Lowest bid contractor.

Depends on the Military actually. I think we can all agree that US Military Grade is far superior to Russian Military Grade.

It means that it meets the requirements of the contract it was procured under.

​@@animeman8203the m16 was iniatilly a failure. 80 years old aks works like dream. You can tell them reds all you want but they sure know how to make them weapons.

@robertnelson4460 not even that in most cases. It normally falls short in at least one, often more ways, and is still used because it is what is there. I will admit there are certain things that aren't skipped on to the same extent, largely with air power and naval boats. But most things are the cheapest they can get, while still allowing it to work. It is not a standard of quality. It really can't be, not if you have a military of any significant size anyway.

I'm glad someone else caught this👍

And China keep these ships in the range of their anti-surface/anti-air umbrella. While US ships are scattered by handfuls.

Came to say this. The tonnage gap is enormous.

@@Anon33467 yes. But also those China's small ships are anti-ship missiles armed ones who doesn't need waste tonnage for fuel, accommodation and food/spares stores, unlike US's. Yeah, USA has super carriers...and China has military aerodromes, and anti-missile batteries, and anti-ship/surface missiles batteries, anti-air missile batteries, coverage of radars, and etc., and etc., while on the land in their homeland. Their Navies are built for different tasks. US's is for projection of force, China's for annihilation of hostiles near China.

@@AKUJIVALDO that is irrelevant to my post

I completely agree with you. I also think the ISD was made for suppression of local systems through intimidation and was designed for planetary bombardment with its turbo lasers and TIE bombers followed up with its organic troop component.

@@Emperorvalse The ISDs were Antiques of their own. They were built at the end of the Clone Wars to deal with numerous amounts of CIS ships. Since 1 Venator could not take down 2 Munificent class dreadnoughts without sustaining a questionable degree of damage.

America that’s the show yhr force

And this was why Thrawn advocated for the Empire to field more advanced TIE Fighters, like the TIE Defender, which could, in the hands of a capable pilot, deal with X-Wings, A-Wings, B-Wings and whatever else the Rebels had in their arsenal.

I love the comparison of the tie fighter to the zero, both were infamous for turning into a ball of fire when hit

Yep, pretty much.

They'd do what other tyrants do. Restrict ammo for frontier forces giving only enough to resist an attack long enough for central forces to reinforce. But not enough for a rebellion to resist central forces. When frontiers in rebellion can resupply without imperial support they can rebel successfully. That's what happened to Rome. But its wealth originated in the frontier. So when the frontier resisted payment Rome fell.

most likely munitions would have been produced in the outer rim @@dpsamu2000

​@@dpsamu2000"Sorry Sir, we've spent lots of ammo in training and rehearsals, please give us more. We're not stockpiling. Pinky promise :)"

For an empire, the most valuable currency is control. A uniform force that can be shuffled around at will, answers directly and solely to central authority and has no sympathies to local populace is vastly preferable to a more cost efficient local defense force made up of local populace, from emperor's perspective.

not just planets whole sectors. i at least hope i am not the only one reforming sectors, reassigning planets and mass assigning governers for the respective roles the sector/plantes have to serve

​@@deathtrooper7760How do you do that? I thought sectors are now automatically generated around the sector capital.

@@Michi-vg2kk you can manually adjust them, adding and removing systems. you should be able to do that from the sctor capital planet interface. they reintroduced this option with astral planes or some time around it. it came at the same time as the option to instal planetary goveners ontop of the sector ones. I used it primarly to min max the mineral and alloy output from former machine worlds i conqured.

Stellaris rewards specialization because planet-to-planet transport is essentially free and each planet can easily produce just one thing, importing all the rest. In SW it can be inferred that inter-sector transit is likewise very cheap.

That isn't what the Clone Wars taught, though.

I’ll disagree with you VERY slightly. It’s geared towards appearing a big target that’s too big to assault but the second you figure out how to take one down they’re finished

@@Historyandlegends789 This isn't even vaguely accurate, though.

@@Historyandlegends789 that is another thing, they wanted to project fear but left openings.

The _Imperial_-class was built to win the fleet combats of the Clone Wars, and we have every indication they would have done exactly that. Anything short of the _Providence_-class dreadnoughts would have been immediately run over, and even they couldn't go toe to toe with an ISD. The thing is, ISDs weren't fighting the Clone Wars, and nothing was trying to go toe to toe with them.

That's actually almost the only thing they got right. The ideal shape of any large space combat vessel should be a tetrahedron of some sort.

