It would seem that the .357 out of the carbine would be more like 1700 fps +, not 1440 as you stated.

Wow, it's always interesting and fun to see ballistics tests. The .357 Mag was definitely the surprise of the bunch. It is worth noting that the muzzle velocities printed on revolver cartridge boxes do not apply to lever guns, which can add 200-400 ft per second. The same .357 Mag round out of a revolver might have been a very different story.

Damon Bungard documented an Alaska caribou hunt where he used his 45/70 and accidentally took down two animals. One was standing behind his target and he did not see it. Luckily he had two tags. But yeah, 45/70 has some intense penetration.

Something very important to remember when shooting pistol calibers from rifles is that it is possible to drive a bullet faster than it's "performance envelope", I think is the term. Projectiles are designed to do specific things within a velocity range so a bullet that is intended to be fired from a handgun might have too much velocity when fired from a rifle and just totally break apart or do something totally different than what it's supposed to do. Lucky Gunner did a great video about that a while ago.

The 45/70 is a great defensive round for when they are lined up out side your solid wood door trying to take your pew, pews

Sling off all you like about those 'outmoded grandpa' rounds like the .45 long colt, .30-30 and 45-70 but they still pack a WALLOP and work as advertised.

Something to consider is that .38SPL lead flat point (WFN, WC, AND SWC) out of a revolver is pretty effective and would be even more so from a rifle and quieter than .357. In the .30-30 the less expensive standard 150gr soft point should perform just as well out to 150 yds. The revelution rounds are only needed for long range which is not a factor for home defense.

Interested to see what a .357 hollow point would have done. Not quite apples to apples with the leverevolution round vs the .44hp. Loving the series though. Just picked up a couple of Henrys. 30-30 brass and a .357 X. 😁😁

something to consider on the leverevolution rounds is they are designed for hunting not self defense to get more distance without having a pointed round hit the primer on the round in front of it go off in the tubular magazine.

One can assume the guy with the lever gun is an experienced hunter & woodsman who can hit what he aims at (not a mall ninja) and with any of these, the bad guy is pretty well buggered.

have loved this series, ty for putting this together. That 44 mag hollow point looks like a great option and less kick for better additional target acquisition

This is a great example of how important it is to know how your ammunition of choice- performs out of your firearm. Great video!

Dang, I was hoping you would’ve used a 158 grain SJHP for the 357 magnum. You may have gotten a better result considering you’re testing for a home defense situation. Still you proved what I’ve always believed about Leverevolution.

I just subscribed to your youtube channel after watching just 2 videos. Great job guys. I found your videos informative and very well done. I look forward to more great videos. By the way the calibers and bullet selections you selected were fantastic!

I have a S&W 629 V-Comp and a Rossi R92 20" in .44mag, so these results make me happy! Thanks.

Ive used the 240 gr xtp In 444 Marlin and it is one of the best rounds ive ever used.

Great video and test. It would be cool to do it at a further distance to give us the idea of damage at a long range. Thanks for the content

I would postulate that the reason for the deference in penetration is the FTX bullet is probably designed to expand well at or above 1800 - 2000 fps while the XTP is designed to expand well from 1200-1500 fps. The 357 or 45-70 did not achieve the required velocity for proper expansion of the FTX bullet. The 45-70 bullet was rated at 2000 fps but I bet that's from a 22' barrel and not a 16' barrel. The 357 is a very versatile round. Try a Hornady 125 gr XTP or even a 110 gr XTP.

If you reload, you can tame the 45-70 to be as light as you want. For shits and giggles I loaded 300gr rn with 8gr of Unique powder and a foam earplug forced down as a spacer, and also to hold the powder as close to the primer as possible. It was stuck in a 2x4 I shot just to see what would happen.

If you have a very fast round designed to expand its going to rip apart and dump energy much faster and penetrate less than a slower similar bullet

357 Mag 158gr XTP best choice Home use SD .. inside 357msg Levergun and use 38Spl quieter and will work perfectly

Would have liked to see the .357 magnum with the Hornady critical duty or similar hollow point. As well with a .38 special would reduce the penetration considerably compared for the leverlution load.

Love to see you do a video using a .454

The FTX is designed to hunt with, and is designed to penetrate further. Why not apples to apples on the rounds used, except for caliber and weight

Well done!

Federal classic 30-30 125gr is the best self defense load. Would love to see you try it.

sweet thanks

Bullet design and weight makes a lot of difference...

38spl sub sonic with a 16" barrel,. Is great for small game, meat on the table, thanks for the video.

"Most humans are 9" thick" -- no human I've ever met was made of gel. I didn't mean that to sound super negative--just pointing out gel is for a consistent medium that represents only one kind of human tissue. Shooting a BG in the chest, a bullet will encounter skin, muscle, thick sternum/ribs, nearly empty lung tissue, and then muscle and skin again, so weird things can happen. Very informative though, thanks or the videos.

