The Cardassian Fleet Doctrine & Tactics Explained!

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Resurrected Starships

Resurrected Starships

Күн бұрын

The Cardassians are known to be 'ruthlessly efficient', with the solid Galor class cruiser the line-ships of their fleet. Let's examine the Cardassian fleet strategy and tactics!
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Game for battle footage is Sins of a Solar Empire: Rebellion, with the Star Trek Armada 3 mod.
Music credit:
"Welcome to the War" by Ender Guney
Music: Epic Cinematic Piano Music
/ @epicmusicchannell

Пікірлер: 143
@parkersenecal5547
@parkersenecal5547 4 жыл бұрын
The Cardassian fleet doctrine reminds me of Mahan's theories on naval warfare, where the idea was to build as many large and powerful battleships in order defeat the enemy fleet in a decisive battle and gain total sea control When we look at it that way it makes sense why the Cardassians build big and powerful ships and have a heavy empathise on tactical thinking aka laying traps and such
@weldonwin
@weldonwin 4 жыл бұрын
Another way to look at why the Cardassians have so few ship classes, is because Carassian home space is supposed to be very resource poor, so it makes sense to build only a few classes of vessel that will do just about anything you ask them to, rather than building dozens of different specialist classes and it also explains why Cardassian ships stay in service so long, with the Galor class just being updated for close to 70 years before they finally start introducing the Keldon class, which itself is really just a modernized Galor. Cardassian technology is also supposed to be a long ways behind Federation or Klingon tecnology, so this would feed into their tactical acumen, Cardassian commanders having to employ superior tactics to offset their technological disadvantage.
@trazyntheinfinite9895
@trazyntheinfinite9895 4 жыл бұрын
@ger du reality had the final laugh when it spat at tge idea and introduced guided missiles.
@gokbay3057
@gokbay3057 4 жыл бұрын
So Imperial Japan. They also fervently believed in decisive battle.
@ryanarment5393
@ryanarment5393 Жыл бұрын
The fact that they use such large and relatively powerful ships also speaks to their poor resources. They built their fleet primarily of their most powerful design in order to maximize the use of the few resources that they have. It also goes to the cardassian philosophy of projecting strength at all costs.
@venomgeekmedia9886
@venomgeekmedia9886 4 жыл бұрын
Cardassian fleet Doctrine: 'Making the best of a bad position' i always saw the cardassians as a equivalent to certain military Junta's and dictatorships in the middle east and other parts of the world. while the size of their forces is impressive. the rank and file is at a disadvantage when it comes to technology. they really never had a prayer against the federation. and they only hold out against the klingons using Guerrilla tactics. but most of their regular fleet was effectively destroyed until the dominion arrived.
@tbeller80
@tbeller80 4 жыл бұрын
In The Wounded it was remarked that the Cardassians were a few decades behind the Federation in starship tech.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
@@tbeller80 Yes, comparable to the Excelsior-class, oftentimes. The Galor also seemed originally scaled, in TNG, to 1587 ft/483.7 metres.
@crownprincesebastianjohano7069
@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 3 жыл бұрын
Cardassian technology had improved by the Dominion War. Their ships could always take some punishment, but their firepower was dramatically increased as evidenced by their ability to one shot kill Birds of Prey, Breen Warships and Dominion fighters. The weapons and shield technology of the orbital weapons platforms were the equal to anything the Federation, Klingons or Romulans possessed. The Cardassians are an example of a power that didn't have enough resources to outfit their entire fleet with the most advanced weaponry (like many poor nations they probably had to work very hard just on providing the basics of a space faring civilization). The admission to the Dominion changed that and we finally saw them reach overall weapons parity with the Klingons and Romulans, if not superiority in shield technology. Which leads me to believe that the Cardassian Union is actually much better off technologically than it was before the Dominion entry by the end of the Dominion War. We see that the Dominion was able to overcome the traditional Cardassian resource scarcity, somehow, considering their newfound ability to produce enormous numbers of ships and equipment. They undoubtedly studied all Dominion technology and if they didn't simply incorporate Dominion systems into theirs, they were probably able to create every good approximations. Either way, there is no reason to think they are behind the other powers in overall technology anymore.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 I would say that being a military autocracy and resource & supply issues were what held the Cardassian Empire back from keeping pace with the larger pan-stellar powers in the Alpha quadrant; not any lack of scientific or technological capability, but lack of industrial capacity to implement their insights fleet-wide. Great Britain had a comparable problem at the turn of the 20th Century, as did the Third Reich and the Japanese Empire in the latter half of WWII - they ran out of resources long before running out of innovative ideas. Recall the character interactions in TNG & DS9 where the Cardassian prelates would order the seizure or wholesale bombardment of worlds simply for their resources. This to me is one case where an ambitious, advanced race is poorly situated for interstellar expansion, and instead of seeking homeostasis or concord with their situation, looks for every possible strategic advantage with a _'carpe diem'_ attitude (not unlike an aggressive, feral animal).
@Marinealver
@Marinealver 4 жыл бұрын
Ferengi Fleet Doctrine is going to be very interesting, you can expect more dirty tricks than a Romulan. Also you forgot about the Cardasian Armed freighter which were designed to keep their cargo hidden from scanners. Bringing the number of ships up to a total of 4 classes.
@tbeller80
@tbeller80 4 жыл бұрын
"Armed" may be generous. Dukat had trouble scuffing the paint on an unshielded Bird of Prey with his cargo ship.
@insertanynameyouwant5311
@insertanynameyouwant5311 3 жыл бұрын
Ferengi doctrine? In TNG they attacked Federation flagship 1 on 1 with no hesitation, unlike Romulans, Klingons or Cardassians. Ferengi fight for latinum but they fight fiercely
@GutkowskiMarek
@GutkowskiMarek 4 жыл бұрын
I like the idea introduced by the Daystrom Institute Technical Library. Cardassians are not on the same level as Klingons Romulans and Federation are, but they try to keep up with them big 3. So they make a decent design and then make a lot of it. Instead of quality, they go for quantity, and as we know "quantity has a quality of its own." It fit very well with the quote from DS9. They are sneaky because head-on engagement would spell their doom.
