It’s like a form of narcissism. The fan can date whoever they want but their idols have to stay single so they can live in the de lu Lu world where they still have a chance

The no dating clauses have always been super weird to me, I think the problem is that these terrible crazy fans are profitable so a lot of the companies want to encourage that behavior... to the detriment of the idol who is a literal human being. Kudos to you for posting about it, because as a fellow anime lover I've also seen SO MUCH toxicity from "fans". T-T

Lets not forget about that one kpop idol who got hate and harassment and was DEMANDED to make an apology because he read Made in Abyss.

Good video! I think parasocialism often is fed by the companies that market the idols/vtubers as well. Both ends suffer, the fans who fall into the marketing & the idols who feel pressure to match the marketing standard. I think this can even happen with normal twitch streamers too, since people often watch them for hours, the lines can get blurred for some viewers.

Oh yeah I like vtubers. But I don’t engage with the community 😂.

Hearing about Aya Hirano was so upsetting and disappointing.She's well known for her voice role as Lucy Heartfilia from Fairy Tail, but she's talked about potentially not returning to voice her in the 100 year quest and actually has decided to stop voice acting due to all the stuff happening with her fans. However, i believe she's said she will voice only Lucy in the 100YQ, but its still insane that her "fans" played such a big role in her career decisions.

I was about to say "how could she hate vtubers?" until I saw *fans* and i was like "ohh ok that makes sense".

It's just still insane for me that some idols/celebrities really have to apologize for finding happiness wth

I agree, it’s sad that people think their idol needs to be everything they want them to be. No life, no nothing, just for them as if they own them.

Kpop, Vtubers, J-idols, I’m not into any of them. But god, I often feel like I respect and appreciate them more than their own fans and management! The way people treat these OTHER PEOPLE is insane! Some of those ‘fans’ are legitimately unhinged. Harming their idol, sending inappropriate things to their idol (INCLUDING PERIOD BLOOD APPARENTLY), stalking them, demanding them to be only an idol and not a human being. All that stuff is so horrifying to me.

How can people be surprised when an attractive, rich and successful person is attached. I would be shocked if they WEREN’T dating someone!

Remember, remember, when Vox Akuma's fans screamed at one of his female colleagues who popped in during one of his ASMR streams to ask for help, and Vox had to tell people "You and I are not in a relationship."

I am a relatively new fan of KPop, I got into it around 2018-2019, and I gotta agree with your take on Idol culture. I refuse to truly engage with the majority of the fandoms for all the points you brought up. I remember reading a comment on another commentary video about Idol Culture saying something along the lines of "Well, they signed up for this." Hell no. They signed up to make music and chase their creative passions. They did not sign up to be policed and judged by "fans" for trying to live out their best lives.

People are getting weirder and weirder these days. The entitlement is insane.

As a person who loves kpop like I want nothing more than the idols I like to be happy. I always think that it’s crazy how like company’s tell them not do date and then when the Delulu fans find any way to like think “of these two idols are together how dare they” or when idols do announce they are dating married or what have you and the “fans” lose their minds is insane. Like let them be happy man.

One instance is when Chen from EXO announced he's happily married with children and fans got so mad they wanted him to leave the group and not support them with him still in it. Even ppl who used to like him would destroy his photocards or anything related to him. It's just so insane. Like it's not like anything changed with the music. Some people argued that they were lied to. I call bullshit.

Fandoms in general can be so crazy. There are some franchises I got burned out on, because the fans are so polarised and fixated on their opinions, that they take offense or call people by harsh insults just because their views are different. Some become so obsessed, that they have to get help through therapy! I don't want to oversimplify a wide spectrum of fans, especially since I sometimes talk about my favourite media during therapy, but *Get over it! Worry about things in life that can actually impact you!*

I've been deep into jpop idol culture for almost 20 years at this point. I never understood the level of entitlement I've seen from the fanbase both in Japan and the wider world. Even when i was 100% focused on my "oshi" i still never felt anything close to that entitlement. I do think a huge amount of the blame rests on the shoulders of the conpanies pushing them though. As a counter to the usual, 2 members of Momoiro Clover Z, one of the biggest idol groups going, have gotten married in the last 2 years. There seems to have been little to no backlash from the fanbase but at the same time momoclo have never been marketed in the usual idol way. Still, as much as Aki spoke pure facts in this video it does make me sad that 99% of jpop idol coverage, even the more professional documentaries,just tend to focus on the negative side of the industry and rarely highlight the nicer stories.

