Lisa's attitude is exactly why the predators are allowed to get by with sa for decades. 😢

This wasn't abuse,this was criminal by law what Robert Morris did. The victim was a young girl . Not an adult. This wasn't a moral failure,it was r@pe.

Great job, Blaise. These cases are horrific, but what’s worse is how ministers are dismissing and gaslighting people with a healthy outcry for these abuses. It’s shocking!

Preach it, Blaise! What you're saying is right. People must not read 1 Corinthians 5 very often. And for those who constantly say, "Don't judge," they need to read verse 12 - "Do you not judge those who are within the church?" That whole chapter is very clear. Strong church discipline can be done in love.

Never submit to anyone who claims religious authority. The authority they are claiming is illigitimate.

I don’t understand what is going on with these leaders? Thank you for talking on this! It breaks my heart how far from the Fear of the Lord we have gone in American Church! Lord forgive us!!

Follow the money. They are on the celebrity pastor speaking circuit. They laud each other and sell each others books. They receive huge fees to speak at each others churches. The introductions they give to each other are embarrassing. Ask yourself, who is getting the glory? Why would they bite the hand that feeds them? Thank you Blaise for calling out sin Biblically. I used to be a Charismatic and read their books, but I just want to study the Bible and fellowship in a small church. I do not trust these mega churches or celebrities.

That's because they never had abuse happen to their daughters. Thank you for standing up for victims.

Lisa Bevere is a fascinating study in hypocrisy. Her FB page is filled w/rants about protecting women and children.

She has minimised their behaviour

So thankful that you’re calling this out Blaise! Absolutely horrified by Lisa’s response! Absolutely shocking and just mind blowing

I will NOT listen to anyone again who speaks like Lisa is and that includes John Bevere or anyonr else, even if I formerly learned from them.

"Sometimes the judgement of God IS the body of Christ speaking..." Those words couldn't be more true. Well said.

8 years ago, I 'room-mated' with a woman recognized as a Southern California prophetess. After 3 months, I couldn't wait to leave. She and our third roommate (all of us over 50) brought in a man half our age to live with us. I protested this was unholy; they refused to listen. I even found this third roommmate sleeping next to this young man. I quickly found a new apartment. I am still on this woman's email list as she continues to travel as a 'minister.' She convinced a formerly gay man that he is a minister 'under her authority.' Any man coming out of that lifestyle needs to submit to a mature, male pastor for healing.

Thank you for continuing to speak the truth. Her comments are so disappointing.

I totally agree. Time out in PRISON.

Lisa comes from the “Don’t touch God’s anointed” crowd. Check out her husband John’s teaching series Under Cover. They promote honor culture even when the leader falls.

If you can't admit that rape, murder, sexual abuse, and assault/battery is worse than gossip or a social lie such as "I love your outfit"... then, you aren't living in reality.

Amen brother. I feel like the key leaders in the big mega churches well known pastors are circling the wagons and don't want any accountability and this wickedness gets glossed over. Zero repentance. 😮😮😮😮 Lord have mercy!

'Spank a bunch of people and put a bunch of people in time out'??? Why do you talk about grown men like they're 4 yr olds Lisa? What an ignorant, minimizing statement for the victims to hear. This was so weird and reveals a lack of intelligence. Is this where she lives in her mind toward life and people in general when she stands up as a leader? Too weird for me.

Most children who have been sexually abused end up using drugs and alcohol and end up in the treatment centers that I use to counsel in. Every client I met with all have the same story, they used drugs to deal with the trauma. These two victims, who have shared their stories are tremendously brave to have never turned to substances when it's 98% of all victims over 30 years of working in this field. To be a woman and try to brush this over is disgusting.

There’s a layer of fear in Lisa in her rant. Why? The spanking comment…..Lisa, you do not have a mother’s authority over the Body! You cannot silence the Body through intimidation and control. As your husband’s ministry progressed, the red flags started flying, and I stopped reading his books which were filled with erroneous teaching. And dear lady, I’m left today void of respect for you also

I have loved and been blessed by the Bevere family ministry for years, but this is disheartening to hear. It makes me think Christian leaders who are trying to downplay these things are downplaying for fear of their own hidden sins becoming exposed.

