Not all bad parenting produce narcissistic children. -:)

My parents rn: 🙀...😾 snowflake😡

I had a perfect upbringing by a wealthy, rational, non violent, and honest married couple, my biological Mum and Da. They were described as "the most narcissistic two people I have ever known" by a clinical psychologist friend of the family with over 50 years experience. My good upbring and their perfect treatment fucked me up perfectly

"Just"

Theoretically. It's no guarantee.

Kristi I agree my father used me as a pawn for his personal greed , desire , envy so I can relate .

@Bob Taylor I agree they can give empaths toxic traits too make them look like the narcissist .

My parents used me similarly. Though I think I turned out better than I should have. I was actually going to only relate my ex-girlfriend's/ex-abuser's story regarding her parents, but remembered my own as well. Hers used her as well, and I think they created a monster in her case.

@@Mike-xt2lh how? What exactly did your father do? How did he use you?

I agree about the label on narcissism. When people think of the word “narcissistic”, the first words they think of are probably “selfish”, “manipulative”, or “bad person”. In this case none of those words could have described Jim. He was simply a victim of his parents’ psychological abuse, but also a victim of his own thought process.

Yes. This is so reaffirming. I hate it when people say things like “you’re not a victim” .

I sorta agree with you as long as the person with narcissism doesn't hurt anyone then they are the victims but if they do abuse people then they deserve to rot in hell I don't care If you had a bad start in life because as soon as you hurt someone else then your automatically an abuser a lot of other people are abused but they don't go on to become abusers in the future

There are favorite Dr. Grande videos and then there are favorite Dr. Grande video comments. Top of the class!

@@whytho1534 Unfortunately not all of us have the ability or the means to break cycles. That’s not an excuse but it’s true. I understand as a person who’s been on the receiving end of narcissistic abuse from childhood into motherhood. Abuse really messes people up. I guess that’s why they call it abuse. Love, The struggling yet successful cycle breaker

This is criminal. Experienced similar incident first hand.

Ugh. My bfs mom is the devil. She has a "child called it" I like to say style of parenting. She takes care of 2,(real mother is druggy on the street), and the 1 is abused and ridiculed and has diagnosed aspbergers and was molested in previous homes. She tells him he's possessed, that he's very bad child, and she buys the other presents when the one is "bad". Only to punish him, that is it. Apparently the kids counselor has told her to not feed him when he's "bad" either. Which has led him to steal food from my vehicle at night, and that leads to more punishment. not to mention she's a cat hoarder. CPS has been there 3 times. They can't do shit. Its sick.

@@TryingNotToPanic Stories like these are why I think of social workers as saints. To know about this kind of abuse, see it happen, and not be able to really do anything about it the majority of the time. That would make me homicidal. But they somehow keep going just so they have the chance at saving some of these poor kids. It takes a truly special soul to do that job.

@@sahamal_savu my boyfriend gets so annoyed at me. Sometimes I just can rant for so long about it, but i guess its because we both know nothing WILL be done. I'm a HUGE animal lover. I even tried cleaning the filth, animal feces, old food. Etc, for her. Which led her to ban me from her home. It's very, very sad and anyone that sees that and legally aren't able to do anything, man...its very bad for my mental state. Let alone someone seeing it everyday.. i mourn for them because i feel like mourning the loss of those childrens lives.. it'll never be the same because, well, the world just isn't fair sometimes...

Katie, You got that right. How immature that step dad was. That was very mean for him to do. They are too mean to have offspring.

💯 Exactly! 👌🏼 I think in this case, the therapists' jobs were to put labels on the parents 🏷️ first, then concretely help Jim get a balanced life: Therapists should have focused on teaching Jim how toxic his family was.

Very well said. Agree.

A pet therapist might help both of you. Who knows?

