A black legion vs red corsairs raider style chaos war between each other while the imperium is busy dealing with different xenos threats would be awesome.

So long as the black legion dont ask the Red corsairs to pay taxes im sure they will get along

I'd like to see a brief conflict between the two, just to show how awesome Huron is and to let the GW writers actually show why Abaddon is in charge.

I love the idea of a chaos civil war if it includes a loyalist primarch coming out the warp with a prevervbial steel chair.

The chaos gods: "You can do this Huorn my boy"....A few moments later at the bookmaker.."All souls on Abaddon!"

Reminder from the Badab War, the Astral Claws were adept at playing with geneseed. So not impossible that they have managed to maintain a relatively pure reserve and growing it further with raids. During the Badab War they, from casualty reports, numbered over 6000 marines, built up over the span of just a few centuries, while not arousing suspiscions for multiple of those.

In terms of ship numbers, the Red Corsairs are reported to surpass any other chaos warband/legion. I would imagine in a space battle the Red Corsairs would have an edge, not just in numbers but experience as well. The Black Legion meanwhile would have an edge in the number of Astartes (not to mention all the other warbands they've essentially vassalized) they could deploy. Abaddon would likely want to either ambush the Red Corsairs (and overwhelm with boarding actions) or force them into a conflict planet side where he could grind them down.

The simplest solution for the Imperium is to tell Ghazghull that Yarricks killer is amongst those two warbands. That would make one hell of a scrap.

A teamup between Perturabo and the corsairs to smash the black legion would be legendary

The Night Lords wanting desperately to smash the little familiar skittering along Huron's back was a great part of the trilogy.

Kinda curious if either of them are gonna try to deal with the nids. Cause I doubt Abby is gonna take the idea of the bugs denying him his vengance and crown well.

As much as these two may hate each other, they are technically allies. I doubt either one would be foolish enough to start a war with the other until after their common enemies are dealt with.

If there is no plot armor involved then my money is on the Corsairs for one reason. In the Night Lords stories they were used by both sides. Abaddon used them as grunts and nothing else while Huron utilized them as they were designed to be. Infiltration terror units.

Huron is a man who can come back from nothing and with his pact with the Dark Powers grant him strength above strength. As long as he keeps delivering and and never gives in I believe he will forever fight on until his death. I can see him ascending as a true champion of Chaos Undivided.

To be honest it's unlikely these two fight one another as long as Imperium still strong, they can't afford to be weakened while Imperium seeks to wipe them out .

He only killed Sigismund while wearing terminator armor with Horus' claws and Sigismund was literally aged 1000 years. While Abaddon was basically only a few years (due to warp whateverness) older.

Blackheart was known in Badab for hiding his strengths, tiger claws into astral claws anyone, and this strategy probably deepened in his fall to chaos. Any projections of the red corsair's strength I will conservatively add 30% to that.

The Red Corsairs have amazing leadership in organisation, cohesion and tactics. It's no wonder many flock to their banners, success breeds success.

It would be satisfying for Huron to call out abbadon on all his failures before ripping out his hearts with his power claw where sigismund failed in his strikes upon them.

I'd like to see Huron just steal one of Abaddons best ships, while just waving and going "You'll remember this day as the day you almost capture Captain Huron Blackheart"

Abaddon and Huron are an interesting study in contrasts. On the surface they're both brutal warlords and conquerers, each the undisputed lord of a legion's worth of traitor Astartes who pose terrible threats to the galaxy as a whole. But Abaddon's all about the long game, he's the man destined to tear down the Emperor and His Imperium so he can conquer it for himself, as he feels is his right. A true visionary, in his own awful way. Huron however seems to be a lot more materially concerned and doesn't seem to care as much about the whole Long War business, as much as he is about expanding and ruling his own empire around the Maelstrom. The man holds giant festivals where he gives away entire armies to aspiring champions, all for the sake of his massive ego, for pities' sake. And while Abaddon is the closest thing to royalty among the old traitor legions (relatively speaking of course, many among them hate his guts), Huron is a jumped up Noveau Riche by comparison, held in contempt by a lot of the old guard in the traitor legions, though as much tinged with envy as it is scorn. I'd like to see the dynamic between these two explored further, I feel like there's a lot of fun to be had looking at how these two would go forward interacting with one another, especially given the insanity and mayhem sweeping the galaxy at the moment. Could lead to an interesting shift in the balance of power between them depending on how things turn out...

