Save 75% on Stellaris and up to 50% on DLC at Humble Bundle and support this channel: www.humblebundle.com/store/stellaris?partner=montuplays Sale Ends 31. July

Imperator Protegit F TEIR: 1:24 Versatility 3:13 Adaptability 5:40 Statecraft C TEIR: 9:19 Domination 11:20 Harmony & Synchronicity 15:58 Expansion 19:20 Like Button 19:30 Politics B TEIR: 22:29 Mercantile 25:32 Diplomacy 28:38 Unyielding 32:36 Discovery 36:20 Subterfuge A TEIR: 40:47 Aptitude 44:07 *Synthetic 46:38 *Genetic S TEIR: 48:35 Prosperity 50:48 Supremacy 53:19 *Cybernetic 56:35 *Psionic

Tier lists never get old.

I'd argue the -10% influence cost to build starbases from expansion, if picked early on, is actually quite potent when it is a first or second tradition pick. The reduced influence cost means that you are more likely to grab particularly important systems, such as good habitables and chokepoints, before any opponents which can have a cascading effect on the rest of the game.

I really think that espionage should be the mechanic that should help you break up large alliances and cause chaos in the late game. Far too often I've tried to conquer the galaxy only to find out that I'd have to fight the entire other half of the galaxy to gain complete control.

The -10% influence cost... really is important early on, where influence is pretty much your limiting factor for expansion. It's absolutely a noticeable difference in terms of much real estate you can grab before the AI does.

I am quite fond of the politics tradition, but then again I do enjoy controlling the galactic senate and becoming custodian.

Expansion is First or Never. The extra pop & Growth as stated are GREAT (if taken early), they can help you snowball faster, but I think you glossed over the Influence cost reduction on starbases, which lets you expand faster to gain key systems and secure chokepoints. It is a VERY important part of the tree, and if you're going for a wide / early expansion style, it's a must-have. You don't take Expansion b/c it's got great high end abilities, you take it so that you can expand & snowball faster in the early game.

Adaptability becomes pretty good with Void Dwellers because of the Orbital Prospecting and building slot - you can get an insane number of research habitats from no deposit planets with that!

I don't pick expansion very often, but when I do it's almost always for the 10% reduced starbase influence cost first and foremost (which you just sort of handwaved as pointless), then the extra pops/growth speed. If I'm not super constrained by my neighbors, being able to expand 10% faster (as influence is difficult to increase very much, so influence/starbase is the biggest limiter of expansion speed, far more than any economic factors) can be very useful in a huge galaxy.

Leader focused builds stack +% leader experience gain. That +300 experience every single time you launch an agenda actually SCALES with that leader xp bonus, so every time you launch, your leaders can get like 1200-1500 xp. It's actually very strong for leader focused builds, especially if you are a unity build that can churn out agendas.

30:00 One addendum I think you forgot about is that the Starbase cost reduction also applies to Orbital Rings and its buildings and modules. That includes the influence cost, which I think is just an oversight.

I think Statecraft is actually being underrated here, it has a niche. Because of how strong some agendas are, the agenda speed and duration perks are actually pretty good, moreso than it felt like you gave them credit for. Plus, you yourself talked about how strong leaders are with galactic paragons, and the +300 exp on agenda activation when combined with a bunch of leader exp bonuses can catapult your leaders up in levels quite quickly, and the completion bonuses are actually pretty good as completion bonuses go. It definitely plays second fiddle to aptitude when it comes to leader traditions, but that's also just because aptitude is really damn strong. I actually found a lot of success taking many of the lower tier traditions to stack empire size reduction perks on a fanatic pacifist inward perfection empire and then further offsetting it with large numbers of high level governors bringing down the empire size even farther, which would not have been as effective without statecraft's exp from agendas. Hell, I didn't even know at the time that you could activate agendas early with unity, and that would have accelerated the process even faster.

