Are Sacramentalists and Confessionalists better with Christian Americanism than Mega-Church Gurus?
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@GrimGriz 12 күн бұрын
You're allowed ONE video per week on Vacation. ONE. Make it count. Your other vacation responsibilities supersede.
@PaulVanderKlay 12 күн бұрын
I'm going to be taking video anyway. Why not share!
@GrimGriz 12 күн бұрын
@@PaulVanderKlay consider not. Consider gazing upon antiquity without cell or lens between you - deeply feel it and such, then give confession of that feel in a vidya shot from the hotel :)
@sunrhyze 12 күн бұрын
You want him not to be able to sleep at night? "I think, therefore I post videos." 😁
@elektrotehnik94 12 күн бұрын
I'm strongly with Griz on this one. ❤️ 1 video a week. Let it simmer. Frequent videos --> shallow, short-term processing --> NOT what the best of Italy is about. I have been plenty in Italy, I speak from experience (I live in neighbouring Slovenia). Enjoy it, embody it; allow it to flow through you. Let the right brain take the wheel. ❤️🏆❤️
@_BirdOfGoodOmen 11 күн бұрын
This is Pastor Paul's influencer arc :)
@grailcountry 12 күн бұрын
God is not "at the top of the hierarchy", he is the hierarchy, for he is the arche of all things, If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there. This is why we keep getting the hierarchy conversation wrong. Sitting atop the hierarchy is human thing, and it's a subtle form of idolatry.
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
Jesus warned about egotistical party animals.
@comeintotheforest 12 күн бұрын
If you’re orthodox, you think that. That’s the metaphysical position of what is ultimately a very small group of people among the followers of Christ. A western reading of Maximus the Confessor’s metaphysics doesn’t place the Logos/logoi in any kind of grand hierarchical structure.
@grailcountry 12 күн бұрын
@@williambranch4283 ?
@grailcountry 12 күн бұрын
@@comeintotheforest Your comment is somewhat ambiguous. It's not clear what you think I am saying, especially given that I am not Orthodox, so it makes it seems as if you think I am defending hierarchy, as generally conceived, which is precisely what I am not doing.
@comeintotheforest 12 күн бұрын
@@grailcountrya lot of misunderstandings happen in KZfaq comment sections, this is probably just another one of those.
@Ben..... 12 күн бұрын
Paul don't make videos out of any perceived "need" on vacation in Italy. you may only see Rome once.
@TheDrb27 12 күн бұрын
I’m hoping the KZfaqr messaging you about JBP is Redeemed Zoomer. When you talked about being surprised about what videos take off , I feel much the same with just leaving comments on any social media platform.
@regpharvey 12 күн бұрын
5:25 Bingo. Smith's apparent assertion that Evangelicals should simply trade in clericalism for credentialism was very curious considering the current institutional landscape.
@pricklypear6298 12 күн бұрын
37:21 a charismatic handsome priest in SoCal walking on $250k marble floors giving a tour of his facilities to group of online strangers brought together by a French Canadian, a Zen Neoplatonist, and a third gen Dutch pastor
@stevemcgee99 12 күн бұрын
The “big box” is virtual. Like an apostle coming through your town for a while. But the (Orthodox) church is personal and depends on the participation of the people there. At least that’s how I understand it.
@alohm 12 күн бұрын
I liken this discussion to something I have noticed in Therapy. A therapist will adopt a new term, or go all in on a therapy - and state that is the solution to all that ails us.. Like Trauma informed mindfulness, or Trauma sensitive Mindfulness, Or VanDerKolz's rapid eye movement, or IFS Schwartz's Gestalt... Term wars is what I call it. The solution is not one, or some, but all. We must try them on for size, since we are the arbiters of value/meaning. It is us that defines, we are the one to embrace the path with devotion. As Jung said all his patients with an unattributed malaise were cured when they adopted a religious view in life. It it not the religion: it is the religioso and the religio...
@rooderoo12 12 күн бұрын
When I was at Calvin, I played in a Medieval/ Renaissance music ensemble called the Collegium Musicum. The troubadours in the group had to drop one of their songs because they took a jab at Leo Peters and his views on evolution. All in good fun. Incidentally, I think Leo Peters invented the color of oleo.
