad track record with mental health and how people less fortunate than others are mistreated horribly in public but I'll refrain since I don't wanna come off racist. There's indeed a pretty disturbing trend with that sort of thing there. Just saying. I'll still pick up UM over M when I get to Gen7 only because of the gameplay content but man... knowing what I know about the story's gonna make me really dislike it as a whole.

That's all I can say

Do What if TouHou characters were Pokemon trainer