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How to tune Dampers (chassis control) - A Sim Racing Setup Guide feat. Automobilista 2

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Steelcast27

Steelcast27

Күн бұрын

00:00 - Intro
00:26 - Mechanical Explanation
02:54 - What is Bump?
03:22 - Front Bump Demo
04:43 - Rear Bump Demo
06:00 - What is Rebound?
06:40 - Rear Rebound Demo
08:36 - Front Rebound Demo
10:08 - Notes
12:16 - Damper Reference Guide
12:25 - Braking
12:40 - Corner Entry
13:14 - Mid-Corner
13:45 - Corner Exit
14:28 - Extro
-Thanks for watching!
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Пікірлер: 54
@jaguatiricaimediata5305
@jaguatiricaimediata5305 2 жыл бұрын
This is the best video on this topic, it's REALLY COMPLETE, and maybe even overwhelming, but after having watched all the very streamlined and too basic videos, this is actually the one I need.
@GDUBMX
@GDUBMX 5 ай бұрын
Thanks for these mate, I felt after numerous years of default setups and the lack of enthusiasm to learn car setups your guides over this last week have helped tons. Taking small steps and feeling how the car behaves is vital but above all there is something truly satisfying knowing you have created a setup which improves your times. Thanks alot mate
@mackelby1
@mackelby1 2 жыл бұрын
Your delivery for us newbs on suspension geometry is relatable. That isn't easy. You really do a good job.
@jamesleegte5753
@jamesleegte5753 2 жыл бұрын
Your style of teaching is of a very high standard and very easy to follow! Thank you for taking the time to make these videos.
@LancerIKA
@LancerIKA 2 ай бұрын
That is the best explanation of dampers tuning i ever saw!
@RichAbe23
@RichAbe23 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent class on dampers… i took good notes too.
@kevin_m
@kevin_m 2 жыл бұрын
Love this tutorial and presentation was well done!
@putzak
@putzak 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for making these, very informative.
@CaptainCrunch99
@CaptainCrunch99 2 жыл бұрын
Well done, explained concisely, and without a lot of fluff, and sidetracked comments. I would suggest watching it three times, so it really sinks into your brain.
@martymestemaker4550
@martymestemaker4550 2 жыл бұрын
Nice production.
@roccothamanoidis
@roccothamanoidis 2 жыл бұрын
This one is a biggy! Amazing explanation work on this topic. 😎👌🏼
@jaysysumakaRatMaster3
@jaysysumakaRatMaster3 Жыл бұрын
Great video bud… really detailed 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
@tt350zJason
@tt350zJason 2 жыл бұрын
Masterful as always...you da man!!!!
@aprosimracing
@aprosimracing 2 жыл бұрын
Very informative, this is a hard topic. I will have to watch it several times, but this is the beauty of KZfaq. Thank you!
@clintbeacock7663
@clintbeacock7663 2 жыл бұрын
Really enjoying this series. I'm just dipping my toes in at this point, and there's no way I'll remember any of this after a single watch, but most importantly - it all makes sense to me as I watch it and I know where to look if I'm having trouble with an imbalance. Thanks :)
@JTthestreetking
@JTthestreetking 9 ай бұрын
Very clear explanations!! Thank you, you are a great teacher!! God bless you!!
@gsam_dad5540
@gsam_dad5540 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent tutorial as usual, I had no real idea about dampers except that they're springs & stop the car constantly bouncing after hitting bumps; this will help big time, I find with understeering my current response of moving brake bias rearward can often swing quickly to bad oversteer so I'm going to have a play with these settings. Keep up the good work, I'll keep the swarfega to hand after all this mechanical stuff :)
@d35p0
@d35p0 2 жыл бұрын
Dampers aren't even springs. They're just a tube filled with oil or nitrogen. They restrict the movement of your suspension which are the real springs. I think when you can visualize that it'll be much more logical on how to tune your dampers.
