What do you guys think is the connection between Arthas, Jailer and the Legion?

"Turns Out Arthas Is A Really Big Deal" Who would've thunk, huh ...

Imagine if Arthas was the only reason why the Lich King didn't fulfill the jailers plans. Almost like he actively resisted the Lich King from within. "Father, is it over?"

Turns Out Arthas Is A Really Big Deal " Always has been

They're gonna eventually bring him back in Shadowlands, either as a helping character or a boss

To be fair. The Lich King was always capable of feats that were supposed imposible to normal Necromancers. For example he was the only one capable of creating Undead Worgen and Third Generation Death Knights.

Neah, Arthas is staying home. With all this pandemic shit he is furloughed, waiting for his old job back.

I mean he sorta was the main driven character during WC3... he's always been a big deal

Arthas the true Lich King shall return! His father was wrong when he said no king rules forever, Arthas’s influence on the lore and events that have happened since the end of WC3 and since his fall atop ICC are greater than we all could have thought.

I would love to see uther regret his decision and it turns out that arthas is the key to the jailers escape.... yeah that would be funny

man this just makes me think back to when i started playing Wow in WOTLK ..miss those times!

Reminder that if Tyrion didn't use [Thoughts & Prayers!] WoW would have ended in wrath.

DORON! ugh ive missed this channel. idk why your newest videos haven't been popping up on my feed - SUPER STRANGE!

Arthas was and is my favourite character, I was rooting for him to win throughout the whole WOTLK.

I always thought Arthas got a raw deal. He was just a young cocky dude who accidentally got involved in forces way more powerful than him. He lost his will and mind and became a tool.

Heres my theory / headcanon. The jailer was the power (as in the necromantic / magical power) behind the lich king and was also imprisioned in / by the helm of domination. The legion imprisoned him with the help of many of the leaders of the shadowlands (including the bastion one). They either made a deal with the legion because the jailer was too powerful and they feared his power or he was already invading other parts of the shadowlands ( like we are seeing now in the expansion). This was most likely helped by the dread lords connection to Ravendreth. They choose to accept the help of the legion either because they were desperate or because Sargeras approached them in his regular titan form and thus they didnt know the legion was evil or they simply didnt know anything about the legion anyhow. Queue Ner’Zul and then Arthas. Perhaps Arthas was actually good and fighting the jailers influence. Thus he’ll be back as a good guy in shadowlands. Think Illidan and the legion expansion. Queue wotlk and Bolvar becoming lich king. There always has to be a lich king because otherwise the jailer will get full control and use it to kill as many as he can and get their souls sent to the maw thus him getting stronger. The jailer didnt dare make his move too obvious and big while the legion was still around. Queue legion expansion and the legion gets defeated. Jailer starts making his move with Sylvanas as his champion in the mortal world. From the wars the jailer becomes more powerful and when the time is right / he can channel enough power into Sylvanas she destroys the helmet thus completely freeing the jailor. I know theres some holes but im to lazy to fill them in right now. Probably some parts i forgot though, oh well.

Arthas was not working with the Jailer. But, Frostmourne and the Helm of Domination are relics from the maw. My theory is, Legion somehow got a hold on them and used them to create the Lich King. Arthas was not being controlled by the Jailer nor was he serving him. He was literally caught up between.

They better bring my boy back as a Paladin so he can screw up Sylvanas

Everyone here is forgetting that if Arthas himself was on the same side as the Jailer, Sylvanas would never in a million years have sided with them. Sylvanas is the ultimate spirit of vengeance and it would be abysmal writing if after she finally got her vengeance she just says fuck it and sides with the Jailer anyway. Also, another big plot point is the fact that if Arthas was doing the jailers bidding, and so was Sylvanas by breaking the Helm of Domination, why wouldn’t the Jailer have just ordered the Lich King to do it before? Some things don’t add up.

Consider that the Bones of Grakkarond are also in Northrend, and what kind of trouble a resurrected Father of Dragons might have caused. Even if we only got a taste in the Supervillain trilogy of Hearthstone expansions, it's still a thought to keep folks awake at night...

