Hi everyone thanks for joining me this evening. As I mentioned earlier Jay Reid has a channel and resources to help people in their recovery from narcissistic abuse, as well as a course for therapists who work with those who have experienced narcissistic abuse. details below. A link to Jay's online course to help with Recovery from Narcissistic Abuse: jreidtherapy.com/narcissistic... The link to Jay's free webinar on '7 Self-Care Tools to Recover from Narcissistic Abuse':jreidtherapy.com/webinar-self... Here's the link to Jay's e-book on Surviving Narcissistic Abuse as the Scapegoat: jreidtherapy.com/ebook-scapeg... Private Facebook Support Group that Accompanies the Online Course:facebook.com/groups/recov... Take the narcissistic emotional abuse quiz: jreidtherapy.com/quiz/narc-ab... Schedule a free 15-minute phone consultation: jreidtherapy.com/book-now Jay's KZfaq channel has a wealth of information on narcissistic families and recovery. Subscribe to Jay's channel: / @jreid-heal-narci...

They claim you are what they are. They shame you for what you are not guilty of. They project, onto you, what they know is wrong about themselves. Shaming you, while never a thought of making a change or two within themselves. Be kind to you, you are worth it. Boundaries are beautiful! 🧡

Praying a swift and restorative healing for everyone on their journey and getting unstuck. May God bless you all

Do not become the person that they are accusing you of being. That is brilliant.

I'm still "here" grieving after several yrs. Lost my entire family, and extended family. Close friends I can count on one hand.

It is so true that we are not grieving the relationship we had - but what we bought into - or as you say, were "promised". To quote the wonderful singer songwriter Chris Smithers, "Its not what I lost that makes me sad. Its what I thought I had." I very happy to finally be free of my delusion.

Oh yeh, I ruminate constantly. Because I just cannot believe that my defensive family wrote me out rather than have one conversation with me.

Decades of abuse in the marriage does take time to heal, there is light at the end. I’m grateful for coming out of it.

12 year marriage and I was just discarded and ghosted by my husband. I'm here because I need major healing

I’m stuck because I stayed married to a psychopathic malignant narcissist for forty years. He alienated everyone, and made it clear that I would lose the whole family if I didn’t please him. It took me 10 years to get used to the idea of having nobody, including my 4 kids. After 2 hospitalizations I’m not making any new friends and the few I have left are all that keep me here. After having a horrible birth family all I wanted was family. I learned never tell anyone what is important to you because they will work to take it away. That’s my acceptance.

This is very helpful. I have been stuck for almost six years of trying to break free. (38 years of marriage) thank you for this topic . It’s very very helpful! For some people this is the only therapy we can afford . Thank you !!

Yes, Darron, EXACTLY!! I’m grieving the relationship I wanted it to be, and….OMG…..the loss of time!!! Nearly 2 decades!!! 😭😭

I knew nothing about Narcissism until I was love-bombed, devalued and discarded by one. As Darren has said, it's the worst possible pain. I ruminate a lot but am getting stronger bit by bit. I've cried a river over the past 4 months!! It's easing off a bit. thank you Darren. this is so supportive.

I will be 50 this year. I’m just she of my Masters degree in counseling. I’m struggling with PTSD, and have had to quit working. I do want to go back, even if I don’t use it professionally. I feel like my life has been robbed. I keep waiting for the right time. Idk what I really want anymore. I’m not able to do much. Everything feels hard.

Temporarily having a narcissist housemate was absolutely horrifying. I am really angry and devastated that children live with that for years. I might even make career of pulling children out of that. I'm in the midst of a counselling diploma right now. I CANNOT believe how awful narcissistic abuse is. Utterly disgusting. Nasty. Nasty stuff.

Thirty years in … eight months out! No contact completely seems to be working for me 🙏

You're grieving the loss of yourself/your life and possibilities that you lost.

16:50 I'm definitely grieving the version of him that he presents to the rest of the world. I'm grieving the way the relationship made me feel, during the short periods when it was good. I'm also grieving the relationship I believed we could have had. And, I'm grieving the relationship I was promised.

Lately ive been ruminating and blaming myself for my terrible choices and losing so much time with toxic people. Its been 20 years since i divorced the narc. 13 years since my narc parents passed away. 10 years since I last talked to my 3 siblings. Im trying to stay present, not get lost in the past.

