booooeeeee team dwarves

Are you an immortal?

I would think it would be the other way around cause if your immortal leaving something great behind wouldn't Matter that much compared to a mortal who would want to make something that will stand the test of time.

@@harryhorrocks6030 Typically items that are made with haste are lower quality. It's not that they are intentionally lower quality, rather that they simply don't have the time to craft and refine their skill compared to someone who is immortal. They'll always be limited by their life span. When you are immortal you want the item you craft to survive with you.

@Exotic-ps7vi I'm just using real life for my reasonings. Most people who have lived throughout time have wanted to leave something behind something that will last like the roman emperors did with the aqueducts and so on . The reason why they did this, I think, is to leave behind a legacy because they know they themselves will not last. If you were immortal, where would the incentive come from after so long would anything be worth doing.

I have a similar belief. I think even more then the valar auley... Only feanor made something that morgoth lusted for. The greatest crafter I'd feanor followed by the valar and Meijer. Then I'd say celebrimbor is next then you have the greatest dwarves of which there many. The difference is that the noldor had divine Providence to work with and the dwarves had been born for it.

Quality vs Quantity

totally agree

an elvish warrior used to using quality elvish weapons wouldn’t think less of a quality dwarvish blade made for an elf.

That's exactly how I think of that matter. There were few elves that could match, or outmatch dwarves in the art of craftsmanship, but there were such cases. However when we consider the races as a whole, it's hard to say that elves are better craftsmans than dwarves. Moreover, the most prominent of the elvish works were made with help or knowledge of the Vala or Maia, while the dwarves were able to create wonders without such help and even from "common" materials.

Angrist was forged by Dwarves (Telchar) and was used retrieve the Silmarils of the Elves (Feänor) but was ultimately wielded by Man to unite Beleriand against Morgoth. (Beren) Also, Beren is Aragorn's direct ancestor

Earendil the Halfelven used Vingilot , a ship blessed by Varda the Ainu, to slay Ancalagon the Black commander of the dragons of Morgoth by the help of a Silmaril made by Feanor the Elf

I'm quite sure Tolkien did this on purpose as the perfect symbol of unity of all free peoples. That was a big theme throughout all of LotR, after all.

I dont know why but this actually gave me goosebumps😅

Much the same way Sam and Frodo went into Mordor with items from all races. Dwarf mail, Elf cloaks, blades made by Men and Elves, cookware made by Hobbits.

That's my feeling. The Dwarves are just better at finding the best materials and working those materials into powerful and useful items. But the Elves were better able to put their own essences (their thoughts, ideas, and feelings) into the things they craft. Which is why Sting, Glamdring, and Orchrist glowed in the presence of Orcs; the Elves put their own hatred of the Enemy's creatures into their weapons.

Yeah I was trying to describe my feelings but you did it perfectly. I don't think one is superior, as their fields of focus are very different. Although I also understand that the Silmaril are quite an impressive feat of crafting, considering they can enable you to fly and have all sorts of cool powers. But nothing really beats the sheer grandiosity(?) of Dwarven architects.

@@elrikk3419 Lord of the Rings: Gandalf uses Light-spell once, very low fantasy Lord of the Rings lore: So this dude stuck a gem on his boat and flew through the sky killing dragons with lazer beams

I kinda agree with you. On one hand, the Elves are generally more “metaphysical” than Dwarves, so they could do more “cool magic stuff” than Dwarves. However, one factor to consider is that the Dwarves are really secretive. One of the only Elves to know a lot of the Dwarves and their methods was Eol, and he was also ultra secretive. From what we do know, the Dwarves are very capable of “cool magic stuff” though we just don’t hear of it as much. In the Silmarillion, the Lord of Nogrod curses the treasure of Doriath and Beren throws it in the river, in the “Song of Durin” we read of “runes of power upon the door”; in the Tale of the Nauglafring (early version of the Nauglamir) Mîm curses the treasure of Nargothrond and Thingol (here known as Tinwelint) allows the dwarves to combine this treasure with the Silmaril, but “the Dwarves were full of bitterness, and all its links were twined with baleful thoughts”. If we got a text written by the Dwarves, we’d probably see a lot more cool dwarf magic.

I was in the middle of typing almost this exact sentiment when I noticed this comment; I couldn't have put it better myself.

By Durin, that’s a line!

Krieg doesnt raise regiments, krieg raises armies. Oops wrong setting😉

@@ricardoandre7049 I'm genuinely pleased someone else is a connoisseur of the grim dark. 😏

Bravo on your line about the elves and dwarves! The only way I would modify it would be saying, "The elves equipped heroes. The dwarves equipped ARMIES."

