Does Bill Belichick have anything left to prove after 25 years in New England? | NFL

Does Bill Belichick have anything left to prove after 25 years in New England? | NFL | SPEAK

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Жыл бұрын

The Patriots haven’t won a playoff game since 2018 and two of the last three seasons finished below .500. Bill Belichick was asked yesterday what type of optimism Patriots' fans should have moving forward, Belichick simply responded quote, “the last 25 years.” Emmanuel Acho, Joy Taylor, LeSean McCoy, and Ric Bucher discuss whether Bill Belichick has anything left to prove in the NFL.
#Speak #NFL #BillBelichick
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The revamped SPEAK takes over the airwaves with Emmanuel Acho, LeSean McCoy and Joy Taylor covering the day’s hottest topics in sports and offering their unfiltered takes.
Does Bill Belichick have anything left to prove after 25 years in New England? | NFL | SPEAK
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@SpeakOnFS1 Жыл бұрын

Check out Club Shay Shay: foxs.pt/shayshay

@randomupdates4013 Жыл бұрын

Dave Helman that is all

@CedRockStarr Жыл бұрын

If Bill Belichek was a Running Back or a Black Quarterback, he’d be unceremoniously cut or fired by now.

@spiritualarchitect4276 Жыл бұрын

Bill Belichick still has to prove that he can win a playoff game as the Jets head coach : )

@crashHypnotize Жыл бұрын

The reason why I give Brady more value. He was not expensive compensation wise, and the offense Brady led kept defensive units on the field a very long time and the defense played limited times while being quite talented and commonly shorter times on field than their opponents. Brady is the culture and system.

@williamli6200 Жыл бұрын

I bet Belidick didn't even know that his defense was WORSE THAN PACKERS defense on total yards allowed.

@pnwguy00 Жыл бұрын

People need to remember how dominant those Patriots defenses were in 01 and especially 03, 04. Tom was great but didn't do anything legendary to win those Super Bowls. Those defenses gave up > 14 points on a BAD day. As the league evolved, the script flipped, but Bill still gave Tom a top 10 (usually top 5) scoring defense every single year. Tom winning with an insanely loaded super team doesn't change any of that. How'd Tom look in 2022 when he didn't have perfect protection, a terrible head coach, and a defense that couldn't stop any good offense. Took him only 3 years w/o Bill to have a losing record; and he only advanced past the divisional round ONCE in Tampa, after 8 straight years of AFCC games in Foxboro. All things being equal, they needed each other.

@williamli6200 Жыл бұрын

@@pnwguy00 WTF? dominating but needed Brady to delivering winning drives in big games? dominating but needed Brady to score 24 or more in back to back playoff games? BTW, Brady delivered 5 comeback wins in 2003, and 3 in 2001, the reason they got first round bye. So stop the BS.

@Alex-sf9bo Жыл бұрын

@@pnwguy00 belichick is under 500 with his defense without brady so no

@sanketpatel9866 Жыл бұрын

Only Acho and Shady make sense here. 5 years ago Belichick and the Media sold such as u can put any QB in some magical offense BB hosts in NEP and win even more than Brady as Brady was just a product of him lol. Even BB tried to blind side trade Brady and Gronk. He isn't anything without Brady. It's been 3 years and you can't discount his trash Coaching prior to Brady either. I understand that a combo needs to happen to win long term but I see no reason why Brady and Reid or Payton couldn't have been together and won 7-9 rings. Reid is a GOAT not BB. Brady at age 43 went to a new team, new "system" they still won. It's very hard to win Superbowls yes, but Brady is a GOAT so it was always possible yearly for him.

@shawngillespie3532 Жыл бұрын

Andy Reid…despite his flaws is willing to change and he develops QBs

@markusmolnar7218 Жыл бұрын

The Popovich comparison was spot on!

@erictalbert4633 Жыл бұрын

Great comparison. I use to say that because Pop always had He’s guys.Duncan, Parker,Ginobili. Belicheck had Tom Brady & associates. And when together they win chips

@mitchwilliams-fj2bi Жыл бұрын

I use it all the time

@Pluto24 Жыл бұрын

It’s a great comparison but what I don’t understand is, is that not every great coach tho? who has won multiple championships with no star player…? It’s never been done but we still seem to pick and choose which coaches get more or less credit. Shady brings up Reid all the time and I’m like bro he had to draft an immediate top 10 Qb of all time to get his first ring wtf are we talking about here, he didn’t win with mcnabb or Vick or Alex smith. Shannahan for as great as he is offensively and a great defense, still would sell his soul for a star QB right now.

@eaglesman19 Жыл бұрын

@@Pluto24omg thank you! Lol I've been an Eagles fan for 18 years make no mistake Ried is a not a bad coach by any means he is a good coach. But his championship success is a product of his QB not only did Ried not win a ring with Vick, McNabb or the other QBs you mentioned but he couldn't win it with Foles either. Dougie P did though in his second year as a head coach and before Ried. Dougie P proved that it wasn't the QB it was that Andy isn't that good of a HC.

@broderickcrawford8110 Жыл бұрын

@@Pluto24 Joe Gibbs won 3 Superbowls with 3 different QBs and none of them are in the HOF....hold this L bro

@jamesjack7074 Жыл бұрын

Slick and Joy are saving this show

@megatran2556 Жыл бұрын

I call him the chubby dude. Haha.