Personally I would love to see a Chaos civil war. It would shake the setting up and I would love to see some of the Traitor Legions pick sides.

I'm amazed that that's Samoa Joe's voice right there.

Alright, this whole scuffle could end three ways: 1. Abaddon kills Huron and GW kills yet another bloved Chaos character for the sake of the plot. 2. Huron kills Abaddon and takes control of the greatest Chaos force in the Galaxy (but it's _very_ unlikely to happen). 3. Abaddon defeats and shames Huron to keep him at his side as an underling. A tactically sound choice, and quite plausible given Abaddon's respect for strength and warrior's honor. This would actually improve Abaddon's character in my eyes.

I am glad to hear your voice once more! Huron will always be more interesting to me than Abby, he just has too much plot armor

This actually seems like an amazing premise for a new Crusade book. Huron gets whispers from his familiar that Abaddon's collaboration with Vashtorr has harmed his favor with the Gods, and so Huron gets the idea that the position of Warmaster is up for grabs, so now they duke it out, and all the other Chaos Legions get to have a big brawling jamboree that's different from their typical infighting born from the Great Game. Maybe Vashtorr being tied up in the Pariah Nexus could justify why the Red Corsairs have more of an edge.

Abaddon keeps forgetting his title is based off might, he has to actually stay above and beyond to be the Leader.

Love it! It's like and old school 40k theories!! We want more!!

Huron and Abaddon will fuse together. The magma of our soul burns with a mighty flame! Super Ultra Combining: Huron Abaddon!! Do the impossible See the invisible Raw! raw! Fight the power! Touch the untoucheable Break the unbreakable Raw! raw! Fight the power!

Samoa Joe?! Wow! Didn't see that coming. I knew he was a gamer, but didn't know he was into 40k.

The High Lords putting the Astral Claws in charge of Maelstrom highly suggests that they are either Imperial Fists or most likely Ultramarine stock. Though them going after White Scars homeworld may, I stress may suggest they are in fact distant White Scar successors. Though I have always felt that Blackheart has been in GW's back pocket should Abaddon prove less than profitable. Now that I think it about it, that makes GW sound like the 4 Chaos Gods themselves.

"Bested Sigismund" Yes, that's what we'll call Failbaddon's ass kicking vs a 1000 year old slow Sigismund.

HURON! HURON! HE'S OUR MAN! IF HE CAN'T DO IT, NO ONE CAN! probably.

Love the new vid & intro! Glad to see a new vid again!

Abaddon " I want a casualty report!!" "Dave has a nose bleed sir" lol

In the maelstrom Huron: allright gentlemen, thank you for joining me on our pre civil war seminar. You will find our battleplans on chapter 3,as the first 2 is a foreword from traitor astartes. Now,for the worshipers of chaos,we are not going to constantly worship,we have sermons held every few days on weekends. Deal with it. Now,is everyone in agreement on putting abbadon on his ass? Red corsairs:YEAH! Huron:now,if we face abbadon,i want snipers trained to put bullets in him 1st chance given. Aditionaly i want sorcerers ready to bind him,while my honor guard,and our more stealthly inclined marines will go fo the kill. In the warp Tzeench:...holy fuck this man is good. ...why is that a good and surprisingly well thought out plan??

Abaddon has too many packs with other warbands as well as daemons. Tho while there are imperial necks to slit dealing with Huron is probably an afterthought, one that may come back to bite him, but still an afterthought.

Haven't the White Scars stalled the advance of the Red Corsairs? If a single chapter of the sons of the Khagan have stopped the Corsairs, what hope does Huron have against the warmaster?

Huron: The Tax Evader vs Abaddon the Despoiler

Would be fitting that the Huron the "son of guiliman" (his geneseed) being the arch tratior who rivals Guiliman. Just like Horus to The Emperor

Emperor be Praised! A 40k Theories video.

Now I want to see Abaddon do maths on how hes gonna win between him and Huron just like Scott Steiner did.

Two videos in one day. AWESOME!

Love the new introduction Rem!

This would be a cool direction for the lore, and it would make sense that chaos factions would quarrel rather than always be harmonious buddies all the time - but I don't give the writers credit to ever do anything like this. I get the impression ever lore decision they make is towards everything stacking up against the Imperium, and being the most serious threat it can be for them to deal with. It's generally rare to see any faction be an antagonist to anything other than the Imperium, much less to be one to itself.