Maw = The Ninth Circle of Dante's Inferno

I want to know what happen to Kel'thuzad I hope he is still alive

If they're all connected somehow does that mean twisting nether and shadowlands are connected? Seeing shadowlands are the place of mortals soul reside and twisting nether are the place of demons soul reside.

If blizzard is gonna do their own version of subverting expectations, it would be that Arthas is ending up getting rescued from the maw and be judged by the arbiter only to become a kyrian because he was actually not as much of a bad guy at all before he was controlled/influenced by the jailer. Imagine that, Arthas with pure white kyrian wings

I want a DeathKnight to absorb all the Titans.

They Kyrians were not scared, only one was. Everybody else was like “shut up”

Arthas is the only true king, as cruel as he might have been. He turned out to be exceptionally strong willed.

I really hope they don't ruin arthas with this expansion

Tichondrius: The runeblade(frostmourne) that you carry was forged by the (Lich King) and empowered to (steal souls). Yours was the first one(arthas) it claimed(warcraft3). 1)Uthers soul was in frostmourne till end of wrath 2)it was Lich king who gave power to the yielder of Frostmourne(in general) not the oposite(warcraft 3 tft). Its sad that blizzard ruins the lore like that and push Sylvanas the femisupreme the grill angel with a bird and the two male deers :) (hope some people know what sarcasm is and dont denie the obvious stuff)

So it's true .. Communizzard finally brought out his Arthas card to attract players.

Arthas WAS chosen by Ner`zhul, for his champion long before the Scourge even began -"Kel`Thuzad"

I think the only proper route would be that yogg saron planted a void seed in arthas' soul after all that time being surrounded by his blood and this was the method to expand into the shadowlands, yoggsaron being the "god of death" so uther dropping arthas soul into the maw is what caused all of this.

Here's a mind-blowing fan theory for you. What if the Lich King and arthas were not trying to help the Jailer but instead by turning everyone into Undead and keeping their souls trapped on Azeroth and free from the shadowlands he was trying to deny Anima entering the afterlife and powering the jailer and more importantly revendread and the master of the dreadlords

Arthas IS the Lich King, Bolvar was just a usurper. We will see the one true king return.

He would have at least gone to Revendreth to be given a chance to atone for his deeds and if he didn't then they would have sent him to the Maw after draining him of his anima

Nice video! Question: if Frostmourne is potentially much more powerful than we thought, would that also apply to Ashbringer? Does the sword that overcame Frostmourne also have powers beyond our comprehension?

Last time I was this early, Arthas was still the Litch King!

@Doronsmovies I recommend taking a look at a new Datamined book called Enemy Infiltration - Preface It makes it seem the dreadlords may actually serve death more concretly as well as various other juicy tidbits. It may also answer the Illgynoth whispers referencing six seats at the table, and "Cunning ones bow to 6 masters but serve only 1" being the 6 cosmological forces!

I’m actually wondering like what exactly is the criteria to be somewhat connected to the maw as a pawn agent or anything Sylvannas I guess there is and will be a complete story on how she can use the power of the maw Lich king armor and rune is from the maw In which I guess nerzhul is completely an agent while arthas is not fully an agent but controllable because his soul falls victim to frostmourne and is scared but what about bolvar why doesn’t he become influenced or know about the maw does it mean you need frostmourne? And the helm of domination isn’t able to make bolvar realize and etc.

I feel like they’re saving Arthas for reclaiming Lordaeron.

My theory: In the Uther short we saw His soul split in two, one devoured and then used to reanimate Sylvanas, and the other... somewhere in the shadowlands. My theory on this soul split is that somewhere in the Shadowlands is the "Humanity" of Sylvanas while her form that was created for one purpose not just to mock her her life: "Destroy everything" or "kill all life". As it is with all Undead, i did hear somewhere that Death Knights even on the Alliance and Horde Suffer from this effect that they are drawn towards life but not to embrace it but to enact the cruelest deeds against it by either killing it or the most gruesome way possible or suffer an effect that literally forces them to go into a bloody stomping war path and basicly kill everything in sight. of course most Death knights now can control this urge but thankfully enough for us there are still many Enemies and problems on azeroth that they can use as a way to feed there bloody hunger for death against life. So again... SOMEWHERE in the Shadowlands is the part of Sylvanas that may or may night come back and could quite possibly revert her back to her old self, see what she has done and basicly exile herself and find ways to atleast redeem most acts of cruelty by either two ways: 1: helping those on azeroth as a champion in the shadows against future threats or 2: Remain in the shadowlands and suffer the pain in Revendreth, Seek her humanity in Bastion, Better herself in Maldraxxus, and honor and respect life itself in Ardenweald and possibly be given new life there. I love Sylvanas as a character but people seem to forget that Frostmourne is quite a Powerful and manipulative weapon that corrupts the soul. Edit: I sometimes ramble on so if things just seem out of place... Yeah, my apologies."