@randomupdates4013 Жыл бұрын

I prefer Dave. Humble and nuanced football takes.

@tmoney4204 Жыл бұрын

@@randomupdates4013 can't stand him he always agrees with joy

@THABOMB98126 Жыл бұрын

The show would be great without Shady to me

@maverick33guy95 Жыл бұрын

@Milos Marinkovic Dave makes the show better

@mannycalavera2335 Жыл бұрын

My take: The fact that Tom was still one of the best in the league at what he does, went to the playoffs AND won a superbowl with a different team does prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Brady did not need Belichick to be successful. Whether the other way around is also true remains to be seen.

@madman1840 Жыл бұрын

Not how that works. Brady wouldn't be who he was if it wasn't for bill belichicke.

@trey740 Жыл бұрын

@@madman1840 thats cap tom brady wouldv'e still be tom brady if he got his chance

@madman1840 Жыл бұрын

@@trey740 no he wouldn't have. His first 3 superbowls all came bc of how good the defense was. Honestly 5 out of 6 patriots superbowl were bc of how good the defense played. Butler cuaght a interception that gave brady another ring and the superbowl against the rams was 100 a defensive game. So bill belichicke is responsible for 5 of brady's rings minus the falcons superbowl.

@trey740 Жыл бұрын

@@madman1840 LOL what the offense was just as good as the defense bill is not responsible for any of brady rings brady made bill who he is and without brady hes mediocre

@cristiangomez4537 Жыл бұрын

@@madman1840 I like how people say 03 that sb was a shootout

@LordCornholio31 Жыл бұрын

Another thing they didnt mention about Bill Bilickeck was how good he was at bending rules without breaking them, like when he played against the jets and kept running out time with the punt formation penalties..

@Speedyreedy1218 Жыл бұрын

And the Ravens with lining up OL in TE position as eligible receivers. See 2015 playoff game and Brady in the post game conference: "It's not my fault they didn't read the rulebook."

@robertsuchy2369 Жыл бұрын

@@Speedyreedy1218 I hated when they changed that rule that you have to report as a eligible receiver

@zerotolerance923 Жыл бұрын

He did break rules

@Speedyreedy1218 Жыл бұрын

@@zerotolerance923 No he didn't.

@djroberts6792 Жыл бұрын

Because they don’t have the knowledge to no that.

@DCL-1992 Жыл бұрын

I greatly enjoy these debates! As much as I like Skip and Shannon, I feel like they are more entertainment than the well balanced team here! Great stuff guys!

@Zdub212 Жыл бұрын

Facts: 2021 Patriots record was 10-7 (10-8 after blowout playoff loss) 2007 Patriots went 18-1, not 19-0.

@BigDilf3 Жыл бұрын

I hate acho but he probably meant 16-0

@gunmonkey6545 Жыл бұрын

Good debate but BB’s defenses were also responsible for SB losses. He gave up 44 points to Foles while Brady threw for the most yards in SB history. Brady put them ahead in the last minutes of both losses to NY and BB’s defenses gave up TD drives to Eli.

@deonterector Жыл бұрын

The second super Superbowl against the giants Brady last touchdown was very early in the 3rd, Those were the last points got out of that game.Patriots defense can only hold up for so long and the drive before eli came in the clutch it was welker that drop the ball and on 3rd down Brady threw behind deion branch.

@dougvuillemot8670 10 ай бұрын

Not to mention him not playing there best defensive player vs the eagles. That choice cost them that game.

@Karnakthemagnificent 9 ай бұрын

@@deonterector Branch was running into the defenders, I tend to think it was a misread where Brady thought Branch would cut it off and Branch kept running. As for the Patriots defense, all year long they were a bend but don't break defense that gave up tons of yardage, in the Superbowl the time of possession for the Giants was nearly double that of the Patriots offense who could not get on the field. Can't score points if you don't have the ball.

@Franzel527 Жыл бұрын

this is why I love watching their show.. thank you for pointing out about how the 2008 patriots others are always giving bill praise that they still went 11-5 that season without brady but they always just stop there and always leaving out that the same team was 16-0 the year prior so with tom brady theyre a +5 team and -5 without him that's big if there's only 16-17 games per season.. if the 2007 pats went 11-5 or 10-6 then theyre gonna look much worst the next season without brady going 6-10 or 5-11 in 2008

@Franzel527 Жыл бұрын

ofcourse belichick is a HoF coach specially as a defensive coach but people needs to start thinking that maybe he's not the greatest coach of all time

@sim396 Жыл бұрын

Bill has unable to draft offensive skill players.

@diegomagellan Жыл бұрын

Exactly

@soda8736 Жыл бұрын

Best QB ever and Best TE ever.

@prestigev6131 Жыл бұрын

@@soda8736 Is currently unable to draft offensive skill players

@coreythomas3633 Жыл бұрын

BEST QUARTERBACK EVER AND THE BEST TE EVER GRONK

@peteasarisi2536 Жыл бұрын

He drafted two SBMVP receivers Branch Edelman & two rb who set SB records for receptions

@terrydizzydude4087 Жыл бұрын

Okay...now ask Mike Tomlin the same thing. How many championships has Tomlin won without Ben Roethlisberger? Big Ben already had a title before Tomlin came along to ride his coattails.