You hit it on the nail. I just watched the HillSong documentary. 😢. Was not just one leader, oh my.....very corrupt business in the ministry. Many victims came forward with sexually assault, and spiritual abuse in the church. But were silenced for years. No help was given to them. It was to protect the predators in church leadership, and their empire. And yes, I too was raised in the church never to question leadership in the ministry. "Do not touch God's anointed", gave many a free pass with absolutely no accountability. Praying for change, true repentance. But many have been disqualified to be Pastors in the Christian Church. They are called in scripture, to be beyond approach even with outsiders.

At the end of the day these celebrity preachers protect their own. They think they are above us common folk because they have convinced themselves they are modern day apostles. I believe there are modern day apostles, but few if any of them are celebrity preachers.

You are so right to call her out...now I understand why I never "bore witness" with both of the Breveres.

She is protecting her very lucrative income and influence streams. The conference and publishing network she is part of. If this network collapses, which it should, her wealth will collapse as well.

Why do leaders like Lisa always go all the way to the "worst case scenario" and say people who calling out unrighteous behavior are "cursing" them. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground for them. No Christian wants to curse anybody?? We want discipline, accountability, repentance and reformation!!! These straw man arguments are deflecting from reality and genuine sin.

THANK YOU so very much for speaking TRUTH in the Body of Christ !! The LORD is shaking the mountain of religion and exposing the true believers of Jesus Christ!!!🙌🏻🙌🏻

I’m not surprised, given that she and John travel in the same circles as Robert and Mike have for years. To date, no one has really stood up for CSA victims who are part of the religious elite. It’s important we see this truth no matter how painful.

"I want to spank them but hey, they're not my servants.." It seems like God is revealing that a lot of these "pastors" are not His servants but rather wealth-seeking frauds who secretly practice lawlessness (Matt. 7:21-23) And Lisa sounds like she had already heard through the grapevine that this type of sin was going on. A pastor should be a man above reproach (1 Tim. 3:2, Titus 1:6-7) not some guy who happens to have charisma but can barely keep it in his pants. That kind of guy can lead us in how to treat Grace like it's cheap, the "hey we're all sinners" doctrine, like we're all just staving off the urge to harm children or cheat on our spouses. That is not a man above reproach who can lead us in righteous living and he should be barred from the pulpit.

Just my perspective: pastors, modern day prophets and many others say don't touch my anointed- maybe just maybe the CREATOR is talking about the children and not self appointed people! This issue is very vile and disgusting and it definitely needs to be addressed and dealt with!

These “leaders” have become just like politicians. As their influence rises they become more and more disconnected from the reality of everyday people. They go from conference to conference, podcast to podcast, writing books and making a lot of money. It’s wrong and needs big reform.

Very good rebuttal. Her protests and objections are problematic and disturbing. She sounds guilty and afraid.

My dad was An angry alcoholic who died in a bad way. I always wondered what happened to him in his childhood. My aunt called me the day after he died and told me he was SA’d when he was young by his dad’s friend. It ruined his life, and many others

Agree that this is so very serious that it must be handled publicly and completely! And legally!!

And this is exactly why these leaders have no problem doing what they do. No fear of God and no fear of being rebuked with real consequences. Even the world does not protect predators. Making a joke of the Body of Messiah with this cover up position. Where is your empathy for their victims?

Dear Lisa B~ Umm... No.

I wonder if this would bother people more if they were Hollywood celebrities instead of celebrity pastors. As Christians we can not excuse these wolves in sheeps clothing.

My understanding a leader is held at a higher accountability

Yes..absolutely..it is time for the church to demand accountability from the leaders / ministers in the church..if we do not no one else will..

What got them in trouble? Sexual assaulting a minor is a crime!