I LOVE how you said "live in defiance".....YES❤

Darren, your videos are full of important information that can help so many people. You have such a calm demeanor, while at the same time covering disturbing topics.

Yes , we don’t like things things that don’t make sense and then there is the struggle to accept the lack of accountability , realizing there is no justice in the legal system , just walking away . Over three years out of a 35 year marriage and now still in divorce proceeding , trying to hold on to finances , all of this at retirement age ! Sometimes I am very angry and frustrated but ultimately relieved to be away from the abusive husband .

The road to recovery is definitely not a cake walk and you're correct in saying the pain hurts like no other.....I just keep reminding myself what my freedom looks like to me because it's definitely not what I'm currently living and after learning about this diabolical mess, I am determined to come out on the other side of this......thanks to people and videos like Darren and his heartfelt content.......and last, but not least, my Creator❤ That is what I am grateful for from enduring this mess. I was reintroduced to Jesus . We WILL come through this.....you never get over it, you learn to allow the experience to better yourself ❤

I don't expect to ever recover they kill a part of you that is optimistic or happy I have serious trust issues now and am completely introverted this is a result of not just the original narcissistic abuse but how I was degraded by others also after fleeing it's a very enabling society I came to realize virtuous traits like truth or justice just do not prevail and that's a depressing realization.

i was discarded again yesterday. i keep making the same mistake. Your video helps me become accountable for my part in falling for the hoover.

I wish you were near! I'm the mother of the daughter who fled home with her 5 kids and pets after fleeing a very abusive husband! The word narcissism was one word she told her dad and I that we needed to study! My goodness! We didn't know of the abuse she was enduring! She was within hours of her death! He's still manipulating her life... Always 'making deals'! Divorce has been put off 3 times...his attys are much like him! Terribly upsetting! 💔

Living in defiance! Not mean or violent but just in small ways that are meaningful to me!

I started with a shamanic rattle, rain stick, and books on trance like Where The Spirits Ride The Winds, and journey music. I sit in my house all alone facing out the sliding glass door looking at the changing maple tree in my Ohio backyard. Remaining still as possible. The rattle and journey music clear my mind. I am meeting myself. It was sad because I missed my son for whom I bought the house. It ended within four months of moving in...his rifle was locked up at the Sheriff's office and the protection order removed him from the house permanently. Right now I'm shaking the rattle.

“They think about winning the battle. But recovery is the ability to think ahead - thinking about winning the war” …

I loved this video so much! ❤ be the best version of yourself which sometimes is enough to be a villain for them. Be the villain - say no, have boundaries, be assertive, self-confident, self-trusting, independent, reasonable, sensible, grounded in reality and your own integrity and authenticity ❤be the hero of your own story❤ thank you Darren❤

Thank you Darren. I still live in his property. I have parkinsons disease and there is a housing crisis. Theres also my very aging dog...I live in defiance as you say. Ive cried so much, ive done that kind of grieving that has me spent and affects my health. I do experience anxiety, anger, boredom. Stopped being jealous of the new supply...i feel compassion for her. She thinks shes saving him. From me. Ive been placing small boundaries. No hugs, not very emotional sharing. Food, coffee? ok. The dog, the cat...ok .Maybe comment a movie etc. Nothing deep. Nothing about us, the relationship, the new supply, therapy...i minimize contact. Thats enough. I need self protection, new networks, couple old good friends. Thats it. I like your calm style. Its inspiring. Right now im listening to Darren from Belfast from the middle of nowhere in Co Galway.I strive for sovereignty. Bit by bit. Thans a million. From the bits of soul he hasnt stolen.🙏

4:42 “we don’t like things that don’t make sense” “how are they going to hurt me” - so true in relation to rumination about narcissistic sibling. I’m trying to heal myself, and gray rock.

I feel better about my choices after watching this. Leaving saved my mental health! I was confused what I was looking for from my cheating x fiancée. I don’t feel so crazy!

Love your videos, no need for music etc that's just distraction. Love what you do.

We think we can fix it, we can't!

This is incredible. This is spot on!! You are reading my mind so many things I've said as I recover from a abusive narcissistic discard and divorce court.

I can only say thank you sir. And I am curious how you know my life having never met me? You know my every thought and behavior. Exactly!

