The problem with #6 is is the lack of sharing your decision because you don’t trust anyone or is it because they don’t want to listen?

⁠​⁠@@watsons4233 In my case I had no experience to comment on to share. Literally had to say I genuinely had nothing to contribute to group conversation/gossip because I already didn’t talk much either. If I have nothing to say I have nothing to say and my “friends” always had issue with that but looking back I wasnt in the ideal understanding of that. So yeah if you choose or can share more you would otherwise what are you going to share? Something that isn’t really necessary to comment on. Like hey my mom is blah blah blah. ( especially when I am not personally and purposefully active in my individual life)

@@watsons4233 so basically in my case it’s not that they won’t listen or that I didn’t trust anyone. I definitely unconsciously knew that if it was right to share it would be right.

@@trea492 I don’t understand. Is you not sharing because you had ‘no experience’ or ‘it wasn’t right’?

@@watsons4233 maybe the feeling they don't want to listen is also the CEN? I know when I try to share people usually talk over me or interupt. I think a lot of that is in how you present yourself. You don't have confidence or respect in yourself and it shows, so other people take that cue.

Exactly. I am a very good listener. I am genuinely interested. I attract self centered, self focused people. I am a helpful and compassionate person. Well, you know the story.

Wow like looking in a mirror, both comments! I’ve gotten off many a phone call or parted ways from a get together only to say to myself “I guess I don’t matter and only exist as a complaint receptacle to them”. I’ve cut them off one by one and am now completely without friends. On the flip side, I don’t feel I measure up to the healthy, kind people I so wish to have friendships with- and always feel like they are “just being nice” to silly me by hanging out. Ugh it’s exhausting and frustrating and depressing.

@@jane_7193 I never really thought of it that way, that the self centered people who like talking about themselves would use our gift of listening, to just dump and run with no reciprocity. But its the lack of reciprocity that shows they don't care. It is kind of hurtful if one is honest. At least it helps you get the weeds out of your life.

I am genuinely interested as well, but it's not mutual, is it? That perplexes me. I wonder if you could get more assertive (read about TA or assertiveness)? It may make it easier to balance the relationships. @@jane_7193

I have the same experiences and i am totally on my own as well, which is a horrible feeling, as I am so needy - which makes people reject me. All therapy seems to be about self-help, so i don't know why therapists exist or how they earn any money.@@kamaliancirranoush1916

Sometimes good to send out a "Test Ping" before divulging anything significantly sensitive and confidential.

I'm sorry you are going through this. I tried energy healing too on you tube vids I wish you the very best

❤

@@Elaine-uc4un Thank you. I appreciate your reply.

BEST wishes to you too! May you find help .. and healing soon … peace & blessings

So sorry to hear you're going through this, and you're not alone! I struggle with friendships because of "over sharing" and betrayals in the past, and an inability to trust myself because of my numerous "triggers" from CPTSD. Thank goodness for caring therapists like Jonice that shine a light in the darkness! Wishing you all the best on your healing journey 🤗❤

Jesus can be your friend,your savior and Lord!He is there for you!i pray that He touch your heart and that you have an encouter with Him🙏❤️

I know right. Love this.

Try conservation volunteering you never get people like that there plus it is very rewarding.

I don't think your alone. I think there are many people in the same position. Today's western society is hostile and rampant with damaged people. There is selfishness all around us. I read somewhere that people with CEN are more likely to become friends with narcissists. I don't have an answer, but, I know that your not unloveable. It's the circumstances of your life that make you feel that way. It must be horrendous being married to someone that has that effect on you. Day in day out, making you feel crap about yourself. I hope you can find a way to find self love, and self worth. A narcissist rarely changes apparently.

Wow, this comment resonates so deeply with me. In my own experience with people I have come to realize that I feel very much the same as you. It seems like everyone has traded the comfort and convenience of technology for the pleasure of actual human to human connection

Sadly, technology has not been good for deep connections. While I am very discouraged, I am not going to invalidate my need for deep connections. I recognize that I am hardwired for connections and relationships. I am a human being and not a machine. Let's keep honouring our souls. Thanks for your reply.@@alessandrobarnara4853

I am with you on texting. It’s ok for a quick communication, but is mostly a utilitarian concept. I get so overwhelmed trying to convey things in texts when people are trying to “catch up” with me. If they really wanted to “catch up” with me why wont they talk to me on the phone?? Texting is exhausting and does not foster real connections, but now that everyone is withdrawn into technology they use the “awkward on the phone” excuse to never actually speak. I’ve lost a friend that way, she won’t talk, and I can’t keep up with texting.

I understand your struggle. Texting is exhausting with little return. I find it sad that people think this is the only way they feel comfortable connecting with people. I have lost 2 'friends' due to their preference for texting over real contact. I refuse to dismiss my real need for human contact and connection. I will not deny my humanity. I have learned to become comfortable setting a boundary around texting. Keep believing in your worth. You deserve real connections. 😀❤@@kamaliancirranoush1916

All I do is text now a days, maybe talk on the phone on a rare occasion if it is someone I know. I stopped answering the phone after covid and hardly ever call people anymore. I even put on my business cards "text only."

I think that really needs to change, but for now, I only know of a few men's groups, not sure what the theme is officially. But some kind of support group, I suppose. In the mental health charities e.g. (UK) MIND, there is a 'club' kind of thing where any gender can participate online and give and receive emotional support. There are also 'live' support groups for any gender, in some mental health charities. The problem I find is not feeling 'caring', just 'interest' and some positive words, as a policy. But you feel ashamed to be distressed in a raw way; and so you have to put on a more practical and constructive veneer and just talk about problems with neighbours, job, dustbins, health, apprehension about a date, legal problems with custody etc - not the real emotions underlying them.

