maaaan, long time fan of both gw2 and your chanel, Vars! i hope to see soon a video about void or shurima champions, that would be sooo interesting! keep it up!

Yooo, GW2 sponsoring creators?? Love it!

Thats super cool that GW2 sponsored you! love that game and your channel.

Guild wars is awesome

Guild wars 2 is fun and has by far the best community. People are quick to help and answer your questions. Being mew is like being welcomed into a family. It's quite the experience.

Anivia E Old Cassio E

Idk if I'd count an aa enhancement as point and click, but yeah.

Who's GP

@@malachiswedberg8367 I'd consider auto empowers as point and click if they do something extra that isn't just damage like Darius w or Rene w

Cassio E

I can see why some were removed/reworked. Toggles are usually balanced by having higher mana/health/energy costs over time, discouraging the player from always having them toggled on. But then you factor in high mana/health pools, health/mana regen, or resource resets/restores and you get instances where singed can perma trail, mundo is always on fire, cho constantly flings spikes, or perma rocket jinx. Edit: Arguably, this is more a problem with itemization rather than the abilities themselves. Tear for a long while completely invalidated mana costs, and spirit visage would let you ignore your own self damage most times due to how much natural healing you'd get, or any extra sources of healing.

@@BoneWalker personally i loved my perma rockets jinx build back in the day when i first discovored murumana does wonders on her before everyone else kinda discovored it it was a one off build i had in aram and tried it in normals ( wouldnt dare try that shit in ranked0 and it was pretty fun

I miss old Aurelian Sol :,(

@@sspectre8217 Sol is Def the real tragedy here

I miss old sol

And because of lulu W master yi practically doesnt exist in higher elos due to lulu w not having reasonable counterplay. Fighting toxic bullshit with MORE toxic bullshit is not the way to balance the game

Yup, but Yi is what he is due to a point and click. A point and click I'd call one of the worst ones.

so... we cant remove pointandclick because you need them to stop a pointandclick champ?

@Guilherme Garcia imagine if yi could use q in the air without clicking anyone

@@mr.joesterr5359 Master Yi doesn't exist in higher elo because sportsmanship doesn't exist in higher elo. Master yi is every weak early game and the enemy jg will bully and invade u and take all your camps. Low elo people aren't confident enough to try that but high elos, u ain't gonna have any camps to farm. Master yo is only a menace because people are tunnel vision for kills, rather the having a proper team comp. A team with a decent about of cc can easily stop master yi from scaling.

Zilean with Shurelyi be like: "IM FAST AS F*CK BOI!"

and then theres pantheon's empowered w

@@jacklepie1133 panth: haha me ez stun and take half your healthbar

@@jacklepie1133 well its range isnt that huge and he needs to get 5 autos or 4 autos and a q and thats kind of the point they kept the original desing of pantheon with point and click stuns but updated it make sense

Most of the remaining point and click abilities are single target CC abilities or ultimate abilities. There are some exceptions like Kassadin's Q but with his Ult it's not like making it a skillshot would change any gameplay pattern.

@@Chankonabebot There are huge variations in the possibility of predicting. A Lux Q can be predicted and sidestepped smartly, a Yone's W after he Es is always predictable but impossible to dodge without ninja-like flashing reflexes.

Malphite Ult is pretty much point and click, even if you have flash unless you know its up and are waiting for it he travels fast enough where I'd say about 98% don't have the reflexes to flash in time. You have all of .00000001 secs to flash to successfully avoid it, if he's coming out of FOW its pretty much impossible to miss.

Cough lux e

@@Chankonabebot That's bad semantics. We are not talking about strict mechanical possibilities, but the rates between possible and impossible. That's like saying all damage can kill in some situations, so any damage is always fine, unless it's an execute.

@@shamrock3957 Not even reflexes, but ping as well. Even a few millisecond's delay makes the difference. So depending on where you play, some skillshots are indeed undodgeable from reaction, only prediction.

