Nate Alexander They need to cover up on it. Too fascinating to not to.

Agreed.

Was just about to say something similar. One aspect that the Hellbound Heart and the first two Hellraiser films had that I think set them apart was indeed their interpretations of both "demons" and "hell" so radically divorced from the Biblical presentations people were usually familiar with. The Cenobites are not "evil" per say, but adhere to a radically different perspective of pleasure, pain, vice and reward than we do. Leviathan is not just some fallen angel, but a bizarre, alien entity whose goals and form conform to nothing we would expect. Even the idea that it seeks to bring "order" (or at least its version of it) flips the normal order/chaos dynamic we typically ascribe to celestial powers on its head. The later films would pretty much ignore much of this, using the Cenobites more as slasher villains and Scarlet Gospels would revert their "Hell" to it's much more Christian roots. Which is a shame because there really was an interesting mythology that, frankly, was far more unsettling and scary in it's eschewing of normal expectations.

The Scarlet Gospels were such a disappointment, it was almost a Forgotten Realms novel. I waited years for that to come out.

I don't think the 2 Barker novels were intended to be cannon with the films, the books are a different thing although the Boom comics are obviously cannon with the movies.

Pretty mediocre movies tbh

Dyionisis Yhe horned one I always feel it’s a shame I can’t use this wonderful phrase more often in general conversation!

Not sure about ever but I do recall hearing when I first saw the movie and thinking damn lol

@@ChocolateEffigy I really liked the first one. The second one was fun, too. I saw the 3rd one, and I think I'm okay not seeing the others for now.

@@ChocolateEffigy I love the makeup work in Hellraiser but the plot really isn’t that great. There are much better horror movies but I still love it. Classic

That's a great connection! Thank you for that

Be not afraid

A Film Theory

Thanks for your input!!!

I think the Leviathan is God having fun with his slave race acting all surprised they are chaotic and now rectifying his "mistake" by torturing his creation. Sounds more in tone with the God of the bible.

I miss this kind of matte magic

Jason do we see anything of the circles below the labyrinth?

@@hl8808 yes you do see the lower circles, several characters travel there thru a portal found in the labyrinth called the Oubliette, the former Pinhead - Elliot Spencer - ends up there and starts running the show, he has a new more beastial form and his cronies down there are more monstrous and savage looking than the Cenobites, this occurs in Boom! Studios comics story arc when Kirsty Cotton - the hero from the first and second movies - became the new Pinhead

In reality the Bible says that no human can escaped and hide from God because He would send Leviathan or Behemoth to turn him/her "into pieces".

@ I do often read about the demon/angel being extra dimensional entities often. But then what made them? Some kind of crazy cycle going on, but the one thing we do know for certain is that we truly are all left in the dark

@@Grayfox354 God made them duh

Yeah, your mother was a hedron, but she turned counter-clockwise...

Thanks the spoilers

Hedronism

@@pepesylvia848 No real spoilers here. Just adaptations of Lovecraftian fiction

Where's the Federal Bureau of Control when you need them?

Agreed, but The Emperor of Man is coming for them both.

@@dudebro5527 Of and theres ganna be plenty of comming, I assure you that.

Nope. They would be mortal enemies. The Leviathan is Order whilst Slaneesh is Chaos.

@@miafillene4396 Hmmm. I think you're write. Usually Hell is Chaos in myth and art, rather than domineering/bdsm like Order.

@@Sorrowdusk - A labyrinth rather than an inferno essentially. Order instead of Chaos. The Leviathan eschews things like flesh itself because it embodies cruel, merciless, Order and regards flesh and pain as synonymous.

The cube is permanently rotating, so nothing can attach to it. The tentacles probably belong to something else that's controlled by Leviathan.

Or the leviathan is trapped inside of the box that is everchanging to keep it in.

Leviathan takes whatever orderly form he pleases. He seemed pretty interested in the toys made in the story of bloodline.

Cora B I know right? He is good.

As your beauty makes the world a better place 😻😻😻

@@alejandrovillalba3143 lmao

His voice is way over done.

Maybe not passed the second movie though as that last movie was a tired flop of a fish gaping for air!