@Tricky117
@Tricky117 4 жыл бұрын
The Voyager episode 'Dreadnought' also shows the Cardassians to have quantum torpedo technology as the Smart Bomb used them as its primary warhead
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
"Dreadnought" was a great example of what the Cardassians could do in the realm of 'special projects and operations'. Another one was "Chains of Command", where the idea of a metagenic weapon is analogous to the modern idea of a neutron warhead, something not publicly known to be practical.
@JeanLucCaptain
@JeanLucCaptain 4 жыл бұрын
Cardassian engineering: always include a bizarre weakness in an otherwise invulnerable system for plot reasons. Galen Erso has joined the chat. Tarken has left the chat.
@JeanLucCaptain
@JeanLucCaptain 4 жыл бұрын
speaking off star wars/vs star trek: can you compare the Maquis to the Rebel Alliance? or do a tactics video for the maquis?
@adamrobinson3123
@adamrobinson3123 Жыл бұрын
You know, I wouldn't be surprised if the cardassians would have bizarre weaknesses in very robust systems. They are a paranoid people, having the ability to sabotage equipment so it doesn't fall into enemy hands or equally paranoid "allies" makes complete sense
@thefirstprimariscatosicari6870
@thefirstprimariscatosicari6870 4 жыл бұрын
I really like the Cardassiam designs because they look and act like what you would expect a minor power to employ, favouring tactics giving them the initiative and a powerful alpha strike to compensate for the technological and economical disadvantage. Really the only thing they seem to be missing is the strategical mobility needed to always have the initiative, but that might be provided by bigger Warp drives while tactical mobility is sacrificed for the better defenses needed to avoid fatal casualties.
@jasonwhite7905
@jasonwhite7905 3 жыл бұрын
I remember in the 90s, when I collected the Micro Machines DS9 3 piece sets, the box said the Galor had Compressor beams.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
That may have been made up by Mattel, but it's an interesting idea to play with.
@SchneeflockeMonsoon
@SchneeflockeMonsoon 4 жыл бұрын
Excerpt from the Inter-Universal Archives. Report on the Cardassian naval doctrines by Commanders Mitth’raw’nourodo and Dr. Julian Bashir, of the Chiss Ascendancy and Starfleet, respectively. “The Cardassian Navy is built primarily on a single type of vessel, with only minor changes to create the larger cruiser, and a moderately distant design for their light scout and corvette. However, the similarity of these vessels to their government’s emblem (when seen from the dorsal side) shows us a unique mixture of art and architecture. They value their people and their world to a significant degree, even so much as to openly display it to all others who would combat them. This indicates to me that the Cardassians are at their most dangerous when they feel their homes and families are threatened, or have otherwise been damaged by an enemy force. Would you describe that as accurate, Doctor?” “Quite so Commander. I can remember that back during the Dominion war, the Cardassians that formed Damar’s resistance were always more dangerous the more they were put down. Towards the end of the war, his entire organization was destroyed except for him and a pair of my friends: Colonel Kira and a rather slippery Cardassian Tailor Named Garak. Yet, by the end of about a month, they’d gathered enough civilians to storm the main command. Not to mention the entire Cardassian military that served with the Dominion turning on their allies when news came of the devastating attack on their main city.” “I see. Then the Dominion leaders had no sense of the Cardassian culture? No understanding of what lay in their art?” “No Sir. In fact, the Vorta and likely the Jem’Hadar were unable to understand anything aesthetic.” “Gods create in their own image. Since the founders could not understand this tool, they weakened their own forces to prevent their own destruction. A foolish waste.” -File breaks and resumes- “Now, notice the heavy forward weapon array, placed and presented more prominently than even Starfleet deflector dishes. Counter-placed with the thin and evidently weak ‘tail’ of the craft. This vessel was designed by a people who employ great trickery and believe in defeating larger enemies through even dishonorable means if it allows for their own survival, or the survival of the whole.” “How do you work that out?” “An enemy to first encounter this vessel type would attempt to avoid the obvious threat on the bow, and attack the weak point aft. Such an action would be foolish, as more weapons are hidden on the aft and dorsal spires than the front. Furthermore, the double curve of the fore hull and its small command saucer atop inspires and persuades enemies and attacks to ‘slide’ or ‘slip’ around or off the main body of the vessel, and onto a perceived weakness.” “I suppose.” “The most telling of their weapons however, is not the vessels at all, but their automated platforms.” “Platforms? Those small defense drones they had at Chintoka?” “Indeed. At that time, the Cardassians had the materials and technology of the Dominion as a backing, and so were not constrained by anything but their own imaginations. Yet they did not created a large dreadnought or something to counter say, the Defiant Class.” “The Dominion already had those, though.” “True, but that would not have stopped a race who believed power or mimicry were the keys to overpowering their enemies. Instead, they made a weapon that was solely useful in defense of their worlds. They were autonomous, as not to risk their own lives, and used massively wasteful amounts of resources to power and field, but were seen as a worthy trade. This reinforces their views of family and self-culture, while the hollow center of the devices underlines their deceptive nature. ‘Strike where our weakness ought to be, and find nothing but defeat.’ “ “And which Cardassian are you quoting there, Commander Thrawn? Gul Dukat?” “Gul Rapdor, from the Cardassian novel: Eternal Service in Fire, Eternal Glory in Stone.” “Ah. Pity the Founders didn’t read it.” “If they had, they might have learned to see what was quite literally in front of them.” “How so?” “All Cardassian vessels and space-made objects are made of a brown and tan color, with red lights and engine colors. Do you know why?” “No? Unless it’s for some historical reason, I haven’t a clue.” “They take this color for the same reason that Federation ships have blue lighting and warp plasma. They believe in looking out at another of their ships or their own, and taking a little piece of home with them. Something they can protect, even when far away. Never attack Cardassia Prime or Earth, unless you know you will not be receiving any more battles in that war. The rebellions you will have to deal with afterwards will be war enough.” -Recording ends-
@alexanerose4820
@alexanerose4820 4 жыл бұрын
Brilliant
@spartan078ben
@spartan078ben 4 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see a fleshed out Inter-Universal Archives Report on Naval doctrines of various factions. Maybe as a fanfiction? I've thought about what would happen if you made a holographic Thrawn in a Federation holodeck. If there's enough lore to aproximate his psycology he would be a fantastic asset.
