The REAL reason Tesla removed ultrasonic sensors from their cars w/ James Douma #33 (Ep. 674)

Рет қаралды 158,831

Күн бұрын

The rest of this interview will be released tomorrow. Recorded from a studio in Austin, TX.
Tesla previously removed radar and now they are removing ultrasonic sensors from their cars. What's going on? James Douma explains how this is a step forward in the right direction.
James Douma on Twitter, / jamesdouma
James Douma on AI playlist, • James Douma on AI
Social
🐦 Twitter / heydave7
🎧 Apple Podcast: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...
🎙️Spotify open.spotify.com/show/2iin015...
📸 Instagram / heydave7
Dave Lee on Parenting, / @daveleeonlife7659
NOTE: Please don’t fall for scammers who might impersonate me or others in the comment section. I do NOT give out my number or ask people to contact me.
💁🏻‍♂️ Disclaimer: All content on this channel is for discussion and illustrative purposes only and should not be construed as professional financial advice or recommendation to buy or sell any securities. Should you need such advice, consult a licensed financial or tax advisor. All views expressed are personal opinion as of date of recording and are subject to change without responsibility to update views. No guarantee is given regarding the accuracy of information on this channel. Neither host or guests can be held responsible for any direct or incidental loss incurred by applying any of the information offered. Author is long TSLA and other stocks at time of original video publish date. When you buy through links in this video description, author may earn an affiliate commission.
Open an brokerage account at Interactive Brokers:
www.interactivebrokers.com/mk...
Check out my archived articles/posts on Tesla and investing: teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threa...
#Tesla #TSLA #Stocks

Пікірлер: 633

@Dave_Lee Жыл бұрын

I'll be releasing the rest of this interview probably tomorrow morning. It's almost 2 hours. James and I are also recording a more technical video as well going over AI Day slides. That will come out in a few days. 😉

@sudeeptaghosh Жыл бұрын

I can bet my money Tesla must have tested verified that they can do it before physically removing the the sensors ..

@davefroman4700 Жыл бұрын

There was news the other day that GM cannot deliver cars due to a shortage of these sensors. So Tesla hit with the same shortage just said, cancel the features for now. We can enable it later without them.

@elcaro5140 Жыл бұрын

Hi Dave, I am a long time Tesla investor and owner and visiting Austin next week, do you have any tips on how to get a peek inside Giga Austin? Please let me know if you have any tips, thank you!

@pierre.a.larsen Жыл бұрын

@@sudeeptaghosh For sure. Tesla's primary concern is safety. Also, they are entirely driven purely by profits as most other corporations. However in this case safety and profit coincide as the added software capability has none or very little added costs. It is a double win.

@flwi Жыл бұрын

Can't wait. I always enjoy the conversation with James!

@savagecub Жыл бұрын

Apparently Elon has never got the “Camera obscured” message that I ALWAYS get while driving at night in high humidity areas.

@markl3893 Жыл бұрын

I get a similar message sometimes when a camera is lined up with the sun. The camera over-loads and Tesla is blinded.

@savagecub Жыл бұрын

@@alldeeplearning949 Maybe apply some heat to the glass in front of the camera.

@SetTheCurve Жыл бұрын

Maybe install a sensor that can see more than the human eye?

@yssubed2 Жыл бұрын

And I expect he’s never driven country roads in snowy weather…

@Robert-cu9bm Жыл бұрын

@@SetTheCurve Name one?... I'm sure NASA will be wanting it.

@KJSvitko Жыл бұрын

I wish Tesla had cross traffic alerts when backing up. Many other cars have it and it is a great feature to reduce accidents when reversing.

@TeNgaere Жыл бұрын

So true. Can't figure why he doesn't add that with Bird's eye view for parking. It would take 1/1000th of the software engineering effort of FSD and would be something my wife would really use!!

@quixomega Жыл бұрын

They don't? I mean, I own a Mazda it has that...

@TeNgaere Жыл бұрын

@@quixomega A lot of OEMs have that, but for some reason, unmexplained, Tesla doesn't. No excuse as they have the software expertise to do it.

@Robert-cu9bm Жыл бұрын

@@quixomega They have the most advanced tech... Like a valve that has no use to the driver. But the more important tech they are actively deleting

@Acsantes73 Жыл бұрын

the reason is that Elon is cheap and is maximizing profit margins for each car. The fact that he removed the uss without having a viable alternative at all was a ridiculous decision. Not having cross traffic backup alerts and bird's eye view are results of this cost-savings mentality they have. It is frustrating to pay this much for a car and not get these basic features other cars have in that price range.