When Arthas dies and Sylvanas wanted to commit suicide. She went to a dark place and saw Arthas there. He was insignificant their. Just a little scarred child running around.

Doron is the only WOW youtuber that doesn't annoy me. Thank you for having a good channel

I hope we can see Arthas interact with Jaina I really like both characters and wish them the best.

The machinery of death broke during Legion. It got confirmed in an interview

Arthas hid a lot more in his head than one would think.

And now we have the “Enemy Infiltration-Preface” on the beta which has massive cosmic Dreadlord implications

Are the Forsaken connected to the Maw? That would explain why their afterlife sucks even for the good undead like Sylvanas.

Arthas didn't break the machine of death... Ursoc was properly sorted years later

Honestly, I think the Legion was just used as an ends to a means. Manipulated by the Nathrezim, who clearly serve someone else and by proxy the jailer- according to a book found in game come shadowlands. As I recall, it was the Nathrezim who created the vampiric runeblades one of which was frostmourne. since Arthas's goal was very narrow sighted and singular, he was the opportune person to unwittingly drive forward some plan the Jailer had. (As in this book a Natherizm notes that forces who are very one minded in their cause are the easiest to manipulate; see naru and the titans) Arthas's singular goal was to eradicate the corruption posed by the legion and their assumed undead. Which I would wager the undead wasn't entirely the legion's pawn, but the Jailer's and the Nathrezim, who are expert deceivers led the legion to believe it was their doing. I can't really say for certain what the jailer's goal is, but I can only assume it is entire domination of the cosmos. As the Natherzim who wrote this Shadowlands book notes that Order (Titans), Disorder (Legion), Life (Wild gods), Holy (Light) and Shadow (Old Gods) are their rivals (which means they serve death) and seek to gain an upper hand on them. What that has to do with everything pinpointing on azeroth, I really can't say- but everyone seems focused on the baby titan. The world soul is probably the key to vast amounts of harness-able power which could likely tip the balance.

Considering that arthas with his army destroyed Lordaeron (biggest human kingdom) Silvermoon, Dalaran, Summoned the legion with Kel'Thuzad, set up illidan to be corrupted, killed the best paladins out there, and litteraly made the forsaken, and considering he is technically the reason that the legion came and thrall went to kalimdor and met the trolls and tauren there, he litteraly made the horde faction and scattered alliance, so ye he was always influental

Why everyone forget the deciever, he is the Master of dreadlords. He create the lich King, there is not way Kil'jaeden to create something whitout knowing where it get power from...

I think the lich king is defitly a agent of the maw but not arthes just the lich king

In shadowlands Doronsmovies: turns out arthas is really a big deal WOTLK: am i a joke to you?

He was using the maw magic sword, then they skip his archon judgment process and toss him straight into the Source of his Lich King power. If they don’t bring him back as a boss then I need to get hired as a writer for blizz. Should be plenty of room for new hires since dreamhaven is gonna take all the OG blizz employees

An in game book was found just that seems to link Sire Denathrius and the Dread Lords and of him seeding agents amongst the other cosmic powers. It could be possible that it was a long con plan to make a Lich King on behalf of the Jailor all along.

I think we can imagine what Sylvanas saw after she decided to end her undead life and jumped off the Ice Crown Citadel

story wise Arthas was and still is the largest threat since the rest of the enemys we face on WOW seems like random dragon ball villains that come and go just to be defeated, we could say that garrosh was also a good threat but it was poorly use

ima call it. either the souls stolen by frostmourne are still split and will play some important role. and or arthas or least the evil part of him will overthrow the jailer and become a cosmic level threat like the legion

Dronsmovies - if Pilav ever made a lore channel could look like this.