@gokbay3057
@gokbay3057 4 жыл бұрын
I would really like Thrawn to give his opinion of Warhammer 40K navies (especially Imperium and Eldar). Even if some things might be obvious. HALO fleets would be nice too.
@SchneeflockeMonsoon
@SchneeflockeMonsoon 4 жыл бұрын
Gokbay I just write dialogue. If RS makes a video, then I can see what I’m working with and I go. If not... I’m not nearly as capable.
@SchneeflockeMonsoon
@SchneeflockeMonsoon 4 жыл бұрын
Benjamin Griggs I’ve thought about it. Maybe I’ll put it up after the Wings of the Empire finishes.
@Marcus51090
@Marcus51090 4 жыл бұрын
Their was a type A and type B galor..... and Type A,B and C variants of the hidiki some are different sizes This is mentioned on screen.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
Oh, and the uprated Type 3 Galor, too...
@johnghudjars3496
@johnghudjars3496 4 жыл бұрын
First off, RIP Rene Auberjonois. Odo was a magnificent character and Rene was beautiful and wonderfully sweet man. It truly breaks my heart. :-( Some further thoughts on the Cardassians and their ships after seeing this video and re-thinking the totality of what we've seen on and off screen. I think the Cardassians and their technology get a bad rap. First and foremost, when speaking of Cardassian technology, one has to remember that it rapidly evolved in the years before and during the Dominion Alliance. And so goes the Galor, Hideki and Keldon classes. There are also variants/Types of the Galor corresponding with when they were built (Galors have been built since the 2340s) or armament. Moreover, the Galors were constantly upgraded with any technological advance, or information stolen by the Obsidian Order. That means the Galor class ship, the Trager, we saw in "The Wounded," is most certainly not a good representation of the class as they were continually upgraded during the early seasons of DS9 and after the Dominion Alliance. By the final year of the Dominion War, the Galor Class was devastating against anything smaller or weaker than a Nebula class ship. And the sheer numbers of them in service meant they could hold their own against anyone. Even in the years before, they were more than a match for a BoP or older Starfleet ship. 1) I want to emphasize, that the advancement and battle worthiness during the Dominion Alliance was not one of the Dominion providing all the tech as we did not see Dominion weapons used on Cardassian ships (though I think the polaron weapons could have easily been used as secondary batteries on Galor and Keldon class ships). The advances in weaponry were Cardassian as demonstrated in "Tears of the Prophets" wherein the weapons platforms were a complete surprise to Weyoun. It was Cardassian Spiral Wave Disruptors and Cardassian plasma torpedoes that were gashing the Galaxy and D'Deridex ships, and Cardassian regenerative shields protecting them against even quantum torpedoes. It was Cardassian technology that produced the new warp engines, even before the Dominion alliance, that made the Keldon and Galor class as fast as the Galaxy and Defiant class (it wasn't the Romulan technology exchange between the Tal Shiar and OO, the Romulans have inferior warp drives to the Cardassians). I believe that what happened in general is that the Dominion alliance took the pressure off the Cardassians and they were finally able to take advantage of some of their indigenous technological breakthroughs thanks to not having to devote every resource to the immediate needs of protecting their space. And they finally had the time and resources to mass produce and install their new weapons en mass thanks to the alliance. 2) Another thing one has to keep in mind when evaluating the Cardassian Fleet is the Strategic situation: The Cardassian Union was much smaller in size (see Star Charts and number of systems used in canon) than the other Great Powers (debatable as to whether Cardassia was a Great Power or just the strongest power of the second rank) which meant it utilized great economy of force in comparison to the others and could field their entire fleet in any conflict around its space, whereas the Federation, Klingons, Romulans, have extensive space that required protection, and each had multiple, substantial threats on their border. Hence Cardassia's ability to mass their fleet against an enemy that could not field even 50% of their fleet in a conflict against them and every student of military history knows that overall numbers are not as important as numbers at the point of friction. Moreover, the Cardassian's compact space allowed them to continually fight the battle of interior lines against an enemy usually at the end of its supply line. This is how they fought to a draw the much larger and advanced Federation, and the Klingons despite being sucker punched by them in "Way of the Warrior." That they were able to rout the Klingons with only a couple hundred Dominion reinforcements in one day, following Dukat's announcement, tells you how stalemated the Klingon-Cardassian War had become. 3) Moreover, the make-up of their fleet and numbers make up for the superiority the Federation and Romulans may have in design: the Cardassian fleet is almost completely equipped with the very tough, and surprisingly powerful Galor class, balanced with the even more formidable Keldon class. And they have many, many, many Galors. Indeed, I would argue that on a per 100 ship basis on average, the Cardassian fleet holds its own thanks to its huge preponderance of medium cruisers over the hilarious numbers of classes of purpose built Federation starships, and the over-reliance of the light, ambush specialist that is the BoP in the Klingon Fleet. Consider, Starfleet during the Dominion War had relatively fewer advanced starships in ratio to the older flying coffins like the Miranda and Excelsior classes. There are only a dozen or so Galaxy class ships, some Nebula class ships, and a scattering of some heavy ships like the Akira, but they are an extreme minority in Starfleet. One can infer that 75% of Starfleet is made up of ships either older or lighter than the Galor Class. Meanwhile, 75% of the Cardassian fleet, from what we see, are Galors. There are not a lot of Keldons, and the Hideki is far fewer in number in comparison to BoPs or Jem Hadar fighters and not heavily used outside their intended role of patrol and light interdiction. 