If you'd like to join the discord server, here is a link: discord.gg/aboeMCU. There are over 800 members so far. Love to have you be part of the conversation!

I could never be the winner of the contest because if he choose me as the winner, it wouldn't be random. I'm here for all time. Always.

Kang wasn't "killed by ants" he was carried away by them temporarily. The final fight, which resulted in him getting sucked into the multiversal engine core was between Kang, Scott, and Hope.

Let's be honest. The writers just contradicted each other because of bad communication. However I'm glad that there are people like you doing their best to make sense of all that. And it seems that at least Michael Waldron now tries to establish some consistency. As the writer of _Loki, Multiverse of Madness_ and _Secret Wars_ he should be more involved in projects like _What if...?_ to avoid any further confusion.

I’m not gonna lie, this idea you had was EXACTLY the way I understood the multiverse and timelines. The TVA wasn’t trying to stop the multiverse from existing but rather they were keeping their universe isolated from all the others. This lines up with the first Doctor Strange movie as well as the Ancient One references the multiverse way before Loki and Phase 4 did. I do got a couple questions like how does Peter B being from 616b and the comic universe as a whole work in this multiverse but at least the MCU got itself right.

This has got to be the most logical description of the Marvel Multiverse rules I’ve ever heard. Very confusing… but internally consistent which is very important.

The fact that the branches are labeled 616 makes sense because of What If. What If is placed after Loki on the timeline, meaning that variants of the 616 universe can now exist. That’s why every What If episode shows the MCU timeline as normal until a certain point. 838 is not one of them. That universe has WAAAY too many changes- no Steve Rogers, the F4 and X-Men exist already, Mordo is good, Ultron worked, Wanda had actual kids? That’s a universe, not a timeline. So the Quantum Realm and TemPads can only used for timelines, but unique things are needed to cross the universes (Chavez’s powers, the NWH spell, probably Kang’s tech) I think this also explains why as soon as the spell breaks- LITERALLY THOUSANDS of variants and universes are visible. It’s like the MCU made itself visible to all the universes in that moment. But that was undone. It is THAT that HWR was trying to prevent. Earth 616 has been hidden, but now it’s like it’s emitting a massive energy surge- one all the Kangs will see. Earth 616 wasn’t ever in danger of becoming a multiverse. The danger was the multiverse finding it. Which it’s about to.

I'm loving this season so far I love how fast paced it is and that every joke hits perfectly

As much as this does seem to track, I feel as though this wildly increases the scale of the multiversal war. If the TVA only holds domain over the 616 universe, then theoretically that means that without the TVA there are Kangs in timelines 616.1, 616.2, 616.3, and so on, AND Kangs in 838.1, 838.2, 838.3, and so on for most (if not every) conceivable universe. That's a lot of Kangs!

The way I reconcile all this is if timelines are indeed technically a universe, but universes that are stacked on top of each other. A universe like 838 or paint dimension is a wholly different universe but the branch timelines that Loki and co travel to are also different universes but we can use the term timeline to describe them because they’re all stacked alongside 616.

Very good video. It's very helpful that they put those distinctions so that we could see exactly how they define it. It's a pet peeve of mine when people say that "ants defeated Kang" in Quantumania. First of all, they were highly modified ants in the quantum realm, given prosthetic intelligence and an insane amount of time to evolve with it. I can't even tell how many of them there were, it had to have been hundreds, and they were all larger than man in the quantum realm. These weren't just ants. With that being said, they did not defeat Kang, they only slowed him down for a few minutes. That's a lot more impressive than people give Kang credit for. I feel like people just want quanta Mania to be a bad movie and find whatever reason they can to call it one. Actually, I think it's one of the better Marvel movies post Endgame.

I really like these vids breaking things down keep it up bro!

Love the video as always! You always have something different and new to offer! 😀

For me personally, timelines make a bit more sense for like What If storylines. But universes make more sense for other cases like No Way Home. But that's just my opinion

Loving your channel - Thank you

Thanks for this! Much clearer now. It's nice to know that you're updating your models and theories as more mcu information becomes available....you know, scientist-style! With hypothesis, and evidence, and what-have-you. I'm sure it can be frustrating and confusing and rewarding all at once. Thanks for all your hard work and effort! 😊

I have a theory that TVA prunded only those timelines that could create a new Kang. He Who Remains uses Miss Minutes (it's just a program) to decide which timelines to prune. I believe that there exist branches like those created by avengers or agents of shield because in those Kang doesn't exist and won't be born for some reason. Of course TVA is told that these branches were ment to happen but I think it's a He Who Remains' lie.