I’m not even jk with this reply but there is a cat on youtube I believe names Chase if you want to check it out. It’s hilariously entertaining but also very interesting to watch supporting your point with your pet. He has an attachment disorder due to abandonment. I always adopt my pets asking specifically their abandonment story, what conditions they were found in, if they have siblings etc. It matters to me that I’m a good parent to my furbabies not just my real ones 😂 I wouldn’t doubt many abandoned pets display some serious behaviors from a narcissistic injury and/or abandonment. They have feelings and personalities for sure!

😆

You cat people....uuugghhh! We're talking about HUMANS here....PEOPLE. Take your cat stuff to an animal behavioral study channel or something; it is NOT appropriate here.

brilliant ..transference!

This studies reviews are so educational and above all interesting, I really like what Dr Grande does for us.

@Spring Lemon Thanks for understanding that!

Very true. I tend to think about people with, for example, NPD as just being trapped by their own dysfunctions (thoughts, feelings, behaviours, traumas). Still as much human as anyone else, and still wants the same things.

@@snuffcarl maybe you're right, but most of them don't even admit they have an issue, and think therapy is useless

@@snuffcarl The problem is the narcissist is still extremely damaging to people that they prey upon. My ex narc probably doesn't believe she's a narc yet she has all the hurtful behaviours and it's not OK what she does to people.

He kinda *is* "not a nice person" though.. I think understanding, not compassion, is what we need more of in terms of dealing with vulnerable narcissists -like myself.

Agreed, his style of presentation is very effective! We are lucky.

Humanimal ya

@Hansol's Friend At the time and where I was trained, a doctoral student had to take a course in the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory,which was then the diagnostic gold standard,fairly early on in the program. We were required to take it ourselves at the beg of the course, then write up a case history and study including interpretation of the inventory results on ourselves.....this was followed up in sessions with our supervising clinician. Only then did we administer and interpret findings on clients and we had to present our findings first to,our supervising clinician. WE had videotaping of sessions then later in the field audiotapes we turned in along with written case notes. Maybe other doctoral programs are designed differently. No one got through our program with anything serious undiagnosed...that is for certain. The MMPI has what is a uniquely designed subscale to root out deceptive answer patterns. Everyone has something they are dealing with...some incident in childhood or,some person they have encountered with whom they have had less than a totally positive experience at some point by the time they reach adulthood....this is just part of the human condition. We students were supposed to work out our issues such that they did not affect the therapy we give and a good clinical supervisor does just that. For psychologists who later have some difficulty, they are supposed to avail themselves of professional therapy. For example, I was unexpectedly widowed at age 31 a couple of years after I received my PhD. I had studied widowhood and had had a widowed client when I was in training but the scant literature there was til that time, was on older widows. My issues and choices were going to be different than an older woman's. After about three mos after my husband's death, I went to my supervising clinician and paid privately for several sessions as a private non student client. Essentially he helped me make some really excellent planning decisions about my personal and professional life. He saved me from floundering around among the too many options I had at the time ...re where to live, type of practice, how to move ahead, future dating and personal relationships. I made some really sound decisions for ME because I had numerous paths I could have followed at that time, personally and professionally...he helped me make good choices, not by making them for me, but pointing out some of the variables I had not thought of...I wish I knew where he was today bec I would like to thank him for the wonderful career and life I have had that he helped by guiding me through my decision making process . Sybil Francis, PhD academic and practicing psychologist, ret.

My dad is an alcoholic therapist

Mike - That is heartbreaking. It leaves you with a lot of dysfunctional baggage handed down to you and trauma work to do to recover. I hope you can find some healing. I hope you can separate from the dysfunction, however that looks for you, and that you find a more positive place of existence in your future.

I agree. I got sort of the same history, but I ended up blaming myself and being codependent in the end. Seeking others opinions and validations because nowhere did it felt safe. I even ended up being assaulted intimately because my dad was calling me abusive names to his drunk friends who did not miss his "green light" comment on my presumed sexual conduct when I was 12. Nobody should go through that. It breaks you at a young age but it continues on through adulthood where all of your relationships somehow loop around reproducing the same circumstances and hoping that it would go differently.

I both relate and agree with everything you two wrote. Thank you good luck god bless.