This is why I think Oshi no Ko got such a following, because it showed the darkside of the fandom in this type of culture

idol culture is toxic, and the vtuber community can be vile, i have left communities for some vtubers I like because the fans in those communities are NUTS!!

This video is like someone borrowed my mind and laid it bare. Aki is my soul brother confirmed.

I've been a K-pop fan for almost 13 years, and this is literally what I said on my Twitter today retweeting about a certain idol being suspected of being married and I will say it here: How many times does this need to be said? IDOLS👏 ARE👏 NOT👏 THE👏 PROPERTY👏 OF👏 FANS👏 THEY👏 ARE👏 THEIR👏 OWN👏 PERSON👏 AND👏 DESERVE HAPPINESS👏 OUTSIDE👏 OF👏 BEING👏 AN👏 IDOL👏 Edit: Thank you for speaking up about this. Sometimes I hate being a K-pop fan because we're often all grouped in together as being insane by people who aren't fans. I personally would cheer at the news of my favorite idols getting married or starting a family as they're human beings like the rest of us and they deserve to find happiness with someone that will love them for them and not because they're an idol.

I'm not apart of idols of any kind of that culture but j do agree it CRAZY how far super fans will go just bc there fav idol is in a happy relationship...😭 I've always found it so werid when I've seen posts and tweets about fan like "omg my fav idol is taken this is sooooo unfair😢😢😭💔"

This is why I can't do fandoms anymore. I love a lot of geeky stuff. I can't handle the toxicity, so I just quietly like what I like from my own little corner and stay out of it.

You can't just post Vox as an example when he's the most hypocrite among all of them.

I have the same thoughts, I like a lot of stuff music, anime, manga, manhwa, vtubers, cosplay, etc... But I never tried to join the community because of this. I cannot comprehend how they can't distinguish what's toxic behavior towards them. They are normal people too but the difference is they're famous. The self-awareness is suddenly not available towards them. You're free to be obsessed with the things you like but know the boundaries. What's the most mind boggling is they like them for so loooong until something mild happens and them bully them to the point of the famous person unaliving.

We arent all like that but there does seem to be many many people are seriously mentally unhinged and need some checking in on and need to step away from the internet for abit

Hyde (L'arc en Ciel singer) married the idol Megumi Oishi, and they had a kid 19 or 20 years ago, they are still together 🥰 I'm actually quite curious about the son, I don't think there's ever been a picture of him....

I got this notification while watching a vtuber clip on TikTok 💀

When someone's "culture" is being an absolute stalkerish weirdo, you're damn right that deserves being called out

9:52 damn, let this man dub an anime PLEASE that scream was perfect. 😭

Idols, v-tubers, and celebrities all deserve love and happiness in their private life. They are human too with emotions and pain. Thats why I respect the celebrities of the skill, talent, and their wholesome sweet personality as a human being.

You know its a good day when aki posts ❤

Just here for the comment section honestly

What's worse than being starstruck? Being starstruck with access to Twitter.

The whole Mii-chan situation was even touched upon in its own way with her character in the AKB0048 anime. I felt so sorry for her when it happened as one of the original members and that's really when I fell off from it.

