I heard the design engineers specified a better chain but gm thought they could save coin by using old mongoose bmx chain

You hit the nail on the head there bud. I've been running my own shop for many years and have seen countless of these engines go the way of the dodo - always the same issue with excessive sludge build up and I might add that as a low friction motor, they are designed to accommodate more blow by than the average other engine (because low friction means less tension on the piston rings among other things). The extra blow by means the oil gets dirtier quicker and needs to be replaced more often than 15,000 km. I tell my customers that it needs to be done every 10,000 max with only full synthetic oil. And as you said the extra blow by causes extra carbon rich gases that need to be vented and often can't be effectively and therefore causes carbon deposit build-up.

I’m gonna do it right now, as a mechanical fitter that makes perfect sense. Bought mine from new, each 10,000 I drop oil and filter, and administer a good quality injection cleaner every service. It’s done 282 and still runs like the day I got it with the original timing chains😉 This is excellent advice!!!😉😉👍🇦🇺

The reason one bank is dirtier than the other is because there is a dirty side and fresh air side. It is there to keep fresh metered air flowing through the crankcase. Fresh, clean air comes in the left bank and then flows through the crankcase and out the right bank valve cover orifice to be burned in the intake manifold. I usually see the timing chain issues on more poorly maintained engines. The chains get hot and stretch and the tensioners get starved of oil from the low oil levels. Moral of the story, change your oil sooner than the oil life monitor says. We had some of the R/V body vehicles that were going 12,000 miles before the oil life monitor told them to change their oil! GM later had a recall to reprogram the ECM to lower the interval. But I still wouldn’t ever go over 5k miles per oil change.

really appreciate this,,i'm a mechanic and have replaced the thermostat in a few,,stupind place to put a t stat,,,,i just bought a commodore with the LE0 engine,,with 270000ks,,youve given me hope ,it started with a little chain / low oil pressure noise,,youve deffinently found the solution to the problem,,,terrific info,,thank you

Did an ignition coil change and I am glad I checked this at the same time. Plastic pipe from the pcv valve and Inlets on the plenum were completely blocked which I cleaned out carefully with a drill bit and a good dousing of brake clean. Thanks for the video, far out.

Excellent explanation for the newer V6's with timing chins or oil pressure problems, glad my older 3800 II is in excellent nick (Oil + Filter every 6 months).

This is the most comprehensive explanation pertaining to the issues these engines exhibit I've heard yet! I cleaned and cleared the buildup in my PCV for my 2010 Traverse about 3 months before I got the dreaded timing code. I now have it almost completely torn down and ready to explore. Better believe I'll be replacing the PCV with a wider breather setup!

Very interesting. Thanks for advice. Was told to avoid a ute with this engine. Also plan to do oil on more regular basis than recommended.

THANKS FOR KEEPING IT SIMPLE AND VERY CLEAR SIMPLE FIX!!

Nice one mate. Very informative about what is actually causing the failure of the timing chains on these engines.

Genius!! You are spot on and entirely correct...thank you!!!

Thank you! Thank you! Finally someone who knows what they are talking about

Yes, I noticed the same thing under the valve covers, same with the pcv vent being plugged ....

Good call with the changing oil at more like 5000 ks , my daughter bought a ve second hand and I'm doing my research ! Good forum man and the crank case vent is something I'll change out ! Thanks !

I have a 2010 SV6 ute from new, 470,000 klm on the clock 80% Driving in Sydney traffic, change full synthetic oil before 7,000 klm, every time, change oil filter every second time. Engine has never had a problem, just a water pump replaced at 380,000klm.

Although both banks on my 175k miles 08 CTS DI motor looked pretty clean during a recent valve cover gasket replacement, this is an interesting theory because I believe the P0008 DTC is the most common indicator of possible timing chain trouble here in the U.S. and that code references the right bank (passenger side in a rear drive car U.S. car). The difficulty I have with the theory is that all 4 cam phasers are exposed to the same environment and as a result I would expect a more random appearing related code setting. The appearance of the troubled side of the engine in this demo makes me curious about the role high engine oil temps could be playing in all of this as that's one of the significant benefits that full synthetic oil has along with its detergents. Perhaps two additional oil squirters spraying, one on each cam chain along with an engine oil cooler holding temps to 180-200 deg may be the ultimate solution as engine oil runs hotter than the coolant temps and is the reason that some cars use engine coolant to keep the engine oil temps in check. I've measured oil temps on a non DOHC V6 as high as 240 degrees during Summer low speed city driving and I know it gets hotter than that. A chain with a good bit of heat in it has a lot of stretching ability if it's already long and on the small side as the lower the metal density the lower the heat capacity and the greater the ability to expand and distort. I believe a good engine oil cooler will help this situation as well.