I am careful to not be friends with authority figures such as teachers, professors, bosses, and landlords.

I grew up in a large church - but because my dad was the custodian, we knew - and were known by - almost everyone in the church. The National Headquarters for our denomination, as well as the flagship university and seminary are located in the same city, so many of the professors attended our church. We knew them on a first name basis, and a large number of them had known my parents since before I was born. They were involved- in varying degrees - in my life from birth onward. I am a musician, and decided to mature in Music Education … so it was only logical for me to attend that school (back then it was a fully accredited liberal arts college). That was my first experience of understanding that it was not really “normal” to be friends with someone in authority over me. I never had any super-negative experiences while I was in school; however, looking back, I wish a few of them had been more straightforward with me. My husband and I might have avoided some major problems in the early years of our marriage, had someone felt comfortable enough to sit down and talk some sense into us!!! This relationship was bizarre from the moment I saw her from the first time - and I had no idea who she was. Very early on, it was apparent that i was SUPPOSED TO BE THERE FOR HER. Our paths have crossed several times in life, prior to us meeting that night, and we both described that first meeting as “a feeling similar to coming home” after years of being away. She repeatedly told me she’d never in 50 years of business been friends with an employee before, with the exception of one woman, who was also another one of her employees, a woman i had started getting to know fairly well. There were two incidents that serviced to push my boss and me into a very close working relationship - her father’s death, and then death of this coworker/friend. The second death was extremely unexpected, and it resulted in me having to cover lots of hours for her until she found a replacement. It was because of that second situation that we discovered I had actually met a relative of hers several years earlier… and we’d passed each other twice daily for almost an entire year as a result of her being her relative’s “chauffeur” (for lack of a better term). She has described me as another member of her family… she didn’t even consider me to be an “employee” in the strictest sense of the word. We were FAMILY. This friendship was just simply meant to be. However, our mutual “friend”, i believe, got her nose out of joint because she felt I was replacing her. That was not it. She had removed herself from the situation long before I was hired. She was visiting my boss one day when i came in on a day off, and we were introduced. She seemed nice enough, and a few days later I saw her in another business, where i spoke, and she looked at me butv didn’t respond. I told my boss about it, and we both decided to reach out to the other woman. I was only trying to be nice… She’d recently lost her husband and was struggling. When we asked about why she didn’t answer he, she claimed she never heard me. Anything is possible… All i know is that this situation was strange from the very beginning. I certainly hope and pray it is fixable. My boss is a very good woman…i have NEVER worked for better employers than she and her husband. I am currently on indefinite medical leave, and would love to get well so i can go back to work. My illness has placed a huge strain on not only my family but her ls as well, because she ended up having to take my hours until she could hire someone else… and then ended up having to hire THREE MORE people to do just the work I was doing 😳 It’s tough all the way around, but I don’t regret for a moment being so close with her. I needed her friendship- and she needed mine.

me too. But you are told it's self-help or nothing. I did find a 'home help' to come and visit weekly but i felt over time that it became more about her and less about me and i felt lonely and stressed with her. I was not assertive enough to ask her to clean things in the house, so they kept getting worse. You could try and find a befriender or support worker.

Ooh one thing. The core beliefs are the key, I think. We form negative beliefs as a coping mechanism for the circumstances we grow up in. They then hamper us as adults. If you could find out what yours are, you could try and eliminate them. Sounds so easy, doesn't it? the Lefkoe Institute has several websites and they include a list of core beliefs that they claim you can eliminate with them.

I’m 65 yo and have come to the dreadful realization that ALL the important people in my life (including my 100 yo mother, my husband of 30 years and my “bff” of 64 years) were part of the old paradigm of about a 20/80 relationship, with me getting the 20. As people showed themselves unwilling to work toward 50/50, I slowly began cutting them off-everyone except my daughter. It has a been a very lonely road for the past three years but I’m getting on track and SLOWLY starting to form respectful relationships. I realize that while, within myself I respected myself (for the most part), I never really expected others to due to my upbringing. My mother recently passed so I was thankful I didn’t have to cut her off before her death, but I was really struggling with our lifelong pattern of her getting 80-90% of our relationship throughout my life. Now that the source of my CN is gone, I feel more and more free of those old patterns. The suggestions given in the video make me VERY uncomfortable but I am doing them. We actually do need people, no matter what we may tell ourselves. I hope you can find healing for yourself.

Hmmm i think you are right, in what you say about the whiners. I have realised that that is how people see me, as I do talk about the same problems. When i ring the Samaritans, I have to be careful not to repeat myself because they accuse me of gong round in circles and terminate the call.

As a client and a full time working parent with limited free time to invest in my personal growth and recovery, videos, especially Dr Jonice's recent CEN videos, and audio books are for me an invaluable tool in between therapy sessions, empowering me to learn and gain insights into my past experience and current behaviours, facilitating faster progress to be made following therapy sessions.

@@jasfra I understand some people find video or audio more suitable to their needs and schedules. OTOH, other people - like me - prefer "good old" reading instead. 🙂 I didn't mean to say videos are useless, of course. The best way of communication would be offering both a video and a transcript - although that's not always feasible.

@@valterpsicofelicita9631same. I read much quicker than it takes for a video to play. I often read the transcript, ut there is no grammar. Alternatively I speed up the video so I can take in the non verbal info as well. Cheers.

@@Purple_Zebra316 Exactly. When I read I can browse the text at my leisure, concentrating on difficult points or skipping what I already know. OTOH, with video the viewer is "held captive" for the whole duration. Speeding up the video is an option, but it's harder for non-mother tongue people like me. Again, this is simply a feedback, not a criticism. 🙂