Yeah, they really made the time travel and multiverse stuff more complicated than it needed to be. Do you remember that scene from the first GotG movie where the Collector explained the infinity stones? I think we need a scene like that that fully explains all of this, and Loki season 2 would be the ideal place to put it (ideally they would have put it in season 1, but alas).

You’re doing an excellent job making sense of all thisb

Good Video!! And thanks for give the answer of the differences between Universes and Timelines!!

I think reality is an umbrella term for universes and timelines. Think about the meaning of the word, “Reality”. Reality is essentially a perceived existence so both universes and timelines consist of realities. Realities are what the people in those timelines and universes experience.

MCU somehow manage to explore the multiverse before going to explore different galaxy

I'm loving this channel :)

Thank you for the detailed and clear explanation! I understand better now! :D

With the existence of multiple timelines comprising 616 that can be as different as having many different lokis (even an aligator), a single universe seems to function as a kind of local multiverse. Each sharing the same big bang.

Looks like they are finally following the traditional way that timeline and alternate universe are two different things. Loki season 2 still has a bit more to go on if they can keep this consistent. Let's not forget that time loop/ouroboros is a factor in this too which the 12 Monkeys tv show comes to mind when I think of this.

This has made everything make so much more sense now regarding the multiverse, thank you

I enjoy your long stuff. Thanks.

I really like this model. This feels like the best explanation so far. It was kinda hinted back in Season 1 and in MoM, but here they gave us the 616.x clue that finally seems to solve it, so I'm really happy about that. The best metaphore that I can think of to describe this is electrical cables: if you cut a cable open, you'd see many intertwined copper filaments, but all together they still make "one cable" which is (in this case literally!) isolated from the external world, and you can have many different cables, but the filaments inside never interact with one another and can run parallel to each other just fine, unless you intentionally link them together. What seems to be the situation in the Marvel Multiverse, then, is that every universe is its own cable, with its own filaments (the branched timelines that come off of it), but for some reason none of them are isolated. It's like a bunch of exposed electrical wires all over the floor and electricity is running wild between all of them (the Multiversal War). Then, HWR took his own "cable" off the floor, put a big rubber band all around it and now it's an isolated cable that can run independently from all the others. But it's only a temporary fix, because on the outside all the other cables are still exposed, and electricity is still running. My dad's mind (an electrician) would blow up if he ever saw a situation like that lol! Now, to explain the Miss Minutes confusion that you mentioned at around 8:50, I think it kinda makes sense that she used the word "timeline" in place of "universe", because if this model is true, then each universe has to have one "master" timeline that then can branch off because of Nexus events. So in the context of the Multiversal War, I think it's kinda fair to say that multiple "timelines" battled each other for supremacy, and by "timeline" she's only referring to the main one that defines the universe. Or maybe it's just propaganda, as you said haha! In any case, I'd much rather they used the correct word "universe" there, but you can still explain it this way. My main question at this pont is about the numbering system. We saw that within the same universe, you can refer to the main timeline as, say, "Earth-616", and to its branches as "Earth-616.1", "Earth-616.2", etc. But how does a *universe* get its number? You'd think the people on the Sacred Timeline would refer to their own universe as number 1, and then maybe label the other universes as number 2, number 3, etc, as they discover them. But as far as we know everyone seems to agree that the Sacred Timeline is 616, including the people within Earth-616 itself and the people in Earth-838 that we met in Multiverse of Madness. In that movie there's even a line by Dr. Palmer that said something along the lines of "We're in universe 838 now and we labeled your universe 616", as if it's a matter of common knowledge. You know, everyone does that, why are you surprised? Lol! But does that mean that by pure coincidence they all came up with the same number? Or maybe they're all counting from the same starting point? Maybe there's a inherent "structure" within the Multiverse that allows everyone to count the universes in the same way? Or maybe they're somehow counting the universes in order of creation and our universe happened to be the 616th one to be created? Of course, out of universe, I understand that they had to make it consistent to avoid confusion in the audience, but in universe I truly have no idea of how this would work and would love an explanation by Marvel.

What "isolation" probably means is that HHR both pruned those timelines where Kang could exist and also by creating the Loom he kept all these branches from ever getting exposed/visible to other universes outside.

love your summory expecially with the diagram, it makes it so much more clear and easy to understand

Love u Best explaination video. The pace is perfert. The recaps are perfect. Everything is a perfect.

