I could hug you. Straight up, people call me crazy all the time for saying the sensor on Razer mice (especially the new Focus Pro) are a significant jump in performance that I can immediately tell and replicate time and time again. They just come back that "no one can feel that" and "it's placebo". But you get it (along with a lot of other people in my comment section actually). As the sensor truly is that much better (along with their firmware). Add that with their clicks and nothing is more responsive (that I've tried). With the 3395 coming to more mice though you'll have access to more shapes (Like the Lamzu Atlantis). But I'd still pick the V2 Pro as it outperforms by a noticeable margin. Especially, once you include the 4,000 hz. Which again tons of people claim you can't feel. So, thanks for making me not seem insane for once. In my videos I don't spend as much time going into this anymore as the majority of people just simply don't care. Also, agree on nearly all your numbered points. I could argue a bit on some of them but there's no point. I completely agree on all your rebuttals for the "negatives" I put in the video. I add those in there as not everyone who watches this video is a Pro and for some people these points are deal breakers. I'm here to serve my audience, of which are quite diverse. I also much prefer the clicks on Razer mice over really anyone else. However, as you mention this is subjective. My reviews are not just my personal opinion but also the opinions I see in other videos, in my comment section, other reviews, and forums. By and large there are a TON of people that simply hate Razer's optical switches. Which is why as a reviewer it is my job to call that out to make people aware of it so they know what they are getting into before purchasing. I think you're exactly right on Logitech winning the marketing war and why they continue to dominate. There are a ton of people that love Logitech and will only say positive things about them. I will add that Razer for many years was doing a crap job making good products that lasted a long time which made a lot of people bail ship. The past few years they have worked extremely hard to win people back (and done a great job) but that "abuse" (for lack of better terminology) hasn't been forgotten by a lot of people which make them avoid Razer like the plague. As for your last paragraph, there is a reason why certain mice are in the premium price category. Nearly all of them (in my opinion) do not earn their price. But the Razer Viper Ultimate (and line of mice) along with the new Razer Viper V2 (and lineup) have. They are by far the best mice I've ever used by a longshot and honestly I'm not interested in trying anything else because they are THAT much better. The only thing that Razer needs to improve on is getting more diverse shapes. As when it comes to most other companies they are not doing as good of job as the rest of the competition. I've learned to really enjoy the Viper shape. But it still isn't "ideal" for me, but I still perform the best with it, due to the other aspects of the mouse and the shape being mostly there. As for cheaper mice, they aren't marketed for individuals like yourself. They don't feel bad and I'm often surprised by how good they feel in general (clicks, shape, size, weight, side buttons, etc.) But they all tend to fall short in one category. Which is sensor. Arguably the only mouse I've tried in the "budget category" (

​@@ThomasMuehler You're not crazy and not as lonely as you think. In my high Immortal 3-Radiant lobbies I've seen on multiple occasions people getting laughed at for using the GPX. It really is that much of a joke. The reason why nobody believes us (in review comment sections anyways because it's targeted for casuals who don't know much about mice) is because it takes a lot of effort and luck to even be in the position where you can buy two overpriced flagship mice and get to compare them at a high level. Think about it. You have to get insanely good at FPS, specifically either CS:GO, Overwatch, or VALORANT. And I don't just mean high rank. I mean like PROFESSIONAL level aim good. You don't look apart from a single professional, and in some areas you look even better than the uninspired pros that have been playing for decades. Then you can only begin to notice the several flaws that you have spent thousands of hours improving on just suddenly reappearing again on a mouse with a worse sensor, which is the GPX. That's where I am at right now. Even in Radiant, I can easily highly criticize anybody's aim and pick out very specific flaws. Of course, nobody can have perfectly consistent aim, however if you're failing to overcome the easiest challenges in aim in general, then there is a problem with your mouse choice. Anybody can become good by learning the game and taking advantage of flaws in game sense and strategy, aim is not the same however. There are zero shortcuts. Wanna know why s1mple has one of the highest sensitivities in the pro scene but the smoothest and possibly slowest crosshair placement tracking out of anybody else? It's because he's realized the flaw that GPX mice have in general. He probably knows it exists. He's 100% tested other mice, including the V2 Pro. Or maybe not, and he just got used to it. But there are multiple cons about this type of aim style which is potentially limiting him. This flaw is the un-adjustable LOD. Lift-off distance and tracking distance in my opinion is even more important than any gimmicky sensitivity or grip style that could possibly exist out there. On the Superlight, it is not consistent and nowhere near close to 150$ level. The difference in LOD quality between the Superlight and V2 Pro is so astronomically high that I'm surprised not a single reviewer has covered it or even mentioned it. (Again, they're casuals and don't know how much effect LOD and tracking distance really has on your aim) They cover it briefly for 10 seconds, say "Oh wow, I can move the slider!" then move on like it's nothing. Now how does s1mple's aim come into this equation? Well, you'll notice he drags his mouse on the mousepad. Quite a lot actually. That's to make up for this flaw. Having anything but consistent smooth travel with your arm will quickly reveal the flaws that have come from this mouse only because the LOD and tracking distance is quite literally uncontrollable and unpredictable. In practice, you can use your wrist in the training range in VALORANT for example and easily flick back and forth to get a 30/30 score on Hard bots, however in a real game you don't look in a 180 degree cone towards the enemy while only moving your wrist left and right and instead it's optimal practice to place your arm straight, elbows above mouse, while putting pressure on your forearms and slight pressure on your wrist every time you are locking into an angle. This was also the problem with Razer Viper's Mini 3359 sensor. If you did anything but drag on the mousepad it would quickly pick up random inputs that don't even exist a whole centimeter off the ground, which is due to its high LOD. GPX doesn't have high LOD, but they have screwed up something with it 100%. This is also the point where motion sync comes in to play to top off the V2 Pro's consistency level for those quick arm swipes. Now I don't know what Logitech has done with their sensor in regards to LOD and tracking distance, but according to their official Logitech representative, "HERO uses a much more intelligent LED system to continuously adjust the lighting power and intensity (frame by frame) to produce the optimal capture for each given frame regardless of surface. This means HERO automatically provides the smallest deviation and lowest LOD possible given the current tracking surface, resulting in a more predictable and consistent tracking experience." In my personal opinion, this is Logitech's biggest downfall. For comparison, would you want to have a system stuck in your mouse that automatically changes the DPI based on how fast you are moving your mouse? Which is quite literally called mouse smoothing? I think this might be the reason why Logitech's mice always feel so much more unpredictable and smoother (not in a good way smooth) compared to the V2 Pro. It's not the sensor. It's their horrible optimizing and not knowing what people actually want. Here's a fun simple test, next time you watch a pro player playing either CS:GO or VALORANT, take a look at their aim. You can very easily distinguish between a GPX and any other top tier mouse GPX users usually: Slower, more controlled tracking/flicking towards enemy since it's unpredictable and unreliable to use your muscle memory to flick in 1ms. Crosshair placement is generally insanely smooth but also seems a little off, since readjusting your aim little by little using wrist aim is insanely difficult without making it hard to readjust to someone's head if they peek out. Even on their best days, their aim never looks like the best it could be V2 Pro users usually: Faster, more controlled, player looks like a cracked 12 year old on steroids moving their mouse around like it's nothing. It's effortless to flick fast towards an enemy head, since every part of the mouse is consistent and the mouse is easier and lighter to hold. Literally nothing about the mouse will change unless you do it yourself. People say that the GPX is more balanced, but from an aiming perspective, it is not. Not even close. Maybe it feels lighter to hold, but definitely not to use when you're trying to micro adjust while tracking a corner all the time. I've noticed that often times my aim fell short of an enemy, not because of the DPI deviation, but because the LOD is so horribly inconsistent that you will never be able to truly control it. Remember: Their aim is not smooth and controlled because they want it to. It's because nothing else worked consistently. Even on low sensitivity in VALORANT on the V2 Pro I would have the same aim style of a cracked 12 year old on steroids because it was RELIABLE, which is an experience the weird LOD and outdated HERO sensor doesn't provide and never will even if you try to brute force your way through it. You should make a video calling out Logitech and this highly overrated mouse in the process. I could talk for hours on end about the tiniest of things that Logitech somehow got wrong. The thing that's annoying is that I am sure that these problems over time would eventually been solved and eventually riddled out, but because Logitech has been refusing to invent for the past 2 years and taking advantage of the monopoly that their 2 wireless mouse have on the market and Razer's horrible reputation they have stalled progress of mouse competition for years due to their greed. We will never truly advance in the gaming mouse market until Logitech releases a new model after people pressure them because they found out it's not actually all that good.

That is very interesting that people are laughing in lobbies about the GPX. I wouldn’t have expected that. But I totally agree with what you’re saying. As I am extremely blessed to have the opportunity to not only buy these mice, but have the other peripherals to be able to maximize their capability, along with the skill and time needed to actually notice it. I don’t think I’m anywhere near the same level as you, as I don’t think I can fully breakdown someone’s aim. I can tell when they are a competent player or not but not break it fully down like you. Which is hella impressive. For me my aim is never a problem in games, it is more I don’t have a lot of free time, so I don’t game as often as I want (which makes me a bit inconsistent in maintaining my very best), and often fall back on my aim as a crutch over utilizing the in’s and out’s of games which holds me back competitively. In regard to S1mple, agree with your points. But also think when it comes to most people who perform at a high level they have certain preferences and become quite stubborn on changing them up (as you’ve mentioned previously they’ve spent thousands of hours committing to a certain thing so to change that means starting over in a way. That not everyone is willing or excited to do). Definitely agree that LOD is a significant contender. As you mention a lot of great mice shapes have come out with subpar sensors (mostly in regards with too high or too low LOD) that have essentially ruined them. With some companies actually releasing patches so that you can adjust them a bit more based on your preferences (but nothing like the Focus Pro sensor). But a quick look behind the curtain from a KZfaqr’s perspective. Spending a bunch of time explaining the importance of LOD won’t matter for 90% of their audience so to spend that time explaining that can be more detrimental than you might realize to the success of their channel/video. I’d argue that most pros or people who prioritize gaming at the highest levels would be willing and more likely WANT to buy the best of the best mice and try them out to see if they could get a competitive edge and wouldn’t be going off reviews anyways. But perhaps I’m wrong on that. I just figure most people that are diehard about a hobby tend to be willing to spend a lot of money on said hobby. As for your next paragraph. Lots of interesting points here. Totally agree that the thing that probably separates the Focus+ and now Focus Pro so dramatically from the competition has less to do with sensor accuracy and more to do with their adjustable Lift Off AND Landing Distance, along with their motion sync. Add that to the 4,000 hz to reduce latency even more and ever little bit stacks to make a bigger impact. As for your arm position I have noticed that when I am using my Razer mice that flicks are effortless where with the GPX it feels a bit more loose and now I’m wondering if that is from the LOD. I’ll have to do more testing on that. Very interesting. Also, as for your arm position. I did most of that but always kept more of relaxed grip. But applying a bit more pressure to my forearm definitely help steady out and control my tracking. So appreciate that tip! I’ll also have to bring up some pro aimers and watch their aim for the things you’ve pointed out. I know I definitely feel that a lot when I’m using or the other (slower more controlled mouse movement vs cracked out 12-year-old). Also, I’ve said for a long time that the Focus+ and now Focus Pro are “pixel perfect” in the sense that I can move pixel by pixel really easily where I can’t do that with any other mouse. Which is why I find headshots and micro aiming to be so much easier on Razer mice. As much as I would like to make a video about something like this there are two problems. 1. I don’t think most people would listen. As I said previously, I don’t spend a ton of time gaming these days which means I’m not able to get to the top ranks of games (assuming that even if I did have the time that I have the skill to get there). Without those ranks I doubt people would even believe that I have good aim so would likely dismiss anything I have to say. Which already happens plenty in the comment sections of my videos when I bring up this type of stuff. Which is fine. The latest competitive game that I’ve played was Halo Infinite where I got into Onyx. Which I’ve also gotten in pretty much all the other Halo games (as Halo’s always been my jam). Other competitive games these days just don’t tickle my fancy enough to spend the time needed to grind out a high rank as I’d prefer to spend my time doing other things. 2. I have an exceedingly small audience, my videos are also on multiple tech products (over just mice), which again does not give me any credibility to claim something that the majority of people would disagree wholeheartedly with. Even if that majority is wrong. Lol. If you ever stream or anything I’d love to stop by and watch some time.

