ps sorry about the audio mix being too loud on this one- von had some mixing gear settings where it didn’t sound as loud. next time it won’t be x

@@launders yo im going need the bkg music, its soo good but the link in the desc doesnt work.

Always a blessed day when you upload. 🙏

it’s that calmness that’s also why he goes underrated somehow. every kill is stress free- insane positional play

that is exactly the reason why the guy is not in the goat debate for most people. the problem is not that he cant hit a flick, but rather the fact that he never puts himself into a situation to have to rely on that. he just plays the game way too efficiently.

@@launders I feel like it's the fact that when you watch Device play you are thinking: "Yeah that looks like something I could do." (the reality is that we couldn't, but it still looks like it). When you watch Simple or ZywOo, you go "Never in a million years could I do that".

@@zezanje1 that's also why I don't consider s1mple the goat, coz sometimes I feel like he's positioning himself so he can get a good highlight play, like he's chasing highlights.. he is definitely a good awper ofc, but I feel like he can be a lot better if he play more efficiently

Device is Sergio Busquets of CS

true thanks, that makes sense. hadn’t thought about that

Median is an outrageously underated average

Good point - I’m a data scientist and I’m an advocate of the median, but if the distribution is normal/ a bell curve, the mean is technically a better average than the median. It all depends on distribution, which is why your initial comment about standard deviation is important.

@@adamchapman3957 I think median would be better for this type of data set given it implicitly "ignores" outliers. Expecting a 95% confidence interval rejection may be too much, hence mean would be overly weighted by outliers or skew

​@oliverpower138 what does median mean isnt that the same as average?

Spare a though for us old bastards that have been playing CS on and off since 1999...

@@krazed0451 old head fartin dust by nowsee you in cs2

hope you feel better king

true he went hard

F0rest is one of the longevity goats too, maybe even THE longevity goat. Dude played in an S tier tournament a couple months ago, didn't exactly play well but the fact he can even play in that bracket still at all is crazy considering hes been playing for over 20 years now, and been a pro for over 18. Taz hasnt played in anything remotely close to that tier for like 5 years+

@@Robstrapdefinitely THE longevity goat

When I go to school I see him on the bus sometimes :)

@@Robstrap To me this is why f0rest is still the goat. He might have never hit the same ceiling in raw skill in the same way some other contenders have, but the fact that he's been doing this for so long... Incredible. He plays with such style too, just like s1mple and device you can always tell when you're watching f0rest play.

watching now!

thank you and thanks for the compliment :D

@@launders ofc you are my favorite youtuber! Hope to someday meet you at an event 😎

get some sennheiser 560S's instead

you got into the hobby earlier than most, just remember cases are never worth do trade ups my son

@@gh_3_2 have never bought a single case and probably wouldnt.... even if ohne didnt do cases, i would still love him because of his humor and how he can make anything funny. like i watched his iem cologne 23 watchparty and it was lit

ur 100% right the team's success was totally based on each other; the other 4 players are also goats, just dev1ce is the goat of goats haha;

U nailed it 👏

every player on astralis did their job very well, they never choked, always put up above average performance and thats it, with perfect team play, you dont need anything more than that, no need for flashy plays or insane clutches, even tho from time to time you would see magisk/device step up or xyp9x clutch in the most outrageous position

Haha no way du bringer janteloven ind i det her xd

As a Heroic fan, I think that the Heroic squad has as much star power as the Astralis roster that went on that epic run. Where the two squads differ is, as you mentioned, humility. Astralis was just the perfect team, perfect org, they never put a foot wrong. Heroic often tends to brag and gloat. Even if it’s lols or memes, it’s still a subconscious effect. I truly hope Heroic can rise to match what Astralis accomplished but I don’t see it happening. From the Americas with love ❤

It look like a snapchat filter 😂

Another key indicator of his prowess is with how much ease he frags. If you see s1mple, he frags like crazy but there is an element of intensity in his aiming that reflects how much effort he's putting in. Zywoo's aiming is calm, s1mple's aiming is tensed.

@@spawnnpwn4166 s1mple is not tense, but he's way more flicky with his shots compared to zywoo. Different player, different sens, different playstyle

@@davidsantoso2291 He is tense... Plus he plays with a relatively high sensitivity thus requiring a tighter mouse grip. Anyone that grips the mouse tightly aims tensely.

He is amazing, a prodigy no doubt, maybe the best of them all. But his average is over 4 years, not 7 like the others. He needs to keep performing at the absolute top level for 3 more years before we can say he really stands out from Niko, s1mple and dev1ce. He might do it but it's not obvious he will

Thank you!!

love to hear that! i vouch for them because they’re honestly the best.

france

Lewl

thanks just having fun!’

nothing worse than daniels!!!

just feeling blessed that it’s close

They’re more expensive initially for sure but longevity is so much better, you can find replacement parts, they’re simpler tech and built better.

thanks mannee. that’s fair!

thanks for sayinnn 😃

s1mple with his most stacked rosters of all time still put up #1 stats, I believe there is merit to your statement... but think about it. Dev1ce has been on shit teams since his return and his stats are good but far from great. Meanwhile you have s1mple and zywoo from 2020-2023 playing with some of the best rosters theyve even been a part of, still maintaining a 1.3 rating. They're just in a different league, dude. dev1ce will never be in a top team again IMO.

@@dasauto1555 s1mple in 2023 has 1.18 rating. Anyway the question remain as to 2018 would peak device be able to be above s1mple just for a year? Btw Dev1ce in 2023 has 1.22 so he's beating s1mple in rating so far this year.