@elijahmadonia Жыл бұрын

7 MINUTES? DAVE WE NEED A 4 HOUR COME ON!

@SuperPK95 Жыл бұрын

Hopefully this is just a teaser 😅

@dewiz9596 Жыл бұрын

Can’t get enough of this double intellect

@petersmangalisongoma2013 Жыл бұрын

😆😆😆

@casperhansen826 Жыл бұрын

1 minute ought to be enough to say, its not needed, we dismissed it and saved a lot of money

@carholic-sz3qv Жыл бұрын

@@dewiz9596 lol……. Don’t overload data centers with things they uses more energy to run

@an9529 Жыл бұрын

2 issues: 1) The steering projection lines in the backup camera are terrible at tracking where I’m going. It needs to be recalibrated. 2) None of the cameras actually show me the immediate surrounding of my vehicle.

@deficator750 Жыл бұрын

thats one thing i never understood is how a car with cameras all around it still cannot do that. let alone giving us that 360 degree birds view

@artemZinn Жыл бұрын

Ultrasonic sensors were giving accuracy in centimeters which was really useful, I doubt camera can do that accuracy atm

@reggiebuffat Жыл бұрын

At the moment

@sebastiangeorge7714 Жыл бұрын

@@reggiebuffat then why are they doing it now ?

@Robert-cu9bm Жыл бұрын

@@sebastiangeorge7714 Money saving

@jesperalstrup2985 Жыл бұрын

No, Ultrasonic sensors is "guessing" distance, but not very accurate. Vision will be milimeters and accurate as they say in this video.

@sebastiangeorge7714 Жыл бұрын

@@jesperalstrup2985 by now vision is not working at all that’s way more guessing

@steverichards7675 Жыл бұрын

I love these in person interviews! Can't wait to see the rest of these conversations.

@markhall7173 Жыл бұрын

No, the cameras will NOT be better inching towards a curb than ultra-sonic (your second question) because they cannot see objects lower than a foot, up to 3 feet in front of the car. This is really about saving money and arguably materials / resources, but let's not say it's about a superior product. It's also worth noting the cameras are being upgraded from 1.2MP to 5MP and it's not clear whether those cameras will be needed to replace all of the functionality of the sensors being removed, or if it can be achieved with cameras on "legacy" vehicles. Tesla Vision doesn't do a better job than radar for AP especially at night and when it's raining (I'm in the FSD Beta and my car is from 2018).

@markwilliams4671 Жыл бұрын

Actually, if you are moving toward a curb, and were more than 3 feet away when you started, the measured wheel rotation in conjunction with the camera's last identified location of the curb, will work. However, if an object, like a bike or skateboard, was placed within the camera’s blind spot (below a foot in elevation up to three feet in front of the car) while the car was parked, it would have no "memory" of the object to work with.

@XXXSilverLesleyXXX Жыл бұрын

@@markwilliams4671 unless it is in active tracking mode during the time

@Robert-cu9bm Жыл бұрын

@@markwilliams4671 Rain?

@antonioma2702 Жыл бұрын

And thats is why a person gets lower safety scoring on FSD if u drive at night, the cameras simply cant see!

@dogoodnotbad Жыл бұрын

@Lashiv b I wouldn't bet on them. I am driving a 2023 MY without USS and it is a disappointment and forward parking is a struggle

@jeremypmerrill Жыл бұрын

2 Problems: 1) You don't have 4 cameras at bumper level. 2) You never are going to get superior with camera alone to camera + ultrasonic. More inputs is always going to be better than fewer. ESPECIALLY in inclement weather. Ultrasonic function normally when covered in water drops. Cameras, not so much.

@daveinpublic Жыл бұрын

Tesla removed the sensors so they don’t have to worry about using extra computer chips, and so they can ship more cars.

@stevenlee1726 Жыл бұрын

Yes! More sensor will always be better and smarter… car can fly too if strapped with a rocket booster… but you have to consider the business side too… is camera enough? Yes! Human can use their eye to drive! So camera is enough for most cases. I think they want to reduce the manufacturing cost

@jeremypmerrill Жыл бұрын

@@stevenlee1726 I understand why they did it, I just think it's short sighted. Auto makers have been installing ultrasonic sensors in cars for years just to aid human drivers, and they are cheap. Every time I drive my Tesla in anything more than a drizzle full self driving goes bye-bye (sometimes the side cameras fog up just from the cold, and Tesla tries to tell me they are working as designed) No way in hell they get to level 5 with cameras alone.

@danepher Жыл бұрын

@@daveinpublic ultra sonic sensors are very cheap including their chips, they were never had supply problems and can be manufactured in any country. Unlike cpu's and gpu's that need state of the art fabs.