I love the Enna's clip at the end HAHAHAHA

I understand this as a kpop fan, as much as i enjoy the music and watching the contents, there are times i stopped listening to specific groups after seeing how some 'fans' can be. It could be easier to just leave the kpop fandom but I do enjoy being a fan, but it's also tiring that that means I will have to expect some toxicity and there's nothing i can do about it. These days it is getting more tiring with cancel culture, and the dating scandal is part of it, but idols can't even be in the same room as others of the opposite gender, they can't make a single mistake because it would be unprofessional but if they are too perfect than they are being fake and seeking attention, if they say or do something 'impure' such as being seen going to a club then they're being a bad influence and should be kicked out and yada yada. It's so tiring and fans are not afraid to be the most toxic person on earth without even caring if they look bad to if their favs notice and call them out for such behaviour. I don't know if it's the same with vtubers and jpop but i'm noticing fans just have a daily chore of bringing others down without even knowing them just to bring their favs up. Honestly, what happened to just liking something and that's it, if you don't like something, why care? unless it made news that someone committed a crime, I really don't understand when some fans made being an anti-fan their whole personality

I wholeheartedly agree with your views on this matter, some of those things even translate to cancel culture as well, it's unfair unrealistic and very biased when it's not easy to even know the half of the life a person with that much fame goes through every day. I can only think of the mental health issues and concerns for the safety of others that are not even though of by those"superfans"

"Don't join if You don't like Idol culture" and then their culture is stalking and sending threats to people

The idols culture, especialy in Japan is like a reflection of Japanese society. Stress of school, taking job, interact social, paying bills,... their toxic lifestyle is making the japanese guys going crazy, become Hikikomori or something like that. I personaly don't like the crazy fans cuz their attitude to the idols, but the society is putting them like this so i can't hate them.

I can agree with you on this there are some fans that goes overboat of thinking that their idol needs to be everything that they want to be without thinking twice and want their idols to stay single but they don't get it that the idols wants to have relationships and living their life the fans don't use their brains or hearts the idols are the victims it happens to other famous people in the state it's sad but true.

I never loved u for a video u posted more than today. Thank you for being a person online that finally says this because honestly same. I used to be such a big fan of k-pop and anime and nowdays I just feel bad for liking things in general. I feel ashamed of being a part of anything

As a small Vtuber, I can agree to alot of this. so many of these unhealthy fans try to make you "theirs" in some way and can become obsessive. its why alot of Vtubers worry bout doxxing and not even face revealing. but yes thes parasocial situations are unhealthy and can hurt both sides in the end.

i'm a fan of all (jpop, kpop, vtuber), and can enjoy without the toxic parts for sure, and sadly with oshi no ko, we jpop idol fans are seen so badly... i get having bias', but don't let it become toxic man, as we've seen how that can end (hurting idols, or yourself..) With vtuber recently it's been chaos and i feel vtuber fandom as gone more bias than any idol fandom would..

I really think the anime film "Perfect Blue" and the anime series "Oshi No Ko" really touches down on how fucked up the idol and entertainment industry actually is. Not just in Japan in Korea but here in States too. If you act like a normal human being, or fall in love you get punished severely, even in some cases with your life. It's very disturbing

Industries market these idols and talents as dolls that the fans can project themselves on to, that's where it goes south.

Some of these people are so delulu that they can’t comprehend the fact that a celebrity doesn’t owe them a relationship.

Yeah, they also freak out if the v-tuber or idol is disabled as well. So much so that I've noticed that the rules with a lot of vtuber streams are vastly different form normal streamer friends where I'm like "..... I'm going the normal streamer route with my rules because I want boundries". Even though I am a vtuber/pngtuber. But I'm also not trying to grow quickly, so I guess I have that type of privlage of working on my own terms in that regard. But I was thinking "I really should just be more transparent with *parts* of my life where I still have my privacy but I'm honest if my hands are being weak one day or I'm emotionally exsaughted, so I'm not going to be my perky self all the time or going to be on the more quiet side. The companies really do set the bar for what is considered "Vtuber" as it is very much based on the idol culture like you said. Yes, inde Vtubers are trying to change some things but it's hard when a lot of newer vtubers that are going into the community think that you have to follow 1 to 1 of what Companies do just to be successful. (This is my own experiences as an independant and having done the research for an friend at the time. Noticing time and again that this was *very much a pattern* due to the misconceptions and misinfomation due to the companies purpetuating it as they want those toxic, parasocial "fans". I found out later on after I found Yam Bat and Squiji explaining that successful indies actually *don't* follow those rules to the T and they actually interpate them differently since they have to do a lot of stuff on their own time and money.) It would be nice though if there's a way to finally combat that toxic fan behavior.