I agree that the Alloytec is bloody good engine! I have had one for well over 7 years and done over 330,000km on it. It has always been serviced regularly with Penrite HPR5 full synthetic oil and the filter changed every service. Every engine has it's faults but from my experience the issues are minor. The biggest problem I had with mine was the water pump leaking but that was an easy fix.

Also they are a engine that was originally designed for the Daewoo Captiva as a East West and slightly tilted back to help oil feed and drain back down the right side head as that is the side which sits next to the firewall. It's just Holden being cheap and not developing the engine to suit a North South layout. Thanks for the video I never noticed the difference in the heads.

Excellent job at explaining the truth (not just your theory). I am a ford guy here in the U.S. (Arizona), but I fix chevys most of the time. I always hated Cadillac. I am doing a top end job on a 2005 srx 3.6 and it has bent valves, broken sprockets/ phasers on the right side of the engine. What the crap? Good for me, I get to make money off of a bad design NOT FAIR FOR THE CONSUMER. thanks for the video and keep up the good work. God bless

I run diesel oil in mine 5/30 you would swear that the oil filter is brand new every time I changed it cleans the motor absolutely beautiful never had a problem

You do have a point, but. Take an ecotec timing chain and compare the two. ecotec chain is very short and fairly solid. Alloytec chains are very long and lighter weight construction; even GM themselves said they are light weight (this was to limit valve train mass). I have worked on too many 20 + year old holden V6 engines that have hone 20,000KM since last oil change and are even on oil filter bypass due to clogged filter and not seen t/chain issues. The longer the chain is the more solid and resistant to wear they need to be. Mitsubishi Astron II 2.6 L 4 cyl had terrible T/chain wear issues for the same reason; in fact I still identify an Astron II by the T/chain rattle before I even see the car.

thank you for this explanation. i just bought a VE 2011 3.0 lt ( 235,000 KM ) and will be taking your advice .

Very informative. I have a 2012 Chevy Malibu LTZ with the 3.6. And I'll be checking it soon. Thanks to your video.

Just took mine out this morning. It was completely blocked. Drilled bigger holes into the pcv valve and now the engine runs very cool and has WAY better throttle response

Just bought a VZ wagon that needed a timing chain. Got the timing kit, inlet gasket kit and timing cover gaskets kit online for under $500. Did the job myself on a weekend. Cleaned out the rocker covers and PCV lines while it was apart. She’s good for service again now. They’re a pretty well designed and packaged engine. Better gasketed and more modern engineering than the old mangers.

270,000km on mine and no problems. Serviced every 5,000km. Will check the PCV now. Thanks.

Fantastic video, I have a massive breather on mine and i have nothing but trouble free driving , and it is turbocharged

That's GOLD mate, my mums just done her vz injector fkup and rhe mechanics telling her $5000 for an engine replacement, calling it timing chain malfunction. Don't worry thats not gunna happen I'll be driving 1000km and do a it myself b4 that happens... but come on we need more of your attitude buddy and good call. Im gunna drill it out and put a moisture catch on maybe 4inch elbow joint or something.

Yes the main problem is the small holes in the PVC valve.

You know, I've been on here for years. Spent a lot of time in South Africa, been around a few Aussies. From my experience, there are more honest, fun Loving, truth seeking Australian people per capita than anywhere else in the world. What I've just written may seem a little bit extreme, but I'm from California I love the truth come what do you think the fires are blazing, there man-made and there are so many truth lovers on the pioneering Spirit California West coast it's not even funny. Thank you, your GREAT! John from Noblesville.

Thanks for the vid bro, just got myself a 2009 VE commodore and a lot of people said about the timing chain problem and this video just solved it!

Great video. I'm off to drill out the PCV and check the covers for sludge. My wagon gets an oil/filter change every 5000km (it's near 275,000km). And even though I spend a fortune on good oil and filters, it's still jet black at it's end (none burnt). Now I understand why. Next oil change, I'm giving the PCV an 'attitude adjustment' and checking the heads for sludge. Subscribed!

Some re-engineering would be interesting. For example, cut a hole in the top of the other cam cover and add a threaded tube fitting with a nut on either side and a couple of fiber washers. . Run a 25mm breather line over and connect it into to the other larger breather line on the other rocker cover. It'd be an interesting hack experiment to try to fix an engineering fail.

