Great talk David. It's quite sad that sometimes people with good intentions, like the guy at the end concerned about recording dying languages, take their frustrations out on completely benign artistic endeavors like conlanging. It's sad because that attitude is basically implying that people who have a genuine love for language and want to engage artistically with it are doing something wrong because they aren't devoting their energy to getting out in the field. It's a really bizarre argument. David's analogy about the fiction writer and historian is a good one, and it threw the guy off. He didn't explain why David's analogy was fallacious despite claiming it was, he just rebutted with a false analogy himself. Choosing to devote your interest and skills in language to using language artistically is in no way equivalent to ISIS destroying cultural artifacts. In the ISIS analogy, people are actively destroying cultural artifacts, not merely neglecting them because they're choosing to devote their energy to do art instead of artifact protection lol; what a strange argument. And in David's case, he shouldn't be considered doing a disservice to dying languages because he's not himself out there recording languages. Conlanging isn't done at the expense of language preservation. To argue otherwise, you're basically saying that art of any form is a disservice to humanity because in a hypothetical world artists with any practical skills could be devoting their energy to other things. I don't imagine many people would defend that perspective when it comes to traditional art forms, yet for some reason when it comes to people playing artistically with language in this manner (an art form just really starting to catch on) some people get all riled up. The position is very illogical. Furthermore, conlangs in art media seem to be getting a lot of people interested in language and linguistics who otherwise wouldn't have become interested in these things. People getting excited about language, no matter how that initial excitement begins (through art or otherwise), seems to only be a good thing to me.

When that guy at the end used the term "geeking out" again and again it reminded me that being known as a "geek" used to be universally a bad thing, rather than now it it simply means being passionate about something out of the ordinary

At about 7:44, the subtitle claims that David is inaudible. It is wrong. He clearly says "lexemes" and I'm assuming the subtitler didn't know that was a word.

I'm sure the dying languages don't have a way of saying, "engage the cloaking device," or "beam the dilithium to cargo bay three." Or that word that commands the dragons to kill its enemies.

Re: preservation of dying languages- I think the gentleman in the audience makes the mistake of presuming that art is without value if it is without "utility." How dare I make cheesecake when orphans starve? Should I condemn myself to a life without enjoyment because others suffer? Further- I would suggest that the dying of languages is the result of colonization and power dynamics which can't be solved or corrected through art forms alone. Thanks, David, for giving this talk.

The hair gets me everytime. So well groomed and simple, it fits him perfectly.

holy shit at the end there David roasted him

Using existing natlangs would be appropriate if you're setting the story in the culture in question. If you're setting it in a fictional culture, go ahead and use a conlang.

A wonderful talk, especially the feedback on the last question from the audience.

I can think of nothing more offensive than using a marginalized and dying language to use for a fictional race in your nerd book. The man is speaking facts when he said “we should be putting the same energy as we put into learning Klingon as we do into” reviving Ido or Basque or Nuatl or whatever, but to say that conlanging is somehow distracting from it? Or to say that we should just use these languages as “foreign-sounding languages for tv shows” is just bizarre. It feels like a poorly thought-out “gotcha” question. “I’m going to prove that I’m smarter and more culturally aware than you.” Like reviving a dying language is very noble, and props on this guy for bringing it up, but to say “why make a language when there are dying languages...” just completely off-topic

That "ISIS is a thing that exists in the world so don't do your job" guy's anger seems misdirected...

It's funny, because I got a degree in linguistics for two main reasons - to conlang better (it was a hobby several years before I got to college) and to work on dying languages, which I can't do directly because I'm semi verbal and have auditory processing disorder - but I am Cornish so I am really into learning Cornish and I know so many people who are into conlanging are also into dying languages and learning minority languges, it's just strange to me that people present that as an either/or when in my experience, it tends to be both (not usually going to communities to record dying languages, which is something I'd love to do but can't, but learning languages that are dying or otherwise minority) And it's not like all conlangers would immediately be going to save dying languages if it wasn't for the conlanging getting in the way...

If you are talking about creating endangered language media for the purposes of preserving that language, then that media should really be made by and for that language's community of speakers, or if appropriate, people wishing to join, or rejoin, that existing community, because those are the people you need to engage in order to keep the language alive. Conlanging is really a completely different audience and market, from minority language resources, especially conlanging in the context of mass media sci fi and fantasy works like _Avatar_ or _Game of Thrones_.

