"Let's elevate the conversation, do you really want to continue like this?" - Is there really a place to "elevate" to, or is this the proper response already? - Does it matter if we _want_ to "continue like this," if this is the right way to proceed?

One can acknowledge most of the residents of Sodom probably had some good qualities, while simultaneously acknowledging God's judgment was for a reason and not just because.

Yes Rod it hurts when you see these people going down the wrong path. They are on a journey in life. They just took a wrong turn. Try nudging them back on the straight and narrow

It seems that you're asking the question, "What rank-order does each CRC member put these three priorities in?" 1. Unity 2. Devotion to true Christian doctrine 3. Devotion to false doctrine, i.e., the spirit of the age. if 2, 1, 3 -- Congratulations on your recent win in the CRC, may many more follow in every denomination! If 1, 2, 3 -- You're just about ready to swim the Tiber, what are you waiting for? if 2, 3, 1 or 3, 2, 1 -- Welcome to the Comments Section, you'll fit right in here! if 1, 3, 2 or 3, 1, 2 -- Immediately turn to your nearest likeminded individual and ask, "Hans, are we the baddies?"

This is so difficult 😢

On lay people, the Affirming folks need to consolidate around local Affirming congregations. Then let Gay Jesus flourish ;-)

Incorporation ... plus a contract to contribute to and gain access to CRC corporate tools like Calvin College. Much faster and smoother than having to build new assets.

re progressives splitting into a parallel organization: I don't see how. All of the progressive patterns I know about are built on a purity spirit and the standard of holiness is a moving target. But I'm probably jaded.

Is there any example in the Bible of a sin being a "holy precious gift"?

If it is not a salvation issue please explain

21:11 Like that but what do you do in the meantime when the decades are going by? I think all churches are going to be dealing with this issue soon...

22:31 liked that rant.... "parallel structures ", would that still be a split?

Paul knows me a bit. About my lack of moderation. My opinion is “if you dont like our confessional church dont let the door hit you on the way out”. The Bible teaches “let your yes be yes and your no,s be no. Anything more comes from the Devil

Look at the bones! - Tim the Enchanter. Ezekiel 37:1-14 ... oh yee of little faith ...

While I have absolutely no love for modernism or progressivism, I'm perfectly fine with progressives having their own denominations and they can teach and believe whatever they like. The USA's greatest blessing has been the marketplace of churches and religion, and that's why we are one of the most religious nations on earth. So I'm perfectly happy with progressives having their say in this marketplace of spirituality. No one seems to fully understand why conservatives, evangelicals and fundamentalists can't abide by progressivism and it's ideas, but the reason is simple: progressivism has always been a very political project, with a lots of primarily atheistic, hedonistic, and materialistic fellow travelers, since progressivism is a product of modernism and postmodernism. Conservatives, on the other hand, like tradition and consistency. They are not looking for the next latest and greatest innovation to fall from the sky like the next installment in the Harry Potter series. They are also the "true believers" who want to keep the old ways, and are the guardians of the old ways. For a very concrete example of this type of conservatism, you need to rewatch the great film "Fiddler on the Roof". There are lines one does not cross in this life, one ignores tradition to one's peril.

I’d seen Rod in videos before but this one made me a giant fan. “You lose some friendships.” “Sorry, I refuse.” The CRC (and every organization) needs more people like him and less political partisans with theological windrow dressing.

Haha i like Rod a lot. He has the same mind as me in many respects. He must be an left over from the hippie era lol but i like how he thinks

More chaos in the "absolute morality given by God" folks who are constantly lecturing nonbelievers like me about how we are moral relativists. Who could have guessed?

I never hear any of these pastors quote scripture about the issue of sin and homosexuality! Why is this sin excused? If I’m living in a sin( no matter what sin) I need to be confronted in the scriptural way and told to repent. That’s what Jesus did! You guys talk in circles! I was a staunch CRC but left at age 45. My heart still breaks for that denomination. Stop this nonsense, I’m not impressed with your conversation at all!