@@zyalss07 I really appreciate you taking the time to share your two cents. So seriously thank you! I think the main reason why you can't feel a difference between the Starlight-12, GPX, Capetown, and Viper Mini is because they essentially have the same exact sensor (almost down to the T in regards to specs). Which is one of the points I try to make for people is that MOST gaming mice out their the reason why they don't feel a difference between sensors is because either A. there isn't any, or B. they are so close that you wouldn't be able to tell. The Focus+ and the Focus Pro from Razer are the only two sensors that I easily tell a difference as they are on another level. This transfers over to the 3395 as well (as it is the Focus+ but for the masses as Razer's rights for them expired). The Starlight 12 and GPX are going to be nearly identical. The Capetown has a 3360 which was then upgraded (mostly with how much energy it takes) for the HERO but has the same performance just at lower power draw making wireless doable. The Starlight-12 is essentially the same thing with higher power performance as it is based off some of the newer standards with the same if not a bit better tech. The Viper Mini is going to be the worst of the bunch as that sensor is a "budget" sensor but it's main flaw is the lift off distance is inconsistent and at higher Hz it falls apart. Out of any of them I'd expect to see a difference with Viper Mini. You are completely right that shape, size, and weight are all dramatic factors in chosing the right mouse. But at the same time a lot of that has to do with the above. As if the sensor is essentially a wash between all mice then you need something else to see the differences. Whereas, those things won't be as important if it has a crap sensor. Thankfully, almost all mice have "good" if not "great" sensors. But since we are talking about "pro" products we aren't looking for anything less than exceptional. At which point sensor should be part of the equation as it does matter when you're splitting hairs for the best competitive edge. In which case the Focus+ and Focus Pro (and other Razer tech) in my opinion is in a league of it's own. I'd actually love for you to go and buy the Viper V2 Pro or Deathadder V3 Pro and try it out and see if you come back with the same thoughts. Then just return it after you're done testing. As I really do think you'd notice a difference. That way you can test it without "spending money on it" as you get it back in the end. I do need to do a better job with side buttons. I personally don't use them all that often and am easily pleased. So, I don't spend a lot of time on them. But have been called out multiple times now in my comment section so I'll try and talk about them more. Granted I feel like it is a short conversation regardless. The V2 Pro and Deathadder V3 Pro both have excellent side buttons.

@@zyalss07 I agree with everything that Thomas said. But you also need to realize that Valorant and Fortnite are not the same, you do not have anywhere near the amount of experience and knowledge about what feels right and doesn't. There are much more intricacies and levels of detail that somebody that just started playing VALORANT wouldn't know what to look for. I'm not being deep or philosophical, it's just the truth. No sensor is 'good enough'. A 2060 is good enough, so does that mean there's no difference in feeling between a 4090? Mouse companies, believe it or not, have advanced their tech far more than what it was in 2020. Every mouse FEELS good enough, doesn't mean that it is. You also cannot tell apart differences from the GPX and Superlight because it is literally the same exact sensor spec wise. Grip is only important for long term stable consistent playing. Not when you're testing the sensor itself and can feel a difference. The only reason Razer is getting hate for the V2 Pro is because so far no mouse has been released by them that hasn't been stripped of features. The GPX is fine to them because it was never marketed for cool RGB or intense gamers who want cool geometric shapes. Its reputation has protected it. Razer needed to make "Pro" more noticeable, as people literally thought it would be an upgrade or next generation for the other Viper Ultimate mouse with cool features. You should genuinely buy the V2 Pro. It is life changing. One tip is when you get it put the tracking distance to low and never touch it again. Anything else is super unstable

That “blank canvas” is the reason why I think so many people love the GPX shape though. But as you say for some people they don’t like it because it can lack consistency. The biggest issue for most people is the flat shape for the Viper. Which I think makes people hate it or love it. All great points!

i cant fingertip the medium viper shape because of smol hands

Can definitely see where you are coming from. The Superlight is definitely the safer shape for most people with the Viper being very polarizing.

I use all viper models nothing feels better than g pro wireless

@@yooanto9465 True that. Lots of people absolutely LOVE the GPX shape. Which is why it is such a popular mouse.

I think your findings are more of the norm. They really did something special with the shape which has helped tremendously with its popularity. It is seldom that someone reaches out to me and says they DON'T like the shape. With the majority of people coming down close to what you are saying. I would love Razer to come out with a shape that was as good. As that way you would get the best of both worlds (specs and shape) and it would be interesting to hear peoples opinions.

@@ThomasMuehler yeah. I really want a gpx with optical switches. People say that they are mushy and doesn't feel as good as mechanical switches, but i love the performance (tested them on DA V2 Mini, shape didn't fit me tho). The optical switches do benefit me in the games i play. I fear that Viper might feel too flat for me and DAV3 might be tad too big for my hands as well *sigh*.

@@scarletvan4749 I'm quite hopeful that Logitech will be releasing a GPX with optical switches. As if they spent the money to release them on the G502X they will likely be bringing them to their other top sellers. I haven't tried Logitech's version yet. And probably won't anytime soon as the G502X just doesn't interest me and money is tight at the moment. But I'm interested to see how they feel seeing as they purposefully kept the mechanical switch design but made it optical therefore hopefully blending the best of both worlds. Personally, I don't notice much difference between optical switches and mechanical switches feel wise. Other than optical switches having more variance. Which is ironic as you would think less moving parts would give improved variance (feel wise, performance wise they are consistent). The only thing, and I have to focus to feel it, is that mechanical switches have a little extra tactile bump to them and I think that is what most people are talking about. But when I'm gaming I don't really notice that. That's also only really on Logitech mice (GPX/GPW to be exact) and not so much on other mechanical switch mice. So, maybe I'm missing something. As I'm with you I'd give a perhaps bit less premium of a click (as I think that is still personal preference and debatable) for improved performance and immunity to double clicks.

I'm glad you enjoyed it!

I'm glad you enjoyed it. Welcome to the family Arvind. I hope you enjoy your time here.

I see that I am a bad influence on your pocket book. I'm sorry and I take full responsibility! lol

You have made some wonderful choices in your gaming mice. All of those are fantastic choices. The shape of the Viper is definitely hit or miss for people. I gotta give it to the G Pro X for nailing that shape and feel.

I'm glad you liked it.

I’m glad you enjoyed it. Thanks for letting me know!

@@ThomasMuehler You're very welcome!

All fair points. Definitely comes down to personal opinion. Greatly appreciate the rundown! I have heard several people have the same findings. Personally, I don't have the same issues. I can grip both of them without any issues with great variability. I also prefer the coating on the Viper V2 Pro. But also think the GPX coating is still one of the best on the market and would agree that most people would find that coating to be superior. My biggest issue is the HERO sensor feels loose to me where the Focus Pro is super tight and responsive. In general the way the Viper V2 Pro feels (performance wise) is just so much better on the Viper I have a hard time using the GPX. But would say the shape of the Viper is poo poo for most people and the GPX is stellar (one of the best ever made). Which is why I tend to recommend the Deathadder v3 Pro over the Viper V2 Pro to most people. Despite it being a larger mouse as the shape is better and more inline with the GPX.

I won’t say GPX has better coating, I’d say 3 times worse then v2, my white GPX changed to yellow nasty color only after 2 weeks of use where I gripped and I couldn’t get it out, even with nail polish 🤷🏻‍♂️

The Viper V2 is going to be a smidge longer and wider. But is going to have a lot less of a hump. Model O is going to be longer and wider than the V2 Pro. But close to the same hump. V2 Pro isn't supposed to be a palm mouse. More of a claw/fingertip. But if you're looking for a size between the GPX and the Model O I think the V2 Pro fits that.

@@ThomasMuehler Thank you man, you helped me a lot with the question marks in my mind.

I appreciate the kind words!

They are a lot faster than GPX stock feet. Or at least when I compare my V2 and GPX on my Glorious XXXL mousepad. Like I’d say safely about 2x faster. I don’t tend to focus on mice feet at all. Nor do I focus much on mousepads so I’m not a good one to ask. Most mice feet are built for speed. Where there are mouse pads for “control” which would slow the mouse down (I think I’d double check before purchasing) and think that would be the better route over buying different feet. As I’ve never heard of PTFE feet being made to slow something down. But I have heard of mousepads doing that.

Just sand the ptfe if you want it to be slower. Around a 1000 grit should work fine

Again, appreciate the continued support and words. Would love to hear your thoughts on whichever one you decide to go forward with. Which at this point sounds like the Viper V2 Pro.

It all comes down to personal preference. From my own personal preference since the Deathadder V3 Pro and Razer Viper V2 Pro came out I don't really care for any other mouse on the market as they just perform so much better and no one else is even close. But mice are more than just specs. Shape isn't a huge deal to me but I would argue is a critical part of the decision making process. So is weight and size. But both the weight and size of these mice are essentially the same. Both of these mice are 10/10 and you can't go wrong with either. Argument FOR Razer V2: - Best of the best tech wise with the ability to do 4,000 Hz polling. Makes it a lot more future proof as it is the cutting edge. - Optical switches are immune to double clicks. Also, lower latency and should last longer. - Side buttons to me feel a lot better. - Cool on/off switch. - Best for claw/fingertip grip. Argument FOR GPX: - Less expensive. But technically using four year old tech. - One of the best shapes that have ever come out. - A lot of people would say this is the best mouse on the market. - Clicks are arguably more tactile and feel better. But more prone to failure. - More practical on/off switch - Best for all grip styles. TIES: - Scroll wheel is great on both of them. - PTFE are great on both of them. - Weight and battery life is going to be essentially a wash. V2 uses USB-C where GPX uses Micro USB. I prefer USB-C

I replied to your last comment. But to keep things simple and for others who come across this comment. I'd also recommend checking out the Deathadder V3 Pro if the Viper shape isn't for you but you want the better tech. Personally, V2 Pro is cutting edge tech wise. Making it more worth the premium price point. As it is more future proofed. Downsides, price, shape, coating. Positives of GPX is Shape and coating is excellent. Clicks feel great. The price is good in your country so it is fair. in US it still sells for 140 - 160 for 4-year-old tech. Which is silly. As the tech isn't anything spectacular these days. Firmware is great. Not great stock feet. Regardless on the one you choose. Both are S-Tier and won't hold you back when gaming.

Appreciate the great rundown! Thanks for taking the time to write it all out for us. I’m glad you are enjoying both and have decided the GPX is the winner for you. Just to add some clarification. G Pro X (GPX) lift-off distance ISN’T adjustable. It still tracking while being 1 - 3 mm above the mousepad is user preference but not everyone enjoys that. The V2 Pro (and other Razer mice with the Focus Pro sensor) have adjustable lift-off and landing distance which can be changed in Razer Synapse. That way if you want it to track when you lift it off like the GPX you can. GPX has mechanical switches which means it can develop double clicks. But also, means that it has more moving parts that add better tactility and tend to feel better for most users. The V2 Pro has optical switches, which technically spec wise are faster. As they don’t need a debounce delay to prevent double clicking and are immune to it. However, GPX has something called “Mechanical Tensioning System” which allows Logitech to adjust the click distance to be very consistent from model to model and keep it low. V2 Pro doesn’t have this so has more variability. Depending on the lottery V2 Pro clicks can have low - moderate pre/post travel. Also, depending on user they may say one or the other click feels faster. Personally, I think my V2 Pro (and Deathadder V3 Pro’s) have faster clicks (both due to distance traveled, being optical, and 4,000 Hz) than my GPX (but we are splitting hairs at this point and is not important for most users). But GPX still has one of the best feeling and consistent clicks I’ve ever used. My two cents and subjective view. My experience with middle mouse click. I think the V2 Pro is perfect as it is a bit more stiff but crisp. And personally miss it when I’m using other mice. Where my GPX middle click rolls easily when pressing and feels a bit mushy. But I can spam click both just as easily. But would give a slight win to the GPX with speed but not accuracy. I also find the GPX scroll wheel to be lighter with not as defined steps where the V2 Pro it is stiffer with more defined steps. Both are extremely accurate but feel comes down to personal preference. The battery issues are extremely surprising to me. All my Razer mice go into a sleep state as they should. Never had it where I woke up and it was dead the next day. Additionally, I think I get better battery life with the V2 Pro and Deathadder V3 Pro than I do with my GPX. But I think both are so good that it is essentially a wash. You can adjust sleep timers and all that in Razer Synapse (where you can’t with the GPX as far as I know). I’m wondering if you turned that setting off or something which prevents it from sleeping. Otherwise, it sounds like a possible defect. The rest of the points I essentially agree with. Kudos on the great rundown and being open to any questions.

Great choice. Can't go wrong with the GPX. It still has a great sensor, shape, size, weight, and clicks.

for me, its the viper v2 pro thats cheaper than the GPX lol

@@vallisluong7049you could’ve bought a used version unless you just got an insanely lucky deal in that case i hate you 😂

Man, $80?! That's a great price for the V2 assuming the one you get is in good condition. I'm excited for you! I would love to hear your thoughts on it once you get it in, both positive and negative.

I got mine new for 120€. I think that's a very good price

@@kermitthedepressedfrog5291Nice! I'm excited for you!

WHAT?! That is wild. I appreciate you letting me know. I have heard of issues with the dongle. But shocked that it continues to be an issue. Especially, multiple times in a row. But haven't heard of too many scroll wheel issues. Regardless, that sucks hard. I'm sorry to hear it. I also think you are incredibly unlucky and that is not the usual case. But can totally understand your possible aversion of wanting to discontinue supporting Razer based off your experience.