Edict fund bonuses become insignificant at higher empire sizes. It should be coupled with a % decrease for edicts, whichever gives the biggest bonus at the moment

Hi Montu! I’ve played Stellaris off and on for years but fired it back up again recently and really enjoy what the game has developed into. I’m commenting because I made it to the “secret callout” point, and wanted to let you know that I’ve really enjoyed working my way through your library of videos. Videos like this are really informative, and your multiplayer series are entertaining to watch and pretty funny at times! Keep doing what you’re doing and good luck!

Hey Montu, if you read this, just wanted to say thanks for doing this consistently quality content. Full and comprehensive explanations, comparisons between various options, guide videos etc. Just good stuff. Feels like shooting the breeze with a buddy about the game and I always finish your videos wanting to go try out a new build haha.

Thanks! Im sure having to update these lists on such a regular basis gets old, but i want you to know we appreciate them. I absolutely love this game but dont have the time to properly keep up with all the changes made to the game so having these lists that I can listen to while working is a massive help. Keep up the work montu

Thank you for this Montu it is an enormous help. I was around for the secret call-out and actually wound up watching the entire video. I often listened to your videos while I am at work here let me simultaneously inform myself while simultaneously helping me focus on my job. Thank you so much for your guidance

Thank you can't wait to watch the new version. I just started playing stellaris again (haven't played since shortly after Mega Corp). I'm having a blast again and the videos are just a great support tool.

12:50 - don't you get the additional leader lifespan AND the reduction of negative traits if you are not a necrophage? You made it sound like you get either one OR the other. But since you get both, it is way nicer, no? In general: A new tier list - I love it :D

I've been waiting for an updated traditions tier list! Thanks so much!

Harmony/sync should definitely have some sort of percentage based edict cost reduction. I actually really like having leaders with edict cost reduction and they put this to shame.

Amazing tier breakdown. Thanks for making it as long and detailed as possible. Watching from start to finish!

Made it to the secret call out for this GARGANTUAN video. Loved it. I was surprised that I actually agreed with most of your rankings. The biggest surprise for me with the latest updates was that I no longer take discovery and expansion as first and second picks anymore, if I ever pick them at all. The combat advantages from subterfuge has made it a 4th or 5th pick almost regularly. Pretty surprising since I've never played with it aside from testing when it was new. I really hope some traditions get a rework and/or slight buffs to make them more viable. I think every tradition should be at least B tier in theory.

Thank you for all your hard work putting these things together. I don;t get to play very often, and it is nice to be able to find good information on the updates. I made it to the call-out.

Just starting to play, and appreciate the ranking lists. There are a lot of beginner guides out there, but not much covers mid to late game, and this is nice for insight into what is coming.

Awake, listening and happy that you provide such amazing coverage!

You should invest in a D tier, to give adaptability the respect of not being put in the same tier as statecraft

I love your tier lists! I watch them all the way through. They are so helpful! Thanks!

This has been a very useful video to watch, thank you for taking the time to make it

was just looking to get back into Stellaris. Splendid timing, Montu!!

It'd be great to also kinda know when to pick them, I know you said it for some but just some example empires with the paths you'd plan to go if that makes sense, although that'd have made the video even more massive. Still a really great list! As always :3

I love your Tier lists and come back all the time! ♥

These videos are always great. Thanks for them they help a lot.

I'm glad they finally put merchant guilds in the glame.

Glad to see you posting again Montu! Missed ya

LET'S GOOOOOOO!! I recently discovered your channel because I recently got into Stellaris, and BOY did i get into it. Not even 2 weeks and I got almost all of the DLCs lol. Started checking out your channel and saw some videos, really liked your tierlists because it gave me an idea of the state of the game and how to play with certain things even if they are not the best. Unfortunately some of them were kinda outdated so I had to take things with a grain of salt (not your fault of course, just the game being updated and balanced regularly). Traditions are one of the most interesting things in this game, so I'm glad you could make a video it for this patch, even if they change again in the near future LMAO Glad to see your content, keep it up!