I agree in the sense that its a base system mechanic that's somewhat balanced, however, something like syndra ult is balanced around the fact that you kill her before she has all the balls, or autos are balanced because if their autos are doing that much damage they are probably squishy af. What's unbalanced and have no counterplay is things like malzahar ult at level 6. Sure you can get a qss later into the game, but likely at lvl 6 u don't have the gold you need to do so unless you got all 4 kills in a river fight 4v4. At lvl 6, malza just one shots u by pressing e,w,r and boom, you're dead (not even gonna mention gank setup.) So yes, in a sense, most point and click abilities have counterplay, but it depends on the situation. Malza ult is counterplayable, but only if u have qss or you have a teammate with you to stop the channel.

@@pharoahofvortex177 Look at it on the other side? Is it imbalanced? Malazhar kit is entirely based around landing W + E + R which all are moderate range in this game. It's all damage over time and you can stop the cancel with a teammate OR buy QSS. The ability ALSO self stuns himself for same duration meaning he can't repostion or cast items/other abiltiies or risk cancelling the ultimate. How is he getting to you? He moves slow af and has no CC to acutally get you to stand still. He needs to flash on you to ultimate in which he will also not have time to W + E before you dash or flash away. How does he use this in a teamfight? Can he just walk up to the ADC and ulti them? No, because he has to wade through a frontlink of tank and brusiers? If he decides to fight tank/brusiers they would dunk on them before he kills them with his relatively low damage outside of full ulti combo. What happens when you ulti the tank/bruiser? Well that's what exactly the enemy team wants when they pressure the frontline into you. If he has a team mate ganking you, then what's the difference? You're telling me you should survive the full kits of 2x level 6 heroes when you are in a bad position? Counterplay doesn't mean you get out of shit for free if they happen to "miss" it. If anything it would be a much better ability if you can just free aim it with longer range or if it was AOE. Like why is other characters with "counterplay" balanced then a mid range channel CC with a few downsides? Is yone dashing across lane and smashing your entire team with multiple knocks up and exploding them before snapping back into safety "balanced" because you can theoretically dodge an assassin initiate if you happen to have flash up at that time or get team wiped. I would think an ability with multiple levels of counterplay + careful management and postioning of when to use it is more "balanced" then the abominations of easy to use get out of jail free cards ultimates we have theses days.

@@pharoahofvortex177 lol you dont get one shot by malz at lvl 6

You guys clearly misunderstood "ability with counterplay" and "stat check abilities".

Yup. People always discount the one point and click every champion has.

ah yes, the adcs are most dificult thing to deal, its not like even a suport tank could kill them

and of course there is a lot, and i mean A LOT of ways to counters AA

wow, that was a really smart thing, i didnt think about it but hell, you're right man

@@bagabundo17 Sett isn't exactly an ADC now is he ?

@codephased akali was never picked in proplay this year

@@cherno8336 She was at least picked 4 Times by Vitality's Lider last Summer Split, so your "never" is in fact wrong.

@@cherno8336 he said "when they're meta"

@@1lik3Fir33mbl3m yes.... happy now?

In defense of irelia and yasuo: no minions. In defense of zed: predictability. In defense of fizz: no way out (which also applies to some of the others ones). Maybe is not the pick. Maybe it's you

Stack his passive AND deal damage to you before pressing R on you. Veigar ult scales with AP and the targets missing hp iirc. Unrelated note: it's hilarrious to have a Garen and a Veigar on the same team as every teamfight is just automatically a 5v3 so long as nobody got picked before the teamfight

Also aiming skill shots is only one skill

Yea but veigar is also short range and immobile so he gets jumped very easily

The issue with Veigar is his cage, such an overpowered ability considering its not an ultimate and the short cd. If you cant jump the cage like Zed or Katarina, Veigar is very rough to deal with, but if you can, Veigar is just an extra cannon minion.

Veigar is easily to counter and it's the same as nasus, bully them in the early game. His stun actually takes a second to cc u and really only catches u if u panicky. It only reliable in lower elos because of the psychological pressure it brings. And any champ with a dash counters it. Just bait it out of him and dash onto him one time.And if u are a mage watch your positioning. Veigar still needs to come in range of u to deal dmg once u don't get caught u can trade dmg still. Tho playing an mage with more range is better.

This is fair because I play alot of characters like that so ik exactly what you mean.

I was gonna day no then i forgot assassins were a thing, so, yes. When you can kill squishies in .9 seconds then yes ✋

“You fool!” Khazix ulting.