@SolidMikeP Жыл бұрын

ahah Its that time of year again!!! Was it Brady....Was it Belichick.....and GO!

@geraldineyarborough9496 Жыл бұрын

NO! That debate is OVER!

@youngdee6421 Жыл бұрын

P sure the debate is over. Brady was the Patriot's way

@TheNinjakat2010 Жыл бұрын

Tom already proved it... so media is trash

@Martin-mp5th Жыл бұрын

The debate been over. Bill gon retire a losing coach without Brady. The new question should be how bad of a losing coach will he be before he hangs em up?

@wblake22 Жыл бұрын

@@youngdee6421let’s not act like Brady left a good patriots team to join a bad buccaneers team. The buccaneers overall was a much better team than the patriots

@andrewillis4141 Жыл бұрын

I appreciate Slick and Joy so much on this one! The game has changed to offensive dominance! Brady definitely deserves most of the credit because coaches don’t play but to pretend those defenses and offensive lines didn’t contribute to those super bowls is asinine! Brady won a superbowl without Bill because of a stacked roster and a perfect opportunity.

@jaywashington7225 Жыл бұрын

But how good is a coach if they can’t evolve

@reekybaby5223 Жыл бұрын

Bro be quiet Tom was New England end of story 🥱

@tonyortiz3350 Жыл бұрын

Stacked roster? Nobody was even thinking or even remembered the bucs existed before Brady got there. I will always like bill but Brady was the team period

@williamli6200 Жыл бұрын

The team built by Belichick wouldn't have won a single SB with any other QB, because the talents he put around Brady wouldn't be enough for other QB to do what Brady did.

@westside5953 Жыл бұрын

@@williamli6200 stop it drew still coulda did that

@jacobcage8633 Жыл бұрын

Well Greg Poppovich hasn't done much without Duncan.

@kevingeorges1160 Жыл бұрын

He had more than Duncan bruv.

@maverick33guy95 Жыл бұрын

It's almost like coaches don't win without hofers.. difference here is that bb put the team together too

@Alex-sf9bo Жыл бұрын

@@maverick33guy95 rexy Ryan wonn4 playoff games without brady

@maverick33guy95 Жыл бұрын

@@Alex-sf9bo did he win a sb? No.. keep it moving

@TheInfiniteNow Жыл бұрын

When Joy Taylor mentioned the Patriots solid offensive line, the bedrock to a Brady-led offense, a shout out needed to happen to Dante Scarnecchia the greatest offensive line coach in NFL history only adding to the argument with his 34 seasons coaching the Patriots predating the arrival of Bill Belichick & needing to be brought back after retiring because of how valuable his coaching was to the organization

@jaayjdouble_1887 Жыл бұрын

The hate is in the air ,Those who don't have hate😂

@duanejennings3189 Жыл бұрын

Where’s Dave??

@diegomagellan Жыл бұрын

Chemistry issues

@randomupdates4013 Жыл бұрын

@@diegomagellan his banter with Shady and points were always well formed. Dave was a great offset to the divas

@night_wolf6621 Жыл бұрын

Slick and Joy are straight cooking on this segment

@trusoule365 Жыл бұрын

SHADY…. Let me Remind you of the Falcons being up 28 to 3 with two minutes and eight seconds left in the third quarter. Last time I checked defense stop them from scoring. And you wondered where Bill Belichick greatness was. Might I remind you that the Los Angeles Rams only scored three points in the Super Bowl the last one the patriots played. That was the same score that Tom Brady put on the Kansas City Chiefs. With patriot players and patriot off into place but what do we know.

@jmannx21 Жыл бұрын

I'm glad to hear somebody say the AFC east was not what it is now

@davis2k1234 Жыл бұрын

Brady went 4-0 the AFC east in 2021 but keep going w that narrative Brady would still be running that division if Bill didn’t throw him out the back door

@satchelthomas8425 Жыл бұрын

@@davis2k1234umm ur wrong sir 2021 brady was on the bucs and got swept by the saints for the second yr back to back regular season

@davis2k1234 Жыл бұрын

@@satchelthomas8425 I didn’t know the Saints got moved to the AFC East Brady went 4-0 VS Bills Pats jets dolphins in 2021

@satchelthomas8425 Жыл бұрын

@@davis2k1234 oh ur a troll I didn't think that was still a thing

@df6148 Жыл бұрын

A new kingdom can’t say look at the past 25 years of the old kingdom. Especially when your most renown Warrior/Leader is gone. Also, Shady made a good point about Andy Reid. As for Bill, needs a legit QB to run his sophisticated offense. And 7:03 Joy is right about Bill/Brady. But To Bills credit, he believed in Brady when nobody else did. Also, Andy Reid might find himself in the same boat as Bill is right now. One day they might say, what has he really WON 🏆 without Maholmes.

@mrmack1988 Жыл бұрын

Nah, we know McNabb choked in that super bowl

@df6148 Жыл бұрын

@@mrmack1988 facts but you could make an argument that Bill has never let a lockeroom divide a team. He’s dealt with killers, divas, role models, gangstas, family guys, 1 year mercenaries, cast off vets, etc…. And they never skip a beat. That Eagles team fell apart after the TO/Mcnabb divide. There’s a lot more between the numbers for bill. But it’s hard to remember until we remember.