@@DoremiFasolatido1979 It's not a tetrahedron. It's a squished pyramid.

@stcredzero I said "almost". They got closer than anything else has.

@@DoremiFasolatido1979 Okay, I'll grant close. Actually, it could also be seen as 2 tetrahedrons.

@@stcredzero One of few actual flaws of ISD was the hangar. It is because original Tector class was designed as Battlecruiseer (in navy sense). Designed to fight with enemy capital ships in skirmishes. With fighter escort provided by smaller Gladiator class, what was not meant to participate in direct combat. Problem was that Clone Wars ended, before they enter service. With only smaller Victory (what was direct fallow up to Acclimator Assault Ship) participating in Battle over Coruscant (they swept CIS navy almost exactly after scene in movie and cartoon end). Anyway. That meant that Tactor was not needed anymore. But empire need something more multi-purpose what could do more colonial supervision duty. Because design was almost finished and capable. They scrap Gladiator entirely (beside few ships what were already build) and relocated hangar to hull of Tector also giving it Assault Ship role (and a massive structural venerability). As such weird hybrid was created, what in theory could do everything, but neither could do particularly well or for rational cost. Though it was a decent ship if used in close to intended role. It is why Thrawn was still using them. Empire was basically like five year old who send Battleship after random pirates.

Vader did the same and arguably have more success (while Defender was amazing, it was prohibitively expansive). Problem was that Emperor has its pet Death Star program, what siphoned all money.

LOL TIE FIGHTAR AM NO SHELDS. How much did shields matter in A New Hope again? Go on, I'm waiting.

​@zephyr8072 If the TIE fighters that chased Luke had sheilds, they would be able to take the shots from The Millennium Falcon and maybe kill Luke, preventing the Death Star from exploding.

​@@zephyr8072 It depend. A-Wing pilots commonly remove shields to get better performance. But basic TIE was straight obsolete, being overrun by a bombers! Generally they were equivalents of Z-95 and slightly better then V-Wing. Using Squadrons (game) as example. A-Wing and Interceptor pairing is accurate. A-Wing has token shield and was faster. When Interceptor has better weapons and was more agile. BUT! Actual equivalent of X-Wing during that period was TIE/AG Aggressor. What was way more capable TIE variant, with missiles (LN has none!) and turret. While it didn't have a shield, turret could easily compensate this flaw. They use LN in game only for nostalgia reason, as it simply could not compete with X-wing. Tie Bomber was straight obsolete! It was designed only for ground attack and it could not effectively attack target in space. Its use in the game is for the nostalgia reasons (at least Y-Wing was still useful, especially with after market modifications). What Should be in the game is TIE/CA Punisher (Interdictor in Legends) What have massively upgunned weapon platform. What could in fact deliver massive punishment to anything in space and in fact did have potent shield! I remind that both are in new canon and were used in that period!

@@StevenRamos248 As side note. TIE/LN variants from Vader Fist, were actually heavily upgraded. They in fact did have shields and hyper-drives, as they were part of Advance Program. Though of course they were not as good as later dedicated variants. Kylo use one of those fighters. So it was not a plot hole.

Count yourself fortunate.

@@TheGoddamnBacon how bad?

Depends on what you’re doing in college and what your media diet consists of but there’s plenty of people on KZfaq who approach things in the world from a material analysis/ political pov

Should watch TIKhistory, or the Foundation for Economic Education "FEE." TIKhistory's critics often mock him by saying "Stick to Tanks" he replies by "Stick to Banks." Because economics is often the driving force for national decisions like wars etc.

Allen loves this stuff. A true nerd

Did you mean Luke could just sneezed and destroyed the Galactic empire?

@@ashipthattriestobotheryou4759 Typically you wouldn't expect a couple of fighter proton torpedoes to completely obliterate a small moon, yet here we are.

And that is because writers write that way. After all, you can't make more books or movies when the literal super-human takes power in the biggest and most powerful star state in reality. Nothing can stop him/her anymore...unless some BS excuses are involved.

@@AKUJIVALDO Yes, but even in this vision a sense of excessive supposed omnipotence is losing them. They become overconfident.

@@janmos5178 except only overconfidence of Palps was for some "unknown" reason(AKA author's BS) believing that Vader will always do his bidding, going so far as to kill his son...after going off the rails to protect Padme...his son's mother. Yeah... So in the end it is always author's BS.