And hypermobility

unless rengar yells

Veigar has 3 abilities that can be dodged. why would you want his ult to be a skillshot

Malphite q is a really questionable ability so if needs a full rework. Veigar has only one point and click ability so it is just fine and pantheon w is mostly a point and click dash not really something to harmful for the game if its stun lasted long then yes but it doesn't I believe lulu's w should not be point FOR THE DURATION

@@ioannapavlou8271 lulu's polymorph needs a huge nerf,most annoying ability no matter what champ

@@ioannapavlou8271 I'd only accept a Malphite Q rework if it got an AoE component and basically worked like a larger version of Maokai Q. The non-interactivity of the Q is what lets it work in lane as a poke tool against ranged champions, so making up for its loss with more wave clear would give him a much stronger game plan against them and help with his ultimate burst combo against multiple targets. That all said, I do like how the power budget it currently has relegates it to only being good in lane or as follow up burst, as it's part of what keeps him in check to begin with.

Thats counted as point and click. She cant miss her ult if someone has her passive on them. She has a lot of AoE so shes gonna get at least 1-2 people

@@takahyuuga When they talk about the defaults of “point and click”, they say “It can’t be used without being able to click on the enemy”, which Lillia can perfectly do with her ultimate. Her ultimate proc the same way as Rell’s one does, except it requires to have the passive on someone. You just press the R and it pop off. If they didn’t count Rell’s R, so they should about Lillia’s

i can see why he put it there tho you can't use it unless a certain requirement is met (aka someone in range) for lillia, there's an additional requirement for her passive to be applied but she still cannot use it if no one is in range but yeah i do agree that it is a weird choice lol

@@takahyuuga you're not pointing, it's more just a click at that point. All her other abilities are skillshots, and her ult requires you to land them for it to work.

@@azurclerx951 but did you read what i said? Can she miss her ult if they have her passive on them?

Bigger point, what's the difference between PAC abilities and abilities with "counterplay" when you get hit with lux snare (or other CC) from the jungle. Anyone else's CC makes all abilities point and click.

The difference is the aoe will probably hit more people, as the point and click only hit one

@@grantsamson2384 That's a super interesting point of view!

@@grantsamson2384 thats why point and click CC is so problematic; it makes EVERYTHING point and click and is point and click itself. I can dodge a lux Q, knowing it's threat, i can flash it, get vision on her so i see it coming, zhonyas it, etc. it has counterplay. But if Malzahar ults me, i am CC'd and suddenly every skill shot on the enemy team becomes point and click.

@@Cheasle2 thats the point of malz existence with is ult

idk, I don't like any abilities or mechanics you can't interact with

I don't think hitboxes are that juncky. I mean ye, there are skins that make abilities smaller or bigger than their hitboxes but *every League champion* is 2d and their hitbox is at their feet (the circle on the ground), so if you can hit their legs, you hit them.

@@TheAzorg some hitboxes do feel janky as hell though. I've been in a number of games where a nautilus q would miss its target by at least a couple of feet but it'd somehow still end up connecting. That's just my experience however.

@@ceilingfan2007 Nautilus' Q has two hitboxes, thinner one for walls and wider one for champions so it's possible to hit a dude behind a wall if you line your hook correctly. It *feels* janky but *works* "as intended".

Can you explain what you mean by 'horizontal' and 'vertical' progression? I'm increasingly interested

@@dominicguye8058 Vertical progression in MMOs is when your character and the monsters continously get stronger. Think of this as each expansion increasing the level cap and introducing new gear that the player works towards to get stronger. Guild Wars 2 has horizontal progression where once you hit max level and get a max gearset, your character will stay at that relative strength forever. For example a Gw2 player who hasn't played in 5 years will still have a relevant character that can play in all the new content without having to grind back up again. Horizontal progression would mean instead of playing just to become numerically stronger, you play for sidegrades instead such as different builds and playstyles, or even cosmetics.

@@dominicguye8058 This is actually incorrect. There is a how to say..."perk system" in place that you're required to grind for. Content WILL be blocked off to you until you grind these out and they're only available to progress once you are at max level (80). Speaking plainly, there is next to no point getting into the MMO if expansion content interests you because it will be an extremely long time until you get there.