I agree about the espionage operations. I've been saying you should be able to assassinate leaders for a while now. AND NOW, with Paradox's Leader rework, it seems like a huge opportunity to play sneaky and do some stabbing from the shadows! Hope they address it! Good video, Thanks

Tier list always helpful! Praise Montu!🎉🎉🎉

Thank you so much for this Montu

For an isolationist empire of any sort, expansion is quite good as an early pick. The empire size reduction keeps you under the size cap longer, meaning you tech faster for longer. Getting planets early is the most important thing and that tree directly helps it. I honestly couldn't find myself picking anything else.

Love the video! I was surprised by one thing, though: while I know you arent rating the agendas specifically in this, I was shocked you didnt touch on how absurdly powerful synthetic yield is. Unlocking that agenda early as machine puts your pop assembly through the roof.

I enjoy every single minute of tier lists!!!!

I’m actually quite fond of the statecraft tradition for a gimmick build I’ve come across. Using the statecraft agenda and it’s finished for +3 councillor skill, as well as the +2 from oligarchy and +1 from vaults of knowledge brings your maximum councillor level up to 16. If you go merchant guilds and max out the director of trade you can squeeze out 11.4 trade value from all of your clerks, merchants give 12 trade. (All this is before thrifty and the other bonuses you can get for trade). Still would be nice if statecraft got a buff though

I'm always glad to see these. You're honestly my favorite Stellaris-tuber.

thank you so much for making this content

Great breakdown!

Honestly. You're the reason I got into the game. Though to your dismay i do full farmer builds. Keep the great content my man. We all owe you

I always was a Hoi player, but when i tried stellaris i was so blown away. I'm still new to the game, but even from the starters i could tell that the naval projection is the way to go. When you do all 5 focuses, game allows you to pick additional one, with juicy +80 naval capacity and other bonus

I always open with Expansion and the influence cost modifier. It's so good for rapidly gobbling up all the systems in the early game and ensuring I get all the chokepoints that I want. I pick influence cost before I get extra pop and growth speed.

I am so sorry for how soon this will be outdated.

The +5 diplomatic acceptance also applies to vassalization and achieving war goals, so it has military use as well

A new tierlist from montu and its an hour long. Basically christmas.

Statecraft has become one of my top picks so I'm surprise to see it so low. There are some benefits which I think he is overlooking. 1) +10% Council Agenda speed means you get agendas more quickly. If you go the unity route and wait until the agenda is about 1/2 the way through the unity cost of rushing the agenda drops a lot so the sooner you get to this point the sooner you can activate it. 2) +20% Agenda Length is nice as late game I often have 3+ active agendas going at one time since it's easier to get them overlapping. 3) +1 Council Skill is nice because the +1 Skill bonuses can go over the level 10 cap. Thus you have have a level 10 leader running as effectively a level 11, with bonuses from other sources you can get a total of like +5 for a max leader with effective 15 level though the single +1 from this is only so so. Lastly because leaders are really powerful when used correctly the thing that makes this Tradition one of my top picks is... 4) +300 XP when you complete an Agenda. It doesn't sound like a lot until you realize how XP works on leaders. XP Bonuses apply from ALL sources so if you have enough bonuses for like +100% XP this becomes a +600 XP gain. I often get closer to 200% in leader XP Bonuses so I earn 900 XP per agenda I complete. Plus I'm rushing agendas every 5+ years mid/late game so it becomes easy to power level my leaders. I originally overlooked Statecraft as well until I found out about that XP gain stacking with my Leader XP gain bonuses. There is only one agenda by default that gives you XP to your leaders and it like all other agendas have a 10 year cooldown once it's no longer active. That means you got about 20+ years between it's uses, sure it does have 2000 XP times your modifier but it's not much considering how rarely you get to use it. My new Meta since leaders were add has been to get as many scientist in the Council for research bonuses and the faster I level them up the higher their bonuses become. Late game I often got like +250-280% bonus to research fields. The other leaders are Govs which I focus more on planetary economic bonuses as I've taken to playing Tall so I can keep the empire sprawl penalties low while boosting my R&D bonuses. I've taken to out pacing Grand Admiral AI so much faster then I had in prior versions in both tech and economy going this route.