@suninmoon4601
@suninmoon4601 2 жыл бұрын
Going from strength to strength, Steel! Keep up the good work 👍🏽 Thanks to your guidance, I now have to rethink my approach to damping completely. For example: I tend to adjust dampers in pairs (asymmetrical triad-setups are for another day), so, if I was struggling with snap oversteer during trail braking, I would try to reduce weight transfer onto the front axle by increasing Front Bump AND Rear Rebound--because, logically, the effect is greatest when both axles work in unison. My thinking was that if I increase the damping (Front Bump and Rear Rebound) this would result in LESS weight transfer not more. But it would seem that I have had the principle bass-acwards all this time 😁 Because your approach produces the desired result: reducing Rear Rebound damping--in other words, reducing resistance to the transfer of energy through the dampers--results in LESS weight transfer 🤪 I still don't get it; but it works 🤷🏽
@Willy78wilfred
@Willy78wilfred 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for your video on the setup of the dampers. I sort of expected the use of telemetry (histograms) to setup the dampers. On youtube I found out that there are quite some things to interprete these histograms, like where is the border of fast and slow rebound, the area of the rebound side (slow/fase) has to be 20 or 50%, etc. So maybe I'll see this in part 2 of the dampers. Keep up the good work!
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
Telemetry won’t be featured in this series. These vids are designed to be accessible to everyone and to help with feel based setups. I have about 50 videos that feature it though if you’re interested.
@juanmata4318
@juanmata4318 2 жыл бұрын
Awsome
@akioasakura3624
@akioasakura3624 8 ай бұрын
Sir you are a mothafuckin G. Just so you know. Simply the best. Thank you so so so much for actually explaining things, and not just saying rules of thumbs copied over a billion times. Big up sir. Thank u so much
@thijsazerty692
@thijsazerty692 2 жыл бұрын
Very Nice! A PDF/document with all the summaries of your guides would het amazing. Any chance perhaps?
@juanmata4318
@juanmata4318 2 жыл бұрын
Heave and third spring explanation
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
We’ll get there.
@c0r5e
@c0r5e 2 ай бұрын
No one discusses how suspensions and damper affects brake locking. I had this feeling but no one on the internet talked about it. They only say to adjust bias but bias isn’t enough
@mackelby1
@mackelby1 2 жыл бұрын
My second comment. Well Steele, I mentioned my new computer and reverb G2. Well computer made it, with 8 mb memory. Really torqued me. I thought I was getting 16. Now I find out Alienware and ram stick compatibility SUCKS. I don't have enough to run VR. It has been a nightmare. I have had computer for a week. Haven't even booted a sim. Really discouraged. These system builders are tricky sneaky shit lord's. My first system from manufacturer. Dell only wanted 2.5 times the price you can buy ram for. NEVER AGAIN. Before this is over I will have nothing good to say about Dell or Alienware I am afraid.
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
Thats awful. Can you return it?
@suninmoon4601
@suninmoon4601 2 жыл бұрын
Belated HNY ✨ Starting to get my head around the damper adjustments, but I need some clarification. When you say (11:50) that--generally--Rebound should be stiffer than Bump, do you mean on the same axle: Front Bump 5 / Front Rebound 6? Or do you mean cross-axle: Front Bump 5 / Rear Rebound 6? Or both: Front Bump 5 / Front Rebound 6 - Rear Bump 5 / Rear Rebound 6?
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
Same axle, but I would use rates on the screen instead of incriminates to confirm. This way the energy absorbed going over track bumps keeps the chassis more stable. The bump controls the unsprung weight, rebound controls sprung weight.
@suninmoon4601
@suninmoon4601 2 жыл бұрын
@@Steelcast27 Thank you 👍🏽
@MiledHorizon
@MiledHorizon 2 жыл бұрын
Does this guide also apply to FWD cars? You'd want to keep some weight on the front as much as possible so would having a stiff rear bump increase understeer? Stiffer suspension makes the weight transfer faster so by making rear bump stiffer, you'd make the weight transfer from the front to the rear faster, is that correct?