Sauron never made the rings of power? Celimbrimbor did. Sauron made the one ring to rule the others

Hey didn’t you used to be Aule’s apprentice? How’s that going Lol

Gondolin caugh caugh, tell that to the elves of Gondolin lol

This is where I am at personally. Without the magics and ultra-rare materials that came from the Undying Lands or from the Vala, elves were not especially talented. If one is prepared to accept that those things don't necessarily belong to the elves, then one must also accept them inferior to dwarves by ceteris paribus.

@@citizen_wayne Feanor made silima on his own, without any help from Valar. Valar didn’t know what silima was and they weren’t able to recreate it.

@@likac92009 Silima/the silmarils required using power from the Two Trees of Valinor. So, yeah. With help from Vala magics...Closest example so far, but my point still stands.

We have a handful of great crafts of the elves, the greatest crafts of all. But I do think that dwarves as a people rather than individuals are the better craftsmen.

Dwarven Talent vs Elven Skill

Aule was not just the smith of the valar he was the creator of the Dwarves!

Do you think that elves actually /craft/ better items or do they simply "cheat" by having access to magics that dwarves do not? If dwarves could weave magic into their weapons (AKA ceteris paribus), THEN who would be the better crafters?

But the quote at the beginning states that the Dwarves were outmatched in everything, except in the tempering of steel and making chainmail armour. Personally, I think it's important to look at the individuals as well as their species. The greatest craftsmen were exceptional even among their peers.

Of course they had guidance from aule, just as Aule gave them their own unique language. Which they guard & keep so secret

Aule taught the dwarves a whole language, though seldom is it spoken & the dwarves guard it in secrecy! Who knows what Aule taught them as he taught them their 1st language

@@markbritton6798 remember the dwarves we’re never suppose to exist if anything there like a middle child. Usually forgotten unless in trouble lol.

​@@Edisito yes my friend, your right there! but my point was that the Elves were the greatest smiths, or Feanor so says Tolkien himself. And as Eru himself blessed & allowed their creation, Aule almost destroyed his creation,till Eru allowed it?

No they couldn't. ask & il send you Tolkien's explanation to this idiotic question your still debating! you obviously missed my 1st explanation!

@@Edisito That's right, Aule was about to smite them all but for Eru's intervention. Remember Aule wife Yavvana wife created the Ents !, inder similar interests, self self bloody self, that Aule & his missus!

Fake. Not once stated. On the contrary actually.

@@kauetadaieski3131 You're really gargling elves in the comments, bro sucks on their ears in his dreams

Only if the Elves are allowed to enchant their works. Elven works are much weaker on a physical level. it is the Magic which makes them strong. So an Elven artisan would give you a much weaker item than a Dwarf by purely physical means.

Isnt Sauron a miar serving the smith valar? I forget lol. If so, that level of engineering and efficiency would make sense

@@changniere7696 yh he used to follow the smith valar before switching sides.

True, sauron with his industrial knowledge etc , could make morder area into a economic urbanize trade power in the middle earth as the Mass produce capital etc , morder has a industrial with large mass production properties in the northern part , with a inland freshwater sea for Fishing and abundant farming and a desert/semi dusty area that could be used to house the population in morder , if morder mass produce iron they could build skyscrapers and rail lines , with skyscrapers they can have a modern urban feel to it and háve rail lines built going through morder and out to move goods exporting and importing thing and they can use horses, oxen, donkeys and giant goats to pull railcars on tracks which ain't a problem and rail lines make things easier to move alot better even for animals to pull, morder and be a industrial workshop of middle earth and Isangard can too

I agree, Magic weapons & awes inspiring jewels goes to the Elves & Armour & protective fabrics goes to the dwarves.IMO

Yes he was, but a top class jerk tho, but as I said he was great, perhaps the GOAT in fiction

You're excluding Aüle and Sauron right?

@@sachinpandey5090 they were good, but Feanor was the first and the greatest.

@@Sam__The__Slayer feanor was the first? Aule and sauron where created BEFORE middle earth, long before feanor's mother and father bumped uglies