David he was first with the god damn DVD corner meme, and he didn't even know it.

People don't understand that a mass of people can't be controlled. Why isn't more energy put on learning real dying languages? Because people think it's more fun to make their own languages, and the community isn't a bunch of robots that can just be told to start focusing on other things.

50:00 Oh man, someone get the popcorn.

What did the guy at the end say in response to David Peterson's "Let's just give this language to the bloodthirsty violent people, how would that have been?" seemed quiet but that was definitely a knock-out punch from David. But it probably comes up so often David basically has a response pretty much rehearsed at this point, lol

For me; 'esquisnas' is edges and 'rincones' is corners. That's just what I always thought

As soon as the final question used "geeks" as a demeaning term I immediately understood that the asker did not have a genuine motive and simply wanted to hate on a group of people culturally different from him. And to use protecting dying languages as a vessel for vitriol is just about the most disgusting thing I can imagine in the field of linguistics.

It's not "cuantos equinas" it's "cuantas esquinas"

I love the way this guy acts

I've watched this video three times, I can't stop re-watching...

9 mins in. This is one hell of a tough crowd.

What do you feel about being readily to capitalize on dying cultures rather than creating neutral artistic productions that aren't stolen from people who aren't even willing to share ?

It's a great book! It's been very helpful in my own conlang hobby ;)

Brilliant! So much fun to listen to

It was a great talk, and he answered the last guy's question very well.

49:25 this guy needs to realize it's not everyone else's job to do something just because he cares about it. "Could be learning dying languages." Hun, these artificial languages are what get some people interested in stuff like linguistics. It isn't "Klingon over (insert dying foreign language)." It's Klingon or disinterest. The only thing that's going to dedicate a person or get someone interested in something like a language that's dying out is simply if THAT SPECIFIC LANGUAGE attracted them. Besides, if shows nowadays just started using random languages over them 'dying out' they'd be harshly accused of cultural appropriation. A fantasy dragon world is not the setting for a small tribal, rarely known language that was just randomly picked up over its lack of usage.

very interesting talk with good answers to the audience questions.

Anyone else getting a young Nic Cage vibe?

Dying natlangs being used in the context conlangs are typically used would most likely be interpreted as inappropriate because you’re separating the language from the culture and removing the significance of it’s evolution to just randomly attach it to civilizations and aliens that don’t exist. Dying cultures with dying languages are not assisted by being attached to fantastical fictional portrayals because it actually pushes the otherness that contributes to its estrangement from the societies surrounding it. The argument of using natlangs more in movies and shows really doesn’t need to be presented to someone who creates languages for fantasy stories with independent histories and cultures

I think the question everyone is debating is reasonable, just a bit derailed because it was framed in such an adversarial way. 1. David's answers are great so I won't try to improve on them. 2. Languages in fiction being substantive is way more likely to interest people in linguistics then using "not quite latin" or "english but obscured with a different alphabet"

Ilaärto trira kòr xirxir en! Predict-I will continue great speaker being!

27:10 Slight correction here: the rebracketing actually happened the other way round, and it was more of a shortening (of phrases like 'mine uncle', 'thine uncle') than a true rebracketing. I remember the King Lear script is full of references to 'Nuncle' this and 'Nuncle' that. Sadly, this particular shortening didn't last until the present day.

I find this to be so DOPE!!!

Just visiting to say that's this is a terrifying thumbnail. Will be back to watch though... David's a peach :)

Correction ¿Cuántas esquinas hay? with an "a" ... or is it? Google throws up lots of results from spanish native speakers which don´t seem to care about conjugation for the question word, "cuánto(s)?" Anyone know?

A special verb conjugation just for sporting events would be an interesting language feature!

Man, what I'd give for a 2week course with David to help me understand how this all functions in layman's terms at least. I get lost like crazy trying to understand all the technical linguistic stuff

38:00 Interesting the Bock Saga claims 2 original languages. Root and Van. The Van broke into 10 kingdoms and the Root were isolated during the ice age.

Clipper ship captain = clipper shipper.

