I'm SOOOOO glad that it wasn't just me who felt like StarFlower hooking up with her ex-boyfriends dad and then HAVING CHILDREN WITH HIM was messed up in some kind of way.

I fully agree, I hate the whole Star Flower romance thing too, it's just disgusting. However, I think it also helps to portrey just what kind of character Clear Sky is, which is to say not a reformed villain, but a warped, psychopathic a**hole of a character even after book 3. Clear Sky consistently lies to himself and those around him throughout the arc, he claims he's qualified for leadership when he's clearly not and he hides behind his "responsibilities" whenever he's caught. He's a shitty person and his choice of mate in Star Flower reflects that, like you said she's an attempted murderer who literally sold all of the proto-clans out to One-Eye, but she claims she's loyal to Clear Sky. Clear Sky is so messed up in the head that he'd rather just have a girlfriend who's "loyal and subservient" to him rather than actually face the issues of what he or she have done. And his refusal to say sorry to Thunder is also a big part of this, he's far too prideful and self-pitying to recognise the damage he caused to Thunder let alone apologise for it. I honestly hate that of all the cats they could've had form Skyclan, it had to be stinking CLEAR SKY! Sorry, rant over XD

Don't get me wrong, DOTC is my favorite arc in warriors but a few things just rub me the wrong way and I usually don't read the last few books because of them. *slight rant alert* I'm probably going to just be saying what's said in the video in different words Oh boy, Star Flower; its like she's introduced just to be pretty, betrays everyone and then get with her ex's DAD, like right after. Like ok if you don't want to be with someone, that's completely your decision but she fricken played Thunder for info and that's it. And whenever someone says something about it in book it's immediately shut down. Shes almost instantly forgiven (partially because you know, she's the leaders mate but still) she just goes "oh yeah I indirectly killed a few cats but I'm just trying to life my life 🥺👉👈 and Im so loyal, remember when I just killed a few cats for my dad yesterday?" and then she's just a helpless maiden in distress for the rest of time, except for when she's suddenly not because the authors randomly remember they atleast wrote a slightly capable character (and by capableI I just mean stubborn)

Not even gonna lie, I had extremely mixed feelings on this book. As always, it’s super interesting to see such a different opinion from what I usually see in this fandom, though I’ve never really heard one on this book specifically. I think slash was actually a super lackluster character, like.. did we need him??? Lol like.. we didn’t need an entirely new cat for that, or at least if we did at least he could’ve been written better and more interesting, maybe with just half a personality? ALSO I agree that quiet rain kinda saved this book ngl the scene where clearsky begged for his mother’s forgiveness.. that kinda made me sad- not for clearsky he can suck a lemon, but more for quiet rain.. I’m sure she hoped for the best for her sons in the forest, but then she found out one of her sons where an absolute beast?? Edit: ntm the fact her youngest son was also scarred both physically and mentally by one of her oldest??????? Then literally DISOWNED her son😭😭 Also I feel like no one acknowledges thunder and quiet rain’s interaction???? Like sure.. they weren’t really anything at all lol but we don’t really get a lot of grandparent-grandchild interactions written into the books, and sure the relationship between the two was honestly kind of negative but like.. I appreciate thunder was just chill all the time, he literally didn’t care lol he just took care of his grandma. also ngl the relationship between starflower and clearsky.. yea it’s weird lol- your also right, a lot of people view her as just some misunderstood kitty because of something her dad did! nar.. ur not an angel urself fella.. Another edit: to add fuel to your fire on the star/clear/thunder situation, I didn’t really see you say it but you might’ve thought this already- Starflower is technically Thunder’s step mom, and.. she. Dated.. him LOL.. I know it was *before* clear and start dated but it’s still.. weird lol

I had a feeling you wouldn’t like this one 😭😭 I haven’t watched the full vid yet, nor do i remember much of this book, but I remember being infuriated with Quiet Rain as I was a die-hard Clear Sky fan, as well as the pure existence of Slash and his crew. I remember that the only thing I liked about the book was Jagged Peak and his relationship with Holly (but like I said, it’s been a veryyyy long time since I read it). The last book’s alright, at least better than a forest divided, and has got some very emotional moments so I hope you can find some enjoyment out of it! But I feel Mothflights super edition wraps up Dawn of the Clans better than the sixth book.

I love listening to your reviews, it's feels very genuine and its admirable the amount of care you put into them 😸

warning: spoils abound. and lots of ranting. I like that we can dwell in collective pain. I was shocked to see that a substantial amount of the fandom thought kindly of or was otherwise neutral to Star Flower's treatment after this book. she doesn't denounce One Eye. she doesn't apologize to Thunder and manipulates his feelings in order to gain citizenship. feelings she later claims, "gushing," that she had no knowledge of. meanwhile Clear Sky, probably the least emotionally adept character of the cast, can read Thunder's affections clear as day. when it came to their first private interaction, I was actually hyped to watch a seductress try Clear Sky by tapping into his vulnerabilities. "I'm bad, you're bad, let's be bad together." she's constantly by his side, in his ear, flaunting her connection to him, talking about: "you made the tough decisions nobody else could" which was LITERALLY ONE OF CLEAR SKY'S COPING PHRASES, back when he was a tyrant. the writing was on the wall. how could the Erins have possibly expected anyone to see authentic good in a character who infamously played the "sweet and helpful" act for her evil father's gain? I can't even start on Clear Sky, a character they're trying to REDEEM, figuratively giving his son the middle finger and running off to play with his dubious ex, so he can forget how terrible he himself is/was. Quiet Rain is a blessing after having to endure for so long as Clear Sky suffers NO real-world consequences whatsoever (that aren't "I had nightmares, boo hoo") for murdering other characters. however, her forgiveness is a curse. it's such lazy writing to have all of your characters shrug off the concept of predeterminism, then selectively apply it as a handy plot-device. the dead can speak to the living in this world! so why rush to 180 her scorn while she's still alive a single chapter later? why must Clear Sky be forgiven when he barely deserves it? ...at least the bonus scene was good?