Would be great to see a more realistic test. Clothing in front of the gel and some type of bone simulator. Entertaining video.

I like Paul's meat target better and closer to real life in my book.

I think I would run those pistol rounds over a chronograph. Your going to find they’re running at substantially higher velocities than are listed on the box. I run Hornady 125 grain XTP’s in my Rossi. I’m getting about 2100 fps out of the 16 inch barrel. They feed flawlessly and the energy dump would be amazing. Great series sir.

Why were ballistic tip rounds used when you’re testing for home defense? Just curious on the reasoning there.

The 30-30 had markedly less penetration but you have to remember, penetration isn't everything, it has more energy than a .357 by a large margin, like they said in the video - the block jumped up and all that energy was all dumped into the target, significantly more energy than the .357. that 30-30 will drop any mammal in North America. The 45-70 was designed for long range shooting and is very comparable to it, but I'd take a 30-30 for self defense any day.

Like to see 25.35. Hornady makes leverevolution cartridge.😊

Should get expansion on 30.30. Second block should catch it. Let's see.😊

No surprise on the performance of the 45/70. I am however very surprised with the .357. Might have to look into one of those. Almost behaves like a 30 carbine ballistically

I want to see the projectiles, how much they expanded and how much weight they retained. It didn’t look like any of them fragments much. My takeaway is that the Lever Revolution bullets don’t expand as well and over-penetrate. Honestly, I was disappointed in their performance here. However, as hunting Ammo they could be just perfect.

I just need to know which gun will kill more deader, 9mm to head or 45-70 anywhere else? More deader more better! Last time I shot someone partly dead I was worried bout the undead part talking smack to me.

Why didn't you use the .357, 180 grain XTP bullet? You probably would have gotten results similar to the .44.

These are some surprising results, always thought the 44mag would have more penetration then the 357mag

I think it has more to do with bullet shape than it does velocity. The two Leverevolution rounds acted like FMJ and just kept going.

Is the 2,400 fps MV of the .30-30 chronographed out of the 16" barrel, or is it the advertised MV from a 20" barrel?

I REEELLY want to see a ballistic gel test and Boston butt test with the .357 again using self defense loads not the leverevolution ammo! I would assume it’s perform better for defense.

Is he, the ballistic gel rep, actually saying @4:45 that penetration in gel equates to target (human or animal) inch-to-inch? Because it Absolutely does not, especially when clothing, skin or pelt, bone, organ, and empty space are thrown in the mix. Also, there are a few examples (‘official’ and youtuber tests) that say clear ballistic gel isnt as efficient and shows more penetration than actual calibrated ballistic gel. The clear stuff just “looks cooler”. Yall arent using the FBI layers of denim test either. Also, higher the velocity, the less penetration the round typically gets in gel, as long as it expands right, because of the expansion!

That has not been my experience with the 45/70. The leverevolution I have used has never exited deer from 12-75 yards broadside. The 44 penetrates deep and the .357 is similar.

Gotta remember that doesn’t have anything that simulates bones so in a rib cage that could slow down a lot faster 🤷‍♂️

.45-70 is an awesome home self-defense round if what's breaking into your house is cocaine bear.

Are the velocities you're quoting out of a pistol barrel or a rifle barrel? A chronograph would be helpful for this kind of testing to get an actual velocity. Also some different bullet types would have been cool, especially some hard cast bullets.

Where did you get the stocks that are on the 30-30 and 45-70 ?? This was a very cool video to watch

Leverevolution is optimized for hunting. Not really meant for human targets.

Shpuld have chronoes

I'd love your see you do tests with 110g, 125g, 158g and 180g XTPs in .357!! Please!.. To help clarify, as I make all my own ammo for over 40 years. The Hornady manual says, The 140g FTX out of an 8" revolver barrel at top powder charge is 1300 fps. Going to the rifle page the .357 with a 16" barrel at top powder charge is 1650 fps!.. That's 350 fps faster! Using the FTX bullet the case is actually shortened to 1.250 due to the different bullet ogive!. A normal .357 case length is 1.280 to 1.290. Once buying preloaded or cut down making your own .357 FTX, you CANNOT reload it to a full .357 regular load Ever again!!!!. You can only reload this cut down or factory made case back to Using the 140grn FTX bullets!!!. Now with a regular 140 grn XTP with max powder load were now at 1900 fps with a 16" barrel!!!!. With a 125grn XTP WERE AT 2000FPS!. SMOKING!!. The .357 has been underrated for ever, because it doesn't start to preform to top profencency until it's shot out of an 8" plus barrel!! The same goes for the 44mag using the FTX round!!

I'd think you'd try .38 with hollow points.

I noticed that when I hovered over the Rossi part, the title shows up as Ruger Model 92...