@danepher Жыл бұрын

@@stevenlee1726 as J.P.M already said. All cars nowadays have ultra sonic sensors at least as an option and they are dirt cheap. Camera is enough for most situations yes, but what about situations that are not? How much is most? The cameras and auto options in my father's tesla stop working under rain, snow and thick fog, when in this situations the radar and ultra sonic sensors would work perfectly fine. The radar works in all conditions unlike a camera, might as well use it.

@brednbudr2406 Жыл бұрын

It's crazy how much more enjoyable these are to watch when you are both talking in person. Really feels different, in a good way.

@pazznecht Жыл бұрын

I have missed James. Such a great guy. Thank you Dave. I am impatiently waiting for his assesment of AI Day 2.

@WilliamFontaineJr Жыл бұрын

Me too can’t wait.

@k8923 Жыл бұрын

One of the best things about our 2012 Nissan Leaf was the 360 degree overhead view cameras. They had cameras on each side of the car and in the front and back. On the main screen in the dash, they had an overhead picture of the car, and real time video facing all 4 directions. It was brilliant. It made parking, backing up, etc a breeze. It is amazing to me that here it is 10 years later and this isn't available on $60,000 vehicles. The back up camera on the Tesla is excellent, but the side cameras face the rear, and the only front camera is behind the rear view mirror, so it can only see things about 4 ft away from the car, so you have no idea how far away from the curb you are, or if you're about to drive over something breakable.

@itsjonathanbitch Жыл бұрын

My Range Rover had it and ut was great. I just expected the model y to have because the system is so much smarter but seems not haha

@derwaechter01 7 ай бұрын

So true. We have the old Leaf and 2024 TMY. It's amazing how the Leaf can be so much better at parking. And it has no sensors whatsoever!

@k8923 7 ай бұрын

@@derwaechter01 Fortunately, we bought our Y in 2022 when they still had the ultrasonics. Still, doesn't come close to the aerial view of the LEAF.

@jayvilla5985 Жыл бұрын

I picked up my new model Y LR on March 1st of this year (2023) and its parking assistance is non-existent. ZERO warnings when parking. I even set up an obstacle with padded garbage cans and reversed into them. I bumped them with no warnings. Same thing goes from the front. I should have paid more attention to that stuff before buying the car. I would have waited. I heard the sensors were removed, but from what I was reading it seemed like “Tesla Vision” was going to be better, but honestly I don’t even think that has been rolled out software wise. If it has, then it’s absolute GARBAGE. My 22k 2014 Honda has far superior parking assistance then this 55k car. And it pisses me off that these Tesla fans like the one you were talking to keep saying that it’s going to be better as if they are sure. When you asked him about the front parking you should have pressed him on that. The Tesla camera in the front is too high up to see anything right in front of the bumper. I would believe that would be better if there was a camera on the bumper, but there is not. And knowing how cheap Elon is there is no way I see them putting one in.

@Resist4 Жыл бұрын

Removing the sensors prior to having the software ready is a huge mistake. And removing radar was a mistake too, since Tesla turned my radar off I have way more phantom braking events. Vision only will never work without more sensors. Tesla removing things is all about reducing their costs, yet it never lowers the price of their vehicles for consumers. But this was a good interview.

@bruceperson7820 Жыл бұрын

I too am having many situations where I get the "phantom braking" from overhead shadows on the road several times on my way to town in the mornings. The cameras can get a film over them where they sort of still work but miss a bunch of stuff. Also the cameras can get crud and even rain drops mess with the cameras. Also the cameras are placed pretty high up and miss things that are low down that the car can still hit. This is a mistake. For people like me that are full self driving beta testers we are so far back on the base release of software that we don't get to keep up with all the new features released to the non-beta testers. When will the base software of beta release be closer to the software being released to the rest of the Tesla community. I get tired of reading and seeing all the great features being released to all the non-beta users and having to wait for months until the beta FSD community gets to try these out. This is especially bad when we lose radar and ultrasonic sensors and they say that software will eventually fix this loss. For us Beta FSD users, this "eventually" is not good enough. I've considered many times dropping out of the FSD Beta just because of this software release lag but then why did I pay so much extra for FSD when I wouldn't be able to use it until someday. This story is getting old.

@Resist4 Жыл бұрын

@@bruceperson7820 I hear you! I'm also getting tired of missing out on the new software updates. It took forever just to get the update that fixed the USB Unavailable issue. I'm not super impressed with the FSD beta anyway, so I'm really considering dropping out because I hate waiting months for bug fixes for other issues because beta users don't get the updates like everyone else does. And I wish Tesla would stop adding games and just fix the Dashcam Viewer!