i totally agree with you aki, thank you so much for todays video. i was super happy to see a new video from my favorite youtuber. wish you a great day :)

Fans like those are crazy to be with. Like I would rather choose not to engage with them

Moral of the story guys: Delulu isn't the solulu

Those obsessive superfans are pitiful, sure. The premise is you market the idea of idols as "pure" and that is what the fans expect. Its like breaking a contract. Give pure idols => get fans throwing a yachtload of money at you. For us it seems just bizarre but i accept it as it is.

Man am so glad that you made a video on this topic because it needed and i just hope it will educate those obsessive fans . Like in kpop there some worst fan can easily ruin any idols life. LIKE ITS TOO MUCH CHILDISH . Idols or even any other celebrities they have their own life and life choices they are not different than us their life just like us , they gonna get married , have families its a common sense but i don't why this overass obsessive fans think they own this idols or this celebrities lifes. because of so much hatred and even intentionally typing negative comments when idols doing lives have put so many in depression at the point to commit su*cide like ..like .. its just so frustrating man . I am a kpop fans and whenever my favorite groups go online or do live chatting i always notice those mf intentionally giving negative comment like it makes me so mad like if you don't like it then don't comment it just go somewhere else get f*king life!! Man this obsessive and rude fans can get a therapy?

As someone who listens to some K-pop groups & Ado. I don’t take it too far & don’t see them as goddesses. I love voice actress even from Japan. I get happy seeing them enjoy their lives & having a family. Seeing the fandom take it too far I do try avoiding interacting with them

See, I love k-pop and bands like BTS, Stray Kids, twice, etc. But they have their own lives and so do I. When I hear they are in relationships, I'm happy for them. I like them so I want them to be happy. People need to learn to get over it.

You're so right! The reactions from fans on their idols lives and choices, says more about the fans and their problems, than the idols!

In the summer of 1984 Duran Duran were pretty big and i was listening to a radio station in Tampa Florida and they announced that the drummer, Roger Taylor, had married. A couple girls called the station and the hosts put them on the air and they were HOWLING!! “How could he??? *gasp* wahhhh” clearly distraught (the hosts were just chuckling at the ridiculousness of it). But at least that’s as far as it went- no internet so no internet death threats. The girls probably just ripped all the posters off their wall!

Omg! This entire video reminded me of how Leon's face actor was harassed for just doing his job, hope the guy's alright...

This is an excellent video with an even more magnificent point being made. Good job Aki!!

I still enjoy K-pop, J-idol, J-pop and even some v-tubers, but once I moved to South Korea, I decided to get out of idol fandom because when I was a part of Momoland's international fan club, it was quite uncomfortable because of the crazed behaviors. For example, when two members of my favorite K-pop group of all time, Rainbow, got married, I thought it was pretty cool to see them moving up in life. Now, do I want to meet idols? Of course I do. Would I get heartbroken if I see they are dating? Not really because idols are human too and they have every right to do as they please. As long as they are doing alright and keep making kickass tunes, all is well.

9:52 Hello! Actually, correct me if im wrong but the crying and screaming that can be heard was satirical, it was done by a Japanese comedian. (Although, i would not be shocked if some Rushia fans sounded like that once they found out about the mafumafu situation)

I left the kpop community because of all the toxicity. So many hated on what you liked but would go ballistic when you said anything about their “idols”. Even from the beginning I thought the whole “stan” thing was weird. How they made their whole life kpop. Now, I met so many awesome people in that community and it helped me grow as a person. I’ll never regret the time I was in that community, it’s just so sad to see the rotten part expanding. I haven’t changed my pfp because I’m lazy, okay- Edit: also my name. I’m too lazy to come up with something else and fix it Edit, again: I CHANGED IT :D

It may be more prominent in Japan, but this is an issue on some level for all celebrities both big and small. One of my online associates I had to tell that the best way to think about online streamers or personalities is that they are entertainers and what you are experiencing watching or interacting with them is only real to a point. When they go offline or off the clock, they have there personal life that is none of anyone's business but there own.