Discovery for me is my "Pick it the moment traditions become available" early game savior. Use it then activate the "Map the Stars" Edict for increased anomaly chance for more research and scientist xp Not to mention the bonuses from said tradition help late game as well with minor but very significant boosts once you have a lot of systems with research stations in them

Sweet video. Call out and watching the rest.

i always feel like some of the bonuses you can get get as a psionic ascended empire always get overlooked, like the shroud preacher destiny trait for governors (25% resource output for psionic pops) and the zro catalysis edict from lvl 5 holy covenant federations (15% resource output for psionic pops) thats with telepaths and the agenda thats 55% resource output empire wide and 110% resource output on a world with a sanctum and the governor. i love it as necrophage whern i don't mind the lack of pop growth because i get that from the slave market

Great guide thank you

Finally a tier list, hurrah!

I love your videos they show me more things that are possible in the game then I cared to explore mostly cause it takes me and my friend up to 4 days to do 1 play through so I usually do small changes between games. Question what would some of your tier list look like for stellaris base game vs +all dlc?

Thanks! Might give cybernetic hivemind a try. These bonuses together with expansion & domination are absolutely nuts

Still with you sir! Never minded long videos at all as long as they are interesting.

I don't know how i managed to stay awake for the whole thing (cuz i watched it right before bed) but i did. Good job, though. I really like some of your reasoning. I've always felt Expension and Discovery were a little too popular but i could say why. You did a really good job articulating it.

I actually wrote a mod to make cloning a more flexible play style for RP reasons and found using jobs to generate organic pop assembly was the most balanced way to do it. So you idea for improving genetic ascension would work well.

With Genetic ascension, if you get the Tiyanki Matriarch you can grab up the Polymelic trait. this gives +0.05 monthly pop assembly per pop (more than twice that of Crystallization or Budding), which stacks with clone vats and can give you ever growing pop assembly. Combine with Vat Grown for a pretty spectacular pop assembly rate.

Distinguished Admiralty* + admiral ruler + Aptitude can get very interesting, especially if you roll Skirmisher at game-gen & start with it at level 2 (further enhanced if you later make them a Strategist & they get Gale-speed). The extra trait picks are huge if you want to match naval design strategies which focus on a single weapon type (hello, missile boats!) I tend to focus on missile kiting with destroyers, so that speed bonus from Skirmisher 2 is a MASSIVE advantage. I often win combats with zero damage taken, & my ships get where they're going faster, which incidentally saves me money as they spend less time out of port. Also helps with exploration & to a lesser extent with construction ships. *Distinguished Admiralty starts your admirals at level 3, & you get to pick the level 2 & 3 traits of your defense minister & optionally your ruler.

Discovery is always a first pick for me. Faster surveying means you can start wide and carve out your territory faster than those around you. The increase in anomolies also generally means the planets you do survey are going to have more resources. The rest of it is negligible aside from the +1 research alternatives, though the 10% research speed is kinda nice

Made it past 40 minutes, my dude! So far, I agree with the tier list. I'm coming back to the game after about a year and have been experimenting with Void Dwellers and Megacorps. Current game is a Megacorp with Tomb World Origin so I could experiment with the relentless industrialist civic. Basically: Post Apocalypse Earth turned Megacorp, With the "adaptive" trait at start. Occupy tomb worlds I find and turn into banger forge worlds. Occupy and turn continental worlds into agri-worlds. Take the Adaptation trad after Mercantile. Occupy worlds I can get up to 70% habitability through research, turn them into industrial worlds, poison them until they passively become Tomb worlds my People are more than happy to live on. Still sciencing it, you should take a look. Love the Content!