Arthas was good until the end, at least a part of him, in the book it seems his mind was shattered into Young Arthas, Ner'zhul and how Arthas saw himself as a death knight who now barely cared about his people (he used to treat his undead army as an actual army because that's the kind of leader he was and just like The Horsemen, parts of his personslity still were alive.)

Actully really exited how shadowlands going to play out and as always great video Dorons!

I feel like Sylvanas wont be able to help herself and in some cold irony she will take Arthas as her servent and we will either have to kill him to set him free, or free him so he can help us beat Sylvanas.

Technically, those nathrezim are the first Maw Walkers

Throwing Arthas into the maw wasn't justice.

if they don't use Arthas in ShadowLands, World of warcraft will fall

I said back when WOTLK ended when Arthas is back ill come back to wow

the lich king helmet design is similar to the maw architecture design especially the armor and building! they look exactly the same so there must be a connection between the jailer and the dread lords. Do you think the lich king armor design a coincidence?

NOTE I have not played WoW in many years, so I have no idea on what has happened in this game. SO this is just what I wish for this game (fan-fiction) If we ever get a warcraft 4 RTS game, I hope we get to play as Arthas. The beginning could be him trying to redeem himself after the things he has done. He starts weak and he does al he can to hide himself from others (using a mask). He goes around saving all that he can from disease to demons, and as he does that, word of his deed goes through the realms. Eventually it would reach all the playable races, of a masked person (no one knows what race Arthas is cause of the mask) and tries to come in contact with him. Arthas would meet many different races and get many allies in his time as a wandered. And get the name of "The wanderer", cause he never reveals his name to anyone. After his ressurrection, his lich king powers that he still has in his soul, became purified and redone to serve the light. In time he might even be able to undo the Undead curse as ge gets stronger and more in tune with the light. Sorry for this sudden fanfiction =) I had fun writing it!

I thought that the runes were put there by Kil'jaeden himself and both frostmourne and the crown were created to imprison Ner'zhul? Correct me if I'm wrong but I think it went something like that.

The jailer chose arthas father child before he was born to become the Lich King.

If this is True than he would beat Sylvanas in a fight because their powers come from the same place but he is baseline stronger. Maybe that’s wet she was chosen. She was the only one that was most like the Lich King.

Funny thing is, I don't think you can call Arthas as the worst person ever and deserving of the maw. Sure he killed a lot of people and raised them into undeath, but he also was the one who kept the undead under control from raging mindlessly across azeroth. Worst people ever are more like Gul'dan, Blackmore and Sylvavas (suck it fanzies)

Heyyy new here haha from what cinematics did those come from? The one that looks like a comic

I'm telling you, Arthas will become the good guy and Uther went on the wrong path when he threw Arthas into the maw.

@Doronsmovies love your work mate. Anything you might say on the topic of sylvanas being thrown into the Maw not once but twice legitimately and Arthas getting tossed in by Uther is a little outside the rules as you mentioned. Are there any other major characters we can confirm have been judged to reside in the Maw so we may draw moral comparisons to Sylvanas and Arthas? I still, even now do not believe he is beyond redemption and uther's actions to me prove it as he was stepping outside the justice he he himself fought for his how life and acted arrogantly and vindictively, I mean after passing and being held within frostmourne then released for judgement. Witnessing the celestial process of moral arbitration he was still not humbled enough and took matters into his own hands. This for me places his own soul in jeopardy although he's already passed judgement so he acts uncharacteristically arrogant without fear of consequence. Strange times in wow lore

But the armor of the lich king was made by Kil'jaden when Ner'Zul was turned into the armor. Unless there is a retcon im missing

The thumbnail is lit 🔥🔥

Imagine if Arthas turns out to be a champion of the Jailor and then puts Sylvanas in her place once more, how epic that'd be, Sylvanas a puppet of Arthas once again! History should repeat itself, also what if Nerzhul and Arthas were primarily controlled by Jailor and all that happened on Azeroth was Jailors grand scheme from the beginning, just imagine the possibilities this expansion brings in terms of lore, I hope blizz doesn't let it become another good guy kills evil and enjoys Moonberry Juice kinda lore once again, it needs to justify everything that has happened on Azeroth during BFA, as well as set a future stage for the lore....