@SlyScribeV Жыл бұрын

I especially despise the Reid mention. It's become more and more clear that people want to see Reid become the GOAT coach one day instead of it being Belichick's title.

@mrmack1988 Жыл бұрын

@dt6148 I agree it's more than just between the numbers. Bills also the gm, which makes each job tougher to juggle. The divide in the locker room was a thing. But then again, we also now know Tom played a part in keeping things chill. Tom put out plenty of fires for Bill. Andy's obviously the better coach of the two in this new Era of football. But in that era, it was Bill. Bills the goat unless Andy ends up with like 4 or 5 rings. Then there's no debating it anymore. Yes, mahomes is great, but Andy is the one that had him passing to wide open no names in the chip.

@williamli6200 Жыл бұрын

@@MapleGlazedDonuts Because Brady's best skill is *passing progression,* (the skills Marino, Peyton and Rodgers were among the worst at) which doesn't produce great stats. With Brady, Pats offense would have scored a FG in later 4th quarters against Raiders and Packers, and would have won. Meaning, with Brady, we would be talking about what a genius Belidick was now.

@jmoney6043 Жыл бұрын

Shady was right about everything until he said Patriots defense isn't good. 😂 I'm not even a patriot fan but saying they didn't have a top defense is insane. With how bad their offense was this season they still had a top 10 defense. If their offense was average that defense would've been top 5.

@CoC_Lord Жыл бұрын

Their defenses were the reason for the first 3 super bowls, Brady really did it blossom into the goat until 2007

@SlyScribeV Жыл бұрын

Nah cuz when he only said the Pats defense had been solid over the years you just knew that he don't like the Patriots at all. He's not being objective when it comes to them and hasn't since he came onto the show. He supports Brady, but he's never been in a Pats locker room and he won't talk to just anybody about the Pats culture.

@jmoney6043 Жыл бұрын

@@SlyScribeV bro he's a Andy Reid guy. I'm not mad at him for that but saying the Patriots defense isn't any good is insane. I like shady but he's straight up wrong about that.

@princecheck11 Жыл бұрын

when did he say that??

@jmoney6043 Жыл бұрын

@@MapleGlazedDonuts I'm not a Brady or a belichek guy but that defense was top end every year. It wasn't their fault the other team had a subpar QB or that Josh Allen went beast mode. All that I'm saying is that defense is top end of the NFL and that's undeniable.

@williamakers3990 Жыл бұрын

Love y’all great analysis Greg to bill was on point

@kylewatson4900 Жыл бұрын

Great?

@joemagarac405 10 ай бұрын

People are harder on Belichick than on other coaches lacking their superstar player for a number of good reasons. First, for years - up until Tampa, really - everyone attributed the patriots success to their system and the system was Belichick’s. Brady was a “system quarterback” Second, Belichick himself not only believed this but promoted the idea with his treatment of Brady from around 2014 on, when Belichick used a rare (for him) second round offensive pick to acquire Garoppolo. Third, as GM as well as HC, Belichick had inordinate amount of power to shape the team, and he “left the cupboard bare” (as he put it when making excuses for himself) offensively, using 80% of his first and second round picks for defensive players. Fourth, he went on a totally out of character buying spree in free agency post-Brady, and still had a .500 team. Fifth, until someone started asking former players, the hype was that BB was the GOAT. To this day, Don Shula’s win % is better than Belichick’s and always will be at this rate. Madden and George Allen too. And none of those guys had anything like Brady.

@SW-pm3ls Жыл бұрын

Andy Reid had a handful of top 10 QB’s as a head coach. McCabb, Alex Smith, Maholmes

@reginaldweaks6913 Жыл бұрын

The Bucs were struggling until Brady had a lot of the Patriots system installed to help

@edwingarland7173 Жыл бұрын

Yeah he used the pats system with all pro talent in all positions

@blackanimelover18 Жыл бұрын

The Bucs were struggling because their QB threw 30 ints, all they needed was for someone to NOT do that.

@deciuswtasby Жыл бұрын

Bucs had a QB go 30 for 30 and they still won 7 games. That team was a good QB away from being a SB contender and they got Brady. Case closed.

@dantheman8152 Жыл бұрын

Joe Gibbs is the greatest NFL coach. Won three SuperBowls with three different QB's!

@mustangs263 Жыл бұрын

Yes because he is not a HOF coach without Tom Brady.

@tswaggcodes5 Жыл бұрын

Looks like “25” hairline is running away as well!😂😂😂😂😊

@randomupdates4013 Жыл бұрын

Yeah wtf bring back Dave Helman. Show missing his football takes and humble balance. This blows

@dacryptkeeper6836 Жыл бұрын

"Players WIN games; coaches LOSE them!" - Bill Belichick. As a so-called "Defensive Genius," HOW did the Patriots lose 3 Super Bowls? DEFENSE!!!!