That’s what god is. It’s eluded to in many “Holly wood” movies. Black cube of Saturn wannabe thing.

From the comic books you can infer Leviathan is a fallen angel/demon lord. There are several circles of hell and Leviathan is just the ruler of one of them (the labyrinth). There are other rulers in other circles of hell, including Lucifer, and they don't seem to like or think too highly of Leviathan at all. Later in the comics Leviathan even acknowledges that God in his infinite wisdom is the only being that could cast judgment on him and states he's even prepared for it to happen one day. To me it seems like Leviathan and the other demon lords are simply doing what God wills. God allows them to run their circle of hell as they see fit so long as they fulfill their purpose of judging and punishing humanity. To what end I don't know.

@@03chrisv awesome, thats the kind of lore i like finding out

He has such things to show us....

cheers dude :)

2022 remake is out, and its awesome

I didn't even know a leviathan had a consistent shape. I thought it was just a massive thing or monster.

I’m guessing you were born in the 70s/80s and saw 80s horror movies while beating Valis 3 in your spare time lol.

I guess my question here is, if so, then why did Leviathan want to slay his own generals. I honestly never understood why Channard and the Cenobites had a showdown. That part never made sense. I guess it's cause he thought he was the stronger one?

@@shredmancer I was thinking that it was more likely they were regaining their Memories of their Human Life and Leviathan was feeling, that they will rebel against him and used Channard through the Tentacle to get rid of them.

@@pain7850 You might be right honestly.

or the sims icon are mini leviathans.... considering hellraiser was out before

CANNON. Q

Or the sims icon is based on the leviathan, bringing control and order to the humanoid chaos.

the levithan the most sadistic sims player

Really, that seems to correlate nicely.

You know it was called the god of flesh, hunger, and desire and lord of the labyrinth in Hellraiser 2? And there are those that disagree with calling the place it dwells in hell.

MetaKnight964 Except everyone calls that place Hell, including Pinhead. Who would know better?

Leondrius The story of "the fallen one" or Lucifer is never once told in the Bible. Research it.

Dominus Satanas How do you think? Lucifer= morning star "How you have fallen from heaven, morning star, son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations! You said in your heart, 'I will ascend to the heavens; I will raise my throne above the stars of God; I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly, on the utmost heights of Mount Zaphon. I will ascend above the tops of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.' But you are brought down to the realm of the dead, to the depths of the pit. Those who see you stare at you, they ponder your fate: 'Is this the man who shook the earth and made kingdoms tremble, the man who made the world a wilderness, who overthrew its cities and would not let his captives go home?'" -Isaiah 14:12

Notice that you do not include the verses around this verse and only see what you wish too. The verses before are clearly referring to the Babylonian King at the time. You need to read the entire book or at least the verses around Isaiah 14:12 to fully understand this. This is actually the reason I became an atheist. Because with out Satan there can be no God. Because the New Testament is really the only place in the Bible where Satan as we know him today exists. Hell and Satan are not in the Old Testament and do not exist to the Jews.

This is true, whenever angels did appear to man the first thing they would say is don't be afraid, their appearance is hideous, some do look like wheels of fire with many eyes

*you're

ed rice thanks fam

+Kumar Sanjeev no problem cuzzo

ed rice 👍😆

No, it makes sense.

glad you found the video :)

Andrew Robertson although the first HR was a gothic masterpiece, i have an affinity as well for the Bloodline installment. It has an epic quality in tracing the box from origin to full fruition. Angelique is also a perfect femme fatale

Agreed. Hellraiser: Inferno is a true shining gem in the series of subsequent shit sequels after Hellraiser 3. *Sue me, I have no shame in really liking Hellraiser 3 almost as much as the first two.*

+Kabayoth he also had a hand in the boom comics

The Scarlet Gospel is a suitably colourful read from Mr Barker too!

The Scarlet Gospels is a shit read and an even worse sequel than Hellworld and Revelations, in my opinion.

Scarlett gospels is the end of the laviathen..and its domain..set fourth by origami birds that pinhead makes to murder the whole of his kind...because he has never liked or wanted any of it....and he Absolutly disposes others of his origin. Cool book for sure...brings back the dick d amour...which was pretty dope..tied his books and films together as one universe.