@amurdo4539 12 күн бұрын
@8:00 Hasn't all food undergone a sort of protestant reformation? Is there any such thing as "pure" or original food?
@GrimGriz 12 күн бұрын
Americanism is already a magic word, might wanna check with your use's alignment with Smedley Butlers ;)
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
Got United Fruit?
@corykobel6117 11 күн бұрын
Ole Smedley!
@Neal_Daedalus 12 күн бұрын
I think there’s a direct inverse correlation between, “getting what I want, or aiming to get what I want in the regular world, the regular culture” and church engagement. I know this point has been made before, but it’s something like hope that is placed at the hands of people (world) vs hope that is placed at the hands of God. Difficult for people to be willing to “give up everything” and follow.
@Neal_Daedalus 12 күн бұрын
It’s only in these situations that the thoughts out of many hearts are revealed
@pizzapractice9128 12 күн бұрын
Looking forward to the Italy posts! Went there 8 years ago with my wife before we had kids.
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
Ciao!
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
"I have no idea what makes a good video" Authenticity. "I am running the worst KZfaq channel around" See above. "I am just bumping along here" Uh-huh. Keep it up, you're doin' great! =)
@alohm 12 күн бұрын
7:58 I Have mentioned the cult of personality and the same danger of party politics. This has been a real issues with Canadian politics and society as a whole, for decades even? We are heard beasts and we use the excuse that higher order thinking is hard - and allow others to define our opinions(doxia) when one the only truly harmful barriers to our agency is to give it away...
@Corner_Citizen 12 күн бұрын
Pretty simple TBH Go to a plant-only carnivore diet
@_BirdOfGoodOmen 12 күн бұрын
The best route is a carnivore-only plant diet. BRB ordering Venus fly traps
@Neal_Daedalus 12 күн бұрын
A cannibal who only eats vegans.
@stevemcgee99 12 күн бұрын
Carnivores eat concentrated plants.
@ProfesserLuigi 12 күн бұрын
@@_BirdOfGoodOmenMaybe you can eat plants grown on only meat based compost?
@GrimGriz 12 күн бұрын
I'm 2 minutes in and Aaron Renn hasn't looked happy about it the whole time
@regpharvey 12 күн бұрын
He pretty much always looks that way.
@anselman3156 12 күн бұрын
Megachurch, Evangelical and even Protestant can be too sweeping terms covering a variety of different tendencies in the American religious scene. I think there may be a basic divide between, on the one hand, large churches with celebrity pastors which are along the lines of Calvinist and Baptist tradition, and, on the other, the megachurches with celebrity pastors who are in the charismatic/word of faith/prosperity gospel tradition which has its roots in occultism and can be very heretical in their view of God and of man. Some of the worst examples of the latter type are critiqued in the YT channel The Messed Up Church. Latest videos on "celebrity super pastors" and how they all promote one another.
@Intellectual-Myopia 10 күн бұрын
Celebrity pastors promoting one another? Not too dissimilar from the circle-grifting going on in the corner.
@fatherbigmac 12 күн бұрын
24:40 "High churches maintain themselves through their practices. Which practices?" Certainly male clergy. That fight is important.
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
Highly symbolic liturgy IMO, is enhancing no matter who the celebrant is or who the recipient is ;-)
@fatherbigmac 12 күн бұрын
@@williambranch4283 hard disagree.
@stevemcgee99 12 күн бұрын
Do all high churches maintain confession?
@fatherbigmac 12 күн бұрын
@@stevemcgee99 Good question. Seems pretty common, even some Lutherans do it.
@corykobel6117 11 күн бұрын
@@williambranch4283 That's a bit of a contradiction in terms. Highly symbolic liturgy REQUIRES very specific limits on who the celebrant and recipients are. By definition, everything is meticulous or it isn't highly symbolic.
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
"Anarchy - you don't hold to any principles, and authoritarianism - you must do as you're told, with whatever new rules people come up with" Are these guys with Abide? Abide is doing God's work against this kind of corruption.