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
FWD cars are tricky. The weight transfers are similiar, but the purpose may not be. In a RWD car, adjusting dampers in the rear are used to control power delivery. In a FWD car the rears are basically a passenger as all the business happens in the front. For FWD cars I would adjust the rear dampers (and tire pressures) to control off throttle rotation and traction.
@MiledHorizon
@MiledHorizon 2 жыл бұрын
@@Steelcast27 It's weird. I find that having stiffer rear bump dampers and/or springs make the car understeer more. It may depend on the chassis design and weight distribution of the vehicle as well however. The rear wheels aren't receiving any torque from the engine so the rear tires will eventually gain traction anyways. So by making the rear springs or rear bump dampers stiff, there may be a moment where the rear tires have trouble finding traction but eventually grip up anyways leading to less rotation. I may just match springs and bump settings to the vehicles weight distribution, but I'll stiffen rear anti roll bars and rear rebound to get the car rotating. So far it seems to work quite well in different games, from FH4 to GT7. I find that in racing, suspension acts as sort of like a buffer in between our inputs and the vehicle's reactions. If the suspension is too stiff, we get quicker weight transfer but the tires may be more prone to losing grip especially when combined with a very aggressive racing style. So even our driving style can act like a buffer just like suspension but through different means. When we're too harsh with the steering, brakes or gas, we tend to lose grip very quickly. When we smoothen our inputs, the tires are able to keep their grip because we are making sure the weight isn't being transferred as quickly. Almost the same way how soft suspension slows down weight transfer. So in a way, stiffening the front doesn't just mean we increase the understeer tendencies of a vehicle, but we are making it so that the forward weight transfer is quicker. I believe Carrol Smith has stated in his Tune to Win book that, up to a point where the suspension no longer moves, stiffening front bump resistance makes a vehicle turn in more. So it really depends on how we make use of the weight transfer.
@gamingandtechnology6913
@gamingandtechnology6913 2 жыл бұрын
I have a request..... Can u make a video in future about how much steering input is needed for corners so we would not overdrive the car? Please 🙏 and one about how to mark a turning point? It's hard at speed to look for turning point
@carltonsmall682
@carltonsmall682 2 жыл бұрын
Does Motec work with this game? or is there another software i could use?
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
No motec. Racing Sim Tools is what ai use.
@acemczero88
@acemczero88 2 жыл бұрын
Are we sure this is correct? Dampers have always been the "black magic" of sim racing because different devs implement it in different ways and it's easy to find one guide entirely contradicting another. For example, I watched an ARA guide last night doing a deep dive on setting up a gt4 on iracing and it explicitly stated that stiffening the damper *slows* the weight transfer and dulls the "snappiness". I can confirm that in iracing, adding rear rebound stiffness aids in nullifying off throttle oversteer by pinning the rear down longer. Using rebound specifically, you're either of the school of thought that a stiffer rebound = stronger dampening effect = slower, more controlled weight and pitch transfer, or the school of stiffer rebound = more forceful pushing of weight off the tire = faster weight transfer and pitch. Personally, the former sounds more right to my non-expert brain. On top of iracing also working that way, Aris--the guy behind ACC--also described it that way and used telemetry to make his point. I love your videos and your teaching methods, but that you explain dampers here the way you do and are able to show it in action suggests that Reiza's implementation is of that latter philosophy, and directly at odds with the likes of iracing and ACC. Regardless of which dev is right, are we sure that this setup guide as a whole is merely featuring AMS2, or would it be better classified as *FOR* AMS2? I think, when it comes to the voodoo that is dampers, such a distinction should be made.