Next video: "The Reason I Hate KZfaqr and Twitch Streamer Fans"

well, sadly, in "idol culture", somehow there is a rule enforced contractually by idol agencies that their idol talents are not allowed to be in a relationship. the other alternative is to go "mainstream".

you are so right! it IS crazy that people even think they get to have a say in what those celeberties do, say or even wear. a lot of celeberties have developped social anxiety, but can you really be surprised?? hell! i would get anxiety just watching yet another drama unfold involving some of the artists i follow!

I've had this video in my watch later playlist for weeks, so I'm glad I finally got to watch it. Yes to everything you said.

i remember in middle school there was a group of girls who would fall head over HEELS for a K-pop group of guys. (i don't know which one i don't follow along with groups like them, just not my kind of music) but they were constantly talking about "Oh i wanna marry THIS GUY" "No im Marrying him!" "fine if you marry him I'm marrying THIS OTHER GUY" and i was like ".....your.....your half his age....maybe even more.…and you live in California.." they would constantly say who they were gonna marry and how they were gonna be a house wife or basically the groups doormats cause they "Loved them"....i get loving band members. hell i have a crush on Billy Joe from Green Day! but they doesn't mean im about to fling myself at a wall if i see a picture of him on a poster or something. the girls showed me just how...Unhinged? weird? i dont know a proper word for it without being mean....but that group made me almost immediately want to avoid any K-pop groups. seeing how chaotic a simple group of like...6 girls can get? jsut imagining a whole damn stadium of them makes me skin crawl...makes me feel like im gonna get mauled for mispronouncing one of the singers names....long story short. Bands are made up of real people. with real lives and possible relationships. they aren't your dolls to dress up and make a fantasy with....if you wanna imagine being with them? go ahead. write fanfiction or something, just don't go down to the point your frothing from the mouth over them kissing someone they love or attacking someone who doesnt like the band. that's just psychotic....and its actions like that that kill peoples love for the band or the members knowing that, one wrong move? your going in a ditch.....sorry for the rant, awesome Video Aki and i hope whoever makes it this far has a lovely day. also im sorry if i repeated the same thing multiple times. drink some water, eat somethign healthy, and have a good night, day, or afternoon.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. I really love kpop, BTS and BlackPink being my favorites, but I can't stand some of the people who go crazy online and in person about them. They forget that while they are idols, they are people to. They have their own lives, so let them live their lives. We can still enjoy what they put out there and let them do as they wish off screen or stage.

I feel the same way, I love your videos and you are doing great. Have a beautiful day.❤😊

I used to be a huge Idol fan. After the shaming of an AKB48 member (I think we all know which girl) researching the industry, and some evaluating of my own values, I had to stop supporting them. It’s so exploitative at its core. It’s a cyanide cupcake of an industry.

I loved that interview!!!! The fan base here is based~☆ and 10 yrs later still here~☆

Miyavi is simply amazing and beautiful ❤️

Honestly, I feel like anime fans are just as bad if not worse, the only difference is that anime and manga can’t sue them, like the amount of times I’ve seen people go crazy and start whole arguments and fan wars about the dumbest things not to mention how insane they get when a animation studio or figure company decides to put a character that’s 15 (and not real) in a swimsuit, they’re so convinced this stuff is real, they’re more delulu than any Idol fan I’ve ever seen.... point is, every fandom has a lot of bad fans, just like they have good ones, just don’t generalize Anyways, I agree with what Aki says in this video, Idols, Vtubers, (everyone) should be able to have a relationship and not get canceled for it, it’s so tiring to see these people get treated like they’re not even human! they make mistakes, they loose/gain weight, they forget lyrics or dance moves, they’re just humans like any of us so please treat them with that in mind, online and offline.