I always thought it was pretty obvious. The sacred timeline is millions of timelines woven together. Tva only pruned timeline that produced a Nathaniel. Hence why we had classic loki, Sylvie, kid loki etc that were all variants on the sacred timeline

my thoughts before watching the video: HHR isolated 616 1. by using that loom to ensure no branches in the ends of timeline 2. by making TVA prune any timelines branching from within the loop farther from the red line (which will probably make another kang?) So, it is possible to jump between the timelines of 616 like in AoS, Endgame But, its not possible to jump between Univeses using this traditional Quantum Realm Approach or TVA approach, (with the exception of Darkhold or America) This would only be possible if branches of two or more universes connect somehow which happenened: 1. in the end of Loki Season 1, 2. by travelling between universes (like Dr. Strange in MoM or by using that Forbidden Spell maybe) doing so causes what we call know as incursions as Reed Explains "boundary between the universes erode causing total anihilation of one or both" So, the battle between univeses , i.e. the multiveral wars occur not due to supremacy or ruling multiple Universes but to save their own universe from incursion (like Kang showed in his room in Quantummania thought that infographic) and destroying the other one like we say in 2015 Secret Wars comics. it all makes sense now...

I’m loving the in-depth analysis

Oh my God thank you so much this clears up so much misconception that I have had about what's going on in phase 4. You got a new follower

timeline? universe? world? dimension? reality? they are all used interchangeably in marvel and it’s super confusing lol

This has always confused me, im so happy we’ve finally gotten an answer

Just watched your video on council of kangs. You were spot on. The loom keeps the 616 nice and tidy and not touching any other universes. I would definitely put in on a go fund me for a miss minutes cartoon explanation lol Thank you and subbed

You're like the only person I trust to make sense of stuff like this lol

I feel like I have a much better grasp on the sacred timeline and the multiverse now. See I always thought the two black holes in s1ep6 was showing that there’s multiple universes in the sacred timeline, such as a universe where Asgardians were animals since we have alligator Loki. However after the branches were bombed in s2, it showed they’re all branches of the 616 universe. Which I can accept that the sacred timeline is just allowed branches of 616, but then why did they show the two black holes? I mean obviously the meta reason for all of these questions is just inconsistent writing behind the scenes of all these projects, but it really sucks trying to put it all together.

This season is going pretty well! Loki might just overtake WandaVision as my favourite MCU TV show 😳

wow you blow my mind and gave me something i needed thanks man

Great explanation!

Ok, if this is the case then: 1. Scott lang travelled to (and came back from) a different universe through quantum realm, assuming the kang stuck there was from a different universe (as you depicted in your diagram). you so can travel universes through quantum realm or if your friends with Chavez. 2. Branches going beyond the red line in TVA monitor are practically going into region/reach of other universes and hence getting exposed to their kangs. 3. Incursion could now mean both collision b/w two timelines of same universe and collision of timelines of different universe (Mega Incursion?! 🥶) 4. How the hell would a paint Kang or a Lego kang fight in a war with Human Kang, makes me wonder if the Kang council is made up of kangs from different universes or just kang from different timelines of 616. (remember Loki will show us Victor timely in some branch of 616 as potential threat at some point in S02) 5. We still don't know where the TVA is located? is there just one TVA for all universes. Is there one TVA in just our universe setup by our good KANG? TVA has its own timeline? How far back it goes?

I love the idea that if a universe is different enough i.e. the paint universe, there are different infinity stones, like a color stone or a texture stone.

Thanks for breaking this down! It's definitely confusing stuff. 👍👍

Wow!!! I’m gonna have to watch this video again

Well, that just threw my understanding of timelines and universes out the window! But I get it now, thanks to the way you illustrated it in this video. I guess we have to assume that whenever they refer to other universes, they actually mean other universes, like when Dr. Strange deals with them in No Way Home and Multiverse of Madness, and everything in What If. That would explain the Infinity Stones from other universes having different properties, as mentioned in the What If season finale. But it's interesting now to think that Loki has thus far only dealt with timeline branches within 616. Now I'm really curious to see if the Council of Kangs consists of a mixture of Kangs from multiple universes and multiple branches of each universe. And I wonder if there are multiple TVAs, each for its own universe. And of course, this goes back to the question of whether there's more than one Quantum Realm. Okay, that's it, my brain just stopped.

If the timeline passing the redline doesn’t signify it becoming a universe, then what does it signify? So I guess that the timelines in what if are those in which a nexus event isn’t pruned?

Amazing explanation and theories 🔥🔥🔥

Amazing video. I understood everything

My understanding is, when a branch is created in the timeline, it becomes a new timeline, then as it continues to exist, over time (no pun intended), it becomes so different from other branch timelines, that it has basically become a different universe all together, and this is the case with every single branch created.