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
The reason I chose AMS2 to do what I do is because mechanically, the the sim behaves as you would expect based on real world principles. I know its not popular to say this as it usually goes over the head of would be sim "critics", but its true. Everything in this video reflects real world mechanical principles, regardless of sim. It was explained to me in this way early on, and this resonated with me. Imagine a damper on the ground in front of you standing straight up. Push the damper down with your hand. A stiffer damper would required more force through your hand to get it moving and the pain you feel in the palm of your hand is the load. In other words, the speed of weight transfer. The softer damper will give. Same weight transfer, but slower, less pain in your hand. Same with rebound, but with your fingers as you try to pull it up. Imagine a tire connected to the damper. If you pull up the damper with the same force and pain through you fingers, the tire will stay on the ground more the softer the damper. However...if you introduce aero into the equation it changes some things. If your car requires a stable aero platform, in the rebound phase, aero is actively pushing the car back down. Rebound stiffness keeps the car down, allowing the car to remain in its optimal aero "window". In non aero cars, this downward force (ahem downforce) does not exist. So in aero cars, as with ACC (which features a self proclaimed "sophisticated" aero model), keeping a car in the rebound phase and in the optimal aero window is key to load. But is not mechanical load. Its aero load. As you can surmise, aero and downforce windows overshadow mechanical concerns in a lot of ways. From a sim racing development perspective, emphasis on aero can indeed overshadow mechanical flaws as well. In AMS2 the slower you go (less aero), the more mechanical concerns take over, as in RL. Online sim racing guides you find will filter you to the principles (aero/mechanical) that most effect their cars. In AMS2 its simple. The slower you go, the more mechanical, the faster you go the more aero.
@andrewfarquhar9083
@andrewfarquhar9083 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent as always my ams2 does not show rate only single numbers despite a full reload after physics update is it wrong?
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
Go to options, gameplay, display and change from increments to rates.
@andrewfarquhar9083
@andrewfarquhar9083 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you
@RevRideReason
@RevRideReason 2 жыл бұрын
In a front engine RWD car with no Aero like a road car, Mustang, on an initial turn in "assuming steering and throttle inputs are gradual before and after changes", will stiffening the rear dampers and softening the front on let's say even springs front to back, give the car less turn in bit or understeer because of added load to the rear tires from stiffer dampers on the rear producing a little more rear wheel tire grip on a heavy front car you think ?
@RevRideReason
@RevRideReason 2 жыл бұрын
I know we're talking about AMS2, but correct me if I'm wrong. I think you said it relates physics wise the reason why you're most interested in AMS2. Thanks 27
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
Stiffer rear rebounds will give the car more turn in. In the rebound phase, stiffer means less load in a non-aero car. Less load in rebound transfers more load to the other tires, in this case the fronts.
@RevRideReason
@RevRideReason 2 жыл бұрын
@@Steelcast27 oh ok thanks for your help man
@juanmata4318
@juanmata4318 2 жыл бұрын
In a sense I know what they are for, BUT not enough as far what to look for when tuning oversteer understeer and driver preference characteristics
@cdrseabee
@cdrseabee 2 жыл бұрын
Which should one start with low/high speed non aero cars handling. ARB/springs/dampers?
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
It depends on your issue and how severe it is. Springs for big entry or exit issues. Arbs for mid corner rotation. Dampers for influences.
@cdrseabee
@cdrseabee 2 жыл бұрын
@@Steelcast27 Thanks. Looking forward to that flow chart!
@Darkaccent
@Darkaccent 2 жыл бұрын
I am very confused by your explanation of rebound. A stiffer rebound setting causes the shock to extend slower, therfore not transferring load as quick as a softer rebound setting. This is correct... Is it not??
@Steelcast27
@Steelcast27 2 жыл бұрын
Common misconception. Stiff Rebounds slow the extension but transfer load quicker. Soft rebounds allow the tire to maintain the track better and thus, keep the load. A tire that is off the ground because the rebounds are too stiff transfer the load to the other tires.
@sjoukehoekstra8
@sjoukehoekstra8 Ай бұрын
Stiff rebound slows down weight transfer, leading to more grip. Stiff rebound can lead to grip loss if wheels are being lifted off of the ground. Both of you are correct. Increase rebound stiffness for more grip, but make sure it's not too stiff. This is not explained well in the video however.
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