@lloydhemstreet3226 12 күн бұрын
Abide has several visible personalities, but there is no “cult” of personality I have seen visible at all. At our conventions, we sit under one another’s sermons, and weigh each message to God’s Word and our Confessions.
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
@@lloydhemstreet3226 Could you get in touch with Redeemed Zoomer? He is in urgent need of assistance / advice / prayer, as his denomination goes through the same thing that CRC just went through. People have asked whether _Abide_ should shut down, or risk facing "St. George in Retirement" syndrome but that doesn't apply here, as far as I can see. There is definitely more than one kingdom afflicted with the same kind of dragons, who could use your support. =)
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
@@lloydhemstreet3226 Ha, OK, just got onto the Abide website, and there you feature a video with RZ from back in February. Good to know you're in touch. =) Good to know that KZfaq is too late. =D
@Subvisual 12 күн бұрын
Pastors giving life advice in less traditional areas strikes me as more of a pull effect than a push one. Like you noted "experts" and institutions have their reputations (justifiably) in the garbage. People (especially young men) want life advice and role models and will search them out.
@mcmosav 12 күн бұрын
14:07 oh really? He finds a book entitled “radical” a bit nutty? He’s right about the dynamics but the milk toast intelligencia always tempts me towards an absurdism pointed directly at their sense of decorum. And everytime I give into the temptation i find that scripture has beat me too it. The law increases the trespass. I don’t think these guys would be baptized by John the Baptist… (because he was baptist)
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
"increase the trespass" ... creates a guilty conscience.
@TristanRiter 12 күн бұрын
Hagia Sofia and Notre Dame aren't 'Big Box'? As a recent ortho convert, I see striking similarities..
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
Basilica = original big box ;-)
@TristanRiter 12 күн бұрын
Or first temple?
@stevemcgee99 12 күн бұрын
The priests are not entertaining the congregation.
@TristanRiter 12 күн бұрын
@@stevemcgee99 pastor entertainers are only one aspect of big box, is my understanding...
@chrishuber9448 12 күн бұрын
I’m not sure Ortho and Catholics are that much stronger than Protestants on YT. It may just be what the algorithm shows you. Elevation Church, for example, has 3 million subscribers. I don’t know who TD Jakes is, but he has almost 3 million as well. Just not in my circle.
@ProfesserLuigi 12 күн бұрын
I think Paul needs to specify what he means by Protestants being ineffectual(or less effectual) on youtube.
@ericschlukebir4194 11 күн бұрын
you blew passed it pretty quickly, but that observation about the "exvangelical" books coming mostly from big box megachurches is really interesting to me when thinking about the Chris Green video. I wonder if there is something about people growing up in a church that is primarily a community (even if much is flawed) that sticks a little deeper and helps people find their way to something better. But the more your experience of church is personality driven and the more church/Bible/Jesus looks like a means towards wealth and fame the easier it is to toss the whole thing out. It's a lot easier for someone who grows up like Chris did to get to a place to say, "they got a lot wrong, but they really believed something was real, and they were doing the best they could." It's a lot harder to dismiss the failures of the big box megachurches. They know exactly what they are doing and they are leaning into it.
@jasons4139 12 күн бұрын
Wait a minute, did I just hear pushback against Cult of Personality and in the next breath promoted KZfaq subscriber only content. Make it make sense.
@WhiteStoneName 12 күн бұрын
24:20 confessions must be held *iconically*. And therefore, kinda not confessionally. Symbols, not confessions. Edit: this has always been my point on the distinction.
@stevemcgee99 12 күн бұрын
I am an icon of the confession (right?)
@WhiteStoneName 12 күн бұрын
@@stevemcgee99 ummm. I don’t think so. Or I don’t know what you mean. Probably the latter.
@stevemcgee99 11 күн бұрын
@@WhiteStoneName my writing is unclear. I mean, how I live my life and how salvation works is shown through me. See me, and I am an icon of the faith I confess.
@tytyvyllus8298 12 күн бұрын
Amused by the idea of popes as charismatic leaders. Trying to think of any with charisma... Maybe JPII? Urban II?