I discovered you yesterday and have been listening to your videos one after the other. I hink my beautiful daughter may be a narcissist, im currently in councelling to sort out the confusion and mess in my mind that I have been left with (no contact for 2 years) I love her so much but had to break away when I swear I actually felt my heart break. Thank you so much for your video content. You are giving me 'light bulb' moments and validation. God bless 💐

Your calm demeanour is so soothing. This video was so helpful, thank you

I think that "right now" idea should be helpful for me to avoid flash backs and invasive thoughts. And looking at my strengths should make me feel better.

Jay Reid (family scapegoat recovery), Dr Ramani (understanding narcissism from a clinical psychologist), Professor Sam Vaknin (deep analytical dive into NPD, BPD, psychopathy, HPD, Sam is a diagnosed narcissist and psychopath), Tamara Hill excellent psychotherapist on many aspects of family trauma and dysfunction), all have KZfaq channels with multiple perspectives. Most importantly, our self care is everything in calming and healing years/decades of what should never have happened to you, and you didn’t deserve it, and you are so much going to love yourself, and be able to deal calmly and nonchalantly with these ‘difficult’ personalities/systems when you have learned from these experts, including Patrick Teahan, and stepped into your true adult self and your own power. Not theirs.

OMG. This is one of the best videos about healing from narcissistic abuse I have ever seen. It was informative, helpful and full of heart. I feel heard, validated and seen. Thank you Dr Magee! This is gold!

I would love it if you would discuss PAS and how it affects our children and even grandchildren. So little in this topic. My 3 adult children treat me as their father did. So hard. Thanks for considering.

Thank you. this has been very helpful. I am almost one year out of a 25 year toxic relationship. Unfortunately the ex is living next door. The ring tone on my phone is I will Survive. And I will!

I’ve just ejected my toxic family from my life. Fortunately, I’ve got zero guilt because I never had any relationship with any of them. Can’t miss what you never had

It is thoughts of the public and private faces of my ex partner that I still find most disturbing and difficult to come to terms with now that I have left the relationship. Videos like yours Darren help to validate my thoughts and experiences.Thank you so much to you and the people who comment.

You're way better than James Bond, Dr. Magee

Thank you Darren for your videos. They are a comfort, I am glad I discovered your channel through that of Jay Reid. I’ve been trying for many years to attain freedom from the ties that bind, having been “raised” by a narcissist and her enabler. It’s been a lonely path, but these videos give me the comforting message that I’m not alone.

" Why the HELL did they do that?" Why was it my own adult daughter who relentlessly holds the attitude that says - " You owe me forever after failing as a parent".

Darren...I just remembered this...I had to many years had no issues with the ex or my mom..I had moved on as it were..5hen out of the blue I had a flashback of my narc mom and I went into a violent rage...this memory at first was just sensed.. then later her image came with it..then the full-blown memories of her! It was like for years your mind suppressed it and had it hidden away. So it came as a total shocker and right outta the blue... and extremely strongly...its was like someone who has a triggered episode and that person having ptsd at the same time! Just like recently my kid saying he wants to hang with my ex and that he idolized him..and that the ex was visiting him as well. i freaked right out... told my kid. you hang with him...lose my number cos i just cant and wont go there at all! Been there,..done that ..and don't ever want that again!!! The horror I got from that trigger was just way too much for me to revisit or go there or handle...my ex left very deep long lasting scars that I repel anything ....even a hint in that kind of direction now from anyone! It's fight or flight with me now. Any of those triggers are just pure unadulerated repulsion to me!!! I even hate arguments and fighting like the plague now too... it scarred me that badly.. that deeply...there are things I just won't tolerate at all now..never again! I'm like a dog that has. Even severely beaten by it's own over a long period of time, neglected and starved to death...doggy new Rea patio when triggered... bite hard and go for the kill!!! there are no more second chances the second time around...lesson learned the first time... beware..mad dog nearby...🐕

I love the book The Count of Monte Cristo too. I thought it was a romance book so imagine my surprise when people call it a revenge story. Still one of my favorites.

"The worst thing a person could do to themself is hate someone else."

This is true.I am empath however my heart has been broken to many times.I take this advice with gratitude

I am so glad to have come across your videos. The way you explain everything just makes it sink in. The rumination drives me crazy. Questions like Why is my mom this way? Why does she treat me that way? …. I get it now. Thank you.