@@ThomasMuehler The mouse itself is great. It is one of the best I have used and still using it. I am currently getting another RMA and will see how it turns out. I am really tempted to buy another brand like Pulsar or Zowie or even a deathadder v3 pro.

@@Cozzyhane I agree. It is one of my favorites of all time. So, I’m just bummed that you keep getting the raw end of the deal! But again, totally understand wanting to try to go with another brand. I’m not saying this is something that should be done in order to fix something that shouldn’t be broken in the first place. But have you tried the Hyper Polling Dongle instead of the one included? If yes do you run into the same problems? Or is it just with the one that is included?

I’m not sold that is the case. Like I get what you are saying. 800 DPI is 800 DPI (in the amount your mouse moves). But what makes one sensor more accurate than another sensor? And why is it that every time I use a mouse with a higher DPI rating that it has better accuracy? Is that a byproduct of something or the actual cause?

​@@ThomasMuehler I could be wrong, but I thought the accuracy of the mouse was determined by the polling rate and the dpi only acts as a modifier for how much your curser can move.

@@_shadow_1 Definitely a lot more at play other than just the pulling rate. While that can be important I don’t think it is a main thing. As plenty of performance mice were at 500 Hz and people not only played well with them but had great variances between them based on sensors. Then most mice went to 1,000 Hz but that wasn’t always consistent. Now, we’ve made huge strides so all of the good mice are pretty rock solid at 1,000 Hz. We also have some wired mice at 8,000 Hz which does improve the entire chain making everything faster and responsive. But I’d argue that polling rate is more of the modifier where the sensor itself plays a huge role. I’ve also noticed that the higher the DPI the more accurate the sensor feels (even at lower DPI). So, I’m convinced that DPI does play a part (other than just marketing). It may not be the direct cause (as DPI is linear, 800 DPI on one mouse should be 800 DPI on another) but think whatever makes DPI higher is what makes the sensor more accurate and whether this is the direct cause (the DPI making it more accurate) or a byproduct that inflates the DPI I do not know. Someone recently linked me a video on how sensors work (kzfaq.info/get/bejne/iaeReLaTmd24c4E.html) which was interesting and I think backs up my point of view. It gets pretty complicated quickly without super good explanations so I could be wrong. I could also just be dumb. I’m still not 100% but from my digging I think my example still holds up. But still very much on the fence.

@@ThomasMuehler he’s actually right, the number itself is a standard, the higher total number doesn’t mean better at a lower number. A perfect example on what makes a sensor better is cameras, you may have a 20mp camera or a 100mp camera, if the supporting hardware is subpar, you won’t utilise the sensors and therefore not have as great photos. Not saying the razor isn’t good, just, there’s a bit more to sensors than just the dpi number :)

@@calvinkleyn9280 I agree there is more than just the DPI number and that DPI is a standard (movement wise) but not accuracy wise. It's a plethora of things that relate to each other and work as a whole. I'm just not convinced that DPI is just a marketing number. As every mouse I've tried with a higher DPI performs better than one with a lower DPI. I'm not saying that is because of the DPI, but I'm not saying it isn't either. As is the higher DPI a byproduct of something else that makes it more accurate? Also, when you look at how a mouse sensor works the subpixels of each pixel are higher which makes me think my example is still accurate. But I'm not an expert and would love to talk to someone who is. Again, 800 DPI will move 800 dots on screen for every inch of real world movement. As it is a linear standard. But are those higher subpixels (for mice that have higher DPI) creating more points making things more accurate inside that 800 DPI range? I don't know. Seems reasonable to me. But again, not an expert. But even using your example the 100 megapixel camera (even with worse software) would still likely take similar if not better pictures than the 20 megapixel camera. While the 20 megapixel camera would be cheaper and could take similar looking pictures than the more expensive 100 megapixel camera with poor software. But the moment you add good software paired with the 100 megapixel camera then there would be a big difference once you look critically with the right tests. But I get your point and do agree with the base premise.

I appreciate you following my content for such a long time! That means a lot. I do tend to be a bit Viper/Razer biased. But that's because I think they are just doing it better not because I prefer the brand. As prior to the RVU I was very securely in the Logitech camp and was in love with the G Pro Wireless when it originally came out. The problem is Logitech just hasn't done anything at all in the past four years which is a shame. I'd love to see an updated mouse/sensor from them. I'll definitely check out more of your content as well. Unfortunately, I don't speak Russian but I'm digging your style. Love your thumbnails and you're videos are definitely in my area of interest.

@@ThomasMuehler agree with you Logitech need to shake the market a bit with something new but I cant say that Razer do nothing at all because of that. So we are as consumers in a good spot. Thank you for checking out my vids. I have my regional niche so I am good with it. I tried to manage ru ang eng channels but I realized that I dont have enough time to do both.

@@EvLTimE I think we are in an excellent spot as consumers. There are a ton of extremely nice mice on the market at varying price points. I was happy to do it. I’d definitely stick to the regional niche if I were you as well. Better chances of finding success that way. As the competition for English channels is kind of nuts. Also, with how much time it takes for a single review I can’t imagine doing it in two different languages. I barely have time to do it in one.

Viper V2 Pro (V2) and Deathadder V3 Pro (DAV3) are going to be essentially the same mouse except for shape. Which will be the biggest difference and you should go with whatever fits your hand better. The next big difference is scroll wheel. As it is very stiff on the V2 where very light on the DAV3. Scroll wheel click is the same on both. I think both scroll wheels are excellent and come down to personal preference. I think the V2 is sligthtly better as I prefer a stiffer scroll wheel and also think the flatter top profile makes it a smidge easier to middle click. I could be recalling incorrectly, but I think the DAV3 has slightly louder clicks but they feel the same as the V2. I also think weight is slightly different between the two (but I can't remember off the top of my head and don't think it is enough of a difference to actually matter). Therefore, my recommendation is that you can't go wrong with either one. And I have them "tied" for first place out of the best mice on the market. But give a slight edge to the Deathadder V3 Pro seeing as I think that shape is going to be more universally liked where the Viper shape tends to be a bit hit or miss. So again, personal preference of what YOU are looking for. Deathadder is best for Palm/Claw. Viper is best for Fingertip/Claw. If you have small hands then DAV3 might be too big.

@@ThomasMuehler thanks for the reply man I have big hands and currently use a death adder from 8 years ago as it fitted my hand best so I think it's the v3 for me if performance is the same

@@duppy9012 Performance will be the same. However, the DAV3 did go through a shape change compared to the DAV2. So, that would be my only concern outside of how loud the clicks are.

Unfortunately, before I had this title I had about 1,000 views. Simply by changing that my views skyrocketed as KZfaq (and the audience) has deemed it a good title. Even if it is a bit click-baity. Also, I really do think that the Viper V2 Pro is much better than the GPX. With a few exceptions. Such as shape. Where, if you can't stand the Viper V2 Pro shape and love the GPX shape and don't feel much difference between the sensor than it should be the one you go with. And 100% think that mice are personal preference. Just because the V2 Pro is the best mouse on the market from a performance standpoint (or any of Razer's recent flagship mice) doesn't mean that should be the one you automatically buy. As shape, size, weight do play a part. And with most people being average likely won't tell a difference between any flagship mouse from a performance standpoint. Which again brings you back to shape, size, and weight that will be easier to tell a difference with.

@@ThomasMuehler I couldn't agree more, to me having better clics/button/sensor is nothing if you can't feel good with a mouse, having the last freaking awesome sensor won't help you if you can't just move the mouse correctly because you are not able to grip it correctly, and every hand is different so obviously if you can try a mouse, go for it ;) And no worries, there are a lot of more click-bait title on YT than yours :P If it helps for visibility than go for it for sure because you deserve more views.

@@Would_he_be_Manbat_Manbat_Man It would be epic if there was a store that just had a bunch of the top gaming mice on display that people could try. And even better if they had gaming systems up that you could try it out on your game before going home.

I saw that. I’ve been trying to get my hands on one as I’m VERY EXCITED for this. As I loved the Razer Viper 8K and this has a better sensor and is wireless and is now 4,000 HZ! I’m looking forward to testing it out. I still personally think that the Viper V2 Pro is better than the GPX. By a bit of a margin but I think this just further separates it. But that’s my opinion. Not saying the GPX is a slouch by any means. Still the second best mouse on the market and depending on the individuals shape preference may be number 1.

You snagged some awesome deals on both. The Razer Viper Ultimate hasn't changed at all spec wise. Outside of going from Gen 1 to Gen 2 switches way back near the beginning when it launched and they added new colorways. As for the GPW they did switch out the switches with something that developed less double clicks after the Shroud edition. Other than that no changes. With the GPX Superlight compared to the GPW pretty much the same mouse except for not having modular buttons and weighing a lot less. As for the V2 Pro compared to the RVU almost everything is different except for the shape and size along with PTFE feet. As it has an upgraded sensor, Gen 3 switches (which honestly are pretty much the same as Gen 2), improved wireless, ability to have 4,000 Hz polling, different on/off switch, scroll wheel is probably the same (I didn't take it apart to look at the encoder). So, personally think you get more bang for your buck as it has the best specs all around (except for weight) compared to any mouse on the market. And will be the standard the competition seeks to beat going forward.

@@ThomasMuehler hi i have a question. Does the g pro x superlight still have double click issues or have they fixed it?

@@checkcek4808 With it being a mechanical switch some users are still getting double clicks. But I would classify it as "fixed". As it is MUCH IMPROVED over previously and now back into the industry standard. To explain a bit more say the average standard is like 5 - 7% defect rate. GPX/GPW was at like 15 - 20% before. Now back down to 5 - 7%. Not exact numbers FYI. Actual percentages may be less than what I mentioned. But back in the day when I did some math that was close to what I was getting if I'm remembering correctly off the top of my head. If you are in a country that doesn't do RMA's or makes them exceedingly difficult I think you'd be safe. However, if you are highly concerned about it then I would recommend going for a mouse with Optical Switches. Such as the Viper V2 Pro or Deathadder V3 Pro.

Noooo that's terrible news (about the GPX and not being able to return). GPX is a solid mouse. Rarely do I hear people not like the shape. So, I appreciate your rundown. You unicorn you. lol Personally, I always thought the performance of the Viper Ultimate was better for me and the superior mouse. Now with the V2 Pro even more so as it just wipes the floor with everything else on the market (outside of the Deathadder V3 Pro). So what are you thoughts on the V2 Pro?

@@ThomasMuehler still haven't received the viper v2 pro. I bought it online when I found one store that was selling a new one for 130$ with tax. Will receive in about 3 days. Will let you know after some time in kovaaks and aimlabs how I feel about the mouse. These are the two software I play with to check whether a mouse is good for me or not.

@@sagnikmaulik Sounds like an excellent plan! That is part of my testing process as well as it gives me some objective measures with just pure aim. Afterwards, I usually go into some of my favorite games to test a bit further. So, totally get it. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts. And I'm excited for you!

@@ThomasMuehler Sorry for not getting back. I got the viper v2 about a week back. And I loved it...for the most part...but the clicks on main buttons. Oh man they are so heavy and hard to push and difficult to spam compared to the g pro x. Why did they have to make it so heavy to push? It takes like double force compared to the omron switches probably even more compared to kailh 2.0s. Ugh. Other than that, it is a good mouse.

@@sagnikmaulik All good! Razer must have some significant variance as I would classify my Viper V2 clicks lighter than my GPX or GPW and easier to spam.

I think it will last a good long time and will be hard to beat for some time now. It's currently my favorite mouse of all time and in my opinion has a good step up on any other mouse on the market. Especially, now that they came out with a 4,000 polling rate dongle which could make it even better. As I personally found a difference with the Razer Viper 8K at 2,000, 4,000, and 8,000 DPI so imagine this will be similar even though it is wireless. So personally I'm excited to try it out. But the point being this has the best tech on the market, and now has 4,000 Hz wireless which is a first. Meaning it'll take a while for other companies to catch up so you should easily get years of use out of it before you notice a significant "upgrade". Assuming you can tolerate the shape and nothing is defective (which I haven't really seen evidence of). So I definitely think you made a great choice and would love to hear your thoughts on it.

@@ThomasMuehler I use an aggressive-claw grip. So this looks perfect for me.

@@Theone.fitness I agree I think this will be a good choice then. As this is made for fingertip/claw.