@@AKUJIVALDO The idea that Palpatine had 'no reason' to be arrogant in regards to the control he had over Vader, despite the fact that Vader was an obedient dog that obeyed his every whim, knowingly or unknowingly, for literally almost his entire life, and has been specifically cultivated and conditioned by him for most of said life to be said loyal attack dog, to the point Vader willingly betrayed all of his morals and principles to save his life, is hysterically funny. Palpatine made one, singular mistake in the entire franchise, and it was trusting he had enough control over Vader to keep him in line for the few seconds it would take to fry the boy. Big whoop.

🤓

Inb4 china tries to get in contact with you after seeing this comment, opsec finna go crazy

I second this ❤

General Kenobi

Well, without the first Death Star, the second would have also been a long-term project. All of the supply lines and R&D already existed from the first. That's how in three years one could practically operational.

The Empire was already the largest and most powerful military force in the history of the galaxy, lul.

@@papapalps2415lasted 20 years comparing to the other empires he is right if palpatine wasn’t hell bent on people fearing him it woulda been greater

@@papapalps2415and I doubt it was Valkorion Empire was far more powerful if only he didn’t decide on fighting both sith n Jedi

@@karltimmer3261 The Empire lasted 'only' 20 years because Palpatine was killed at the eleventh hour in a last second betrayal by his right hand man/the literal Chosen One in a moment prophesied about for millenia, and was likely THE single most significant event in galactic history as a whole. Trying to dismiss all the context behind it is cute, but it isn't going to work. As for the Eternal Empire; you are, factually, wrong. The number of statements declaring the Galactic Empire was the largest and most powerful military force are likely somewhere in the double digits. If you wish to prove otherwise, then you will be doing so.

Hubris destroys.

Actually, that was still done in WW1 and WW2, to provide convoy excorts.

Armed merchant vessels have been a thing since wind powered navy

Nobody said that the reclaimed ships need to be manned by their original crews. It's a better idea to fill them with navy seamen

This a literal child's solution to economic, infrastructural and societal issues. Like, I geniunely think this is an idea I recall being floated by teenagers back in high school during group projects. Although amusingly, it also seems to be a policy of many third world countries in RL. Which shows what I am saying wonderfully, lmfao.

@@papapalps2415 Fair enough those are not my fields of expertise. Now do you actually have any suggestions or possible answers to the massive issue of a low population across a massive area that makes the building of infrastructure and the defense of said infrastructure nearly impossible due to it having not nearly enough people? If you're here to throw shit, well bullseye, I know pretty much nothing about these sorts of things because I find the language and people typically involved in these fields aggravating at a deeply fundamental level. Now do you actually have something constructive to say or can your contribution be summarized as "Lol ur dum!" and nothing else? Any suggestions as to how the issue of The Outer Rims may be solved?

Just like that libertarian town that got overrun by bears?

The issue of the Outer Rim would be broken by improving land infrastructure and communications. Together with work programs, affirmation programs especially on local administration and specialized education tailored to the Outer Rim's world The benefits will come in a long time. But it will be great. The programs are meant to make every citizen more productive through expertise that is tailored to their home planets' specialty The Outer Rim problem is not a population problem, its a produtivity problem

@@naoyanaraharjo4693 Nah. Again, it's far more complicated than 'just build infrastructure lul'. There's any countless number of powers in the galaxy, and the Rim, with a vested interest in keeping the status quo. SW very much operates like a feudal society in some aspects, namely in the massive power of certain noble families/houses, as well as the corporations. To say nothing of the Hutts, naturally.

lol!

"....and finally defeat..." Fighter quality, or lack thereof, isn't what defeated the Empire, though. I urge you to actually consider watching ROTJ, it really is quite good. "The lack of even basic shields ensured a future where very few experienced pilots would survive to train..." This is nonsense, though, because based off literally almost every piece of visual media in existence, fighter-grade shielding doesn't seem to meaningfully affect survival in combat, nor does this make much of any sense regardless, seeing how the Empire was primarily built for internal policing and peace keeping enforcement. Very, very few pilots would see much combat regardless. And from an alternate perspective; what TIE pilots DO survive heavy combat (even if the idea that being unshielded=TEEHH SUCCKKZZ was entertained) are going to be god-like, and easily relative to even the Rebel's best. Which is...hm, uh, exactly what we see in ANH? UH-OH. "It also encapsulated the Empire's arrogant belief that it could somehow endlessly absord losses in the event if a true conflict..." Fucking lul what? I don't even know where to start here. Should it be that the idea that the pre-Endor Galactic Civil War being a 'true conflict' is fucking delusonally insane and utterly detached from the source material? Or the idea that the Empire COULDNT absorb whatever relatively miniscule losses it usually took? Or perhaps most amusingly, that the Empire COULDNT take the loss of a few fucking TIE's, despite heing a government that can shit out planet vaporizing battlemoons in total secrecy? "Had he lacked shields during the Death Star trench run, Vader's shots likely would have destroyed him..." So have you just never watched ANH, or...?