I don’t mind hanging out in Hololive, Vshojo Community or Indie Vtubers to basically for the memes, or just staying there for fun. BUT, I do hate Idol Cult. Like to the point that I see these groups lower than “Twitter Users” like if I see Idol Cult harassing someone I’ll usually go offensive on them. Oh and I hate Nijisanji, as a company. Seriously how does a management can mess this up so badly. The PR is somehow dumber than my good old days of playing with School’s Fire Extinguisher. Oh some fans in Niji are okay, but god I hate those who are delusional that the company did nothing wrong.

The thing that pisses me off so much is that these entertainment companies don't promote artist and their work, they promote parasocial relationships, fictional people with a clear character sheet that the fans can fantasise about, and these people are not allowed to stray away from the character they're playing. The companies need them to do somzthing to be bankable but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter, they are what the company needs them to be, regardless of what they are actually good at. They're just products for the company to sell, that's why there is ton of idol merch with their face on it and that's why we're seeing the same thing happen with vtubers Truth is that for these artist, because they're not really being promoted as artist but rather as fantasies, regular fans wouldn't spend money on them and the companies know that, so they push the idols and vtubers to be very close to the other part of their fanbase that is more extreme because these people are willing to pay ungodly amounts of money just to say hi to the idol/vtuber

I see so many similarities in the Anime Fanbase community as well. We have people criticizing others for experiencing anime differently ( aka, manga readers, sub-watchers,dub-watchers ) and we have people obsessing over anime characters, and some of those, at least in the show, are minors… it’s all just so toxic and it made me not watch anime as much anymore or just barely talk about it, never online, cause I know I’ll get ridiculed for simply not liking a ship. Seriously, ppl need to wake up to reality.

As someone who watches a lot of anime and love listening to j-pop music all the time. I never knew about the way fans could act towards idols. And then Oshi No Ko came onto the scene and its all about fan culture the parasocial relationships the mental health effects on idols who make mistakes and how it could destroy their career even to go as far as self h*rm. It very much opened my eyes to what my favorite idols in Japan go through everyday. Nobody should have to feel like their whole life is to be judged and questioning every decision they make. Scary stuff.

This just reminds me of what happened with Christina Grimmie where this fan became obsessed with her and when she got a boyfriend, the fan went crazy, went to her concert and ended her life and then his own. It’s so sad. She was so young and it was all because of parasocial relationships and fans being crazy.

In defense of the entitled: The whole concept of many idols is "the girlfriend experience". Like Aki said, companies will fire talent for going public with relationships, and for good reason (they stop making as much money). So in many cases, the feeling of entitlement is cultivated intentionally, and is how you get poor simps to spend all their life savings on those idols and their merch. With so much emotional and financial investment on the line, from people who are easily manipulated, it's bound to explode when the illusion is shattered. Sex sells, and for some, so does the illusion of its possibility. A large chunk of the industry is predatory and exploitative. And if I'm being honest, in some cases, especially if it's older and independent "talent" getting attacked, I feel worse for the fans than the idol. Younger talent might not truly understand what they're doing, but the more experienced are fully aware. If you spend years defrauding a whole town worth of people, don't be surprised about all the pitchforks and torches when they realize what you've done. Fun fact: many times when a VTuber "goes on break" it's maternity leave, because they've been married for years.

This is going to be unpopular but I have to add that there is some sort of two way engagement in this sort of thing, and ignoring that plays into the idea that there is no fix and we just have to deal with these annoying crazy fans. The thing that that draws these groups into the same category (hence drawing a similar fanbase) is the marketing element in which you get to listen / watch these people, interact eith them via superchats or live settings - have planned meet ups and have all sort of incentives to buy into an "oshi" or the equivalent in these other groups. Obviously this isn't always pushed by the performer and is usually done by marketing teams (or people higher up the chain you know what I mean). All that being said - and I hate to say it - but the conclusion of the video just being "guys haha just stop being crazy and get over yourself" is strange when in reality, there are oddballs who have no social life, may have some disability or are just straight up neet shut ins that don't leave their room and are using up half of their rent money to donate / buy all the merch because "maybe they'll be noticed". It's a perpetual cycle that isn't just continued by the weird people buying into it - it's the practices by the company and people too