I'd like to hear his views on regional accents within his constructed languages. If he invents a planet-wide language, is it all spoken the same way or is there the equivalent of Australian-Klingon, British-Klingon, etc? My northern British English accent is full of (or missing?) dropped h's, and glottal stops. I pronounce 'glass' to rhyme with mass, not with farce. The word 'shouldn't' comes out of my mouth as 'shunt'. That also means I can the c-word without fear of censure in certain contexts, whereas others couldn't/cunt! Is this something the conlang community takes into account, the pronunciation of the same word, but in different ways?

I think _all_ languages are beautiful.

38:13 I mean so many languages now are going unrecorded so maybe not it's just where the resources and personnel are to do so

Idk why, but people clapping at first had me dead lmaoo

27:10 Actually, he's wrong. The word "oncle" has always been this way. It comes from French _oncle_ itself from latin _avunculus_ A correct exemple of what is trying to illustrate would be "nickname". Indeed, this word used to be _ekename_ in early middle English. Due to a wrong rebracketing, the word went from _an ekename_ to _a nekename_ which gave us the word as we know it today

In the subtitles: 7:42 [INAUDIBLE]: Lexeme kzfaq.info/get/bejne/kJtgh5Cl2NLWl6c.htmlm10s [? word and ?]: Word and paradigm

There are probably many fold languages dead that no one even knows about when compared against all of the sum of languages that exist today. Languages die, it kinda sucks, I guess, but it is going to happen, but no let's expect people with the education required to preserve these languages to give up their passion to do something they aren't really interested in doing.

base 7 barely makes any sense, because it’s probably one of the most impractical bases. it seems really odd that such a smart culture would willingly pick such a bad base system tbh. well at least that should add to this mystery of them? nonetheless, outstanding talk, this was quite inspirational and got me quite inspired. so thanks for taking your time to do it!

Apparently f t and s in a row in a word is barbaric, I how this person talks.

36:30 wash sounds like water rushing. sh sounds like a river. Funny how this was in another google talk.

Topkek, K-T-B is an overused example

what he does is so beautiful!

Last guy really made a dumb argument, ignorantly accused David of a false analogy, and shamelessly strawmanned him.

8:47 Thanos XD

Anyone else notice his thumbs are the same shape as his fingers

I don't like the word 'sixth' because I can't pronounce it, and the sound of it is just unpleasant. I have nothing against the number six, I just don't like 'sixth'.

16:59 which language is that?

Glow= glühen in German

For folks who stuck around, found the ReaL LiNgUiSt.

Esquinas is feminin in Spanish 😐. But whatever great video

HAHA that ethics guy... wtf! "I think the sentiment is well founded, I don't think the solution you present is a good one, or feasible, or necessarily respectful." haha CRUSHED! he is like the linguistics equivalent of a SJW, i.e. self righteous and ignorant.

I agree with the practical reasons David gave about why real dying languages aren't used in this way, but I don't know why the real native speakers would be offended if they were. If I was a speaker of a dying language, I can't imagine being offended if I heard it spoken by a fictional race on TV, and I would probably be happy if it got people interested in the language in the real world. At least the language would be getting exposure, and maybe it would be saved in this 'disrespectful' way. But all the reasons he gave about the difficulty in finding a native speaker who would be able to translate everything, I completely agree.

In the series The 100, every time they speak that foreign language, the whole thing is kind of fake. The expression on their faces is fake, the accent sounds fake, I think. I think I would enjoy the series more if they just kind of speak, like, English. But then, it's Hollywood.

The absolute most hideous word in English is "sixths". The /sθs/ cluster is just ridiculous.

Ironically American english is more like the english spoken in Mozart's day than modern British english.

That dude at the end sucks. People can choose what they want to do!

Guy at 47:50 needs to get laid. If he is so upset he should do something about it himself.

hey David petter son visited my school for career day it is actually true haters might say isn't

I think the man talking about old languages had a completely valid question, to be honest. I think it'd be a nice idea

Uhm. What is the point of creating a new language? Like, we can’t even understand other cultures and their values in languages that already exist. Everyone’s pumped for some guy making a brand new language? …for profitability?? Naaaah.

why is “the art of language invention” spelled with a j instead of a dʒ