Lucian/Senna Q is interesting because they both allow for, essentially, trickshots. Since they're range is a bit beyond the target, they can use it to line up their attacks on unsuspecting targets and get some surprise damage off. Of course the caveat is that you need to have something to target to do this, so I think it's fine. It essentially makes the Q's a hybrid between a point and click ability and a skillshot.

@@tomlynmathewsjr7514 thats why they have ethernals called "trickshot" and "also trickshot"

Irelia needs point and click, but Akali honestly doesn’t need it. She used to not have point and click on her R1, but they changed it to point and click so that it couldn’t be used as another get-out-of-jail free card, which I guess is a valid reason.

I think point and click abilities can be more expressive of skill of both players when done correctly

honestly i think that Malza R is the most balanced point and click of them all, because he also cc himself making it really hard to use in teamfight if you are the only non feeding one in your team

Makes ignite into a skillshot

I'd agree, if we were talking about his previous E iteration, where he needed to mark a minion with burn with another ability to hit you with the AOE portion of his E. Nowadays if his E is up you cant walk near the wave or else you're gonna eat a chunk of damage from his E +passive burn with no prep required.

Anivias E is fine since it is kind different because in order to make it "impactful" , one need to land a skillshot first

Thats not true. Veigar Q used to be point and click same as Anivia's E and it became a skillshot that could be stopped by minions. He got much more play after this change.

@@TheKaratejesus They also made Veigar Q longer and able to hit 2 targets.

@@kamaniek-o-d-d2524 yeah. If they changed anivia's E it would gain extra effects too of course.

@@TheKaratejesus Veigar's Q was just... a point and click damage tool, that also helped him farm. Anivia's E is used a lot like caitlyn's headshot auto, or like Karma's ult. It's effectively an enhanced Q/R (but you can cast it after the Q or R in question) You can technically use it on it's own, but it has a pretty high mana cost for it's low damage. It's also comparable to Lux's auto attacks. (50 difference in range, both do extra damage after an ability, Lux does less damage but doesn't pay mana and can use them more frequently) When under pressure it's Anivia's only last hitting tool. Anivia has very slow auto's (both in wind-up and projectile speed) and very low mobility. She also has weak waveclear (not counting ultimate) and is easily pushed in to her tower. She also doesn't have veigar's zoning and his old stun, nor does she have any burst of damage outside of her Q-E combo, with her W mainly being a defensive tool, and her R both taking time to ramp up, and dealing it's damage over time, rather than a burst of damage. In conclusion, Anivia needs E in order to make up for the weaknesses in other parts of her kit.

They are all pretty fair tho

I mean her shield and ult are fair Its just her poly thats kind of annoying (but like i understand that it also has to be point and click)

@@Jynx9921 no they arent. Fuck that champ

Disagree: having it as a skill shot allows him to use it either as an escape, or a gap closer where you purposefully miss the front line to get to the back line

@@nightangelx1513 Warwick is about chasing. Since when was chasing about using your ult as an escape?

Well, we can at least enjoy 1800 range q :)

I think Yone and Akshan top the list there. Though Akshan in my mind is the most absurd champion simply due to the fact that his kit has literally everything except true damage, cc, and untargetability. Shield got it, MS boost, got it, resetting dash got it, crit got it, lifesteal, perma-invis, resurrection, execute, double auto, hybrid damage, 3 hit passive, reveals enemies with his q and grants vision along its path for a second, bonus gold on scoundrel kill, bonus mana regen whilst invis, on hit, he's got it all.

Yes counter-play my Lablanc Q-Q instant kills and Karthus R without having zhoyas hourglass.

Swiper is obviously op and has only one counter. Horrible balance.

YESYESYESYESYESYESYES I love you, you're a intelligent person.

Same with Skarner's ult. It's one of the few tools in the game that actually allows you to reliably control space around you and protect teammates. It doesn't matter how tanky a champion is if an assassin can just blink/dash onto my ADC and delete them within a second, completely bypassing whatever attempt I can possible make at saving them. The threat of an undodgable point-and-click lockdown that they can't mobility-cheese out of is what keeps them at bay and encourages the other team to actually have to deal with me first, either by killing me or forcing me to use my ult on something else.

I agree with this but the Lulu part is wrong. It's in big part because she can give up to over 5k gold worth of stats by just being Lulu.

but malz ult has a built in counterplay, you can interrupt him

Pay your malzahar taxes

@@MAMAJUGO How do i interrupt when suppressed?