@Blackmigobubbie Жыл бұрын

And how did the win 4 Super Bowl defense

@matjohnson9988 Жыл бұрын

And they also won them with defense so your point is 🤷‍♂️

@17thNO Жыл бұрын

Did Tom Brady win every Superbowl or game? No he did not. You win as a team and you lose as a team. Did the Buccaneers win the Superbowls when he was in Tampa Bay. Both of them together in New England went 10 years without a Superbowl win. Brady alone with that 18 and 0 team with Moss should have won that game Brady was in both games against the Giants, what happened....Brady was the quarterback of all three of those Superbowl losses. Including the 13-3 offensive masterpiece they won versus the Rams I. The last Patriots Superbowl win. Tom Brady led the Buccaneers willed the Patriots to win in the last game he played.

@dacryptkeeper6836 Жыл бұрын

@@Blackmigobubbie Belichick is TOO conservative on offense . . . it took game winning drives, led by Brady, to win! Do you think someone like Mac Jones, or even Cam Newton in his prime, could have won those Super Bowls? NO TEAM has EVER won so many championships with the revolving door of receivers. I stand by my opinion, and quoted Belichick, himself, in my initial post!!!

@Zdub212 Жыл бұрын

@Da Cryptkeeper too conservative? How about going for it on 4th and 2 and let Peyton Manning win the AFCCG? Pats would have another ring if BB had been more conservative there.

@kingkoopa2831 Жыл бұрын

If Brady was just a “product of Belichick’s system” then Bill should be able to draft any QB and do what he did with Tom. However he can’t. It was Brady

@JonKlinkel Жыл бұрын

Going 61-21 the year after Duncan retired isn't the same as having a LOSING record the year after Brady leaves. Someone is obviously in love with Belichick.

@dwightwordlaw5170 Жыл бұрын

What’s he talking about? The patriots weren’t ever a 19-0 team. They were 18-1 in 2007. They lost to the Giants in the Super Bowl. I’m shocked Joy and Slick didn’t correct Acho for saying that.

@vinsanity982 Жыл бұрын

Why? Normal people don’t go around correcting every little misspeak or error other people make. Especially if they understand the context and the intent of what’s being said.

@dwightwordlaw5170 Жыл бұрын

@@vinsanity982 Thats a huge error. They weren’t a 19-0 team. They didn’t have a perfect season. They almost did, but they were 18-1. I understand he was trying to make a point, but still you can’t say they were a 19-0 team when they weren’t. Only the Miami Dolphins had a perfect season. Not the Patriots.

@edsadler1039 Жыл бұрын

Im a cowboys fan so this is probably the first time i agree with shady

@princecheck11 Жыл бұрын

Rick made a good point by comparing bill to gregg they really are the same

@paulbrandano3477 11 ай бұрын

Changing the rules about hitting a QB helped Tom a lot. I'll take Bills record without Brady any day.. Patriots won many games with No name players.. Always good O line too! One more thing, Bill never said He was the greatest, It's you. So, Who does he have to proove to you's? Bil and Tom were a perfect fit both great.

@joemagwood9130 Жыл бұрын

The Patriots was a great team that won 6 SB with a great coach and a great QB.

@patrickreidy7420 Жыл бұрын

My man slick got ‘‘em at the end..Phil Jackson didn’t win with knicks but that’s a convo for another day lmao

@minzyailee3023 Жыл бұрын

But he wasn't a coach with the Knicks.

@LDRTrejo Жыл бұрын

I cannot stand this Belichick slander. Belichick Absolutely deserves the title of GOAT coach. He built the pats defense multiple times over into championship defenses, and absolutely was a humongous factor in Tom Brady becoming so driven to excellence. The reality is once tom reached a level of understanding the game so much better than others, of course he and josh would take over that offense. And when tom left, the “patriot way” that was there for so long before left with him, he was the last bastion of it. And in its wake is the modern player mentality.and the patriots simply didn’t have the guy they need for a style like that. This season will show us if Belichick can adapt, but make no mistake, that doesn’t take away the GOAT title imo.

@davis2k1234 Жыл бұрын

I’m not sure Bellicheck is even top 5 coach of the last 25 years def not better then Andy Reid and there coming in last in the AFC east this season so gonna have to wait another season and come up with more excuses why he is below avg coach wo Brady to carry him

@WRNIIVIIII Жыл бұрын

WIN WITHOUT BRADY!

@Patsman2993 9 ай бұрын

Andy Reid has won two superbowls, has historically terrible defenses, and is basically being carried by Mahomes right now the way you can say Brady did with Bill. Belichick has been a GM, has almost always had a top 10 defense, drafted multiple HOF players, still has a lot left in the tank. Rest of the division and conference has been able to build up with talent while the Patriots focused on championships. They’re still rebuilding and not too far off from being competitive with the top dogs after 4 years from Brady leaving.

@StuntmanBeatz313 Жыл бұрын

It is a TEAM accomplishment in the "Ultimate Team Sport"... this whole, which 1 person is responsible, when other ppl have to catch, defend, block, kick, manage the clock, substitute, game plan etc is really crazy to me..

@deciuswtasby Жыл бұрын

They have to justify their lunacy thus these kinds of topics lol. That’s really all it boils down to

@keenannash2947 Жыл бұрын

No one is saying 1 person is 100% responsible for winning. The question is who is MORE responsible. Do you think every player, coach, and staff member should get the same % of credit when a team wins? Or do some players, coaches, or staff members get more credit than others? Obviously most people believe the latter, and the point here is Tom deserves more credit than Bill... NOT all of the credit, just mire than Bill.