Agree with you. Stop the criminal “ministry” mafia in the world

Thank you Blaise for addressing what Lisa Bevere said. Her thinking is erroneous and reveals her lack of understanding the aggregious and criminal sins of these predatory wolves using the body of Christ. I pray she gets true biblical knowledge and apologizes for her error. This problem is very disturbing.

Thank you for sharing. As a 50 year survivor of sa I can attest to the way it totally changes your life. And to think she is just blowing this off with a time out kind of scenario is shocking, disappointing, and a little maddening. When people want to ignore or push this type of thing under the rug I have to wonder why. Maybe it's friendship? I wonder ... if she just found out her son had been sa by her pastor 25 or 30 years ago ... would it still be so easy to be nonchalant about it and just take a time out? Idk. I lost a lot of respect for her today. Does God forgive? Absolutely. He forgives all the other people in jail who have committed crimes when they come to him. But that doesn't take away the fact that they committed a crime. And they can't just take a time out rather than serve time for the criminal act committed. Beyond frustrated with these people of influence being above the law...even tho the law states there is a statute of limitations. That's great for the perpetrator. Too bad there's no statute of limitations for the victims whose lives are completely "reformated" from what God intended them to be bc of living in secret pain trying to protect a family from what they believe and are told is their responsibility or it will all fall apart. Sorry. I'm rambling but this struck a nerve.

Wow, Blaise, you were nailing it on every point. Thank you for making yourself available for the Lord to speak truth through you. I hope Lisa hears this. The fact that she said nothing about the deep and lasting harm done to an innocent child is shocking and heartbreaking. 💔

THANK YOU FOR SERVING BROTHER ❤️🙏

Again with the straw man. No this is not about the body of Christ being a bunch of immature brats, gleefully condemning fallen leaders. It’s not about forgiveness or unforgiveness. It is about real, biblical, New Testament accountability for leaders. It’s about which people are or are not qualified to have leadership and influence in the body of Christ. It is about processing the grief and pain and damage caused by leaders who were not EVER qualified to be leaders in the church. It is about justice and about holding people accountable for their choices (for their own sakes and for the sake of all the precious people around them- who are just as important in God’s eyes as any celebrity “minister”, btw.) I’m so disappointed and grieved by this.

Evil needs to be exposed, not overlooked

Thank you for calling her out on this. My mother, who is in her 70's and a truly Godly woman, got upset with me when i talked about whats going on. It is shocking that so many people, whom I normally respect, would be backing a criminal. What the actual is happening?!?

My question is, what are THEY hiding??? The gaslighting, grooming and being so out of touch is truly sad. I have worked with victims and survivors and it can affect someone their whole life if they cannot get the proper help. Even with help, it can take years to recover! Didn't Yeshua say it would be better to have a millstone placed around their necks and thrown into the sea than to harm a child? Didn't he also say a good shepherd leaves the 99 SHEEP to go after the 1? Not the shepherd, but the sheep!

I’m sure she’d feel differently if that was her 12 year old daughter

It’s interesting To note that the apostle Paul called out people by name and named their sins in his letters. He mentioned one guy by name who said the resurrection already happened and warned the church to stay away from him. He mentioned one guy to the Corinthians who slept with his father‘s wife and told them to cast him out of the church until he repented. He told the church about another brother by name who “loves this present world” and so he refused to take him on his next journey. We should use the Bible as our example. Paul did not concerned himself with “honoring” fallen brethren.

Lisa Bevere’s defence of these men is abhorrent. I just had another conversation with my teary 30 yo daughter last night. She was SA’d for years as a child by her grandfather. She has been in counselling for years and despite having come a long way, was working through a rough bunch of emotions yet again. She wondered aloud if she would ever not feel this way. What has been done to these victims doesn’t just allow them to move on, but stays with them. Some are driven to addiction or worse. The abusers being “trusted” men, whether family members or spiritual leaders actually makes them worse than if it were a stranger. I just can’t imagine how anyone can defend them. Maybe if Ms. Bevere or one of her children had experienced SA themself, she wouldn’t be so quick to come to the rescue of the victimizers. I’m sickened by anyone’s defence of what happened. It says a lot about these people.