Sounds like nevvile bartos, your onto something but

Mate you're onto something here. Used to see this shit everyday (engine builder by trade) and was forever ragging on the old allytech down.

Hello thank you for brilliant information just pulled my engine apart and i was wondering the two different color in two banks you are a great mechanic good on you

G'day mate, love your accent & your attitude to poor engineering. (bye bye engine LMAO) it's about time we got a fairdinkum Ausie to give it straight and with a fix for the problem. Good onya pal.

Second Gary Jessup. Timing chain just went on mine. I haven't had a look but you have a good point.

Fantastic post, thank you for sharing the info, clear conscience and demonstrated

Could it be the vacuum on the right side of the motor not allowing the oil drain back proper ?the left side pulls fresh air in from breather allowing the vacuum from other side of motor pull it down into crank case on left side. The right side now has to overcome the vacuum etc pulling it up to drain back just a theory what you think

I'm older and don't drive my VZ much, so I thought the oil'd be OK. After 12 months, it was sludge. 6 month oil changes and the car runs perfect now. Redone breaks, suspension and lowered, radiator, tailshaft, with added catback exhaust, fat low profile tyres with 18 inch Holden mags, and (by the previous owner) a body kit that I've variously been told is Tom Walkinshaw and HSV original (but really, I don't know or care other than I like it), I'm also told it was chipped, and finally just painted matt black also helps. Sure, I put more money into my car than it's worth, but if it's the last car I'm ever going to own, then WGF? It's not an absolute dream to drive, but it's mine and it's better than the HZ and HR, HQ's, HJ and Austin 1800 before it. To drive, it's the best and last car I'll ever have. I like my VZ Alloytec, and the Ecoteckers with their chip on their shoulder can go flail themselves.

In the US we call these the "high feature" V6. We drill out the holes in the PCV. But I think I like you approach of just getting rid of it.

CLEAN THE PCV VALVE AND KEEP IT CLEAN...Thanks proflowfab for the talk and video on these engines (i just bought a VZ after owning a VT for 5 years) I'll be doing it SAP! If nothing else it's a wake up call to keep the PCV valve clean at least. Mitchs comment that the clean air is drawn in the side that ends up relatively clean side and the dirty side has the PCV valve which draws out the air circulated through the engine is a very good one I reckon. So if the PCV valve is blocked the sour air in the crank case can't get out and circulation of air is stopped. So I think proflowfab you've not got it right to remove the PCV valve because this draws out the air/gas inside the engine and I think helps keep the engine somewhat clean. The one you show looks like it was probably blocked for a long time maybe causing the issue of dirty bank 2. proflowfab you say you've done a lot engines, have you usually found the PCVs blocked? I doubt if this could cause the chain problems alone. Seems good servicing will help against poor GM materials and poor design. (I am a qualified mechanical engineer [mechanic]) but got out the trade after my apprenticeship to go off and play rock n roll for a living, did I say a living? Lucky I had a good wife who had a good day job! john b.

Hands Down The Best Description of this engine !! Keep up the great work mate!

Hi there, can you please do a follow up video on how you solved the problem. You have shown us the problem and now we need the solution

Awesome info mate, not a huge engine bucket of knowledge myself, looking to buy a second hand 2007 Holden Calais with an alloytec engine, this timer belt problem is worrying, going to have to ask the owner if he’s had anything done.

Mine has +200,000 miles and yes evap system is not the greatest. Still pushing 307 HP and torque around 300! Thanks for the video, the 3.6L high feature engines from 2008 Cadillac CTS are crazy good. 0-60 mph in 3.9 seconds faster than most caddy V's!

Every V type engine will have a cleaner side, and a dirtier side. It is caused by the clean air entering on the breather side, and heats up(and is mixed with blowby gasses) as its drawn through the crankcase to the PCV(vacuum) side. Regular oil changes, and PCV inspection/ cleaning will reduce this effect greatly. If you change the orifice size you will usually cause a driveability issue. Change your oil every 3,000 miles, not every 6-10,000 like recommended. Just my 2 pennies to think about.

Theres no ventilation here... Here no ventilation... ventilation? No.

Did the timing chains on a friends cadillac sts. you're spot on. It looked exactly like this. correlation and misfire codes came back after maybe 6 weeks of trouble free driving. Sits on the curb behind his new civic now.

