Illini uses the needles to change his face it's just that he doesnt normal care about killing people

Aye, I've tried to reference that every time I talk about them. They simply cannot be held to the same standard as the othet characters.

Illimi can embue objects with nen with sho like any nen user like gon and killua did early on ​@@theoverthinker348

This whole channel started out entirely as a coping mechanism for my HxH withdrawal, so I'm very glad I can help others cope too 🙂

I also think knuckle condition isn't that negative given he only has to land a hit and not carry equipment

Yop, but it still feels... off.

Ooof, indeed. The sheer scale of DBZ/Super characters is simply far too big for the confines of HxH I think. I'm guessing the Kamehame would be Emission, the Multiform Technique would be Conjuration, the Kaioken would be Enhancement on steroids, etc. Fun to think about, but very difficult to retroactively fit, since the vast majority of DBZ/Super techniques would fall withing Emission or Enhancement.

@@theoverthinker348 yes indeed but it would have alot of overpowered nen abilities

Vegeta's nen vow is that the more he jobs the stronger he becomes, and his 2nd condition is that he has to eventually lose to continue gaining strength

😮

I get ya, but that's I meant when I said that Togashi's been broadening the scope of Nen abilities in recent chapters. The old rules really don't apply anymore. First and foremost, it was actually stated (in the manga only, I believe) that Tsubone morphs her body around conjured vehicle parts to facilitate them and since she's a Transmuter inherently, I'm imagining the actual morphing of the body is done via Transmutation. Conjuration entails the creating of physical object via Nen, but Heinright actually transforms inanimate objects into seemingly living creatures that retain their original functionality (e.g. Snake guns). This should be beyond the scope of Conjruation as it was original described. Lynch has an Emission-based ability wherein she punches someone and their "inner voice" answers her question. This, again, seems to go beyond the "Emission allows you to separate your aura from your body" initial descriptor. That one guy that can transfer damage via Emission also tells us that Emission now primarily allows for abilities that "teleport, transfer, absorb or separate aura, body or any clearly defined "tangible" concepts (e.g. "damage"). i don't remember that guy that can morph his hands, honestly, but Conjuration is adjacent to Transmutation, he could simply be tapping into it to accomplish this. Though why he wouldn't simply be creating the tools AROUND his hand is beyond me. While I for the most part welcome the gradual (and during the Voyage a bit of a steep and jarring) increase in scope of what the various categories are capable of, some of them definitely go beyond what I personally think to make sense and strain my suspension of disbelief (i.e. Heinrigh (as much as I adore the guy)). I recommend you check out the "8 Nonsensical Nen Abilities - Hunter x Hunter Analysis" vid if you already haven't. I cover both Tsubone and Heinrigh (as well as a bunch of others) there. Sorry for the essay, hopefully this made sense.

@@theoverthinker348 Late reply but you do raise a lot of good points, I still think it's more along the lines of Conjuration since Kurton was also described as a Conjuror and he has the same ability as Tsubone (chapter 361). I also can't find that statement regarding Tsubone in either Viz or the fan translation, the descriptions I found only mention her transforming her body into vehicles, and the Nen chart places her in-between Transmutation and Conjuration, but she is referred to as a Conjuror. As for the rest, I have nothing to dispute. Personally the way I rationalize it is by looking at all the rules we've learned about Nen as descriptive and not prescriptive, that they are just the characters' way of explaining the phenomena they witness in as general of a way as possible, rather than Nen having been brought to existence with a guideline that tells all. I think the whole "6 Categories of Nen" thing is more like a theory than a fact, and that there might be more hybrid categories or advanced versions as we see with Conjuration and Emission. Hell, Specialization is basically just one large dumping ground for everything that doesn't fit the other categories, but I think there are several specific categories within it. Aside from Specialization which produces a variety of effects, there are as a matter of fact only 5 other effects on Water Divination, but the actual categorization and descriptions of these effects are a human construct, they might not really cover what the effects really are, so instead of Emission, the category that changes the color of the water might be more along the lines of "Transferring" (which would cover basic emission, teleportation, abstract concepts and even absorption like Meruem and Tyson's GSB), and instead of Conjuration, the category that produces an object in the water could be "Actualizing" (which would cover actual conjuration as well as transfiguration and Nen Beasts). I see the earlier explanations of these categories as something akin to how in grade school, you learn a lot of simplified and sometimes even wrong science because it'd be too confusing to study the more complicated explanations. That being said I do wish Togashi would clear a lot of this up by using the current arc's Nen classes as an excuse.