PREACH on the true fans part. If anyone is a real fan they would of be super supportive and kind and happy for those idols even the vtubers. Parasocial people in those communities are not fans at all...because they only do what benifits them and be the absolute worst people and send ridiculous death threats cause god forbid their favorite idol and vtuber is married and taken. like dude get a fucking grip. As someone who is a vtuber myself, we dont allow parasocial shit. alot alot alot of vtubers dont allow it. period. people being creepy the vtubers would be very vocal on about it on pointing out what their doing isnt okay. Your favorite wifu and husbando in the vtuber community is taken well be happy for them. they're happy! The same goes for content creators also on youtube too because people do parasocial shit. im still pissed about the parasocial fans getting pissy towards Amy for dating Markiplier and its like - dude hes fricken happy why dont you chillax?????? People forget these people are human. the same for vtubers, theyre actual people behind the models. they are not anyones waifus, their not anyones huabandos, they dont owe anyone shit on anything, they are not anyones girlfriend and boyfriend in these parasocial peoples fantasies. they have a right to date whoever they want that they truely love and someone who supports and genuially cares about them. lets be blunt and real - idols , vtubers, and content creators alike- dont want to date anyone who is a fan and acts so parasocial because thats a major red flag cause the parasocial people act way too entitled like a karen and think their idols/vtubers/content creators owe them anything and info, and get pissy and go into death threat mode when told no and find out their favorite person is taken and married acting like world is over its the end when ,....its not and these people need to seek professional help for their concerning behavior. vtuber community i dont engage much i only engage with those i come across and those who are friends of my friends. i mostly ignore the big side of the vtuber community and just do my own thing in my vtuber scene with my tiny community. i just keep enjoying do what i do like everyone should and everyone shouldnt let the ridiculous parasocial questionable people ruin their fun and enjoyment of enjoying kpop and vtubers and such. you can still enjoy them while not being in the community. theres gonna be rabbid fans and people who wanna do stupid things, theyre in EVERY community , and only way to not engage with them is just block and dont even give them the time of day. enjoy what you truely enjoy. if you feel disconnected cause your just not enjoying it as a whole anymore thats fine. i dont let the fans side make me want to quit enjoying. if i dont enjoy something anymore its for something else or its just suddenly fell out of love for it.

Omg, when you started talking about obssesion and idols I remembered the anime movie that traumatized me af (enough for me to forgot the title), but it was about a security guard obsessed with an ido whose concerts he was securing. This shit was low key scary but high key traumatizing and crazy Edit: googled it, Perfect Blue is the name of movie

I am a vtuber/faceless streamer who started streaming and making content with a long term partner. I still had very vile/adult themed messeges from "fans" ranging from uncomfortable comments to talking/asking more about my personal life which I never answer and worst of all forced role play in my dms. Forced. Adult. Roleplay. of very vile things and using very vulgar language and I am only a very very very small vtuber/content creator. I try to keep those people very far away from me and my community but I can only imagine how impossible that is when you becomer a bigger face online/on social media or in real life.

This is a really informative video about idol culture. Even in other fan cultures, there are insane fans who hate when their favorite creators get into relationships and aren't exactly how they imagine them to be. I find it to be much worse in the idol industry due to how the corporates only see them as product for the consumer to spend their money on

I feel this. I stopped really talking with fans after what with rushia and depressed nousagi. So many people in the vtuber space defended DN when it was found out he was selling doxxed info of the hololive EN girls. He sold their faces,states they lived in, and if I remember right even their past jobs and what they did, it was creepy asf. He even had private info about one of them called kira, which was about a traumatic life event with her and sold it. When people called him out on this so many people came running saying it's not doxxing even though the links he gave were to doxxing sites and tried the whole it's 2 clicks away and act so entitled like they have a right to know this info cause they once gave a vtuber $2. I found myself after that talking to vtuber fans less and less and getting annoyed at how many saw it as a competition to who was more popular. Ever since I did that, I found myself enjoying it more, but it sucks feeling like i take a risk to talk to any fans of vtubers now.