So how did the other Kangs conquer their universes . I assume they would have the same problem with multiple timelines branching out from their universe

Amazing video with facts. This is right

You explained it perfectly !! Nailed it man, Everyone on youtube was talking about universe creating from timelienes and it was soo irritating to hear !! Thanks to you.. I hope people will see to it..

Hope Loki find different variant himselves to stop all Kang

It would have been less confusing then if it was called the Sacred Universe and not the sacred timeline. Also, I think Kangthe C, Vic timely and HWR are the same person. So I disagree on that.

I watched this 3 times already, this is the 4th and I just saw the reference about the contest! 😂 Going in for the 4th view, great analysis! 💪🏾

Cant wait for next episode

I'll be shocked if someone doesn't walk away with a quantum physics degree by the time this season is over 😂 Also, did you know that Endgame's final battle happened yesterday?

Stumbled upon this! Wow!! :D

this new season of loki rocks!

What If - killing, he who remains, is the catalyst for a new universe in the MCU.

They didnt try to keep our universe separate from multiverse, they kept only one timeline for our and other universes, which made sacred timeline, separate (isolated) from branched timelines, as they pruned all branches

I’m not the expert by any means but I think you have it now sir. This is the conclusion I came to as well after many hours of trying to make sense of it. Very intriguing topic. I hope Marvel keeps putting this kind of thought into the writing like Waldron did. Keep up the good work!

everyone needs to see this im tired of people thinking timelines and universes are interchangeable.

Yeah, I feel like this is pretty consistant with what we've learned (primarily thanks to your great research). I find the idea of other universes existing before the MCU started to branch really satisfying, since it means the other universes like Tobey's, Andrew's, Fox X-Men, 838, etc. existed before Loki. I also think your assessment about universes just creating timelines instead of creating new universes is true, it simply makes sense; and I think you found a really good way to explain the Watcher's confusing wording from What If...? Also, here after watching episode 3 and I assume you'll cover it on your episode 3 breakdown, but for me it's pretty interesting that they actually showed us branches being created in real time (by Renslayer and Miss Minutes giving Timely the TVA book). Even the text, which previously showed "Sacred Timeline", now showed "Branched Timeline" when Loki and Mobius came to it, and it also means that the main MCU Kang (Even if it wasn't He Who Remains) isn't actually from the 30th century, but instead from the 19th. Finally, related to the subject, I was in deep thought about the whole multiverse concept and how that applies to Marvel, and an idea sprung up: Let's say Marvel has a bunch of universes, they make up the Marvel Multiverse. But by definition, a multiverse is an infinite number of universes. So... would that mean that inside the Marvel Multiverse there can exist, let's say... the Star Wars Canon universe? I mean, it's a universe, so shouldn't it? But now let's think, Star Wars ALSO has their own multiverse, where we can put the Canon universe, the Legends universe, etc. inside of. Now let's add DC into the mix: As proven by The Flash and Crisis on Infinite Earths, there is a DC Multiverse, where a bunch of universes are inside of (The DCEU, Christopher Reeve's Superman universe, the Adam West Batman universe, etc.). So each of these multiverses seems to be contained by the limits of their own franchise. We obviously know why these fictional worlds can't collide because of real-life stuff, but let's ignore outside universe stuff and just focus on in-universe stuff. Would this mean that there's something above a multiverse? Something that includes all multiverses? An... OMNIVERSE?, which would be for multiverses what a multiverse is for universes? Maybe it means that characters for which a multiverse is considered a real person (Luke Skywalker in the Star Wars multiverse), for another multiverse is considered a fictional character (Luke Skywalker in the Marvel multiverse), which could be bits of a multiverse spilling over to another one. It's an interesting thought, and if there ever was a hypothetical scenario where a bunch of these franchises crossed over (even if it's just fan-made), that would put into question if such a thing exists. Imagine an incursion (Doctor Strange 2) or Worlds Colliding (The Flash) where instead of universes, it happens with whole multiverses. And maybe, instead of destroying one or both (like in those examples), they could instead, merge. Just a little hypothetical to think about. Also, I need to see paint Kang

4:54 people definitely shouldn’t have ignored this scene 😂

Abitofeverything you're a genius bro🧑‍🎓

I can't wait for tomorrow's episode of loki. 😊

You are a genius.

What a great video! One thing too is that when Quantumania Kang is showing the multiverse, I'm pretty sure what causes incursions is branch timelines getting too big and crashing into another universe, (seeing as they are stacked on top of each other).

4:34 - what this scene reminds me is the Lee Smolin's cosmological model, where, when a black hole is created, a Big Bang of a new universe happens inside of it, with new set of rules. And on and on it goes.

Another great video! MARVEL HIRE THIS GUY! 💯💯💯 Thank you for your explanations and breakdowns, it makes the most sense the way you’ve explained it.