Much appreciated!

Overthinking's the gimmick :-) I get ya, but if killua morphing his hand or creating illusory doubles of himself is not Nen, there's no reason Illumi's face-changing is. It could be some in-world esoteric skill that Illumi has simply invested the time to master. Rhe time-limit could simply be his limit to maintain a transformation without needles and while only using "muscle memory." It could've been retro-actively retoconned to be a proper Nen ability as well. While I adore the series, it's not without its inconsistencies (especially early on). Things regarding the Zoldycks are quite a bit messy and my goal is to try and rationalize everything in-world in a way I find sensical, so some disagreement on some stuff is both expected and welcome. Oh, and good point regarding Pokkle. That's either an inconsistency on Togashi's part (all constructs not created by Conjuration should be invisible to non-Nen users as a baseline), a condition of thr ability or perhaps the arrow is actually conjured. Any of these could work.

Have a thumbs down

Honestly, it was done almost a week ago, but I'm spacing out the release of the vids to give the channel a bit more consistency. I'm currently working on another HxH vid that's about 50% done and will be the longest non-podcast vid on the channel yet. Also, thanks :-)

Oh, it's possible that it indeed is, I just don't think it is. I probably should've lingered on that point a bit, but the vid was long as is. Essentially, I'm unsure as to whether smoke can be conjured. I was always under the impression that only solid-like object could be conjured and that things like heat (Feitan) and electricity (Killua) would need to be transmuted. Nowhere is this stated outright, but I don't believe there's been an instance of a Nen user conjuring a gas, plasma or liquid (please correct me if I'm wrong).

@theoverthinker348 I think it's hard to prove whether any transmuter or conjurer are transmuting or conjuring because of how close they are on the nen ring. With that said, I see no reason why smoke or liquid couldn't be conjured as they are physical things just in a different state of matter. Fire and electricity are not physical things, so i agree they probably have to be transmuted.

Thaaaaat's... a decent point. It's entirely a possible that that's how it works, but Manipulation was primarily intended for literallymanipulating objects (Gido), animals (Ponzu), humans (Shal, Illumi), or substances like blood or smoke (Zakuro and Morel), but was never outright established as allowing you to restructure and reform non-malleable material like skin, bone, etc. We coould potentially be talking about an advanced application of Manipulation, instead of Transmutation, but while Illumi's and Pouf's shape-changing abilities can be explained without Nen (in my mind), Tsubone's and Bisky's can't. And since Bisky's a pure Transmuter despite having a Conjuration-based hatsu and Tsubone is a Transmutation-midpointer, I'm leaning towards it being an advanced application of Transmutation after all.

@@theoverthinker348 Fam it never been said the object had to be malleable, actually there’s never been a statement that limits manipulation at all. There was someone who could transform guns into snakes and i’m pretty sure they’re a conjure. I think conjurers can create objects on there body or make there body into an object, as they can turn objects in to something else. So that solves tsubone. bisky wished that ability in to existence (for years) and it gives her absolutely no benefit, it nerfs her. So she could actually be using manipulation unconsciously because she wanted it so bad. To me wishing for years, na praying for years and the fact it makes her weaker is a sufficient trade off for the ability to work. To me the fact that she had to pray instead of just making the ability, proves it’s not a part of her category. Using manipulation to transform while being a transmitter, kind of fits the bill of something that would require that much dedication and yearning. Honestly I don’t see how transmutation can transform you from how the men typing is stated to work. To me its conjuration or manipulation.

@@theoverthinker348 I take it back seems like transportation can also change your body, because yupi can do it and he is also a transmuter so yeah you're probably right. I still don't see a reason why manipulation can't change your body though.

@@asura3229 Exactly, but I usually avoid referencing it since Chimera ants are so weird with regards to their abilities. As sin, apart from having Nen, they also have their own unique powers/special abilities a lot of the time thanks to them Chimera ant genetics. It very possibly could, I just think Transmutation is a better fit and I think there's more evidence for it than with Manipulation.