Shout out on the Scourge reference lolx3. I remember only good things about this series from a few months ago, I personally find the only worthwhile parts of book 5 to go back to is Quiet Rain's family scenes. Clear Sky's part was indeed yikes... but by that point his distress was just so delicious I forgot about all that other missed opportunities. Yeah I loved your >10 min of raging rant and how it brings to light where all the plot holes are showing in DOTC [5/6]. I guess I didn't pay enough attention to that particular Clear sky + StarFlower hole because what happens in the next 2 books was distracting enough to make me stop caring. My comfort realization [and partial head canon] is that from this book onwards all of Gray Wing's adopted kits split like Mothflight's and imho should've been far more impactful in comparison because of their life achievements, becoming leaders/med cats but the lack of recognition for many of his kit's became very noticeable. I'm proud of Acorn Fur, Thunderstar & Lightning Tail, Sparrowstar [never confirmed dead so I stand by this], Owlstar and Pebble Heart.

Yeah I think starflower is the one character I really really dislike in the series. I haven’t read DOTC, but I’m kinda glad I didn’t get attached to her for her to turn out the way she did.

Man I cannot wait to hear what you say about Mothflights Vision

I literally CANNOT with Clear Sky and Star Flower!!! Besides Thunder liking/being with her first, its also the fact that Clear Sky called her a "young cat" and said something like "finally he had a mate worthy to be at his side" HUH??? 🤢

Tbh I love DOTC but I found the Star Flower-Clear Sky thing was just... really weird. I also just don't like clear sky in general, but whatever lol

I did think it was messed up that they did that too. I mean, if I recall, wasn't Star Flower described as young? And Clear Sky was kinda old?! If that's true then that's... Disgusting. I honestly think kinda they should've had Star Flower die in battle, or get chased out, never to show her face again. It sounds harsh but making her hook up with her ex's DAD? I would've rather seen something bad happen to her than that. And I don't like how they made Clear Sky act like a sensitive little child. Like one book he's all rules and stuff, and then a few books later he's just... That. Quiet Rain is the only redeeming part of the book. I liked her; she wasn't about taking anyone's nonsense. She was a good character.

My blood boiled when Quiet Rain snapped at Clear Sky and was shamed for it.

I enjoy your content a lot, keep it up man! The 6th book isn't that much better than this one but the ending is quite unique. I feel like Mothflight's vision is the true ending to all of this though, and overall its a pretty good book aside from the ending.

May I say that I am SOOOOOOOO glad you talked about Starflower! I hated her sooo much!

I remember I read the first couple of books when I was in middle school, and really liked them, it's too bad that the dawn of the clans took such a dip in quality.

I was ok with clear sky but he then goes ahead with all the star drama O.O

So I just discovered warriors on January 7th 2022 and rn I'm on The New Prophecy Starlight but Idrc about spoilers I just like listening, knowing about it, and your thoughts. Like sure I got spoiled Blue star dies, FireStar does, Tigerstar is evil and etc

This book was what made me stop reading warriors altogether lmao. Haven’t read another since, I was that disappointed. It is *impressively* bad.

I actually agree with this much more than I did The Blazing Star. I loved it when we got to spend time with Greywing, and especially LOVED Quiet Rain showing up. LOVED that she said all the things that the readers have wanted to say to Clearsky for 4 books. I hated the thing with Starflower... That was a difficult thing to read through, and probably the worst part of the entire arc. It felt very um... I don't know, Jerry Springer? Like the dad deciding to be with his son's ex-girlfriend. I didn't hate the book, since Starflower wasn't usually the main focus, it was more like an annoyance in the back of my mind. It did bring down the story, even though DOTC is my second favorite arc out of the series... I felt like all the other characters in all the other clan's were much better written in the last three books of this arc.

I wanted to like Star Flower but the books really don't do much other than show her as a selfish cat who uses her beauty to get things

Honestly, I found Star Flower becoming mate with Clear Sky and just instantly getting away with everything by using the silliest excuses to be so funny that I couldn't be mad at it. And aside from that, I liked seeing people creating and joining different groups based on(for the most part) logical and previously established reasons. It really showed how most named characters get some kind of personality, unlike every other arcs except maybe arc 1. I think the fact that dawn of the clans has a fantastic ending and is consistently good from book 2 to 4 makes me more forgiving towards this book too. Unlike vision of shadows and the broken code, it isn't the entire second half that's a complete mess, just some parts of it.

It also disgusting they said she is good because she came a kit machine for Clear sky to get kittens from

I really liked this book, it was honestly one of my favorites of the arc It’s not a bad book nor hard to read, at least not for me. The characters are still consistently good especially the scene with quiet rain. Also I wish you used the original covers in these videos as I prefer them myself but it’s a small thing I suppose.

Star Flower is hands on the worst character in the whole warrior cats. Like "Omg Thunder I didn't know you still liked me, lemme date your dad!" like holy stupid Star Flower it's not always about you and leave Thunder alone. I can't even express my hate for her and it's so wrong that she had children with her ex's dad. That's so messed up. I almost stopped reading warrior cats because of how much her character annoyed me.