I like discovery more along the lines of A rank. But I do play (and everyone I play with) on low hyperlane density so "Blitz scanning" all the routes to cut the AI off from taking everything "behind" them works great. Even more so now that leader cap is a thing, can't just plop out 10 science ships to scan like crazy. Would have liked to see base sci ship be able to scan, but not do anomalies or asset tech, etc etc. Then leaders could buff scan rates with level / skills more than the "empty" ship. And tech is king, so having the extra tech speed never hurts.

I occasionally take adaptability on void dweller for the strategic resource because every bit helps, and the building slots.

Sorry I've been asleep through every single one of your videos, I've never listened to one. Kidding I've watched every video all the way through

I like expansionist for the colony buffs and the influence discount. In almost every game I play, I am usually hurting for influence. Except for one game I played where I was running into the influence limit, which I never new existed. I still do not know what I need to get so much influence.

i think the need of Supremacy unlocking war doctrines is like Diplomacy unlocking federations, War doctrines must be a regular tech (a rare one) and Supremacy could amplify the bonuses of war doctrines or maybe add another doctrine idk... ...ah and the same with Mercantile, the diferent tipes of trade must be a tech and this tradition could amplify that bonuses

an hour long vid? hell yea. Now that's girth. Respect.

The Return of The King. Thank you, Montu, for your great content once again. I will use this knowledge to ̶p̶u̶r̶g̶e̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶s̶u̶b̶j̶u̶l̶g̶a̶t̶e̶ make friends with all the nice aliens out there.

I'd say you're flat wrong about the -10% Starbase influence cost on the Expansion tree. It's THE most important early tradition to grab, because it gives you the ability to take extra starbases way faster. The cost may be whatever late in the game, but in a highly populated game where you have to race to grab as much territory as you can before other empires do, it's THE most important thing to have. It lets you lock in choke points early on, or mess up other empires borders to open a path to attack. It lets you box in empires, or snake yourself into highly rich systems. It's THE tradition that sets up your late game. The tree itself might not be that important, but that one tradition early is a game changer. Then you can pick up the +1 pop once you already have a colony starting up. You can actually pick it after the colony is already establishing, as long as you get it before its finished, you get the extra pop, so you don't have to rush the +1 pop tradition, but the -10% influence cost is insanely good for the early 'race' phase of the game.

nice one montu

Psionics is so powerful if you get the Instrument of Desire. Put the sanctum of desire on an Ecumonopolis and BOOM you have alloys. I have had as high as 30 alloys per Metalurgist, there must be ways to get it higher than that but that is the best I have managed so far. Other bonuses are also great , all pops pumping out extra resources , great scientists and Admirals , the Governor boost is not great but is still a bonus. I almost always go Discovery then Aptitude. Without Discovery the intital scouting to choke points doesnt go well for me so I always regret not taking it. Leaders are so insanely powerful you should be using every advantage you have to boost them so Aptitude is a must have and must have early imho.

Are you still planning to make that Leader traits tier list video? I noticed the preview is no longer up.

Oh man you really went for the two favourite starters! XD

Let's goooooooo. Got that popcorn ready.

About to embark on my yearly month long stellaris addiction. Perfect timing for this to come out

One of the improvements one could add to the federation tree could be using envoys to boost the targets opinion of every federation member. That may mitigate the issue where if one member of you federation is hated by a non-federation member, the opinion malus applies to you as well. If I’m role playing the United Federation of Planets I should be able to liaise between the Vulcans and the Andorians to expand the federation.

Always still here for Montu

Usually I go discovery first just to get map the stars and the extra survey speed, then go expansion for the influence discount on starbases so I can rush for the chokepoints. Finish up expansion for the extra pops, finish up discovery, and from there it depends on the empire build.

A note regarding the reduced building upkeep from Prosperity: The alloy maintenance cost on habitats is assigned to their capital buildings. In other words, the Administrative Operations tradition *reduces habitat upkeep costs*. That can be a LOT of alloys.