@@miguelhernandez4794 me too to you all. Thanks for sharing. Caroline, Scotland. ✌️❤️💪🙏

Agree! You guys are amazing, to survive that and to have such insight!

I’ve found more than one that suffered from some form of the health problems going on right now. Patients aren’t supposed to find out but medical people gossip- and not in a maleficent manner. Therapist get ill as anyone else.

I had fallen for a psychotherapist. It was hell. Beyond malignant. Later I realized my mom is a covert but no she's a psychopath. And my brothers too are cluster b. But it was my mom who was hard to recognize. She took me to a psychiatrist who said there's communication problem in the family. Then there was a lady psychotherapist. My mom took me saying she is a friend. I was in tears when I realized my mom and that lady therapist has tricked me. Layer I wrote to the previous psychiatrist. I think he communicated with that lady. N my mom became quiet. N I moved to different city. But last year I ended up with my mom brothers again. N I figured out my mom is a covert narc. N she is the one who has actually raised a cult. They brought one lady psychotherapist in the house. I stayed calm. During talk the lady ended up sharing that her husband used to call her crazy. And she said I m so good.So my mom n sis in law went to a leading psychiatrist who in turn told my mom that she is jealous of me. They didn't share this with my brothers. So I played the game. When they called me crazy., I said let's go to this psychiatrist but this psychiatrist instead of helping me she said if you have figured out your mom is a convert narc and you are not traumatized, you get psychometric test done I was so pissed off at her. So I wrote to the very first psychiatrist and the entire family went with me and he handled them. He said I m fine. He said you can't force someone to see a psychotherapist.

I’d say a surprisingly large proportion of therapists have a background of some dysfunction in their lives, hence the attraction to the profession. The annoying thing is, as illustrated by this case study, some simply aren’t on top of their own problems. At worse, some therapists ARE the kind of people that patients are trying to get help about. It is a disgraceful situation to have a therapist who, despite having got the qualification/s and the right to practise, simply doesn’t get them self completely sorted before attempting to help others. Therapists like that have no place in good practise and should not be given the responsibility of treating clients.

Victoria Finnseth Stenersen what’s so funny? Huh? Isn’t KZfaq part of his job? I just don’t get people like you smfh🤦🏼‍♀️

@@food2430 What is the problem? I tend to add a laugh if I feel happy about something. Without the laugh it might seem as if I was being sarcastic or something.

Thank you.

Sam is the bomb

Not right now though surely!?

@@HumanimalChannel Honestly, preparing a video, recording and editing does take a lot of time. But since he has studied the field a lot, I assume he doesn't need to do that much research.

It's awesome, but I hope he'll take some days off whenever he needs to (which I am sure he will). I know that if I had begun doing this I might have gotten a bit anxious had I not been able to do it the same time all the time.

@@The_Tortoise_and_the_Hare Yeah, that's when I had when I was making movies while going to school / writing my thesis. Just knowing that you have a deadline after your regular work is quite stressful.

@@BrainsApplied I'm sure it is work and takes time, however I wondered how g is other workload changed during the current strange times. Some people may be working more, for example over phone/zoom etc and some would have more time right now.

GOAT of psychopathology 😌🙌

As long as this job allows you to keep your red Swingline stapler, I'm good with it ;-)

Aww I almost didn’t post that for fear it would come off wrong, thanks so much for the heart! ❤️

I know what you mean , he seems to be in complete control at all times on these posts but he is the best out there !!

I agree...it’s weird and kind of fun to picture the doctor chilling out with friends, maybe busting a few moves on the dance floor! 🕺🏻👀

He has a great calming presence. I'd like to be a fly on the wall at Christmas, I see him getting all irate over Monopoly like the rest of us 🤣

Yup I've been with two narcissists and both of them were parasitic. The first was financially dependent on his grandparents. The next one was dependent on me

@@aurora8749 glad you’re out! It’s SO exhausting

Mike - It would be interesting to read about your father’s disorder. People my age have been taught many different things about Borderline Personality Disorders in men. The criteria changed so many times people gave up their studies due to frustrations. One was a priest I worked with. I was like “if he wasn’t patient enough forget it about me. “ I would appreciate it if it would hurt you to share more. If it does then just good luck from me.