I left my covert narcissist ex GF in 2016. As you all know they put us through hell before we leave. I never spoke to her again. Lost count how many times she hoovered over the years. She still tries and she's been in another relationship for a few years. I'm over it all now but I still get triggered and angry sometimes. But I will never speak to her again. I'm also not the same person I was before I met the narcissist. Resigned myself to being single the rest of my life. Only 43 years old, but I'm never risking loving another woman again. They are just not worth it. MGTOW for life now.

At 18 I had a live in situation for three years, at 29 a marriage for six years, at 40 a marriage for 14 years. I've been alone ever since. The first one was the worst. What I've noticed helps the most is just getting new experiences and history behind me, which takes time, but "Time Heals." Things I used to do as a kid I now take a more in-depth interest in. I also systematically rid my home of triggers, like his handwriting on a box, etc.

Darren, in such a kind fashion, you just validated and summarized what I've gone through the last three years. Interestingly enough, it was more regarding addiction. I feel like addiction and narcissistic behavior are so parallel. Anyway, THANK YOU! I hope you truly know that your efforts are appreciated!

Thank you for your videos. They are really helping me process my complex feelings while lifting some of the weight I've been carrying inside.

Your episodes are well put together, keep on doing this.

This is a honest, compassionate, brilliant exposure of a difficult human experience. Thank you, dear colleague!

The pain of betrayal is like a bottomless pit. Thank you for providing clarity and a path to move forward ❤

Just found your vids Darren, and your giving more truth than my old therapist did! You're telling my story 100% here. Thank you!! Narcissism and LOADS of passive aggressiveness and what I call "backhanded compliments" from my family.

I like your point on "it's okay to be the villain. ". I definitely encourage you to make an entire video on this. This is something I really struggle with and I'm sure others do as well. It has kept me stuck for so long. Thankyou

i lost myself, my house, my job. it shattered me

Somewhat the information that it is unlikely that a narcissist will ever change, gave me a massive relief instantly. I am not going to waste my energy in efforts to change the way she behaves and hope for better, except where my 3 year old daughter is involved. When toddler comes to me in the morning and says that she is afraid of mum, I feel obliged to protect her. Sad. But, it is what it is. Thanks for confirmation of my own conclusions I came up during over 20 years of relationship , I just could not believe that it could be truth. Self doubt played a nasty joke making me paralyzed and unable to act wisely. Thank you.

"Grieving from the relationship we hope we would like to have "🙌I just realized I do not want to meet my mother due to her toxicity and narcissistic personality traits. It is better for my own sanity, but it makes me extremely sad that I can not meet her and have this good quality time together, talking, cook relax etc 😵‍💫 It makes me extremely sad this is not an option for me and that is part of the grieving process🥵

Thank you for addressing this Darren. Spot on. It is a continual grief process 💕😞💐it does feel like you are letting go of a version of yourself that was with them in the past. And grief of the one you hope would be in the now.

Thank you for this video. Makes me feel stronger and more prepared to move forward.

31:29 stop hoping they will change. Take care of you again. Because that is who you really must help

Your are a doctor. regardless. I have watched a great number of videos on narcissism, and I find that yours have the most depth and are most informative. I greatly appreciate it. Topics like reactive abuse, strawman fallacy, gas lighting, circular reasoning, manipulation, triangulation, coercion/control, and flying monkeys, take time to explain, and a short description from many of the videos out there, does not help much. You cover them extensively, and that is invaluable. Narcissism destroys environments, responsible for many wars, is a prerequisite for ethnic cleansings and can be for genocides. On personal levels, it is the biggest stress inducer out there, and as we know, when it comes to our health, stress is one of the biggest killers. Thanks Darren.

It's like you are reading my mind. Your videos make sense to me. Thank you.

Love your work on here, Darren. It's been so helpful over the last few years.

I got over the need for ‘closure’ and the need for the world to right itself towards me when I did not go full no contact and my ex narc waited patiently for 7 years before finding an opening through my adult children to finish the job of my total annihilation. He didn’t quite succeed as I am still breathing, but whatever was left of my life is now gone, including my child who does not belong to the ex narc, but who is now totally alienated from me and living with the ex narc. The things he did were so unbelievably evil, yet everyone always took his side. This is not statistically possible in a world with some ‘Normal’ people who can reason and see both sides of an issue. I had to face the fact that I didn’t know any such people either in my family or in the court system. Knowing about these parasitic creatures and how they operate is knowing that the only way for any peace is cutting them all off and never looking back. It is hard to want to start a new life. I want no part of the old one either-no people places or things from that time. It was all a nightmare that I want to forget entirely. I can go and do almost anything I want now, but don’t want to go anywhere or do anything. I already went everywhere and did everything I ever wanted to do and all that is gone. I’m not depressed, just stuck not knowing what to do or where to go as I don’t want to go anywhere or do anything. I got a puppy which is wonderful. This prohibits travel to places I don’t want to go to anyway. I want to move but can’t find a place I like in any area I would want to live in…I just don’t care anymore about anything except to figure out what to do now when I don’t want anything. If I didn’t have my puppy, I wouldn’t know if I was alive or not.