This helped out a lot! Could you also build upon with dimensions?

This is the best Explanation i have found to date on this specific problem ive been wondering about LOL, now the only thing confusing me is "dimensions" in comparison to realities or universes (timelines)

I'm glad someone could break it all down and make sense of this. This is just about how I figured things worked out, but really, it's easy to get confused with all the different terminology that gets thrown about. So, we have the Forest, the Tree, and the Branches on the tree. America Chavez can jump between Trees. Supreme Strange can jump between Branches.

The journey to secret wars is going to be so cool starting this year. .

I think that another possibility is that branches from universes within the multiverse can become their own distinct universe but that 616/the-sacred-timeline branches cannot become their own distinct universes due to its isolation from the rest of the multiverse and the temporal loom. This would also make some of the watchers lines you mentioned make sense if ‘What If’ takes place after the theorised un-isolation of the-sacred-timeline as branches from 616 are now possible.

New sub thank you

Ive always been confused between to two since s1, hope this video helps out!

A branching timeline can reach into another universe once it gets past the threshold. That’s the purpose of pruning them. Once the timeline gets that far it now begins to reach another uncovers and that causes the incursion. Or at least one way of causing an incursion. You can also cause it by being in a universe you are not supposed to be in. Because now your are bringing a different temporal energy footprint into it. A footprint that belongs in a different universe.

I've always lamented that "The Sacred Timeline" is just but one of many universes and that the multiverse still existed, just He Who Remains cut off access to them by pruning the branches, rather than the branches, themselves, being the only things making up the multiverse. Especially since the Raimiverse and Webbverse are definitely not branches of The Sacred Timeline. I also have a theory that Earth-838 is the product of a Earth-616 branch crossing a FoX-Men Universe branch.

By what I think, this universes concept is that the Tva had their own universe and tried to isolate itself form other universes, but when timelines branched it is like a water droplet splitting into 2 which is another way to describe branching, and intentions, characteristics of other timelines becomes complicated which prompted the tva to prune all timeline to keep things simple or some of these timelines might have malicous usage,and these timelines splitted into different universes,which explains more why the tva is isolating themselves from other universes and prevent their own from splitting, thus which explains the universe multiverse,timeline question. Multiverse--Universe--timelines.

I think another thing that could've contribute to the confusion with What If, is that when you look at some promos for What If prior to the release of that week episode on places like Twitter, they have a shot of the TVA screens as branches grow before we get clips of that week episode.

i was never confused that much just waiting until they told the story

This quantum sh!t is blowing my mind . Just imagining the visuals and recalling the visuals we’ve already seen.

The "Good Guy" will always never trade 1 person for the whole universe in the MCU, so someone has got to make that change, and i am almost certain it'll be Loki

It means that Multiversal War is still happening because the multiverse is still there ,only our main universe[616] is hiding from all of the council of kangs

I think this is incredibly clever rationalisation, sadly I don't hold out much hope that this has been thought of on their side so get ready for a contradiction to this at some point soon xD Really cool video though, I'll certainly be thinking of this for as long as it works in universe :)

It definitely makes sense when you think about it, like He who remains probably originated from a branch of the MCU timeline and then once he isolated his timeline and managed the flow of time he decided to pick the branch where his variant is just a candle maker in the 18th century, allowing him to know that theres no chance of him becoming too powerful

I am now firmly a Paint Kang believer. Thank you.

Simply Put: Alternate timelines are just any and/or every decision that we haven't made. The TVA intervenes when we make decisions that we are not supposed to make. This rule probably applies to every sentient being in the multiverse.

Good video. Makes sense. Who do you think Imortus was referring to when he says "They're beginning to touch the multi-verse." ?

this video needs to be sent to the folks at marvel studios

My headcanon is that branches create more incursions and those incursions being what creates reality overlaps. By having Dox prune the redline branches in E2 it's preventing the incursions that would allow the alternate Kangs to come. I THINK.

And what’s ironic in your video Is I was just rewatching the episode this past weekend “what If..” . I wanted to gain more understanding of Cagilostro, O’Bengh, and Eye of Agiamoto. Did some research and It kinda blew me… even the Dr. Doom portion…

Marvel established years ago that as far as their Verse is concerned, timelines and universes are the same thing. Unline DC, in which timelines exist within universes and each universe has their own chronological scale.

Thats gotta be the best possible theory i ever heard. pretty sure mcu somehow managed to mess these all ip due to lack of communication and understanding among the writers of different shows and rewitings. its doesnt seem to be preplanned. But i really do hope that they come up with this plan by the end