I see it as one of those problems that the Empire could never solve without not being an empire: imperial doctrine demanded TIE pilots be dependent on their home ship, otherwise rebel pilots could easily defect and fly away with them if they had the ability to work independently.

@@oscaranderson5719 Something the empire could have done if they wanted was have small "carrier" transports without all the long term facilities, like an upscaled transport ring for an entire squadron. I think Star Wars Rebels showed some cases of the empire fielding less than an ISD. The loss of apparently difficult to train crew & pilots seems a bigger oversight though if they had to fight a full scale war.

@@SyncViews they could, and smaller ships did exist, but the smaller they made them the easier it would be for a crew to defect with them. the nebulon-b actually did have a hangar to deploy fighters and it got nicked constantly. ah, not to say your assessment isn’t correct- I 100% agree with it- I just see it as realistic that an evil empire would jump to the obvious short-term solution when facing an insurgency.

Because star wars puts an over emphasis on the capabilities of star fighters, which against large cruisers like an ISD lack the weapons to deal any meaningful damage. Even proton torpedoes lack penetration power, we can see the damage one does when it is shot from red leader and fails to go into the thermal exhaust port. It only causes superficial surface damage and this is supposed to be a fighters anti ship weapon, which mind you it's intended targets again are not cruisers but smaller corvettes and frigates. Fact of the matter is that unless a fighter is specifically equipped to deal with heavily armored and shield targets it is not going to be effective against large cruisers, only against other fighters, corvettes and frigates. The ISD is literally the pinnacle of ship of the line design philosophy having significant firepower, 60 turbo lasers and 60 ion cannons, a large complement of craft, 48 TIE ln fighters 12 TIE bombers and 12 TIE rc recon fighters, and the durability to go toe to toe with nearly any other cruiser scale ship and come out on top. Same cannot be said of the venator.

@@colinbielat8558 and it still can't shoot down bunch of fighters and gets bullied by rebels with nothing more than corvetes and a skyscrapper with engines bolted to it. This is same lvl of stupid as WW2 battleship being sunk by somalian pirates. And if you are going to use this battle as a reference for fighters anti ship capabilities I would like to remind you that 5min earlier SSD got destroyed by some random dude ramming it with a fighter, even concentrating forward firepower did not help.

@@xzardas541 rouge one is one of the worst star wars movies ever made, people only like it for the Vader hallway scene. Anything in that movie should even be brought up in any arguments. 120 guns on an ISD will put up a wall of fire that will either completely vaporizer a fighter or fry its electronics and focing them to continue on their trajectory until they crash into something or die from lack of oxygen.

@@colinbielat8558 I was referencing original trilogy but sure, whatever you say.

@@xzardas541we see many times that Star Destroyers had the accuracy to hit smaller targets, even though the millennium falcon was more bigger than an X-wing, the hit;miss ratio was actually pretty good, so really I’d say hitting an enemy fighter each 8 shots or so isn’t a stretch, and also what happened at endor was pure storytelling nonsense

Stormtroopers lost to teddy bears with sticks and stones of course they could not fight those aliens alone.

​@@redenginnerGod I fucking hate this fanbase so much. So much blatant misinformation passed off as factual, so many random, half-recalled, butchered quotes taken out context, and so many little gems like this; wherein a quote from a sarcastic Han is passed down like holy gospel and spread via the grapevine like this, whilst ACTUAL GODDAMN QUOTES wherein Imperials and the Vong themselves admit that the Empire would have obliterated them had it been a few decades early mysteriously never appear in the collective imagination.

​@@rapatacush3Watch ROTJ ploz.

This entire post is literal nonsense, though. The Empire wasn't preparing for the Vong explictly; this is based on nothing but fanon presumptions, and Imperial apologia. And per everybody from Imperials, the Vong themselves, and basic common sense, we literally know the Empire would have won against the Vong with ease, Jedi or not.

@@redenginner sounds like something Han would have said

Yup. We ahve about 12 carriers. China has only 4 max

The F-35 program is slated to replace 3 aircraft programs (the F-16, F/A-18, and A-10) in the US military alone, for less than the combined cost of those programs, while adding stealth and datalink capabilities. It is the most advanced combat aircraft ever invented. You want to see stagnation, go ask China how their knockoffs are doing.