You did wonderful with your English. I couldn't even tell. If you want me to type you a long rundown I certainly can (and would be happy too). But you've caught me on a day I'm feeling lazy. The G Pro Superlight is dead to me. As I don't see a point in buying it in 2022. You are essentially buying a mouse that has four year old tech in it for a premium price. That is assuming you aren't getting it on a massive sale. Which would be the only time I would entertain it. And by sale I mean less than $99. It is still an amazing mouse and still one of the best on the market. But technically the Viper Ultimate had better specs and now that the Viper V2 Pro, Deathadder V3 Pro, and Razer Basilisk V3 Pro are all out they have a noticeable spec bump on every category. Better wireless, much better sensor, 4,000 Hz compared to 1,000 Hz, etc... So it's an easy choice to me the V2 Pro. The only caveat is that if you don't like the Viper V2 Pro shape then it can be a deal breaker. At which point I'd recommend the Deathadder. If that shape doesn't work then the GPX. Basilisk is a great mouse for those who aren't primarily gaming on it. The only reason why I don't recommend it for FPS is because the weight his a lot. But outside of that it's a spectacular mouse that I use all the time when I'm not gaming. In general these three mice from Razer (and those that will also be coming out such as the Viper Mini Ultimate or whatever they call it) are the only mice I'm interested in going forward. As all other mice are quite behind in specs and are using the same shapes that I've tried a million times. Some newer mice are now using Razer's old tech (that got replaced with their new line up mentioned above). And I would look at those if they have something else interesting. I've heard good things about the Lamzu Atlantis. It also comes in at an excellent price. But if I'm paying premium (greater than $100 and especially greater than $130) I want the best. And the Razer mice are easily the best spec wise on the market. Shape is really where they don't do as well. Also not everyone likes the Optical Switches. I'm not among that group. I think the shapes are above average but not great. And I love their optical switches and prefer them over mechanical due to the minor performance buff. As for your question my Viper V2 Pro is still like new without any issues. Same with the Deathadder V2 Pro (I've got two of them one in white and one in black) and same with the Basilisk V3 Pro. A lot of people don't like Razer and are hyper-critical on them. Which is fine. But mention that as people are overly negative most of time on them and go out of their way to find issues. Where with Logitech they practically worship like they are God. Even though most of the time if you actually look they have the same if not more issues. Also, did I mention 4-year-old tech but still charging $160?! But bottom line. All of the mice I just mentioned are 10/10. They are the best on the market and you won't find better. So no matter what you choose you're getting an excellent mouse that should last you years (assuming nothing goes wrong in which case hopefully the country you live allows RMA's). I also feel like I've been a bit overly negative on Logitech here. They make great products. But have really stagnated over the past four years with really nothing new. And I feel like their recent products have been highly disappointing as they don't preform well for where they are priced. I was a huge champion for the GPX and GPW when they came out and still for the most part am. But when we are comparing them to Razer they just don't perform if we are looking holistically at it. But if you don't care about specs. The shape, texture, and clicks on the GPX tend to be superior. For sure on the shape. Texture is personal preference but most people would choose them over Razer's texture. Last, the clicks again are personal preference. Mechanical switches can develop double clicks and have debounce delay and are just a bit slower due to that (but may not actually be noticeable so splitting hairs) but have a superior feel. As Logitech's Mechanical Tensioning System is AMAZING and provide for very consistent crisp clicks. Along with having a nice little extra tactile bump for mechanical switches which are simply non-existent on optical due to physical design. I'd still say the clicks here are exceedingly close and hard to call. PTFE are way better on the Razer. Mouse wheel is a wash between the two. But I personally prefer Razer. Side buttons are much better on Razer. Battery life is about a wash. On/off switch is better on GPX. But more unique on V2 Pro along with ability to cycle through DPI. Weight is a wash. Specs again go to Razer. Well... would you look at that I typed a book anyways. I would love to hear which one you go with and your thoughts on it.

@@ThomasMuehler I 100% agree with you about the GPX being too outdated when it come to specs, premium pricing and people being biased towards razor. I still read some reviews of people complaining about double clicking (GPX) even in the newer units. RMAs in my country is a bit sketchy and there is a chance that they might leave me hanging with a broken product, so i dont want to take a risk. The V2 pro is costing me 123$ here whereas the GPX is 135$ (good job logitech). Honestly i dont care about the shape as i'm from India, we are known to be super adaptive and compromising if it comes to it ahahaha About the book you just wrote, it shows you know exactly what you're talking about and how kind of a person you are by putting so much effort to help someone out. I'm currently RMAing my Glorious Model O wireless because of a faulty right click. As soon as i get my money back, i'm almost sure that i'll go with the V2 pro because i only play competitive FPS games and i do care about specs.

@@g0dfree291 Especially if the V2 Pro is cheaper I'd go with that. And as you say if you are adaptive then easy win. lol. Since you also care about specs and FPS then again I think the V2 Pro is the right choice. I'd love to hear your thoughts on it once you have time to try it out if you remember. Glorious is also an interesting company. Hopefully that goes smoothly and quickly.

@@ThomasMuehler After seeing so many reviews and still not sure which mouse to go for, you helped me alot to come to a conclusion. Ofc i'll share my experience with you when i get my hands on it.

@@g0dfree291 looking forward to it and I’m excited for you.

My first reaction was Deathadder V3 Wired. As it has a better sensor, clicks, coating, shape, and is capable of 8,000 Hz. With the only downside being it is wired. So, in general an improvement in every category other than being wired. The Deathadder V2 Pro is still an excellent mouse. Shape is going to be the old Deathadder shape which I think is less comfortable than the new one. As it is a bit wider among some other small changes. Performance is going to be similar. But not as future proofed. I do like the wireless and the dock though. Also, RGB if that is important to you. But the V3 Wired is a better mouse objectively if you can tolerate a wire.

Congrats on winning the most condescending comment of the day. Nice work. While some of your points have merit, they don't paint the full picture and make a lot of incorrect assumptions. I'll admit this video is not the most professional video I've done, could be greatly improved, streamlined, and was 100% ad libed. Also, I click baited hard on this video. Which is obviously working seeing as it was recommended to you. 1. Grip varies wildly from person to person. While your breakdown of possible claw grip makes sense logically, in real life it doesn't break down that way all the time as hand position changes greatly based on a lot of different factors. Also, if we are using Pros as an example of what works and doesn't work (which is a fallacy in itself) a ton of them use claw grip, and a ton of them use the Viper Ultimate and Viper V2 Pro. In fact, the Viper V2 Pro tends to be the second most used mouse outside of the GPX. Logitech also sponsors a ton of Pro teams and spends a huge amount of marketing at them (way more than Razer) and have an incredibly passionate user base. GPW was also one of the first premium mice to hit the market and was the only thing for six months, which was then followed up with the GPX which was by itself for a long time before the Viper V2 came out. Pros are also notorious for keeping with what is comfortable for them even if it isn't the best technically. As skill tends to be set no matter the device you are using. Just certain items make it easier and more consistent to perform at a higher level. Last, as you mentioned the GPX shape is stellar. One of the best ever made making it an excellent choice for comfort as it works well for nearly all grip styles. 2. The sensor absolutely DOES make a difference. The issue is that almost all the sensors on the market have the same exact specs which leads the incorrect conclusion that sensors don't matter and all feel the same. Claiming that humans can't feel something is amazingly arrogant and in general tends to just be incorrect. As people continue to say that humans can only see in 60 Hz which is just plain wrong. Most have not tried a superior sensor (such as the Focus+ or Focus Pro) so they think since they haven't felt a difference before they won't feel it now. However, once you do you can easily tell a difference. Is that difference substantial enough to choose a mouse just based on that? Not necessarily but that's a long answer that I won't go into. As shape still plays a critical role and Razer tends to suck at shapes. With the Viper being highly polarizing where it is very hit or miss for people. However, the Deathadder V3 Pro has an excellent shape paired with the same internals and is quickly taking the top spot for many people. With the Razer Viper Mini being upgraded to have the best specs on the market along with an S-Tier shape it too will be taking top spot for a lot of people once the affordable models come out. A ton of people also have a lot of issues with the HERO sensor as some of the technical choices they made lead to instability especially with fast flicks. Also, the automatic lift off distance isn't nearly as good as on the Viper's. Grip helps alleviate this flaw, where I'd argue the opposite can happen with the Viper where the sensor alleviates the grip issues. 3. GPX being better than the Viper in every way is just an incorrect statement all around. Maybe for you. But objectively that just isn’t true. Yes, GPX does CERTAIN things better. Such as shape and I'll give you hand position. Clicks also FEEL better. Arguably, with Logitechs Mechanical Tensioning System they have some of the best feeling clicks on any mouse period. Objectively, clicks are faster, last longer and are immune to double clicks, side buttons are better, better PTFE feet, much better sensor, supports 4k polling on the Viper. Then we go into more personal preference things. If you are a comfort sort of person, the GPX is a clear winner. If you are a performance oriented individual the Viper V2 Pro is better. But again, mice are personal preference and highly subjective based on what the individual prioritizes. Shape, size, weight, click feel, side buttons, scroll wheel, PTFE feet, software, sensor, material, coating, etc. all go into a person’s decisions to choose which is the best mouse for them. GPX and Viper V2 Pro are both S-Tier mice as they hit all of those categories well. You can't go wrong with either one of them. But depending on your frame of reference one or the other will be better. But it isn't a cut and dry case where one clearly wins. But truly, and I mean this sincerely. I'm happy that you enjoy the GPX a lot and it is endgame for you. I’m often left in awe (in a good way) the sheer dedication that GPX users have. As they love their mouse and want everyone else to love it too and simply can’t understand why someone else would prefer a different mouse. Often to the point of extremism where they simply won’t hear other peoples opinions.

@@ThomasMuehler @ThomasMuehler Write an essay, not gonna read it man. The GPX shape is what kills the viper, I made a clear cut biological explanation based on how tendons work as to why. It's the choice of the best gamers worldwide, including the very best CSGO and Apex players, for this reason. And to be very clear, I will always condescend to paid salesmen who act like they're giving real human advice. People need to stop trusting and youtuber with affiliate links, just get a job man. "Ad lib" don't you ever try to act like any word out of your mouth is honesty. Have you ever hit top 500 in the world? No? Who are you to give advice on what's going to help someone aim their best? You literally said the Vipers sensor is better too, like sensor means something 😂😂. This was a persuasive bs to sell your affiliate links, nothing else. Again, gain some honour and get a real job thanks

@@rhyvehr Interesting take. I can see you enjoy your echo chamber and aren't interested in a productive discourse. I wish the very best for you and hope you have an excellent rest of your day/week.

@@ThomasMuehler Sounds like more affiliate marketer coping and bs. No echo chamber here, only flickshots in apex that no other player in the world will ever hit. And again, I have every right to have my own opinions and thoughts, thnx. No need to get upset about it

@@rhyvehr Lol. You keep slayin' man. I'll see you on the battlefield with my inferiorly shaped mouse. You are absolutely right, you do have a right to your own opinions and thoughts and I'm glad you are exercising those rights. Also, don't worry about me I'm just peachy.

No, my face looks best when it's miniature. I'm much more handsome that way. lol. But seriously if I do a video with this style again I'll keep that in mind. I always appreciate constructive criticism. Also, I appreciate the kind words. Means a lot.

@@ThomasMuehler I figured lol. You should consider how much force it takes to click the left/right mouse button & side buttons if possible. I know there's devices to test that, but they may provide that info in their spec sheets.

@@zazabean23 I haven't invested in one of those machines. But most of the time when I do one of my "professional" reviews I'm better at explaining the clicks. I'd say both the GPX and Viper V2 Pro require light actuation force with mild pre-travel and arguably moderate post-travel. But if you're good at not bottoming out then mild post-travel as well. Making them both a very light switch. It would be nice for them to put that on a spec sheet though. I think people would find that very beneficial. I'll have to look into that measuring device and see how much they cost. Might just have to bite the bullet. But part of the issue with that is that it will vary wildly depending on where you are clicking the switch. Along with just variation from unit to unit. As that doesn't tend to be a perfectly standardized thing.

@@ThomasMuehler yeah true. Regarding DPI you're correct. The higher FPS & resolution of the sensor the better tracking at any DPI.

Totally understandable and reasonable. Sometimes shape can make a huge difference and you gotta go with what works best for you.

While I agree that the weight, charging type, and build quality are similar. I completely disagree with not feeling a difference with the sensors (or whatever software/firmware/etc. that causes what I'm feeling). But would agree that the GPX has a safer better shape for most people. The on/off while unique can be frustrating and is better on the GPX. But agree with the the GPX having better battery life and Viper V2 Pro having better side buttons, better skates. Grip I could argue for either one as I like them both and consider it a wash but think most would find GPX to be superior. But period both are top tier mice and the best you can get and can't go wrong and really comes down to which feels the best to you. Personally for me the Viper V2 Pro easily wins all around for me. But plenty of people still prefer the GPX. Thanks for sharing your two cents. I greatly enjoyed it.

@@ThomasMuehler Going back and forth between the GPX and the V2 Pro (both using an Artisan mouse pad) I couldn't tell the difference with the sensors.. enough to say it made a difference for me. I do have my DPI settings set a bit higher on the GPX vs the V2 Pro.