Finally someone who’s sounds like they know what their talking about. Cheers mate ! Pulled my pcv out and it was completely blocked! Not game enough to pull the cover off. Big thumbs up for the info 👍

If you just kept it old school and change your oil every 3000 miles, you probably wouldn't end up with that issue. I have zero faith in the oil life monitoring systems. And this is coming from a 20-year GM technician

Lurv this guy. He convinced me with crystal-clear logic and demonstration. I got two Rodeo's. Tomorrow I "piss the damn PCV's off!' Onya dude. Mozzman

Thank you. Very much. Just bought a maxx. For Phillippines wife. And yes timing chain. Thank for the heads up. Please tell me what else should be done when doing a timing chain. Thank you for your time. Appreciate it. Take care. Thank for the upload

Thank you so much for your info . My ve did a timing chain last year and cost $3000 today it just went again

I do big long kays in my VE Omega. But, I change the oil out every 10 thousand, not the 15 thousand they lay out in the "service" guide. Full synthetic Pentrite. Taken a while to warm to the alloytec but it's done near on 170000kms and touch wood, has been a good motor. I'll be going back to an EcoTec though if it shits the tin.

Wow great info bud. seems like someone should make a kit for all vehicles that has this v6

great vid mate.straight to the point no bs.. after watching alot of theses vids saying the same thing, i pulled mine apart.. 2005 vz alloytec i brought when it had 50k on it. has 250k on it now. i change my oil every 3k with nulon semi synthetic 10w / 30. both side`s were very clean "golden in colour", great news for me. i did drill out the pcv vent to the biggest i could get it. the timing chain still looked new and is tight as f@#$. i have just started using nulon 5w / 30 full synthetic

I wonder how you could modify the pcv system and not have fuel trim issues. There are bulletins for an updated cam cover and pcv tube on the older ones btw

someone needs to come up with a double roller timing chain for these. double the chain like the oldschool v8 and 4.3l engines

Recently retired a VZ holden alloytec with 460,000km and it was still running sweet. Never even had the rocker covers off. The secret is NEVER miss a service and always use quality oil & filters.

Interesting, My 07 RA V6 Rodeos timing chain went at 89000ks, think I might open this valve up and see what difference it does make. My oil changes where done by the book as well, also using a good oil.

So I initially watched and liked this vid shortly after getting the dreaded P0008/P0017 codes in my '06 2.8L CTS (we call it a HFV6 in North America, no Holden here). Cleaned my 4 CPS and 2 VVT solenoids to no avail. I decided to pick up an excellent condition used 3.6L from a wrecker to swap it out. Took the valve covers off the new(er) one today and although the engine was immaculate compared to the one in this vid, I can confirm the left bank was far cleaner/brighter that the right bank. I'll be replumbing the PCV system and possibly adding some auxiliary oil filtration and a catch can. With that addressed, are there any decent aftermarket bolt ons for these engines?

there is a new redesigned valve cover gasket for that bank to address some of the oil use issues with that pcv setup ..

Great video sir well explained. I just had my timing chain done about two weeks ago and when the covers got taken off the driver side of the engine was so clean it looked as if it wasn't receiving any oil. On the other hand the passenger side was a different story but it wasn't bad at all it was pretty much clean. So my question is what can I replace the passenger side pcv with so it can breath better?

Where do you get the replacement part from and is there a video on how to change it. Im very interested.

i think my 08 cts-4 has already had the chain done as it looks like the bolts have been off once. only 72k miles on mine so lets hope proper maintenance goes a long ways

The breather isn't the issue. The issue is the breakdown of the oil. This engine requires oil changes at lower intervals, e.g. 5000 miles. That would cure all the problems.

hey neville, here no cash, cash no ok... robbo? No cash.....

Hey dude....thanks to your information now im not to scared of buying VY 2 with a quad cam engine. Thanks bud

Thanks for working that problem out. I reckon your right

Crank case ventilation in these engines is a problem yes, but its got nothing to do with wear on the chains . The stretch wear on the chains has more to do with inferior chains and guides and the fact that they are too small to do the job long term. In fact the biggest single reason for the stretch is the fact the engine is a V6 configuration and the four single camshafts with three sets of lobes will snatch back and forth three times each turn. Couple that with four cams all doing this snatching puts extreme conditions on the chains, guides and the tensioners . The shit that forms from the poor ventilation can block the check ball valves in the adjusters and stop the adjusters from locking up with hydraulic pressure and thus the adjusters and guides are pulsating with the camshafts snatching and is acting on the ratchet locks of the adjuster and eventually over time will flog the whole mechanism leading to codes coming up in the early stages followed by noisy operation and ultimately catastrophic engine failure in the form of bent valves, broken rockers and stretched or broken camshaft caps and bolts. Now if this engine with four camshafts was a V8 or V10 then this snatching tendency is massively reduced and in the extreme other end if the engine was an inline six single cam of old, then there is next to no bouncing as there is load coming on and off the cam at any given time and the only real load will be the total drag imposed bu the springs and friction. Hope everyone can see the correlation with what I am saying here. Ultimately the underlying fact here is -- the chains, guides and adjusters is too complex under done in sizing for the job required .