@jonathansage2147 Жыл бұрын

@@Resist4 omg the dashcam viewer is completely bricked in my car, is it like this for everyone? It takes 5+ minutes to load anything. I entirely stopped looking at sentry recordings. I just hope if anything happens to my car I'll be able to pull the SD card and read it elsewhere.

@jonathansage2147 Жыл бұрын

@@bruceperson7820 I didn't pay for FSD, but removing radar made my car worse too. I get about 3000% (3/day vs .5/ week) more false positive forward collision warnings now. I am seriously considering setting it to late warning, but that feels like disabling a safety feature.

@Resist4 Жыл бұрын

@@jonathansage2147 The Dashcam Viewer has not worked right since day one. And Tesla has done nothing to fix it. I rarely get full 10 minute clips. Most of the time they are one minute, two minute, three minute, 4 minute or 5 minute clips. Often the video skips around or doesn't finish. Moving the slider many times causes the video to not finish and loop. This can't be that difficult for Tesla to fix. I think the Dashcam Viewer is more important than adding more games to my car. Elon just fix it and give us better resolution cameras for crying out loud! And don't tell me that the cameras were never designed to be used as a dashcam, because if so then you guys weren't thinking ahead and aren't as smart as you claim to be.

@BB-xy5nd Жыл бұрын

I was wondering where Douma was. He needed a week to absorb AI day 🤣🔥

@Xavi7192 Жыл бұрын

😅

@heinzn6272 Жыл бұрын

I feel a little smarter every time you have James on your podcast Thanks Dave

@Xiku Жыл бұрын

Lol James has no clue what hes talking about. Sounds like a marketing guy discussing engineering

@deficator750 11 ай бұрын

James is a clueless. How the heck can a camera be better than USS thats in the bumper when the cameras can't even see anything below the bumper.

@MikeKobb Жыл бұрын

I'd like to push back a little on the assertion that the current vision-based system is better than the radar system was. Would appreciate hearing the basis for this claim, because it sure doesn't seem to be based on the experience of many of my friends. (I have an older car with radar.)

@shantanubhattacharya1220 Жыл бұрын

Very timely and informative. Thank you. James answered the question I had (as I'm sure many others did) since the news broke.

@leononymous2562 Жыл бұрын

very cool to see another in person interview with you two!

@hardywoodaway9912 Жыл бұрын

I still waiting for my autopilot to be better… to drive as fast as with radar, to drive as close… I still waiting for automatic wipers to be on par with other cars, same as automatic high beams. If you’re a Tesla owner you get promised a lot but what you actually get…

@TC-V8 Жыл бұрын

I find often get dazzled from Tesla M3's - do you think this this due to their automatic high beams?

@skyshade9106 Жыл бұрын

@@TC-V8 probably my model x plaid i get brighted all time by mostly semis driving on the interstate because the auto high beams are sooo bad they turn on wayyy to much not too big of a deal except the fact my 150,000 dollar car i have to manually turn on and off the high beams becuase it cant tell if someone is in front of me!!

@dogoodnotbad Жыл бұрын

I can relate to that ... I just got my 2023 MY without USS and it is a disappointment. Even forward parking is a struggle. I don't understand why they removed USS without replacing their function

@gabormark2294 Жыл бұрын

This is just mind blowing. The confidence in vision to make such a huge decision. With existing HW, not even hi res cameras like Nio, or HW4 FSD

@fxavcat Жыл бұрын

Love the studio, looks great!!

@cbeebe007 Жыл бұрын

Looking forward to the whole interview! Don't worry about making the segments seem like they are from independent tapings. Just release the clips, we all know it was from one sit down. That is what Lex and Rogan do.

@chrisk1295 Жыл бұрын

glad to see and hear James in HD!

@chrismd00 Жыл бұрын

There’s a 3 foot Blindspot in front of the car and there’s also an area behind the car for the offsite sensors may help with backing up into a rock

@jorgepadilla9945 Жыл бұрын

especially living here in LA, parallel parking is super important.. a tight squeeze, I'm not gonna rely on the blind spot of the camera to tell me to keep going...

@Cybertruck_Scotty Жыл бұрын

You guys rock, thnx for all the high quality conversations!

@fparent Жыл бұрын

I'm not against Tesla trying different things however it should ensure a better experience not a worst one after the transition. Contrary to what he says Tesla Vision is not better in every way after the removal of the radar. After my radar was removed I am experiencing dangerous "phantom braking" in situations where it never happened before.

@Mojo16011973 Жыл бұрын

Great stuff guys. Can't wait until "tomorrow" 🙂

@DiabloSpearguns Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the video, very informative

@TedKidd Жыл бұрын

You two are going to chat on a daily basis? AWESOME 👍

@t1328 Жыл бұрын

Good video. But what evidence do you have that auto pilot is working better with vision only than it was with vision and radar now? I’m still seeing major complaints about phantom braking, and law suits to boot. Personally I believe having to redundant systems is always better than just removing one that is known to work better for some scenarios, and I believe removing the radar was a major mistake.