I read a manhwa and something I remember from it was “Idols are products”. It saddens me to think that idols are almost strip away of what little freedom and wellbeing they have to the point where they view themselves as objects to be sell. It a really mentally taxing especially being in the entertainment industry where you are the entertainment. It sad to see that how things are in the world.

"They're barely fans" DAMN you said it! 👏That one line sums up so much.

Oshi no ko is a great series that covers the dark world of idols. Thanks for speaking up on this!

no, straight up, these STANS freaks for these idols are cliniclally insane

Ironically, I never had a fanbase i could actively interact with and really feel like i was a part of until i found my second vtuber oshi (Josuiji Shinri). Toxic fans are in every fandom, i just want a chill place to meet fans that have one foot in reality no matter how much we cook lore for our oshi-sonas. Im glad i found the Koilective because some vtubers fan servers are... Intense and can be borderline/outright toxic 😭

Dark Side, lets give it up🤙

I heard that in Southeast Asian countries the 'boycott' is very powerful! The public turning against a product is super powerful. Perhaps that's why companies that sell pop music etc, from their beginnings, took super good care of their fans fantasys. Now fans are so used to this that they feel entitled to it.

May I also add that Yuzuru Hanyu literally had to settle for divorce after being only married for a few months because his fans were sending death threats to him and his wife and they were harassed by paparazzi daily. He had to do it to protect his wife and thought she would be better off without him. Like I love this dude and would be over the moon to ever be able to go at one of his shows.Yea he's handsome and cute and has the grace of a prince on ice, but I'm not coocoo enough to think that we have a special personal connection or that I'd have a chance with him??? The only thing I wish for is for him to be happy and healthy, and it hurt so much to see him be this sad. He's still a person with a personal life and the right to be in love. Can people really be that delusional and downright stupid? I also wanna add that especially in the kpop industry (as well as some vtubers), they are marketed and set up in a way that favors parasocial relationships with their "fans". It's to the point where they practically act as your personal gf/bf with the way they use fanservice.

I've watched Oshi No Ko enough to know about the Toxic Idol Fandom

I am the most parasocial person I know and yet I get pissed off when I am lumped up with people like these. when the Rushia was married situation reached me, I felt overjoyed that she found someone that she could truly love, and then I wondered why everyone didnt feel the same way that I felt. As someone who has been living because of vtubers, I can say that if you truly love the person that gives you reason and purpose then you would want nothing but happiness for them. the thing that really pisses me off is that there are bastards who genuinely think that they are entitled to something. . . and the worst part of it all is that they dare call themselves "fans".

Oh man I feel bad that the VTuber community is getting a negative bad rap especially those outside of the VTuber community only focusing on the negatives. Yes I do agree that there are some crazy fans. The genuine fans don’t care about them and be against them but those looking outside the VTuber community will think all fans are like this and ruins the reputation of all VTubers.

As someone who has been in so heavily into kpop, the parasocial relationship got so much worse over the years as the company pushes those agendas when it shouldn’t matter what goes on in their faves lives. Like you said as long as they are happy that’s what matters. Over the years I have pulled back from kpop because of how toxic it is so I just support my faves the best I can

I’m glad I’ve interacted & stayed in the vtuber fan space that actually does not care about the personal life of a vtuber. If they’re in a relationship, that’s cool! Me and so many others are there to enjoy & receive the entertainment that our oshi’s provide for us, and as long as they’re safe & happy, that’s all that matters. But the loud minority of vtuber fans that take the parasocialism to an unhealthy level, or claim to be fans then go around harassing others, are fans that I denounce constantly. They’re in it for the satisfaction of their own desires, and in it to cause as much harm to everyone else, which makes the vast majority of us vtuber fans look *incredibly* bad. Your criticisms against the fans are completely understandable, but also, don’t let it overshadow the vast majority of us and our normal views on vtubers. We’re just like normal fans of content creators like you & Joey.