@williamli6200 Жыл бұрын

Like Patriots to a Boeing plane, Brady was the engine that determined how far, how high, how fast the plane could fly. I don't know what is in so simple that you t@rds don't understand.

@newagain9964 Жыл бұрын

True normally the QB is 80% of a win or loss. Even on a Run and play D team. Like the 90s bucs or recent titans.

@steve_santiago Жыл бұрын

When Joy said “I don’t want to be unsexy here” who else thought she couldn’t be unsexy if she tried?

@Stonecoldalston Жыл бұрын

13:46 Right blue some people might not say that Greg pop is the greatest coach of all time that’s only because the down years in the past 5-6 years go back to 2014 it was a real convo of course he still had work to do but people was putting him in the convo and he still is

@FoodImpact Жыл бұрын

Bring back David helman!

@ronwilliams5576 Жыл бұрын

I still say if he was able to keep Jimmy G he would be in a better position jmo

@makani9004 Жыл бұрын

I think his coaching tree is a point in this favor though. He had his eye on every part of the team, and it shored up the weaknesses of those guys. The second they didn't have Bill running beside them holding the bike they drove straight into a dumpster.

@FrizzKid05 Жыл бұрын

I don't think his coaching tree is a great point for him. McDaniels and Brady were the reason the offense worked. Now, when he doesn't have either of their minds, they're mediocre, at best.

@njongomato 11 ай бұрын

I agree, Bill needs to evolve

@all-topics Жыл бұрын

he only waiting until he passes don shula as head coach with the most wins

@GG89262 Жыл бұрын

Belechick caused Patriots to lose a Superbowl by benching Malcom. Tom took less money and where is this talent that Bill put around Tom. Any true Wide Receiver #1 except Moss and he was at the tail of the career. Now we we see what Belechick is truly is without Tom. We saw that in Cleveland.

@randywatson2103 Жыл бұрын

The worst thing that could of happened to Bill's legacy did happen...Brady doing what he did with Tampa Bay.

@mattbedrosian5298 Жыл бұрын

Not just Brady winning a super bowl year 1 in Tampa. But Bill hasn't sniffed a playoff win in 3 years since 12's been gone.

@jeffm7145 Жыл бұрын

Now Bill needs to win one

@DA-MAGIC Жыл бұрын

with Mac at quarterback 😆😆

@QuesTV92 Жыл бұрын

They needed each other. That defense bailed tom out just as much if not more than tom carried that team. They loss twice to the giants in the superbowl look at the scores

@aholmes74ah Жыл бұрын

Tom won without Bill

@QuesTV92 Жыл бұрын

@@aholmes74ah tom went to a stacked team. He still almost lost to the packers and the defense bailed him out

@davis2k1234 Жыл бұрын

@@QuesTV92 he only scored 31 Pts and 3TDs vs packers he was so lucky for his defense bail him out 🤡

@QuesTV92 Жыл бұрын

@@davis2k1234 he threw 3 pics

@davis2k1234 Жыл бұрын

@@QuesTV92 After building a 28-10 lead and 2 of those INts were basically punts on Hail Mary 3rd and longs and one was a drop by Evans hit him in the hands he played amazing that game and the whole 2020 run

@Dontberetarded Жыл бұрын

I hate the Patriots but Bill is one of the greatest coaches. I mean really, what would Andy be without Mahomes? He wasn’t being praised when Alex Smith was there. “Sussess” 😂

@Matt-cr4vv 9 ай бұрын

I wish people would acknowledge that as impressive as the TB chip was Tom stepped into a much better situation than Bill has had I’m trying to replace such a vital position. I think it would be more damning on Bill if he was having these results with either a pro bowl level QB or had drafted a genuinely franchise caliber QB. But the reality is he hasn’t had that. And the best option to replace Tom was a rookie with a very low ceiling that everybody acknowledges doesn’t have the talent to carry the team. So you’re comparing Tom stepping onto a roster full of all pros that lost a ton of very close games the year before (six were by a score or less) with a turnover machine QB versus having to replace the most vital role a team has. Bill has been miles from perfect but we also need to stop pretending like the task at hand was equal for both. Bill deserves a ton of criticism for how he’s handled Mac but the task was immensely higher for him. Now I’d be on board more if let’s say he got a Lawrence who had the ceiling to actually lead the franchise and was falling short. But I’m not willing to brush away all of Bills success because he hasn’t had title contending teams with a past his prime Cam or low ceiling Mac. I get why it seems that way but I just can’t do it and think the unfair argument gets made largely because for so long he got to benefit from everybody refusing to credit Tom.

@abrahamsannoh 11 ай бұрын

25. I need to do his homework on the claims he be making, yall!! It's so disrespectful to hear the claims he's making. Anyway, thanks for the motivation!! 🙌🏾💪🏾💪🏾🙌🏾💯

@originata3748 Жыл бұрын

Hard to argue against Shady's argument, 55-59. Thats 7 seasons worth of games.