@@qiuwbr091 bipolar is a different disorder than borderline tho. Borderline means you are suicidal, have sudden outbursts of anger and constantly experience inner turmoil (and the like) while bipolar means that you experience reoccurring phases of either depression or grandiosity and reckless behaviour.

miles ignotus -I think if you use the search engine there are a couple.

@@qiuwbr091 There are indeed many articles/videos on the Internet on this topic, but most of them aren't very well researched. And some of the research papers that actually go into the finer details, for example those by Kernberg, are actually not accessible to the public for free on the journal sites. There's so much confusion regarding how MNs differ from sociopaths and psychopaths. Even some therapists use those terms interchangeably. And that's not totally unreasonable either given how there are so many overlaps. On top of that, most articles seem to make a clear distinction between overt, covert & malignant narcissism as if they were three separate categories of narcissists. In reality however, a covert N could actually be more malignant than an overt one - the "covert" here simply refers to their hidden grandiosity, and a MN could very well have a covert expression of their pathological grandiosity. Point being, I'm looking for a thoroughly & scientifically researched video on MNs, which takes into account all the latest research on the topic (and there aren't many when it comes to MN), minus all the fluff & confusion. I'd have happily done the whole research by myself, if the journal articles could be accessed by me without having to pay an exorbitant amount just for a "48 hour access" to the pdf. Having said that, I'll still try Researchgate, and see how that pans out. Anyway, thank you for your kind suggestion.

miles ignotus sci-hub.tw will allow you free access to studies

I have nobody to help me. She's isolated me and alienated me from everyone I love and took all of our money and resources. So, I can't even get a lawyer or whatever. I'm sleeping in my car, without my family. Without this woman that I love so deeply, who's done nothing but hurt and destroy me. I hate myself for loving her.

Please don’t give up. Get help. New National unfortunately mental health crisis 988 like 911 but for mental health emergencies

Its a waste of time. Don't waste your Time. You will just be Used as 'supply'. I wasted 13 years. At this point, he will NEVER see his child again. He can continue mooching off his parents and feeling 'powerful' from playing with his mommy putting her on and off the toilet and bathing. That's what nursing homes are for, sick, disgusting NASTY 'people'. His 8 yr old child in tears for a father means nothing. Screw these 'sick' people.

Could it also be that his mother would make comments claiming she would die without his support and that hes afraid that he would be seen as responsible for it? If his mother is that vindictive and abusive to him already, would it be safe to guess she could guilt him into continuing to care for her by telling him "I will die if you don't " . I feel for Jim. In those family dynamics, dissent or individuation is forbidden and any attempt at it is met with punishment. I see alot of myself and some other people I've known in this vignette. Especially the school part. When you're neglected you don't really learn the skills necessary to function properly in the world. Growing up in a similar household, I was always anxious and afraid to directly ask for help as I would be yelled at or mocked for being weak. When I got to college I had it in my head that I wanted to be a lawyer despite not having a passion for law mainly to try to earn my family's love and approval. I really struggled with writing and while the school offered assistance , I was too afraid to seek it thinking I would get the same harsh treatment from the staff as I did my family. As a result, I took the same mindset behaviors Jim held, changing majors 3 times and almost flunking out. I feel really bad for Jim, he really is a victim of circumstance. It's disheartening to see how he was pretty much set up to fail in life due to his upbringing. I think as bad a wrap as narcs get they really don't understand that their behaviors are harmful or difficult due to not growing up with healthy models of interaction. Its basically abusing a kid in every way possible then sending them out into the world and expecting them to behave well adjusted. They seem like they're just trying their best with their limited understanding of how to get their needs and wants met in a healthy way. For all their poor behavior bad wrap, it's really sad for them.