Facts! Sad, but nothing but truth!

Idk I seen more kimes ranch hats, gruntstyle t shirts in my area and I live 30 minutes form NYC

True.

Good articulation.

Maybe for kids now but when street wear first popped off we definitely weren’t going to KZfaq and fashion KZfaq was barely a thing.

@@GDL364 replace KZfaq with Reddit, forums, etc. that’s just how people do it now, but here has always been a fashion community to learn from

Streetwear for some starts with rock climbing and their culture in USA, For some punk, for some skate, for some hiphop, for new kids it's sneakers. I would agree that if it's not dead it's definitely 'out of shape'. Consumerism and brands making everything 'limited' is not sustainable at all. Have been seeing trends that some buyers for retail shops are calling sneaker collecting 'pervert' and going deeeeeep into the roots & 'old money' OG looks/items. Wonder if there will be time in the future when people will get laughed at for paying resale for fast fashion items.

@@kingart23 I was actually thinking the same thing. Streetwear is like that stepdad that used to be in shape but then started slowing inching towards only eating fast food.

Nope it was a fad and way of dressing when u don’t really give a fuck. Now Ralph Lauren and preppy/ ivy look will never die

Tell this guy

Nobody said hip hop wasn’t a factor. It was literally stated that Hip hop built a MANSION over skate punk. There was a fusion where everything was deemed streetwear. The only argument is that it should be TWO different things. Skate styles and Hip hop styles are two different categories. I think the confusion comes from the fact that the term “street” is used which implies hip hop. And the silhouette for the most part is a non starter; early hip hop was wider, bigger and baggy. Skate was slim and regular w/ nods to bigger and baggy later. The whole “not giving black culture/hip hop enough credit” is out of line. The whole idea is to put more emphasis on hip hop as it’s own separate thing so the people that made it get more credit rather than merging it with “streetwear” to dilute the culture that hip hop provided.

Your timelines and concepts are wrong my man. Skate punk? Nah.🤨

Literally a style bruh. Just because you didn’t care for it doesn’t mean it didn’t exist. My argument is that it should have been two different things not apart of the same thing. Hip hop didn’t ask to be fused with skate. That was done by media outlets and the industry.

@@THECASUALco "“not giving black culture/hip hop enough credit”" I really don't think anyone said that, dude.

Not bad at all. Not my cup of tea personally but I like how hes putting his own spin on it & making sure theres still a statement & emotion behind it. Streetwear at the end of the day is art, jus like all fashion is. Its an expression of self and I hope that never dies. Trends & money is cool but we still can never forget where we started & who we were/are.

WORD! I could NOT have said it better myself. That just makes you super cool imo!!!! Mad respect! Never change man!:)

well said

Perspective is a very odd thing is it not? “Streetwear” as a concept is a co-opted term. First and foremost when you live in a time where the term was never used in the first place it stands to reason that streetwear is amorphous depending on your locale. To those in the California “streetwear” has a different origin. New York as well. The issue brought here is the amalgamation of styles has led to streetwear be an ambiguous, vague concept, devoid of any direct inspiration that clearly differentiates it from other fashion genres. Such as if skate ISN’T a large part of streetwear then why is the biggest brand in the world a brand dedicated to skate lifestyle. And why pray tell is the biggest hip hop inspired Brand based out of Japan. To be honest I HATE the term streetwear, which is really the point. It dilutes influences from certain parties. Crossover is always welcome but if we can’t differentiate between what comes from one lifestyle to the other it makes for a confusing genre of fashion. To someone from NY streetwear likely has more roots in hip hop. To some one out west in LA the perspective likely changes. As stated in the video “streetwear” as a concept is far too vague a term to describe the various lifestyles it supposedly takes cues from.