@markweswhit869 9 күн бұрын
Found this really interesting 🤔. “The Return of Orthodox Protestantism” is a movie I’d like to watch. (I’ve been catechised, when I hear “Cult of Personality” the Living Colour song immediately comes to mind 🙂)
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
PVK gives laity a peak behind the pulpit. Gorilla Guru is the leader of Simian Better Together ;-)
@jasonrodneypnw 12 күн бұрын
14:10 what a strange take on Radical / David Platt. I wonder how accurate Miles Smith's project is given Chris Green's point about simplification of complex things.
@alohm 12 күн бұрын
7:40 john 5.6 King James Bible When Jesus saw him lie, and knew that he had been now a long time in that case, he saith unto him, Wilt thou be made whole?
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
"We're not confessional, we're constitutional" That's a heresy then, isn't it?
@comeintotheforest 12 күн бұрын
That H word gets used very lightly in these circles
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
@@comeintotheforest Sometimes the situation measures up to examples from the past. Donatism sets a pretty low bar.
@samuelewing8935 12 күн бұрын
Eh... IDK I can't speak for the LeHayes specifically but evangelicals definitely didn't invent the holy men as romantic/marital guide idea. In fact while some religions emphasize it more or less it's one of the most universally common threads of religious practice from pre-Christian fertility cults to modernist self help groups like NXVM.
@thekalezelden 12 күн бұрын
Be careful in Rome. You may be tempted to swim the Tiber. The city houses some potent magic.
@Phlebas9202 12 күн бұрын
PVK's whole life has been an inoculation against that magic. Just see how he reacted to the Trenham marbles.
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
Isn't there something called "Jerusalem Syndrome" too?
@sunrhyze 12 күн бұрын
@@Phlebas9202 "Trenham marbles" 🤣🤣
@Phlebas9202 12 күн бұрын
@@sunrhyze I thought that was a pretty good joke for a trip to Rome ;) Rome's gaudy constructions have no power here. Deep down CRC are nature lovers.
@corykobel6117 11 күн бұрын
@@Phlebas9202 I'm susceptible to the CathoDoxMagic, but I was unimpressed by the Trenham welcome. The church itself though, gorgeous. Distinction between the man and his marbles. 😉
@pigetstuck 12 күн бұрын
"big box evangelical orthodoxy" -- Anglican?
@Phlebas9202 12 күн бұрын
Smith sounded very PCA. The whole interview felt like punching down.
@_BirdOfGoodOmen 12 күн бұрын
Eh, I thought it was all 🎯, personally. Very true to my experience anyways
@mcmosav 12 күн бұрын
The parallelism in this comment is beautiful. Like a psalm is it’s wisdom concealed.
@Phlebas9202 12 күн бұрын
@@_BirdOfGoodOmenI don't think he was wrong but it was very predictable.
@_BirdOfGoodOmen 12 күн бұрын
@@Phlebas9202True. It would be nice if we could see these critiques could come from within the Evangelical sphere. That it's from an ostensibly non-Progressive Protestant academic is a step in the right direction at least. There definitely are issues but from what I've seen they're dismissed as whining because "mommy and daddy made them go to church when they were 12"
@comeintotheforest 12 күн бұрын
29:58 I’m a big fan of the worst KZfaq channel around
@shadylampable 12 күн бұрын
Regarding youtube video attractiveness, I think 'unformed thoughts' sounds mysterious. Maybe PVK says a heresy or starts a fight? Imagine the drama!
@SourdoughNeil 12 күн бұрын
Surely I can't really be first?
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
"Trump resembles Evangelical leaders" ... Like Joel Osteen? You can't seriously be thinking of Pat Robertson, can you? (That reminds me, I need to take my "Pat Robertson Was Right" jar to the bank, it's got thousands of dollars in it by now...)
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
Bwahaha ... I was thinking of Billy Graham ;-)
@jimluebke3869 12 күн бұрын
@@williambranch4283 Welcome back, I was getting worried about you.
@williambranch4283 12 күн бұрын
@@jimluebke3869 I am always with you, until the end of this Age - Jesus & Bill
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