45-70 = Shock & Awe

Ok you have to remember the faster something is going the more resistance so it stops faster

30-30 go in second block😊😊

Can the 45-70 shoot through a brick wall and cause a mortal wound to a ballistics gel dumby? A real brick wall! Make it happen I'll subscribe, pay you to build my lever action!

45-70, maybe not be the best self defense round, unless a dinosaur is breaking into your house...

26" barrel more power.😮😮😮

That 357 wasn’t moving that much slower than the 30-30. Your not getting 1400 from that carbine I hope. I’m getting 1940 from a 158 SJHP

357 hornady load I designed for hunting not self defense.

"Probably not going to be broken into with no clothes on..." Apparently you've never watched Cops. Every episode of Cops has a naked tweaker, coming soon to a living room near you. To clear up some misconceptions, we should note that bullets expand proportionately to their velocity, and expansion limits penetration. So with expanding bullets, like the FTX and the XTP, we would actually expect the bullets to penetrate further with less velocity, because the bullets would expand less. This is within reason, of course. If you lower velocity beyond a certain point, it is going to neither penetrate nor expand. Energy in physics is the ability or potential to do work, and is separate in concept to power, which is work done in a certain amount of time. Bullets possess energy in the form of mass and velocity, and they only use their energy by losing mass or velocity. An expanding bullet increases the surface area and drag on the bullet, which causes it to lose velocity faster. In doing so, the bullet converts potential energy it possesses in the form of mass and velocity into kinetic energy, which can then be seen in the temporary stretch cavity. The velocities on the .357 Magnum and .44 Magnum are probably for 6 to 8 inch barreled revolvers. The velocity from a 16 inch lever gun on these rounds could be several hundred fps faster. Which again, increases expansion and probably results in less penetration than would be experienced through a revolver at the published velocities. The 200 grain .44 Magnum round was heavier, but has a similar Sectional Density to the 140 gr .357. The lack of penetration from the .44 round relative to the .357 is probably do to greater velocity increasing expansion, and to differences in bullet construction between the XTP, which is designed as defensive JHP, and the FTX, which is more of a modified Hornady Interlock JSP, intended for hunting medium and large game. Terminal ballistics is a fascinating subject. It is incredibly complex, even shooting a homogeneous substance like gel, and becomes exponentially more so studying wounds in living tissue. Always fun to watch some gel get shot...

You left out your 500 S&W!

In most cases "Over penetration" (within reason) is a borderline myth at worst and grossly overexaggerated at minimum. Ballistics gel and esspecially clear gel will show penetration around X*1.5 actual real world penetration. Took a small doe at 30 yards with a 10mm round that shows 16 inches in gel and it didn't exit broadside - no bone hit. ...ymmv

I trusted this guy’s videos. He made mistakes. I should apologize and be responsible for them.

FTX bullets penetrate..Pentwater... they are designed to get past clothing and eject the rubber plug when it expands. It's built using the same theory the critical Duty uses...pre load the tip of a hollowpoint instead of it getting clogged with clothing. Btw, who shoots a 200gr 44mag? 240 is a mag bullet, 200 is a special bullet. I don't even see them as a forensic ballistician. Strange bullet choice. 240 or nothing for 44 mag.

Long gun HD Ok Ranch Texas are large. I have heard never seen. Live in trailerpark 22 pistol is enough. You can’t shoot if back stop people you love or live NY tall building. You might injure next door etc even kill in 3. Appartment too. Stand you ground do not let Sicarios out of vehicle. Take’em still in car🥞 45-70 or .50

45-70 is a old military round if it will kill humans in combat; it will work for human truders at your house for self defense

Gel is NOT meant to represent a 1:1 for humans, idk why he was trying to compare the gel penetration to whether someone might have clothes or something. Gel is for comparing rounds to each other or establishing baselines, ie barriers in front of the gel, then you compare that with real world results and make a connection as to how well a bullet does. So saying "yea a bullet went 16" in gel and a person is only 9" but maybe the guy has thick clothes" is wrong. The depth of a man and the depth of the gel tract don't compare. You don't tack on a few inches of gel depth if they have a jacket, because clogging the hollow point might actually make the bullet go FURTHER by turning it into essentially a FMJ. The guy selling gel should know how it's supposed to be used

Well. If you want to see a thief do a two foot backflip go with the 30/30.

As someone who's worn Carhartt stuff as a mechanic/outside machinist, one it's overpriced and overrated. Two, a "Carhartt jacket" isn't that thick. Sounds like I'm being harsh but not trying to be. I'm sold on the .44. I don't think a .44 chambered in a rifle gives a damn about a jacket.

I wrote several different comments but i ended up deleting them all because they all sounded so negative,,I'm sorry but i don't like the idea of messing up a lever action rifle trying to make it look "tactikool",, they were designed perfectly without adding a bunch of plastic crap all over them..i know my opinion is just that, only an opinion so don't take it too seriously...

Damn I just noticed all of your other guns in the background. Wtf do you do for a living? Can't be from KZfaq.