​@@THECASUALco I agree with some of the points you make, and yes perspective is a very odd thing indeed. But when you roll in facts and experience that perspective can walk the line of truth. Yes you can say "Streetwear" is a co-opted term. You could also say the same about the word "Hip Hop" as well. Here's the thing, everyone has "their version" of streetwears origin. I've worked in the fashion industry for many years (and still do) and watched this category be birthed. It doesn't matter that I'm from NYC. I was a skater also. I was heavily influenced by the west coast culture. traveling from one coast to the other often gave me a front row seat to seeing this come into play. Skate was indeed influenced by punk, ska and thrasher music. It wasn't just on the west coast, it was the same on the east. But Hip hop's explosion and global domination would eventually reach the skate market. Skaters like Chad Muska would be a huge advocate for urban wear in the very early 2000's. But as "Urban fashion" began to die by 2004 and skaters into hip hop was greater than those listening to Punk by that time. The skating culture as well began to explode more than ever. This is where the shift happened. With brands like Ecko fading there was a void. Enter Crooks & Castles, 10 Deep, The hundreds etc. The "commercial" birth of Streetwear. Streetwear was an under current during Urban fashion. It was waiting to break through. When urban was at its peak streetwear existed. It was just a subculture. Triple 5 Soul, PNB Nation, Supreme, Futura2000, Xlarge, Stussy (as you mentioned) Union, FreshJive, ConArt I can keep going, were all considered Streetwear back then. Look up Collezioni Street & Sport magazine. Its a trend forecasting mag. It use to come out quarterly. I was buying these back in 1997 for $30 an issue. They were already calling the fashion look that was borrowing from Hip hop, Action sports, Rock and classifying it as streetwear, back then. I say all this to say I agree with you about Streetwear being here to stay. It was always here. It will continue to evolve. Even to a point where I believe the word "Streetwear" will no longer have meaning. It will just represent a space. The same way when we say an artist is dropping a new "album". An album use to be a physical thing. It stood for something. Now its just a word we use to represent what the artist is releasing. Streetwear as you said is far too vague NOW as a term to describe all from which it takes its cues from. I also hate the term streetwear. lol.. But I do like your content. :)

I think we need to start this off by saying you’re probably closer to my generation than you think. I know every single label you stated and Collezioni. The video stated in no uncertain terms that streetwear has foundations in punk, not that punk is streetwear. Long story short, I too work in the industry, a student of fashion history (literally my focus in post grad studies). I think we agree more than disagree, in fact based on what you’re saying I don’t think we disagree at all. This video glossed over history but it wasn’t a in depth history lesson. It was using that history to acknowledge that streetwear is too vague a concept to ever die. Also I made sure to hip hop was the father of streetwear or rather “built a mansion over streetwear”. I still stand by that streetwear as a concept is a lazy industry term meant to take focus away from creatives in different genres of style and fashion despite the obvious crossovers. This is why the streetwear community is fragmented. You have varying walks of life with no definitive structure nor ethos under one umbrella. As you mentioned these are all lifestyle labels but as you know the communities didn’t coin these terms, the industry did. They were subcultures and should have remained as such. It’s much easier to understand “skate lifestyle label” than streetwear brand. Which is basically the commercialization of urban lifestyle brands.

@@THECASUALco I agree with you on all points. Upon looking at our responses I believe we both share the same views. :)

Only that iteration of it. Just keep evolving and staying true to you. That's all that matters! ✌️

Nah I think it gets just the right amount of credit. Again, people pay attention to the mansion built on the foundation, not the foundation itself. Skate may have laid the ground work but hip hop certainly bought that land built a big ass house and changed the trajectory.

You keep saying some mansion was built over punk. You got it wrong. You got your eras and timelines wrong as well. You are stuck in your own ideology, no disrespect.

Bruh Workwear, Greaser, Beatnik, Punk, 70s & Bohemian, Sporty 80s, Skate /hip hop, street. (Edited for additions) I believe you aren’t going far back enough.

@@THECASUALco of course we can go further back and find older influences and in the beginning skate and hiphop was different. Skate was pretty much surfer style and hiphop was a more street/sportswear version of disco. But the way they evolved they became pretty much the same way before it was called streetwear. At least in the counter culture end of it. Mainstream and underground hiphop style has always been pretty different from each other (but also with obvious similarities). The foundation of streetwear is mainly equal parts skate and hiphop, with a good dash of grunge. (With other inspirations also but that's the main ingredients imo). And of course hip-hop didn't invent workwear, but brands like Carhartt has been big in hip-hop for 30 years. Back in the early 90's we used to wear tons of workwear (real workwear brands sold in craftmans stores) because hip-hop brands wasn't that much of a thing yet and workwear was closer to the style we liked. Later it was a lot of skate brands. Not because we took their style, but because it was pretty much the same style and we didn't like the flashy hip-hop brands like Fubu, Sean John etc lol The essence of streetwear today is very much hip-hop. Hip-hop has always been a mix of everything. You take some funk drums and mix it with a classic violin and you got hip-hop. It's not so much where the parts come from, it's more about how it's styled together. The same way as brands like Undercover or SLP aren't streetwear but pieces can be styled as streetwear.