the grieving section @14:13 up to mourning the illusion @16:57.. very helpful. not alone, but normal stages with no particular order.. thanks, man.

Wonderful video..as always...I particularly love your advice of staying present and being the observer of your own thoughts/emotiins/limiting beliefs....this is such a wonderful excercise when practiced often...it makes your realise that you have been none of the thoughts/ emotions etc ...very stabilising and empowering 💪💕 . Love your videos thank you xxx

My perspective is similar to yours on prioritizing your time and energy on relationships with people who value mutual respect and trust. People who aren't invested in you aren't worth investing your time or energy. They often get into conflicts with people who they devalue, or can't control. But when they try and fail at making you explain yourself to them , you will free yourself of an endless cycle of defending yourself to a toxic person.

This what I told my mom "I feel stuck". this was before I realized my dad is narcissistic. the title hits the nail on the head. I'm grateful for your video, as it validates everything i felt and helps me to continue put myself first and stop looking for reasons why some ones actions are the way they are.

This is the first time I have listened to your Chanel I found you have been the most helpful in getting better having lived with a narcissistic daughter. The narcissistic daughter is not often spoken about. I feel this is an area that needs a little more attention. I am the mother of a narcissistic daughter who has destroyed and tortured me for years.

Im crying 😢 its not too late...i hope so

Our brain tries to resolve the puzzle we feel, like when it completes pics in psychology. Rumination?

this video has been the most helpful of them all.After I left my marriage, 14 years, I managed to find others just like him.And I think my relationship with my oldest sister is ground zero. The abuse she bestowed upon me was where I learned to be stuck and reminiscing over and over the hurt that I still do today. I have been comsumed with the over and over to where I can't focus on today. Thank you so much for giving suggestions that I can use, just to exist in relationships where there is no getting away from. Blessings from Atlanta Ga

Very helpful video, thank you. Speaking about giving them what they want, and I'm referring mainly to my parents, my brothers and sister came afterwards 😂, is never enough or the right thing! I was lucky enough to understand this in my teenage years, I was a kind of a rebellious child. The siblings, on the other hand, made more damage, I always protected them. A few years ago, I came across that saying, "The greatest punishment for someone is to give them what they want", Oscar Wilde if I am not mistaken, sad also that when God wants to punish someone is fulfilling him/her a wish. Is like watching out on what we wish for, it might become true 😂. Looking back, I see differently what I was doing. I find it so true and comfortable! I'll be the villain !❤ Thank you for your videos!

Thankyou so very much for your time, and either or both of your commitment to your field of work or helping others. For the first in a long time I’ve needed support after a devastating 18 months. I am seeing what I’ve realised as a good outcome. I have surrounded myself with narcissistic, likely recreating the relationships I grew up with with my parents. I have found myself abandoned and amidst very hard times. Your videos are bolstering me through this. Your comments resonate deeply, and you give hope. To me and to others who in difficult times don’t have the resources to seek advice and therapy to map the way out. Thankyou. You are making a difference.

Really appreciate your kindness. Thank you for posting these videos.

Im still grieving. That person manipulated me to waste my entire life savings on her. Took everything from me, my money, my life, my family and left me in the end when i was financially bankrupt. Always made me feel like im responsible if their life sucks or unable to secure a loan to fund their life. Promised me good future and that we would earn together and become rich. Even when she's gone, She's playing games by trying to suck every bit out of me by forcing me to give her more money.