Good job on this. The only reason people try to confuse, speaking the straight truth with cursing or attacking. Is because they are subconsciously afraid people will seriously look at what is truly going on in their lives. An honest person never fears scrutiny. They may be annoyed by it, but never afraid. Some even welcome it because they know it will highlight their integrity.

This is an EXCELLENT response to Lisa's take on things. I am astounded at her response and that part about God dealing with the other nations...if anyone is like me and felt that slight terror at those words, that's exactly what spiritual abuse can feel like (when someone tries to intimidate you with God's word and push you into something that God is not actually saying to you). That was not on Lisa, it's not the same at all. I am so glad Blaise's response was spot on!

Excellent reply!! Thank you so much!!

"Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment" John 7:24 expose the wolves in sheeps clothing

All sin is not equal. Even the Bible says sexual sin is worse!!! How a sin affects another person matters!!! All sin will keep you out of heaven, equally, we all need the blood of Jesus, but not everyone has broken the law with their sin and hurt other people so much.

It appears God is separing the wheat and tares and both are making their fruit known for everyone to see. Its sad to see how many people in the body of Christ are actually tares. That's why we put our faith in Christ and not people. Which ,unfortunately, alot of us have learned the hard way.

Well Mrs. Bevere, If its in the bible ,than its for us. It was good enough for Paul, its good enough for everyone else in CHRIST ✝️✨🙌🏼. No abuser of children, wifes, church ,finances, ect. has a place on the pulpit. How prideful you are Lady!!. In my expierience, people who dont want to face the sins of the church, have a lot to hide themselves and ate scared the garbage getting in public....

Bravo Blaise !! Continue your bold courageous calling out of predators and the apathy and refusal by leaders to strongly call them out and demand accounting and change!! Churchianity is not safe for me … I shall not return ever again !! 5 decades of this crap!! DONE!!

Thank you, Blaise!👏 The way these leaders keep circling the wagons for each other displays such a *disconnect* from what's really happening with REAL people out here and REAL victims and yes, I'll say it, even what seems like a disconnect from the heart of God. I used to receive a lot from Lisa Bevere's ministry, but this....she *really* missed it here. Her talk about "spanking," and just the overall tone....even the blond woman in the short clip (IMO) looked uncomfortable. Her explanation seemed more how celebrity Christian leaders view THEMSELVES in the Bible (I guess that no one's ever allowed to hold them accountable...), yet shows a real lack of understanding of the *Word* of God and real lack of the *fear* of God of how VERY seriously He views abuse, oppression, injustice, etc. This, "Sit down and shut up, no talking by you peasants will be allowed by us, the KINGS!!!" kind of speech ....there are no words 😮 Everything in Lisa's words and demeanor here is a reflection not of the fruit of the Spirit, but of insensitivity, pride, myopia and impatience, with an uncaring, scolding attitude. Something is *definitely* off 🤔

Perhaps time for those leading the flock who have caused abuse to take responsibility and not get away with it.

Thank you for addressing this head on! I got a message from a very close friend telling me she heard from God that “you are persecuting God’s people.”

My heart hurts every time I hear someone like this and others say these kind of things. Now I’m wondering what’s in her and hubby’s closet.

John beavers teachings caused havoc like you would not believe in the church in my town, those old vhs/dvds did the rounds and it gave the pastors free reign to treat people like garbage

Keep going 🙌🏼🙌🏼 Your podcasts have changed my life.

To "spank a bunch of people and put them in time out" sounds like you are talking about a *child*, not an adult! Children might argue about going to bed or lie or hit back at their parents. Apples and oranges and all that. This is not even close to the same thing, Lisa.

Spank them and put them in time out?? While we are so busy showing "mercy" for the great evil that these people have committed, the victims are ignored and where is the care and mercy for them.. makes me so angry. Thank you for standing up for the victims. Repentance is the only way or it keeps happening and hurting so many people..