You should watch The Shining, and The Stand. They are originally Stephen King novels.

I think sounds like hommer Simpson

40k is trash

@@coveredinherintestines666 Its ok to be wrong sometimes

@@kyllme1500 im glad you agree 40k is trash

6:66 minutes and seconds? You mean 7 minutes and 2 seconds? I know the joke you're going for but phrasing matters here.

Ryan Brennan right lol

Get a girlfriend

ErwinSchrodinger64 6 minutes and 66 seconds? 66 seconds don't you mean 7 minutes 6 seconds :p

More like 6:06:06.

yeah sorry buddy, moved house recently so everything has been all over the place, didnt even have internet for two weeks :-/ currently working on an actual schedule of content moving forwards, so there should be a weekly hellraiser video, every Wednesday, if all works out okay. again, my apologies dude! not my intention to leave anything behind.

Actually...I wasn't complaining...I just wanted to say I like your style of narrating very much! It fits these horror movies perfectly...Anyway, keep up the great work! I just got obsessed with Hellraiser franchise recently. I really want to learn more about it! :)

lol I know you weren't complaining dude! just wanted to explain how the channel is going to be moving forwards :)

your profile pic brings back some memories, Good ole White Glint, the frame I used for some of my most devastating designs in AC4:A.

Same, just wish they were longer.

+Brent Waters ???

Mr H Reviews I changed my name due to privacy issues it's Mike Reid I'm the guy who was obsessed over shaw being killed and kept asking you will we ever see you really are lol

Mr H Reviews Mr h my name before was Mike Reid I changed it recently we use to talk about alien convenat all the time I'm the guy who was obsessed with shaw being killed off and I was really pissed we talked alot about it lol

Hellraiser came out first💀💀💀

@@playlover9680 I know

+thecowwarrior3 Clive was trying to retcon out certain aspects built up over the years following the movies, so the movies stemming from the initial book then ending in the scarlet gospels, thats why they contradict one another quite a lot

Mr H - I'm not quite following what you're saying. The story/plot from The Hellbound Heart is what Hellraiser 1 & 2 were based on. I could see Clive not considering anything after Hellraiser 2 cannon (although I consider the first four films to be). But even so, the "explorers from another dimension" line is straight from the first film. The Hellbound Heart and Scarlet Gospels directly contradict one another. That is what I don't understand.