4) And those Galor class ships don't get the credit they deserve: 1) They can take a beating even without shields. The Prakesh took a pounding for like an hour against 3-4 BoPs but held up long enough for the Dutapa Council to be rescued. Who knows how many Klingon ships they had fought off before the Defiant arrived. 2) By the Dominion War they have some serious firepower. They can one-shot kill a BoP, Jem Hadar Fighter or Breen Frigate with the for or aft heavy disruptor. That thing is equivalent to a Type 12 phaser. 3) They are fast. "In Defiant," Keldons were maintaining distance with the Defiant at Warp 9.6 or something. Undoubtedly the new warp engine designs were mass produced as the Nebula class USS Honshu was caught at high warp by Galors. They are much faster than a Warbird, Dominion ship, and possibly Klingon (we never see a Klingon ship going faster than Warp 9). 4) The have great firepower in a 360 degree arc, something notably missing in Klingon and Romulan ships. The lighter Spiral Wave Disruptors were killing Federation fighters with quick shots and they can mass several disruptors on a larger target at the same time (each approach angle has at least six disruptors trained on it). 5) There are thousands of them. 6) We only see them fire torpedoes once, but we know that Cardassian plasma torpedoes are lethal, and that they also have Quantum Torpedoes. One also has to assume that they might carry Dominion polaron torpedoes. This all leads to a favorable comparison to the K'vort, Vor'cha cruisers, and Federation starships inferior to the Nebula or Ambassador Class (except there are 1000s of Galors). And the Keldon is even better. It has three heavy disruptor cannons and can match a Defiant Class (See "Valiant," where Captain Watters refers to going head to head with a Cardassian battlecruiser, undoubtedly a Keldon as Galors are always referred to as destroyers and cruisers. Watters says they both fought until their main power was off-line which is an improvement over the Keldon's performance in "Defiant" where four quantum torpedoes knocked the Keldon out of the fight with only light damage in return). 5) Finally, I think once they joined the Dominion they caught up technologically. This is evidenced by how powerful the Galor became and the tech needed to build those weapon platforms. And it is especially telling in how many ships the Dominion was able to build in a resource poor region. In two years, minus the 1000 or so Dominion ships that came though the wormhole, and the existing Cardassian fleet, something over 20,000 ships were built in Cardassian space (see the episode where 1500 Klingon ships are said to be outnumbered 30-1, and figuring the Breen fleet comprised about 25% of that total). We know from intuition and on-screen scenes of Dominion shipyards that Cardassian ships were being built in large numbers along with Dominion ships. Despite the horrific losses on Cardassia Prime on the last day of the War, and the losses incurred on Septimus III, and in the Chintoka system, wherein there is no other reference to Cardassian systems subject to invasion and conquest*, the Cardassians probably closed the war better off in technological advancement than they had been before. They inherited all that Dominion know how even if the Dominion fleet returned to the Gamma Quadrant. That and the Cardassian fleet finished the War far larger than they started it with, and didn't suffer the losses the rest of the Dominion fleet did in that last battle by virtue of the Founder placing the Breen in the place of honor (See the exchange between Thot Pran and the Founder in What We Left Behind, it is also implied the Cardassians were relegated to a secondary role in the battle) and switching sides. *Non-canon works take huge liberties with information available, there is no proof in canon that any other system in the Cardassian Union aside from Cardassia Prime, Septimus and Chintoka were invaded or occupied. In this regard the Cardassians had it easy considering the Klingons and Federation endured the invasion and occupation of dozens upon dozens of systems (see Inter Arma Enim Silen Leges."
@casbot71
@casbot71 4 жыл бұрын
What is interesting is their warp drive layout, do they have small nacelles in the tail (those two prongs) or do they have an *internal warp drive,* or just a engine exhaust - like some small Birds of Prey with the orange red glowing rear. It wouldn't affect sublight manovering since that depends on impulse drives and thruster layout (and inertia dampeners ect). Incorporated into a Defiant style blocky ship without projections that block line of sight for weapons, it would be a even more effective design as it removes a major weakness of many ship designs - the FTL engines can be easily targeted, especially in suprise attacks. Throw in heavy armour in all round coverage and it's a good concept for another minor race to reverse engineer. The Cardassians aren't going to be changing their paradigm and TBH they will end up a Federation client state if being logical, no one's going to allow them to start mass producing warships post Dominion, and they don't have the resources to spare. Starfleet can provide security. Speaking of the Defiant, Hidenki class ships look suspiciously enough like the Defiant to suggest that some Cardassians espionage may be involved (there is beta canon). As for the colour of Cardassian ships, maybe it's a homage to the Suiliban Cell ship, another non nacelle design?…
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
Mounted within the broad wings, is usually what I infer. The aft forked 'tail' may be a weapons suite, and maybe sensors and jammers, too.
@NoBudjetFilms
@NoBudjetFilms 4 жыл бұрын
I love my Galor Cruiser in Star Trek Online, such a pleasure to fly.
@paulrasmussen8953
@paulrasmussen8953 4 жыл бұрын
Lucky guy
@LMG1792
@LMG1792 4 жыл бұрын
Agreed I love it wish I had a keldon now to.
@NoBudjetFilms
@NoBudjetFilms 4 жыл бұрын
@@paulrasmussen8953 It's available in the C-store if you got the cash. Under the Cardassian bundle.
@paulrasmussen8953
@paulrasmussen8953 4 жыл бұрын
@@NoBudjetFilms that has to be new before it was a lock box only
@MatthewBluefox
@MatthewBluefox 3 жыл бұрын
@@NoBudjetFilms It's Lobi store actually, so it's only a single character unluck and that's not worf the lobies, even if they're freely earned through the yearly mega event.