​@@MagnusTheCrimsonKing Dev0rce has been playing t2-t3 for most of the year 😂😂😂😂😂 no way you're comparing a team that only made deep runs in t1 events vs a team that only made deep runs in t2 events. Also with this in mind he's up against the worst s1mple we've seen in years by 0.04 rating playing against weaker competition. There's no case for him to be comparable.

good choice

kennys is so interesting cause his peak was so high but he never beat #6 over a whole year statistically. though everyone would agree at the time he was the hardest player to play against by far.

those are the two most important priorities for an fps player for sure

Ropz made it to fpl with 60hz monitor, so its certainly possible to play extremely good with just that. And I'm pretty sure your frametime is exceptionally good so you still have a ton of advantages.

i would turn the game loader if i were you

i look forward to this day!

peak, difference in skill compared to others, eye test, longevity, individual accomplishments, team accomplishments the only reason support players aren’t in the conversation is because stats were made to define star players and can’t quantify support player skills like communication, nade usage, dropping guns, seeing the map. most of the time elite players are equally good at all those things too anyway

@@launders And that’s here where it gets murky. Because in a case like Device’s incredible consistency, he had Xyp.. Xyp don’t have the prowess to be in a star position, but no star can do what he does/did as a support. He has specialized in that role to the extent that he’s impact is invaluable. His ability to perform under pressure is/were on the top. Likewise, you can band a bunch of stars together, but in almost all cases, it will always fall apart except freak examples. Everyone can use a nade, everyone can drop a gun, but many stars won’t calculate a whole game, and what has lead up to that game, and process what happened prior, what is the possible future outcomes in this game based on that, and how do we optimize our chances of success based on execution. It’s incredible complex, that suddenly go ways beyond fragging, and ofc. you know all of this, and probably thought it many times and are probably at a different stage than I am. Yet, I don’t know if you last statement is true: “most of the time elite players good on all those things”. I would wager some are way better at communicating under pressure than others. Others can take the lead and make sure things goes according to plan, while others say as less as necessary. If all pros were equal in those categories, why can we then define them by roles? Why don’t you just have a star player being an entry fragger, if you want a bigger volume? Apex in his peak entry fragging days did like Xyp, something else than no one else could do to that degree. So my point is, perhaps there’s more measurements? It is established that something we won’t be able to consider? The first categories you mention is ofc. indisputable, and you will probably be accurate in finding the GOAT by those measurements. Can we by clearly identifying what or how we measure an IGL, support, entry (which is also a support role, really) is their unique traits, that they have that should/shouldn’t be measured in terms of goat? Or should they be judge separately in their own category? Because then we’ve established as to why Glave is not a GOAT compared to let’s say Niko. Glaive will never have the same raw cs prowess as a Niko, but he has achieved significantly more, and by all things considered, he may actually be a more complete player than Niko, and Niko has put himself as an IGL or always contest to be on the top of the hierarchy no matter where he goes, which also heavily impact ingame and ingame decisions and his teammates performance. It’s something that is almost impossible to really quantify, yet it is visible no matter which team he played for (again I stopped watching since 21)… but except from raw star fragging measurements, wouldn’t Glaive win in all other categories? Hence he’s more successful in the game? Using football as an analogy again, a discussion for who’s the best player now often includes, Haaland and Mbappe. The case for Mbappe is that he’s a more complete forward… but he’s not as a good striker as Haaland.. well Haaland got to the toughest league in the world and broke the goalscoring record with a huge legacy in his rookie season… but he may be part of the best team football has ever seen with the current best manager, meanwhile Mbappe has only his prowess to show for, but he’s playing in a nonsensical league if you judge by the upper echelons of football. Then many would actually wager on Kevin De Bryne and perhaps he were the best player in the world at a time… but he’s a creative player, he’s not a goal scorer, yet what he does is so invaluable and with such an incredible skill and skillset it makes him an atypical choice for the best player. Is there or can an example like that happen in CS? Where you’re so good at what you do, and you’re so invaluable, that it tilts over the normal preconceptions on how you value who’s the GOAT? And in coming to that conclusion can we then measure and compare someone like Device to a Simple more accurately? And can we stack someone like Apex, Xyp or Krimz in that hierarchy if that is even possible. Also I would like to add COMPETITION to that list. Some eras of CS has way harder competition than others, that you won’t necessarily remember just by looking at a glance on liqupedia. And those things are always fun to discuss in every sport… like it’s the celebration of who’s the most skilled above all skilled. That’s a man thing! And then you get angry, and then I get grumpy, and I hit you, you head Butt me, I kick you in the nuts, you grab my arm, I grab yours - and then we realize that, we could really use a beer right now, and if you’ve read this so far, I can heavily recommend some exclusive Belgian beer from Grimbergen called: “Magnum Opus, Astrum and Ignis”. You can only acquire them from the main brewery in Belgium though, and you better drink it from a proper Grimbergen Cup!

@@Christian_Bagger I get Lau responded, but I dont think he expected to be reading the holy bible in response. 🤯

@@dasauto1555 hehe, well, I don’t really care whose responding or not. If I write a blog like that, I don’t expect anyone to read it, it’s for my own selfish reasons to be frank, and usually helps my brain to process things. If someone wants to join, debate or share their thoughts and opinions the more the merrier… but it’s not an expectation, and no one has to participate or respond if they don’t want to.

@@Christian_Bagger fair enough carry on 🤙

lmfao

idk who the fuck they are but great comparison