@@patc8653 I get a smattering of people where some say they do feel and difference and others say they don't. My biggest indicator is that me being completely out of practice and not gaming for a while went to use the Viper V2 Pro and broke all my records. Which continues to happen time and time again. Along with more consistent scores at higher marks in AimLabs or Koovacs. Especially, when directly compared to literally any other mouse (Starlight-12, GPX, RVU, etc.). Also, just feels easier to do what I want with it in games. Had the same thing with the focus+ sensor across mice which is what makes me think it is Razers sensor/software/firmware over shape, size, weight, etc. Don't get me wrong. I still absolutely LOVE the GPX and think it is a 10/10 mouse. Just think the Viper V2 Pro is better for me.

@@patc8653 i think there is a difference in dpi due to dpi deviation. The GPX is the deviates the least and the razer deviates more by like at least 10dpi, factoring in different mousepads which can contribute to the deviation and sensitivity in games, it could be very possible that turning the DPI higher on the GPX is about the same DPI as the v2 pro. For more information, watch Optimum Tech's video on that. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/iciqpph6q6nTfYU.html

Thanks for the useful info bud

Obviously, I disagree. As do plenty of people online and in my comment section. I understand where you're coming from. But the fact remains that anytime I use a Focus+ or Focus Pro sensor I feel a difference compared to anything else on the market no matter the mouse means something is different about Razer mice. No, it isn't the shape as if anything I prefer other shapes more as most Razer shapes are mid at best. Also, objectively from testing the Focus Pro and Focus+ sensor score higher and Razer's latency in general (clicks, motion latency (actually think that goes to Logitech), wireless, etc.) goes to Razer. Also, just because someone can't feel a difference doesn't mean someone else can't. Kind of like the whole fallacy that we can't see faster than 60 Hz. I think most people incorrectly think that there is no difference between sensors these days as 99% of them are the same. The 3370, 3360, 3389, 3390, HERO, etc. all have the same specs (or essentially the same) and DO feel nearly exactly the same (firmware being the main thing that makes them feel different). Making most people who haven't tried the Focus+ or Focus Pro sensor think there isn't a difference. I also wouldn't rule out firmware differences being the reason. Or more likely a perfect storm of multiple small things. As the 3395 sensor that is now coming out on a lot of mice that used to be exclusive to Razer doesn't feel as good as Razer's sensors (most likely firmware differences). However, still feels superior to HERO like sensors. Which is a sentiment that is gaining a lot of ground since new shapes are coming with a superior sensor making people feel the difference and comes up frequently in reviews.

Great summation and I pretty much completely agree. I think if we include the new DAV3 in the mix that would be 9.5 (as it has superior shape to the Viper V2 Pro and superior specs to the GPX) with the Viper V2 Pro being 9.0 (being held back by shape) and GPX 8.5 (being held back by specs and price. I say price as it is older tech and should be more affordable over $10 more retail then the latest and greatest). As personally I find the increase in tech to be more beneficial and substantial than most other people. As technically Razer's older tech (Focus+) was superior to the HERO and Logitech's tech. With the newest Razer tech further gaining distance to the HERO as everything about Razer's new tech beats their old tech which was already the best on the market. And notably one of if not THE ONLY company that actually has better specs than everyone else on the market (who have similar wireless tech, same switches, and similar sensors at ~20K DPI, 400 IPS, 40G, no enhancements) over 30K DPI, 750 IPS, 70G, asymmetric cut off, motion sync, and I'm blanking on the last one. Along with better wireless protocol, optical switches, and 4,000 Hz polling.

@@ThomasMuehler I slightly lower the score because I think LG has better software than Razer (but both are NOT great here). Also I can envision an even better mouse than either. Though yeah. I actually have the LG Pro Superlight and I quite like it. I got it for 30 EUR less so IMHO I did OK. But I really like the Razer one too. I think modern high end mice are generally VERY good. And I honestly dont know what they will come up with next because once one combines and refine's razer's tech with more shapes / style of mice and better software... what is next? Like at that point you have real 9.5s ;d IDK what else can be improced personally.

@@CharcharoExplorer That's fair. I think I'd go with the opposite. I like Razer's software but sometimes it doesn't play nice. So totally get why people don't like it. I hate Logitech's as it may work well but is too complicated and basic. I also think you made a good choice. Can't go wrong the GPX. If you are looking at retail price for both I think Razer is the best choice (assuming you can stand the shape). But to upgrade from the GPX you are definitely paying for diminishing returns where there may be an improvement but it will be small and cost a lot. Also, is dependent on what other gear you have (monitor, GPU, game, etc) and skill if you will see the improvements anyways. I also agree we are in a golden age where finding a BAD gaming mouse is exceedingly hard. The difference between most mice are minor which is why "shape, size, weight" has been the go to advice for most people for years now. But I think Razer's most recent mice has now changed that as the spec increase now is a big enough difference to be noticeable. But PRICE still plays a HUGE part. I think where they will go from here is slight improvements to specs. I think the Focus Pro accuracy is like 99.6% so we still have 0.4% to go lol. Additionally, 8,000 or 10,000 Hz but wireless and better battery life. Outside of that I think we'll see modular designs kind of like keyboards where you can swap out switches and change clicks and all that jazz. Or something we haven't even though of. But it will be interesting to see.

@@ThomasMuehler Yeah small upgrades to software and specs for sure. I think I will upgrade in 2025 to the latest Razer/Logitech/ someone else if they are competitive wireless mouse then. I think it probably STILL wont be a big deal even then but it may be at least something good enough for me. Then the Logitech will be given to either my GF or brother or kept as a mouse for the TV HTPC. It currently uses a cheapo wireless mouse. Having something premium would be nice for it too. WHy not. I play mostly SP games. And I am (at times) GE in CS GO but that isnt due to aiming skill. Same for World of Tanks. Thank you for the review! And yeah I cannot wait for Logitech's response and Razer's response to the response and for the other competitors to reach or perhaps exceed em!

@@CharcharoExplorer I think you've got a solid plan of action going that I totally agree with. Looks like your skill level is good enough that you'd see a difference, but again diminishing returns and not worth it currently. RIGHT! Competition can be a great thing. Appreciate the great conversation. Have a great rest of your day/week. Have fun gaming!

I completely agree with everything you said. GPX definitely has one of the best shapes on any mouse period. But think especially now that the internals aren't as ground breaking as they use to be for the price. The way I sometimes sum it up is that the GPX has an excellent shape that makes up for not as good internals. Where the Viper has superior internals that makes up for it's poor shape.

hahaha. I was using my Viper yesterday and it is an amazing feeling mouse. The balance on it is incredible.

.My bad. I’ll make sure to do that for the next video. Lol

There is a portion of people that definitely agree with you. I think if the Razer Viper Mini had better specs and was wireless to start with it would have been more popular. It is still quite popular despite it's shortcomings. And Razer has confirmed a GOAT Viper Mini will be coming out. It was supposed to be out this year (2022) but something happened that postponed it. I think they are trying to sell it with the 4K dongle and they have had a hard time getting those so I think that plays a part. I too think the Viper Mini shape is better than the Viper. But I've settled for the VIper seeing as the specs have a big enough jump to me that it is worth it. And I don't HATE the viper shape so that makes it more doable. But yeah the Viper Mini is definitely a fan favorite (even if it is not widely popular). I've never heard anybody say they don't like the shape actually. Just a lot of people that are like you.

I appreciate the encouraging words! I'm glad you liked it.

Hmm, significantly big hands makes me not think that the GPX would be a good fit. As it is very much a "medium" sized mouse. With the shape it makes it seem smaller than it is too. I've also had others with large hands report it feels too small. Could still be good but I'm hesitant. It isn't quite as long as the V2 Pro but is taller and has a more dedicated hump. Viper V2 Pro, as mentioned is longer, but is very flat. Great for fingertip grip and works well for claw as well. Terrible for palm. I'd recommend also checking out the Deathadder V3 Pro. As it has modern tech in it. The same as in the Viper V2 Pro. And personally if I'm spending top dollar I want the newest latest and greatest tech over 4-year-old tech (which is in the GPX). Much better sensor and allows for 4,000 Hz (Deathadder V3 Pro & Viper V2 Pro). But reason why I bring up Deathadder is it is a Large mouse made for palm but claw works well too. And I think it would do better for your hand due to the overall size.

It is a very neat technology. However, I'm not sure how many people actually use it. It would be interesting to see how popular it is. Probably more popular than I think seeing as they made sure the Superlight still has it.

@@ThomasMuehler I have both hyperflux and powerplay. I’m using powerplay with g pro super light x. Gotta give it to Logitech for supporting their product even if it didn’t see widespread popularity. The viper v2 would’ve been awesome with hyperflux but we’re stuck with the mamba since forever.

@@obliviondust2719 Totally agree. Gotta respect when a company makes sure a cool feature continues to be a thing despite how popular it is.

I need to do more research on the matter. As I’m getting conflicting things from different people. I agree that 800 DPI will only move 800 dots per inch on the screen. As it is a standard. But if you have two mice at 800 DPI one may still be more accurate than the other. What causes this? DPI, IPS, G’s, Firmware, Software, Other hardware in the mouse? I don’t know. But I have noticed consistently across the board that a higher DPI sensor will perform better than a lower DPI sensor. Even if the actual reason for that has nothing to do with DPI. Hence why I’m saying I need to do more research on it. I also think my analogy makes sense. But maybe I didn’t explain it well and I’m sure it has holes in it. As I came up with it on the spot. Yes, if you take a 4k display and turned the resolution down to 1080p it isn’t going to look like 4k. But you still have 8 million pixels compared to 2 million if you look microscopically at it. Going to 1080p doesn’t just eliminate 6 million pixels. It does spread the 1080p image across more pixels which can make the image blurrier. But again, if you were to zoom in you would still be able to see more detail compared to a normal 1080p screen of 2 million pixels. Making the image the same but not the same at the same time. Not sure how to explain that correctly.

@@ThomasMuehler You wouldn't see more detail on a 4k screen at 1080p in fact you would see less due to the scaling of the display making it more blurry than a native 1080p. The 1080p image is being stretched across mulitiple pixels, its the same amount of detail as a native 1080p its just blurry due to the image scaling that is performed by all lcd-based displays. A mouse sensor isn't a lcd display, so the two mice should feel very similar to each other in terms of DPI because it doesn't have to scale anything. Perhaps the Razer viper is just a better fit for your hand, therefore making the mouse feel better. Maybe im wrong as well, though im not an expert on the topic this is just the way I've always understood it. The latency test also reveals similar response time results when the dpi is the same which should indicate that the DPI feels the same on both.

@@ChazMcClure I apologize for the book. Simply sharing my thoughts. Not saying I'm correct. Correct about the scaling which I mentioned in my comment. But again, that 4k screen still has 8 million pixels even with a 1080p image on it (even though it looks blurrier to the eye due to scaling). Where the 1080p screen still only has 2 million pixels making it technically “less” accurate even if your eyes are telling you something else. Yes, a sensor isn’t an LCD display, but it is a “camera” that is taking an image. So, while they are not exactly the same some parallels can still be drawn from both. I do agree that the dots per inch (the distance it moves) should be the same regardless of the mouse you use. However, feel can be different as if I’m using a Logitech Mouse and a Razer Mouse that 800 DPI can technically have variance. For example (and totally made-up numbers for illustration purpose but I have noticed in real world testing) if I move both mice 1 inch, I can get a full rotation of my character in game on the Logitech Mouse and maybe get a full rotation and a half on the Razer Mouse despite both being set to 800 DPI. Making the Razer one be 850 DPI on the Logitech one to move the same distance. Which comes down to firmware/software/other differences from brand to brand. Therefore, my hypothesis (which could be completely wrong as I’m obviously not an expert either) is that if a mouse is capable of 30,000 DPI it would take a picture of 30,000 “pixels” (which is probably NOT the correct term but I’m running with it) all the time regardless of what DPI you choose. Then when you change your DPI it scales that 800 DPI across 30,000 pixels over reducing the image to 800 pixels. Hence my screen analogy of a 4k display ALWAYS has 8 million pixels even when running a lower resolution. As the 800 pixels scaled across 30,000 pixels would still be more accurate as you have more pixels to rely on making the whole thing more accurate at a granular level. But you could argue that on certain DPI’s that don’t evenly divide would cause you to have DECREASED accuracy. Which brings up the whole pixel skipping debate. Testing has also showed that DPI response time has diminishing returns past a certain point. But this then brings in multiple variables. Which I think is the crux of the problem. We relate DPI to overall accuracy as it is an excellent shortcut to make a snapshot decision on which is better. When in reality the DPI may not have ANYTHING to do with overall accuracy. But having a higher or lower DPI max amount may in fact be a side effect of what makes a sensor more or less accurate. Which is why they use it for marketing as they don’t have to go into the science and all the complicated bits. Hence why I really need to do more research. Or ideally talk with someone who is an expert that can fast track this for me. As from my testing higher DPI mice are more accurate than lower DPI mice consistently and across the board. Is that due to the DPI or something else. I have no idea. As for the fit for my hand. I’ve heard that argument a million times. I do agree that shape plays a major part on how well you perform with something. The issue is that the Viper V2 Pro is not ideal for my hand but I still perform the best with it. The same thing happened across the board with any mouse that had the Focus+ sensor despite it being in different mice (Viper Ultimate, Deathadder V2 Pro, etc). So while the shape does play a part I also think the sensor plays a part as I’ve had other mice that are perfect for my hand shape that I perform worse with because the sensor is inferior. Is this placebo. Possibly. But from my testing doesn’t seem likely. But I’m just some random dude on the internet.