@skullhelmet1944
@skullhelmet1944 4 жыл бұрын
I miss those helmet things that the Cardasians used to wear I also miss those crazy beards too LOL
@thegreenmanofnorwich
@thegreenmanofnorwich 4 жыл бұрын
They never called them spiral wave disruptors on screen. It seemed like they later settled on phase disruptors, which I thought might be a sort of hybrid between a phaser and a disruptor.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
A disruptor is a high-powered phaser design operating on the same essential principle. Disruptors are designed to maximize the Rapid Nadion Effect and the spontaneous production of antiparticles, specifically anti-protons, to maximize their effect against shields and armor. TBH I'm not sure what a 'spiral wave disruptor' is supposed to be, or how it differs from the direct-fire Klingon, Breen, or Romulan disruptors.
@davidburton4582
@davidburton4582 4 жыл бұрын
Their ships also fight in a squadron of 3, to help with the lack of possible other weapons and other deficiencies. They also have a weakness, like all Cardassian vessels: their sensors can be fooled.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
Even Federation sensors can be fooled under the appropriate circumstances (what does a cloaking device do, anyways?). The idea is IMO that Cardassian sensors are in a previous or substandard design iteration and their weaknesses are known to the atsute & well-trained in the Federation, Klingon, and Romulan fleets.
@jinsetayinsei4146
@jinsetayinsei4146 4 жыл бұрын
Very happy to see the Hutet get some love. Cardassia reminds me of a bully who's big, but not especially strong or can take a punch. Their fascist empire was desperate for new resources and vulnerable (I'm betting) to resistance given the way they viewed and treated weaker peoples. They were foolish enough to challenge Starfleet and got lucky when the Federation had an idiot at the negotiating table; something an entity occasionally known for conquest through diplomacy shouldn't be known for :P There are a couple of hints in DS9 to other chasis besides the one on screen. I think a thoroughly fleshed out Cardi fleet would be awesome. Given their philosophy, I think their fleet was highly role-specific with little regard for resource cost. Building a Nebula to do some of the jobs of a Galaxy just for cost isn't something I think they'd do. There is a game mod which featured a post-war Cardassian fleet that favored frigates, destroyers, cruisers as the mainstay (all new stuff). They emphasized heavy cruisers and few light dreads with Galors and maybe one Hutet reserved for desperate situations. The fleet was high cost, but delivered an appropriate bang for your buck. This meant careful planning and execution with high risk; ideal for Cardassians having gained a lick of sense. I would have loved to fly this fleet, but I'm pretty sure the mod died.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
An old TNG novel also featured the Liburnian-class battleship - a narrow, spear-shaped ship a bit bigger than the Galaxy-class... (see Memory Beta)
@jinsetayinsei4146
@jinsetayinsei4146 3 жыл бұрын
Interesting design. Kinda weird. I do like CDS for Cardassian ship names.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
@@jinsetayinsei4146 Yes, presumably meaning Cardassian Defence-force Ship or similar.
@oliverfranke7650
@oliverfranke7650 4 жыл бұрын
Cardassians use torpedos. The "dreadnought" from the Voyager episode 'Dreadnought' utilized Quantum torpedos. Given the fact that it has been reprogrammed prior to the Voyager disappearing, Starfleet introducing that weapon with newer ship designs past 2371 and that the Maquis propably doesn't have access to top edge weapons technology, it's likely the Cardassians developed their own version of a Quantum torpedo, or this weapon was copied from Starfleet designs.
@_BLACKSTAR_
@_BLACKSTAR_ 4 жыл бұрын
Yes the Galor class has torpedos.You see them on that same episode of TNG.They destroy the ship with false lifeform sensor echoes using torps after the admiral orders Picard to withdraw.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
'Ensign Ro', was it? Or 'Parallels'?
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
@@chrissonofpear1384 'Ensign Ro' ,I believe, where Picard, at Ro's confidential advisement, exposes the Cardassian's willingness to and the admiral's complicity in destroying an unarmed ship supposedly full of refugees to eliminate a political headache. Picard was an explorer, diplomat, and ambassador; he knew how to tango with Romulans, but not how to outwit the wily Cardassians; Ensign Ro did.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 Жыл бұрын
@@HuntingTarg It was a trick question, pretty much. I think the latter episode reused same vfx, for torps? Meaning, I knew the answer.
@jhallam2011
@jhallam2011 2 жыл бұрын
In the episode Ensign Ro the Cardassian ship had torpedos. Thanks for the video!
@DarinRWagner
@DarinRWagner 4 жыл бұрын
Leskit (Tackleberry from the Police Academy movies) had the best lines in that episode.
@hisdudeness8328
@hisdudeness8328 2 жыл бұрын
In regards to the Photon torpedos, or lack there of, by the Cardassians. There’s a simple explanation for how they might have such weapons in later episodes of the series. During the border war, the Cardassians gained a few tactical victories over the Federation, so it stands to reason that they salvaged the wreckage of the destroyed or disabled Federation ships, and gained access to the Photon torpedo weaponry in those ships. And the Cardassians most certainly began to reverse engineer those more advanced weapons for use on their own ships.
@shaalis
@shaalis 4 жыл бұрын
PLus the Galor and Keldon each have HUGE aft cannons. I think they often would use their forward guns to sweep target's of their critical systems and use the big aft cannons to fly by, then rip apart enemy targets.
@mrhades652
@mrhades652 4 жыл бұрын
Although I'm not a massive Trekkie, I love these videos. Great work!
@antwan1357
@antwan1357 4 жыл бұрын
Can you do Ferengi Fleet doctrine? Buyer beware doctrine has a nice ring to it. Did you know Ferengi cloak the inside of their ship's interiors? You can see the outside but you cant see whats inside them.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
I believe it's not a cloak as much as sensor screening, akin to 'duranium shadows'; somewhat similar to the way lead interferes with x-rays.
@N0TS0uh
@N0TS0uh Жыл бұрын
The cardassian orbital defense platforms are mentioned to carry torpedoes.