I'm suprised as to why so many people don't want him back. I love when Blizzard ties storyline with old lore to explain past events or offer a new perspective we didn't see before. The ilgynoth lines are juicy and prove they have some things planned in advance. BGA was a lore mess and didnt really tie to anything but Shadowlands seems to be going in a good direction. Arthas is not the Lich King anymore but I would love to see his arc explored further and discover what was behind all of it. It's their base material from WC3, I doubt they mess this up.

Arthas should have went to the arbiter for judgement. I do believe arthas wasn't aware of his actions from taking up frostmourne, I believe he was trapped in his body and mind but had no control over it. He will of faced judgement for strathholme but not his actions as the lich king.

Question Wasn’t killjedan Who created the helmet with narsu body

plot twist, all this was for sylvannas desire to deserve a honorable death from arthas when he tried to resurrect kel thuzad during the scourge attacked for the sunwell

i have a question, if when Uthur died, didn't frostmourne absorb his soul? so how did he go to the shadowlands if his soul was within the blade, empowering it?

I think you're reading too much into things here, drawing lines I really can't see and seemingly forgotten or overlooked a lot of already established lore. And nobody who understood even a fraction of the threat the Lich King posed, would claim he was "just a nuisance". Without Tirion Fordring's plot armor and his mass resurrection spell, the Lich King would most likely have succeeded. The players; "Azeroth's greatest and most powerful champions", LOST to the Lich King. They all died. Did you forget that? The Lich King wanted to rule Azeroth, what his plans were next we may never know. Had he succeeded, and with the most powerful beings on Azeroth at his command, his possibilities would be near limitless. As for Sargeras and the Old Gods, they were not introduced "after" the Lich King. They've been known since vanilla, you just didn't see Sargeras in person until Legion as a player. Even the Void Lords were getting their share of lore in the BC expansion. Had the Lich King been an agent of the Jailer he'd do what Sylvanas did a long time ago. The Lich King kept all the souls of his victims within Frostmourne to empower himself - Sylvanas made sure to send as many souls as possible straight to the Shadowlands and into the Maw, as the Arbiter had been "shut down". Breaking the Helm of Domination to open the rift made zero sense until Blizzard's writers altered the lore. Until that happened, the helmet did nothing but control the undead that had been turned by the Scourge, which is another plot hole that Blizzard has yet to adress: What the heck is going on with all these undead that are now supposedly running rampant on Azeroth, who's going to deal with them? That was the very reason Bolvar took up the role as the new Lich King; to keep the Scourge in check. As for the Dreadlords, of course Blizzard might retcon this as well. Initially it was established that Sargeras found the Nathrezim (Dreadlords) on their own planet, and now many seem to think they're from the Shadowlands. They are demons, thus why they're sent to the Twisting Nether when they're killed, and not the Shadowlands. This was established a long time ago. Just because they look like the Stoneborn doesn't mean they're from the Shadowlands; there are many races and creatures in the Shadowlands that look like creatures from the "planes of the living". Which isn't so surprising since some of them keep their original form even in the Shadowlands, we've seen quite many already. It was also stated that the armor and the sword of Ner'zhul was made by the Nathrezim by orders of Kil'Jaeden, and I severly doubt the writers at that time even thought about the Jailer or whatever; it's almost 20 years ago this was written. Ner'zhul's task was to weaken Azeroth for the coming of the Burning Legion, but instead he decided to try and take it for himself. The Shadowlands as a concept is very new and hardly ever mentioned before, barely hinted at if you read very deep between certain lines and interpret it as you like to fit what now is - Just look at the forums, some serious weed smoking is going on in the fan theories there. It's also now stated that the Icecrown has served as an anchor to the Shadowlands on Azeroth, which in itself is a serious lore plot hole - The Icecrown didn't even exist before Ner'zhul was thrown into Northrend, he had it built and then Arthas upgraded it. Blizzard's writers are just making shit up as they go, and alter established lore like J.K. Rowling on an acid trip. Sargeras did not "want the World Soul". Sargeras wanted to destroy the World Soul and the entire planet, just as he has destroyed countless other worlds. And in Ardenweal we hear that a World Soul has never been seen in the Shadowlands, which would imply that the destruction of the World Soul would not benefit the Jailor. Sargeras' Burning Crusade is exactly what its name implies; he intends to burn and destroy everything in the cosmos, because he was driven mad and corrupt during his initial conquest to rid the cosmos of demons and corruption from the Void. It's therefore borderline insane to think Sargeras would give a damn about the Jailor; he's a Titan who's sole goal is the destruction of all life and all worlds to stop the Void's corruption in the physical plane. Sargeras is hellbent on stopping the Void Lords, and the Void is currently mentioned in battles with the Shadowlands, specifically the Bastion. So if there is any indication that the Jailor is an ally of the Void Lords, Sargeras would hate his guts by default. Arthas was never "consumed by the power of the Maw", he was corrupted by Ner'zhul through Frostmourne the moment he made the pact with it, which was Ner'zhul's sword. The fact that they've decided to attribute the same type of runes that Ner'zhul was rocking to the Jailor and his realm is just disappointing. If it turns out they're going to reduce the Lich King to an ignorant pawn of the Jailor, I won't be surprised, but even more disappointed. Arthas has always been a big deal, because as the Lich King he was one of the greatest threats that Azeroth ever faced; and had it not been for Tirion's plot armor he most likely would have succeeded and made Azeroth one big world of undeath for him to rule; all bound to his will. I would wish the Legion good luck with conquering Azeroth if the Lich King had succeeded, and the same goes for the Old Gods. A Lich King empowered with the souls of an entire planet is no small foe, as well as the fact he'd have its strongest champions at his disposal, the very same champions who would fight back every threat known to Azeroth before and since. I believe the only thing he may not have been able to stop would be Sargeras in his titan form, as Sargeras has cleaved entire planets in half with his sword.