@shakorieaster7489 Жыл бұрын

Why do people forget Adam Vinatieri won a lot of those games Tom and Bill get credit for. Not to mention that defense........... or the fact they cheated ALOT!

@jrad410 Жыл бұрын

How did Vinatieri get into range to make those FGs? Also you make it sound like it always came down to a kicker lol

@shakorieaster7489 Жыл бұрын

@jrad410 out of what I said, your concerns were the kicker an not the cheating? Lol ok.

@jeffm7145 Жыл бұрын

Come on Acho - they were 18-1 not 19-0! Nobody remembered the Giants won? And in Mac's first year they were 10-7, not 9-8.

@Dontberetarded Жыл бұрын

I hate the Patriots but Bill is one of the greatest coaches. What would Andy Reid be without Mahomes? He would be Andy Reid with Alex Smith. “Sussess” 😂

@Branderbie 9 ай бұрын

If you had a car that won every race for 10 years, then you took out the engine and put it in a new car and that new car won every race and the old one lost, you wouldn't wonder what was actually responsible for the wins. People only have trouble with this because they talked about how great BB was for years and years and don't want to look like they were wrong now. BB has coached 10 years where TB wasn't the QB and won 1 playoff game in those 10 years.

@Agent77X Жыл бұрын

You only as good as the latest season or two! Have to continue proving yourself!😮

@sham55 Жыл бұрын

Don’t forget Bill did alright - was winning with Bledsoe before he got injured. I appreciated Rick’s comparison to Pop and his take what Belichick has left to prove. Acho and Shady are very quick to criticize.

@TakeNotesKid Жыл бұрын

He was WHAT? 5-11 in 2000. 0-2 in 2001. That’s winning with Bledsoe?

@mikehatten5738 Жыл бұрын

@@TakeNotesKid hahahaha some people just start typing without booting up the brain first 😂

@soda8736 Жыл бұрын

Ok so now they want to go back the last 3 years for Belechic , but with Lamar they act like he last played in 2019? Pick and choosing. Hypocrites

@Broncoburger Жыл бұрын

Well yes "his" quarterback has won more super bowls than him. Quite obviously it was the quarterback, not the coach. The real genius was Josh McDaniels who is not head coaching material which also reflects on him.

@apope06 Жыл бұрын

The B defense was a huge part of those super bowl wins. Not just Brady.

@DynastyFade Жыл бұрын

11:37 I disagree with the concept of "what we know" because "what we know" = accomplishments. The what if game shouldn't be played because it's not real, but individual stats can point to opportunities that we just didn't get to see. In the same way that we didn't get to see Westbrook, Harden, and Durant (on OKC). The argument is still valid, just not as measurable since it's conceptual.

@joofmagoof2841 Жыл бұрын

it was tom and belichick. Stafford with the Rams is pretty close to Tom with the Bucs. The main difference being their previous teams.

@bikesnippets Жыл бұрын

Acho talks, and talks, and talks, and talks, and talks......and talks. Then....he talks some more. A mass of words cascading, as he looks around for impressed faces....but finds Joy looking at him, thinking...."hurry up Acho!" That 55 - 59 record without Brady is damning evidence. He was average pre-Brady, and average post-Brady. His assistants fail everywhere they go. It really does look like Bill was simply a great D-Coordinator, with one or two good coaches, and a legend at QB, who he drafted as an afterthought in Round 7.

@HemiLeo392 Жыл бұрын

Yep as a pats fan absolutely right it was Brady more n now give Mac Jones a real OC

@mca217 Жыл бұрын

If the Patriots want to win they just need to sign Uncle Rico. Boom. You're welcome Pats fans.

@JBrosBuilt Жыл бұрын

He can throw a pigskin a quarter-mile

@josephsmithmeyer1195 Жыл бұрын

As a fins fan who hates the pats the fans should not worry they mad the playoffs with Mac and last year had no offensive coach I think they'll be fine and they deserve to loose the division a few years

@brettperry218 Жыл бұрын

As a pats fan I couldn't care less about BB's legacy. I care about winning championships. Craft and Belichick have shown over the last few years that championships aren't their priority anymore.

@thetarheel2010j Жыл бұрын

Acho reached beyond the heavens for that 19-0 and 11-5 comparison… I wish he was still gone

@REE_III Жыл бұрын

Acho bad analogy. Stocks have "risks"...being a fan does "not."

@eddurriii8214 Жыл бұрын

I just want one day for this crew to actually tell the truth…especially Joy n Shady

@randomupdates4013 Жыл бұрын

Dave tells truths and is missing

@DaNumba1Rapper Жыл бұрын

I'm just saying - for an "incredible defensive mind", all 3 of those SB losses were all because of the defense from said "incredible mind" 👀

@dominiquerobinson8888 Жыл бұрын

The 2 first losses were on the offense.

@travisblair3189 Жыл бұрын

@@dominiquerobinson8888 Exactly ‼️

@deciuswtasby Жыл бұрын

@@dominiquerobinson8888 facts. The goat had his defense hold another team under 20 points and he can’t get it done? It’s always been on the offense but they blame the defense 🤣🤣🤣🤣

@ddm62571 Жыл бұрын

Nobody looked at Belichick as not even the greatest but even a good coach until Tom Brady came in his life and changed everything for him and that's a fact!