@nulian Жыл бұрын

Only real reason it probably was removed was supply shortage of chips.

@t1328 Жыл бұрын

@@nulian I think it was just cost cutting personally.

@jonathansage2147 Жыл бұрын

My car is worse without radar. My incidence of forward collision warnings have increased several hundred percent. I used to have one every two weeks or so. I now have 3/day. That is too many false positives for a safety system. It's now the boy who cried wolf and I will probably set it to late warning, but that feels like I'm choosing to compromise my safety for the sake of not being annoyed.

@t1328 Жыл бұрын

@@jonathansage2147 from what I’ve been reading, that’s true of the majority of Tesla Model Y and Model 3 owners. Phantom braking is the reason I sold my 2020 Model Y after radar was removed permanently when I signed up for FSD beta. It’s way worse than radar and vision combined. Since I wrote this reply I looked into it more. It’s gotten very bad for many, but not all Tesla owners.

@jonathansage2147 Жыл бұрын

@@t1328 ouch. What are you moving to? Radar was software removed only like a month ago (they made the announcement and cut over for new cars many months ago), you jumped ship super quickly. I'm going to hold out for longer, but a Rivian R1S is super tempting.

@bujin5455 Жыл бұрын

It's always nice to see James, but I wish it wasn't a "quick" video, but rather a LONG video discussing AI Day 2022.

@paulhendershott667 Жыл бұрын

The biggest shortcoming will be a 3'2" blind spot in front of the car and 2'8" blind spot in the rear. The limitation on both will be the camera angle shooting forward and down. Without additional cameras or new locations (Tesla said the locations will not be moving), it will be interesting to see what the solution will be or if that will be just an acceptable shortcoming moving forward... (pun intended)

@johncrist4554 Жыл бұрын

Dave being back

@andreb.8266 Жыл бұрын

You know how good a camera is in snow/slusch/rain condition, I know for myself I had to remove the dirt quite often on all camera because no Cie as make something to clean the damn cameras automaticly.

@haggish7100 Жыл бұрын

Hi David, I like and follow your channel and this is the first time I post a response. I think here that you are not asking the critical questions. The camera on the Tesla sits at the top of the windscreen and cannot possibly see closer than one meter in front of the car at the very bottom. How can this be better than today's ultrasonic? Another thing, everyone who buys a Tesla doesn't live in California. What about those who drive where it rains or snows a lot, the camera becomes quite useless then, doesn't it?

@pauljefferies9087 Жыл бұрын

Ok, ok,ok! Next they will get rid of the headlights, I suppose?

@michaelplotkin7383 Жыл бұрын

Another great job, thanks.

@wz9581 Жыл бұрын

Hi Dave, I thought this format of interview is great! Nonetheless, you bring a lot of great content for all of us, thank you always 😊

@MrMacaroonable Жыл бұрын

I've learned so much from these interviews with James. He's such as intelligent, humble and great explainer of everything. Thank you Dave for spreading these knowledges.

@199724 Жыл бұрын

Yeah, as a Tesla owner I can guarantee you together with all Tesla owners that this is not knowledge, it's bullshit.

@dr-k1667 Жыл бұрын

I think many will agree with me that right after A. I. Day Part 2 we were waiting to have you talk with James. The more conversations the better!!

@Pikminiman Жыл бұрын

I'm guessing this was a really long, more structured conversation, and Dave is releasing it in small parts. My first thought is that it will be good for the channel and good for topic organization.

@lecisko Жыл бұрын

Yeah, tbh for me something an hour long is usually a no on the whole watch. 5-20 minutes is more like it

@MrDuncanBooth Жыл бұрын

Thanks Dave and James

@elcaro5140 Жыл бұрын

Dave, how can I get to see inside Giga Austin next week any tips?

@optimagroup11 Жыл бұрын

High curbs cost me $1,800 twice, once at a new Starbucks, once on a narrow out-of-town residential street making a Y turn with my Ex 'distracting me'... after just getting it fixed! First time car insurance covered it and dinged me for three years with higher premiums , second time I just said old car, let it hang down... until I get my Cybertruck and then let FSD use 'vision' to figure it out... of course, the Cybertruck won't need to worry about high curbs! Lol Who needs ultrasound?... oh yeah, bats! Lol SoCalFreddy

@DaveDayCAE Жыл бұрын

Thinking about smart summon and other self driving scenarios, what about a cat or a dog that takes a nap near or under the car where the cameras cannot see them? Since the front facing cameras would be blocked by the frunk, might the sonar detect an animal under or near the front bumper better than the cameras?