From some researches I have these points to note, despite not reading the books. One is that from what I understand Clive Barker draws a LOT of his inspirations or I can tell he has a good understanding of Kaballah and maybe the Talmud, but I will explain why - but Nightbreed also shows a lot of this influence directly. CowWarrior I should note this as well - Christianity has Hell from Helheim, Hebrew tradition has Gehenna and Sheol. Alone, that distinction may put a spin on some things. Gehenna is the fiery pit, Sheol is the abyss. So Hell can be seen as Gehenna in true Abrahamic tradition and Sheol is the Abyss and Limbo most likely. The Leviathan is mentioned in some of that Jewish Occult lore as being, if I recall correctly, the Holy Serpent and ruler of Markuth. There's an esoteric side to all this, but also a 'practical' side, Markuth represents the physical being, manifestation and universe. As you go up the Sephira they become increasingly spiritual domains. Beneath it is the Qliphoth, the Sephira is the Tree of Life - Qliphoth is the Tree of Death and Chaos. As it was said, Leviathan sees the mortal world as full of Chaos, and this Serpent brings Order. Aspects of Merkaba and Gematria might be seen in the Cube and how it works as a planar gateway, and how it is steam-punky. Advanced magics are as complicated as any other advance sciences including in calculation. There are different ways to interpret some of this in a real-sense. The Leviathan usually represents a feminine aspect and the mental aspects, which are superior to Behemot / Behemoth's physical, basal aspects of masculine-physical and manual creation, bound up by those primal 'Great Beast' things. Leviathan is then seen as the 'Great Dragon' of wisdom and divine creation, which is why that aspect is revered. However there is also aspects to point out the Leviathan is not exactly a good being, tied into Behemoth and with the Aziz are described as beasts to slay and feed the end-times world with. That alone can pose a lot of discussion or consideration, but in these terms maybe it sheds light. The Leviathan springs up from The Abyss and so it brings the 'Order out of Chaos' motiff with it but in this case, semi-clearly, the Serpent is not being nice about how it tries to reinforce 'order' on humanity. Can't even be sure what the real point would be to that extent, punishing humans for their erring sins is one thing but damning them into Cenobites to continue the process is logical enough to continue that process.. but I don't see how it restores order except by gnawing away at the worst of humanity lured to the greed of the Cube. In Nightbreed the role is a little reversed. Baphomet is seen as a 'good' figure to the Nightbreed themselves and they have this validations for their existence and behavior, and at the same time you can see how they are not that good based on all that but there's sympathy because the outcasts don't actively do harm and the dumbass redneck humans go out of their way to destroy the unknown / hassle these outcasts who do well when left alone. Contrasting, but with the lore at hand it may make some sense. So, then, if The Leviathan and Cenobites are from the Abyss - Sheol, and the maze and wasteland is what has been built upon it by the Leviathan as it gathered souls, then Lucifer and Hell - Gehenna, would be a rival contrast. Lovecraftian element aside or included, I can see why Pinhead might be drawn to conflict with Lucifer in his domain. I'd have to read the book to see how he defines Lucifer and Hell. It also isn't unreasonable to point out Fallen or Fallen vs Outsider might clash, especially Fallen. They didn't all agree during the Fall and after the Fall they have little reason to cooperate if they have beef for conflict or power and control. Particularly if Lucifer's design and realm doesn't go with the Leviathan's scheme and design. May even be interesting to propose that the Leviathan being a Mental aspect, frowns upon the physical world and it's inhabiting behavior.. which is why it punishes and hates the Flesh which falls to sin. Lucifer, if Clive is being 'canon' there Abrahamically, IS the weakness of the flesh. He represents the lust, rebellion (Chaos) and self-determination in it all. Maybe Lucifer's Order out of Chaos doesn't mesh with Leviathan's, or maybe Lucifer's Hell is contained Chaos and thrives on that alone being perpetuated. It is clear that the heroine leaning towards purity and cerebral survival is the heroine for this reason, she is what the Leviathan cannot contend with and has no reign over and so on. Maybe the Leviathan is just that Abyssal thing pushing in and contending with other big-bads, and alien mentality to bear. I do agree, if the books cause too much contradiction or the hidden / deeper meaning is terribly hard to grasp, then he may do well to novel about The Leviathan directly and set all things straight that way. I'll continue to do my usual research, but I hope that helps.

I think the scarlet gospel were more based off the comics and completely different from hellbound heart since pinhead wasnt even in that.

I don't remember exactly but was not the Leviathan in the last book the engime that Lucifer created to keep himself dead? The one where Pinhead wants the armor he is wearing to become the God of Hell?

Patrick McHale weaveworld, imajica and coldheart canyon were good clive barker novels aswell 👍

Yeah, for seemingly seeking to purge all the chaos and flesh of humanity, it sure does seem to have a good time messing around with flesh. The only thing the Leviathan seems to be successfully destroying is body hair. Still a noble cause.

GreatgoatonFire yes!! Thank you

I ship em

Then that AI shouldnt have googled torture porn. I mean look at the outcome

Precisely why even ancient or modern / future AI should be minded carefully. Imagine the paradoxical or complexity the AI would pick up seeing the movies? lol

I really like that idea.

Hence its love of order and hatred of chaos. Great idea!

57575756 I Think Therefore I AM.

TheCrashingToaster we are everything for we are. Extence is chaos, we change our souroundings which by its very nature is disorder, chaos. Death is the only form of true peace. Nihilism at its finest

Leviathan is a psychopath. It tries to create good, but instead creates hell.

:) im glad!

Mr H Reviews no problem. Watching you explain this story, this universe, gives me more curiosity as to what Mr barker is trying to show us. He's very cryptic about his work. While also being very upfront.