I think, a war for the titel of warmaster would be a bit refreshing. I was never a big fan of failbaddon, mainly because the fantasy "equivalent" has shown more than enough how its done, and because i cant quite ignore the fact that Abby is still only a space marine, buffed up by all chaos gods. Now imagine one of the unaligned primarchs getting that treatment. Technically they already are buffed by becoming demon princes, but come on man, they are or should be way more competent in every way, even before demonhood and everything. So still, even after reading all the lore about it, i still dont get why he is the warmaster.

I imagine a lot of the other chaos forces and their Primarchs would love Abaddon to be embarrassed by Huron.

Whenever Huron has a good idea at the Chaos Meeting: "The intern has a point."

Two @40kTheories videos in one night? Praise the Emperor!

Dont underestimate Huron. He showed himself to be quite capable during the Badab War. I also wonder if Abbadon would take a conflict with Huron seriously enough to fully mobilize his full strength. I also see Huron as being the instigator in such a conflict and would have a plan of action for it.

The Black Legion numbers remind me of every juvenile delinquent who wears gang colors. The novels have said that Abaddon doesn't really "command their loyalty", but instead they go along for hopes of loot or an opportunity to get something else out of it. He doesn't exercise authoritative control of the whole body, many wouldn't even come of he asked. A lot of his number at more loyal to warband, unit commander, or chaos god.

The intro has improved a lot over the years.

Tying up Chaos’ forces while the Imperium is having a bad time, seems like a decent way of stalling chaos before 11th Edition.

I love your line delivery.

The black Legion has a larger force compared to the red corsairs, as stated in Blood Reaver, Talos stated to Huron that his forces are comparable or 2nd to the black Legion.

Abaddon has the support of the demon primarchs and I doubt that huorn would be able to get that...mortarion would smoke Huorn in one of his incense burners, magnus would turn him into a fancy book cover, angron would mash him into smooth Red paste and fulgrim would show Huorn what he hides in the bottom drawer of his nightstand

Great vid!

God imagine how metal the art from their factions fighting would look

I'd honestly like to see a conversation between Guilliman and Huron. Considering how G was treated on his return, i could see an offer of forgiveness and bringing back to the fold. Huron is kinda like G anyway considering how he was conducting himself before his own fall.

The Battle of Lupercal's Bastards.

To witness these two forces combat one another would be interesting, to what levels would they devolve into. Even more so if the Orks have any say about it

Chaos gods, Gork and Mork, Eldar gods away from Slaaneesh, and The Emperor: Damn Khorne you are a genius to set this fight

I’m sort of coin-flipping on either faction maintaining such a massive growth. Given that the Black Legion has and assumedly continues to draw on recruits via subordinating other warbands and alliances with the remaining Traitor Legions to supplement their numbers where the Red Corsairs draw more from Renegade Chapters, defectors from other warbands and geneseed theft. I can certainly buy the Red Corsairs having superior genestock considering the purity of geneseed they have access to, alongside their own having less long-term corruption having spent less than 2,000 years in and around the Maelstrom compared to the 10,000 years spent in the Eye of Terror, but I don’t really buy their numbers growing so exponentially solely on the basis of defection and suborning Renegade Chapters.

I never thought about this situation but it does makes sense, it's building it self up to a massive Class. Great work as always!

I know you've been dying to do this one Rem! Huron is definitely more interesting compared to Abaddon and definitely more fun but you absolutely nailed the comparisons between the two. I'd love to see this conflict become a reality but I'm sure GW won't move on it. #TeamHuron 🤘

New intro music is awesome!

...Huron doesn't need plott armor to be capable ( even Night Lords were able to work with him to great effect). Abbadon is also more careless in terms of losses, & that doesn't do much for the loyalty of one's forces.

Great Video 👍

GW does not take lore in logical directions, We thought that there would be a clash between Angron and Ghazghkull as well.

I think it'd break the setting if there was a showdown and they calmly negotiate that Abaddon head toward Terra while Huron wrecks face elsewhere. Would love to see Huron unlock the blackstone fortress, be the ex machina that saves Guilliman somehow, then leave as the news filters through to G-man that terra has fallen.

I'm waiting for the point at the height of the battle where Huron shouts a one liner about being harmless, and abbadons whole arm and power claw just FUCKING FALLS OF NO MATTER HOW DEEP I PINNED IT OR HARD I GLUED IT... Sorry, think I had a flashback for a second then, what was I saying?

Awesome, I'm glad we are talking about the Red Corsairs again

I think the winner would be... Drach'nyen. Because it will probably end up in the hands of whoever comes out on top anyway.