The analogy to Shawshank Redemption was spot on. I had a Freudian Slip with my second husband's sister-in-law, "I don't want to get divorced again." She evidently wasted no time in calling and telling him, because within ten minutes he was on the phone wanting to "start over." But that was the last I heard of it. Instead, he apparently began a smear campaign, because he started showing up at home in the middle of the day, calling me at night while on his business trips, with nothing to say. So I just started not being there, and not answering the phone. I got no inquiries as to where I was. (Actually, I was at B&N reading self-help books). If I went to see my father, he would call on the house phone instead of my cell. People started acting very strangely to me. I just let it roll. I, on the other hand, began making my adjustments toward a new life. He never let me open the mail, even mine. So I didn't, but I began going through the bank and financial statements and receipts, a few months at a time and copied them, and carefully put them back. (In my own defense, I had a really good job and had been supporting my self and my boys, before I met him, but soon afterward, he decided we would relocate far away to a place where I could not find even close to the same level of job, and had to transport the kids to visit their father, as well as continue to spend several more years in court.) I never touched anything when he was on a trip, and I never took any money. Knowing that I would be without any means for awhile, over the next two years I bought what I was going to need, and put it away. Underwear, detergent, etc. He was a negligent narcissist, which I have just come to understand (Thank You Darren) so it wasn't difficult to just shut up and take my own course of action. (I just made certain that he would go down the stairs first, etc.) We were both doing our own versions of Shawshank Redemption. No, I don't feel any shame; the whole marriage was his carefully crafted ruse.

THE THEFT HENCE OF MY LIFE CHANCES AND RIGHTFUL OPPORTUNITIES AND CHOICES TO HAVE MADE.

Yes, Jay Reid is fantastic, such deep insights he has

I feel certain that I could heal more easily if I could get out of the same town everyone is in. The threat of running into them is always on my mind. I have no way though to leave right now.

I am in the "living in defiance stage". Thank you, I did not know there was a word for it.

Thank you. This is so helpful. This has been hard for me to talk about and explain. It’s like you’re inside of my mind and saying everything I need to hear. Feeling very heard and helped…

So much amazing information to unpack there, thank you so much Darren. Going to listen again, as I so often do.

Good advice 👍 - stop hoping they will change - stop explaining yourself - yes, do what is in your best interest - stop arguing in motive arguments - be the villan, but not their villan - have boundaries - don't be trapped in the moment, look to the future

Your words are helping me so much

Thank you Darren. You have helped me a lot and I appreciate your good, solid, well presented work. Thank you. Please know you are making a powerful and valuable difference in people’s lives. Thank you

It's the most unbelievable kind if pain..Lettinh go of a parent or deeply loved one is easier than letting go of him.This grief is on another level,another realm of darkness

Thanks Darren for your video, at the end you said let go, well after this it does get easier and it frees up space for good people to come into your life, takes time to trust again and sometimes you get caught out again but there is a planet of people and not all are bad.

34:00 Great point about not over-explaining yourself. There's an acronym from.a self-assertiveness book called DEER (never Defend, Explain, Excuse, or Rationalize). Or JADE (don't Justify, Argue, Defend, or Explain)

Darren- having also just stumbled upon your videos, I would like to join the mass of of your audience in thanking you. I had only recently read something that had a few descriptions of narcissism, but it was enough to catch my attention by its accuracy in describing the woman with whom I’ve been in a 10+ year relationship- 5 years of which have been very toxic and very difficult. Because of the first 5 perfect years I have been in a sort of conscious denial about my situation. I’ve kind of known for some time that it’s not going to get better, but having 5 years of a beautiful relationship before it turned toxic helped me slip into denial. Hearing you say that a person could be stuck because they are hoping that the person they fell in love with will come back when most likely they will not. Or maybe they never existed. Your words have helped me step away from that denial. There’s a feeling of abandonment and a slight disbelief that someone could put on such a good act for so long before showing their true colors. Never the less, I am ready to face forward and begin to move on. So thank you from the bottom of my heart

This is exactly what i needed to hear. It doesn't make sense. A 1st visit with a counselor. She said, "why didn't you speak up and ask? Truth is, i was afraid of confrontation- the absurdity of the situation made me believe the answer would not be valid. I know enough about them to know they lie, they cover things up to get their way. I kept quiet, adjusted, let it go. It was a temporary situation with a brother-wife, but it still feels odd. They sent a gift but i had just moved; brother got mad at me- for not knowing to give my address. Had no idea about a gift, it went back to his home. When i gave him my address, he kept the returned gift. He is my big brother. Childish? Punishment? I didn't keep my address from him- was busy moving by myself, live alone. It bothers me, we're grown.