Well league is a 5v5 game isn't it?

@@mr.joesterr5359 not playing 1v9

If we put auto attacks in the same category, what would be the counterplay to adcs?

@@lucaiozzo8273 Thornmail, when it was actually allowed to be good (Bramble Vest is good in lane). I do prefer DotA's version of it where the reflect is an active, Blade Mail. All it reflects is Damage intake, meaning you can still CC them in a pinch. And it's a lot of damage reflect. 80% return for 4.5s. You have to completely ignore that person while its up.

@@lucaiozzo8273 with current league of legends mechanics available to every champion, I can only think of exhaust, randuin and lmao thornmail But theoretically, there are many potential mechanics that could counter them, like disarms, blinds, evasion, damage reduction, attack speed reduction, projectile destruction, projectile redirection, projectile reflection, taunts, or if you're a madman, a debuff that turns their auto attacks into skillshots

Its already possible with a stealthed fiddle. If all 5 opponents walk within range and you q they're all feared

The thing is that most point and click CC that can last as long as Skillshot CC is on ultimates, for example Malzahar's, so i still think it's fair as there are many more op ultimates in the game that are not point and click for example Yone's or Samira's

@@mypersonalaccount4934 What makes Yi Q ridiculous is that he resets it so easily, it being point and click is fine

@@Jynx9921 yeah letting him reduce his q with autos while at the same time giving him an occasional double auto was not a good idea, especially with attack speed buffs and quick blades existing

+ 70% cd reset on takedown nice balance rito

Thats what we have Smite:Battleground of the gods for get the best of both world and smite actually has some "point and click" type abilites but instead of clicking you hover your ability target widget over them and then it locks on to them....and it works pretty well and isnt op at all...

yes AA are point and click but there is actual items and A LOT of abilities desing to counter AA. Its not the same thing

@@bagabundo17 and what about adding abilities/items to counter point and clicks?

It "only" slows you and you still can use your abilities.

@@1lik3Fir33mbl3m ? its a 5 second stun

@@speedracer_online "Nasus ages his target, slowing their movement speed by 35% and reducing it further to reach 47 / 59 / 71 / 83 / 95 % slow at the end of 5 seconds. The target's attack speed is also slowed by half the amount, initially slowed by 17.5% and increasing to 23.5 / 29.5 / 35.5 / 41.5 / 47.5 % over the duration." Its not a STUN.

@@1lik3Fir33mbl3m ight bro sorry. its not a stun

Yup. Not everything about this game is movement and aiming micro, as much as I like long range skillshots. ...Pls Rito, stop bullying artys.

I liked old league with less macro and more "win lane stomp game" Only season i made past low diamond was S3-4 cause of the exp you got from kills, now i win lane lose game anyway cause im a 95% mechanical player

@@ElPepo1337 Go play battlerite.

@@morosov4595 Yea, im not gonna quit a game i wasted 10 years on, so ill pass.

@@ElPepo1337 You do you. Just saying there is a game that does exactly what you wanted. I'm not gonna switch, because i played age of empires as a kid, and league kinda reminds me of that.

There are a lot of ways to make point and clicks more balanced and interesting. Your idea is one of them but as you said it only works on melee champs, ranged abilities and ranged abilities with different range than auto attacks require other solutions. For example, some need carefull positioning to be effective, like Vayne's Condem.

But thats a balancable trait. Just raise the cooldown. The problem is that Riot's designed the game so that ultimates in modern league are intended to be up in every objective fight, use them in every fighjt because if you die, itll be back up before you get back to lane anyway, etc. etc. Just look at Axiom Arc, Lux, etc.

and it also is cc area

I thought I was the only one honestly, really tells you how Riot is approaching the game lately alongside how many recent champions are either manaless or have non-existent mana costs.

You mean Severum’s Q? Severum’s basic attacks are modified in a weird way, I believe they’re not projectiles and they also have a non-cancelable windup or something like that, i don’t really know what that means though

@@Elektr0hazard As I said Severum isn't as Lilia but Gravitum defo is.

@@adrien4269 Yes it is. But you can make it instant too, if you press Gravitum’s Q before the basic attack actually lands it’ll root instantly on arrival, I think, I don’t remember too well if that’s how it works