@MatthewBluefox
@MatthewBluefox 3 жыл бұрын
Keeping up with the Cardassians is a full time job. :)
@starbugmechanic5236
@starbugmechanic5236 Жыл бұрын
Lol
@Bubble_0f_d00m
@Bubble_0f_d00m Жыл бұрын
The Cardassian ship design from TNG was actually very specific for how they were supposed to think and fight. Same with Federation, Klingons and Romulans. Klingons had only forward facing weapons on their ships, and the weapons were out in the open, big and direct. Klingons don't run, they strike hard and fast. Federation had their weapons out in the open, but able to cover every angle. They weren't offensively laid out in a way that you could bring all weapons to bare on a target, but rather well-prepared defensive weapons that left no area of attack against them undefended. Romulan ships didn't show their weapons at all, like so many other things Romulans keep them secret until they need them. Cardassian ships actually had subtle front facing weapons and their large rearward facing disruptor cannons, as big as the forward-facing Klingon cannons. Those two prongs at the butt end of the Galor, those were actually designed to be huge cannons. Cardassians were originally meant to be more dangerous running than they were coming at you. They were snakes, who didn't think like humans or Klingons. Their tactics were of hit and run, trying to get you to follow into traps. Sadly the show didn't follow the original ship design when it came to space tactics.
@BGRANT777X
@BGRANT777X 4 жыл бұрын
I've always thought the Galor class was a ship that didn't get enough love. Its a shame they followed it up with the Keldon which was basically a Galor class wearing a backpack. Even years after I saw the show I didn't know there really were two ships, I thought it was just a visual inconsistency.
@Colin_
@Colin_ 3 жыл бұрын
We see that the orbital weapons platforms use high numbers of Plasma Torpedoes, so id say its safe to assume that the larger ships in their fleet would have them.
@21owlgirl72
@21owlgirl72 4 жыл бұрын
I love how in the video game the fire and smoke is RISING
@trazyntheinfinite9895
@trazyntheinfinite9895 4 жыл бұрын
just like my boner everytime the spectacle in that mod begins.....
@johnghudjars3496
@johnghudjars3496 4 жыл бұрын
Great video! I agree mostly, I think it is mentioning the Galor and Keldon class have the same heavy Spiral Wave Disruptor cannon to the aft as they do the for. We never see it on screen but it is there if you look at the ships, and mentioned in the literature. It means maneuvering is not as useful for the enemy as those cannons can one shot kill a B'rel class BoP, Dominion bug ship and Green frigate. Moreover, they attack in formation so that those lighter disruptors can hit a flanking target en masse. They do use torpedoes; the orbital weapon platforms used very effective plasma torpedoes and they also possess quantum torpedoes. Speaking of the lighter disruptors/phasers (depending on the Type of Galor), both the Galor and Keldon are covered with medium weaponry. The designer of the model, Rick Sternbach, notes that each of the little pyramids on the model are disruptors, and there are 11/12 of them. This is also seen in canon in episodes like "Sacrifice of Angels" and "Preemptive Strike," where they are used as point defense and against flanking fighters. Though not as powerful as the disruptor cannons, or even Type X phasers, they are in such quantity in every firing arc as to make up for lack of punch. Though that punch varies as they were unable to destroy Maquis Raiders during TNG, but powerful enough to destroy Federation fighters with ease by the Dominion War.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
Also, I suspect they have at least AT TIMES equipped or experimented with phasers - and even have ejectable 'phase coils' in one episode.
@johnghudjars3496
@johnghudjars3496 3 жыл бұрын
@@chrissonofpear1384 There are variants of Galor Class, at least three types, so it seems they probably have had different weapons at different times. Mixed armament is not unusual as even the Klingons have used phasers and disruptors. In the case of the Cardassians it is likely they have rapidly upgraded their ships to keep pace with Federation developments, and using stolen technology, to the point where their weapons were very lethal by the Dominion War. No doubt the Dominion helped them advance technologically as the Cardassian weapons of the last seasons of DS9 were comparable to the Federation (Heavy disruptors on par with Type XII phasers, Quantum Torpedoes and regenerative shielding). The Galor class of the last year of the Dominion War is far more capable than the Galor Class of the last couple seasons of TNG.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
@@johnghudjars3496 That would make sense, yes. I believe phasers are mentioned in 'The Wounded' and 'Chain of Command, part 2'. Whilst torpedoes are maybe seen in 'Ensign Ro' and 'Parallels'...
@johnghudjars3496
@johnghudjars3496 3 жыл бұрын
@@chrissonofpear1384 Also in "Tears of the Prophets" the weapons platforms were loaded with 1000 plasma torpedoes. Also in Voyager episode "Dreadnaught" it is established that the Cardassians possess quantum torpedoes as well.
@patrickcummins79
@patrickcummins79 4 жыл бұрын
They also attack in 3s to make up for the older design of their ship. A galaxy class pre dominion war could easily take on 1 galor.
@smudge4331
@smudge4331 3 жыл бұрын
I was under the impression Cardassian Cruisers (atleast the Galor) were considered quite manoeuvrable for their size. STO makes note of it and we see the Galors being able to ‘keep up’ with the Defiant and chase down Dominion ships.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
Those could have been upgraded by then, I suppose. Still, is possible they often were.
@ryanarment5393
@ryanarment5393 Жыл бұрын
The fact that they prefer to set traps and lay in wait to ambush their enemies is interesting, given that they don't have cloaking devices. Deuritium shadows, holoprojections and other diversions would work even better if they could keep their real ships close by and undetectable.
@jimtilley1158
@jimtilley1158 4 жыл бұрын
The Spiral wave Disruptor is their main forward weapon, however you failed to mention the more powerful Disruptor Wave Cannon sites in various schematics, DS9 Tech manual and Star Trek The Magazine. Which also shows deep insight into Cardassian tactics. Sure you get the forward Alpha strike. them pummeled by multiple disruptor emitters as you pass. then before your shields can stabilize you then get hit by the more powerful Disruptor Wave Cannon, Like a mere after thought. And if the Cardassians disengage in combat and leave. To pursue. You will be facing their most powerful weapon as well as the standard disruptors that have an aft arc.