I believe you are on the right track with this issue, but oil brand has a lot to do with this as well. Back in the 1960's my father worked as an engineer with BP. This was before BP owned Castrol, BP's oils were very good back then made with Venusvalian light crude mostly. When I was in my teens 1970's I was into high revving high horsepower 6 cylinder Holden engines taking great pleasure knocking off many V8's with pickup and top speed. At the time of rebuilding my second engine I asked Dad what oil would give me the best engine life. His advice was this, any good quality 20/50 oil with a viscosity improver (summer temps sometimes hit 48C) but don't use Castrol. In his experience every engine he had ever worked on large or small that had consistently used Castrol ended up with hard shellac deposits in the engine, so I stayed away from Castrol. In 2001 I was working in a garage and a mature aged widow came in with a toyota corolla saying her oil light was staying on, her late husband had always looked after the car. We did the proper checks and determined the oil sender in the cam shaft oil supply was at fault, replaced it and all was good. One week later she was back with the same issue. The boss said take the sump off and check the pickup. With the sump off we could see the pickup was almost blocked and there was hard shellac deposits covering the strainer and every surface that did not spin. It took me more than 40 minutes with a wire bush to clean the strainer and another hour to clean the sump, later I filled the sump with $10 oil and a good engine flush and ran it for 30 minutes. Drained it changed the filter and refilled with $10 oil again and drove it for about 10km, drained it and changed the filter again and filled with Mobile oil we used in the workshop. When the lady returned I asked her did she know what oil her husband had been using? Her answer.... He only ever used Castrol!!! Hand on heart .. true story! I have always use the best oil I could afford, Mobile 1 if I can, sometimes I use additives, never exceed 10,000Km + filter oil changes and in the last 40 years have never had any engine that was dirty inside. Given proflowfab has sighted this issue with timing chains and some Alloytech's have 250000 + km's on the engines and on issues my guess is that is also an oil quality issue, but I will be checking out the vent hole on my recently purchased VE asap.

would you just stick a thin wire down the pcv regularly? or just drill the bugger out?

Thanks bloke.Simply put .Sensible analysis.

I'll agree with that it is a contributing factor but there are others that may contribute an even greater part- 1. Engines run too hot now days to burn off HC and that causes premature wear on the nylon/plastic guides. 2. The chain isn't finished smooth on the links so the sharp edges cut into the guides. 3. The chain is made of an inferior material and wears/stretches too fast. GM's problems usually don't lie with the engineers. It usually lies with the bean counters cutting cost and quality of the materials that are used in the design. Too bad, really, It's a strong running engine that could last a long time. Still can if rapid revving of the engine is avoided(bad on the guides and chain stretch) and synthetic oil(reduces wear on inferior parts) is used. Still plan on putting at least one chain in this engine during it's lifetime if you own one.

Why is it that GM updated the rocker cover gasket and blocked off even more of the PCV port?

Great video...just subscribed to your channel. Question. Wouldn't taking the valve out cause oil to leak out and all over the block during normal operation? Is there a way to drill that POS existing valve out and replace with one of a much wider diameter? I own a VF 3L V6 wagon with 55k on the odometer and I have been religious about changing the oil with the most expensive synthetic I can buy. One of the reasons I went with the Holden was that unlike Mitsubishi and many others, it does not use a rubber belt (pain in the backside to maintain) but a robust chain. Maybe I thought wrong! Eek!

Great Video ! - Love the info and, especially , the way it;s delivered :-) Thanks !

Aye think you're royt, mate! Cheers from New York!

Do not vent to atmosphere, that it will only make it worse and break and take the engines design back to the 1940's, mod the PCV orifice as per what is found onLFX engines and newer. Also the rocker cover gasket design was changed where it has an infill panel on the seal over the rear section, the version shown here is the old gasket. There is in fact a link from the cam area to the PCV via a slot in the plastic of the cam cover to act as a built in Oil/Air seperator.