@@ThomasMuehler Maybe your right, but the sensor shouldn't have to scale the image like a display does, the display has to do this because LCD tech uses a fixed pixel format, A camera that you're not actually looking at shouldn't have to perfrom scaling because this would be pointless and add input lag. And yes the 4k display does have more pixels but this doesn't make a 1080p image more accurate on the display because its the same image, the scaling would normally just do what called "pixel doubling" which is pretty much just scaling the image to the size of 4k, No new pixels are added, old ones are simply doubled (or another multiplier depending on the res being scaled) therefore no new detail is added. Dpi variance does exist but this can be easily fixed by just plugging in both mice and seeing what feels the same. But I don't understand all of this on a deep level so at this point im just sharing thoughts.

@@ThomasMuehler Also maybe the higher DPI overhead lowers sensor issues to a even at lower dpi, much like how capping fps allows for a more stable gameplay experience due to there being more GPU overhead to iron out any stutters or issues, idk tho.

According to the spec sheet I looked at on Nvidia's website when I made this review it was not present. But I think that was just due to not updating it as the Viper Ultimate was. But since I don't own a Reflex Monitor I can't test for myself.

Tough Question. My first thought was "GPX is the past, the Viper V2 Pro is the future." Translation = The GPX is using old technology that's been around for years. It has aged well and is still top-tier (for now). But the new Razer Mice (Viper V2 Pro, Deathadder V2 Pro, and Basilisk V3 Pro) have the latest and greatest tech that will become the next staple for the next 2 - 3 years-ish. The Sensor is much improved but more importantly the 4,000 Hz polling changes things. Now that Razer lost their exclusivity of the 3395/3399/Focus+ sensor (granted I think they still hold the rights to asymmetric cut-off, smart tracking, and motion sync (which are the main things that differentiate it from the competition) and have replaced it with the Focus Pro which is even better) the rest of the competition is about to pass Logitech tech wise as well. As wireless (moreorless) is equal at this point (not completely true but basically). As new mice from unknown companies are coming out with that sensor (see Lamzu Atlantis) which know what the market wants (shape, size, weight, click wise, etc.) and are able to deliver at lower prices (as really they are just coming up with molds over the entirety of the tech like Logitech or Razer who did wireless, sensors, clicks, etc.). Where Logitech really has been gliding by since the Logitech G Pro Wireless (not the GPX the WIRELESS original version) came out which was around 2018. FOUR YEARS AGO. The new Logitech G502X has been a huge disappointment as really they did NOTHING different other than adding opto-mechanical switches. I also don't see them doing anything different going forward. Seeing as why would you release one of the most successful mice of all time with specs that are about to become extinct if you were coming up with a new sensor or other tech? Leading me to believe Logitech may come out with an opto-mechanical switch version of the GPX/Wireless but won't be updating the sensor or wireless. But hope I'm wrong about that. All of that to say the Logitech G Pro Wireless has shined for a long time but its reign (in my opinion) is coming to an end. But with all that said, mice are more than the tech inside them. A huge majority of people will report that specs have no say in mice these days as sensors have been "flawless" since the PMW3360. For reference from least to best sensor over the past 5 - 6 years = 3360 -> 3366 (Logitech Exclusive) -> HERO/Roccat OWL, 3390, pretty much any other main sensor on the market these days -> Focus+ -> Focus Pro. I disagree with that 'flawless' statement. As I feel a difference between sensors. So have plenty of people who I've talked to in my comments. Maybe it's placebo. Maybe it's not. I'll let you decide. But back to my point, for years we've (mice reviewers) have been saying the things you should be focusing on is SHAPE, SIZE, WEIGHT. Which was correct. The Logitech G Pro X Superlight hits all three of those for 95% of people which is why it is considered a Greatest Of All Time (G.O.A.T) mouse. I'd argue the shape is arguably one of the best we've ever seen on a mouse. With Logitech's Mechanical Tensioning system they also do a superb job at how their clicks feel along with having great firmware and low latency. Which again, is why its is an S-Tier mouse. But I think with Razer's new lineup of mice that HAVE come out and WILL be coming out SPECS now need to be considered when shelling out premium price for a mouse (greater than $120). As with the GPX you are essentially buying 2018 tech for $116. Where with Razer you are spending $160 for the latest and greatest. BUT the Viper V2 Pro does NOT have as good of a shape (arguable as shape is personal opinion but from general consensus). Additionally Clicks for some are not as satisfying (I'd say 50/50. Where some love em' and some hate em'). There are some other slight difference but come down to personal preference. But spec wise all around Razer wins. I'd argue the Deathadder V3 Pro is a better pick over Viper V2 Pro. As the shape is better. So... all of that to say I have a hard time justifying the cost of the GPX personally. As I look holistically at mice. The GPX, Viper V2 Pro, and Deathadder V3 Pro are all S-Tier mice and are some of the best you can find on the market so no matter what you're getting the best of the best. Mice are more than just specs and come heavily down to personal preference. I think you get more bang for you buck with Razer. But I think there would be a large amount of people who would say go with the GPX. But they would justify that as "it feels good and I perform well with it". Which really is the whole point of a mouse, so they aren't wrong. But I perform better with Razer. Not sure if this helped. I'd be interested in hearing which one you choose and your thoughts on it once you get it in and try it out.

@@ThomasMuehler Man, I cannot express how thankful I am for that reply! You just convinced me to buy the V2 Pro instead of the GPX! To be honest, I was leaning towards the V2 Pro at first but the lower price and the fact that a lot of the FPS pros use the GTX (I wonder why the V2 did not appeal to them as much. Maybe because a lot of them don't like the shape?) made me a bit uncertain. A friend of mine has the V2 Pro so I have tested it already and I really do like the shape and the design. Haven't tested the GTX. I will still give it some thought but your reply definitely pushed me towards the V2 again. Thanks!

You are absolutely right. I've got it on order. But haven't gotten it yet but will be testing it out to see if it makes a big difference or not. As it's also $30 which is a bit steep. Especially, on an already $150 mouse. But in my books the Viper V2 Pro is the better mouse over the GPX by a good margin.

That's fair. I'm glad you are enjoying it! The Viper V2 Pro should be more expensive as it has modern specs where the GPX has 4-year old specs. In the US the GPX tends to float around $140 - $160 all the time with the Viper V2 Pro retailing for $150 and being on sale for about $120 - $130.

Oh man, I'm excited for you. You're in a similar boat as me as I was over the moon when this thing dropped and it has been even better than I imagined and has securely taken my personal top spot. I would love to hear your thoughts on it once you've had some time to try it out.

@@ThomasMuehler You will hear back from me in a few weeks friend, cant wait to try it

@@voltiez1752 I am very much looking forward to it.

@@voltiez1752 go check out kzfaq.info/get/bejne/quCfpsuftM-amqM.html

@@voltiez1752 How do you like the Viper V2 Pro?

Focus Pro by a good margin, Focus+ by a slight margin, HERO, then tied for a bunch of other sensors like the 3395/3370/Owl Eye, BAMF, 3335, etc. But yeah easy win to the Focus Pro as the best sensor right now.

I do agree that at this point shape plays a more critical role over internal specs. And think the generalized advice to get the one that feels better should be the one you should get. As you say the ones that are worth purchasing at the very least have good enough specs. But I completely disagree that human motor skills can’t keep up. As the human body is a wonderful marvel that most of the planet severely abuses, barely takes advantage of, and takes for granted. I’m on the fence about placebo effect as I could argue both side. However, disagree that shape is the only factor when one feels better. As I can have a shape that I know I don’t like but has better internals and it perform better. Also, when you change the shape constantly but feel the same smoothness and accuracy and they have the same internals it means it is the hardware that is providing a lot of that feeling. The Focus Pro sensor destroys anything else on the market. So much so that no other mice are interesting to me right now. As they won’t perform better from an objective standpoint and the shape is just going to be another basic refresh. But I also think that comes down to where you fit in the spectrum. If you are high performance oriented then specs paired with shape matter. If you are on a budget and want the best option as you won’t be able to upgrade specs paired with shape matter. But if you are a causal user then absolutely go with the one that is the best priced that fits your hand well. As specs WON’T matter at that point. Which is like at least 90% of users. Agree with the Starlight-12. A lot of that is hype. Not worth the price. As they aren’t using good internals but budget ones. More interested in the new Starlight X or whatever that is releasing in August. As it has better internals that should be worthy of the price tag. But yeah QC was horrible. Synapse is frustrating. I wish they would come out with a more lean variant that would just allow you to make basic changes to the mouse without all the bloat. But I’m glad you are enjoying the V2 Pro. I really think they knocked it out the park and am still always amazed at how good it feels when I try another mouse and come back to it.

I have a hard time believing that Razer will move away from optical switches in the future. Or they will change in feel to be all that different from how they are now. As they feel extremely similar no matter which generation. It more comes down to shell shape/design than the switch itself. For example the Deathadder V2 has quiet clicks (which can almost be mushy) compared to Viper Ultimate (which are loud and therefore feel more crisp). Despite both having the same gen 2 switches.

@@ThomasMuehler Theoretically the viper shape will be better for my fingertip grip than gpx but the optical switches was a down side for me although others feactures were excelent (Dav2, Bv2). I could try the viper but if the feeling keeps same or even worse than before, I will go to gpx for the click feeling although theoretically is a "worse" mouse. Well the gpx is upgradeable in switch aspect but paying $150 boxes (in my country less than that, is like 117 US) must be a nearly perfect mouse, the gpx is good but Logitech can make better mouses if they want. Edit: Btw, the Vv2p cost like 189 boxes in my country.

@@XD1999cable Out of curiosity what did you not like about the optical switches? I'm assuming feel? But just curious. As for me personally, I find them to be pretty close to the same feel (GPX still has probably the best feeling clicks of any mouse I've ever tried) but are faster (objectively whether I feel it or not) and are immune to double clicks. Both of which I'll take nearly every time over a mechanical switch. But do understand that for some people the way a click feels is the main factor. Where for me performance is. GPX is crazy expensive for being as old as it is with as old of technology. But when you 10/10 the shape and clicks it makes it extremely popular. Not saying the GPX isn't a fantastic mouse. It is just showing its age now adays. And I totally agree that Logitech can make a better mouse. They've done it in the past multiple times. The GPW was so ahead of its time (along with the Viper Ultimate) that the competition just recently caught up. I'm hoping that they have something in the works. As the G502X was mostly a flop. But at the end of the day if you aren't obsessed with performance only metrics (which also at this point may or may not lead to any real world difference) you should be focusing on Shape, Size, Weight, and how it feels for you specifically over everything else. As we are at the point where a lot of mice are so close together performance wise it isn't really worth measuring. But I do think the latest Razer lineup (V2 Pro, Basilisk V3 Pro, Deathadder V3 Pro) are all noticeably ahead performance wise. But again, how dramatically that changes day to day performance varies from person to person and I think percentage wise is still small.

@@ThomasMuehler for don't explain a lot, yep they feel weird, I didn't like the feeling of the clicks is like a mushy feel, with basilisk v2 was less mushy but it still was mushy, again both mices has great feactures but that feeling was annoying, for others games does the job and actually had good click acurancy but the feeling was something that I didn't enjoy in both mices, but the focus+ sensor was the best that I have ever tested. Maybe doesn't help that I used always mechanical switches for over 7 years, and now with the kailh 8.0 the feeling feels good. In short words, I didn't liked the click feeling. Maybe with 1 month of testing will be normal but I tried like 2-3 weeks with my past razers mices, so It was like 4-6 weeks with optical switches. The dav2 was so confortable but it had the most mushy cliks compared with basilisk v2 maybe with viper will be different for the shape but again, in my country cost like 189 us and gpx 117 us I prefer to wait to get the viper because I want to feel that smoothness of past razer mices, something that Logitech didn't give me with hero 25K. Probably I won't like the v3, or maybe I will enjoy a little bit more than past razer mices, it's just a matter of trying and giving razer a second chance.

@@XD1999cable I appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts and experiences. It really does help me out. I can totally understand where you come form with the mushiness of click feel and how that can be a turn off. Also, I completely agree the Focus+ and now the Focus Pro feel way better than anything else. And the HERO sensor to me something just feels a bit off. Also, I get the price makes it hard to swallow/justify. I know that Amazon has refurbished versions that tend to be $99 US over $150. But personally I get anxiety about used items. If you end up trying it out I'd love to hear your thoughts on it.