Expansion tradition habitat build cost reduction applies to Habitat influence cost as well, costing 120 influence instead of 150. Also in 3..4.5 Diplomacy Tradition's boost to Trust growth and the like does affect the Federation experience gain to some extent, that should still be the case.

Statecraft combined with Machine Empire/Rogue Servitor lets you get a pretty ridiculously high level Council that is also filled out, and leaders in no time, giving you quite a bit of an advantage in the early game.

Hey Montu! How would you feel about a tradition tree focused on bonuses towards being an overlord? (tradition examples include more influence per subject, overlord holding upkeep discounts, terms renegotiation cost discounts, more diplomatic weight per subject, faster specialization exp gain, etc...) I find it weird how there's an entire DLC expansion and an ascension perk regarding overlords and vassals, but no dedicated tradition tree...

@MontuPlays , your explanation makes sense as to why you ranked Prosperity so low. In your opinion, what does this demotion imply about the current tall vs. wide meta & the previously all-important “tempo” of pop growth? Note that I haven’t played since before the release of Nemesis, so my understanding is dated!

I think I agree with expansion placement, except if your playing as a Lithoid species. The slightly cheaper outpost building means I can yoink more planets to help take advantage of the Lithoid +50% habitability bonus and grow pops on more planets, while the pop growth helps deal with the Lithiods slower base pop growth. Hell if you want to stretch it a little bit more, the faster colonies and 1 extra starting pops helps your colonies start producing useful stuff faster, which Lithoids are normally slower at.

F tier seems more of a thing you pick when trying to really lean into certain builds since I always go statecraft since I like making my leaders (specifically councilors) as powerful as possible

I've been playing Stellaris since release and only recently have I stopped first-picking expansion. I think the left side of the tree was more balanced around the original frontier outpost system. I think if the left hand side was changed to give bonuses to starbases or colonization-relevant economic bonuses like construction cost or speed the tree would become stronger again.

"If you want to do basically anything except faster survey speed and get more anomalies, you don't really need Discovery." I do agree with this statement, but only because the faster survey speed is quite a gem in boosting basically everything. For me, it is indeed the reason to have it as an auto 1st pick. Survey results are RNG-based which makes it hard to calculate the gains for comparison, but in my experience it tends to really enhance both research and economy. (Economy a bit less than research though.) Consider that with the maps the stars edict enabled, the tree gives +60% survey speed +10% Anomaly discovery chance. This means that 3 scientists can do the work that should keep 5 scientists busy for other empires! It does require a bit of mis-balancing your empire in the early game, but if you can get a 25 year long 6-scientist early-game survey expedition going, the discovery tree basically gives you 4 additional scientists worth of output during that time. I don't think Discovery is quite as good as Prosperity overall, but I think it is certainly good enough automatically to pick discovery first, and prosperity second. You really have to use it though. The moment assisting research becomes a better use of your scientists time than surveying, the tradition pick must already have paid for its opportunity cost, or it is better to not pick it (first, or at all).

I think I would make the adaptability more about terrforming and keeping the prospecting bits. For statecraft, the finisher effect could be +1 councilor slot and for gestalt +1 lvl to council nodes. I'm also sad that the prospectorium doesnt have a buff at tier 3 from the prosperity finisher

You can use a lot of traditions to give a giant output to leader XP gain. Such as Statecraft, Aptitude, and Discovery plus more. But instead you could just go and get the Zroni Precursor. Use the relic and constantly level up your ruler over and over again.

oh boy, we need a guide of how ships should be made and the composition.

O_O 1h video montu!

I’d argue that discovery and expansion are great specifically when picked early because the survey speed bonuses and outpost influence costs let you expand your territory faster to prevent yourself from getting potentially boxed in by other expanding empires

When my happiness authoritarian stability build for maximum money (HASBMM) has some F and C teirs while im thinking they are B teir, (early edict for me really helpsmout having 5-6 things running) More starbases early on means more food, just build them for food and trade within edges, on edges you can make them tanky boys (really easy to get +16 starbases)