@Karnakthemagnificent 9 ай бұрын

Joys' point about the players that Belichick put around Brady is well taken, but Belichick also notoriously squandered high draft choices on picks like Harry, Easley, Dowling, Jackson, & Richards, and in more years than not, Brady made that O-Line look better than it was because he got rid of the ball so fast even having to throw to targets like Caldwell and Thompkins - not exactly household names. Yet even in those lean years where the Boston sports media were appalled at the lack of offensive talent, they got to the playoffs. Right now, Mac Jones is surrounded by as much offensive talent as Belichick can muster and they are 1-2. Only winning against the Jets whose QB was unwilling to compete and may have just played himself out of the NFL.

@kevindavis4351 Жыл бұрын

Brian Daboll and Brian Flores were the only coaches that were from the Belichick tree that had success. Bill O'Brian was borderline ok but he alienated himself from his own team before getting fired.

@Atlas365247 Жыл бұрын

Thank you Rick for analogy.

@captainchaosxx3866 Жыл бұрын

Now I cringe every time because Mccoy can't pronounce "success' 😖 maybe that's me be a hater.

@Righteous628 Жыл бұрын

Shady is 1,000% correct

@giles815 Жыл бұрын

How many coaches in the modern era are considered the greatest and did NOT have a franchise QB? Mac Jones clearly isn’t a franchise QB.

@tfirejubrajubrah Жыл бұрын

I hate the argument of "He had the same coach for a long time". Players get coaches fired all the time right? Well if they can get a coach fired, can't they keep one employed if they keep winning for them?

@trusoule365 Жыл бұрын

All I see is a bunch of people afraid of the patriots getting a quarterback. Who is the back up quarterback for the Kansas City Chiefs? Exactly

@spliffgod5941 Жыл бұрын

Joy your are never unsexy 😊

@crashHypnotize Жыл бұрын

Bill is just like Popovic with the Spurs right now. Both are over the hill right now.

@Stonecoldalston Жыл бұрын

He have to win a ring without Brady if Brady didn’t win in Tampa it would be different but he’s in the Kobe situation when him and a shaq spilt Shaq won right away with his new team & kobe legacy was being torn down until he won Bill have to go Win

@jimmydurham9318 Жыл бұрын

Since the millennium has started defense has won championships with the exception of a few especially the number one defense is like New England and Denver got shut down. The Giants Phillies Seattle rams ravens twice New England three times the other teams had top 10. Defense can still win it has Jimmy g who put them in position to be a hero at the end of that Super bowl

@TheNinjakat2010 Жыл бұрын

The pats in the 90s was a good team went to a SB and playoffs... so BB took a good team over.

@ryanc9888 Жыл бұрын

Belichick proved himself as a great coach in super-bowl 25 when his defence shutdown Jim Kelly and the Bills juggernaut offence. Belichicks game plan for that super-bowl was so good it’s in the pro football hall of fame. He was the defensive mastermind for those great NY Giants teams

@djroberts6792 Жыл бұрын

His game plan is in the hall?

@anitafloyd2554 Жыл бұрын

Coordinating is not head coaching. Nearly every headcoach has an impressive coordinating resume, thats how they become headcoaches. They did not shut the Bills down, first off. The NYG offense held the ball for 40 mins and Buffalo still got in FG range to win, the kicker just missed. I dont care about the HOF status of that gameplan, their were many superior SB defensive performances than that one. SB 18, SB 19, SB 20, SB 26, SB 27, SB 35, SB 37, SB 48, SB 12,

@kingkoopa2831 Жыл бұрын

So he’s an overhyped D coordinator without Brady

@anitafloyd2554 Жыл бұрын

@@kingkoopa2831 thats all he is. If being an OC or DC is so great, then why do they regularly leave champions/contenders to become head coaches of awful franchises? Crennel left a 3 time SB winner to go and coach the Browns. Demeco Ryans left an elite SF team to coach the Texans. Mike Holmgren left the dynastic 49ers to go and coach an awful Green Bay team. Norv Turner left the 2 time defending SB champion Cowboys to coach the post Joe Gibbs rebuilding Redskins.

@drew4564 Жыл бұрын

If the bills had a kicker they lose the superbowl the defense didn't win it Scott Norwood did😂

@javongreen734 Жыл бұрын

He ain't got nothing else to prove just need to coach two more years so he can get the record

@diegomagellan Жыл бұрын

Mhhm

@RedsoxPats34 Жыл бұрын

He needs to win a SB with Mac

@Stonecoldalston Жыл бұрын

6:45 if belichick coaches don’t have success other places that’s actually proof of how great he is that’s not a knock on him We know Shady played with Brady so he bias but let’s be real The fact that the pats made the playoffs so soon after Brady left and was about a game away this year from making the playoffs mediocre QB play shows his greatness it’s hard to judge until he get a real starting QB

@reginaldweaks6913 Жыл бұрын

Shady McCoy jumped on the bandwagon for his 2 superbowls and wanna hate on Bill

@jessierolan Жыл бұрын

Joy needs to be the host, she's by far the most knowledgeable on any lineup, she's also the most calm and convincing while being nuanced and looking at both sides. Acho is a good color guy, but he's acting too much on this show to be the host imo.