13:56 just finishing, nice handling that there. Even if one argues the "Robert Morris" guy doesn't fall under Matthew 18.6 level of the Lord's judgment, and we were to accept that he is not a false brother, then all the more it is right to bring forth a rebuke before all in such a case. But no one is cursing either way (save maybe the guys running for the hills in the end). It's Biblical to confront sin in the body of Christ. And if for this, as her insinuation suggests to others from a place of fear-based thinking "God will judge me next if I speak up" then so be it, and may our voice all the more stand upon: "I know, O LORD, that Your judgments are righteous, and that in faithfulness You have afflicted me" Psalm 119.75 and "Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me...And see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting." Psalm 139:23-24 and even "Behold, I am the Lord's servant; let it be to me according to your word." Luke 1.38 thanks for speaking to this. It's reflective I think of the man-centered "gospel" in the "church" 🤔

Thank you for your boldness, for your love and for being a voice for those suffering and for the body of Christ as a whole. I say amen to your prayer as well.

This was beautiful and I appreciate you and your wife’s words and heart so much! What you are doing to help people that say they follow Jesus actually have the fear of the Lord is wonderful.

I am fairly certain that they have books published by Charisma. It is in their financial interests to tow the Stephen Strang party line.These people will never change, in my opinion.

Another excellent program! Well said!! God BLESS you❤

Lisa Bevere is in error here. Her stance as a mature leader is extremely troubling. I regard her misappropriation of scripture and bad theology inexcusable.

Hopefully the statute of limitations will be lifted like in Australia … anyone who has harmed a child in this way should be held accountable and face serious consequences but how much more devastating for someone representing God doing so!

Talk about taking a verse out of context. Lets go to what Jesus said about harming children. "It would be better you weren't even be born", I will leave that there.

Many church leaders are self-appointed, not God ordained. Not sure which ones are really anointed by Father God? Agree with your prayer at the end.

"spanked and a timeout" is a wild statement!

Keep up the good work Blaise. Really appreciate you and Christina and all the work you do for the body of Christ.

I have lost all respect for her and her husband after this statement I will no longer spend $1 on any of their books or anything else that they're selling they've sold out.

God actually used prophets to expose sin and rebuke Israel. When Israel didn't listen to the prophets THEN God used other nations to punish them. Today, in the church, very often, the voice of those who expose sin is being silenced. We don't even allow for sin to be responded to and dealt with. This is so ungodly.

Yes! We are called to be the REAL EKKLESIA which means to judge the evil amongst us, also representing the true kingdom of heaven according to Luke 10:19 ❤ We are supposed to be taking dominion and authority over this earth 🔥

1 Corinthians 5 tells us how we should respond to sin in the church. Many of these leaders would do well to read that chapter. I just saw where Lisa B is scheduled to speak at Gateway Church Conference coming up soon. Perhaps her $10,000-$20,000 speaking fee could have something to do with not wanting to speak out about RM abuse of a 12 year old little girl:(

Both John and Lisa have been under at least 3 controversial ministries, so shocked to hear that from her

Thank you!!!! So thankful for this podcast. Speak for those who can’t!

I’m so sick of the “we’ve all sinned” argument. The old fall back excuse for not doing what the Bible says to do with leaders who are not above reproach. We all need forgiveness and should give it. This has very little to do with forgiveness and everything to do with repenting from the tolerance of sin from the leadership. Honor culture meets Scripture. Honor culture loses, and God is exposing it. So frustrating to go over this 1000 times and these folks don’t get it! (Or don’t want to). Predators and immoral leaders exist. At this point, I’m getting more disgusted the way we, the church body, as well as other leaders, refuse to follow scripture on dealing with this issue. Finally, again, we are so far down this road because we tolerated “just adultery between adults” that now it seems “judgmental” and mean when the demand for discipline and accountability involves a child victim!!!! I don’t want to start considering motives, but it starts to look like what is most important to some of these leaders is to keep their network of power and influence intact.

Interestingly, the Beveres are very close with James and Betty Robison. James Robison was very involved with Robert Morris in the 80's (still is??) and employed him just one month in of his supposed 2-year "stepping down from ministry." They all seem to think they are UNTOUCHABLE ....and these kinds of videos by Lisa Bevere are the result. God help us.