@@yodaslovetoy I know that but architectural master was Feanor, Aule was a Valar a god and Sauron entered way late to create things

this may be one of the best analysis in my opinion

Well the Elves definitely since the beginning had many talents and skills, the Elves already started to develop their skills back at Cuivienen and from then on they would develop further, especially if receiving knowledge (in regards the Noldor) or simply hone their skills on their own (in regards to other kinds of Elves who remained, except for Sindar who received much help from Melian in developing their crafts and also in due time exchanged knowledge, skill and goods with the Dwarves, Sindar though also had skills in various craft, and as we see with Galadhrim of Third Age, even simple elven roper has skill to create ropes of mysterious and cunning workmanship: "And they added also coils of rope, three to each boat. Slender they looked, but strong, silken to the touch, grey of hue like the elven-cloaks. `What are these? ' asked Sam, handling one that lay upon the greensward. `Ropes indeed! ' answered an Elf from the boats. 'Never travel far without a rope! And one that is long and strong and light. Such are these. They may be a help in many needs.' 'You don't need to tell me that! ' said Sam. `I came without any and I've been worried ever since. But I was wondering what these were made of, knowing a bit about rope-making: it's in the family as you might say.' `They are made of hithlain,' said the Elf, `but there is no time now to instruct you in the art of their making. Had we known that this craft delighted you, we could have taught you much. But now alas!" Galadhrim of Lothlorien even seem to have some skill in working stone, as they had stone paved roads and other such structures (though that may be atributed to the influence of the Noldor and tutelage of their craft, though going by texts in the Nature of Middle-earth, even Teleri elves had some basic stone working skill and building skills). The Teleri curiously enough in Tolkien's various texts are mentioned for particular skills in various versions: ""for the Teleri prized silver above gold, and their skill as silversmiths was esteemed even by the Noldor."/" It was a frequent name among the Teleri, who in addition to navigation and ship-building were also renowned as silver- smiths."/"“became the most usual form among the Elves of Valinor, because the Teleri in their lands, to the north of the Noldor, found a great wealth of silver, & became the chief silver-smiths among the Eldar” (Letters 426)

One Valian year was around 9,7 Solar years.

The dwarves are the best

Hi Rebecca! Thanks for watching, my friend. I think I would choose to be a Ranger of the North following Aragorn, living in Evendim near the Lake! How about you?

@@MenoftheWest hey I would be an elleth from mirkwood with legolas or an elf from Rivendale.but my home would be near the forest

If I were to do battle right now and am given a selection of Elven and Dwarven equipment, I would go with Dwarven. Elven things seem to apply best for specific people while Dwarven things seem most practical and universal, if that makes sense. For instance, a trained archer with a bow may be better and more skillful with that bow, but anyone in my army can pick up a crossbow, then point and shoot with high efficiency. The bowman may be better but he is finely attuned to the draw weight, flex, and all around "ability" of that bow. Meanwhile, crossbow Joe can point and shoot effectively with any crossbow he finds. Obviously my analogy is not perfect, amd all archers here may want to argue but that is how I see this

Nobody created Mithril. They just mined it.

I thought Sauron tought THEM ring-making. Remember, Sauron was a disciple of Aule the Smith prior to defecting to Morgoth's side (as was Saruman).

Sauron taught celebrimbor and the elves

@@30noir thanks for the correction

@@Thomas.Wright you are right thanks my mistake

Same I’ve loved them since I first discovered Tolkien, purely for the aesthetic. Then I learned about Gotrek Gurnisson from the Realmslayer audio dramas, and the character made me realize why I love them so much: they have a boisterous, bombastic approach to life, a love of strong drink and fierce battles and a fierce, diamond-hard dedication to their friends and loved ones.

Not sure about money, but In Deep Geek has done videos on the economy's of the different races in the Lord of the Rings. They are quite interesting I would highly recommend them. 👌

Most of the trade in the West was by barter. The more urban areas like Fornost Erain, Khazad-Dum, Osgiliath, Ost-in-Edhil, Minas Anor and Ithil and Tharbad, used the coin of the realm in copper, silver, gold, and (until 1980 TA) mithril. I would imagine the relative worth of Mithril got a boost after Numenor went into the drink and and even bigger bump after Durin's Bane silenced the gnats who woke him up with their endless ringing picks. By the time the Fellowship was formed, Mithril was worth over 100x more than gold. Other than that comparison, I cannot recall Tolkien mentioning the relative value of other metals or their value as coinage.

@@Historic_Entertainment Yeah watched his videos and I was just curious if they was anymore info, or even just to get Yostens view of it.

"But did Tolkien go into detail like how George R.R Martin did with currency?" No, he was busy creating languages and other important things.