please make this arthas redemption arch!

OK so Sargeras and the Jailor couldn't have made the demons as the demons were the ones that put doubt on Sargeras. Also we don't really know the connection to the twisting nether and the shadow lands.

So all this war there been in warcraft it was just feed the jailer and if we didn't kill the lich king he would be much more powerful then the burning legion or even the void lords? Damn that would be awesome to server a king that powerful

Aren't the dread lords just apart of the venthyr or w.e I believe there was an audio file that kinda proves it

So.. bigger deal than he already was? :P

Can you imagine barely realizing that Arthas is a big deal ?

So if Arthas was under his influence Sylvanas is too because she didn't like the Lich King but to join the Faction that did this to her... odd.

Look I just want a point where I work for the bad guys as a separate faction , but I know that is just a pipe dream

Well so far we don't see anything hinted about arthas, I have a feeling Blizzard probably just dumped him in the maw and called it a day lol, watch Blizzard justify it saying Arthas is some random shade you interrogated as part of the quest LOL.

I guess Illdan return to stop Arthas return and Thrall dead then go to see his mom and Thrall fucking come back as worldfucker and kill everyone.

Dude!!! Where is sargeras’ hand on the world??? He literally put his hand on the planet Why tf no1 thought at this???

WC3, WC3 TFT, WOTLK, one of Blizzard's most iconic characters. TuRnS oUt hE wAs a BIG DeAL!1!! And then the Angel Uther just proceeds to "GOODBYE, JOJO!" his body to the Maw 😂

when really blizz is doing what wwe does and bringing old characters back to try and sell tickets

Still dont understand this confusing power level blizzard created. Sargeras gave power to Kil'jaeden, than Kil'jaeden created whole concept around lich king, including runes on the Frostmourne. I still dont understand how the fk could we beat Kil' jaeden 2 times if he had the power that even Bastion is afraid of. Still need more information about how is Sargeras connected to the Maw, since he is the one who was the Kil'Jaeden's mentor. Is jailer somehow connected to demons and sargeras? Blizzard will have to give us explanation for it.

2:05 this guy looks better than the actual jailor,i wish this was the villan...not some skinny half naked dude