@terrencechilds8984
@terrencechilds8984 4 жыл бұрын
Win by any means necessary
@MidnightSt
@MidnightSt 4 жыл бұрын
It's probably purely the effect of game logic, but since having played Star Trek: Bridge Commander, it's very hard for me to take Cardassian ships seriously.
@speestechsupport1341
@speestechsupport1341 4 жыл бұрын
I personally dislike the Spoonheads, but the Keldon and Galor-classes are very good-looking ships
@NoBudjetFilms
@NoBudjetFilms 4 жыл бұрын
That's a racism.
@speestechsupport1341
@speestechsupport1341 4 жыл бұрын
NoBudjetFilms I have the S-word pass, Garak gave it to me.
@brianjohnson5272
@brianjohnson5272 3 жыл бұрын
During the early fed/cardi war the mixum is simple. "Easy to taunt easy to trick." With the undisciplined vigor of a school bully you could bait ships into bad spots and wipe the out.
@ExiledPiasa
@ExiledPiasa 4 жыл бұрын
how about doing some episodes on like the Federation or Defender class heavy cruiser? Maybe a crossover between OST and SW?
@aaronsmith7946
@aaronsmith7946 4 жыл бұрын
"GAH-LOR" not "GUH-LOR" - according to DS9 episodes
@jaqenhghar2970
@jaqenhghar2970 4 жыл бұрын
he mispronounces the Hidecki class as well. Kira in DS9 pronounces it "HEH-DECK-EE" not "HIGH-DECK-EE"
@sovietdominion
@sovietdominion 4 жыл бұрын
Does the hutet apear in other games the Dominion wars? I thought it didn't. Als the dreadnaughht missile had torpedo launcher however like DS9 itself we don't know for sure on the origin of these weapons
@resurrectedstarships
@resurrectedstarships 4 жыл бұрын
I dont 'think' so, only in game mods other than Dominion Wars. I was surprised by it when i first saw it.
@cosmicpearl5497
@cosmicpearl5497 4 жыл бұрын
@@resurrectedstarships it also appears in the Ultimate Universe mod for Star Trek Legacy
@NoBudjetFilms
@NoBudjetFilms 4 жыл бұрын
The Cardassian predilection for using traps and deception to fight the Klingons may not be their normal MO. They were badly losing that war, and the Cardassians had to adopt some unconventional tactics just to hold the line (Dukat using a transport ship to take on and capture a Bird of Prey comes to mind). When Damar began his coup the military soldiers who sided with him seemed unfamiliar with secrecy, and guerrilla warfare. They even seemed to detest it, as being beneath them. I think the normal MO for the Cardassian fleet is to hit hard and suddenly, before the enemy can respond. They rely heavily on larger ships so that they can mount those big disruptor lances since that is the only weapon that is semi-effective against the technologically superior neighbors they knew they would have to fight (Federation and Klingons). So they built as many Galor ships as they possibly could, with big heavy guns. But they knew that they needed some versatility in this very top heavy fleet, so they made sure to cover all angles of attack on their Galors with disruptor arrays to help handle smaller, faster enemies.
@davidtherwhanger6795
@davidtherwhanger6795 4 жыл бұрын
The torpedo and phaser banks on DS9 were federation installed. It was an upgrade. First season DS9 had no weapons.
@Vontux
@Vontux 4 жыл бұрын
Wrong, first season DS9 had weapons just not as many. In the first episode they fire their only few photon torpedos to bluff the Cardasisans.
@davidtherwhanger6795
@davidtherwhanger6795 4 жыл бұрын
@@Vontux Have reviewed the first episode, and I stand corrected.
@shanenolan8252
@shanenolan8252 2 жыл бұрын
There is a military transport vessel identical to the Klingon military transport, duka captains one it an episode
@poseidon5003
@poseidon5003 3 жыл бұрын
Oh and there is NOT ONE EPISODE that stated that Cardassians use "spiral wave disruptors, ". Not a one. They're phasers. Their personal sidearms and rifles are disruptors. but the ship weapons are phasers. Jelico even had them eject their "main phaser coils."
@johnmckenna5782
@johnmckenna5782 4 жыл бұрын
On Spacedock, the narrator was saying that the Cardassians were pushing the Federation around during the first Cardassian war. I don't think this was the case. I think Federation ships were more than a match for Cardassian ships, and the Cardassians gained no territory during the first war. What do you think at Resurrected Starships?
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
I assume they caused major inroads, early on, but soon failed to maintain the momentum, due to their technology shortcomings.
@cadengrace5466
@cadengrace5466 4 жыл бұрын
Cardassian tactics are an outgrowth of their having inferior ships compared to their opponent navies. The Galor is not the equal of the Excelsior and is far less agile or capable in combat. The Keldon is merely an upgrade of that base design and has all of its flaws. Likewise it is a better ship than the Galor but it has not kept pace with the main line ships of other navies. A Vorcha is more than a match for one and an Excelsior is probably still the better ship. The Nebulae class cruiser Phoenix took one apart from outside its ability to shot back with a photon torpedo. A Galor opened fire on the unshielded Enterprise-D and did minor hull damage to no consequence. Once the shields came up the Ent-D crippled the Galor in two shots. The Cardassians have poor warships and a fleet tactic based on that fact.
@mb2000
@mb2000 4 жыл бұрын
But which came first, the emblem of the Cardassian Union or the Galor-class? And I think the Cardassians has more freighter ship types than actual military ship types. And they wonder why they couldn’t even defeat the Maquis...
@Roosauec
@Roosauec 4 жыл бұрын
Borg fleet doctrine, maybe?