@blakerupert Жыл бұрын

Cool new format!

@crawfordwoodman2626 Жыл бұрын

Thanks, Dave and James. Very helpful. Looking forward to the next talk 👍

@normharper4492 Жыл бұрын

Great new look! Keep up the awesomeness 👌

@beck99o Жыл бұрын

ooooh.. I sense a long conversation with James split out into daily chunks coming! Cant wait. Thanks as always for doing this.

@petermuller5275 Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the insight. I have owned and driven a model S for five years. Love the car, but the software has been all over the place. I have a history in software and think its safe to say that TESLA has not delivered on its promises. The whole story about removing sensors because they believe cameras will do a better job has either not been explained to the publich very well, or its a lot of wishful thinking that might work one day. In the meantime TESLA is still delivering cars with incomplete software which can lead to users making assumptions that could end up hurting them.

@crawkn Жыл бұрын

What FSD is missing which would be the most enabling is networking with other vehicles and infrastructure, and even potentially pedestrians, which would give precise feedback and enable coordination. The network would necessarily be incomplete when first activated, but even occasional inputs would be helpful in identifying errors, and in some cases correcting them in real time. The data requiring integration and interpretation would be orders of magnitude lower in volume than for the vision-based portion of the system, and would normally be precise and reliable.

@tyronemcgillick Жыл бұрын

Great new format!

@ShinkaTV Жыл бұрын

I feel like if Dave invited me over for a family dinner I would be just finishing up my meal and he would abruptly just say "alright, thanks." and stand up to usher me out the door haha.

@Ample17 Жыл бұрын

Yeah the endings always roll in a little abrupt 😂

@johntyson1958 Жыл бұрын

You guys are great together 😎😎

@gregorybower9498 Жыл бұрын

Thank you Dave. James D is such an excellent interviewee; I only wish he'd go to work at Tesla 😳

@larryanddawnstaudt379 Жыл бұрын

"The best part is NO part"

@bigpicture3 Жыл бұрын

Technically the human eye has electromagnetic frequency range limitations that end at the ultraviolet end and the infrared end of the spectrum. The camera sensors can be made to extend beyond these end limit ranges even into night vision. In intense rain or snow storms radar may have some advantages in detecting road edges and obstacles etc.

@tomcapon4447 Жыл бұрын

Biggest impact I see is repair time and cos.! Sensors are why a bumper cover replacement can be thousands of dollars.

@RolandGustafsson Жыл бұрын

Ultrasonic sensors are inexpensive, just bought a 4-pack for my SUV for $25. And yes, they work fine. Radar is probably expensive, however. (Which my Model 3 has)

@jgelim Жыл бұрын

Very helpful thanks

@bobdyck8508 Жыл бұрын

Very interesting! Thank you so much

@robertmpeterson9755 Жыл бұрын

Kepp me from curbing the wheels - I'll be ecstatic.

@SunshineVocals Жыл бұрын

The update on vision is great but they still need the sensors for other advancements. Like emergency braking and when getting close to things. Self-parking will surely not be a thing anymore. They have removed functionality that are not replaced with vision and that's rediculous.

@cryptoslacker-464 Жыл бұрын

Thanks Great discussion

@jerrymartyniuk2221 Жыл бұрын

what about when my car wakes up near a large hump not visible and I try to go forward??

@arshdeeppandher6960 Жыл бұрын

Any update for H4? New cars delivering in Q4 2022 c/w new cameras. Does this mean it also has H4? If so, based on previous H3 transition, when can we expect notifications for H4 retrofits?

@FlorinArjocu Жыл бұрын

There are a million cases cameras cannot do at all or better than sensors & radar. Those are not corner cases. For example: if the camera is dirty, if it is completely dark, if strong light shines into the camera, less than 1 m in front of the car, an object coming from behing another object in that blind spot, getting out from a garage (pretty allodern cars have radars in the corners telling you if there is something coming) etc. Those are daily situations.

@MLG7707 Жыл бұрын

can anybody say to me, how the top cameras determine the object exect location like uss? and what about the snowy or muddy terrain? since i use the new 23 model y, i never felt secure and safe in narrow place? specially on the traffic light, many motorbike seems like in the car, or through to go!! front bumper is going to full of scrath!! did the tesla use the car in the factory and other road conditions? many many questions!

@frodekleppe3884 Жыл бұрын

Nice studio and video.

@magnusjohansson5383 Жыл бұрын

Great episode!