The references to money are in the Lotr narrative itself, we have the silver pennies being used in Eriador (Shire and Bree-land) plus the general mention of the 'gold pieces' so simply put gold and silver coins are used. “Ass! Fool! Thrice worthy and beloved Barliman!” said I. It’s the best news I have had since Midsummer; it’s worth a gold piece at least. May your beer be laid under an enchantment of surpassing excellence for seven years” said I.” ... "Bill Ferny's price was twelve silver pennies; and that was indeed at least three times the pony's value in those parts. It proved to be a bony, underfed, and dispirited animal; but it did not look like dying just yet. Mr. Butterbur paid for it himself, and offered Merry another eighteen pence as some compensation for the lost animals. He was an honest man, and well-off as things were reckoned in Bree; but thirty silver pennies was a sore blow to him, and being cheated by Bill Ferny made it harder to bear." Fellowship of the Ring In the fragment of writing within HoME which was one of the drafts that apparently was supposed to be inserted into appendices we have this particular reference (but mind that in terms of linguistics it's also early draft): "Similarly farthing has been used for the four divisions of the Shire, because the Hobbit word tharni was an old word for 'quarter' seldom used in ordinary language, where the word for 'quarter' was tharantin 'fourth part'. In Gondor tharni was used for a silver coin, the fourth part of the castar (in Noldorin the canath or fourth part of the mirian)." HoME XII (Side note: Noldorin seems to be precursor of Sindarin in later version of legendarium) In The Hobbit we also have the golden coins (particularly the hoard of treasure in Troll cave are mostly gold coins). "There were bones on the floor and a nasty smell was in the air; but there was a good deal of food jumbled carelessly on shelves and on the ground, among an untidy litter of plunder, of all sorts from brass buttons to pots full of gold coins standing in a corner." Obviously there are more references to money in general, but it seems obvious that the coins and precious metals they were made of, were the standard, the basis of the worth of monetary exchange in Middle-earth, obviously the examples of other arrangments like barter, but gold is quite often the means, the Esgaroth the Lake-town obviously would work on monetary economy as well: "The Master of the town sprang from his great chair. ... giving his mind to trade and tolls, to cargoes and gold, to which habit he owed his position." Yes it is also seen on example of Azog that even Orcs know and acknowledge the worth of money, they too desire treasures etc. Azog purse: "A small bag struck him. It held a few coins of little worth." One can imagine that the Orcs could potentially engaged in some trade among themselves, or with the renegades of various other races, precious metals as always would be medium of exchange heh Orcs probably had their 'black market' ;) hehe, though in their societies it probably came down to plunder and loot being distributed along the strongest warriors (we also hear of Orcs receiving sometimes some pay especially for job well done, though in what form is unknown). We know that in the time when Moria and it's mines were active the worth of mithril was "Its worth was ten times that of gold, and now it is beyond price; for little is left above ground, and even the Orcs dare not delve here for it. The lodes lead away north towards Caradhras, and down to darkness." Trade in general is often mentioned in various writings, even money lending is sometimes mentioned, in The Hobbit we have examples of that, borrowing money: "“All the same, I should like it all plain and clear,” said [Bilbo] obstinately, putting on his business manner (usually reserved for people who tried to borrow money off him)..."/"Altogether those were good days for us, and the poorest of us had money to spend and to lend, and leisure to make beautiful things just for the fun of it, ..." Whether this sort of practice was common place we can't say, though it probably was not like usury or anything like that, unless of course it was part of the economies of developed societies and kingdoms we simply don't hear of it much. Precious metals appear to be the basis, the 'gold standard' so to speak :), silver was more common no doubt though there seems to be lot of gold in circulation as well. We don't know who exactly minted coins, though most likely it came from multiple sources, the old currency of Arnor, the Dwarves and obviously the Numenoreans in their realms always did so, in organized kingdoms with administration etc. one would need such solutions. So to summarize the currency used by Hobbits in the Shire, (which was also used in Bree) is more or less 'silver penny' and gold coins. Hobbits definitely seem to have thriving trade with all the references: “The purchase of provisions fell almost to nothing throughout the district in the ensuing weeks; but as Bilbo’s catering had depleted the stocks of most stores, cellars and warehouses for miles around, that did not matter much.” … “The next day more carts rolled up the Hill, and still more carts. There might have been some grumbling about ‘dealing locally’, but that very week orders began to pour out of Bag End for every kind of provision, commodity, or luxury that could be obtained in Hobbiton or Bywater or anywhere in the neighbourhood.”

But Jay Foreman says that Yorkshire doesn't exist!

@@qwertyTRiG I don't know who this person is, sorry.

@@DanceySteveYNWA Look for the video "English counties explained". It's informative and funny.

@@qwertyTRiG not really interested in historical British geography, and it's ever changing borders. Thanks anyway dude.

😂 them scary ballista

Yup Narsil made by the dwarves broke like glass under Saurons foot? Thats shoddy goods for you! Like that repro stuff they sell in the shire! "Pun from movie" Till the Elves mended it Properly? Lets not forget that the sword was said to shine with light like the sun so maybe the dwarves knew some magic too?