I actually stopped trusting her and John a little while back. And her position only reinforces why this has been enabled to continue. (Also, it's interesting to note her black and white freemason colors. When you know you know). This position tells you everything you need to know. How sad that so many of these people being vague and wishy-washy have the influence over so many people. Lord, have mercy!!

The Bevere’s have their own teaching about the culture of honor.

This is a slap in the face of ALL abused by SA. This would mean Lisa thinks all abusers should get a spanking and time out. After all God is not a respecter of persons. Why would Morris or Bickle get a pass?? Common sense Lisa, common sense. This is not God's wisdom. The book of James says true religion is this, take care of widows and orphans. Keep yourselves unspotted from the world. It does not matter how long it has been, justice still demands exposure and consequences.

Being in Church and seeing all of these things happen in front of me for years, coming from a Church where pastors kept having affairs with church members in front of me... allowing this trash to discourage me as a young girl, that came from abuse in her own home. I always felt sad for that man and woman that sinned in front of my eyes. I realized that some should be held accountable for letting down the body of Christ of being Bad Shepherds. Years later the Lord bringing me to a new Church. This awesome pastor that was honest enough to be vulnerable with us, the body of Christ. I realized, Lord was showing me that humans are broken, no matter where I go (btw, Lord, called me to serve in our Healing Rooms). We as the body of Christ are not able to heal until the bad is called and exposed and there is repentance. (The days of.."Ah, there is nothing to see here folks" are over!") Everyone will be held accountable for what he or she did in the eyes of the Father, Here on Earth. But it's time to allow Holy Spirit do the healing. Our job as believers is to forgive and intercede! Not let the seed of bitterness take root. These men WILL be judged, I promise you. But it's our job to Bless them and Allow God to do His job. We aught to pray for Deliverance and for healing for these men that have failed the body. ‭ Mark 9:42 NLT‬ (JESUS spoke these words) [42] “But if you cause one of these little ones who trusts in me to fall into sin, it would be better for you to be thrown into the sea with a large millstone hung around your neck. bible.com/bible/116/mrk.9.42.NLT ‭2 Chronicles 19:6-7 NLT‬ [6] and he said to them, “Always think carefully before pronouncing judgment. Remember that you do not judge to please people but to please the Lord. He will be with you when you render the verdict in each case. [7] Fear the Lord and judge with integrity, for the Lord our God does not tolerate perverted justice, partiality, or the taking of bribes.” bible.com/bible/116/2ch.19.6-7.NLT ‭Luke 6:41-42 NLT‬ [41] “And why worry about a speck in your friend’s eye when you have a log in your own? [42] How can you think of saying, ‘Friend, let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,’ when you can’t see past the log in your own eye? Hypocrite! First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend’s eye. bible.com/bible/116/luk.6.41-42.NLT

Didn't the Apostle Paul say, "Those who sin rebuke before all so that others also may fear."? The context was about rebuking leaders in the churches who sinned. **Rebuke them openly ... literally make an example of them.** THAT'S SCRIPTURAL. Leaders will be judged more keenly by God. They need to walk in a holy kind of fear, respecting the position they are in and the trust they have been given, watching their own lives and conduct very carefully.

BOOM-“we are not another nation, we’re the Body of Christ” so solid i laughed out loud, SPEAK IT, BRO.🔥🔥

what i hear is “i don’t want to get my hands dirty.” got it, Lisa-stay comfy. the rest of us that’ve been HAMMERED most our lives will step up; because we freaking get it-not on our watch

They are in on it. She is just accountable. They probably have blackmail on her. They all are sick

THE REASON THESE PEOPLE WONT SPEAK UP IS BCAUSE THEY WILL LOSE VIEWERS AND MONEYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!! THEY COMPROMISE WITH TRUTH AND DO NOT DEFEND THE INNOCENT!

“We’re not another nation, we’re the Body of Christ” 🫳🎤

Lisa is loyal to the wrong group. Will never read her books again. True colors are coming out.