@johntyson1958 Жыл бұрын

I’m still waiting to get functionality back on my’21 sr+. But I remain optimistic 😎

@db-mp2of Жыл бұрын

I think they wheel need another camera in front like other vehicles have had for some time now

@Birthhammer Жыл бұрын

Best intro of all Tesla content providers, no contest

@rickmorenojr Жыл бұрын

The issue is where the cameras are mounted on Tesla vehicles. The angle from the front camera creates a blind spot for objects about 12-inches tall, three feet or less from the front bumper. I hope they can fix that with the new 5MP cameras.

@pfcrow Жыл бұрын

The camera resolution doesn't fix that. What fixes that is remembering what was there, even if you turn the car off. Of course, that only helps for things that don't move, like curbs, not for things like dogs or your kid's scooter.

@jonathansage2147 Жыл бұрын

@@pfcrow Or I put a non standard pair of wheels on my car and now all of it's math is wrong. Or the object moves. Or I jockey the car several times with the object out of frame and the map progressively drifts further and further from reality. Or I turn the car off and it forgets everything that was out of frame. Or I install a software update and it forgets everything out of frame. Or ANY number of other totally plausible edge cases.

@robinisathakur Жыл бұрын

@@pfcrow Or your kid. Kids running around or sleeping animals etc are not exactly edge cases, they are real world everyday occurrences which the old system would have coped with fine. I have a theory that American parking bays are huge compared to the rest of the world so Elon and the rest are not that concerned about it, or at least they don't appear to be moving very fast on this. Doing this internally while beta testing is fine. Rolling out the 'feature' to the whole world and inconveniencing people that have purchased your product, making it far less safe is not.

@Dontslaythybroski Жыл бұрын

Woah new podcast studio?!!

@paulsandgren8625 Жыл бұрын

What i want to know about is the cameras they are using. How do they deal with darkness, rain, snow or any vision impairment? Do they incorporate night vision or FLIR? part of making FSD better than a human driver is to make it see better than a human. I have thrown these questions out there many times and have yet to get an answer. I would love to know your thoughts Dave.

@waynerussell6401 Жыл бұрын

Photon counting - kzfaq.info/get/bejne/eb5mirtitLTboHU.html

@TeNgaere Жыл бұрын

Paul... Unfortunately it is very hard to get responses to KZfaq videos. Some producers are very good at it, but they are the exception! I have never gotten an answer from Dave Lee, sadly enough.

@paulsandgren8625 Жыл бұрын

@@TeNgaere Thanks Marvin. I guess I will keep plugging away at it. So far the only response I have gotten was from Warren R but he would answer my questions with other questions in what I perceived as condescending. I am trying to throw questions out there that I personally have not heard asked before. If I could get some of these influencers to get these questions to the masses, it may be a benefit.

@TeNgaere Жыл бұрын

Paul I am disappointed that some of the well known Tesla KZfaq influencers are not asking for these simple software additions. They spend a lot of time talking about video game or music addtions but nothing about completeing features like Birds Eye View or cross traffic alerts. Go figure. I have texted Elon many times but no response of course.

@paulsandgren8625 Жыл бұрын

@@TeNgaere one thing i have been pondering is the feasibility of dynamic inductive charging for EVs built into roads. I have no idea what the costs would be but it would be interesting to have EVs that weigh much less as they will not need as large of a battery pack therefore more efficient. Just thought I would run it by you

@adamriese3610 Жыл бұрын

My only concern is, when my rear camera is full of snow and dirt in winter

@rk-mu8yf Жыл бұрын

What happens when it rains? I always get a message that at least one of the camera is blocked. MX 2018

@TylerHilliard Жыл бұрын

3:35 EXACTLY! Ultrasonics on my brand new Y we're telling me the distance from a pole NOT the curb so drove over the curb scraping it.

@tt3kgtvr4 Жыл бұрын

I get that as the car moves it can assume an object is still there but what about if you’ve been parked and the objects around you move when you get back. Ex garbage cans

@arguanmodeth Жыл бұрын

I liked the radar. Our Tesla group could park several cars facing into a circle, put a microwave dinner in the center and it was like a tailgate party.

@johannesdolch Жыл бұрын

My guess is that the new occupancy model make ultrasonic superfluous and since they are not perfect they might even confuse the AI

@jebber411 Жыл бұрын

Hi Dave. Off topic- but any chance you’re interested in doing a deep dive into material resources? Volt Rush by Sanderson could be a primer. I’ve been close to the mining industry and see Tesla’s 4680 strategy having a huge scaling problem -worries me more than Tesla’s AI strategy (as an investor). I’ve been to dozen’s of large scale mining operations and basically see them in a similar manner to legacy auto. Extraction yields need to improve ~an order of magnitude to be successful. New company called Tesla Rocks? Hope you asked James some of my AI questions. Thanks for your thoughtful discussions!