I totally get where you are coming from and get what you are saying. To just add on a bit. 1. Power savings affect performance/latency. I don't remember off the top of my head. I think it turns off some features making the sensor slightly less accurate. Which honestly, would probably bring it down to par with other sensors on the market. But that is speculation on my part. 2. Best lift off distance tends to be the lower the better. As that way your cursor moves the least amount when lifting and landing. However, this is also a personal preference type thing where some people like it higher or lower. This is also helpful in the case of Crafted Mice Mod where you take the internals of a V2 Pro and put it in a Starlight-12 Shell. With the sensor not being the same height as the original you need to adjust it. This wouldn't be possible with the GPX. 3. Also, optimal settings technically vary from person to person. But it Synapse most people either leave everything at default or they move the sliders to be the max/min of everything. So turning polling to 4,000 Hz (assuming you have the dongle) and then lift off and landing distance to the lowest amount.

@@ThomasMuehler Sounds reasonable to be fair. I got the v2 pro today. You convinced me :) I guess having more options to play around with is a good thing after all. Oh and may I throw in another two questions here? How does the 4k Hz affect the cpu because I read that a few people have problems with that. And, what is the difference between 1k Hz and 4k Hz ( I have a Ryzen 5 7600x if this is any relevant)?

@@silentsnake820 I think having more options to play with is better. But I'm a min/max type of guy so that's my jam. Unless if you have a low-tier CPU I don't think 4,000 hz is going to make a difference with your CPU in a noticeable way. With my old 3800x and now with my 5900x I have zero issues. I'm pretty sure the 7600x being the newest generation is better than my CPU. Bottom line I don't think you'll have an issue. Even on my gaming laptop with like a 5800H or something I have zero issues. As for 1,000 Hz and 4,000 hz I'd recommend watching these two videos as it will go more in depth than me talking here: 1. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/oLmafK-VreDedZ8.html 2. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/mdZnrdBy2JbJoY0.html But basically, 1,000 Hz scans 1,000 times in a millisecond where 4,000 hz scans 4,000 times reducing latency to like 0.25 ms or something which just makes you slightly more accurate. It's not a big difference but I feel a mild difference kind of like goign from 144 hz to 240 hz. You may not feel it when you first upgrade but if you go back down to 144 Hz afterwards you can feel a difference.

@@ThomasMuehler Thanks for the info I checked out the videos

@@silentsnake820 If you end up with a 4K dongle I would love to hear your opinion on if you feel a difference or not. As currently consensus on the internet is mixed. Where some claim there is none. Where others say there is little (like myself). While others say there is a big difference.

Viper Ultimate is going to have the same shape as the Viper V2 Pro, which is the same as the original Viper. Only real changes are internal specs, right side buttons, mouse wheel (kinda), and rgb. I'm a performance oriented guy that also tries to be as objective as I can (in the since I try not to give a product a higher or lower score if it isn't my jam and try instead to judge it on general audience consensus along with the tech inside it and how well or not well it performs but of course personal opinion is impossible to take out of the equation so it still happens). I tend to bias towards that heavily (performance). Whereas, others are more of a comfort or what personally fits them best. To each their own. With that said, objectively the Viper V2 Pro/Deathadder V3 Pro/Razer Basilisk V3 Pro are all technically (performance wise) the best mice on the market by a good margin. Or really anything with those same specs from Razer (Focus Pro Sensor, and ability to do 4,000 Hz polling). Weight for those (except Basilisk is "heavy") is also excellent and in the ideal range for most people. However, SHAPE also is "king" where a mouse can have the best specs but if it doesn't fit you well then it doesn't matter as you will perform worse with it over something with a good shape that fits you well (assuming specs aren't massively different). The Razer Viper Ultimate and any other Razer mouse that have those same specs (Focus+ sensor and their wireless tech and optical switches) are going to be the second best mice on the market from a performance standpoint. Then you get into a tie between all Logitech Mice. As they all use the same tech too (HERO and Omron switches with their wireless tech). But The G Pro Wireless and G Pro X tend to be top dog as the GPX is lightweight but same shape as the GPW. When the GPX/GPW first came out it didn't have any competition. Until six months later the RVU came out. However, the shape from the GPX is arguably one of the best shapes EVER on any mouse period (from a numbers perspective). Pair that with what used to be top of the line specs (as this is a four year old mouse we are talking about that hasn't advanced tech wise since that time) that is lightweight and again arguably has some of the best feeling clicks. Leads to it being a lot of peoples favorite. Add that to a bunch of pros using it and giving the fallacy of belief that it must be "better" along with price point, along with marketing, along with people generally liking Logitech a lot better than Razer and you've got "the best mouse on the market". However, objective testing from a performance point of view shows that isn't correct. if you wave "shape, size, and weight" point of view. Which is also critical for how good a product is. In general the GPX has the same specs (equal) or better then everything else on the market (other than what is listed above and now mice with the 3395 sensor and even then it is arguable). Which is again why most people say it is the best. As if you haven't tried the Razer mice and enjoyed their shape, along with having a good enough gaming machine, monitor, and mechanical skill to feel the difference then you aren't going to say it is better. Or if you aren't someone who is playing to be the "best of the best" then it won't matter. Therefore, making the GPX a better choice as it is a safer shape and clicks may feel more crisp due to being mechanical (but also may lead to double clicks). Basically, what I'm saying is that there are pros and cons to both the Viper V2 Pro, DAV3, and GPX. You can't go wrong with any of them. To me the HERO sensor feels terrible to me and I think the jump in specs is highly noticeable making me completely forget about the GPX (but it was my top mouse for a long long time). I also have objective reasoning for that as well outside of personal opinions. But in the end YOU gotta do YOU. Meaning what is your preference and what feels the best for you? It doesn't matter what I think or anyone else does for that matter as we aren't playing games for you. Which is why at the end of the day you gotta go with what feels best for you.

@@ThomasMuehler it seems weird, but I liked the GPX shape more than the viper from razer, its simple and good quality, I didn't liked that the USB is soo bad quality for high-end mouse. the total I spent on GPX is 117$ with the extended warranty (2 years total warranty)

@@esko4725 I don't think you preferring the GPX shape is weird. I think most people would agree with you. It would be nice if they would update the Micro USB to USB C though. Especially, since these days Micro USB isn't used a lot less. For $117 I think that is a pretty good deal. And if you're happy then that's all that really matters.

Thanks!

You are correct. I believe when I released this video that was not announced yet.

@@ThomasMuehler oh, okay

@E. Ribella dont use patato pc if u buying any of these

It appears to me that the G Pro X Superlight varies dramatically depending on where you live. Here in the US I almost exclusively see it for retail at $159.99. Currently it happens to be on sale for $129.99. I've never in my life seen it for $80. Correct, if you were to play at maximum DPI the mouse would be too fast to control. Unless if you were able to decrease in-game sensitivity to make it manageable. It looks like I need to do more research into how DPI works. As I'm getting to different explanations. Where some people are saying if you have 30,000 DPI that it makes the entire mouse more accurate even if you are using it at lower DPI (which I think is correct, that it will be more accurate, but that may not be due to DPI itself but probable other factors). Where other people are saying 800 DPI is 800 DPI period. Which I also think is correct but is it more accurate then a mouse that maxes out at 3200 DPI vs 30000 DPI? I'd again argue YES but is that due to the DPI or other things? Is DPI only a marketing spec? I have a hard time thinking they'd continue to increase that number if it wasn't important. But that could also be a side effect of the thing that actually makes it more accurate that they can quantify without having to explain it in complicated terms. So, I return to I need to do more research on this matter. But from my experience the higher the DPI the more accurate the mouse. My top three sensors are the Focus+, HERO, and Focus Pro all of which have high DPI, IPS, and G's. But I know firmware also plays a big role. All of that to say I don't have enough knowledge on the subject to effectively answer your question. As I think there are two correct answers. With one being obvious (800 DPI on Mouse A and 800 DPI on Mouse B will both move the same amount of spaces on your screen. But is one more accurate than another due to having higher DPI and is that always present? I don't know). The end of your comment fell apart rapidly. But what constitutes a good or bad scroll wheel really comes down to personal preference. I think the scroll wheel on the Viper V2 Pro is excellent. I prefer it over the one on the Superlight. But plenty of people would disagree with me on that. So I think it makes it hard for manufacturers to get right as everyone has different opinions on it.

@@ThomasMuehler good reply! Nothing more to to say. About the scroll weel is cuz no man want a scroll that’s not firm and makes difference in noise sounds. It’s nothing to like about that fact. The rest of the scroll is okay 😅

@@techquad1151 What do you mean by "not firm". I find my scroll wheel to be extremely firm, consistent, and has extremely dedicated steps. Along with being very accurate (if I scroll x spaces it is always x spaces which isn't always the case with scroll wheels). But I do agree the noise for the Viper V2 Pro is not ideal. But believe that is a side effect of having such a precise scroll wheel. You can't make incredibly crisp clicks without the clicks themselves being loud.

@@ThomasMuehler I did write viper v2. Now I was confused / we booth are agreed then 😍However I’m certain the tech won’t have that as a problem for long if so. no matter how hi end the scroll is xD this is something I can’t like no matter the tech. My Xtrfy Mz1 has a good scroll weel. At least out of the box.. I have way to many mices anyway 😍love for the 🐁 mice

@@ThomasMuehler yes( I know its not scalping in your country probably stock priced) Anyway -in Norway Scalping is not ordinary, it happens.. However big stores here follow a certain sale’ policy. Cuz viper v2 is a newer mice then Logitech’s - it’s now only 80 $. Anything else would be kind of a rip off or scalping near in my shops.

That is correct. Logitech G Pro X Superlight often referred to as GPX or Superlight in shorthand.

lol fair enough. I've actually had both lock up on me and not work. But Synapse has a large lead on how often it happens. But Logitech's software is so useless I'm not sure why it even exists. It's a lose lose. lol

That has been my thoughts as well. But studies have also shown that there is a reduction in latency with higher DPI (say 400 over 1600).

@@ThomasMuehler if that’s true that‘d be cool

@@DeutschPolizei Check out Battle(non)sense. He has videos on it.

I'm glad it has worked well for you. I'm just not a fan.

@@ThomasMuehler your not alone I heard this before Maybe it’s cuz all I do I switch my dpi and polling rate

@@Flock13 Yeah for that it works just fine. You try to do anything more complicated then that and it falls apart quickly.

@@ThomasMuehler makes sense I’m thinking about getting v2 pro my left click broke on my super light I can still use it just cracked and broke off a little bit

@@Flock13 That's a bummer. The Viper V2 Pro is an S Tier mouse assuming you like the shape. It is my main and will continue to be so. But the G Pro X isn't a slouch either. Comes down to what you can afford. But certainly don't think the V2 Pro is a bad purchase. If you end up getting it I would love to hear your thoughts. How'd you break the click on your Superlight?

Agree on all points. Also, loving the non-biased take as well. I'm with you I would love to see Logitech release a new G Pro or similar with ballin' specs that destroys Razer. But until that happens. Razer's currently top dog.

@@ThomasMuehler Yeah fr i have products from both brands and they are incredible, for price to perfomance i think the best product i have is the logitech g435 very very good headphones for their price very good materials, design, battery life, sound and range. Also for the realese of a new Logitech mouse i think it will be great for marketing and it will be more interesting and better to have another competitor from logitech's side. It will be interesting what they can come with.

@@zon1c341 Totally agree. I'm a big fan of Logitech. But think a lot of the recent fare has been meh. But I have enjoyed both the G335 and G535. The Astro A30 was interesting. I found the G502 refresh to be highly disappointing. The G735 was a failure. So currently not liking their current direction. As it just feels like they aren't trying, are capitalizing on their previous good will as they use to knock every product out of the park, and are only out to make profits but not good products. So, I'm really hoping they turn around. As I want the healthy competition in the market and I want to love their products again.

@@ThomasMuehler Me too i love logitech but the direction as you said where they are headed to is not good. I recently bought a new keyboard g512 carbon and im very pleased with its performance in games, built quality, switches etc. The keyboards of logitech are great but i think they can realese something better i hope the future we are headed to gives us great products from the brand.

Call of Duty Ghosts was great. I don't know what you're talking about. lol

I would agree you have the polar opposites here. Where the GPX is almost too safe of a shape where the Viper is a lot more daring and flat. Personally, I really enjoy both shapes. But the Viper took me a while to get used to. But the more I use it the more I like it. Where, the opposite almost seems true with the GPX. Where I keep coming back to it, enjoy the shape for a bit, and then am like, "meh". I'd love to hear your thoughts once you try them both out. I think people will like the new Viper V3 HyperSpeed shape. It is more safe while keeping a lot of the good parts of the Viper. I'm still VERY early in the testing phase, but it may be one of my favorite shapes of all time.