You’re actually doubling down on my point that hip hop style co-opted skate and created “streetwear”. Which is basically the take in video. Hip hop is a culture of sampling (as you clearly illustrated) and the very fact that skate had established brands and looks well before hip hop fashion took root is an admission that skate built a definitive foundation. I’m finding it hard to understand why people feel disturbed by skate being a foundation of street. Like I never gave hip hop credit. Where in the entire episode did I say that hip hop wasn’t a part of “streetwear”? The only logical conclusion is the unsaid racial bias here. We associate skate and punk with white people and hip hop with black people which is honestly the elephant in the room right now. There were blacks involved in punk & skate. Whites involved in hip hop. To lesser degrees on both spectrums but this is not supposed to be racial. Purely lifestyle and subculture. And influence isn’t some boogyman that gives less credit to the cultures that made things popular. Hip hop made street popular. It’s real easy to understand and was said in the video. The problem is somehow people want a revisionist take on inspiration and influence. It would probably blow people’s mind if I told people that the black panthers and there attire was inspired by UK punk underground scenes that predated the movement. But to some people these individuals came up with these concepts out of the ether and had no reference what so ever. It’s ok to be inspired there’s nothing wrong with saying skate & punk (which predated definitive hip hop style) is a foundation of street.

Yea if that's includes black nail polish extra tight clothes,chokers skirts dresses mfers be on,count me out

Fr, I still see Vans

I'd say that we are living in the twilight of counterculture when it comes to fashion. Anything and everything is so incredibly easily accessible that it all blends into this gray mass of microtrends. It's impossible to start a community around a certain way of dressing without it growing out of proportion and next thing you know, it's so "last week".

Exactly. 😅

Katherine Hamnett

Vivian Westwood, Kei Minomiya, Undercover, Commes Des Garcons, Margiela, Miharu Yashiro, Julius, CCP, MA+, nude:Masahiko Maruyama etc. There’s plenty of punk labels or those that use punk references. We simply don’t celebrate them because they usually aren’t mainstream. Which is kind of the point.

@@THECASUALco Yeah, I drove for a punk band Oi Polloi for few years, 4 European tours and those punks were not wearing those labels. Calling you label punk is not punk..what is perceived as Punk is probably one season of seditionaries' and reworking those idae, no judgement, Reggie, you are an american in Japan, I am looking at this from a Uk/ European perspective and my lived experience ...I am just a 60 year old dude wearing Kapital and Snow Peak . . Punks tend towards anti fashion ie not spending money. Lots of DIY and customisation of Old clothes and mil surp...which in turn get filtered and interpreted by the fashion industry, where in Japan punk is seen as a valid reference point. . It is a Simulacra, not the real thing. Like Ralph Lauren selling an ideal of American Cape cod old money..You buy the concept of the thing not that actual "Thing" spend all your money on Ralph but you won't own a yacht nor a home in the Hamptons. Turn up at some Anarchist squats in your Comme and see how you are received.

@@tonytuffers You really are having a laugh, son.

@@THECASUALco Seditionaries' was Viv. And really defines punk... Worlds end onwards?

I don’t understand what you mean.

Streetwear wasn’t coined by black people tho…

“Black” people don’t usually coin titles and names for everything they “do” they just “do” them…they get “labeled” by certain other folks.