@cgamiga Жыл бұрын

FSD also missed bunch of deadlines not just due to complexity, but also as they changed approaches and solutions a few times... first the 4D nets w/ video/objects over time, then the occupancy network, etc... they realized some approaches couldn't work or scale properly, so they changed and now as mentioned, built an even better foundational tech for the whole AI stack, which enables other stuff like parking and Teslabot..

@michalkalavsky Жыл бұрын

I would strongly disagree with current layout of tesla cameras. Only chance they can pull it off with this camera layout is to map and remember area before you park for example. I just can imagine for example how precise can they monitor front right and left corners of car.

@starwreck Жыл бұрын

Nice set

@RobStevens64 Жыл бұрын

I think the flaw in the logic here is that people DON'T just do things like judge distance with their eyes. It may seem like we do, but our other senses play into how we judge things, too. There are very few times where multiple senses aren't used. For example, what you taste is influences as much by your sense of smell and sight as it is your actual taste buds. Soldiers have found their sense of hearing is affected by wearing a helmet, even when it doesn't cover their ears (sound reverberates off your skull, too). I think Tesla is going to find (the hard way) that multiple signals are really needed for the kind of fidelity they want to go for. And personally, I think that where safety features are concerned, more input signals are better than less. But let's be clear, ultrasonics are going away to reduce cost and complexity. And it's happening now because they already made the decision to drop ultrasonic, and they can't change their mind and get the parts now ... suppliers have reallocated supply elsewhere. So now they're forced to go without and have the vision software catchup.

@mondayjj6901 Жыл бұрын

Hi Dave, did you get any feedbacks about AI day from James?

@dougmanck4149 Жыл бұрын

Do the Tesla cameras ever get dirty? Are they unaffected by snow, frost, rain, dust mud etc? Will Teslas only be sold in sunny areas?

@kdungan100 Жыл бұрын

I live in a snowy/slushy area in winter with salted roads. Front cameras are cleared by the wipers. The left/right back looking cameras are well protected and almost never need cleaned. The left/right front looking cameras can get dirty, but it doesn't seem often; occasionally, I will give those a wipe. The back camera gets dirty all of the time, covered in salt. I regularly clean that camera at least once a week. The operator will likely need to periodically clean a little. It seems to take a few trips to obscure the rear camera, so it doesn't seem to get clouded in a single trip.

@RyRch Жыл бұрын

This guy speaks with such confidence about things that are so obviously untrue. There is no defence for removing what for some is a critical aid BEFORE you have the replacement ready. Just shows utter contempt for your customers. There’s no way camera based systems can be better than USS with / or Radar. It’s cost cutting pure and simple.

@edwardtse8631 Жыл бұрын

Seemed like shure sm7b is just the best in the market, the sound is just perfect.

@syproful Жыл бұрын

The biggest issue i have is that on the T there is no camera sprayer. In rain it takes sometimes 5min of driving to be out of use.

@msmiller57 Жыл бұрын

Thanks guys! As usual great and thoughtful conversation. I think removing the sensors is a good move. I have a 2019 M3 and I have gotten phantom readings from my sensors when parking since day one. Never could trust them completely. Do you think they'll disable the existing sensors already in the fleet as they upgrade the software to not use the sensors?

@WilliamFontaineJr Жыл бұрын

Good question.

@Tom-ku8bu Жыл бұрын

I think to have heard that model x and s still keep the ultrasound sensors. And probably the cars that have them probably still gonna use them because those cars without are going to have for the beginning reduced fsd function until the method without ultrasound sensors is hardened.

@pfcrow Жыл бұрын

@@Tom-ku8bu S/X are keeping them until the software is complete so that people buying $100K+ cars don't have missing features. Though I believe someone posted pictures of an S without them in China, so that may not be true.

@MarcioSouza1 Жыл бұрын

Sick studio!

@teslaandtech Жыл бұрын

It will be interesting to see how this plays out

@GroovyVideo2 Жыл бұрын

Nice looking set

@mitch1958no1 Жыл бұрын

and hopefully, there's no freezing rain, slushy roads, or road dirt to obscure the cameras. during winter, I have to frequently stop and clean off the camera lenses to make them useful. But I guess it's not that much of an issue in California or Texas.

@Ryukachoo Жыл бұрын

1:20 Laughs in fender benders the world over

@pauljefferies9087 Жыл бұрын

Yes, fellow viewers, it is in fact becoming more and more difficult to determine if the story is true or not. You see, fellow viewers, “the people who make cars sometimes have lapses in their own reasoning, regarding safety features, unfortunately”.