Thank you for good video . Doing a chain job on one I just bought.

G’day. thanks for posting this video. I've heard all sorts of rumours about chains on these engines. What year Alloytec was this one if you can remember? I heard GM changed the chains in 2006 onwards to a narrower 7.7mm pitch chain from a 9.525mm chain in an attempt to make the engine quieter. I’ve heard that this problem effects the 2006 onwards with the narrower 7.7mm chain mostly. I have a 2005 VZ with 90k on it with so far no timing chain issues, fingers crossed. I’ve kept the oil changes very frequent. have you done any timing chains on any 2005 Alloytecs or heard of this happening on any 2005 Alloytec or mainly the later ones?

Can I show my mechanic this video and have the problem solved?

I've got an 06 rodeo 400k no history of timing chains being done I'm scared to take the rockers off. Although I do service it every 2500 km

Here in the US, the 3.9L Ford has similar issue, I'm rebuilding one now. Timing guide broke due to heat and under lubrication causing the timing chain to fall off the exhaust cam sproket and snap.

Thanks for that. How often do you reckon the PCV should be cleaned if nit getting rid of it.

This really reminds me of the 4.6L northstar, great engine murdered by an engineering flaw...a fixable one at that....but neither should have their flaw....

Can someone explain a fix. I understand what his saying but can you get a bigger PCV , remove it completely. Will drilling it out fix the problem. Not mechanically minded so i need some help. Thanks in advance.

There could be an issue with the intake manifold design, and the hose that attaches to the PCV valve

if you piss off the return to the plenum will it alter the air fuel mix, drill out the PCV worked well, it stop using water, no condensation in the oil filler cap also. I did add a catch can.

Deleting the PCV System as you have suggested will make the oil gunking worse as the engine vacuum will not suck up vapours and moisture, you got it wrong too, MAF metered Air enters the Passenger side cover (the cleaner side you show)down through the engine and then exits the 1.5mm port up to the the two plenum vac ports while at idle / moderate throttle, only time any vapour will "vent" from the Passenger side larger port will be wide open throttle conditions which is like 1% of the time. Also Australia wide modifying a engines emissions to vent to atmosphere is illegal and will fuck with the metered air from the MAF sensor and will be technically a strange vacuum leak, a plumbed in oil catch can or cyclonic separator like on my LY7 on the vac side/pcv side is legal as it maintains vacuum, a vacuum sealed clean side separator on the passenger side could also be used.

the fixed the colouring by using diesel oil and drilling out the rocker cover breather on the right side.

If you enlarge the pcb hole will that interfere with the MAC sensor?

I have a stock as a rock VZ V6 190kw 2004, When I bought it second hand for 3k (200,000kms) I had not done any research into this engine and just got it relying on Commodores reliability and I also loved the look of the VZs. I have since googled and You Tubed it and now wonder when mine is going to go boom. I have also noticed that there are hardly any VZ's 190kw on the road. Since owning mine I have seen 2, and that was for sale on Gumtree.

The oil filter on this engine is too small in capacity in my opinion. Change half way through your oil change intervals to keep gunk from forming. 6000k max full synthetic + 3000k oil filter change outs. Because the oil filter is on top it's easy and non messy.

Doing Line lockers on a standard alloytec isnt really good for the timing chain of any engine, let alone alloy tec. I dont give mine too much load, 50% maybe under overtake. Dont thrash the things, then break them, then call them bad. lol. Min is just coming up to 350,000 km (live deep in country) I service it every 50,000 lol and I have zero timing chain issues. I get a lot of blow by though turning up in my plenum and intake tubing. But again, I really go easy on her, and always warm her up till the auto choke lifts off. (approx 60C) and I take it real easy till shes full up to operating temps. Alloytecs are great. the bad thing is the lack of mods. Esp the type of mods that increase longevity and increase "Thrashability"

I just picked up an 06' STS4 AWD with the LY7 in it and I'm happy has good torque and power but I'll be doing oil change tmrw now :P

Spot on. The front bank on my 3.0 looks super clean , say 45k miles or so, no to very little browning on the camshaft, or head surface. The rear is crusty , varnished over....what's more the new style valve cover gasket is supposed to restrict even further the ventilation of the back bank to curtail some oil consumption. I would rather add a quart of oil or so between changes than loose the entire motor from lack of oil pressure. Yikes! Mine is a 183miler with cam timing issues and an external head gasket coolant weep from the back bank near the intake valley.