Also? That aircraft at 6:50 is not the F-35, but the F-22 - the first 5th-gen fighter, the previous title-holder for most advanced combat aircraft ever invented, and probably still the best dogfighter ever produced.

You missed that the Ewoks were furry Vietcong?

@@jonharrison9222 no not that but I meant more the parallels between the empire and the US

They don't use anti-matter.

Pulling information out of your arse; we see that Stormtroopers were Elite forces not just compared to “other troops” and we also see that TIE Fighters were able to outclass X-wings in dogfights, low performance my ass

Yeah and most of China’s numbers advantage is fishing boats with guns on the front.

The Dark Trooper project was originally in the old EU. And it was better developed there.

@@dylandarnell3657 i know i used it as an example of the empire trying to improve their quality in this case the troopers

The V-wing was not in anyway superior to the TIE Fighters besides from having a small number of concussion missiles. Otherwise, the TIE Fighter completely outclassed it in Speed, Maneuverability, Laser Cannon firepower, and Targeting Systems.

Venators wouldn't do s***. For one they would require significant time in dry dock to have the storage racks installed in them, if they can even be installed at all in a venator. And even then the venator is a very horriblely designed ship, it has to much open space that can cause explosive decompression, is entirely reliant on internal tensor fields to keep its hull together due to the huge open space and lacks the necessary armaments to go toe to toe with more armored cruisers.

Agree.

Agreed, if there were a lot more AI ran fighter ships with the main ship controlling them, it would've saved a lot more personal. Sadly the star wars galaxy has had a few robot rebellions in the past and hates using AI for complex things. Using personal for controlling ships is a tried and true functionality, but lacking in innovation. I believe there was a Legends story where a whole space station was run by an AI and was WAY more effective then being ran by people in terms of defense.

This isn't actually how military spending nor industrial production nor gurellia warfare works in the slightest.

@@papapalps2415 Yeah, that username just proves my point. And for your information, authoritarian dictators do in fact have significant control over their militaries and military spending. Then there's the direct actual examples of those individuals pulling production and funding from general military spending to fund personal pet projects.

@@StarShadowPrimal Right, but it isn't, though. You can't just magically dump money in the ways you are whining about, nor is this how standardized mass production works, nor, most amusing of all, is any of this even accurate to the source material anyways, as ISDs already made up 1% or less of the fleet.

@@papapalps2415 Look, we get it. You are salty because your namesake was a miserably poor leader who lost everything he had stolen to a small resistance movement. He nearly collapsed the galactic economy to build 2 moon-sized space stations for the sake of causing fear, but they failed so badly that combined they destroyed nearly as many Imperial bases/cities/planets in tests as they did enemy capital ships in actual battle. He built something like 25,000 Star Destroyers as do-everything massive generalist designs that were regularly destroyed by vastly more efficient and inexpensive groups of specialists. Military design SHOULDN'T work that way, but it very much did and Palpatine paid the price for his hubris..

@@StarShadowPrimal "Look, we get it..." Who is 'we'...? "You are salty because your namesake was a miserably poor leader..." And your proof of this is...? "...who lost everything he had to stolen to a small resistance movement..." That isn't what happened, though. He, and the Empire by extension, lost because he died due to a eleventh hour, last possible second betrayal by his right hand man/the literal Chosen One, in a moment prophesied about for thousands of years and guaranteed by the Force itself to remove the blight on itself that the Sith represented, and which Sidious embodied. "He nearly collapsed the Galactic economy..." Yes, sweetie. He almost collapsed it so bad, infact, that....uh, literally almost nobody noticed or was the wiser to the first one being built, nor the exponentially, orders of magnitude larger and more powerful second, both of which being built in total secrecy, in the middle of nowhere, with no preexisting logistics train or support. And then, a scant few years/decades afterwards, a small splinter movement of said government then went on to hollow out a planet and build an EVEN LARGER AND MORE POWERFUL version, in even MORE secrecy than before, alongside a full galaxy conquering navy (much of these arguments also pertain to the old canon, as well). "...but they failed so badly..." ...That they had to instantly and immediately targeted by the Rebellion in force, as otherwise they represented an existential threat to their continued existence and any further resistance to the Empire, yes. "...that were regularly destroyed..." Lul no. "...by vastly more efficient..." They weren't, no. "Military design SHOULDNT work in way..." I fucking love when KZfaq randoms try to bullshit their way to victory by just throwing endless amounts of meandering bile at me like you came up with it yourself.