Well the average mouse is still closer to 80 grams. When the Superlight first came out the average mouse was probably closer to 90 - 100 grams. So 63 grams was Superlight. The Superlight (and the Viper V2 Pro) are still some of the lightest mice on the market as well so I'm not sure what you mean by not even being light. They are only beaten by a select few mice (such as the Starlight 12) which isn't readily available for the mass majority of people. But I get where you are coming from.

You gotta do what you think is right. The V2 Pro is easily the superior mouse. I'd recommend checking out the pinned comment of this video. But that's completely up to you.

I haven’t had any issues with synapse for quite some time now. And by quite some time I mean years. No you don’t need an account to use it. You can have a guest profile, set your settings and then uninstall the program. I don’t know what ads you’re talking about. however I do still agree that having more simple software that isn’t as busy and complicated would be appreciated. Or even a single software that allows you to edit multiple peripherals from different companies would be awesome. I will admit the RGB settings on synapse are still highly frustrating, and the inability to save colors to your mouse is ridiculous.

Appreciate the input! What makes you like the V2 Pro better?

@@ThomasMuehler they both feel comfortable in my hand but I use a aggressive claw grip and the viper fits me like a glove. After about two hours of gaming on my gpx my hand starts to cramp up. I know I'm not the only person that happens to. I've heard others say the same thing. The viper is designed for a claw grip and you can tell instantly after using it the first time if you are a claw gripper.

Totally understand where you are coming from. $250 is nuts. In the US at least it's the same price as the G903 originally launched for which would be $150 (us dollars). And would have released for $130 if it weren't for COVID and all the jazz that have increase pricing for everything (among other things). But you can't beat soldering on new ones and having a mouse that feels brand new for $10ish. Definitely made the right play there my dude. Well done. The G903 is still one of my favorite mice of all time. As that was the FIRST expensive mouse that I bought (actually the G900). But man it was awesome.

Big win. Appreciate it. Still have a lot of questions though. Not sure if I fully understood it in the way of how DPI relates to the other computations for overall accuracy. I get that a sensor can have 40x40 pixels, of the 40x40 pixels you can choose subpixels which then increases your overall DPI (25 in the case for the video was 4250 DPI where 29 was 25k for the HERO sensor) and then it would be higher for the Focus Pro sensor. Which then uses interpolation to see the differences. It still almost seems to me that a mouse with a higher DPI will still be making more data points (even at lower DPI's) therefore making it more accurate. As each pixel has more subpixels which has more points of data even though it will move the same distance. But again, that is the part of the video that I'm not quite sure I fully understand.

Agreed.

The Viper is easily the winner. But since it's "cool" to hate on Razer and love on Logitech it tends to win. Despite being behind. However, I truly do appreciate your candor and I'm glad you found your winner! As at the end of the day it doesn't matter how good or how bad a product is as long as you like it and are satisfied with it.

Solid choice. GPX is a great mouse. I wouldn't say MUCH better. But does have a superior shape. But not specs.

I don't think I've ever agreed with a comment more in my life. I 100% agree with everything you just said. GPX just released a RED version and it's REVOLUTIONARY! lol

@@ThomasMuehler little update, i just refunded the gpx and bought a deathadder v3 pro so i can switch between DAv3 (Dave?????) And viper v2 as my wrist is not too happy about going from a heavy DAv2 wired to a light and flat viper

@@smalzio. lol I never noticed that it spelled out Dave... nice catch! Not a bad idea. I definitely go back and fourth a lot just depending on what I'm doing or how I'm feeling that day.

Yeah, I was highly disappointed (and still am) of the GPX side buttons. As they are probably the mushiest side buttons I've tried. Which is a bummer seeing as the GPW were solid. But I am really impressed with the V2 Pro and DAV3 side clicks. I'd love to get your thoughts on it once you've tried it out.

I am right there with you.

On which game?

@@dushanstankovikj For me I am better on ALL games with the V2 Pro. I perform objectively better all around with the V2 Pro. But again, still love the GPX.

@@ThomasMuehler i think that diference in modern mouse sensors are so slight almost no exsistant. Maybe because you are playing lower dpi thats why you cant track as well as viper pro. Because lower dpi have more input lag expecially on wireless mouses. Try 1600 dpi and lower your sens than you will see the difference.

@@dushanstankovikj quake champions and cs.

You are correct. When I recorded this video the 4,000 Hz dongle hadn't released yet.

@@ThomasMuehler my bad I thought that the 4000 hz polling was in the mouse it self but I was wrong lol

@@icy_mixtures9851 All good as technically you aren't wrong. The mouse does support 4,000 Hz internally but that isn't used until you pair it with an external 4,000 Hz dongle which is sold separately. Or at is for now that may change in the future, and by future I mean like a year or two from now. But you can get it bundled currently (if it is in stock as they have been having a hard time keeping up).

That's awesome! What are your thoughts on them both?

@@ThomasMuehler I've used the Superlight a lot more, cause I had it for longer, but so far I actually like the razer better, mainly cause it feels lighter, but I'm about to mod the Superlight and the razer is for a project where I will only use the PCB and create my own case kinda like optimum tech so will see how it's gonna be then

@@jomio4682 Appreciate you sharing your two cents! Can totally understand using the Superlight for longer. I'm with you where I think the Razer just feels better. Those mods sound kind of interesting. What mod are you doing for your Superlight?

​@@jomio4682 Appreciate you sharing your two cents! Can totally understand using the Superlight for longer. I'm with you where I think the Razer just feels better. Those mods sound kind of interesting. What mod are you doing for your Superlight?

@@ThomasMuehlerI wanna solder in new switches on the Superlight (kaihl 8.0), clip weight off the main frame, if I find a good 3 pin battery with half the capacity I wanna use that. Then lighten the shell and base by cutting out non critical parts kinda like bearded bob did

What surprises me is that on the Logitech G Pro Wireless (GPW) they were good. But on the Logitech G Pro X Superlight (GPX) they are probably some of the mushiest I've tried. And you would think with how popular this mouse is they would have tried to fix that over time. Especially, since Logitech hasn't released anything new since that time (excluding the G502x or whatever it is called that was a massive let down all around).

Super light is 120 bucks here in Sweden.

The build quality feels cheap compared to a GPX. Even the RV Mini has better build quality. What you’re really paying for is the sensor and inflation. Shape is opinionated.

I'm actually surprised at how often I don't see it. Along with people trying to compare sale prices to retail prices. As that isn't exactly fair either as this is a brand new mouse. Of course it isn't going to be on sale. But I get where they are coming from.

That's awesome. $160 here in America.

Interesting. My Viper V2 Pro feels way better than the GPX and Viper Mini. But I suppose that comes down to opinion too. You are correct. You are paying for the sensor, along with other top of the line specs, with a smidge of inflation. Shape is completely individualized.

I’m not sure what you are referring to. Mind enlightening me?

Loved the rundown. I do agree that Razer is known for inflated prices. I can see how having such large hands would not only make the Viper (and the lack of hump) uncomfortable but also just hard to find a good mouse in general. I think having a large version of the Viper Mini would be absolute fire (as it has a good pronounced hump and is a much better shape than the original Viper if small mice fit your hand). I'm also all over having a switchable back. As I'm always a fan for options and customizability. I would imagine that a new Deathadder will eventually drop with the updated specs. As it is one of their most popular mice. An ultralight version of that would also be awesome. And if they could improve the clicks a bit. Fire.

@@ThomasMuehler Yeah, I find it amusing when reviewers and posters complain about the DA or Katana being too big, lol. I am curious about the Pulsar Xlight V2 Mini, as it does have a higher hump - which is my main issue with the Viper - with a shorter length. I'm thinking it might be more maneuverable than than the DA or NKS. Do you think that mouse could work with my size hands? As for the DA, I agree that an ultralight version would be great, along with the Viper V2 Pro's switches (the DA's main buttons are too mushy). And my Katana had a problem with spinout, so I got a refund, which led me to trying the Viper. Anyway, I'm off to Best Buy to return it. Maybe I'll use the refund to pay off a car note. 😄

@@Noneya5555 ​ @nbri555 The surface level specs of the Xlight V2 Mini look good. It is a bit shorter than the Deathadder (but I think the more important factor would be overall size over length). Looks to be a bit wider which could go either way of being a positive or negative. Personally, I like thinner as I think it gives me better control (think a pencil/pen vs a thicker paintbrush). But again, personal opinion. The heigh is also 3 cm shorter. Unfortunately, one thing I have learned with mice shapes as it really doesn't matter how much you talk about the shape as you never know until you try it. Or you've tried a bunch of mice and know what you like or dislike. I've heard great things about Pulsar. And they say they made sure it is balanced. 55 grams is great. Good battery life. Solid sensor. Good switches. So spec wise and price wise it seems like a win. Assuming it actually fits your hand and also feels good. As specs can be misleading and don't always mean you get a good product. Most of the time the switch feel doesn't come from the switch itself but from the shell design of that mouse. As if it is off it will make the actual click feel a lot different. With the Deathadder changing overtime the clicks have also changed. Not so much because of the switch but because of the under the hood changes to the shell to get it lighter or add functionality. Have you looked into the M4/M42? As I know you mentioned that earlier and I think they have great shapes and the M4 I have is excellent. The new Model O Pro may be of interest. But I think it is closer to the Logitech G502 which is more made for medium/large hands over extra large. One mouse I really liked was the Corsair Sabre RGB Pro. So, I'd definitely recommend checking out that guy. As it is made for larger hands. The Logitech G903 is heavy but has a unique shape that may fit. And I'm on the fence about the Roccat Burst Pro. As I think that will be a bit too small but has an awesome shape. Almost a large Viper Mini actually. Then there is also the Kone Pro Air from Roccat as well. Cooler Master MM720 MAY work as well. Unique shape that if it fits is surprisingly awesome. Quite wide so that may work well. Those are the only things that I can think of off the top of my head. As I tend to not focus on extra large hands (as unfortunately you are more of an outlier). My hands fit squarely into the large category so I'm pretty ideal as things go in that end. And no joke about the Car Note. Lol

Deathadder V3 Pro is probably very good for you.

@@sagnikmaulik I saw that Razer released the DAV3. And you may be right, that one might be better for me. It’s just too bad it’s as expensive as the new Viper. Hopefully, the price will drop around Christmas. Thx for the suggestion. ✌🏾

If you say so. I haven't noticed that on any of my Razer mice and classify them as low pre-travel on average with low to medium post travel. As mine barely move before I hear and feel the click. So I find them to be as competitive as anyone when it comes to the best mice clicks when I do A - B testing. Including comparing directly to Logitech GPW and GPX. So, I'm not sure if I'm just lucky, you're unlucky, or if people are just thinking it has a lot of pre-travel based off other reviewers, or other. So, personally don't understand where that comes from. Was recently watching Bearded Bob who said the same thing that it "has horrible pre-travel (like usual)" and I was like WTF are you talking about?! lol. He was also completely wrong about the sensor for the Deathadder V3 Pro. But otherwise enjoy him for his breakdowns. Even if his knowledge of the tech isn't top-tier his disassembles and weight loss mods are.

Yeah, I would love to see them update it. There old software was much better in my opinion.

@@ThomasMuehler I didn’t get to know the old one 😩😥

@@idonodono6678 Yeah Logitech G Hub replaced it which I was quite upset about. The old one didn’t look nearly as good and didn’t do as much. But the layout was so much better so I wish they would have just updated that. Over this monstrosity.

Right?! I don't understand how it's so bad.

I'm assuming that you live in a different region than me. As I see it in stock everywhere (Amazon, Razer, and Best Buy).

@@ThomasMuehler indeed xd

@@rodrigofernety Well when it finally comes in stock and you've had time to try it out AND if you actually remember. I'd love to hear your thoughts on it.

Maybe not as much as I make the title seem. And the GPX is still an excellent mouse. But I definitely think the Viper V2 Pro is better in almost everyway.

@@ThomasMuehler I have the two of them and I try it out both so I have a very good idea what are the pro and cons of both mouse but in my opinion the v2 is way better even my AIM is better … tracking is amazing great review thanks so much you got a new sub here

@@GAMINGANDFITNESSREALTY I 100%. My aim is WAY better with the Viper V2 Pro over any other mouse and I'm actually in love. lol. I'm glad you love it just as much as I do. Also, welcome to the family Gaming & Fitness. I'm very happy you are here.

Imma be honest wit you. I have no idea what that means.

@@ThomasMuehler don’t pay any attention to him it’s something these kids say these days that makes them feel “cool”.

Perhaps? But what if you're wrong?

I'm curious on what misinformation you're talking about and the video you are talking about from BattleNonSense? As I don't like to be giving incorrect information. But I'm not sure what you are talking about exactly. My explanation on how sensors work is likely incorrect. However, my conclusion that the Focus Pro sensor is much better than the HERO sensor is not. But again, I don't like being wrong and sharing incorrect information so specifics from you would be helpful.