@tilasole3252
@tilasole3252 Жыл бұрын
Never had a want to really play Sins of a Solar Empire and now...
@asvarien
@asvarien 4 жыл бұрын
What game is that you show?
@resurrectedstarships
@resurrectedstarships 4 жыл бұрын
That's sins of a solar empire with star trek armada 3 mod.
@carolheward6479
@carolheward6479 2 жыл бұрын
Galor class ships fire torpedoes at the bajoran ships in next gen when picard lets them as he has saved the crew.
@QuantumNova
@QuantumNova 4 жыл бұрын
So I guess the rear Ultra spiral-wave launcher isn't canon. Galors were supposed to have a huge aft weapon. It was on the official star trek site a few decades ago. (Now I feel old )
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
@QuantumNova - the DS9 tech manual (not always reliable) does imply a fairly powerful aft disruptor of SOME sort is equipped, however.
@crownprincesebastianjohano7069
@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 3 жыл бұрын
I tend to think that the Cardassian Union is actually much better off technologically than it was before the Dominion entry by the end of the Dominion War. We see that the Dominion was able to overcome the traditional Cardassian resource scarcity, somehow, considering their newfound ability to produce enormous numbers of ships and equipment with the resources of Cardassian space alone. Following the defeat of the Dominion, the Cardassian was awash with Dominion technology, and they undoubtedly studied all of it and if they didn't simply directly incorporate Dominion systems into theirs, they were probably able to create every good approximations and greatly advance their knowledge in nearly every field. Either way, there is no reason to think they are behind the other powers in overall technology anymore.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
The Dominion does not tolerate resistance of any kind. The Jem'Hadar are indiscriminate killers, who follow orders blindly and wholeheartedly, 'without any code' as noted in Soldiers of the Empire. And the Founders believe(d) that they are superior, whether by birthright or simple natural superiority, so lives of humanoids & other 'solids' mean nothing to them. Hence (TL;DR) I think the Dominion would do things to enforce compliance and access resources that would get Cardassia into unwanted diplomatic/political problems if they did them on their own.
@HuntingTarg
@HuntingTarg Жыл бұрын
One power I would have liked to see in the Dominion War would have been the Tholians. If the Romulans saw the threat from afar and decided to intervene in their own way, it's possible the Tholians might have made similar choices.
@dedrickhowell805
@dedrickhowell805 4 жыл бұрын
Isn't that just the nav deflector dish and not a weapon mounted at the center bow.
@paulrasmussen8953
@paulrasmussen8953 4 жыл бұрын
Common visual error
@tbeller80
@tbeller80 4 жыл бұрын
Nearly every weapon shot from a Galor during TNG and DS9 comes from that spot.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
@@tbeller80 Yes, it was INTENDED to be a deflector dish, with disruptors being the small pyramid structures on the wings and belly - but apparently some weapon is built into the dish.
@schooljs1
@schooljs1 Жыл бұрын
what game is this from?
@barrybend7189
@barrybend7189 4 жыл бұрын
Zentradi fleet tactics from SDF Macross.
@attila535
@attila535 4 жыл бұрын
Do they even have them, considering they seem to always have the numerical advantage.
@barrybend7189
@barrybend7189 4 жыл бұрын
@@attila535 yes there are tactics. Most of the tactics we have to glean are from Bretai as Kamjin is mostly useless to analyze.
@tbeller80
@tbeller80 4 жыл бұрын
360 degree weapons coverage, but those weapons are weaker than the main forward gun. Groups of Maquis raiders could take on a Galor. Two Klingon Birds of Prey were a match as well.
@johnghudjars3496
@johnghudjars3496 4 жыл бұрын
Prior to the Dominion. By mid-conflict, Galors were one-shot killing BoPs and even their secondary disruptors were frying Federation fighters with one hit.
@Palmerrip
@Palmerrip 4 жыл бұрын
So if Cardassian check is so fantastic how is it that two Cruisers and one freighter could not defeat one unshielded Federation ship?
@sid2112
@sid2112 4 жыл бұрын
Watched the commercials for you buddy.
@slayingboo7533
@slayingboo7533 4 жыл бұрын
Youth Sisko put torpedo launchers on ds9 fore dominion threat
@tbeller80
@tbeller80 4 жыл бұрын
They fired torpedoes in the first episode.
@TeamDoc312
@TeamDoc312 4 жыл бұрын
Let me introduce you to the Hideki Class... It's what happens when the visual effects people need a new ship, hit the store for greeblies and say, Holy Crap, let's just take that 1/420 scale USS Defiant and cut about 3/4 of it out and roll with it! Introduction over! You're welcome
@Plasmacore_V
@Plasmacore_V 4 жыл бұрын
You forgot the yellow paint.
@chrissonofpear1384
@chrissonofpear1384 3 жыл бұрын
Technically, it was a ship based on the same concept art that inspired the Defiant, which began as a small, unrelated freighter concept.
@poubelle_blanche
@poubelle_blanche 4 жыл бұрын
Echalon. Eshalon not Eckalon.
@sarcasticstartrek7719
@sarcasticstartrek7719 4 жыл бұрын
They use phasers - because they say it multiple times in the show. "Spiral wave disruptor" is not something uttered in Trek canon.
@bloodysimile4893
@bloodysimile4893 Жыл бұрын
Federation fill with pasisfiy and anti war policy allow the Cardassins to get bold and foolish, never show Cardassins their place that they not as strong as they think in wide galaxy.
@InveterateMendaciousness
@InveterateMendaciousness 4 жыл бұрын
Why don’t you make Halo content?
@tomyrody4412
@tomyrody4412 4 жыл бұрын
Pffft, Gaylord-class.
@gavinburns6994
@gavinburns6994 4 жыл бұрын
Love DS9 my favourite of all the Star Trek series. Never again will we see the like in this age of terrible "woke" shows. Expanse is only good show in scifi genre right now. Orville is ok distant second. Discovery is unwatchable now. And they stole from Anas Abdin let us never forget that.
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