Then you shouldn’t be worried about the terms “street” nor “punk”. I think you interpreted this as giving punk all the credit when it was intended to separate hip hop/black culture from the “streetwear” that fused it. Much like how Jazz was ripped away from black communities. You are correct that blacks don’t often coin movements. It part of the reason it has been so difficult to sell it to the masses. Once somebody put black/inner city styles into the mainstream under the banner of streetwear it became sellable. And who made out more for that? Blacks or the industry? Sure some made it but the fashion industry still has a ways to go when it comes to representation. Which I would guess is your primary concern: giving credit where credit is due. Again people pay attention to the mansion more than the land it was built on. Hip hop is that mansion but saying skate and punk aren’t a part of the equation is intellectually dishonest.

Nah, your psyching yourself into doing everything against what you think are my concerns. When do you actually think skate punk was a foundation for “Hip Hop”? Think before you answer.

Now you’re conflating two different issues. One, if we’re talking purely INDUSTRY fashion, not the culture (hip hop culture obviously was not founded by punk) but in the industry, punk had already settled foundations in the fashion industry well before hip hop fashion (as a concept). This lead to skate styles and hip hop styles ran alongside in a totally different genre of fashion. There was a time when skate and hip hop weren’t the same, I’m sure you remember. However skate style had more crossover appeal than hip hop I.e it was too “black”. Thus the industry/media using a term defined in skate culture in “streetwear” took it upon themselves to integrate hip hop styles under that banner. This is what I argue should have never happened. Hip hop brands were lifestyle labels in their own category. However it did happen and as a result of hip hops far greater marketability than skate it overtook the term streetwear, with detrimental effects. Soon everything became labeled streetwear with no clear lines of distinction leading to a massive decline in urban lifestyle labels. Now the biggest labels aren’t led by the people who make them popular but the individuals who profited from a merger of hip hop and skate culture. So punk laid the foundation PURELY in the business sense as it was already established in industry circles. Skate made it more accessible to a crossover market, hip hop made it famous. I contest that this has lead to many outlets diluting the impact of black culture in fashion because the lines are not clearly drawn and there’s too much space for confusion. Such as this conversation here.

There is a lot of truth to this! Like for sure! But it goes back even further. Like before hip hop. There is a lot of back and forth in the "discussion or language" of style and fashion and their roots...wear things come from... But in reality.... everything has always been a remix that comes from somewhere else. Not to take away from your topic specifically. I just personally love seeing a fall in the division of peoples. I love embracing unification...but not like like everyone has look alike or something.... What I mean to say is... For the first time ever... I am seeing ppl actually just embrace what they want to look like.. regardless of what's supposed to cool to wear.

Greaser culture came way before hip hop styles and were rebellious as well. Punk is a direct descendant of that. Hip hop is a fairly new phenomenon. Streetwear wasn’t a concept within hip hop.

@@THECASUALco Streetwear as we know it currently is highly derived from hip hop and blackness. The style and the looks are directly tied with blackness. No one nowadays is trying to look like a greaser lmao. Rebelliousness didn’t originate from hip hop, that’s clearly not what I’m saying. If you trace back the silhouettes and styles of Streetwear nowadays it’ll take you back to blackness.

You misunderstand. I’m not saying it didn’t. I’m saying that black style should never have been fused with streetwear and “punk” styles. That’s my main issue and where the confusion comes in.

@@THECASUALco I appreciate the clarification! I was about to say 😂 but I feel you. A NYT article completely left blackness out of the Streetwear narrative and thought it was happening again

I don’t ever go by what “people” think but by the information provided. Regardless if people see “streetwear” as a byproduct of hip hop, it’s a lazy term created by industry insiders to dilute the impact of inner city black creatives and culture vultures. The sad reality is that individuals co-opted it without realizing that they were giving away their culture for the sake of a title. Now the biggest “streetwear” brand on the planet is a SKATE brand (Supreme) and the biggest hip hop brand is a label created by a Japanese dude who was inspired by planet of the apes & the beastie boys (Bape). Hip hop/black labels should of been their own lane instead they were happily fused into something that was never about hip hop culture in the first place.

@@THECASUALco this always goes to show, that whenever the true movers of culture create, those who have no real stake dilute and pollute. Sneaker culture as well as “streetwear” all comes from the culture created in the Bronx.

This exactly. Except no one in the Bronx called the sh*t streetwear. It was just style. So it begs to question why the term was created in the first place.

@@THECASUALco have you seen the movie wild style? I’m asking as a Legitimate question.