First i still need to be convinced that abbadon the armless is actually a threat

That chaos gate music. Oof 👌🏻 perfect.

It would be nice to see Abaddon get kicked down a peg or two. Especially after what he did to the Nightlords.

Despite being on almost as much life support as The Big E, I feel Huron should replace Failbaddon. I mean he actually knows how to use the Legions to their strengths. Best example being using the Night Lords to use their terror tactics, rather than as Frontline fighters like Failbaddon did.

Honestly it's kinda like that Season 3 episode of The Boondocks. "Hateocracy" there's a line in there that sums up a LOT of Chaos Warbands in a nutshell: "Now we hated each other right away! ...But we hated everyone else even more!" That's basically it. Plus, they both know that they'd be risking a LOT for very little gain. Huron basically said in that quote "Try me, b*tch." Whilst putting a hand on the hilt of his weapon.

Always felt like Abaddon was an Archaon the Everchosen-wannabe. He's got heavy plot armor, a big fated ultrastrong demon sword, gifts from the gods and stuff. Huron feels like an evil but cunning and selfish bastard that's clever enough to fully use the strengh of OTHER chaos legions not like Abaddon who's like "I am strong and i use MY brute strenght to crush you". I'd frankly prefer to have Huron as leader as i feel we'd see chaos in a way better way, like each legions/warband, used to their fullest being raw violence, warp power, psychological warfare and stuff.

My issue with giving estimate of a faction's density is that James Workshop absolutely sucks at consistency and will only use numbers that adventages their storytelling. As such, estimating the progress of the raid corsair's size in the future is pointless in my opinion because it's actually impossible to accurately predict

Legion size could mean anything from the under 10k pf the Emperor's Children/Thousand Sons, to the hundred k and up of the Ultramarines/Word Bearers, I mean the Black Templars have been called legion sized so....

Oooh, like the new music!

These read like Dr Evil type stories with maniacal laughter and twirling moustaches.

4:40 Huron and his red coursairs are an independent Chaos faction in their own right. 6:17 [Huron Quote] damn he's not loyal to Abadon at all. 16:48 The Hamadria is such a weird demon, is it Chaos Undivided.

Huron has some Ultramarine plot armour so it's a close fight

new intro, sweet

I thought I remembered the Word Bearers having close to 250,000 legionaires before the heresy.

We NEED this to happen

You forget that the time in the eye of terror runs differently.

YO THE NEW OPENING! Thats fucking sick. Its a bit weird seeing that instead of the old one, its still epic.

I like your voice and your 40k videos

I generally like Huron more as a character and I like the overall look of the Red Corsairs, but Abbadon would probably win, mostly because of plot armor.

Imagine if Huron replaces Abbadon as Warmaster

It would really depend on which could rally the most marines behind himself. We know that all the original traitor legions would fall in behind Abaddon. And having just the iron warriors and death guard alone would definitely tip the scales towards Abaddon. As well as Abaddon is now working with Vashtor. As much as i hate him, i see Abaddon winning

The conflict would completely ravage the Sugma system...

New music is dope

I've always brought up this conflict that I would love to see play out. I feel like Huron is a much better big baddy personally. Even if Abby would come out on top, it would be a great story opportunity & some story growth for the traitors.

A fight between them would be a perfect time for the Lion to strike and cripple the forces of both.

Oh man, I NEED that Abaddon vs Huron art. That's Eliphas', right? Got a link to the full image please?

One thing that I think it's important to note about the growth of the Black Legion compared to the Red Corsairs is that the Black Legion has fought 12 black cursades against the imperium, which I think it is safe to say, are far higher in intensity and casualties than most of the conflicts the Red Corsairs have fought against the imperium, excluding their invasion fo the White Scars homeworld of course. Due to the casualities the Black Legion has substained during its Black Cursades I don't think it's safe to say that it took them 10000 years to get to their current strength. Though we don't have any sources on it I think it's within the relm of possibility that when the first Black Cursade happened the Black Legion may have had similar numbers compared to what they have now and as the first black crusade only happened 1000 years after the Horus Heresy then that would put the Black Legion at a similar growth rate as the Red Corsairs. Edit: Even if the Black Legion was smaller during the 1st Black Crusade I still think it's safe to say that it didn't take 10000 years to for them to reach their current size. While it still may be true that the Red Corsairs do have the advantage in terms of growth speed, the gap may not be as big as 8x.